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Thread: 4th-&-1

  1. #31
    Senior Member Array title="El-Gonzo Jackson has a reputation beyond repute"> El-Gonzo Jackson's Avatar

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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Does getting bashed go into the decision for Tomlin?
    Nope.

    He was asked in the postgame presser about the decision to punt. He said the defense had been playing well and the plan was to hopefully pin the Browns deep with a punt, have Steelers defense get a stop and then get a short field for the Steelers offense. Smart move IMO.

  2. #32
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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by 86WARD View Post
    So if he goes for it and they fail (like they’ve done almost all season), you’d be here bashing him for turning the ball over and giving the Browns a short field.
    Well it's not like Ben didn't do that 5 times already, at that point in the game we had momentum and it was do or die. What did the Browns do after that punt? They drove down the field and scored anyhow.

  3. #33
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    Re: 4th-&-1

    In the game day thread I said that I would have gone for it, but I understood the decision.

    The bigger headscratcher was earlier in the game being in Browns territory down 28-0 and punting. That I don't get.

    I also get going for the first 2-point conversion attempt, but I strongly disagreed with it at the time.

  4. #34
    Senior Member Array title="teegre has a reputation beyond repute"> teegre's Avatar

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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Two things:

    1) We had had two good series (Ben was 8-8 on one) and scored two TDs. We were driving a third time. We had a good first down... 2nd-&-5... and then there was one of those awful sideways throws that lost yardage. THAT playcall was what screwed that drive. Yes, we got 8 yards on third down (which would have been more than enough to convert... had we not lost 4 yards on second down).

    2) Why doesn’t Rudolph (or Dobbs) run the QB sneak? Really. I know that some will say that it telegraphs that it’s going to be a sneak. Kind of. Rudolph (and Dobbs) can actually throw a good pass; it’s not like it’s a WR pass. More importantly, who cares if everyone knows it’s a sneak!?! In most of those situations, the defense knows it’s a sneak; it works, because you don’t waste time with a handoff.

  5. #35
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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by teegre View Post
    Two things:

    1) We had had two good series (Ben was 8-8 on one) and scored two TDs. We were driving a third time. We had a good first down... 2nd-&-5... and then there was one of those awful sideways throws that lost yardage. THAT playcall was what screwed that drive. Yes, we got 8 yards on third down (which would have been more than enough to convert... had we not lost 4 yards on second down).

    2) Why doesn’t Rudolph (or Dobbs) run the QB sneak? Really. I know that some will say that it telegraphs that it’s going to be a sneak. Kind of. Rudolph (and Dobbs) can actually throw a good pass; it’s not like it’s a WR pass. More importantly, who cares if everyone knows it’s a sneak!?! In most of those situations, the defense knows it’s a sneak; it works, because you don’t waste time with a handoff.

    A picture is worth a thousand words. This is also the look Ben has when Randy is talking to him between series.



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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by W&M_Steeler View Post
    I was in the "No" camp for the same reason the people in the room were. The Steelers O has been historically bad in short yardage situations this year, the Defense had been hot and almost had a pick 6 on the prior drive, there was plenty of time, a quick 3 and out would have probably wound up with the ball back near mid-field anyway.

    The fact that Berry then blasted the ball into the endzone and the defense gave up a long TD drive doesn't mean punting was the wrong choice. Either option could have worked; or better yet, don't call two horseshit horizontal passing plays in a row that set your drive up to fail and result in a 4th down situation.

    I do think punting on the Browns 38 was indefensible though.
    Football 101. When you're down two scores and it's 4th and 1 later in the game near mid field, you go for it. There's only so many possessions left and you could not count on the defense doing much last night. You could count on the offense doing something. Bad call.

  7. #37
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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by Shoes View Post
    A picture is worth a thousand words. This is also the look Ben has when Randy is talking to him between series.


    FITCHNER: I’m thinking that we try a sideways pass to our smallest receiver... and hope that he gets 10 yards without any blocking.

    BEN: Shut up, Randy.

  8. #38
    Senior Member Array title="El-Gonzo Jackson has a reputation beyond repute"> El-Gonzo Jackson's Avatar

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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by Six Rings View Post
    Football 101. When you're down two scores and it's 4th and 1 later in the game near mid field, you go for it. There's only so many possessions left and you could not count on the defense doing much last night. You could count on the offense doing something. Bad call.
    Wrong.

    There was 15:00 left in the game. The Steelers just held the Browns to 2 successive 3 and out series. Taking 1:00 and 1:27 for those failed drives. The previous drive was a 7 play 3:53 drive that resulted in a Browns punt. Lots of time to get 2 stops and score 2 TD (one on a short field) and erase the 12 point lead at the time.

    Everybody likes to say "the offense had momentum", but reality was the Defense had 3 successive stops of the Browns offense. Strategically, Tomlin made the right call. As a coach, you cant panic when there is still 15:00 to play.

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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson View Post
    Wrong.

    There was 15:00 left in the game. The Steelers just held the Browns to 2 successive 3 and out series. Taking 1:00 and 1:27 for those failed drives. The previous drive was a 7 play 3:53 drive that resulted in a Browns punt. Lots of time to get 2 stops and score 2 TD (one on a short field) and erase the 12 point lead at the time.

    Everybody likes to say "the offense had momentum", but reality was the Defense had 3 successive stops of the Browns offense. Strategically, Tomlin made the right call. As a coach, you cant panic when there is still 15:00 to play.
    I agree. I think it was a tough call, and I don't fault Tomlin for punting given the game situation and how terrible the offense has been all year on short yardage. The fact that Berry and the Defense proceeded to shit the bed makes punting look like a worse decision than it did at the time.

  10. #40
    Senior Member Array title="El-Gonzo Jackson has a reputation beyond repute"> El-Gonzo Jackson's Avatar

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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by W&M_Steeler View Post
    I agree. I think it was a tough call, and I don't fault Tomlin for punting given the game situation and how terrible the offense has been all year on short yardage. The fact that Berry and the Defense proceeded to shit the bed makes punting look like a worse decision than it did at the time.
    Honestly, at the time I thought ...Do you go for it? But then I thought of what I would do on the sidelines as a coach with 15:00 left, a defense that has forced 2 straight 3 and outs and an offense that has shown no real ability to control the LOS in short yardage.

    The answer was easy....dont panic, lots of time, punt the ball to pin them deep and play the field position game to get it to a 5 point deficit with 10:00 left on the clock.

  11. #41
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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson View Post
    Honestly, at the time I thought ...Do you go for it? But then I thought of what I would do on the sidelines as a coach with 15:00 left, a defense that has forced 2 straight 3 and outs and an offense that has shown no real ability to control the LOS in short yardage.

    The answer was easy....dont panic, lots of time, punt the ball to pin them deep and play the field position game to get it to a 5 point deficit with 10:00 left on the clock.
    Same here. I wanted them to punt at the time.

  12. #42
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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Yes. Agree 100%.

    I probably would’ve gone for it myself, but totally understand how and why the decision was made. Everyone wants to point to that decision as Tomlin being “out coached” but in reality, the decision was a good one and if he did make the decision to go for it and they didn’t convert, people would be up his ass about that...

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwinsgames View Post
    you are a Kenny Pickett enabler

  13. #43
    Senior Member Array title="El-Gonzo Jackson has a reputation beyond repute"> El-Gonzo Jackson's Avatar

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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by 86WARD View Post
    Yes. Agree 100%.

    I probably would’ve gone for it myself, but totally understand how and why the decision was made. Everyone wants to point to that decision as Tomlin being “out coached” but in reality, the decision was a good one and if he did make the decision to go for it and they didn’t convert, people would be up his ass about that...
    If you tell me that Mularkey, Whiz, Haley is the OC and they have a good 4th and 1 play on the call sheet, based upon what the Browns have been doing for 3 quarters, then maybe I think of being aggressive on Offense. But Fichtner is the worst Steeler OC, since Ray Sherman and I would put my trust in the defense to get a stop instead.

  14. #44
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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson View Post
    If you tell me that Mularkey, Whiz, Haley is the OC and they have a good 4th and 1 play on the call sheet, based upon what the Browns have been doing for 3 quarters, then maybe I think of being aggressive on Offense. But Fichtner is the worst Steeler OC, since Ray Sherman and I would put my trust in the defense to get a stop instead.
    Haha, great point

  15. #45
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    Re: 4th-&-1

    If they had Dobbs active, it's a QB sneak for a 1st.

  16. #46
    NFL's Dirtiest Player Array title="86WARD has a reputation beyond repute"> 86WARD's Avatar

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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson View Post
    If you tell me that Mularkey, Whiz, Haley is the OC and they have a good 4th and 1 play on the call sheet, based upon what the Browns have been doing for 3 quarters, then maybe I think of being aggressive on Offense. But Fichtner is the worst Steeler OC, since Ray Sherman and I would put my trust in the defense to get a stop instead.
    Agree. They were shitty all season in short yardage situations. Fichtner has no idea what to do with that play. If they went for it, it probably would’ve been Watt up the middle...seemed to be the new wrinkle/innovation for the week.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwinsgames View Post
    you are a Kenny Pickett enabler

  17. #47
    Senior Member Array title="teegre has a reputation beyond repute"> teegre's Avatar

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    Re: 4th-&-1

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    If they had Dobbs active, it's a QB sneak for a 1st.
    Bingo!!! I said the same thing!!!

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