Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
The future QB for the Steelers for the playoffs and next season is Ben R Rockstar. Make no mistake, this is his team until he leaves it. Drafting a better backup/emergency QB is A GOOD IDEA, but it will not yield immediate results. Those looking for an instant upgrade to this offense merely needs to want WRs to catch the balls consistently put into their hands. It's not flashy but it keeps the chains moving and puts points on the board.
How Ben looks in the postseason is going to decide his future with the team. If he plays like shit, the front office will have to start seriously looking for a long term replacement ASAP. Though his cap hit is front-loaded, so it's likely that he will still be the starter next year (19M I believe? Which is really a low cap hit for a starting QB)
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We only really need OL, so I am all for trading the entire draft for Watson, he is like a mini Mahomes with no talent around him. We would really only need to replace our C, and a tackle, but we could even keep AV because Watson is mobile enough to make up for an average OL.
If Bill O'Brien was still their GM they probably would trade him for Mason Rudolph straight up.
I agree, If Ben reverts back to the inaccurate, tired-armed QB of the last several weeks the FO has no choice but to begin the search for a replacement. There are 2 options, draft a QB ( trading up is always an option) in the '21 draft and allow the future QB to sit and learn behind Ben. Option 2 is to address other areas of need (OL and RB) then wait Until '22 to draft a QB and let him get pointers for Rudolph and Dobbs. It's 100% worth it IMO to trade up into the Top 10 and get a guy that is truly desired and let him soak up knowledge from Ben.Originally Posted by Fire Goodell
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First....understand mechanics. Ben was throwing with one leg under him. Those downfield throws are going to be inaccurate more often than not without both feet/legs involved. The question is whether or not Ben was worse than his backups WITH the knee injury.
Second....Ben is the QB until this contract runs out or he retires. Bringing in another QB right now is pointless to this season. It does NOTHING to improve the team now.
Third....IF the WRs could simply catch the passes thrown into their hands, and THEN try to make a play upfield, Ben is throwing at about an 80% completion rate and keeps moving the chains. That by itself puts more points, and therefore wins, on the board.
To look at a season and point to one player and say this is why we lost the #1 seed is beyond silly. Just plain not smart. To think Ben goes from comeback player of the year to not even worthy of leading this offense because of TEAM losses is moronic. MORONIC. But people have to find a reason(scapegoat) for anything that doesn't give them instant gratification. This 'let's jump on the rookie QB carousel and hope we get the next franchise guy immediately OR everybody gets fired for not drafting right' thinking is beyond what I'm really willing to say on here yet. But.. have fun 'cause that's how most of you think.
How would drafting a QB the year before Ben retires be pointless? When Ben was drafted he sat on the bench and waited. The idea that Ben will suddenly discover the fountain of youth and plays another 3 seasons is simply wishful thinking. I'm not aware of anyone who has knowledge of this team who believes Ben alone shoulders the blame for the late season hiccup thats impacted the Steelers. I would rather draft a QB (assuming the Steelers find him) and not wait until they absolutely have to find one than pick up a guy that another team gives away. The fact is the Steelers need to get younger at the QB position and its really an issue that cannot be ignored
I’ll withhold judgement of Rudy til this weekends game...
I’d honestly rather see Duck in this iteration of the offense.
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Array title="DesertSteel has a reputation beyond repute">
For 2+ games.
Fields is looking great tonight.
When Fields is good, he’s really, reeeally good. My problem with him is that when he is pressured, he looks awful. A QB won’t last long in the NFL playing scared.
Currently, I’m loving Desmond Ridder. I watched him today, and WOW!!! what an arm!!!
I thought Ridder was going to get that one first and end the game. I still won money on them. Mac Jones is interesting and may be there when we pick. Ridder might be there too!
Exactly my point, you never know when your number will be called
Fields throws a awesome deep ball!
My problem with Fields is that he seems to get banged up A LOT and it's likely due to his run style. I have doubts he will hold up in the NFL
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Maybe possibly trading up for Lance, maybe taking a look at Mac Jones, Trask shouldn't be outright dismissed but his stock took a hit. Other than that, 2022 draft class may be better
I think he meant that Ben just missed the "elite" QB club because Brees, Rodgers, Rivers, Manning and the like all have so much more career playoff success and so many more SB rings than he does.
Ben's passing was off prior to the Cowboys game as well. So either he comes with pre-injured knees or he is 38 and he isn't what he once was. He played basically 25 minutes of football in 2020 where he looked like he didn't mind getting hit to make plays. He played 25 minutes of football where he used his legs to consistently throw the ball. The rest of the year he rarely stepped into throws, was scattershot in his accuracy over 8-10 yards, and was often late and behind WRs in the short areas.
From what I have read, many believe that the late passes and the fact that the ball either sails over WRs heads or tails off is a guy that is just heaving everything with mostly his arm and not using proper fully body mechanics. Also, during the 3 game stretch of losses, Ben's reads were even crappy.
I am overjoyed that he looked better in the second half against the Colts. And I am hopeful that he can put together a playoff run. Maybe even a magical one. But I still stand by the reality that he is far more done as a QB than not done. If it was my team (and there was not internal knowledge about injury or something else that isn't out there in public) I would be looking for how to gracefully ease him out the door.If not in 2021, then definitely in 2022.
Now, he plays like he did in the last quarter and a half against the Colts in 2 playoff games? Then I will (maybe) buy into the knee injury idea and that he still has a full season in him of above average or better play in 2021+
Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
Does this put you on the move on to Rudolph ‘plane’, bring in one of those guys off the FA list ‘train’, or in the start drafting the next golden boy ‘automobile’.
IF the plan is to ‘ease’ Ben out, one of these becomes the new plan. And a commitment to all is a commitment to none and is of no use to anyone. So what really is the better move?
Not sure what you are driving at...Ben plays out this season for better or for worse. Then you have a QB depth chart of Rudolph/Dobbs/Hodges/And Best Player You Can find. Whether it is a draft pick or a FA or a Trade Target. Then you have an open competition through the off-season and hope you find your successor. Rinse and repeat until you find someone who doesn't suck.
Not sure what is so complicated or controversial about that. It is the way almost every NFL team transitions from a decade+ "Franchise QB" to whoever is next. The other path is to purge the roster, tear it all down, and accumulate assets for a total rebuild starting in 2022-23. And I don't think this team is that far away from their next window of contention to go down that path.
If it wasn't for the dire cap situation the NFL is forcing on everyone in 2021, this wouldn't be as big of a deal. There would be more avenues for squeezing cap space out of the roster and they would almost certainly be in the running for "insert vet QB starter here". But they likely won't want to gut the depth chart more than they already are going to have to. So I guess draft pick?
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As an AAC football guy, I have watched Ridder for a few seasons. Big arm and good mobility. This year Josh Allen/Carson Wentz. ???
My view, my Memphis Tigers defense has never had a problem containing him outside of this season. But that was mostly the Cincy defense honestly.
Ridder is worth taking a long look at but I haven’t seen anything special from him. Maybe the light came on for him this season.
Array title="DesertSteel has a reputation beyond repute">
I’d have my eye on Oklahoma QB Rattler when he is eligible. He reminds me of Mahomes.
Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
What I am driving at is simple. Of every scenario you have mentioned Ben is still the better option for this season and next.
In 2020 Ben has a better completion% than his career average, but you(posters) say he's been badly inaccurate. He's averaging 1 yard shorter per pass attempt than his career average, yet you(posters) claim he's become a Charlie Checkdown. His QBR is higher than his career average. Where is all this "Ben's done" talk coming from? YES, the Steelers will need to get their next QB soon, Ben is 38 after all and unless we see something new, MR is not the answer. But there is no reason for some mad scramble to "ease Ben out the door" and start throwing darts at failed FAs and untested rookies.
Ben's passes dropped% is 6.4%, compared to 2018's 3.6%(WRs dropping balls in their hands). Ben has had 17 passes batted down at the LOS or behind this season, 0 in 2018(OL play). Ben's time in the pocket prior to a pass this season is at 2.1secs. It was 2.2secs in 2018, yet he has been hit 44 times this season compared to 37 times in 2018(again OL play).
What tends to make things complicated and controversial is Ben has a year left on his current contract and should be back next year, regardless how fans feel about it. Besides, you've seen the list of 2021 QB FAs. There is a very real need for a youth movement/upgrade on the OL already. AV, Feiler, and Banner are FAs I think. IF Conner and/or JuJu leave via FA a draft pick will most likely go to one or both of those positions as well. There is 2-3 2021 picks already. Adding another QB doesn't help the immediate situation in any way at all.
You can trot out all the stats you want. But I know you watched the games. And that showed a QB that wasn't getting it done. Defenses were scoffing at the intermediate and deep passing game. Notice how EVERYTHING on offense worked once Ben hit a few deep balls and forced the Colts safeties and LBs way the hell off?
Every wonder why the drop % skyrocketed? Go back and watch even the highlights of 2020 passes. They are frequently late and behind. Forcing a running receiver to reach low and behind to try and get it. Now combine that with needing 8 yards and getting the ball at 2 yards. Maybe you are gonna try and cheat a bit and get a head start on avoiding the DB that was totally squatting on your route because your QB hadn't completed a pass over 10 yards in a month?
https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/...E750381/season
Those are not pretty pictures for the most part. Ben Roethlisberger is an average NFL QB at this point in his career. Average NFL QBs do not win SBs. If that is the goal, it is time to move on.
The yards per completion stat is down with Alex Smith, Phillip Rivers, Andy Dalton, and other noted checkdown artists. Averaging under 5 yards per attempt is not good for an NFL QB. No liked it when he did in 2018 and why should it be a great idea now?
https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/stats/p...ards-to-sticks and he is throwing over a yard short of the sticks and hoping his guys can make a play.
This is a HOF QB playing out the string. Unless, as I said elsewhere, there is some "mystery factor" that changes his play over a playoff game or two...I don't think he is worthy of being a 40 million dollar starting QB. So have a retirement ceremony, take your cap medicine, and move on.
Now, he plays like he did against the Colts for the last quarter and half over a playoff run? Then I will change my mind.
That is cause he tries to look like him with his hair and acts like him when they score.
Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
MojoUW, THAT is exactly the offensive gameplan. Get the ball out quickly to the playmakers and let them make plays with the ball. Keep the chains moving. When guys drop the ball in their hands at a rate of 6.4% that creates more 3 and outs than it should.
The WR gets the separation, Ben gets the ball out quickly and on target at a 76.4% rate, but the WR tries to make a play before he has caught the ball and drops the catch at a 6.4% rate. That's not on Ben or coaching or play calling, most of the time. That is on the WR.
I have seen Ben throw the ball, especially to Ebron for some reason, and the ball arrives at the mid-shin level. IMO, that is on Ben. But that has not been the vast majority of the offense's problems and inability to consistently move the chains. IF the receiver would simply catch the ball and fall down right then and there the Steelers rarely see a 3rd down and the offense keeps moving the chains.
You see Ben as the problem, I do not. That seems to be an impasse in this discussion.
This is a case of Agree to Disagree.
The way I look at it is , when I see the tires balding on my Daily driver I start shopping for new tires. The other option is to chance it and hope your existing tires make it through another few months or so. Maybe you save a few bucks and the tires do just fine or maybe one of them blows out while your driving. Point is why wait until the Steelers absolutely have to replace Ben because he cannot go on. We see the writing on the wall and its not telling us anything Positive.
The offense is designed that way by the fact that they ran out of options. Originally it was to cover up for Bens deteriorating elbow and post surgery it is to cover up for a poor line and a declining QB who can’t get hit.
Watch the throws. Look where they arrive versus where the WR is going and where the DB is. It’s been pretty poor. Watch the deep balls that are way off target for an NFL QB. watch how his lower body never moves on throws anymore.
I think it was awesome how Ben came back and was willing to do anything to win. I truly believe he’s trying to win a SB for his teammates. I also believe he looks washed.
Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute">
They say stats can be made to show anything you want them to show. Here are Ben's stats. Go game by game, go year by year, whatever. Make them say that Ben has lost what you say he has lost. There really is 17 years worth of Ben on here.
https://www.pro-football-reference.c...R/RoetBe00.htm
But you want me to go with YOUR eye test vs MY eye test instead? Like I posted last, impasse. I yield.
Find a stat 2020 Ben ranks top 5 in. Top 10? I can find one. He is #6 in TDs. He’s average or worse in the other stats. Based on 17 years, that’s a drop-off.
Did you feel like you were watching high level QB play in Rivers last week? I didn’t. But the season stats say the two are similar or Rivers slightly ahead.
A replacement needs to be found ASAP, assuming they’re not sold on Rudolph as the future. None of the free agents any better than Ben at 80%, nor is anyone on Steelers roster. Id say Ben is 80 % of what he was in prime. If he had prime mobility back he could carry team, but D doesn’t have to factor for scrambling or our running game. Its like every play is 3rd and 8. I doubt the top 5 qbs in draft available for us but a guy like Mond or Ridder could be a good gamble. They need to be proactive especially if Ben doesn’t step it up in postseason. No sense paying a guy 30 mill for sentimental reasons when they cant get you over the hump.
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