FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

[NCSteeler]

Outside of the truly bad teams , I didn't see many defenses looking like the keystone cops on opening day. Bellichexk called defensive time outs twice when his guys were in bad position. That's good coaching. I realize we would have needed twenty timeouts for Tomlin to do that but he could have at least tried. And no improvement at the half

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk

[hawaiiansteeler]

in addition to firing Mike Tomlin and every other coordinator and position coach (excluding Mike Munchak, of course) I also have the following suggestion:

every single time any Steelers player has a bad game, cut them no matter what the reason was or who they are. that way none of our players will ever have two bad games in a row...

http://www.wechselwild.com/sites/default/files/styles/detailseite/public/motif-images/2012-0/22/88/danger_-_genius_at_work_0.png?itok=o91g5qZX

[Steeldude]

Lebeau's Titans played pretty well, but they were up against a rookie QB. The defense produced 4 sacks. I only watched about a half a quarter of the game.

[zulater]

in addition to firing Mike Tomlin and every other coordinator and position coach (excluding Mike Munchak, of course) I also have the following suggestion:

every single time any Steelers player has a bad game, cut them no matter what the reason was or who they are. that way none of our players will ever have two bad games in a row...

http://www.wechselwild.com/sites/default/files/styles/detailseite/public/motif-images/2012-0/22/88/danger_-_genius_at_work_0.png?itok=o91g5qZX

So every single time a coach is criticized by a fan the fan is a moron? Head coaches are infallible and the Rooney's are the only one's smart enough to see that? That's the sense I get here.

Yeah I guess we're just not smart enough to understand how marvelously the Steelers were coached against the Patriots.

[Mojouw]

So every single time a coach is criticized by a fan the fan is a moron? Head coaches are infallible and the Rooney's are the only one's smart enough to see that? That's the sense I get here.

Yeah I guess we're just not smart enough to understand how marvelously the Steelers were coached against the Patriots.

you have to realize that there are points along the spectrum between those two extremes, right? No one is saying that the Steelers coaching staff is always right. Just as many are reacting against the trend to get out the torches and pitch forks whenever the Steelers don't beat their opponent by more than 3 scores.

The Pats make many teams look foolish on defense. Pus, the reality is, the Steelers secondary is one of the worst in the league. All anyone is saying is that one week is not a trend. It is an isolated game. If no improvement is made in Week 2 on the same issues, then there is a pattern and therefore a problem that can be directly blamed on the coaches. Prior to that, we can be pissed our favorite team lost, we can lament the lack of a strong defense, we can complain about mental mistakes, etc - but we should most likely hold off on claiming that Tomlin, Butler, and Haley are 3 of the worst coaches in the league and the Steelers will always enter each game as hampered by their coaching staff as a one legged man in an ass kicking contest.

[steelreserve]

you have to realize that there are points along the spectrum between those two extremes, right? No one is saying that the Steelers coaching staff is always right. Just as many are reacting against the trend to get out the torches and pitch forks whenever the Steelers don't beat their opponent by more than 3 scores.

The Pats make many teams look foolish on defense. Pus, the reality is, the Steelers secondary is one of the worst in the league. All anyone is saying is that one week is not a trend. It is an isolated game. If no improvement is made in Week 2 on the same issues, then there is a pattern and therefore a problem that can be directly blamed on the coaches. Prior to that, we can be pissed our favorite team lost, we can lament the lack of a strong defense, we can complain about mental mistakes, etc - but we should most likely hold off on claiming that Tomlin, Butler, and Haley are 3 of the worst coaches in the league and the Steelers will always enter each game as hampered by their coaching staff as a one legged man in an ass kicking contest.


I've got news for you, we made ourselves look foolish on defense. Because we were foolish. Not a fire-the-coaches thing, but it was 100% on us, and if we continue to use that strategy Butler and Tomlin should both be kicked in the nuts. Haley too, for good measure.

So our secondary is one of the worst in the league. Whose fault is that? When you're in your ninth year and one of the longest-tenured coaches in the league, that is ... All. You. Ken.

[zulater]

I've got news for you, we made ourselves look foolish on defense. Because we were foolish. Not a fire-the-coaches thing, but it was 100% on us, and if we continue to use that strategy Butler and Tomlin should both be kicked in the nuts. Haley too, for good measure.

So our secondary is one of the worst in the league. Whose fault is that? When you're in your ninth year and one of the longest-tenured coaches in the league, that is ... All. You. Ken.

:applaudit:

p.s. the kick in the nuts line made me spit my drink laughing just now! :lol:

[polamalubeast]

The problem I have with Tomlin / Haley, is that they are too conservative.The points scored is more important than the time of possession and I not think Tomlin realizes that.

[Psycho Ward 86]

The problem I have with Tomlin / Haley, is that they are too conservative.The points scored is more important than the time of possession and I not think Tomlin realizes that.

please dont encourage them. Haley's going to call another double reverse WR pass with Antonio Brown again

[tube517]

please dont encourage them. Haley's going to call another double reverse WR pass with Antonio Brown again

Yep. Remember Haley called a reverse with that "speedster", jerrico cotchery :lol:

[polamalubeast]

And the steelers are so slow in the no-huddle/2 minutes offense.......

[teegre]

And the steelers are so slow in the no-huddle/2 minutes offense.......

Yet, the Steelers were still ranked #1 in scoring in the final 2 minutes of each half....

...and, they were #1 by a significant margin (something like 70 points, and second place was 40 points).

[polamalubeast]

Yet, the Steelers were still ranked #1 in scoring in the final 2 minutes of each half....

...and, they were #1 by a significant margin (something like 70 points, and second place was 40 points).


But it does not change the fact that the Steelers are sometimes too slow in this situation as in the first half against the pats or last year against the buccanners in first half.

[fansince'76]

Forgot about this new smiley...

:mob:

:chuckle:

[smokin3000gt]

Forgot about this new smiley...

:mob:

:chuckle:

It should be :tomlin: or :coaches: instead of mob :grin:

[hawaiiansteeler]

So every single time a coach is criticized by a fan the fan is a moron? Head coaches are infallible and the Rooney's are the only one's smart enough to see that? That's the sense I get here.

Yeah I guess we're just not smart enough to understand how marvelously the Steelers were coached against the Patriots.

huh?

wtf are you talking about? :noidea:

[Mojouw]

But it does not change the fact that the Steelers are sometimes too slow in this situation as in the first half against the pats or last year against the buccanners in first half.

Wait. So facts don't change the matter? How does that work?

This whole debate is an example of my point from earlier - slow compared to what/who? Our perceptions of what "should" be or actual comparisons with other NFL teams?

For instance between 2014 and 2015 (counting regular season and playoffs) the Patriots appeared in 20 games and ran 299 plays with under 3 minutes to go in a half. They put up 13 TDs. During the same time period and same conditions, the Steelers ran 341 plays in 18 games resulting in 16 TDs. Not really slicing it up any further than that, the math says the Steelers ran MORE plays in LESS games - so they MAY be doing things much faster. I realize that w/out looking at game situations you can't account for running out the clock etc - but first glance seems to support the idea that the Steelers run MORE plays under 3 minutes than one of the teams most noted for playing fast.

[polamalubeast]

Wait. So facts don't change the matter? How does that work?

This whole debate is an example of my point from earlier - slow compared to what/who? Our perceptions of what "should" be or actual comparisons with other NFL teams?

For instance between 2014 and 2015 (counting regular season and playoffs) the Patriots appeared in 20 games and ran 299 plays with under 3 minutes to go in a half. They put up 13 TDs. During the same time period and same conditions, the Steelers ran 341 plays in 18 games resulting in 16 TDs. Not really slicing it up any further than that, the math says the Steelers ran MORE plays in LESS games - so they MAY be doing things much faster. I realize that w/out looking at game situations you can't account for running out the clock etc - but first glance seems to support the idea that the Steelers run MORE plays under 3 minutes than one of the teams most noted for playing fast.


That does not say everything, because sometimes this is the opponent who has the ball! As Thursday, the Patriots had 0 play with 2 or 3 minutes left in the 2nd or 4th quarter since it was the Steelers who had the ball!

And I not just speak when this is the 2 minutes offense, I would like the steelers play faster, especially in the first half to take advantage of the talent to the offense that the Steelers have but unfortunately Tomlin give too much importance of the time of possession.

[Mojouw]

That does not say everything, because sometimes this is the opponent who has the ball! As Thursday, the Patriots had 0 play with 2 or 3 minutes left in the 2nd or 4th quarter since it was the Steelers who had the ball!

And I not just speak when this is the 2 minutes offense, I would like the steelers play faster, especially in the first half to take advantage of the talent to the offense that the Steelers have but unfortunately Tomlin give too much importance of the time of possession.

http://pfref.com/tiny/iAElm

So last year the Steelers were 6th in offensive plays ran during the regular season. Only 59 plays behind the Eagles and their acknowledged warp speed offense. Patriots were lauded in the press last season for playing extremely fast and they only ran 5 more offensive plays than the Steelers.

So, again, based on what actual facts - do the Steelers play slow on offense?

[polamalubeast]

http://pfref.com/tiny/iAElm

So last year the Steelers were 6th in offensive plays ran during the regular season. Only 59 plays behind the Eagles and their acknowledged warp speed offense. Patriots were lauded in the press last season for playing extremely fast and they only ran 5 more offensive plays than the Steelers.

So, again, based on what actual facts - do the Steelers play slow on offense?


http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/pacestats2014


And each year,the Steelers have one of the teams with the less drive in the nfl.

[teegre]

But it does not change the fact that the Steelers are sometimes too slow in this situation as in the first half against the pats or last year against the buccanners in first half.

Okay. :huh:

I once say a picture of Kate Upton that wasn't very good.

Michael Jordan occasionally missed a shot. Or, two.

And, YES, the Steelers did not score on every single 2-minute drill... just more so than every other team in the NFL.

[zulater]

Please enough with the stats. If you can't see the Steelers have trouble executing a 2 minute offense or even a 5 minute offense then you just haven't been paying attention for the past few seasons.

The Steelers burn more clock on less plays when they try to score in a hurry than any team out there. I'm in a hurry now, but if you need examples then you probably just need a new team, because you sure as hell haven't paid much attention to this one.

- - - Updated - - -


Okay. :huh:

I once say a picture of Kate Upton that wasn't very good.

Michael Jordan occasionally missed a shot. Or, two.

And, YES, the Steelers did not score on every single 2-minute drill... just more so than every other team in the NFL.

A lot more fg's than td's, and how many of those were of no consequense? I mean that last td against Pats meant nothing, but if you want to credit it as a success, good for you. I wont.


The Steelers hurry up offense is as often as not painful to watch.

[teegre]

Please enough with the stats. If you can't see the Steelers have trouble executing a 2 minute offense or even a 5 minute offense then you just haven't been paying attention for the past few seasons.

The Steelers burn more clock on less plays when they try to score in a hurry than any team out there. I'm in a hurry now, but if you need examples then you probably just need a new team, because you sure as hell haven't paid much attention to this one.

Wait... earlier someone said that Tomlin was more concerned with TOP than with scoring points.

Ergo, I talked about the only stat that matters: points scored during those 2-minute drills.... and, the Steelers were #1.

But, YES, other teams sure did look great while simultaneously not scoring points. :huh:

[polamalubeast]

Please enough with the stats. If you can't see the Steelers have trouble executing a 2 minute offense or even a 5 minute offense then you just haven't been paying attention for the past few seasons.

The Steelers burn more clock on less plays when they try to score in a hurry than any team out there. I'm in a hurry now, but if you need examples then you probably just need a new team, because you sure as hell haven't paid much attention to this one.

- - - Updated - - -



A lot more fg's than td's, and how many of those were of no consequense? I mean that last td against Pats meant nothing, but if you want to credit it as a success, good for you. I wont.


The Steelers hurry up offense is as often as not painful to watch.


100% agree

[teegre]

A lot more fg's than td's, and how many of those were of no consequense? I mean that last td against Pats meant nothing, but if you want to credit it as a success, good for you. I wont.


The Steelers hurry up offense is as often as not painful to watch.

A lot of teams have "meaningless" TDs scored in the final 2-minutes... not just the Steelers.

[zulater]

A lot of teams have "meaningless" TDs scored in the final 2-minutes... not just the Steelers.

When I get to Ky I'll offer you up some of the Steelers Chinese fire drill type 2 minute drills if you like. The ones where they waste time outs and clock with equal aplomb. But I'm out the door now so it will have to wait a day.

[teegre]

When I get to Ky I'll offer you up some of the Steelers Chinese fire drill type 2 minute drills if you like. The ones where they waste time outs and clock with equal aplomb. But I'm out the door now so it will have to wait a day.

KY???

The Chargers sure looked pretty on their 2-minute drill at the end of the half. River was flawlessly using the clock... and threw an INT. Zero points.

BB looked like a baffoon: wasting time outs, not getting out of bounds, and having Heyward-Bey drop that TD. At least the Steelers got 3 points.

[Mojouw]

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/pacestats2014


And each year,the Steelers have one of the teams with the less drive in the nfl.

Except that the table ACTUAL says that the Steelers played as the 8th FASTEST team when they were down 7 or more points. Also, the site clearly indicates that "The intent is to describe pace as dictated by each team's game plan or style of play, not pace that is situation-induced. The current definition discards plays when the score differential is greater than 10 points in the first half, plays when the score differential is greater than 8 points in the 3rd quarter, plays in the 4th quarter or overtime, and plays in the last five minutes of the first half.". So it discounts ALL of the plays that we were originally talking about, the end of half/game.

The only column that SORT of takes that into account is losing by 7 or more, and then they really ramp up the pace (this is the 2nd to last column). Looking at the last column, other teams that are similar to the Steelers overall slow ranking (24) are Dallas (31), Seattle (28), and SF (23). Those are all similarly RB centric offenses. Hmmmm....wonder what the pattern could be there...

If you are scoring the 7th most points in the league, running the 6th most offensive plays, 4th in percentage of drives ending in points, still lead the league in taking the longest per drive (2 minutes and 59 seconds - which is only 30 seconds LONGER than the league average and 53 seconds longer than the shortest team - the Eagles), AND be 2nd in time of possession per game behind the best rushing team in football (Dallas) - how is that a bad thing?

Does anyone want this defense on the field more frequently?

[teegre]

Except that the table ACTUAL says that the Steelers played as the 8th FASTEST team when they were down 7 or more points. Also, the site clearly indicates that "The intent is to describe pace as dictated by each team's game plan or style of play, not pace that is situation-induced. The current definition discards plays when the score differential is greater than 10 points in the first half, plays when the score differential is greater than 8 points in the 3rd quarter, plays in the 4th quarter or overtime, and plays in the last five minutes of the first half.". So it discounts ALL of the plays that we were originally talking about, the end of half/game.

The only column that SORT of takes that into account is losing by 7 or more, and then they really ramp up the pace (this is the 2nd to last column). Looking at the last column, other teams that are similar to the Steelers overall slow ranking (24) are Dallas (31), Seattle (28), and SF (23). Those are all similarly RB centric offenses. Hmmmm....wonder what the pattern could be there...

If you are scoring the 7th most points in the league, running the 6th most offensive plays, 4th in percentage of drives ending in points, still lead the league in taking the longest per drive (2 minutes and 59 seconds - which is only 30 seconds LONGER than the league average and 53 seconds longer than the shortest team - the Eagles), AND be 2nd in time of possession per game behind the best rushing team in football (Dallas) - how is that a bad thing?

Does anyone want this defense on the field more frequently?

Yeah... but, BB looked stupid.

[Mojouw]

Yeah. Let's ignore stats and trends.

But we can look at outliers and biased personal perceptions as sound evidence instead!

Good lord, this is a waste of time.

[Mojouw]

Please enough with the stats. If you can't see the Steelers have trouble executing a 2 minute offense or even a 5 minute offense then you just haven't been paying attention for the past few seasons.

The Steelers burn more clock on less plays when they try to score in a hurry than any team out there. I'm in a hurry now, but if you need examples then you probably just need a new team, because you sure as hell haven't paid much attention to this one.

- - - Updated - - -



A lot more fg's than td's, and how many of those were of no consequense? I mean that last td against Pats meant nothing, but if you want to credit it as a success, good for you. I wont.


The Steelers hurry up offense is as often as not painful to watch.

I just can't help myself. You do realize that NONE of the things said in your post are facts? They are ALL personal perceptions?

In 2014 the Steelers had 9 touchdowns that came in the 2 minute drill tied for second in the league. Roethlisberger threw for 224 more yards in the 2 minute drill than any other QB in the league and produced 7 TDs against 1 INT.

If you go to five minutes or less in a half or game the Steelers are tied for 3rd in TDs @ 13. Roethlisberger continues to be a stats leader.

These are facts. Perhaps what you are really railing against is the red zone or overall drive efficiency rates? Let's take a look (Oh NO! More stats!):

In 2014, the Steelers were 4th in % of drives ending in scores. However, you are more than right that their efficiency in the red zone stinks. Coming in at #19 in the league with 51.72% of red zone possessions resulting in a TD. But that is not the end all be all stat, as Oakland lead the league at over 70%.

So the Steelers play fast enough, they just can't put it in the endzone more than 50% of the time they get inside the 20. That is likely where the real problem lies, not in pacing.

But we can talk about pacing all damn day if you guys want.

[Count Steeler]

I have been a proponent of taking penalties when we are in the red zone so that we can get out of the red zone and increase our chance of scoring. I kid, somewhat.

[polamalubeast]

I am not just talking to play faster at the end of each half, but also in the first and third quarter!

The Steelers were 20th for points scored in the first quarter and 29th in the 3rd quarter.

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/1st-quarter-points-per-game

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/3rd-quarter-points-per-game

The Steelers must be more aggressive in this situations, otherwise it wastes the talent on offense.

- - - Updated - - -


I have been a proponent of taking penalties when we are in the red zone so that we can get out of the red zone and increase our chance of scoring. I kid, somewhat.

The steelers are always been terrible in the situation football and this is a another problem

[Mojouw]

I am not just talking to play faster at the end of each half, but also in the first and third quarter!

The Steelers were 20th for points scored in the first quarter and 29th in the 3rd quarter.

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/1st-quarter-points-per-game

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/3rd-quarter-points-per-game

The Steelers must be more aggressive in this situations, otherwise it wastes the talent on offense.

- - - Updated - - -



The steelers are always been terrible in the situation football and this is a another problem

And they were 2nd in second quarter points and 1st in fourth quarter points. That gives us 6th in first half points and 10th in second half points. Not great, but top third of the league in either measure.

I think what you and others are really frustrated by is not the pace (# of plays run) but the result of those plays. In other words, getting into the red zone 3 times and instead of coming away with 21 points, coming away with 9 or less! No that is something I can get on board with.

[teegre]

I have been a proponent of taking penalties when we are in the red zone so that we can get out of the red zone and increase our chance of scoring. I kid, somewhat.

:rofl:

Joking aside, RED-ZONE efficiency is the offense's biggest problem... (not how pretty the 2-minute drill looks).

I've averred for years, that if they could turn two FGs per game into TDs, this offense would be #1 in the league. They've improved, but not by much. As in: they should have easily put up 35 last Thursday. Alas...

[fansince'76]

Joking aside, RED-ZONE efficiency is the offense's biggest problem... (not how pretty the 2-minute drill looks).

I've averred for years, that if they could turn two FGs per game into TDs, this offense would be #1 in the league. They've improved, but not by much. As in: they should have easily put up 35 last Thursday. Alas...

They should have hung 40+ on them, even without Bell and Bryant. For as much as people are on the "OMG! The Steelers defense is a steaming pile of shit!" bandwagon, the Patriots defense looks almost as bad.

[polamalubeast]

They should have hung 40+ on them, even without Bell and Bryant. For as much as people are on the "OMG! The Steelers defense is a steaming pile of shit!" bandwagon, the Patriots defense looks almost as bad.



With the exception of last year, the Patriots have always been one of the worst teams in yards given, but they were always in the top 10 in points allowed because they are great in the red zone defense and good for create turnovers.

The Steelers are terrible in defense in the red zone since the start of the season including the preseason and of course, they create no turnovers,this is the big difference between the pats defense and the steelers defense

[fansince'76]

With the exception of last year, the Patriots have always been one of the worst teams in yards given, but they were always in the top 10 in points allowed because they are great in the red zone defense and good for create turnovers.

The Steelers are terrible in defense in the red zone since the start of the season including the preseason and of course, they create no turnovers,this is the big difference between the pats defense and the steelers defense

Last Thursday night, the Steelers offense stopped themselves, was my point.

[teegre]

They should have hung 40+ on them, even without Bell and Bryant. For as much as people are on the "OMG! The Steelers defense is a steaming pile of shit!" bandwagon, the Patriots defense looks almost as bad.

I know, huh.

They were slobbering all over Malcolm Butler... who gave up the second most passing yards of the entire weekend. :wtf:

[hawaiiansteeler]

Please enough with the stats.


why, because they don't support your argument and in fact contradict what you're saying?

[zulater]

KY???

The Chargers sure looked pretty on their 2-minute drill at the end of the half. River was flawlessly using the clock... and threw an INT. Zero points.

BB looked like a baffoon: wasting time outs, not getting out of bounds, and having Heyward-Bey drop that TD. At least the Steelers got 3 points.

Abbreviation for Kentucky. Where I spent the last thirteen hours driving to. Now I'm going to get some sleep. Later I'll give examples. r

[teegre]

Abbreviation for Kentucky. Where I spent the last thirteen hours driving to. Now I'm going to get some sleep. Later I'll give examples. r

KY for Kentucky. :doh:


In my defense, I am so used to these young people using letters for phrases (BRB = be right back, FWIW = for what it's worth) that the abbreviation for a state never even crossed my mind.

I was was racking my brain trying to figure out "KY". I settled on the phrase "key you" (as in: I'll use a keyboard and type you a response.) Anyway...

[polamalubeast]

643820276283756544


Ouch!...This is pathetic!

[tube517]

643820276283756544


Ouch!...This is pathetic!


Those cool shades make everything rosy. :coffee:

[zulater]

KY for Kentucky. :doh:


In my defense, I am so used to these young people using letters for phrases (BRB = be right back, FWIW = for what it's worth) that the abbreviation for a state never even crossed my mind.

I was was racking my brain trying to figure out "KY". I settled on the phrase "key you" (as in: I'll use a keyboard and type you a response.) Anyway...


No problem. And listen, I'm not anti Tomlin. I don't want him fired. I think he's a very good coach. Sure I blow off a bit of steam in his general direction after a loss, but I realize he's not going anywhere nor do I want him to.

But all that said I don't think a lot of the criticism directed his way is unfair.( though obviously some is) I think there's a lot of rationale posters and fans who point out valid points of concern. For instance I think there's been multiple times the Steelers have butchered clock management at critical moments, though at the moment due to overwork my brain is fried and I can't put my finger on specific instances. For example I remember SB XV there was some real sloppy clock management at the end of the game. It didn't seem as though we got nearly as many plays off as we should have.

Also a couple games last year where I vaguely remember using time outs and clock and getting few actual plays off. Maybe Tampa Bay, and Saints game last year? Again my brain is fried, been driving to the legal limit for about 3 weeks and I can't quite put my finger on it, nor will I probably get around to remembering the specifics I need to support my argument anytime soon, so I'll concede the point.

I got more important things to do with my time at the moment than arguing Steelers clock management.

So there you go. You win. :nw:

[Cyphon25]

643820276283756544


Ouch!...This is pathetic!


Those cool shades make everything rosy. :coffee:


Just listened to this and couldn't believe it. I really wish David Todd would just respond straight up to that like "are you fucking serious with that answer?".

I made a thread after his post game presser about some of the stuff he says and once again there are only 2 ways I can see this. Tomlin is either the biggest bullshitter in the world or he is really that dumb. Honestly I am leaning towards the latter. I know he bullshits some, but this would just be beyond believable. He is a moron.

[teegre]

No problem. And listen, I'm not anti Tomlin. I don't want him fired. I think he's a very good coach. Sure I blow off a bit of steam in his general direction after a loss, but I realize he's not going anywhere nor do I want him to.

But all that said I don't think a lot of the criticism directed his way is unfair.( though obviously some is) I think there's a lot of rationale posters and fans who point out valid points of concern. For instance I think there's been multiple times the Steelers have butchered clock management at critical moments, though at the moment due to overwork my brain is fried and I can't put my finger on specific instances. For example I remember SB XV there was some real sloppy clock management at the end of the game. It didn't seem as though we got nearly as many plays off as we should have.

Also a couple games last year where I vaguely remember using time outs and clock and getting few actual plays off. Maybe Tampa Bay, and Saints game last year? Again my brain is fried, been driving to the legal limit for about 3 weeks and I can't quite put my finger on it, nor will I probably get around to remembering the specifics I need to support my argument anytime soon, so I'll concede the point.

I got more important things to do with my time at the moment than arguing Steelers clock management.

So there you go. You win. :nw:

I hear you. I really do.

Obviously, no coach is perfect. Noll wasn't. Cowher wasn't. And, Tomlin isn't. I've had my qualms about each of them... and, Yes, fans have the "right" (for lack of a better word) to vent after a loss.

But, threads entitled "Fire _____!!!" are generally just bitch-fest, filled with fans seeking (unattainable) perfection.

From having been on many different boards, the problem is that sometimes Steelers fans have a sense of entitlement. (I'm not saying you do... at all. But, some fans do.) For example, there was a certain board where I got banned for celebrating after XLIII. All that the mods wanted to do was rip Richard BeLeau for allowing the Cardinals to come back. They couldn't even enjoy the victory, because the victory wasn't "perfect." Those are the same types of fans who get angry when the opposition scores ANY points in a game.

Perfection is not reality, and in turn, some fans never happy... and in turn, they come here to create threads about firing people.

Have Tomlin's teams misused timeouts on occasion? Yes
Have Tomlin's teams led the league in scoring on 2-minute drives? Yes

While I understand the plight (the 2-minute offense could be better), and while I admit that a timeout might get wasted here & there, the Steelers still run the most productive 2-minute drill in the NFL. Make sense?

If we are going to talk gripes, I am far more concerns about the drives that stall in the red-zone.

SUMMATION:
Worrying about the 2-minute drill is akin to worrying about the gas mileage on your Lamboughini. Whereas, the red-zone efficiency is a broken radiator hose. The latter is a "fix now."

Re: SB XLV
There was plenty of time; so, they did not need to stop the clock. That said, YES, Tomlin should have called a time out to get everyone on the same page*. As it was Randle El ran the wrong play, wasting a down.

*(Tomlin called a timeout during the middle of the final drive of SB XLIII, to do just that: get everyone on the same page. Alas...)

[zulater]

Fair enough teegre. :drink:

I will disagree slightly one thing though. Noll wasn't perfect, but damn was he good.Looking back in retrospect he made some terrible personell moves. Sometimes his loyalty outweighed his commons sense. For instance I had a neighbor who was one of the ground crew at 3 Rivers. He said at the time when Mark Malone was given shot after shot to hold the qb job that one of the reasons Noll kept with it was because he felt guilty that Malone blew out his knee playing wr at Noll's request. People don't remember Malone was one of the fastest guys on the team prior to blowing out his knee. Genuine 4.5 speed when that was a rarity. Anyway Noll felt he owed Mark more of a chance than what his talent after the injury warranted. Also there were examples of keeping a washed up Dwight White over an emerging Dwayne Board. etc...

But to the point. Talent aside. Find me the team or the time Noll got beat by an inferior team? Very rare. His record as a favorite was virtually without parallel.He got the most out of the talent he had. And unlike today's coaches, he could coach every single position on the field with competency . .

[hawaiiansteeler]

Those cool shades make everything rosy. :coffee:

I gotta find me a pair so I can be cool too: :rockon:

http://nicepickcowher.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/58/files/2012/05/mike-tomlin1.jpg

[zoneblitzerII]

9 years is long enough for coach Switzer. Time to move on and hire a real head coach.

[Craic]

And unlike today's coaches, he could coach every single position on the field with competency . .

I think that's more due to the complexity of the game today. I'm mean, just thinking about the Dline, back then, they rushed against a line that basically put their arms up, grabbed their own jersey, and tried to stay in the way of the defender. Yes, they did gapping and other things, but today's coaches also have to get Dlines to work on defending against the hand punch, leverage against what was called holding back then, etc. etc. It's like anything else. What was cutting edge back then is part of the basic skillset now, and a ton more has been added, which is why there's so many specialty coaches anymore.

[teegre]

Fair enough teegre. :drink:

I will disagree slightly one thing though. Noll wasn't perfect, but damn was he good.Looking back in retrospect he made some terrible personell moves. Sometimes his loyalty outweighed his commons sense. For instance I had a neighbor who was one of the ground crew at 3 Rivers. He said at the time when Mark Malone was given shot after shot to hold the qb job that one of the reasons Noll kept with it was because he felt guilty that Malone blew out his knee playing wr at Noll's request. People don't remember Malone was one of the fastest guys on the team prior to blowing out his knee. Genuine 4.5 speed when that was a rarity. Anyway Noll felt he owed Mark more of a chance than what his talent after the injury warranted. Also there were examples of keeping a washed up Dwight White over an emerging Dwayne Board. etc...

But to the point. Talent aside. Find me the team or the time Noll got beat by an inferior team? Very rare. His record as a favorite was virtually without parallel.He got the most out of the talent he had. And unlike today's coaches, he could coach every single position on the field with competency . .

Awesome Mark Malone story. I did not know that.

Alas, I think that some people remember two things about Noll, which clouds their judgement of him.

1. He passed on Dan Marino.

2. The playoff drought in the 80s.

TEE: What do you remember about Noll?
FAN1: He sucked... he passed on Dan Marino.
TEE: What about his four SuperBowl victories?
FAN1: Did I stutter??? I said that he sucked!!!

:smh:

[zulater]

Awesome Mark Malone story. I did not know that.

Alas, I think that some people remember two things about Noll, which clouds their judgement of him.

1. He passed on Dan Marino.

2. The playoff drought in the 80s.

TEE: What do you remember about Noll?
FAN1: He sucked... he passed on Dan Marino.
TEE: What about his four SuperBowl victories?
FAN1: Did I stutter??? I said that he sucked!!!

:smh:

Someone in the Steelers organization bought into the rumor that Marino was a coke head. First off I don't think they thought he would fall to them. but when he did then the rumor became self perpetuating, with everyone in the NFL thinking the other team's must now something they didn't. Anyway with Noll's previous dealing with the extremely talented but drug addled Joe Gilliam just the hint that Marino might have some involvement with drugs that was all that Noll needed to steer clear of Dan.

I don't know if there was ever any truth to the rumors? Because it was the early 80's and coke was the club drug of the day. It wasn't uncommon that's for sure. Sad to say myself and most of the people I hung with at the time (I'm 55 one year older than Dan) did coke occasionally and sometimes more often than that. But honestly I doubt he did. He was more of a jock, he liked his beer, I think he was a straight shooter in that sense.

What they didn't know then, what became painfully obvious within a couple years of Dan's departure from Pitt was that his senior season drop off was all about what a crappy head coach Foge Fazio was. Going from Jackie Sherrill to nice guy Foge, who couldn't coach his way out of a paper bag, was what accounted for Marino's terrible season. Had Dan come along a few years later he would have left school after his Jr. season and been a top 5 pick.

Anyway long story short to paraphrase the Lemony Snicketts books, it was a series of unfortunate events that led to the Steelers not drafting Dan Marino. I never held it against Noll. It was just the times and the history with Gilliam. .

[zulater]

I think that's more due to the complexity of the game today. I'm mean, just thinking about the Dline, back then, they rushed against a line that basically put their arms up, grabbed their own jersey, and tried to stay in the way of the defender. Yes, they did gapping and other things, but today's coaches also have to get Dlines to work on defending against the hand punch, leverage against what was called holding back then, etc. etc. It's like anything else. What was cutting edge back then is part of the basic skillset now, and a ton more has been added, which is why there's so many specialty coaches anymore.

Maybe, but funny enough the guy most credited for improving Kelvin Beachum was Noll disciple Tunch Ilkin. Tunch taught Beachum how to punch out, and how to use better leverage and refined his footwork.

[Craic]

Maybe, but funny enough the guy most credited for improving Kelvin Beachum was Noll disciple Tunch Ilkin. Tunch taught Beachum how to punch out, and how to use better leverage and refined his footwork.

Yeah, but Tunch was an O lineman who played precisely during the years where many of those changes and shifts began taking place. More interesting, about three years into Ilkin's career, the Steelers hired their first OC (maybe ever?). I have to wonder if that was partly because of the specialization of the game.

[teegre]

Someone in the Steelers organization bought into the rumor that Marino was a coke head. First off I don't think they thought he would fall to them. but when he did then the rumor became self perpetuating, with everyone in the NFL thinking the other team's must now something they didn't. Anyway with Noll's previous dealing with the extremely talented but drug addled Joe Gilliam just the hint that Marino might have some involvement with drugs that was all that Noll needed to steer clear of Dan.

I don't know if there was ever any truth to the rumors? Because it was the early 80's and coke was the club drug of the day. It wasn't uncommon that's for sure. Sad to say myself and most of the people I hung with at the time (I'm 55 one year older than Dan) did coke occasionally and sometimes more often than that. But honestly I doubt he did. He was more of a jock, he liked his beer, I think he was a straight shooter in that sense.

What they didn't know then, what became painfully obvious within a couple years of Dan's departure from Pitt was that his senior season drop off was all about what a crappy head coach Foge Fazio was. Going from Jackie Sherrill to nice guy Foge, who couldn't coach his way out of a paper bag, was what accounted for Marino's terrible season. Had Dan come along a few years later he would have left school after his Jr. season and been a top 5 pick.

Anyway long story short to paraphrase the Lemony Snicketts books, it was a series of unfortunate events that led to the Steelers not drafting Dan Marino. I never held it against Noll. It was just the times and the history with Gilliam. .

That is an excellent breakdown of the Marino incident. Excellent.

Now... we just need to have every disgruntled Steelers fan read that. I'll start but cutting & pasting it into an email to my dad (30 years, and he's still angry).

[49ers44steelers3]

Keep Uncle Tomlin and Big Blow, San Francisco owns these two clowns, and will have home field advantage in Penisburgh, expect 20,00 San Francisco fans, Steeler fans are lame and weak, and usually hide at the site of San Francisco fan.

[steel striker]

Look FS76 said it best they should have scored 40 points last week against the cheats Brown torched Butler all night but, we once again killed our-self in the red zone. Plus the cheats defense has almost as holes as the steelers defense has. Lets see what happens this Sunday against the niners.

[fansince'76]

Keep Uncle Tomlin and Big Blow, San Francisco owns these two clowns, and will have home field advantage in Penisburgh, expect 20,00 San Francisco fans, Steeler fans are lame and weak, and usually hide at the site of San Francisco fan.

Funny, thought it was a school day. Stop misusing the junior high school library's computer, kid. :yawn:

[hawaiiansteeler]

Keep Uncle Tomlin and Big Blow, San Francisco owns these two clowns, and will have home field advantage in Penisburgh, expect 20,00 San Francisco fans, Steeler fans are lame and weak, and usually hide at the site of San Francisco fan.

perhaps you should ask your Mommy to double-check your posts for errors before you send them and embarrass yourself...

[teegre]

Keep Uncle Tomlin and Big Blow, San Francisco owns these two clowns, and will have home field advantage in Penisburgh, expect 20,00 San Francisco fans, Steeler fans are lame and weak, and usually hide at the site of San Francisco fan.

From the scent of your post, I deduce that you must be from Gilroy.

From the spelling, I'd guess that you went to school in Oakland.

And, from your subtle racism, I believe that you are a tour guide in Chinatown.

[TD's & Beer]

A 49ers fan?

I knew I smelled something

[fansince'76]

From the scent of your post, I deduce that you must be from Gilroy.

From the spelling, I'd guess that you went to school in Oakland.

And, from your subtle racism, I believe that you are a tour guide in Chinatown.

Sleuth Badge winner!

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/72/SLEUTH_badge-1-.jpg

:chuckle:

[teegre]

Sleuth Badge winner!

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/72/SLEUTH_badge-1-.jpg

:chuckle:

:hatsoff:

[tube517]

Keep Uncle Tomlin and Big Blow, San Francisco owns these two clowns, and will have home field advantage in Penisburgh, expect 20,00 San Francisco fans, Steeler fans are lame and weak, and usually hide at the site of San Francisco fan.


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/45/1c/e2/451ce2819d6b4337690cb116f9025c96.jpg

[st33lersguy]

Keep Uncle Tomlin and Big Blow, San Francisco owns these two clowns, and will have home field advantage in Penisburgh, expect 20,00 San Francisco fans, Steeler fans are lame and weak, and usually hide at the site of San Francisco fan.

Tomlin and Ben are now 2-1 against the 49ers. In two meetings in Pittsburgh against those 2, the 49ers have been outscored 80-34. So much for the 49ers owning those two

[86WARD]

Tomlin. Possibly the biggest dope on the planet...

[Edman]

Can't defend this atrocity.

[Craic]

You guys are absolutely hilarious with your Tomlin Hate.

There's one goat tonight, and that's Scobee. He failed, hard. So hard he couldn't be trusted. Oh, and knowing how our special teams blows coverage at the most inopportune times, you want to trust THEM in OT? But go on hating if it makes you feel any better.

[Edman]

You guys are absolutely hilarious with your Tomlin Hate.

There's one goat tonight, and that's Scobee. He failed, hard. So hard he couldn't be trusted. Oh, and knowing how our special teams blows coverage at the most inopportune times, you want to trust THEM in OT? But go on hating if it makes you feel any better.

Scobee is the goat for missing the kick.

Tomlin is the goat for being stupid enough to trust him again, knowing how terrible he is.

[teegre]

You guys are absolutely hilarious with your Tomlin Hate.

There's one goat tonight, and that's Scobee. He failed, hard. So hard he couldn't be trusted. Oh, and knowing how our special teams blows coverage at the most inopportune times, you want to trust THEM in OT? But go on hating if it makes you feel any better.

Exactly.

People want to trust Scobee to kick a 50 yard FG. :rofl2:

[Craic]

Scobee is the goat for missing the kick.

Tomlin is the goat for being stupid enough to trust him again, knowing how terrible he is.

Unfortunately, there's not much you can do at certain points but send your kicker out there, even in a 50/50 shot. But of all the questioning of Tomlin's decisions, yeah, that one I can see the most credence in.

[zoneblitzerII]

He's a good cheerleader but a dunce of a coach, a literal dunce. The sooner we move on from him, the better.

[86WARD]

Exactly.

People want to trust Scobee to kick a 50 yard FG. :rofl2:

No. But you don't throw the ball on 4th & 1 and if you are going to throw, you don't run a pass play like that...lol. And on the other 4th down, he should have punted...two dumb mistakes by the head coach that lost the game...along side the kicker.

[steel9guy]

YOU KICK THE FREAKEN FIELD GOAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NEVER BEEN THIS FREAKEN MAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Craic]

YOU KICK THE FREAKEN FIELD GOAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NEVER BEEN THIS FREAKEN MAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Did you even watch the game? You want to send Scobee out there, again?

[86WARD]

You don't kick the FG with Scobee back there. You call better plays.

[steel9guy]

Did you even watch the game? You want to send Scobee out there, again?

Over throwing a pass to Antonio Brown with a running and shaky QB. Scobee has to make one sometime.

[teegre]

No. But you don't throw the ball on 4th & 1 and if you are going to throw, you don't run a pass play like that...lol. And on the other 4th down, he should have punted...two dumb mistakes by the head coach that lost the game...along side the kicker.

AB was open. It was a routine throw. :huh:

- - - Updated - - -


You don't kick the FG with Scobee back there. You call better plays.

Such as... one to your best player... who is open.

Check & check.

:huh:

[zoneblitzerII]

Exactly.

People want to trust Scobee to kick a 50 yard FG. :rofl2:

The logic in that is as follows:
if the kick is good you win the game.
if not you still turn over the field.
if you go for it and do not make it, you turn over possession.
if you go for it and make it, you prolong possession.
One play absolutely ensures victory in that scenario, unequivocally. And that is why the announcers were a bit stunned as to why the "Coach", chose not to go for it.
now, you can say the kicker is struggling and he sucks yadda yadda, but, he is, after all, an experienced long range kicker who has shown to be physically capable of performing such feats AND in sports, you usually allow players to work through their struggles to achieve success on the field.
given all of these factors, the computer says kick no matter how much it makes you want to gag. You kick to win the game.

[steel9guy]

I have something for Tomlin. Run the ball more with Bell. Instead of stupid play calls on 4th down.

[NCSteeler]

The logic in that is as follows:
if the kick is good you win the game.
if not you still turn over the field.
if you go for it and do not make it, you turn over possession.
if you go for it and make it, you prolong possession.
One play absolutely ensures victory in that scenario, unequivocally. And that is why the announcers were a bit stunned as to why the "Coach", chose not to go for it.
now, you can say the kicker is struggling and he sucks yadda yadda, but, he is, after all, an experienced long range kicker who has shown to be physically capable of performing such feats AND in sports, you usually allow players to work through their struggles to achieve success on the field.
given all of these factors, the computer says kick no matter how much it makes you want to gag. You kick to win the game.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[NCSteeler]

I have something for Tomlin. Run the ball more with Bell. Instead of stupid play calls on 4th down.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[NCSteeler]

Cant blame the coach for the incompetence of the players cock fag. Josh scobee missed two field goals and brown dropped a touch down pass... keep sucking cock faggot... pass your **** wife to me... maybe your daughter can watch

Someone ban this assclown


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[teegre]

The logic in that is as follows:
if the kick is good you win the game.
if not you still turn over the field.
if you go for it and do not make it, you turn over possession.
if you go for it and make it, you prolong possession.
One play absolutely ensures victory in that scenario, unequivocally. And that is why the announcers were a bit stunned as to why the "Coach", chose not to go for it.
now, you can say the kicker is struggling and he sucks yadda yadda, but, he is, after all, an experienced long range kicker who has shown to be physically capable of performing such feats AND in sports, you usually allow players to work through their struggles to achieve success on the field.
given all of these factors, the computer says kick no matter how much it makes you want to gag. You kick to win the game.

Odds. It comes down to odds.

The FG try was not the best odds tonight.
Most nights, yes.
Tonight, no.

[steel9guy]

Cant blame the coach for the incompetence of the players cock fag. Josh scobee missed two field goals and brown dropped a touch down pass... keep sucking cock faggot... pass your **** wife to me... maybe your daughter can watch

Troll

[86WARD]

Cant blame the coach for the players not doing their fucking job and making plays.... you people are more fit to be raven fans...

You can blame the coach for making dumb decisions. Following his fat gut that led him wrong...again. You can blame the coach for piss poor play calling...lol.

[86WARD]

keep blaming tomlin for 2 missed field goals... stick to figure skating.. none of you ever had a good career playing ball.... cant blame the coach for the players not doing there job... more than enough chances to win that game

And Tomlin blew two of them with his play calls on 4th down. He and Haley had a shit game plan from the start. Keep blaming the players...most of which played fairly well and ignore the source of the problem. Looks like your "ball career" was pretty much in the shitter too tough guy.

[86WARD]

I'll be at 3601 South Broad Street in Philadelphia tomorrow. Come on down. You won't show. Mommy won't let you out that late.

[teegre]

:popcorn:

[86WARD]

:popcorn:

:lol:

[SteelMayhem72]

Over throwing a pass to Antonio Brown with a running and shaky QB. Scobee has to make one sometime.
I agree...you let the guy redeem himself and it will boost his confidence and now his confidence is definitely shot...if he misses oh well...i think our D was playing well enough to win but you still gotta try that kick anyway with a veteran kicker...he had plenty of leg...not like he was kicking them short

[SteelMayhem72]

The logic in that is as follows:
if the kick is good you win the game.
if not you still turn over the field.
if you go for it and do not make it, you turn over possession.
if you go for it and make it, you prolong possession.
One play absolutely ensures victory in that scenario, unequivocally. And that is why the announcers were a bit stunned as to why the "Coach", chose not to go for it.
now, you can say the kicker is struggling and he sucks yadda yadda, but, he is, after all, an experienced long range kicker who has shown to be physically capable of performing such feats AND in sports, you usually allow players to work through their struggles to achieve success on the field.
given all of these factors, the computer says kick no matter how much it makes you want to gag. You kick to win the game.
I couldnt have said it better

[hawaiiansteeler]

here's the latest NFL draft rumor:

the Steelers are trying to package Josh Scobee, Jarvis Jones, Cam Thomas, Landry Jones and Dri Archer for a new head coach...;)

[86WARD]

here's the latest NFL draft rumor:

the Steelers are trying to package Josh Scobee, Jarvis Jones, Cam Thomas, Landry Jones and Dri Archer for a new head coach...;)

DEAL.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Steelers out-kicked, out-coached in loss to Ravens

Bryan DeArdo
Pittsburgh Newsletter

The Steelers outplayed the Ravens on Thursday, but inferior coaching doomed the Steelers in their 23-20 overtime loss to the Ravens.

Two mind-boggling fourth down calls set up Baltimore's game-winning field goal, a 52-yarder by Justin Tucker to hand Pittsburgh a loss even uglier than their Week 1 setback at New England three weeks earlier.

With Le'Veon Bell running at will-he finished with 129 yards rushing on 22 carries-Steelers coach Mike Tomlin and offensive coordinator Todd Haley elected to not give him the ball with the game on the line. After Bell gained 30 yards on three carries on the Steelers first drive of overtime, Pittsburgh went away from its running back, choosing instead to have Michael Vick pass, then and run for no gain on consecutive plays.

On their next possession, after a stellar defensive stand by its defense, Pittsburgh had the ball in field goal range on fourth and one at the Ravens' 33-yard-line. But instead of giving it to their All-Pro running back, and with no confidence in Josh Scobee, who missed two field goals and also deserves his brunt of the blame for the loss, the Steelers tried a low-percentage pass to Antonio Brown that expectedly fell incomplete.

Pittsburgh's defense, which played well for most of the night, finally gave up too much ground, as Joe Flacco moved Baltimore's offense 32 yards for the game-winning field goal.

Despite having arguably the best back in the NFL that spent most of the night shredding the Ravens defense, Pittsburgh's coaching staff instead put the game in the hands of Vick, who shouldn't have been put in that position in his first game as a starter. He played well, completing 19-of-26 passes, but when you have the best player at his position, his number must be called with the game on the line.

to read rest of article:

http://pit.247sports.com/Bolt/Steelers-out-coached-in-loss-to-Ravens--39883164

[polamalubeast]

It was terrible...Tomlin is maybe the 3rd best HC in the AFC North right now.....

[steel striker]

I just don't know how you could not have given the Ball to Bell in those situations. My god but, as usual Haley tries to get too cute then it cost the steelers the win.

[ALLD]

Tomlin forgot to make the adjustment in his head that we had Vick playing instead of BB. The standard is the standard is a nice platitude, but realistically you need to account for talent among different players to plan successfully.

[Texasteel]

It was terrible...Tomlin is maybe the 3rd best HC in the AFC North right now.....

He could possible be the 3rd best coach on the Steelers. { Can't believe I said that.]

[hawaiiansteeler]

He could possible be the 3rd best coach on the Steelers. { Can't believe I said that.]

who's ahead of him, Munchak and Butler?

[GBMelBlount]

By season's end Tomlin (like every year with Ben) will be rated a top shelf coach.

[86WARD]

By season's end Tomlin (like every year with Ben) will be rated a top shelf coach.

But for Tomlin,,will,it be warranted...

[hawaiiansteeler]

I have something for Tomlin. Run the ball more with Bell. Instead of stupid play calls on 4th down.

might want to cc Todd Haley on that memo to Tomlin...

[tube517]

might want to cc Todd Haley on that memo to Tomlin...

Haley only relays messages by napkin, not emails. :chuckle:

[blackngold8766]

Odds. It comes down to odds.

The FG try was not the best odds tonight.
Most nights, yes.
Tonight, no.


whats up Teegre
Understood odds weren't great based upon past experiences this season but what are your options the rest of the game. Unless they were going to score a td at some point you have to send him back out there. At that level if you don't have confidence in him at 50 yds I highly doubt you feel much better at 40 or 30.

[teegre]

whats up Teegre
Understood odds weren't great based upon past experiences this season but what are your options the rest of the game. Unless they were going to score a td at some point you have to send him back out there. At that level if you don't have confidence in him at 50 yds I highly doubt you feel much better at 40 or 30.

What's up, brother?

The last I heard from you, you were driving out to fix some powerlines... and then, Steelers Fever suddenly died. What I want to know is: what the hell did you do??? :rofl2:

To answer your question:
Honestly, I would have kept driving and driving until they scored a TD. I was having visions of the "Kris Brown FOUR missed field goal" game. Sometimes, guys just get into a funk... and Scobee was definitely in a funk; hence, I probably would not have gone with him even at the 10.

Good to see that you've found your way here. Welcome.

[polamalubeast]

Time for a change?

[fansince'76]

I've had enough of Haley's shit play calling, I know that much. It's like watching an 85-year-old woman trying to drive a Ferrari.

[lipps83]

Hi everyone. I was formally a Mike Tomlin supporter, but no more after today.

He is a turd that needs to be flushed.

[st33lersguy]

Let's be honest, this team will miss the playoffs twice out of every 3 seasons and never make it past the wildcard round for the rest of Tomlin's tenure. This idiot needs to be fired!

[polamalubeast]

The steelers will miss the playoffs for the 3rd time in the last 4 years......No playoff win since 2010.....

[MrPgh]

There are two extremes in regards to coaches. One extreme is what the Browns do, firing their coach every season or two seasons. The other extreme is what the Steelers do, keeping their coaches for the better part of 20 years no matter what. I think there's a happy medium in there somewhere. The Steelers are not going to suddenly become an "unstable franchise" if they were to move on from Tomlin.

[86WARD]

He got abused by Harbaugh today.

[polamalubeast]

He got abused by Harbaugh today.


again

[Mach1]

Consistently losing to suck teams year in year out is getting old too

[SteelerFanInStl]

I'm ready for a cleansing of the coaching staff. The only coach that i want back is Munchak.

[lipps83]

There are two extremes in regards to coaches. One extreme is what the Browns do, firing their coach every season or two seasons. The other extreme is what the Steelers do, keeping their coaches for the better part of 20 years no matter what. I think there's a happy medium in there somewhere. The Steelers are not going to suddenly become an "unstable franchise" if they were to move on from Tomlin.

Yeah, but you know the Rooney's smile from ear to ear when anyone announces "Steelers only 3 coaches since 1969".

[fansince'76]

I'm ready for a cleansing of the coaching staff. The only coach that i want back is Munchak.

Butler has been doing it with smoke and mirrors. Lake needs to go, Smith needs to go and Haley needs to go.

[lipps83]

I'm ready for a cleansing of the coaching staff. The only coach that i want back is Munchak.

I am more than willing to give Butler a few more years. He has really impressed me with what he did with the pile of shit Lebeau left him.

[86WARD]

If "Cool Shades" is staying, I'd keep Haley to be honest. Smith and Lake have to go regardless.

[MrPgh]

Yeah, but you know the Rooney's smile from ear to ear when anyone announces "Steelers only 3 coaches since 1969".

I guess they can smile when there is no playoff revenue too.

[Shoes]

No way in hell would Tomlin sign another contract in Pittsburgh if I were ArtII. Tomlin has a big bag of BullS**t, thats what he excels in.

[86WARD]

Great day for this thread BTW.

[Drazo85]

No way in hell would Tomlin sign another contract in Pittsburgh if I were ArtII. Tomlin has a big bag of BullS**t, thats what he excels in.
Fire Rooneys!!!

[EzraTank]

The steelers will miss the playoffs for the 3rd time in the last 4 years......No playoff win since 2010.....

So basically Tomlin has yet to win a playoff game without Cowher's players.

[Shoes]

Fire Rooneys!!!


Once Dan is out of the picture, you may be saying that in truth!

[MrPgh]

Since Tomlin isn't getting fired, let's see if the Rooneys are at least willing to take personnel decisions out of his hands. Tomlin's failure with those decisions come mostly from his arrogance.

[SteelerFanInStl]

Butler has been doing it with smoke and mirrors. Lake needs to go, Smith needs to go and Haley needs to go.
It's hard to tell if some of the defensive failures are due to lack of talent or poor coaching/play calling. The defense has been abused all season by mediocre QBs. We consistently sit back in a soft zone and get picked apart.

[ALLD]

A good scheme doesn't lose to a 4-10 team with only 4 picks and a journeyman QB that has 12 days with the team. There's something wrong there.

[86WARD]

A good scheme doesn't lose to a 4-10 team with only 4 picks and a journeyman QB that has 12 days with the team. There's something wrong there.

QFT.

[Shoes]

A good scheme doesn't lose to a 4-10 team with only 4 picks and a journeyman QB that has 12 days with the team. There's something wrong there.

Indeed, its on the coach!

[zulater]

This is the most futile thread in the history of internet message boarding! Outside of finding dead hookers in his yard or kiddie porn on his pc he's not going to be fired! Period end of story! Live with it, Tomin isn't going anywhere. And he's not a bad coach anyway. In fact I would say he's a good coach. One of the top 6 or 7 in the league. If you don't agree tell me who's better. Or better yet sell it to the fan bases of the other teams that their coaches are better. We only see the warts on our own guys.

[st33lersguy]

When is this asshat's contract up. Rooneys should have his head examined for sticking with this moron. 3 missed playoff appearances in 4 years with an elite QB.

[Steel Peon]

It's not over yet, but overall it's been a hellishly tough season, and opinion-wise, we've been in and out of playoff contention several times all year. Given that this is Butler's first year as DC, and we've had great success on offense as well, then there's really not a shit load to be deathly pessimistic about. IF this season is over after next weeks game, then I still say give Tomlin at least one more year before thinking about changing leadership.

[MrPgh]

It's not over yet, but overall it's been a hellishly tough season, and opinion-wise, we've been in and out of playoff contention several times all year. Given that this is Butler's first year as DC, and we've had great success on offense as well, then there's really not a shit load to be deathly pessimistic about. IF this season is over after next weeks game, then I still say give Tomlin at least one more year before thinking about changing leadership.

Would you let him continue making personnel decisions?

[steelreserve]

This is the most futile thread in the history of internet message boarding! Outside of finding dead hookers in his yard or kiddie porn on his pc he's not going to be fired! Period end of story! Live with it, Tomin isn't going anywhere. And he's not a bad coach anyway. In fact I would say he's a good coach. One of the top 6 or 7 in the league. If you don't agree tell me who's better. Or better yet sell it to the fan bases of the other teams that their coaches are better. We only see the warts on our own guys.


Oh, this again.

A better question is, what has Tomlin done above and beyond what you'd expect from any random NFL coach? Nothing. He hasn't let everything come completely unglued and go 4-12, good for him. But he had the HUGE advantage of having one of the best QBs in the league, which you can't say for 95% of the other coaches that have come and gone during his tenure.

Put Tomlin in charge of some team like the Bills or the Buccaneers, and he'd get you your 4-12 record, maybe be one-and-done, and then this whole conversation is stupid. Take any halfway decent coach who isn't in way over his head at the NFL level - say, Tom Coughlin or Jeff Fisher - put him on the Steelers circa 2006, and I'd bet you $100 you'd get the exact same result as Tomlin if not better.

What have I seen from Tomlin? A lot of bluster, a lot of the team being unprepared, almost zero player development except for a few special cases - and some really obvious deficiencies in how the team is put together, which appear to stem not from bad luck or the regular ups and downs of the draft, but from stubbornness and/or just not getting how certain things work.

"You can't use the argument that it's Cowher's players anymore!" Well, what has he done now that it's all his own players? Consistently play .500 ball with an elite QB and a team that everyone thinks is more talented than its record shows. A good coach would have us wrapping up a playoff spot around Thanksgiving and we'd be debating whether resting your starters too much is the right move or not. Great coaches take players like we have and do things like invent new offensive schemes around them. What are we doing? Mucking around in pigshit and struggling to make the playoffs one year out of four. One of the best 6 or 7 coaches in the league - get the fuck out of here.

[stillers4me]

The Packers are losing 31-0. But that never happens with future HOF quarterbacks and good coaches. :coffee:

[teegre]

It's not over yet, but overall it's been a hellishly tough season, and opinion-wise, we've been in and out of playoff contention several times all year. Given that this is Butler's first year as DC, and we've had great success on offense as well, then there's really not a shit load to be deathly pessimistic about. IF this season is over after next weeks game, then I still say give Tomlin at least one more year before thinking about changing leadership.

Yep.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Fire Rooneys!!!

Fire Everybody!!!

[Steel Peon]

Would you let him continue making personnel decisions?
I'd say draft picks might be his weakest trait as a coach, so maybe someone could tutor him a bit? And don't start on the whole Blake thing, because he barely had any effect on the game today, and we don't have that many options at CB anyways. Maybe drafting some CBs in earlier rounds a few years ago might've helped?

[teegre]

I'd say draft picks might be his weakest trait as a coach, so maybe someone could tutor him a bit? And don't start on the whole Blake thing, because he barely had any effect on the game today, and we don't have that many options at CB anyways. Maybe drafting some CBs in earlier rounds a few years ago might've helped?

I like Bud Dupree, but oh how I wish Marcus Peters had dropped a little bit farther.

[hawaiiansteeler]

I like Bud Dupree, but oh how I wish Marcus Peters had dropped a little bit farther.

no kidding, I think Peters has something like 8 interceptions already in this his rookie season...

[zulater]

Oh, this again.

A better question is, what has Tomlin done above and beyond what you'd expect from any random NFL coach? Nothing. He hasn't let everything come completely unglued and go 4-12, good for him. But he had the HUGE advantage of having one of the best QBs in the league, which you can't say for 95% of the other coaches that have come and gone during his tenure.

Put Tomlin in charge of some team like the Bills or the Buccaneers, and he'd get you your 4-12 record, maybe be one-and-done, and then this whole conversation is stupid. Take any halfway decent coach who isn't in way over his head at the NFL level - say, Tom Coughlin or Jeff Fisher - put him on the Steelers circa 2006, and I'd bet you $100 you'd get the exact same result as Tomlin if not better.

What have I seen from Tomlin? A lot of bluster, a lot of the team being unprepared, almost zero player development except for a few special cases - and some really obvious deficiencies in how the team is put together, which appear to stem not from bad luck or the regular ups and downs of the draft, but from stubbornness and/or just not getting how certain things work.

"You can't use the argument that it's Cowher's players anymore!" Well, what has he done now that it's all his own players? Consistently play .500 ball with an elite QB and a team that everyone thinks is more talented than its record shows. A good coach would have us wrapping up a playoff spot around Thanksgiving and we'd be debating whether resting your starters too much is the right move or not. Great coaches take players like we have and do things like invent new offensive schemes around them. What are we doing? Mucking around in pigshit and struggling to make the playoffs one year out of four. One of the best 6 or 7 coaches in the league - get the fuck out of here.

Name 5 better. Then go to those teams mb's and tell their fans how wonderful their coach is compared to Tomlin and wait for your reply's. :coffee:

[ALLD]

I say the Rooney's wait for Ben to retire before they make a move, not that it isn't justified now. Lose to Cleveland next week and Tomlin needs to "retire".

[lipps83]

The Packers are losing 31-0. But that never happens with future HOF quarterbacks and good coaches. :coffee:

To the 13-2 Cardinals.

Come back here when they are losing, coming from behind the 4-10 Ravens. How deep do you have to look on the Packers historical schedule to see them consistently losing to inferior teams? Probably quite a few seasons.

Big difference losing big to one of the top 2 teams in the conference than being swept by a 4-10 Ravens team with a street free agent playing QB.

[Shoes]

Steel Dad ‏@SteelDad (https://twitter.com/SteelDad) 2h2 hours ago (https://twitter.com/SteelDad/status/681236543214907393)
When you lose 7 of 11 to under .500 teams and 8 of last 11 to BAL that my friends is a pattern and not a good one. #Steelers (https://twitter.com/hashtag/Steelers?src=hash)
16 retweets36 likes

[86WARD]

Oh, this again.

A better question is, what has Tomlin done above and beyond what you'd expect from any random NFL coach? Nothing. He hasn't let everything come completely unglued and go 4-12, good for him. But he had the HUGE advantage of having one of the best QBs in the league, which you can't say for 95% of the other coaches that have come and gone during his tenure.

Put Tomlin in charge of some team like the Bills or the Buccaneers, and he'd get you your 4-12 record, maybe be one-and-done, and then this whole conversation is stupid. Take any halfway decent coach who isn't in way over his head at the NFL level - say, Tom Coughlin or Jeff Fisher - put him on the Steelers circa 2006, and I'd bet you $100 you'd get the exact same result as Tomlin if not better.

What have I seen from Tomlin? A lot of bluster, a lot of the team being unprepared, almost zero player development except for a few special cases - and some really obvious deficiencies in how the team is put together, which appear to stem not from bad luck or the regular ups and downs of the draft, but from stubbornness and/or just not getting how certain things work.

"You can't use the argument that it's Cowher's players anymore!" Well, what has he done now that it's all his own players? Consistently play .500 ball with an elite QB and a team that everyone thinks is more talented than its record shows. A good coach would have us wrapping up a playoff spot around Thanksgiving and we'd be debating whether resting your starters too much is the right move or not. Great coaches take players like we have and do things like invent new offensive schemes around them. What are we doing? Mucking around in pigshit and struggling to make the playoffs one year out of four. One of the best 6 or 7 coaches in the league - get the fuck out of here.

Lol...

[86WARD]

Name 5 better. Then go to those teams mb's and tell their fans how wonderful their coach is compared to Tomlin and wait for your reply's. :coffee:

You should go back and dig up that garbage thread too...lol. This thread is about as lame as a Blame Ben thread or maybe a trade Ben and sign Mark Sanchez thread. Why not just let people vent how ever they see fit?? Lol.

[st33lersguy]

The Packers are losing 31-0. But that never happens with future HOF quarterbacks and good coaches. :coffee:

The Packers are in the playoffs, the Steelers are not so

- - - Updated - - -

Tomlin is a waste of Ben's prime

[steelreserve]

Name 5 better. Then go to those teams mb's and tell their fans how wonderful their coach is compared to Tomlin and wait for your reply's. :coffee:


I think in that other thread I came up with 11 or 12 that I would've considered better or at least equal. In reality there are probably dozens and dozens who would do at least the same job if you account for current coordinators, college coaches, etc. who haven't had an NFL head coaching job yet.

No, Tomlin's not the worst coach ever, but he's pretty much proven to me that he's just average and that's all he's ever going to be. I'd prefer a coach that's better than just average.

[fansince'76]

To the 13-2 Cardinals.

That the Steelers beat by double digits earlier in the year with a 4th string QB...

[Terrapinstation]

Whoever came up with the game plan should be immediately fired. Our offense has been on absolute fire for weeks. We've been on fire because we come out throwing and throwing, spreading the field, and playing up tempo. Baltimore has the worst pass defense in the league. So what is our game plan? Run, run, run.

So what if Deangelo was getting huge yardage? We played Baltimore's game by running so much. We slowed the game down and played right into their hands. Ben and the WRs never got into rhythm.

Defensively, Baltimore has a QB that was at home playing with himself until 2 weeks ago. They have zero WRs that can stretch the field. What's our plan? We've been recently successful (somewhat) by playing press and bringing tons of pressure. for some reason today, we give them 12yd cushions.

Yes, coaches this stupid should be fired. Sorry. Tomlin sucks.

[86WARD]

Whoever came up with the game plan should be immediately fired. Our offense has been on absolute fire for weeks. We've been on fire because we come out throwing and throwing, spreading the field, and playing up tempo. Baltimore has the worst pass defense in the league. So what is our game plan? Run, run, run.

So what if Deangelo was getting huge yardage? We played Baltimore's game by running so much. We slowed the game down and played right into their hands. Ben and the WRs never got into rhythm.

Defensively, Baltimore has a QB that was at home playing with himself until 2 weeks ago. They have zero WRs that can stretch the field. What's our plan? We've been recently successful (somewhat) by playing press and bringing tons of pressure. for some reason today, we give them 12yd cushions.

Yes, coaches this stupid should be fired. Sorry. Tomlin sucks.

Harbaugh came up with that game plan and it worked perfectly for he and the Ravens.

[86WARD]

Maybe Tomlin should start handing out stickers for the boys' lockers. Works for the Ravens...lol.

[NCSteeler]

To the 13-2 Cardinals.

Come back here when they are losing, coming from behind the 4-10 Ravens. How deep do you have to look on the Packers historical schedule to see them consistently losing to inferior teams? Probably quite a few seasons.

Big difference losing big to one of the top 2 teams in the conference than being swept by a 4-10 Ravens team with a street free agent playing QB.

I have to agree here, every lose is not equal. Losing consistently to bad teams is a big problem for tomlin, I thought he fixed it the year but no still the same under prepared team


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[NCSteeler]

Jar itch hot his random losers ready yo beat the offensive powerhouse that the Steelers are proclaimed to be


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[B&GFever]

funny how this place loves Tomlin so much ....

tell me what other team with a Franchise QB , the leagues best WR , one of the leagues best deep threat WR's , a premier running game , a solid O-line ....

and fails to make the playoffs 3 of the last 5 years and is one and done the two years they do make it ....

[Hawkman]

Wow guys....if you need to kill yourselves........don't do it. I just drove 200 miles back home. I'm still thinking that the forth and one on the first series was a good call. We have just played two huge games and won, and these guys had nothing left but to kick our ass, they did not...but they won...I am as mad as any one...and Boykin is not the second coming

[fansince'76]

funny how this place loves Tomlin so much ....

tell me what other team with a Franchise QB , the leagues best WR , one of the leagues best deep threat WR's , a premier running game , a solid O-line ....

and fails to make the playoffs 3 of the last 5 years and is one and done the two years they do make it ....

Still waiting on that dynasty to materialize in Green Bay since they beat us in the SB five years ago. Just sayin'...

[Shoes]

Wow guys....if you need to kill yourselves........don't do it. I just drove 200 miles back home. I'm still thinking that the forth and one on the first series was a good call. We have just played two huge games and won, and these guys had nothing left but to kick our ass, they did not...but they won...I am as mad as any one...and Boykin is not the second coming


I disagree with the call, your playing the Ravens where every point counts, even more so since Tomlin has lost 8 of the last 11 to the rats.


No one said Boykin was, rather he better than Blake, don't you agree? Yet Tomlin will start Blake next week.

[B&GFever]

Still waiting on that dynasty to materialize in Green Bay since they beat us in the SB five years ago. Just sayin'...


I could care less what other franchises do , I want the one I follow to win !

speaking of that SB 5 years ago .... that afc championship game we won to get there was the last playoff game we won

[Hawkman]

No one said he was, rather he better than Blake, don't you agree? Yet Tomlin will start Blake next week.
I am not a Blake fan, but Boykin played a whole worse today.... Want the pictures. Everyone got their wish today..

[fansince'76]

I could care less what other franchises do

Well, you asked what other team with a franchise QB, top-flight receivers and a strong running game has fairly consistently underachieved in relation to their respective talent level. The mighty Pack has gone 2-4 in the playoffs since that game themselves and the only reason they got one of those wins was due to officiating incompetence.

[Shoes]

I am not a Blake fan, but Boykin played a whole worse today.... Want the pictures. Everyone got their wish today..

Did you also take picture of the 4-5 one arm misses of Blake today?.....Like 16 games worth, like leading the entire team in missed tackles. This game sure as hell wasn't lost because of Boykin.

[Hawkman]

I'm out

[Shoes]

I'm out

You seem to be the only one who thought Boykin had a bad game. No one here thought that.

Brandon Boykin: Thought Boykin had a nice game. Breakup on the goal line when covering Maxx Williams and he worked over a running back for a sack of Ryan Mallet. Boykin got the start in nickel and hopefully continues that role for the rest of the year.

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2015/12/quick-hits-steelers-vs-ravens-winnerslosers-2/

[B&GFever]

Well, you asked what other team with a franchise QB, top-flight receivers and a strong running game has fairly consistently underachieved in relation to their respective talent level. The mighty Pack has gone 2-4 in the playoffs since that game themselves and the only reason they got one of those wins was due to officiating incompetence.

well technically GB best WR has been out since the beginning of the year with an ACL , they haven't had a good running game most of the year and the O-Line has not be very good either ...

and that is 2 wins more than we have managed in the playoffs .....


one could say we have been without Bell but truth be told we have not missed a beat with D-Will in his place , sure Ben was down but we have managed many of these losses to bad teams with him playing so that excuse doesnt quite fly either ... so there is that

[steelreserve]

Second-half defense was not bad; 7 points allowed. They looked better, too. The story there is that we just could not move the ball and Ben making stupid throws.

What it looks like to me is: Blake on the field - whichever of Boykin, Cockrell, Gay and Allen are in all play worse. Blake not on the field - they play regular defense.

I noticed that in the first half today, Cockrell was the odd man out on most of the downs. Blake was there with his 10-yard cushion PLUS immediate backpedaling.

For once, defense didn't blatantly cost us the game or almost cost us the game ... still, can't help but think we could've done better against Ryan Mallet and his bunch of no-names.

[GoSlash27]

Jar itch hot his random losers ready yo beat the offensive powerhouse that the Steelers are proclaimed to be


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

^ Can somebody decipher this post for me? I can't decode it and I'm afraid I might lose sleep wondering about it.
Thanks,
-Slashy

[SteelMayhem72]

ive already stuck a fork in this season and im ready for next season...tired of this up and down undisciplined and unprepared shit show off and on all season. i think this team seams to be a me,me,me team and more worried about personal accolades. This team celebrates way too much much this season during games when they dont need to at the time. Not to mention penalties,fines etc for it. Thats an undisciplined team. Boils down to tomlin being a ra,ra,ra coach and not so much a leader.

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[Steel Peon]

Did you also take picture of the 4-5 one arm misses of Blake today?.....Like 16 games worth, like leading the entire team in missed tackles.
Well now you're just lying, he was in on 1 play as far anyone saw.

[86WARD]

People that don't see a problem with the lack of playoff appearances and one and done in the playoffs is kinda disturbing. Lol.

[Shoes]

Well now you're just lying, he was in on 1 play as far anyone saw.

As far as anyone saw? I think your lying, Blake was sure as hell in there for more than one play. I saw him doing his one arm misses. I'll get the snap count shortly.

[lipps83]

People that don't see a problem with the lack of playoff appearances and one and done in the playoffs is kinda disturbing. Lol.

Yeah, it is kind of odd. I got a lot of flack around here for saying the pass defense was atrocious after Manziel lit them up (but unable to put up points because, well, they are the Browns and don't know how to score). The Steelers won that game and only gave up 9 points, so the fact that Manziel put up more yard than he ever will in his entire career they said was completely irrelevant.

It was very relevant and has been a huge problem for years but masked by smoke and mirrors for as long as possible. It is now so bad that you can no longer hide it and teams can and have brought in nobodies and can light up the defense like a Christmas tree on fire. Complacency is what led to this problem and complacency is why Tomlin will be the coach for another 10 years. Nobody cares to fix it because apparently things are 'good enough'.

[zulater]

Ok, so now we take a vote, and if the vote goes as expected then who among us goes and breaks the news to Tomlin that we let him go? :sarcasm:

[st33lersguy]

The tragic thing is that Big Ben's prime is being wasted on a coach who can't evaluate secondary talent and who loves to lose to crappy teams. 3rd missed playoff appearance in 4 years. Unacceptable with a franchise QB. All he had to do was beat two teams with a combined 7 wins with a red hot offense and one of the best QBs in the league, and he couldn't do it. Enough is enough Tomlin! And why is he going for it on 4th and 1 in field goal range an accurate kicker? Did that make too much sense?

- - - Updated - - -

9 seasons under Tomlin, only 2 of them led to playoff wins

[NCSteeler]

^ Can somebody decipher this post for me? I can't decode it and I'm afraid I might lose sleep wondering about it.
Thanks,
-Slashy

Your welcome


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[ETL]

I know it's the coaches job to motivate and scheme properly but games like today - it's a matter of veteran leadership more than the coaches.

[Shoes]

Well now you're just lying, he was in on 1 play as far anyone saw.


As far as anyone saw? I think your lying, Blake was sure as hell in there for more than one play. I saw him doing his one arm misses. I'll get the snap count shortly.

Blake played at least an hour into the game... can't find the snap counts yet, but if he was only in on one play as you said, he missed the tackle because I clearly saw that.

[JKLTO]

Tomlin didn't lose the game. However, I did see a number of dudes standing around in Steelers uniforms not doing their jobs.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Tomlin’s overconfidence costs Steelers in loss to Baltimore

by JUSTIN RUOFF

http://frsports-bucket-0001.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2015/11/20171758/164092015_1605_49ers_at_Steelers-e1448850729517.jpg

Nameless, gray faces.

That is the term Pittsburgh Steelers coach Mike Tomlin likes to use when talking about his upcoming opponent. In his mind, it is a way of eliminating distractions and it helps his team focus primarily on their play. As a result, we’ve heard Tomlin use this phrase hundreds of times during his tenure as the Steelers’ head coach.

On Sunday though, it cost him.

The Steelers went into Baltimore this week looking to cement their position in the playoffs with an easy victory over their rival, who are down on their luck. The Ravens had lost their last three games by a combined score of 82-35 and started a quarterback who just joined the team 10 days ago. So, naturally, the Steelers were a 10-point favorite, despite being on the road.

Unfortunately for Pittsburgh though, it wasn’t the easy game everyone expected. The Steelers struggled to get going on offense and ended up losing the game 20-17. The loss puts the Steelers on the outside looking in for the playoffs with just one-week left to play. They’ll need to win their last game against the Browns next week and they’ll need the Jets to lose in Buffalo.

But it shouldn’t have been this way. The Steelers should have rolled over the Ravens as everyone expected. Honestly, they would have if it weren’t for a questionable first quarter decision by Tomlin.

To start the game, Pittsburgh got the football first and immediately started to dominate with the running game. They marched down the field, but were eventually faced with a relatively short fourth down on the Ravens’ 25-yard line.

At this point, Tomlin could have easily sent his kicker out and given the Steelers an early lead. Although Pittsburgh had their problems with kickers early in the season, Chris Boswell has quickly become one of the more reliable kickers in the NFL for the Steelers. He’s made 26 out of the 28 kicks he has attempted, which is good for the sixth best percentage in the NFL.

But instead of taking the three points, Tomlin left his offense on the field and attempted to get the first down. Pittsburgh ran the ball with DeAngelo Williams, but he was held up short and the Steelers came away from the first drive empty handed.

Now I understand the logic behind this decision. The Steelers were running the ball very efficiently and it didn’t seem like Baltimore could stop them. There was really no reason to think they wouldn’t get the one-yard.

The problem is the Ravens gained a lot of confidence by stopping Pittsburgh. It was confidence they hadn’t felt it quite some time. It gave them momentum for the first time in weeks and it drastically changed the game. No longer was it a game between a 9-5 team and a 4-10 team. It was now a rivalry game.

And that was exactly what Pittsburgh didn’t want to happen. The three points would have kept the Ravens’ confidence down and risking that was not worth the risk. It certainly wasn’t in this case, as Pittsburgh ended up losing by, oddly enough, three points.

Hopefully the decision doesn’t cost the Steelers a playoff spot.

http://www.todayspigskin.com/afc-today/pittsburgh-steelers/tomlins-overconfidence-costs-steelers-in-loss-to-baltimore/

[Steeldude]

I know it's the coaches job to motivate and scheme properly but games like today - it's a matter of veteran leadership more than the coaches.

They really don't have any quality, veteran leaders on the team, at least on defense. The defense is in dire need of one. The last leader on defense was probably Lloyd, but I would go further back and say Lambert. Lambert was a physical as well as a cerebral leader. Lambert knew the game. I know people will say Porter was a leader, but he was more of a loudmouth than a true leader.

IMO, Harrison should play 90%+ of the snaps vs. the Browns. The defense feeds off of him. They need to get him going. Jones is just a waste to have on the field. I would rather see Blake than Jones.

[zoneblitzerII]

Something has GOT to change AND you can't fire all the players. Mike just has to go. That's it, plain and simple. He has presided over too many of these gutless, inept performances against league piñatas. Sure it's the players and the leadership group. But you can't axe Ben and co. This has happened far too many times under Coach T. If he has to pay for Ben's ineptitude so be it. He's had a good run. Now get some fresh eyes in there to see what they can salvage for Ben's remaining years....Or they can continue to be patient and watch the club underperform against crap teams and when it really matters.

[86WARD]

Ok, so now we take a vote, and if the vote goes as expected then who among us goes and breaks the news to Tomlin that we let him go? :sarcasm:

Tee Tee

[Drazo85]

I agree that Steelers are annoying to watch under Tomlin. They are going to kill me if they continue to play down to opponents like they did yesterday, and last season, and season before that etc. I agree that Steelers are maybe wasting prime years of their franchise quarterback. I agree that mediocrity is frustrating. But for a second we must put our feelings aside and include simple logic while analysing current situation.
1) Firing Tomlin- there are reasons to fire him, okay, i can pretend i understand it. What after that? We all agree that Rooney's basically hit the jackpot with last three head coaches. They can not hit jackpot with every coaching hire. They are bound to miss. Ben has, what, 3,5,7 years left? Firing everybody and starting with a new head coach is risky. What if the risk doesnt payoff? What if a new guy leave a mess? Remember Josh McDaniels and Denver? What if someone similar is hired? What if if new guy dismantles the core group? Remember Chargers firing Schottenheimer after 14-2 season and hiring Norv Turner? Be carefull what you wish for, it may came through.
2) Tomlin has a .64 career wining percentage and only active coaches that are better than him are belicheat and McCarthy. He has two super bowl appearances and hasn't had a losing season yet. His playoff record is not as good, but its above .50 with five wins and four loses (McCarthy is 7-6). We all know that Tomlin inherited almost all of his coaching staff from previous regime, and that Rooneys forced Arians to "retire", kept LeBeau two or three seasons too long, hired Bicknell to kill Ben and all of our linemen, hired Haley, are keeping Smith etc. Tomlin is a perfect match for the Rooneys and you are delusional if you think he has the uper hand in deciding who are Steelers going to fire, hire, keep, draft, sign. He can suggest, but he cant decide.
3) Wasting franchise quarterback-We all know Ben isnt Marino, Manning, Brady, Rogers, Montana, Young... Who is he than? He is a gunslinger, a guy that can bring you to the sky, but can also bring you to the ground. And Steelers are his reflection. Unpredictable. He can make a toughest throw-Steelers can beat toughest team. He can make stupidest interception-Steelers can lose to Buccaneers at home. You live with, you die with him. I know i am simplifying things, but at end of the day it is what you get from him.
4) Superbowl wins are hard to come by even with franchise quarterbacks. Manning, Favre, Warner,Brees have one. Marino, Kelly, Moon, Fouts, Tarkenton etc have none. It shows how hard is to win in this league. Some of the greatest QBs have one to none Superbowl title. It's hard. I dont want to elaborate what were the coaching situations with that QBs, and their franchises (maybe i should, maybe there are patterns, but i leave that to someone how wants to debate this with me)

[Shoes]

Well now you're just lying, he was in on 1 play as far anyone saw.


As far as anyone saw? I think your lying, Blake was sure as hell in there for more than one play. I saw him doing his one arm misses. I'll get the snap count shortly.



Blake played at least an hour into the game... can't find the snap counts yet, but if he was only in on one play as you said, he missed the tackle because I clearly saw that.



Blake played 41 defensive snaps yesterday before leaving the game about halftime. Now I'll try and get some clips for you.

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2015/12/steelers-vs-ravens-player-snap-counts-week-16/

[TD's & Beer]

Something has GOT to change AND you can't fire all the players. Mike just has to go. That's it, plain and simple. He has presided over too many of these gutless, inept performances against league piñatas.

Yep

Arrogance and chest thumping lost this game.

They came out running the ball and instead of taking the 3 pts (which they would need later) they beat their chests and got stuffed on a 4th and 1.

The cockiness continued on defense. Ryan fucking Mallett ass raped the mighty Steelers D. Go read that in the press clippings.

[MrPgh]

I know it's the coaches job to motivate and scheme properly but games like today - it's a matter of veteran leadership more than the coaches.

Once again someone makes a post acting like this is the first time a Tomlin-coached team lost to a lesser team. Off the top of my head I can think of at least 15 games the Steelers under Tomlin lost that they shouldn't have, and most of them you can't blame on poor QB play.

[Steelman]

To be clear, I'm not on the "Fire Tomlin!!!" bandwagon. But his comments after the game about "we learned a painful lesson" really bothered me. How many years in a row do we have to learn this particularly painful lesson?

I also don't believe the game hinged on going for it on 4th down on that first drive. Momentum shifting? Yes. But there were 3-1/2 quarters after that where the whole team sucked ass. There were multiple blown opportunities to swing the game back in our favor not to mention the fact the defense looked like an army of five-year-old boys playing soccer.

The bottom line is this game was a team loss if I ever saw one. From Mike Tomlin at the top to Jacoby Jones at the bottom. I'm not saying don't hold Tomlin accountable. I believe he should, as it's part of his job. But I also know the players played like shit. Even if we had the most amazing ground-breaking game plan ever, I think we still would have lost.

[zulater]

Tomlin deserves plenty of criticism today. But the whole "fire Tomlin" thing is ridiculous. You take that talk anywhere outside a Steelers mb and you're laughed at. Dismissed as a knee jerk no nothing idiot. Outside of Arains ( at the moment if they fail in the playoffs just wait for the whining) either Harbitch, and Bellichick there's no coach in or out of the NFL you can make a slam dunk argument is better than him. I'm not saying that he's the 5th best coach in the league necessarily. But for every coach outside of the aforementioned you bring up I can poke as many holes in their resume as you can in Tomln's. Coaching in this league may be at an all time low. I mean in Noll's day you had Landry, Shula, Walsh, Bud Grant, Chuck Knox, John Madden etc...

Anyway I get it. I feel your pain, I've heard the arguments and agree with them to some extent... we're wasting the prime of a great qb's career... "he won withCowher's players"... lose to bad teams etc... But at the end of the day the guy's never had a losing season. Despite losing 40% of his starting o-line for the majority of the season, despite losing his qb for a full month he's probably going to win 10 games this year. ( anyone think Pouncey and Beachum's loss wasn't felt yesterday?) He's not getting fired folks. The players like and respect him. He's got a good coaching staff. It's not going to happen this year, and most likely not next either. So it's a futile thought. You're pissing in the ocean, spitting on a 5 alarm fire. It's foolhardy to even think Tomlin's job could be in jeopardy. In a way this thread reminds me of so many facebook posts predicting the arrest and or impeachment of Obama. You might not like him. There's probably even some rationale cause to doing both. But you're doing nothing but making as ass of yourself if you for a minute think it might actually happen, that your joining on to the cause is going to foment change.

Oh well I guess if it makes you feel better in the moment to advocate for lost causes have fun.

[polamalubeast]

Firstly,Mike McCarty in Green Bay deserves to be on the hot seat, but at least his team make the playoffs every year since 2009.

Losing against a 4-10 team with the playoffs on the line this is not acceptable. Missed the playoffs three times in four years is very painful.Very painful.

Worse than losing in the AFC title game at home, it's not even close.

[zulater]

Firstly,Mike McCarty in Green Bay deserves to be on the hot seat, but at least his team make the playoffs every year since 2009.

Losing against a 4-10 team with the playoffs on the line this is not acceptable. Missed the playoffs three times in four years is very painful.Very painful.

Worse than losing in the AFC title game at home, it's not even close.

Outside of being assured a playoff spot due to being in an inferior conference and division, if you're a Packer how good are you feeling about your team today? They got horsewhipped yesterday by the Cardinals! They had to pull their qb to preserve his life. They have less chance of winning a Super bowl today than the Steelers! Yeah I said it and I mean it. Because while the odds are still stacked against them making it in to the playoffs we know that if they do get in they can rise to the level of anyone and put up a good game. The Packers wont stand a chance against anyone in the playoffs other than the Redskins.

By the way Tomlin bashers. When the Ravens punted into the endzone, 3 minutes left in the game, and the Steelers offense coming on to the field trailing by 3, you're team is in position to at the very least take the game to OT. I thought they might win it there. But they didn't. The players fell short. We allowed a sack ( after a nice first down), then followed that up with two deep passes either of which could have been caught by the receivers, and the game was over.

Sometimes you lose. It shouldn't have happened but it did.

[steelreserve]

Tomlin deserves plenty of criticism today. But the whole "fire Tomlin" thing is ridiculous. You take that talk anywhere outside a Steelers mb and you're laughed at. Dismissed as a knee jerk no nothing idiot. Outside of Arains ( at the moment if they fail in the playoffs just wait for the whining) either Harbitch, and Bellichick there's no coach in or out of the NFL you can make a slam dunk argument is better than him. I'm not saying that he's the 5th best coach in the league necessarily. But for every coach outside of the aforementioned you bring up I can poke as many holes in their resume as you can in Tomln's. Coaching in this league may be at an all time low. I mean in Noll's day you had Landry, Shula, Walsh, Bud Grant, Chuck Knox, John Madden etc...

Anyway I get it. I feel your pain, I've heard the arguments and agree with them to some extent... we're wasting the prime of a great qb's career... "he won withCowher's players"... lose to bad teams etc... But at the end of the day the guy's never had a losing season. Despite losing 40% of his starting o-line for the majority of the season, despite losing his qb for a full month he's probably going to win 10 games this year. ( anyone think Pouncey and Beachum's loss wasn't felt yesterday?) He's not getting fired folks. The players like and respect him. He's got a good coaching staff. It's not going to happen this year, and most likely not next either. So it's a futile thought. You're pissing in the ocean, spitting on a 5 alarm fire. It's foolhardy to even think Tomlin's job could be in jeopardy. In a way this thread reminds me of so many facebook posts predicting the arrest and or impeachment of Obama. You might not like him. There's probably even some rationale cause to doing both. But you're doing nothing but making as ass of yourself if you for a minute think it might actually happen, that your joining on to the cause is going to foment change.

Oh well I guess if it makes you feel better in the moment to advocate for lost causes have fun.


If we miss the playoffs three out of four years, I don't think it's ridiculous, nor do I think anyone is making an ass of himself by complaining. That's unacceptable, period. Even more unacceptable for a coach with the tools at his disposal that Tomlin has. Maybe if you hired someone for a rebuilding project with the understanding that he had a few years to shape the team ... but even then, patience would be starting to wear thin.

Funny that you would make the argument, earlier in this same thread, that we should "Pick five coaches we think are better than Tomlin, then go to those teams' message boards and see if the fans agree with you" ... then say that only Steelers fans will tell you Tomlin's not a good coach. Well - which one is it? Are the other teams' fans all wrong and "making asses of themselves" for complaining about their coaches? Or do the Tomlin haters have a legitimate argument? Pick one - you can't have both.

As for the likelihood of it happening, well, that is not up to us. But if you see a problem and don't say anything about it at all, then guess who's the jackass.

[Shoes]

I'd let him finish out his contract, but wouldn't offer him a new one.

[polamalubeast]

Outside of being assured a playoff spot due to being in an inferior conference and division, if you're a Packer how good are you feeling about your team today? They got horsewhipped yesterday by the Cardinals! They had to pull their qb to preserve his life. They have less chance of winning a Super bowl today than the Steelers! Yeah I said it and I mean it. Because while the odds are still stacked against them making it in to the playoffs we know that if they do get in they can rise to the level of anyone and put up a good game. The Packers wont stand a chance against anyone in the playoffs other than the Redskins.

By the way Tomlin bashers. When the Ravens punted into the endzone, 3 minutes left in the game, and the Steelers offense coming on to the field trailing by 3, you're team is in position to at the very least take the game to OT. I thought they might win it there. But they didn't. The players fell short. We allowed a sack ( after a nice first down), then followed that up with two deep passes either of which could have been caught by the receivers, and the game was over.

Sometimes you lose. It shouldn't have happened but it did.

This is one of the reason why I wrote that their HC deserves to be on the hot seat.But Jordy Nelson missed the entire season and they had no one to replace him.

But this is certain McCarty deserve to be on the hot seat since 2 playoff win since 2011 (one of his wins were against Joe Webb and the Vikings) with Rodgers is not enough, but I'd rather be in place of the Packers that the steelers right now.

Since at least the Packers have not missed the playoffs since 2011 and they have been in the Divisional Round 3 times in 4 years and since 2012 the Packers have lost against a better team than them in the playoffs.

The Steelers, that is a another story in the same period

[fansince'76]

This is one of the reason why I wrote that their HC deserves to be on the hot seat.But Jordy Nelson missed the entire season and they had no one to replace him.

Well, if we're going to start using the injuries excuse, we had Mike Vick and Landry Jones under center for 1/4 of the season. How many games did Rodgers miss? And we've been without the services of arguably the best all-around RB in the league for the majority of the season. Not to mention our All-Pro center and our starting LT. As zu mentioned, think those two weren't missed yesterday?

And "making the playoffs every year but falling short" only worked for Cowher up until around 1997. After that, people screamed for his head pretty much constantly until he finally managed to win a Super Bowl 8 years later.

[tube517]

I'd let him finish out his contract, but wouldn't offer him a new one.

He's signed through 2018.

[zulater]

This is one of the reason why I wrote that their HC deserves to be on the hot seat.But Jordy Nelson missed the entire season and they had no one to replace him.

But this is certain McCarty deserve to be on the hot seat since 2 playoff win since 2011 (one of his wins were against Joe Webb and the Vikings) with Rodgers is not enough, but I'd rather be in place of the Packers that the steelers right now.

Since at least the Packers have not missed the playoffs since 2011 and they have been in the Divisional Round 3 times in 4 years and since 2012 the Packers have lost against a better team than them in the playoffs.

The Steelers, that is a another story in the same period

Assuming we win next week, that's 21 wins in the last two seasons. Yeah we probably wont make the playoffs, but I think in the history of the current playoff format a 10 win season adds up to about a 93% playoff chance. So off the last two seasons you're firing a coach who's already been to two Super Bowls? And you bring up Jordy Nelson. Well what about losing Pouncey before the season started? Losing Beachum? Losing Bell? I mean all told I think Bell and Ben were on the field together for a total of about 20 snaps this season. If I told you that was going to be the case in August wouldn't you have signed on for a 10 win season?

[steelreserve]

Assuming we win next week, that's 21 wins in the last two seasons. Yeah we probably wont make the playoffs, but I think in the history of the current playoff format a 10 win season adds up to about a 93% playoff chance. So off the last two seasons you're firing a coach who's already been to two Super Bowls? And you bring up Jordy Nelson. Well what about losing Pouncey before the season started? Losing Beachum? Losing Bell? I mean all told I think Bell and Ben were on the field together for a total of about 20 snaps this season. If I told you that was going to be the case in August wouldn't you have signed on for a 10 win season?

Don't go counting your chickens just yet - we're only at 9 wins. And would I sign on for 10 wins and missing the playoffs (again)? Hell no I wouldn't.

If you're arguing that it's fine to continue winning nothing and making excuses, and we should all shut up and like it, then sorry, but that's a bunch of crap. There's always an excuse. There are always various twists and turns, including injuries. We've lost at least one starting offensive lineman for the season just about every year, so I don't even think that's a big deal; it's just part of the game and happens to a lot of teams.

We've had adversity, but so do most teams. How well did we deal with it? Not well enough. Would I have signed up for that? Not a chance.

[B&GFever]

fire Tomlin is always ridiculous after a loss , that is cliche as he is ....

but how many times can people go to bat for a guy who simply does not learn from his mistakes ?

If he where a QB he would have been benched years ago and out of the league by now ...

remember the standard is the standard and quite frankly Mike Tomlin is not living up to it ...

he has been defended how many times here now over the years ? its been called ridiculous how many times now , but yet it keeps rearing the same ugly head ....

if you do not learn from mistakes you repeat them over and over and over ....

Einsteins example of insanity is simple ..... if you keep doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results ....

Thats is exactly what is happening with Mike Tomlin , that is the exact same thing that is happening here .....

shall we recap a bit ...

we have not won a playoff game since 2011 and in the last 5 years just 2 playoff appearances and where 1 and done in both as a wild card ...

have lost 8 of the last 11 games vs number 1 rival the Ravens

have lost 7 games out of the last 11 to teams below .500

on pace to miss the playoffs again this year when all he had to do was lead his team to two victories vs 2 teams with a combined 7 wins

Piss poor clock management every time it matters , arrogance that is beyond every coach in the league not named bellicheat , bad in game decisions ( see yesterdays no FG attempt ) in a rivalry that almost always comes down to 3 points or less and points are of a premium ... Starting players who have ni business in the league over guys who have proven to be superior players because well for no other reason than he tries hard ...


but hey if mediocrity is all you strive for have at it ... he is all yours and lucky for you he won't be going anywhere because thats not how they do business in Pittsburgh ...

But excuse the rest of us for wanting to actually improve and are not satisfied with mediocrity .

it seems like an eternity since Chris Hoke and Aaron Smith where on this roster and guess what thats exactly how long it has been since we won a playoff game

[polamalubeast]

The packers have often been one of the most injured teams every year since several years now and it includes their year they won the SB in 2010.

I do not care of the record of the steelers, since you can not lose a game with the playoffs on the line against a 4-10 team.In 2005, the Steelers were playing against a 5-9 Browns with the playoffs on the line and they won 41-0.

[zulater]

fire Tomlin is always ridiculous after a loss , that is cliche as he is ....

but how many times can people go to bat for a guy who simply does not learn from his mistakes ?

If he where a QB he would have been benched years ago and out of the league by now ...

remember the standard is the standard and quite frankly Mike Tomlin is not living up to it ...

he has been defended how many times here now over the years ? its been called ridiculous how many times now , but yet it keeps rearing the same ugly head ....

if you do not learn from mistakes you repeat them over and over and over ....

Einsteins example of insanity is simple ..... if you keep doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results ....

Thats is exactly what is happening with Mike Tomlin , that is the exact same thing that is happening here .....

shall we recap a bit ...

we have not won a playoff game since 2011 and in the last 5 years just 2 playoff appearances and where 1 and done in both as a wild card ...

have lost 8 of the last 11 games vs number 1 rival the Ravens

have lost 7 games out of the last 11 to teams below .500

on pace to miss the playoffs again this year when all he had to do was lead his team to two victories vs 2 teams with a combined 7 wins

Piss poor clock management every time it matters , arrogance that is beyond every coach in the league not named bellicheat , bad in game decisions ( see yesterdays no FG attempt ) in a rivalry that almost always comes down to 3 points or less and points are of a premium ... Starting players who have ni business in the league over guys who have proven to be superior players because well for no other reason than he tries hard ...


but hey if mediocrity is all you strive for have at it ... he is all yours and lucky for you he won't be going anywhere because thats not how they do business in Pittsburgh ...

But excuse the rest of us for wanting to actually improve and are not satisfied with mediocrity .

it seems like an eternity since Chris Hoke and Aaron Smith where on this roster and guess what thats exactly how long it has been since we won a playoff game

Uh again, this doesn't come down to a vote. He wont get fired because the fans think it should be so. If you like that sort of thing you can always try the Browns, Dolphins, Colts, or in a usual offseason the Redskins or Raiders for your team until Tomlin gets fired or more likely decide's to retire in a decade or so.

Obviously there's two sides to this coin, you can couch things in a positive or negative way regarding Tomlin's overall record to make your case. But know this. At the end of the day he has the support of management. He owns that locker room. Those players like and more importantly respect him.

Here's where I stand. I hope the Jets lose to the Bills next week. I hope we win and go to the playoffs. That said, that's unlikely to happen. So do I think Tomlin deserves next year? Yes I do. If they fix the back end of this defense and get a bit better luck in the health department then let's see what Tomlin can do? Give him 14+ games of Bell, Ben, AB, Pouncey, and Bryant with a bit better defensive team next year and if it doesn't happen then I'm standing with you pitchfork and torch in hand.

[polamalubeast]

fire Tomlin is always ridiculous after a loss , that is cliche as he is ....

but how many times can people go to bat for a guy who simply does not learn from his mistakes ?

If he where a QB he would have been benched years ago and out of the league by now ...

remember the standard is the standard and quite frankly Mike Tomlin is not living up to it ...

he has been defended how many times here now over the years ? its been called ridiculous how many times now , but yet it keeps rearing the same ugly head ....

if you do not learn from mistakes you repeat them over and over and over ....

Einsteins example of insanity is simple ..... if you keep doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results ....

Thats is exactly what is happening with Mike Tomlin , that is the exact same thing that is happening here .....

shall we recap a bit ...

we have not won a playoff game since 2011 and in the last 5 years just 2 playoff appearances and where 1 and done in both as a wild card ...

have lost 8 of the last 11 games vs number 1 rival the Ravens

have lost 7 games out of the last 11 to teams below .500

on pace to miss the playoffs again this year when all he had to do was lead his team to two victories vs 2 teams with a combined 7 wins

Piss poor clock management every time it matters , arrogance that is beyond every coach in the league not named bellicheat , bad in game decisions ( see yesterdays no FG attempt ) in a rivalry that almost always comes down to 3 points or less and points are of a premium ... Starting players who have ni business in the league over guys who have proven to be superior players because well for no other reason than he tries hard ...


but hey if mediocrity is all you strive for have at it ... he is all yours and lucky for you he won't be going anywhere because thats not how they do business in Pittsburgh ...

But excuse the rest of us for wanting to actually improve and are not satisfied with mediocrity .

it seems like an eternity since Chris Hoke and Aaron Smith where on this roster and guess what thats exactly how long it has been since we won a playoff game


ouch

[fansince'76]

The packers have often been one of the most injured teams every year since several years now and it includes their year they won the SB in 2010.

So have the Steelers. How many dozens of OL combinations did the Steelers have in 2013 alone?

[Shoes]

He's signed through 2018.

Where's that hippo fart when you need it?

[tube517]

Where's that hippo fart when you need it?

:lol:

See Craic's signature

[ALLD]

I don't like his style. It's lots of talk and bluster. I think some of the players were thinking if he was for real.

[teegre]

Berman, Jackson, Carter, and Co. were saying if they were starting a franchise, Tomlin would be on the very short list of coaches that they'd want.

Deion, Marshall, et al. have said similar things on NFL Network.

Local San Diego radio talks about they wish that Tomlin was their coach.

SUMMATION:
Distance makes the grass grow greener.

[stillers4me]

Yesterday's non FG on 4th down.......well, I can hardly blame Tomlin for having that kind of confidence in his offense at this point.

So who let who down?

If we had scored a TD on 4th down, we wouldn't be having this conversation today. We'd be calling him Coach of the Year.

[st33lersguy]

Berman, Jackson, Carter, and Co. were saying if they were starting a franchise, Tomlin would be on the very short list of coaches that they'd want.

Deion, Marshall, et al. have said similar things on NFL Network.

Local San Diego radio talks about they wish that Tomlin was their coach.

SUMMATION:
Distance makes the grass grow greener.

They don't have to experience the frustration first-hand that the Steelers do

[Terrapinstation]

Berman, Jackson, Carter, and Co. were saying if they were starting a franchise, Tomlin would be on the very short list of coaches that they'd want.

Deion, Marshall, et al. have said similar things on NFL Network.

Local San Diego radio talks about they wish that Tomlin was their coach.

SUMMATION:
Distance makes the grass grow greener.

Hmmm, in this politically correct day and age, I wonder why that is???

[teegre]

They don't have to experience the frustration first-hand that the Steelers do

Yeah... Chargers fans would kill for that kind of "frustration."

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Hmmm, in this politically correct day and age, I wonder why that is???

Please... explain.

[hawaiiansteeler]

fire Tomlin is always ridiculous after a loss

it would be even more ridiculous after a win, wouldn't you say? :wink02:

[fansince'76]

Hmmm, in this politically correct day and age, I wonder why that is???

I think I know what you're getting at. As such, it's funny how they don't say the same things about Marvin Lewis...

[Terrapinstation]

Yeah... Chargers fans would kill for that kind of "frustration."

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Please... explain.

Same reason you have a better chance of seeing a bigfoot than a member of the main stream media utter a negative peep about Obama? Maybe they just use up all their coach bashing on Chip Kelly and Tom Coughlin.

[steelreserve]

SUMMATION:
Distance makes the grass grow greener.


Distance as in "the other side of the fence," I suppose. From right up close, I'm pretty certain it looks like old hay with poop in it.




Yesterday's non FG on 4th down.......well, I can hardly blame Tomlin for having that kind of confidence in his offense at this point.

Who let who down?

If we had scored a TD on 4th down, we wouldn't be having this conversation today. We'd be calling him Coach of the Year.


A lot of people are up in arms about going for it on 4th down. I didn't think it was a bad idea. The play we called ... not the best. But the overall idea of being aggressive and trying to kick them right in the throat, I liked. Don't forget, the field goal was by no means a sure thing.

Basically, I agree with the people who think it's dumb to make a knee-jerk reaction to fire the coach because of a decision that didn't work out in the game. That IS knee-jerking. But if it's something that's just the latest iteration in a pattern, or the end result of an issue that's been going on all sesaon or for multiple seasons ... that's a different matter.

The outcome of this one game - as well as the fact that we were in that position to begin with, and for that matter, this season as a whole - pretty well summarize my issues with Tomlin, which is a feeling that's come up over and over again for years. And that feeling is "missed opportunity."

[teegre]

it would be even more ridiculous after a win, wouldn't you say? :wink02:

Pffft... strawman argument.

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Same reason you have a better chance of seeing a bigfoot than a member of the main stream media utter a negative peep about Obama? Maybe they just use up all their coach bashing on Chip Kelly and Tom Coughlin.

Ah... got it.

btw: Sheets are on sale at Wal*Mart.

[Terrapinstation]

Pffft... strawman argument.

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Ah... got it.

btw: Sheets are on sale at Wal*Mart.

Case in point why you'll never see certain people criticize Tomlin. Thanks for proving me correct.

[fansince'76]

Case in point why you'll never see certain people criticize Tomlin. Thanks for proving me correct.

Even though the majority of the talking heads previously mentioned are African-Americans themselves? :noidea:

[teegre]

Case in point why you'll never see certain people criticize Tomlin. Thanks for proving me correct.

You started that train of thought... so, it's your burning cross to bear.

[polamalubeast]

In the current head coaches that I would take before Tomlin.......Bill Belichick, Pete Carroll, Bruce Arians, Ron Riveira and John Harbaugh.

In the maybe:Andy Reid, Sean Payton, Mike McCarthy, Tom Coughlin.

In the young coach, who is maybe too early, but they have the potential to become a very good HC:Mike Zimmer and Todd Bowles.


Yes, Tomlin has never had a losing season, but at the end of the 2012 season and the beginning of the 2013 season, the Steelers were 4-11, which is worse than the Ravens this year and it wasted two seasons, which is worse than a losing season.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Same reason you have a better chance of seeing a bigfoot than a member of the main stream media utter a negative peep about Obama? Maybe they just use up all their coach bashing on Chip Kelly and Tom Coughlin.

so within your first 4 posts here you've already played the race card?

gee, can't wait to read more of your posts...:jerkit:

[Terrapinstation]

so within your first 4 posts here you've already played the race card?

gee, can't wait to read more of your posts...:jerkit:

Yeah I mean, according to the talking heads, Tomlin must be the greatest coach in the history of the league. I've yet to hear anyone criticize him for anything. As was posted, they'd all want him as coach if they were starting a franchise. Why the undying praise for a guy that's coached a very mediocre team for years? What exactly am I missing here? Tomlin's a decent coach, but to some people he's Vince Lombardi.

[fansince'76]

In the current head coaches that I would take before Tomlin.......Bill Belichick, Pete Carroll, Bruce Arians, Ron Riveira and John Harbaugh.


LOL - I'd love to see Yinzer Nation's reaction had it been Tomlin who made "The Call"... :lol:

And Ron Rivera? Really? Two winning seasons mixed in with 3 sub-.500 campaigns? OK.

[polamalubeast]

LOL - I'd love to see Yinzer Nation's reaction had it been Tomlin who made "The Call"... :lol:


I would have been angry, but at the same time,Carroll has a lot of success since 2012 and this is with a young QB.

[Terrapinstation]

LOL - I'd love to see Yinzer Nation's reaction had it been Tomlin who made "The Call"... :lol:

Carroll is far too conservative. He would be an awful fit here.

Harbaugh is a good coach, but he's too big of a douchebag.

I'd take Tomlin over both of them.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Pffft... strawman argument.



I'll take that as an ad hominem attack...:chuckle:

[steelreserve]

The race thing is a legitimate question, since you know, the league actually has a rule about race for coaching candidates, and has gotten completely caught up in the political correctness movement as a whole.

Do I think it actually has anything to do with the Tomlin situation? Not at all.

The mainstream media doesn't say anything negative about Tomlin for the same reason they thought our team was going to fall off a cliff when we lost all the "big names" like Hines Ward, Aaron Smith and James Farrior in one offseason. They're looking at it from 30,000 feet and they don't see it. You can miss things as big as a truck, or for that matter a house, pretty easily from there.

[polamalubeast]

And Ron Rivera? Really? Two winning seasons mixed in with 3 sub-.500 campaigns? OK.

Just have to look at the roster than Rivera has inherited in 2011.It was a 2-14 team in 2010,now they are a real contender.

[fansince'76]

Just have to look at the roster than Rivera has inherited in 2011.It was a 2-14 team in 2010,now they are a real contender.

Heard that in 2013 when they went 12-4 only to go one and done in the postseason and then follow it up with a 7-8-1 campaign in 2014...

And I've heard many denigrate Tomlin for last year's 11-5 record against a "cupcake schedule." Please take a gander at the teams Carolina has been playing all season if you want to see a cupcake schedule.

[polamalubeast]

Heard that in 2013 when they went 12-4 only to go one and done in the postseason and then follow it up with a 7-8-1 campaign in 2014...


In 2013, the 49ers were better than the Panthers.I will never blame a coach if his team lost against a better team unless the coach takes a horrible decision during the game.

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And I've heard many denigrate Tomlin for last year's 11-5 record against a "cupcake schedule." Please take a gander at the teams Carolina has been playing all season if you want to see a cupcake schedule.


14-1 is an achievement, even if your schedule is easy.Just look at the schedule of the 1999 rams or the 1972 dolphins.....they have not won against a playoff team during the season.

[tube517]

In 2013, the 49ers were better than the Panthers.I will never blame a coach if his team lost against a better team unless the coach takes a horrible decision during the game.

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14-1 is an achievement, even if your schedule is easy.Just look at the schedule of the 1999 rams or the 1972 dolphins.....they have not won against a playoff team during the season.

It's nice but ask the 2004 Steelers, the 2011 Packers (1 and done in the playoffs), the 1998 Vikings what a 15-1 record meant.

[polamalubeast]

It's nice but ask the 2004 Steelers, the 2011 Packers (1 and done in the playoffs), the 1998 Vikings what a 15-1 record meant.

The 2004 season of the steelers is one of the most enjoyable seasons I've seen.I'm not in the mindset Super Bowl or bust, since winning a SB is very hard but finish the season 15-1 is also very hard.

But missed the playoffs with a good team is very painful.

[teegre]

Once again someone makes a post acting like this is the first time a Tomlin-coached team lost to a lesser team. Off the top of my head I can think of at least 15 games the Steelers under Tomlin lost that they shouldn't have, and most of them you can't blame on poor QB play.

Here is a list of the playoff-caliber teams, and their records against teams who have losing records this season:


9-0 - Carolina Panthers
8-0 - Cincinnati Bengals
9-1 - Arizona Cardinals
8-1 - Minnesota Vikings
8-1 - New England Taperiots
7-1 - Kansas City Chiefs
7-2 - Green Bay Packers
7-2 - Seattle Seahawks
6-2 - Denver Broncos
6-2 - Pittsburgh Steelers
8-3 - New York Jets
8-3 - Washington Redskins
6-3 - Houston Texans
5-5 - Atlanta Falcons
3-4 - Indianapolis Colts

Both of Pittsburgh's losses to "losers" were against Baltimore... who is their rival. That fact can't be ignored. Even if the second game should have been a gimme, Vick started the first game.

[NCSteeler]

fire Tomlin is always ridiculous after a loss , that is cliche as he is ....

but how many times can people go to bat for a guy who simply does not learn from his mistakes ?

If he where a QB he would have been benched years ago and out of the league by now ...

remember the standard is the standard and quite frankly Mike Tomlin is not living up to it ...

he has been defended how many times here now over the years ? its been called ridiculous how many times now , but yet it keeps rearing the same ugly head ....

if you do not learn from mistakes you repeat them over and over and over ....

Einsteins example of insanity is simple ..... if you keep doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results ....

Thats is exactly what is happening with Mike Tomlin , that is the exact same thing that is happening here .....

shall we recap a bit ...

we have not won a playoff game since 2011 and in the last 5 years just 2 playoff appearances and where 1 and done in both as a wild card ...

have lost 8 of the last 11 games vs number 1 rival the Ravens

have lost 7 games out of the last 11 to teams below .500

on pace to miss the playoffs again this year when all he had to do was lead his team to two victories vs 2 teams with a combined 7 wins

Piss poor clock management every time it matters , arrogance that is beyond every coach in the league not named bellicheat , bad in game decisions ( see yesterdays no FG attempt ) in a rivalry that almost always comes down to 3 points or less and points are of a premium ... Starting players who have ni business in the league over guys who have proven to be superior players because well for no other reason than he tries hard ...


but hey if mediocrity is all you strive for have at it ... he is all yours and lucky for you he won't be going anywhere because thats not how they do business in Pittsburgh ...

But excuse the rest of us for wanting to actually improve and are not satisfied with mediocrity .

it seems like an eternity since Chris Hoke and Aaron Smith where on this roster and guess what thats exactly how long it has been since we won a playoff game

I love this post!


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[Hawkman]

I love this post!


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I hate this post.

[Hawkman]

Ben can't play in that stadium....I have no idea why...but look at his history, he made the call on the field to go for it on 4th...I liked the call at the time, he could have jumped over DD and made it, but called that slow developing running play.

Clock management!! Blaming that on Tomlin....not!!! Ben was in "no huddle" and had to call "time out" twice and had a delay penalty once......in a hurry up offense. At one point Ben looked to Heath to call the protection.

This one is ALL on Ben and the Offense..... So stop with the f@&king Fire Tomlin.....ain't going to happen.....and who should replace him...Cowher....... He sucked at Ravens stadium too.

[zoneblitzerII]

Time for a culture change. The annual losing to basement dwellers has to stop.

[teegre]

Time for a culture change. The annual losing to basement dwellers has to stop.

Once again...

Pittsburgh is 6-2 against teams who have losing records this season, which is on par with the rest of the league (see: post #485).

Both of those losses to "losers" were against Baltimore... who is their rival. That fact can't be ignored. Even if the second game should have been a gimme, Vick started the first game.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Time for a culture change. The annual losing to basement dwellers has to stop.

http://wellingpropertyblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Broken-Record-psd53198.png

[zoneblitzerII]

Once again...

Pittsburgh is 6-2 against teams who have losing records this season, which is on par with the rest of the league (see: post #485).

Both of those losses to "losers" were against Baltimore... who is their rival. That fact can't be ignored. Even if the second game should have been a gimme, Vick started the first game.

They play down to their competition and you know that. Everyone who has watched this team the last few seasons knows that. That is who they are.

[plenewken]

They play down to their competition and you know that. Everyone who has watched this team the last few seasons knows that. That is who they are.
True and they are also Baltimore's bitch, which is unacceptable.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Gerry Dulac@gerrydulac -

If Steelers miss postseason, it will be first time since Chuck Noll became coach in 1969 they have gone 5 years without playoff win.

https://mobile.twitter.com/gerrydulac/status/681689858117611520

[tube517]

681932207196364801

[fansince'76]

To anyone who's interested, knock yourself out:

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/fire-mike-tomlin/

[tube517]

To anyone who's interested, knock yourself out:

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/fire-mike-tomlin/


To continue to play to bad competition and to consulting wizards from Hogwarts to make up weekly game plans.... Fired

Todd Haley Potter?

:chuckle:

[zoneblitzerII]

True and they are also Baltimore's bitch, which is unacceptable.

Add to that their bitch even when they field a team with 19 players on IR and a QB who came off the couch to play.

[fansince'76]

681932207196364801

Hold on...

wait for it...

"Bu-bu-but, Big Ben!" (Never minding it was largely Mr. "I-don't-need-no-stinkin'-QB" Cowher's own fault that he didn't have a franchise QB at his disposal...)

[B&GFever]

40% of the Ravens wins in 2015have been vs Mike Tomlins Steelers