Mike Tomczak had a good football head.Originally Posted by DuckHodges
Mike Tomczak had a good football head.
I think I want to say Tomczak was better. Or at least less likely to throw killer picks.
I don't know every single name, but it actually seems like this offseason may be the rare year where there is a glut of veteran backup QBs on the market who don't suck too bad and aren't too expensive. It would be a shame if we passed up that opportunity because we're stuck on Shitty Mitch.
I mean, I know we're the Steelers and we never fire anybody no matter how much they suck or else we'd be like the Browns, but that does not always make it smart. Objects at rest tend to stay at rest, even a rock or a piece of wood has that figured out, it's not special. Even if it was a lateral move financially, I'd rather have just about anybody else. Call it irrational hatred, but I just can't stand to see that guy on the roster after he cost us an entire season.
See you Space Cowboy ...
Tomczak was a smart player…just couldn’t execute.
But that’s what Tomlin does. Hell he was loyal enough to the veteran to start him over the better player. He kept Jones around when there was much better options (Foles), he kept Rudolph around when there were much better options (Fitzpatrick) and now he will keep Trubisky around for 2-3 more years…once he’s extended. Tomlin likes to feel comfortable with not changing and also not think of back up QB as a need or important position. If they were to release Trubisky and sign another veteran, it would be the absolute most shocking thing this team has done under Tomlins watch…and it’s not even close…
Khan has said he want to keep Mitch in 2023 and after that but I don't think Mitch will accept a extension....
Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
I don’t see why not. Even if he has himself convinced he’s starter level, he faces the exact same situation anywhere else. If he goes to Indy, for instance, they are drafting a rookie early as well. Where does he go and he’s the default starter day 1? Plus, I think he will get playing time even as the backup with the Steelers. KP is tough but he’s no BigBen. This division is brutal on QBs.
Both Mitch and Mason Rudolph have to realize neither of them can go to other teams and be "starters". It's just not going to happen at this point in their careers. Mitch is on his third team already with the Steelers. For those teams that clearly are looking for a new QB with an open starting position, none of those teams will be clamoring for Mitch (or Mason for that matter). Not that I think the NFL media knows what they are talking about all of the time, but I never see any reports of teams wanting to go get Mitch or Mason for a starting QB position this offseason, or even to compete for the spot. These guys are career backups, which is not a bad gig at all in my mind.
That’s ridiculous. No “borderline” starter like Foles or Fitzpatrick was coming to Pittsburgh while Ben was here. Those guys chase starting opportunities not sleepy backup jobs behind a HOF caliber guy in his prime.
Who is Mahomes backup? Tysom Hill, basically a TE, was Brees backup at the end. Who is Josh Allen’s backup now that it’s not Trubisky?
Your missing the point for one. Secondly, Foles could’ve been had at that time. Very easily after the Rams released him. He made something like $1.75M from the Chiefs. Throw $3M at him and he’s in Pittsburgh. Fitzpatrick also was a back up at almost everywhere he went. I mean you want to use Matt Hasselbeck as example, he’s another name. He took a backup job behind Luck. Point is, there were plenty of back up QB opportunities out there of the veteran nature and WAY more talented than Jones and Rudolph; Tomlin stuck with the lesser alternative. He will do the same in this situation as well only Trubisky is more talented than the previous two and costs more money than the previous two.
Array title="oneforthetoe has a reputation beyond repute">
It's easy to sit at a computer and tell a guy that he will never be a starter and should sign as a backup. However, if you were "that guy" in high school and college it's a hard pill to swallow - especially true if you were a high draft pick. At some point, of course, the vast majority of players have to accept that they will not be stars (or even have long careers).
Michy the Kid (what movie?) will be 29 when the season starts. So, if he would sign a two-year extension, he would be 32 and pretty much have to accept that nobody is going to think of him as a long-term starter. Certainly, there is always the possibility he could find a 2022 "Brown's" Jacoby Brissett situation, whereby he is a place holder for a QB due to injury or excessive massaging. Still, he will eventually have to accept reality no matter where he goes.
Just as a side note: as most here are old enough to remember, thirty years ago most rookies didn't usually start their first-year, so there was opportunity for "place holder" QB's to get some quality starting time. Those days are definitely over.
I'm not sure Nick Foles was "way more talented" than anybody. He had one year with a gimmicky Chip Kelly offense and then ONE part of year that he was incredible. And then an entire career of going places and getting benched for other options.
And Fitzpatrick wandered around the league looking for weak or declining starters that he could take playing time from.
Further, when you have a HOF QB that you are spending a gazillion dollars on...the best thing your back-up QB can be is cheap.
The Steelers can't afford to be cheap on their backup QB. Is Mitch overpaid? Yes, but with Pickett's concussion history, the Steelers would be wise to have a good backup QB, at least one of the best backups in the NFL, even if he is overpaid.
Foles had a great career in Philadelphia but he was awful in other place!
And Ben did not miss many game because of a injuries from 2013 to 2021 outside of 2015 and of course in 2019 and the steelers had drafted Rudolph in 2018...Of course it did not work but Foles had a huge contract in the 2019 offseason with the Jags...For Fitzpatrick,he was always in a place where he could be the starter for several game at some point in a season so the steelers were not a option for him
I'd settle for steady or reliable.
Your saying Nick Foles and Landry Jones were close in talent?
Again, missing the point.
There were veteran options, much better than Jones and Rudolph…Tomlin stuck with what he was comfortable with…just like he will stick with Trubisky because there’s a comfort there, even though there might be better options out there. Salary cap is not an issue with him.
"Our backup QB sucks, but we need him because he sucks in OUR system!"
-Steelers front office motto
See you Space Cowboy ...
Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-age...arterback/all/
Who is the better backup and how much do they cost? Must have a starting point to find any common ground or to at least debate apples to apples.
Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
The only QB I see on there is Brissett. He is a career backup but still costs over $5M. Honestly, I like Mitch better. An extension that makes him cost less per season and I like him even more.
Produced similar results. Losing turnover prone football.
I further figure Tomlin had little to do with it ultimately. Those dudes were cheap. That was the key. Capped out and making a SB push. Not the time to spend anything on backup QB.
Also they tried to upgrade on the cheap with Gradkowski, Vick, Dobbs, etc.
Brissett beats the ever-loving dogshit out of Trubisky, and for less money. I would take that deal in a second. I would probably put Case Keenum in the same category.
Others on the list I'd consider would be Bridgewater, Daniels, Gabbert, even Gardner Minshew, who have all shown they can play well enough to win you a game, and probably all would cost far less than Shitty Mitch.
Cooper Rush is another one, although I have no idea if he'll actually be available or for a decent price.
There are some other names on that list that I really have no idea how they're doing now or whether they are realistic options, but at one time would have been hands-down winners over Trubisky and could be worth a look as a backup: Darnold, Wentz, Mayfield, Mariota, to name a few.
Before you say "have you seen those guys play, half of them are garbage!" ... Did you see Mitch play last year? The bar is so low that you pretty much have to dig a hole for it. There are like 15 guys I'd rather have. We're in the position where even if they suck too, we're no worse off.
See you Space Cowboy ...
Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
First, I would never call someone garbage just because they are backup level in the NFL. Just not my style.
Second, I don’t necessarily disagree that some of those guys you list aren’t better overall QBs. I just don’t think they are head and shoulders better. I also don’t see a big enough savings salary cap-wise to get upset over a move or not. Mitch will get a check whether he is kept or released. That $8M difference would pay a different guy $4-$6M, so say $5M. For me that’s a huge chunk of money. For the NFL it doesn’t even move the needle. So for approximately the same talent level, it’s ok if they do/ok if they don’t.
KP plus Mitch is better than KP plus Mason. Just my opinion.
You can't just look at lists of current or past free agents and be like "Oh! They should sign this guy!". Especially with QBs. It doesn't work that way. These higher-end back-ups/lowest tier starters do not typically go places without a clear scenario that leads them to starting a high # of games.
Take Brissett. He just wouldn't sign to come to the Steelers. Maybe last season he figures he can hold off the draft pick and make a run at being the starter. But now? No way. Some team like Washington, Vegas, Panthers, or whoever else misses out on the first wave of the QB musical chairs is going to throw big $$$ at him and the phrase "compete for the job".
Since 2004, the Steelers have had ONE season (2022) where they could tell any QB that they had a chance to "compete for the job". That was the lone season where they signed one of the "top" FA QBs available. It turned out that those evaluations of MT's abilities were a bit off.
But I think the conversation on the back-up QB issue from 2004 to now needs to have a bit of cold water thrown on it. For a long time, Pittsburg was one of the least attractive places in the NFL for well regarded back-up QBs to sign. There was no clear path to starting games. There was no "QB Guru" to burnish their reputation - like how Payton/Brees were going to fix Jameis or Daboll revamped Trubisky. So they were left sorting through the bargain bin of dudes without other options. Then, after that kinda sucked; the started prioritizing their own draft picks. Now...who those draft picks were....that's another conversation. But if you're going to be bad at the position at least you are young and cheap!
Array title="pczach has a reputation beyond repute">
Trubisky was basically a quarterback that was generally one of the 15-20 best quarterbacks during his time with the Bears. He was never a great quarterback, but he led them to the playoffs multiple times and had some decent numbers.
He isn't garbage. He's a guy that didn't live up to where he was drafted and didn't become the star many had hoped. It doesn't mean that he doesn't have value. People overreact to him having a couple bad games in a shitty offense. The offense is getting better. So will Trubisky when inserted into it.
I have no problem with Brissett or Keenum being the backup here, but I also don't have a problem with Trubisky. This is all about what they believe is best for Kenny Pickett's development and what is best for the team. Sometimes continuity is the best approach.
Here's an article on Trubisky's time in Chicago with plenty of stats and perspective. I think it's a fair evaluation of him as a player. I think Mitch T has done enough in his career to show that he will be a good backup QB for years to come if the Steelers want him to be and HE wants to be. I think the anger, frustration, and panic about him playing here as a backup is more than a little silly.
https://www.profootballnetwork.com/l...chicago-bears/
Trubisky has lackluster mechanics, doesn't see the field very well and can barely function without a dominant Defense to carry the day for him. In other words, a perfect backup.
As a backup, I have no problem with Trubisky. He can come in and steal 1-2 games for you. It's Starter Mitch Steeler fans are (rightfully) afraid of. Either way, if Pickett is ever out for a considerable time, they're in trouble.
Array title="pczach has a reputation beyond repute">
I mean......name a team that isn't in trouble if the starting quarterback goes down.
That's the nature of NFL football and football in general at all levels of play. Teams having the backup quarterback play great football and being the reason for teams winning is the extreme exception, not the rule. Most teams are simply trying to survive until the starter returns and are hoping to tread water.
Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
All you need do is look at all the fanfare and oohs and ahhs Cooper Rush got last season when Dak was out to see exactly that point. The backup came in and looked pretty good over a few games. In SF they made the backup look good as well, until he needed to throw a deep pass. SF still doesn't have a QB, just a roster of backups. If KP has to miss a couple game it won't really matter much who backs him up. So keep Mitch, replace Mitch, or add a second Mitch.
Those weren’t upgrades. Those were necessity signings at the time and Dobbs was a throw away draft pick.
Too much complaining for nothing again!
I mean, it's true that Ben's backups weren't great in his last 10 years or so but it's not bad like the Colts in the Peyton Manning era or the Packers in 2017 or other years with Aaron Rodgers
Also the reason why there's too much complaining about it is because under Tomlin the steelers were decent when Ben was out...From 2007 to 2021 the steelers were 17-15-1 or something thing like that, so it was not terrible..... the steelers have bigger problem than that!
I don’t know how to explain it clearer.
They weren’t going to spend $$$ on the position.
There was no path to starts or ability to rehab league wide perception.
Therefore, there was zero reason for highly regarded backups to consider coming to the Steelers.
They lured in vets when they could and gambled on mid to low round draft picks.
I can not understand how that was supposed to go any other way.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote