Ben not HOF

[I-Want-Troy's-Hair]

I don't say this often but I agree with Florio....it's almost like Ben is invisible.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...ry/rumor-mill/

Kurt Warner says Roethlisberger not a Hall of Famer, yet
Posted by Mike Florio on February 4, 2011, 12:03 AM EST
Ben Roethlisberge

With the annual Hall of Fame vote coming up on Saturday and increased chatter that Steelers quarterback Ben Roethlisberger will nail down a spot in Canton with a third Super Bowl win, a guy who won only one title in three tries takes issue with the idea that Roethlisberger belongs among the game’s immortals.

Former Rams, Giants, and Cardinals quarterback Kurt Warner says it’s too early to bang out a bronze bust for Big Ben.

“I like Ben,” Warner told 620 KTAR in Phoenix. “I think Ben’s great and I think he’s a winner. And to me that speaks volumes for your legacy. But when you’re talking about the best quarterbacks in the league, you have to look at all the factors here.

“I mean, he won a Super Bowl and he was 8-23. But he won the Super Bowl and he gets that on his resume. But he was still 8-23.”

Warner is referring to Super Bowl XL, in which Roethlisberger completed nine of 21 passes for 123 yards and two interceptions. He also had seven rushing attempts for 25 yards and a touchdown.

In Super Bowl XLIII against Warner’s Cardinals, Roethlisberger completed 21 of 30 passes for 256 yards, one interception, and the game-winning touchdown pass to Santonio Holmes.

“I’m just waiting to see Ben as the guy that carries his team at some point in time,” Warner said. “The fortunate thing for him is he hasn’t had to do that. He carries them in the last two minutes. He makes some key plays. [He's] phenomenal out of the pocket and ad-libbing. But for me, if you go to the Hall of Fame, you have to be a guy who can carry your team week in and week out as a quarterback. That’s my opinion.”

Sorry, but we’d rather have a guy who carries the team when it counts than when the game isn’t on the line. Even though Roethlisberger may not have had impressive numbers in Super Bowl XL, he presided over three straight road playoff wins to get there. (everyone seems to forget this) In each of this year’s playoff wins, Roethlisberger delivered clutch third-down throws to Antonio Brown, including a 58-yarder on third-and-19 that, if the Steelers beat the Packers on Sunday, rightly should be remembered as one of the biggest plays in NFL postseason history.

Then there’s the fact that, since losing in the AFC title game to cap his rookie season, Roethlisberger has led the Steelers to nine of 10 win in postseason games

Nine of 10. Warner didn’t do that. Brady hasn’t done that. Manning hasn’t done that.

So while we respect Warner’s opinion, we’ll disagree with it. If Roethlisberger gets his third Super Bowl win in three tries, he’ll be bound for Canton five years after calling it quits.

Especially since he may end up with four or five rings.

[Craic]

I don't think he is a first ballot HOF 5 years out from playing- least not yet. But Florio does make a lot of excellent points.


Furthemore, I think Warner has no idea what Ben actually does with this team. He doesn't see all the RUNNING first downs Ben makes when he HAS TO make them. He doesn't see Ben willing the team on. Carry the team? That is the problem with pretty boy football. Ben's job is to HELP the team, not carry it. Same with every other position.

[HometownGal]

I've always loved Warner and still do, but does he watch the same Ben Roethlisberger that we do on a week to week basis? Of course Ben doesn't "carry the team" - no one player should "carry a team", but damn it, when the chips are down Ben comes through. Seems like a little envy to me which shocks me coming from Kurt.

“I’m just waiting to see Ben as the guy that carries his team at some point in time,” Warner said. “The fortunate thing for him is he hasn’t had to do that. He carries them in the last two minutes. He makes some key plays. [He's] phenomenal out of the pocket and ad-libbing. But for me, if you go to the Hall of Fame, you have to be a guy who can carry your team week in and week out as a quarterback. That’s my opinion.”

[ALLD]

Ben may have been 8-23, but won. Kurt is 1-3 in SBs.

[Iron Steeler]

Hmmm Lets looks a the years leading to the arrival of Ben...

1999-Kordell Stewart as QB 6-10 Season... Failed to make the playoffs
2000-Kordell Stewart as QB 9-7 Season... Failed to make the Playoffs
2001-Kordell Stewart as QB 13-3 Season... lost to the Patriots in AFC Championship game
2002- Tommy Maddox take over 10-5-1 Season... lost to the Titans in the divisional round of playoffs
2003- Tommy Maddox as QB 6-10 Season... Failed to make playoffs
2004- Ben Roethlisberger qb 15-1 Season... Lost to the CHEATS in AFC Championship game
2005 Ben as QB 11-5 Season... Wins the superbowl
2006 Ben as QB 8-8 Season... Failed to make playoffs
2007 Ben as QB 10-6 Season... lose to Jags " Harrison hold play wasnt called"
2008 Ben as QB 12-4 Season...Won superbowl
2009 Ben as QB 9-7 Failed to make playoffs
2010 Ben as QB 12-4 going to the super bowl

Since ben as been under center it seems like he has got us to the superbowl every other year. The 2006 season i call the cowher departer season, Bill cowher kinda "meh" attitude about that whole season because he finally got his ring.

The point that I am trying to make is that the major difference in this team from 1999 to now is BEN. Ya the defense has always been great, ya we always try to establish a strong running game. BUT the only thing that is different from now to then is the QB.

Heres some food for thought... if we didn't have the Cheating Patriots steal that game from us in 2004 and the dreaded hold on harrison was called in the jags game... the Steelers could have at least one more superbowl

[Bluecoat96]

I've always loved Warner and still do, but does he watch the same Ben Roethlisberger that we do on a week to week basis? Of course Ben doesn't "carry the team" - no one player should "carry a team", but damn it, when the chips are down Ben comes through. Seems like a little envy to me which shocks me coming from Kurt.

I like Kurt as well. I'm sure he may be a little envious. HOWEVER.....I heard from his own mouth on the NFL network that because he grew up a Cowboys fan, and because he lost to the Steelers in the superbowl, he HATES the Steelers. He respects the Rooneys, but hates the Steelers. While I think he tries to be objective as an analyst, I think his bias against the Steelers is obvious. Still an overall good guy though.

[zulater]

Yeah well I think Kurt Warner had too many shitty seasons to ever be considered a genuine Hall of Fame qb.

http://www.pro-football-reference.co...W/WarnKu00.htm

Look at Kurt from 2002-2006, simply awful.

Ben's never had the first team all pro talent that Kurt needed to boost his immobile ass to top level play. I mean look at Kurt's time in St. Louis, he had arguably the best LT in football history, one of the top five backs ever, and the best receiver core ever assembled. Yeah Kurt, you really carried that team....

[Butch]

Screw kurt I don't give a rats ass what he says.

Mke Taylor (Ticket 760 here in San Antonio) has Ben's Back!!! He quoted Jim Rome in saying to the effect if you don't think Ben is a Great QB then you don't need to be a part of this show. Called those people mouthbreathers and that is where I put a-holes like warner.

If there are any Steeler fans on here from S.A. you have to listen to this guy he's a cowboy fan but he has a lot of Steeler Love and is so damn fun to listen to. He's on here from 4-7 central time.

Yinz can listen to him on 760.com

[TheRuneMeister]

You don't judge a guy by his 2 Super Bowl performances alone. You judge him by all the other games he played. That includes some amazing playoff performances. I get so tired hearing that he didn't earn his first and Super Bowl...what...he didn't just play 1 game those seasons!

In 2005 he led the league in Yards Per Attempt with an 8.90, and finished third in passer rating with a 98.6. Brady did a 7.8 YPA and a 92.3 rating that year, and apparently he is the best QB of all time.

[fansince'76]

Yeah well I think Kurt Warner had too many shitty seasons to ever be cosnidered a genuine Hall of Fame qb.

http://www.pro-football-reference.co...W/WarnKu00.htm

Look at Kurt from 2002-2006, simply awful.

Ben's never had the first team all pro talent that Kurt needed to boost his immobile ass to top level play. I mean look at Kurt's time in St. Louis, he had arguably the best LT in football history, one of the top five backs ever, and the best receiver core ever assembled. Yeah Kurt, you really carried that team....

Agreed - not to mention the fact that he was playing bush league football and stocking grocery store shelves until he was 27. I don't consider him to exactly be a 1st ballot HoF lock either.

[SteelerFanInStl]

Blah, blah, blah. Who cares? The last time that I checked, Ben wasn't finished with his football career so I don't really give a rat's ass whether or not people believe that he's a HOF QB NOW.

[tube517]

[BigNastyDefense]

I think Warner still has sour grapes from Super Bowl 43.

[HometownGal]

I think Warner still has sour grapes from Super Bowl 43.

That's a very reasonable assessment. Warner and Steve Young can go play patty-cake under a rock together after the Steelers win on Sunday.

[Iron Steeler]

He fails to mention his performance in XLII? Of course.

He says in order to be in the hall you have to see him carry his team week in and week out...

Umm of showing the visual evidence. I would sit there and ask kurt crybaby warner find me footage where he doesn't carry the team? He contradicts himself in two sentences. One he praises bens 2min offensive ability and then he claims that he doesn't carry his team.

Superbowl XLIII hit the replay button kurt!

[zulater]

Generally I like Warner, and he's entitled to his opinion, and I understand he qualified his remarks about Ben with a yet. But regardless, if his posistion is that Ben isn't worthy of HOF consideration after 3 Super Bowl wins then he sure as hell shouldn't propose himself as being worthy either. Because I can't think of one HOF inductee who has as many bad seasons on their resume as good ones.

[tube517]

Exactly. How about that year in NY Kurt? Those injury riddled years at St Louis?

Generally I like Warner, and he's entitled to his opinion, and I understand he qualified his remarks about Ben with a yet. But regardless, if his posistion is that Ben isn't worthy of HOF consideration after 3 Super Bowl wins then he sure as hell shouldn't propose himself as being worthy either. Because I can't think of one HOF inductee who has as many bad seasons on their resume as good ones.

[Edman]

With all due respect to Kurt, If Ben has no business in the Hall of Fame, neither do you. But People are considering it anyway.

He was a grocery-bagging nobody from the Arena League until the Rams picked him up, QB'd one of the greatest ensemble of offensive Power for three years, dropped COMPLETELY off the map afterwards, lost his job to Marc Bulger and run out of St. Louis, went to New York to sit behind Eli Manning, then went to Arizona to sit behind Leinart then had the one miracle run to the Super Bowl in 2008.

Kurt Warner, when look at his career as a whole, is a gloried journeyman at best. 4-5 Good Seasons for Four Different Teams over a decade doesn't and shouldn't make you a lock for the HOF. You better get over yourself, man.

[GodfatherofSoul]

Just because you're surrounded by great players doesn't mean you're not a HoFer. Look at Troy Aikman. The guy was insanely accurate and could've been one of those Peyton types, but he had a HoF line with Emmit Smith to hand off to and a stellar defense.

And, Kordell never won any Superbowls. The only time I can think of a total scrub QB getting to the Superbowl as a hindrance rather than help was Trent Dilfer.

[Dino 6 Rings]

I'm more worried about Dawson and Bettis at this point over Ben.

Oh and Curtis Martin (LETS GO PITT)

[BnG_Hevn]

Steelers' QBs will never get respect b/c it is the defense that carries the team. He could literally put up Manning numbers and still get no respect b/c then it would be the defense that gave him those opportunities.

Same with Tomlin. He gets no respect as the HC b/c it is the "organization" that is responsible for the success.

Honestly though, I'd rather be part of a winning organization like the Steelers and get no credit (or very little) than to be on a loser franchise and get all the credit.

[7SteelGal43]

Well, Hall of Fame or not, here's my take on it. Two words......BEN WINS !


I am sick and tired of hearing people compare Big Ben to Tom Brady and Peyton Manning. It's kinda like comparing apples and oranges. No doubt, Brady and Manning are great QBs. You can't argue with those stats, but Ben has one more SB ring than Peyton and is one win away from having as many as Tom. And the last time I checked, during any given play, there are 11 men on the field. In a word, it's a TEAM thing. And the Steelers are a great TEAM. Ask the Miami Dolphins fans how they feel about having a HOF QB who was a record breaker and definitely on ANY "top 5 greatest QBs of all time" list. Look at Terry Bradshaw. He wasn't a top five QB, or a "statmeister", but he's got 4 rings, cause Like Ben, he just WON. On any given Sunday, I'll take BIG BEN ROETHLISBERGER !

[st33lersguy]

This is coming from a guy who lost to Roethlisberger in the superbowl and has won one less superbowl than Ben. I guess that just because Warner gained a lot of yards by simply throwing passes to talented pass catchers that he can criticize someone just for not throwing for 4,000 yards and 30 TDs per year

[steel striker]

Don't hate the player hate the game.

[VTsteel]

[steeldevil]

Yea he is not in yet, but if we win on Sunday he is in.

[86WARD]

If he wins a third championship this weekend and continues to make the playoffs, he's a first ballot lock as long as he stays out of trouble...

[Count Steeler]

Let's let Ben finish out his career and then we will see if he is HOF. The guy is still only in his 6th year.

[steel striker]

Alot of people don't see the big picture here and, that is winning they just like the stats. The only stat that matters is wins and, that is what Ben does he wins. Maybe after Ben has a big sb win maybe with mvp honors the so called experts will change there tunes. Well all except the biggest Ben hater Steve "I Hate Big Ben" Young.

[tube517]

Don't hate the player hate the game.

5 time 5 time 5 time.....(Staring at palm)