Colbert On Roethlisberger’s Future With Steelers: ‘We Have To Look At This Current Situation’

[Shoes]

Well if Ben said he didn't care what his pay was in 2021, what's the problem? Unless he does care how much he's going to get paid in 2021



Recognizing the cap issues Ben Roethlisberger’s contract presents, Kevin Colbert was non-committal to Roethlisberger’s future with the team. Speaking with reporters for roughly 30 minutes Wednesday, Colbert addressed Roethlisberger’s status going forward.
While Colbert said Roethlisberger can still play, he reiterated a need to re-work his $41 million cap charge to have a chance to move forward together.

https://steelersdepot.com/2021/02/co...ent-situation/

[DesertSteel]

Picked this up in an ESPN article:

The cap charge for the Jets' entire defense is $46.6 million, according to Over The Cap. The Pittsburgh Steelers' charge for quarterback Ben Roethlisberger is $41.3 million.

Actually, the Jets will fall below Big Ben's number if they release defensive lineman Henry Anderson ($8.2 million savings). Roethlisberger, too, seems to be on thin ice.

[that1guy]

The Steelers will be desperate for a franchise QB in 2022.

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

Screw Ben and he has been hurting this team for the last 5 years. He seems like a selfish person and all about him. F him and do whatever it takes to draft Mac Jones.

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My bad I should have said 10 years.

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His heart hasn't been in it since the last SB win against Arizona and it's been showing for years.

[DesertSteel]

Screw Ben and he has been hurting this team for the last 5 years. He seems like a selfish person and all about him. F him and do whatever it takes to draft Mac Jones.

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My bad I should have said 10 years.

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His heart hasn't been in it since the last SB win against Arizona and it's been showing for years.

I think your view is held by, maybe, a 2% minority here. And frankly, that 2% aren't posters I'd want to be associated with.

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

I think your view is held by, maybe, a 2% minority here. And frankly, that 2% aren't posters I'd want to be associated with.

That's not an argument just a personal attack.

The Steelers offense is the way it is because of Ben and Tomlin. The Steelers are unrecognizable from the team they were with Cowher. The more presence Ben has had with the team the more it became a passing offense like the Lions or Saints.

In 8 of the last 9 seasons the Steelers have been in the bottom half of rushing teams in the league despite never having had a losing season and therefore incentive to run the ball and kill the clock. This is despite having had a top OL for several years and very good backs like Bell, Williams and Conner.

I don't know what mental gymnastics are required to state that QB aren't responsible for team success or offensive output. It's pretty clear Ben wants the offense to be one where he passes 600+ times a year.

The Steelers were better off with Ben than without. Anyone who watched 2019 agrees. That doesn't change the fact that the Steelers identity offensively is completely centered on Ben, and therefore the resulting performance is directly attributable to said offensive philosophy.

The defense has been blowing games in the playoffs lately. I don't blame Ben for the last two playoff departures. I just think it's ridiculous to try and enforce cultish worship of Ben when as a matter of fact the Steelers have largely taken on his personality and philosophy as an identity.

[Mojouw]

All teams that employ a HOF caliber "franchise" QB take on the personality of that QB and cater their entire offensive scheme to the abilities and preferences of that QB. To do anything else would be foolish and dumb.

To say the Steelers offense is unrecognizable from what they were under Cowher is a good thing. If the Steelers had not changed for almost 15 years since Cowher retired, that would be folly on an epic scale.

The last 6 SB winning teams have ranked 25, 22, 5, 3, 12, and 17 in rushing for the season. Proves you don't have to run the ball to play winning football.

For all but 3 seasons in Ben's entire career (2017, 2018, and 2020) the Steelers have ranked outside of the top 5 in pass attempts per game. Most years outside of the top 12 and many years outside of the top 20.

And this is coming from a guy what doesn't think that Ben should play anymore. But whatever points are being made that somehow the past 10 years or whatever are some misguided mistake behind a lost cause at QB and that the Steelers should've been having Ben turn around and ram the ball into the gut of a big ass RB 35 times a game is just ridiculous.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

I think your view is held by, maybe, a 2% minority here. And frankly, that 2% aren't posters I'd want to be associated with.

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

All teams that employ a HOF caliber "franchise" QB take on the personality of that QB and cater their entire offensive scheme to the abilities and preferences of that QB. To do anything else would be foolish and dumb.

To say the Steelers offense is unrecognizable from what they were under Cowher is a good thing. If the Steelers had not changed for almost 15 years since Cowher retired, that would be folly on an epic scale.

The last 6 SB winning teams have ranked 25, 22, 5, 3, 12, and 17 in rushing for the season. Proves you don't have to run the ball to play winning football.

For all but 3 seasons in Ben's entire career (2017, 2018, and 2020) the Steelers have ranked outside of the top 5 in pass attempts per game. Most years outside of the top 12 and many years outside of the top 20.

And this is coming from a guy what doesn't think that Ben should play anymore. But whatever points are being made that somehow the past 10 years or whatever are some misguided mistake behind a lost cause at QB and that the Steelers should've been having Ben turn around and ram the ball into the gut of a big ass RB 35 times a game is just ridiculous.

The winning QBs the last 6 seasons were Brady, Manning, Mahomes and Foles who have playoff career INT% of 2.2, 2.3 1.3, and 2.4 respectively compared to Roethlisberger with 3.8.

Roethlisberger is a gunslinger. The best pass he ever threw was to Santonio in triple coverage.

This is exactly the point- you think Roethlisberger is as meticulous in preparation and as good at protecting the football as Brady or Manning therefore he should run the same offense with the same results.

Brady put up 589 points in one season; Manning 606; Mahomes 565; Ben 436. One of these things is not like the other one.

Roethliberger put up 389 in 2005 on 268 throws and 436 in 2014 on 606 throws.

Why do you think Ben is putting up barely more points throwing twice as much as he did as a rookie? Ben is clearly a much better QB now than he was then.

Your argument is that because Brady, Manning and Mahomes can win throwing 40+ times that so should every other QB be able to do the same thing as 3 of the all-time GOATs. Ben's winning percentage when throwing 40+ times is around .300.

Coming in to this season Mahomes was 7-3 (.700) throwing 40+; Brady 64-34 (.653); Manning 46-49 (.484); and Ben 21-42-1 (.336). Based on that information you think that Roethlisberger should be in a high pass volume offense as those other QBs? Why? Again... one of these things is not like the other one.

[Mojouw]

I have no idea what your point is. On one thread you argue Ben is the REASON for the Steelers success and on this thread you argue Ben is the CAUSE of an organizational failing?

Roethlisberger has been in a "high pass volume" offense basically 3 times in his entire career:

1. 2020 - being a low pass volume pass offense imploded before their very eyes and halfway through the season, they switched to the only thing that seemed to work - until it didn't.
2. 2018 - this one actually seemed to be by design. this is the year they seemed to get carried away with going "pass wacky".
3. 2017 - Offense was not the problem that year. While I might not like everything they did as an offense that year, the approach isn't what got them beat. The complete lack of playmakers at the ILB and DB positions got them beat.

So we have one year in a decade and a half career that throwing the ball too much seems to really have been the primary cause of the team failing to reach its ultimate goals. Really seem to have nailed down your overall thesis there.

[steelreserve]

The truth of the matter is, Ben is past the point where he is likely to "carry" the team to a championship. Doesn't mean he can't still play quarterback or is hurting the team, and we certainly aren't better off without him in the short term. For at least next year, he probably has to be on the roster no matter what, just because of the cap charge situation. Is the rest of the team strong enough to be a contender? Well, the offense has a lot of question marks, and the defense would be glad to avoid taking a half-step backwards. Anything can always happen, but as it stands I'd call the team a long shot that can probably scratch out a winning season but not much more.

It depends what Colbert, etc., think is the best path to rebuilding/retooling into a long-term contender. If that's spending a year or two in purgatory while trying to rebuild on the fly, I doubt they do anything drastic with Ben. If it's the nuclear option, then maybe they decide it's better to eat shit for a season and see if they can get a first-round pick for Ben that they can use in the rebuilding. That is probably not too likely.

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

I have no idea what your point is. On one thread you argue Ben is the REASON for the Steelers success and on this thread you argue Ben is the CAUSE of an organizational failing?

Roethlisberger has been in a "high pass volume" offense basically 3 times in his entire career:

1. 2020 - being a low pass volume pass offense imploded before their very eyes and halfway through the season, they switched to the only thing that seemed to work - until it didn't.
2. 2018 - this one actually seemed to be by design. this is the year they seemed to get carried away with going "pass wacky".
3. 2017 - Offense was not the problem that year. While I might not like everything they did as an offense that year, the approach isn't what got them beat. The complete lack of playmakers at the ILB and DB positions got them beat.

So we have one year in a decade and a half career that throwing the ball too much seems to really have been the primary cause of the team failing to reach its ultimate goals. Really seem to have nailed down your overall thesis there.

Roethlisberger threw 38 times per game in 2014 and 42 per game in 2015 which you say isn't high volume...

There are two QBs in NFL history with winning records when throwing 40+ times per game and neither is Roethlisberger which is more to the point. Ben's career record when throwing 40+ is worse than the Tampa Bay Buccaneers record- the losingest franchise in history by percentage. LeT's Do MoRe oF ThAt.

You blame the 2017 season on the defense when the offense gave up 14 points off turnovers to the Jags as well as had two turnovers on downs. Roethlisberger is 0-7 when throwing 40+ times in the playoffs. 0-7... LeT's Do MoRe oF ThAt...

Closest Roethlisberger has gotten to back to a Superbowl? 2016 when Bell was on pace for an MVP like season then carried the first two playoff games.

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Steelers are definitely better with Ben as we saw in 2019. I don't like that the Steelers are publicly campaigning against Ben regarding his cap hit but Ben never kept a tight lid on things either so oh well.

The Steelers are in position for another winning season and possible playoff berth. Same as always.

[st33lersguy]

At this stage in his career, Ben is a limited QB and the Steelers won't win another Super Bowl with him. This Ben is closer to his many post-Bradshaw predecessors than he is the Ben in his prime. He's turned into a checkdown artist

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

At this stage in his career, Ben is a limited QB and the Steelers won't win another Super Bowl with him. This Ben is closer to his many post-Bradshaw predecessors than he is the Ben in his prime. He's turned into a checkdown artist

Ben still has the arm strength- he is overthrowing receivers deep not underthrowing them. This is like the movie Rookie of the Year. He is probably just adjusting to his newfound superhuman strength.

My own opinion is that Ben has only had amazing chemistry with two receivers: Santonio and AB. I don't think he trusts his receivers. He seems to trust Ebron the most right now.

[Mojouw]

Roethlisberger threw 38 times per game in 2014 and 42 per game in 2015 which you say isn't high volume...

There are two QBs in NFL history with winning records when throwing 40+ times per game and neither is Roethlisberger which is more to the point. Ben's career record when throwing 40+ is worse than the Tampa Bay Buccaneers record- the losingest franchise in history by percentage. LeT's Do MoRe oF ThAt.

You blame the 2017 season on the defense when the offense gave up 14 points off turnovers to the Jags as well as had two turnovers on downs. Roethlisberger is 0-7 when throwing 40+ times in the playoffs. 0-7... LeT's Do MoRe oF ThAt...

Closest Roethlisberger has gotten to back to a Superbowl? 2016 when Bell was on pace for an MVP like season then carried the first two playoff games.

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Steelers are definitely better with Ben as we saw in 2019. I don't like that the Steelers are publicly campaigning against Ben regarding his cap hit but Ben never kept a tight lid on things either so oh well.

The Steelers are in position for another winning season and possible playoff berth. Same as always.

It isn’t a high volume compared to the NFL. #6 and #15. Not exactly an unreasonable amount.

I mean I guess they could throw 23 passes and then just call it a day. Victory formation the rest of the plays.

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

It isn’t a high volume compared to the NFL. #6 and #15. Not exactly an unreasonable amount.

I mean I guess they could throw 23 passes and then just call it a day. Victory formation the rest of the plays.

In 2015 Roethlisberger was on pace for 680 passed- most in the NFL. 42.6 passes per start.

Since 2011 Ben has averaged 37.6 passes per game; Rodgers 34.8; Brady 37.7; Brees 38.4; Wilson 30.1; Mahomes 36.7.

Yeah, I don't think Ben is that kind of QB. The risk/reward isn't there. All those other QBs except Wilson have put up 34+ per game while Ben put up 27 per in his best year.

Ben is twice as likely as Rodgers or Brady to throw picks and scores a TD less per game while throwing as much or more. It's about complimentary football and not giving the other team good field position.

[Mojouw]

Ben was that kind of QB. Now he isn’t. It’s time to retire. I’ve been saying that for months.

But to back off of Ben in 2015 or 2014...that’s not really a realistic argument. If he wasn’t that guy, then they should’ve cut him.

You’re basically arguing that Ben wasn’t a SB winning caliber QB post 2010.

You don’t pay him all that cash and then cripple the passing game. The Seahawks are doing that now and it’s actively stupid and losing them big games.

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

Wilson just had a career year with the most pass attempts he has had, most TD, most points scored, second most yards etc. Seahawks lost their all-time great defense- same as what happened to the Steelers.

Seahawks were 8th in points scored and 1st in points allowed when they won the SB; last year they were also 8th in points scored but 15th in points allowed. You think the problem is the points scored?

...

We aren't going to agree on anything. You are arguing that Ben throwing more than Rodgers and as much as Brees is the optimal strategy for winning a Superbowl even though that hasn't worked out for either of those teams and Rodgers is a 3x MVP.

Rodgers is 11-9 and Ben is 13-9 in the playoffs. Rodgers is 45 TD to 13 INT vs 34 TD to 28 INT for Ben.

You just ignore that Ben is 0-7 when throwing 40+ times in the playoffs.

...

When Bell was playing like an MVP the play selection was 60-40 pass. It is the team strategy.

[Mojouw]

Wilson just had a career year with the most pass attempts he has had, most TD, most points scored, second most yards etc. Seahawks lost their all-time great defense- same as what happened to the Steelers.

Seahawks were 8th in points scored and 1st in points allowed when they won the SB; last year they were also 8th in points scored but 15th in points allowed. You think the problem is the points scored?

...

We aren't going to agree on anything. You are arguing that Ben throwing more than Rodgers and as much as Brees is the optimal strategy for winning a Superbowl even though that hasn't worked out for either of those teams and Rodgers is a 3x MVP.

Rodgers is 11-9 and Ben is 13-9 in the playoffs. Rodgers is 45 TD to 13 INT vs 34 TD to 28 INT for Ben.

You just ignore that Ben is 0-7 when throwing 40+ times in the playoffs.

...

When Bell was playing like an MVP the play selection was 60-40 pass. It is the team strategy.

Play selection should be dictated by the players available. Of course you give an MVP RB the ball a bunch. Just as you let your HOF QB throw the ball to his deep WR corps.

You fail to mention any context for all the random stats you toss around. Steelers were between 6-twenty something in pass attempts per game for every season of Ben’s career except the 3 I mentioned. Most years they were league average or below.

Ben throwing the ball too much isn’t the problem. It’s being so bad at running when they do run that’s at issue. Effective is more important than frequent.

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

Play selection should be dictated by the players available. Of course you give an MVP RB the ball a bunch. Just as you let your HOF QB throw the ball to his deep WR corps.

You fail to mention any context for all the random stats you toss around. Steelers were between 6-twenty something in pass attempts per game for every season of Ben’s career except the 3 I mentioned. Most years they were league average or below.

Ben throwing the ball too much isn’t the problem. It’s being so bad at running when they do run that’s at issue. Effective is more important than frequent.

Play selection has never dictated play selection on the Steelers. It didn't matter that Bell was getting 5 ypc. That's the point.

Our TE is a glorified WR who lines up in the slot.

The Steelers do not want to run the ball. That's the point and that is Ben and Tomlin both.

The three seasons you mentioned? You ignore Ben's league leading 42 attempts per start in 2015 though?!

This is going nowhere.

Unbalanced attacks haven't worked for Rodgers, Brees or Roethlisberger. If it hasn't worked for Rodgers it damn sure won't work for Ben. Steelers ran 39% of the time in 2014 and 41% of the time in 2016 when Bell was averaging almost 5 ypc.

It's not about just the offense it is about not putting the defense in bad spots which has been a recurring theme for over a decade now. Zzz.

[Mojouw]

So your argument is what? Hand the ball off more to Bell in the playoffs? Which playoff games? The ones he wasn’t hurt for? Which ones were those again?

Or throw less in the season or so they featured one of the most effective offense at converting drives into points?

Should they have thrown less in 2020 with old man Ben at the helm? Absolutely. They tried. They stunk at it.

So somehow results from now are correlated with 5+ years ago?

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

My argument is what worked for the Steelers was run the ball and stop the run as an identity first and foremost.

2005 Steelers were dead last in passing as play selection.

2008 Steelers were 23rd in passing as play selection.

2016 Steelers were 20th in passing as play selection.

Not having a run game has not worked for the Steelers. 2007 was the only year the Steelers were top 10 in rushing. The last three years the Steelers were 31, 29 and 32 in rushing yards and you are arguing this is a recipe for success so I am wondering where is that success?

The only season in the last 10 where the Steelers were actually Super Bowl contenders was 2016 when Bell was averaging 4.9 ypc and ran for 167 and 170 yards in the playoff wins.

...

You are like "Yes, I love that 2016 was sandwiched between not winning a playoff game for 4 years and not winning a playoff game for 4 years. Let's keep following this extremely unsuccessful approach and anyone who thinks differently is an idiot. I'm definitely not going to remember last year's Super Bowl when SF made it on running the ball alone or the year before that when Todd Gurley did the same or 2016 when Bell put the team on his back in a way Ben has never done. Only copying the Detroit Lions works in the NFL. Brady doesn't need a rushing game so no QB should need a rushing game because every QB is as good as Brady."

[pczach]

My argument is what worked for the Steelers was run the ball and stop the run as an identity first and foremost.

2005 Steelers were dead last in passing as play selection.

2008 Steelers were 23rd in passing as play selection.

2016 Steelers were 20th in passing as play selection.

Not having a run game has not worked for the Steelers. 2007 was the only year the Steelers were top 10 in rushing. The last three years the Steelers were 31, 29 and 32 in rushing yards and you are arguing this is a recipe for success so I am wondering where is that success?

The only season in the last 10 where the Steelers were actually Super Bowl contenders was 2016 when Bell was averaging 4.9 ypc and ran for 167 and 170 yards in the playoff wins.

...

You are like "Yes, I love that 2016 was sandwiched between not winning a playoff game for 4 years and not winning a playoff game for 4 years. Let's keep following this extremely unsuccessful approach and anyone who thinks differently is an idiot. I'm definitely not going to remember last year's Super Bowl when SF made it on running the ball alone or the year before that when Todd Gurley did the same or 2016 when Bell put the team on his back in a way Ben has never done. Only copying the Detroit Lions works in the NFL. Brady doesn't need a rushing game so no QB should need a rushing game because every QB is as good as Brady."

Show us all those Super Bowl wins with a dominant running game before Ben got here.










Exactly.....

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

Show me all the playoff wins in the past ten years in Ben's ideal offense.

The Steelers are 1-6 since SB XLV in playoff games where Bell did not run for at least 167 yards. Thoughts?

Please explain why 1 playoff win since 2011 where Bell didn't carry the team is desirable.

[Mojouw]

Ok. So play the same game as 15+ years ago? That seems legit.

Also that run-tastic 49ers team lost said SB because they were unable to effectively pass the ball with their meh QB.

Do the 2021 Steelers need to run better? Of course. But to use that as a jumping off point to argue that the franchise was off in la-la land since 2008 or whatever is goofy.

That requires that we all accept that Ben was basically Jimmy G or Kirk Cousins for his career. Because your argument is to take the ball out of Bens hands because he wasn’t good enough. If that’s the case, then he shouldn’t have been signed at 25-30 million per year. If you sign a guy at that level, you cater your entire offense to him. Like the entire NFL does.

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

The 49ers have 7 playoff wins since VLV with Garoppolo and Kaepernick as QB.

The Steelers have 3 of which 1 was a fluke over McCarron's Bengals and 2 were Bell putting the team on his back.

49ers have been to 2 Super Bowls in that time.

You'll have to explain to me why the 49ers are wrong for overachieving and the Steelers are right for underachieving.

Explain why 1 playoff win in 10 years without Bell playing like TD is satisfactory. I'm stupid maybe I just don't get it.

"ThIs iS tHE NeW nFL!" never resonated with me. Help me understand.

[Born2Steel]

I think what we ALL want for 2021 is to see the effort when it comes to running the ball. 2020 had an idea and offensive scheme to throw short to skills players, letting them use the open field to make big plays with the ball in their hands. It worked for a while. Same as a running team, defenses know what you're doing and know how to defend it. It comes down to which team makes the plays. Down the stretch the Steelers didn't make the plays. And there is blame enough for all involved. Injuries, dropped passes, turnovers, poor blocking, no team cohesiveness all contributed equally to the late season demise of the offense.
I think Colbert and the FO know this team is on the edge of a huge change. Nobody wants a complete wasted season in 2021. So in order to rebuild, some things will need to be taken down. Just how much, where, at what cost, among other factors are what Colbert is talking about as much as Ben personally. There is more to it than just 'Ben and the run game'.

[Lloydwoodsonjr]

There is no run game and never has been under Tomlin. I'm not sure if that was intentional early or if Arians and Zeirlein caused that but more recently it is.

My point is that doing the same thing will not produce a different result.This strategy has resulted in early playoff exits at best for the last decade with the one exception that is 2016.

[hawaiiansteeler]

There is no run game and never has been under Tomlin. I'm not sure if that was intentional early or if Arians and Zeirlein caused that but more recently it is.

My point is that doing the same thing will not produce a different result.This strategy has resulted in early playoff exits at best for the last decade with the one exception that is 2016.

you don't think Ben's 34 TDs to 28 ints ratio in 22 playoff games has also been a part of our playoff failures?

[DesertSteel]

To say that the Steelers tried to run the ball in 2020 is total BS. Their last 11 games they averaged 19 rush attempts per game, after averaging 32 per game during the first 5 games. They abandoned the run game. The OL got soft on run blocking because they succeeded with the short pass -- until they didn't.