Moats: Should The Pittsburgh Steelers Sign Melvin Ingram Or Justin Houston?

[Shoes]

[Born2Steel]

From that conversation I agree with the thought of bringing in a veteran to play a backup role that allows Highsmith to start and grow into that role, while allowing Roche to not be expected to step into the primary backup role day 1. Makes good sense to me.

[Mojouw]

I think that the idea is sound. But Ingram and Houston are not coming to Pittsburgh. Two reasons:

1. They don't have any money to pay them.
2. These guys are going to go somewhere to either ring chase or play a TON of snaps and rehab their 2022 FA value. Neither is really the plan in Pittsburgh.

[Shoes]

From that conversation I agree with the thought of bringing in a veteran to play a backup role that allows Highsmith to start and grow into that role, while allowing Roche to not be expected to step into the primary backup role day 1. Makes good sense to me.

I think I'd go with Houston if I had a choice. He played in every game last season, with no injury issues and I believe they said he had 8 sacks plus he would be the cheaper of the two. I like the thought that he would be great player when TJ and Highsmith need rested.

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I think that the idea is sound. But Ingram and Houston are not coming to Pittsburgh. Two reasons:

1. They don't have any money to pay them.
2. These guys are going to go somewhere to either ring chase or play a TON of snaps and rehab their 2022 FA value. Neither is really the plan in Pittsburgh.

Moats seemed to think they could swing Houston.

[hawaiiansteeler]

are they willing to play for the one year vet minimum?

[Shoes]

are they willing to play for the one year vet minimum?

I believe last year Houston was a 9m cap hit on the colts. I'm sure the Steelers don't have the cash as Mojouw said but the Steelers have played musical chairs with money in the past. I just hope they don't bring Chickillo back.

[DesertSteel]

I hear that Jarvis Jones is available.

[Mojouw]

I don't think that Houston is gonna come here and play 10 snaps a game for like $3 million or something. Why would he? I'm sure the Chiefs, Bills, Bucs, or another SB contender would more than willingly match that deal.

Also....what does the team want in another OLB? Does that player need to play special teams? Almost certainly. Houston and Ingram won't be doing that. Does another OLB ONLY play on obvious pass rushing downs? Because Ingram and Houston aren't coming here to play run defense. And if Watt is a legit DPOY candidate and Highsmith is everything the team seems to think he is...why would you ever pull those two off the field on a pass rush down?

To me, it seems like what they Steelers need is a solid professional OLB that is a good run defender and can play on STs. Any pass rush is just a bonus. Again...and this is just my weird brain...but that says something like Jayrone Elliot or the 2021 version of him.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

I hear that Jarvis Jones is available.

Yeah, but do you think they could lure him away from Subway to Latrobe for Training Camp?

[BlackAndGold]

Trent Murphy makes more sense cap wise.

[Born2Steel]

I think I'd go with Houston if I had a choice. He played in every game last season, with no injury issues and I believe they said he had 8 sacks plus he would be the cheaper of the two. I like the thought that he would be great player when TJ and Highsmith need rested.

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Moats seemed to think they could swing Houston.

I think the NFL are doing the 1 big cut at the end of TC again this season. Maybe if they don't bring in a 1 year vet minimum guy now one could come available at the cutdown. I don't think they would bring in another rookie at this point, but maybe. It seems to me you want a guy that brings a veteran experience but would be the 1st backup role for Watt and Highsmith. If not Houston or Ingram I would bet someone else gets cut and can be picked up for vet minimum or a little more at the end of TC.

[Born2Steel]

What do we think of Mychal Kendricks?

[pczach]

Yeah, but do you think they could lure him away from Subway to Latrobe for Training Camp?

It's awfully hard to give up that employee discount.

[hawaiiansteeler]

It's awfully hard to give up that employee discount.

I think you get a free cookie once a month also, no way he's leaving.

[teegre]

Which is worse: working at Subway or eating the food?

[86WARD]

Which is worse: working at Subway or eating the food?

Working. Because when you work there, you’ll probably also eat it...

[Disco1981]

I think that the idea is sound. But Ingram and Houston are not coming to Pittsburgh. Two reasons:

1. They don't have any money to pay them.
2. These guys are going to go somewhere to either ring chase or play a TON of snaps and rehab their 2022 FA value. Neither is really the plan in Pittsburgh.

Not so sure about no.2...They're old veterans on their last legs...I don't think any pending/big future FA signii is in their future

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I don't think that Houston is gonna come here and play 10 snaps a game for like $3 million or something. Why would he? I'm sure the Chiefs, Bills, Bucs, or another SB contender would more than willingly match that deal.

Also....what does the team want in another OLB? Does that player need to play special teams? Almost certainly. Houston and Ingram won't be doing that. Does another OLB ONLY play on obvious pass rushing downs? Because Ingram and Houston aren't coming here to play run defense. And if Watt is a legit DPOY candidate and Highsmith is everything the team seems to think he is...why would you ever pull those two off the field on a pass rush down?

To me, it seems like what they Steelers need is a solid professional OLB that is a good run defender and can play on STs. Any pass rush is just a bonus. Again...and this is just my weird brain...but that says something like Jayrone Elliot or the 2021 version of him.

Between giving Highsmith AND Watt rest...He would hardly play only 10 snaps! It's usually every 3rd series...Which would mean, every other series when you're spelling 2 of them!

[teegre]

Melvin Ingram has always reminded me of Bud Dupree (or, vice versa)… in that they were both injured early & often, but when healthy, they were pretty good at applying pressure. Ingram (and Bud) spent four years doing squat, before they broke out. Ingram had a short-lived resurgence… before he once again couldn’t keep healthy (which I also foresee for Bud).

Simply put, Ingram might sign for cheap, and if he’s only asked to play 15 snaps (a series or two in each half), then that might the best for him and for the Steelers. It’s just enough playing time to keep him fresh/off of the training table, while allowing him to go “full tilt” on the plays where he’s spelling Watt/Highsmith.

[DesertSteel]

Between giving Highsmith AND Watt rest...He would hardly play only 10 snaps! It's usually every 3rd series...Which would mean, every other series when you're spelling 2 of them!

TJ's snap count was over 83% last year. How's that every third series??

[Shoes]

Looks like it was Ingram

[DesertSteel]

I love the definitive "He's not coming" conclusions in here.

[86WARD]

I love the definitive "He's not coming" conclusions in here.

A rule of thumb: If they want a player, they’ll get the player. Money/Salary cap is least of their issues. They ALWAYS find money if they need to…

[Dwinsgames]

I think that the idea is sound. But Ingram and Houston are not coming to Pittsburgh. Two reasons:

1. They don't have any money to pay them.
2. These guys are going to go somewhere to either ring chase or play a TON of snaps and rehab their 2022 FA value. Neither is really the plan in Pittsburgh.

oops

[Mojouw]

oops

Yup. Totally nailed that prediction.

I really thought that Ingram particularly would get like 6-8 on a one year deal.

[DesertSteel]

Yup. Totally nailed that prediction.

I really thought that Ingram particularly would get like 6-8 on a one year deal.

Anyone know what he did get?

[Mojouw]

Anyone know what he did get?

I think I saw $4 million.

[Shoes]

I was still hoping for Houston because of the no injury issues and he played very well last year, also read the Steelers wanted him. Still hasn't signed anywhere, so I'm guessing he has a high price. I agreed with Moats on Ingram, if he is in 2019 shape, he will probably be the starter.

[teegre]

I think I saw $4 million.

1 year/$4 million

Houston is indeed who the Steelers wanted, but his asking price was twice as much. The silver lining is that signing Ingram for cheap allows the Steelers to still sign another free agent.

Last season, Houston had more sacks (8 to 0), but over the past three seasons, Ingram had a ton of pressures. They may not be as easily noticed, but pressures lead to incompletions.

[Mojouw]

1 year/$4 million

Houston is indeed who the Steelers wanted, but his asking price was twice as much. The silver lining is that signing Ingram for cheap allows the Steelers to still sign another free agent.

Last season, Houston had more sacks (8 to 0), but over the past three seasons, Ingram had a ton of pressures. They may not be as easily noticed, but pressures lead to incompletions.

I would argue that Ingram is also the more complete LB at this stage in their careers.

[teegre]

I would argue that Ingram is also the more complete LB at this stage in their careers.

That might indeed be the case. Because, while Houston has far more sacks AND Houston has the name recognition (three All Pro seasons and the sack leader in 2014), Houston hasn’t made a Pro Bowl (nor an All Pro team) in half a decade. Maybe Houston is a “sack only” type of player at this point… …but, I honestly don’t know, because I didn’t watch him with the Colts.

The drop off between what the two players can demand on the open market might have more to do with Ingram’s injury history (than a difference in their levels of play).