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Thread: Coaching Carousel 2020

  1. #31
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    Re: Coaching Carousel 2020

    I just don’t get the McCarthy hype...the Steelers fans saying that the Steelers should’ve fired Tomlin and hired McCarthy...lol. Drives me up the wall...

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwinsgames View Post
    you are a Kenny Pickett enabler

  2. #32
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    Re: Coaching Carousel 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by tom444 View Post
    It's a bit early to take that position isn't it?
    Judge may turn out to be John Harbaugh and any HC hire is a roll of the dice.

    But with regard to the process they screwed up since they still were planning to bring Ruhle and McDaniels in for interviews and ended up with Judge

    The Giants, who joined the N.F.L. in 1925, have become known for a staid, prudent management style. True to form, on Tuesday morning, the team was expected to do something predictable: Hire Matt Rhule, the former Giants assistant coach who has become a rising star after rebuilding downtrodden college football programs at Temple and Baylor....

    Judge’s hiring startled the pro football community, because the Giants had scheduled an interview with Josh McDaniels...

    McCarthy, who won a Super Bowl with the Packers, seemed a good fit for the Giants, but he was lured away over the weekend by Dallas Cowboys owner Jerry Jones. On Tuesday when Rhule accepted a gargantuan deal from Carolina reportedly worth $60 million over seven years, it appeared that the Giants had been outfoxed in a race for the two most recognizable candidates.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/07/s...ge-giants.html

    When you are a legendary franchise such as the Giants and have put yourself in the position of being afraid to lose your hire to Mississippi State after you did not even get to interview your primary candidate, your hiring process has been something less than optimal.

    After Baylor’s Matt Rhule accepted the Panthers job, the Giants had a decision to make. Mississippi State was pursuing Judge, and there was an emotional attachment there, because Judge and his wife are both alums. So Judge needed clarity on where the Giants stood so he could make a decision on whether or not to return to his alma mater.

    https://www.si.com/nfl/2020/01/07/jo...nts-head-coach

  3. #33
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    Re: Coaching Carousel 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    Judge may turn out to be John Harbaugh and any HC hire is a roll of the dice.

    But with regard to the process they screwed up since they still were planning to bring Ruhle and McDaniels in for interviews and ended up with Judge

    The Giants, who joined the N.F.L. in 1925, have become known for a staid, prudent management style. True to form, on Tuesday morning, the team was expected to do something predictable: Hire Matt Rhule, the former Giants assistant coach who has become a rising star after rebuilding downtrodden college football programs at Temple and Baylor....

    Judge’s hiring startled the pro football community, because the Giants had scheduled an interview with Josh McDaniels...

    McCarthy, who won a Super Bowl with the Packers, seemed a good fit for the Giants, but he was lured away over the weekend by Dallas Cowboys owner Jerry Jones. On Tuesday when Rhule accepted a gargantuan deal from Carolina reportedly worth $60 million over seven years, it appeared that the Giants had been outfoxed in a race for the two most recognizable candidates.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/07/s...ge-giants.html

    When you are a legendary franchise such as the Giants and have put yourself in the position of being afraid to lose your hire to Mississippi State after you did not even get to interview your primary candidate, your hiring process has been something less than optimal.

    After Baylor’s Matt Rhule accepted the Panthers job, the Giants had a decision to make. Mississippi State was pursuing Judge, and there was an emotional attachment there, because Judge and his wife are both alums. So Judge needed clarity on where the Giants stood so he could make a decision on whether or not to return to his alma mater.

    https://www.si.com/nfl/2020/01/07/jo...nts-head-coach
    Looks to me like they wanted Judge:

    Joe Judge, Who? Why the Giants Took a Risk on This Dark-Horse Candidate

    There’s a good chance that many people were Googling the name of the new Giants’ head coach today. From our perspective, here’s why the franchise felt comfortable hiring Judge.

    Albert Breer15 hours ago
    The casual Giants fan probably hasn’t heard much about Joe Judge before he was hired as the team’s head coach. So here’s what you need to know about the franchise’s big swing at a dark-horse hire.
    • Judge’s strength is in his command; he has the ability to lead and be the one at the front of the room. And if you don’t believe me, you can trust Bill Belichick on that. His actions over the last five years demonstrate how he feels on Judge.
    • In 2015, Belichick elevated Judge to special teams coordinator—the first time he’d entrusted that area, one he sees as vital, to a young guy during his time in New England. Belichick inherited Brad Seely, who had a decade of prior experience as an NFL special teams coordinator, when he got to New England in 2000. When he lost Seely after 2008, Belichick replaced him with Scotty O’Brien, who’d been his special teams coach in Cleveland.


    • Belichick added receivers coach to Judge’s responsibilities in 2019 as a clear effort to help get him in the head-coaching conversation, similar to what Andy Reid did for John Harbaugh 12 years earlier. Before the 2007 season, Reid made Harbaugh, his special teams coordinator for eight years, his defensive backs coach. That caused other teams to view Harbaugh differently, and he got the Baltimore job the next year. It’s easy to look at it now and see how this one played out similarly, and it’s a sign of the belief Belichick had that Judge was ready for his shot.
    • This all seemed to happen fast, right? That’s because it had to. After Baylor’s Matt Rhule accepted the Panthers job, the Giants had a decision to make. Mississippi State was pursuing Judge, and there was an emotional attachment there, because Judge and his wife are both alums. So Judge needed clarity on where the Giants stood so he could make a decision on whether or not to return to his alma mater. Ultimately, Judge became the clear choice with Rhule out of the picture, and the Giants moved fast.
    Those that know Judge aren’t stunned that he interviewed well on Monday, just hours before all this went down. His presence is his strength, and it was obvious that would show up in an interview setting.
    • Are his coordinator hires important? Definitively, yes. But you can say the same about most new head coaches. Two of the guys still alive in the playoffs, Tennessee’s Mike Vrabel and Green Bay’s Matt LaFleur, only called plays for one year before becoming head coaches. Another, Kansas City’s Andy Reid, was never a coordinator before getting his first head-coaching shot. Both coaches in the college football national championship, LSU’s Ed Orgeron and Clemson’s Dabo Swinney, were just position coaches before becoming head coaches. Bottom line, play-calling is a very small part of being a head coach, and there’s very little correlation between a candidate’s play-calling ability and making a strong hire.
    • Finally, Judge’s disposition lines up with GM Dave Gettleman’s history with coaches, and the Giants’ history with coaches. In Carolina, Gettleman won with Ron Rivera—a front-of-the-room leader more than a schemer—and Rivera delegated the defensive strategy to Sean McDermott during his first six years in Carolina. Before that, Gettleman worked with Tom Coughlin in New York—Coughlin was the Giants’ wide receivers coach before getting head coaching jobs at Boston College, then the Jaguars and the Giants.
    The Giants’ other home-run hire at that position over the last half-century was Bill Parcells, who had only been a coordinator for two seasons before being promoted to head coach. Also, he delegated a lot of the defensive responsibility during his eight years in charge there to … Belichick. So it’s not hard to see why Judge was walking into a place that would be very open to his candidacy as a non-obvious choice.
    This all, of course, guarantees nothing. But it should illustrate why the Giants felt comfortable giving him a chance. And why the fit there is better than you might think.


    Question or comment? Email us at talkback@themmqb.com.
    https://www.si.com/nfl/2020/01/07/jo...nts-head-coach

  4. #34
    Senior Member Array title="AtlantaDan has a reputation beyond repute"> AtlantaDan's Avatar

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    Re: Coaching Carousel 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by tom444 View Post
    Looks to me like they wanted Judge:

    https://www.si.com/nfl/2020/01/07/jo...nts-head-coach
    Make a decision you were forced into then dispatch the spin patrol. Or do you expect an organization to say we missed on who we wanted but will try to make the best of it?

    If they wanted Judge why not lock both sides down Monday night with a signed term sheet and tell Ruhle we have our guy so do not bother flying to New York for the interview? Instead they leak Ruhle looking for a contract match because they were left at the altar.

    Judge and the Giants are still negotiating contract terms - nothing rushed about that process - no sirree

    Eric Bieniemy just has to remember he is going to have trouble getting a HC gig because teams are going to be extremely reluctant to hire anyone who has not been a coordinator with actual playcalling experience.

  5. #35
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    Re: Coaching Carousel 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    Make a decision you were forced into then dispatch the spin patrol. Or do you expect an organization to say we missed on who we wanted but will try to make the best of it?
    From the same article you posted from just that I posted the whole thing.

  6. #36
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    Re: Coaching Carousel 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post

    Eric Bieniemy just has to remember he is going to have trouble getting a HC gig because teams are going to be extremely reluctant to hire anyone who has not been a coordinator with actual playcalling experience.
    Maybe they let Bienemy call 2nd half plays like they did Doug Pedersen?

    Doug Pederson dropped an interesting bit of news at his introductory press conference as
    Philadelphia Eagles
    head coach: He called the
    Kansas City Chiefs
    ' offensive plays in the second half of every game the second half of the season, including Saturday’s AFC divisional playoff game against the
    New England Patriots
    .
    https://www.espn.com/blog/kansas-city-chiefs/post/_/id/15760/doug-pederson-says-he-called-offensive-plays-in-second-half-against-patriots

  7. #37
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    Re: Coaching Carousel 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by tom444 View Post
    From the same article you posted from just that I posted the whole thing.
    No kidding -I read it before I posted the excerpt and the link (which IMO is what is permitted under fair use references to an article)

    Of course the Giants are going to say they were blown away by the interview of their new hire and got their guy just like Rhule is going to say Carolina is his dream job after he apparently tried to get the Giants to match the Panthers offer

    As far as Albert Breer at SI giving his view on why this can work out, last one out the door at SI hopefully will remember to turn out the lights

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...say-its-chaos/

    Looks like the Giants management structure and what they were willing to pay put some limitations on who was willing to work there - but since hiring Belichick assistants has always worked out hiring a line assistant with no play calling experience obviously is what they wanted from day one of the search process


  8. #38
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    Re: Coaching Carousel 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    Looks like the Giants management structure and what they were willing to pay put some limitations on who was willing to work there - but since hiring Belichick assistants has always worked out hiring a line assistant with no play calling experience obviously is what they wanted from day one of the search process
    In other words you don't have a real reason why the Giants shouldn't have taken Judge.

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