its rebuild /retool time

[dislocatedday]

I think you keep Decastro, and draft a lot of OL. Would like to keep Dupree, but will take Hilton of the two if I had to choose between them to sign.

Yes, Decastro is the one I am iffy on as I think he has been playing hurt this year and he is not super old yet, but if the team really needs to get some extra money he would be a candidate for release.

My thinking is that they can keep a couple young guys such as JuJu who is only 24 (assuming he would take a deal somewhere around 4 years for 40-45 million) and either Dupree or Hilton/Sutton, and still have some money to spend elsewhere. Connor may even come back on a relatively inexpensive deal. I do not think he will "break the bank" somewhere else.

Obviously TJ is going to get a massive deal, but he is already on the books for approximately $10.5 million next year and they could sign him to a massive extension that does not really increase that amount next year.

[pczach]

And people wonder why Bradshaw flipped this fanbase the bird for a good two+ decades after he retired...

It's pretty sad the way fans send players off after all the victories. I mean, Bradshaw and Ben played in 7 Super Bowls between them and won 6, but you have to listen to assholes saying "fuck him" over and over again in the gameday thread, or saying they've sucked for 10 years....These people are clowns. They don't deserve to root for winners. They deserve to be fans of teams that don't go to the playoffs for nearly two decades.

It's really, really sad.

[DesertSteel]

And people wonder why Bradshaw flipped this fanbase the bird for a good two+ decades after he retired...

Ultimately who cares?

[fansince'76]

Ultimately who cares?

Plenty of people seemed to when he was doing it...

[Shoes]

Ultimately who cares?

Exactly, the fans get pissed, the players walk away with millions and flip off the fans after every game....in private.

[dislocatedday]

It's pretty sad the way fans send players off after all the victories. I mean, Bradshaw and Ben played in 7 Super Bowls between them and won 6, but you have to listen to assholes saying "fuck him" over and over again in the gameday thread, or saying they've sucked for 10 years....These people are clowns. They don't deserve to root for winners. They deserve to be fans of teams that don't go to the playoffs for nearly two decades.

It's really, really sad.

I don't think I've personally ever reacted that way and referred to Ben in such a derogatory manner on these boards, but I do think it is time for him to retire. This team has other issues obviously, but I really don't think the Steelers can count on Ben going forward. I appreciate all he has done for this franchise, as we have been lucky as fans to not have to worry about the QB position for 17 years now.

What are you thoughts on Ben playing after this year?

[Edman]

It's pretty sad the way fans send players off after all the victories. I mean, Bradshaw and Ben played in 7 Super Bowls between them and won 6, but you have to listen to assholes saying "fuck him" over and over again in the gameday thread, or saying they've sucked for 10 years....These people are clowns. They don't deserve to root for winners. They deserve to be fans of teams that don't go to the playoffs for nearly two decades.

It's really, really sad.

Then you realize they are professionals who have been granted the privilege to live dreams few even have access to and go home to big bank accounts and tv contracts and you don't really feel all that sad anymore.

[DesertSteel]

Plenty of people seemed to when he was doing it...

Troy was pissed too but his time was up. Ben's time is up. You can't make business decisions from emotion.

[Mojouw]

If the team cuts or encourages to retire Ben, Pouncey, Haden, and McDonald -- that is +$17 million in cap space. Meaning (based on https://overthecap.com/calculator/pittsburgh-steelers/) they go from -$21 million to +$17 million with just those 4 changes.

Take Haden out of it and it is +$10 million in cap.

I have no idea if those moves are good or bad ideas. Just jumping off Desert Steel's idea that there are some serious business decisions to be made between now and the start of the league year in March.

[Mojouw]

Also, I am the last guy to every advocate for firing people. But, at this point, three questions need answered:

1. Is the prioritization of pass blocking over run blocking a decision by Fichtner or to cater the offense to Ben R?
2. Is the lack of RPO and play action a decision by Fichtner or to cater the offense to Ben R?
3. Is the short passing game a decision by Fichtner or to insulate a diminished Ben R from throws he can not reliably make anymore?

Depending on how those questions are answered, the path forward on offense gets some clarity.

Honestly, no matter what, I think Fichtner needs to go. I think he was a good coach for Ben in his prime. Ben is no longer in his prime, so he needs a coach who can cover that up if Ben plays in 2021+. If Ben doesn't play, turn the thing over to Canada (that is why they brought him - regardless of what they said in public) and see what you can do.

[Fire Goodell]

Rudolph looked better than Ben lately

[Shoes]

Also, I am the last guy to every advocate for firing people. But, at this point, three questions need answered:

1. Is the prioritization of pass blocking over run blocking a decision by Fichtner or to cater the offense to Ben R?
2. Is the lack of RPO and play action a decision by Fichtner or to cater the offense to Ben R?
3. Is the short passing game a decision by Fichtner or to insulate a diminished Ben R from throws he can not reliably make anymore?

Depending on how those questions are answered, the path forward on offense gets some clarity.

Honestly, no matter what, I think Fichtner needs to go. I think he was a good coach for Ben in his prime. Ben is no longer in his prime, so he needs a coach who can cover that up if Ben plays in 2021+. If Ben doesn't play, turn the thing over to Canada (that is why they brought him - regardless of what they said in public) and see what you can do.

I don't think Ben listens so much to Fichtner. I don't know how many times I've seen Fichtner blabbing away and Ben is gazing out at the horizon with a blank look on his face. I agree that Fichtner needs to go, but I think Ben will return. If that is the case I hope its to prep a new QB. As others have said here he isn't going to win another SB. The hour glass is about empty.

[Mojouw]

Rudolph looked better than Ben lately

And they basically don't run the same offense when Rudolph plays. The Steelers have 2 offenses - the Roethlisberger offense and the Not-Roethlisberger offense. Determining the reasons and who decides what between those two would provide a great deal of insight into why we saw some of the things we saw in 2020.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't think Ben listens so much Fichtner. I don't know how many times I've seen Fichtner blabbing away and Ben is gazing out at the horizon with a blank look on his face. I agree that Fichtner needs to go, but I think Ben will return. If that is the case I hope its to prep a new QB. As others have said here he isn't going to win another SB. The hour glass is about empty.

I mean he could, Jimmy G almost won one. But I agree with your line of thinking.

I won't be upset with much of anything as long as the Steelers don't try and just run out the closest version to 2020 they can in 2021. If Ben comes back, the system needs a revamp. If it is not Ben, a new system needs installed that caters to whoever that is.

[Shoes]

And they basically don't run the same offense when Rudolph plays. The Steelers have 2 offenses - the Roethlisberger offense and the Not-Roethlisberger offense. Determining the reasons and who decides what between those two would provide a great deal of insight into why we saw some of the things we saw in 2020.

- - - Updated - - -



I mean he could, Jimmy G almost won one. But I agree with your line of thinking.

I won't be upset with much of anything as long as the Steelers don't try and just run out the closest version to 2020 they can in 2021. If Ben comes back, the system needs a revamp. If it is not Ben, a new system needs installed that caters to whoever that is.

Jimmy G could at least move. You can play if you're old, not so mobile, but accurate. If you're old, not so accurate and not mobile, that is strike three.

[Fire Goodell]

I think we gotta go back to basics. Draft a RB and some maulers in the OL. Bring that toughness back to Pittsburgh that's been lacking for a long time.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Troy was pissed too but his time was up. Ben's time is up. You can't make business decisions from emotion.

Truth.

Steelers arent winning a SB with Ben at QB any more and his $20million + contract (or dead cap) just keeps the team from keeping young talent on the roster. Time for Ben to retire or the Steelers to release him and start re tooling around the young core of talent they have.

Some of you are gonna learn what it was like to be excited that a guy like Mark Malone, Bubby Brister or Tommy Maddox got the Steelers to the playoffs.

[Steeldude]

It's all ok. The Steelers are learning some new dance steps. That's all that matters.

[pczach]

I don't think I've personally ever reacted that way and referred to Ben in such a derogatory manner on these boards, but I do think it is time for him to retire. This team has other issues obviously, but I really don't think the Steelers can count on Ben going forward. I appreciate all he has done for this franchise, as we have been lucky as fans to not have to worry about the QB position for 17 years now.

What are you thoughts on Ben playing after this year?

I'm fine with moving on from Ben. I just defend him when people are screaming at him because they don't realize others are responsible for some mistakes that he gets blamed for.

The OL needs to be retooled.

The offensive scheme needs to be scrapped or highly modified.

Fichtner needs to go.

Some established players need to be let go.

[86WARD]

It's pretty sad the way fans send players off after all the victories. I mean, Bradshaw and Ben played in 7 Super Bowls between them and won 6, but you have to listen to assholes saying "fuck him" over and over again in the gameday thread, or saying they've sucked for 10 years....These people are clowns. They don't deserve to root for winners. They deserve to be fans of teams that don't go to the playoffs for nearly two decades.

It's really, really sad.

Well said.

[86WARD]

If the team cuts or encourages to retire Ben, Pouncey, Haden, and McDonald -- that is +$17 million in cap space. Meaning (based on https://overthecap.com/calculator/pittsburgh-steelers/) they go from -$21 million to +$17 million with just those 4 changes.

Take Haden out of it and it is +$10 million in cap.

I have no idea if those moves are good or bad ideas. Just jumping off Desert Steel's idea that there are some serious business decisions to be made between now and the start of the league year in March.

I keep seeing people wanting to cut/not re-sign Many players. At some point, you are going to have to field a roster. Are people looking to put together a competitive roster or just a full roster?

[86WARD]

Also, I am the last guy to every advocate for firing people. But, at this point, three questions need answered:

1. Is the prioritization of pass blocking over run blocking a decision by Fichtner or to cater the offense to Ben R?
2. Is the lack of RPO and play action a decision by Fichtner or to cater the offense to Ben R?
3. Is the short passing game a decision by Fichtner or to insulate a diminished Ben R from throws he can not reliably make anymore?

Depending on how those questions are answered, the path forward on offense gets some clarity.

Honestly, no matter what, I think Fichtner needs to go. I think he was a good coach for Ben in his prime. Ben is no longer in his prime, so he needs a coach who can cover that up if Ben plays in 2021+. If Ben doesn't play, turn the thing over to Canada (that is why they brought him - regardless of what they said in public) and see what you can do.

Ben doesn’t like to do play action. That’s on him.

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

I'm fine with moving on from Ben. I just defend him when people are screaming at him because they don't realize others are responsible for some mistakes that he gets blamed for.

The OL needs to be retooled.

The offensive scheme needs to be scrapped or highly modified.

Fichtner needs to go.

Some established players need to be let go.

We probably made the playoffs last year if not for Fichtner babying the QB's. He has to go and Ben as well and you can't be a NFL QB worried to be hit constantly! Pouncey got to go as well an man did he kept screwing us all game. Take his Pro Bowl arse to another team.

[fansince'76]

Some of you are gonna learn what it was like to be excited that a guy like Mark Malone, Bubby Brister or Tommy Maddox got the Steelers to the playoffs.

More like they're going to learn to temper their expectations greatly when they find out that franchise QBs don't grow on trees...

[Six Rings]

JuJu is really the only receiver that consistently catches the ball.

I'd say Washington and Claypool are reliable.

[teegre]

As dislocatedday said:

Cut ties with Ben, Pouncey, Haden, Ebron, McDonald.

DeCastro was playing through injury; so, he gets a pass.

I keep JuJu. He is the only receiver who can get open consistently, catches the ball consistently, fights for extra yardage, and doesn’t run backwards.

[DesertSteel]

Ray got the report card right.

https://www.post-gazette.com/sports/...s/202101100188

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

As dislocatedday said:

Cut ties with Ben, Pouncey, Haden, Ebron, McDonald.

DeCastro was playing through injury; so, he gets a pass.

I keep JuJu. He is the only receiver who can get open consistently, catches the ball consistently, fights for extra yardage, and doesn’t run backwards.

I will argue Washington does the same. Ben gets the ball out so quick and why Washington is the lost man.

[teegre]

I will argue Washington does the same. Ben gets the ball out so quick and why Washington is the lost man.

Washington needs more time to get open?

Please, clarify.

[DesertSteel]

More like they're going to learn to temper their expectations greatly when they find out that franchise QBs don't grow on trees...

So to use a Tomlinism, we should just live in our fears and just watch Ben turn into Willie Mays at the end of his career. Because we might end up worse? That mentality has nothing to do with being a fan. The organization has been nothing but good to Ben from day 1, even when his off field behavior embarrassed the Rooney’s. It’s now time to move forward. And the truth is that the Steelers won as many games in the 8-10 years before Ben’s arrival as they have the last 8-10 years of Ben’s career.

[fansince'76]

So to use a Tomlinism, we should just live in our fears and just watch Ben turn into Willie Mays at the end of his career. Because we might end up worse? That mentality has nothing to do with being a fan. The organization has been nothing but good to Ben from day 1, even when his off field behavior embarrassed the Rooney’s. It’s now time to move forward. And the truth is that the Steelers won as many games in the 8-10 years before Ben’s arrival as they have the last 8-10 years of Ben’s career.

Not at all. I think it's time for Ben to retire. But I think people need to realize that we have a much greater chance, historically speaking, of winding up with someone like Trubisky than we do with Mahomes, that's all.

I caught some of that Saints/Bears game. Ugly. Talk about a great defense being squandered - it was like watching the mid-90s Steelers all over again. The homecooked officiating to ensure another Brady/Brees matchup didn't make it any better either.