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Thread: Going Forward; What You Want to See

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    Some people will say bring in a new QB but honestly the backups we had were thrust into horrible situations
    -Shit O-line the caliber of the late 00s o-lines
    -No reliable WR or TE
    -No real QBs coach
    -Probably the worst OC in the NFL, a guy who struggles with basic concepts as play construction, situational football, and the idea that if a play doesn't work it shouldn't be run

    Honestly I think there may have been 4 QBs in the NFL that would have had any success with this shit supporting cast around him: Russell Wilson, Patrick Mahomes, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers. The fact that even Ben looked bad when he was healthy speaks volumes

    Moving forward the Steelers need the following
    A better OC: I don't care if he is Ben's buddy, he is horrible. This year unequivocally proved that without elite talent around him, Fichtner is clueless. If Ben doesn't recover or he gets injured again this offense is toast. A good OC can help elevate a QB and maximize a QB's potential (you know like how Greg Roman has designed an offense around maximizing Lamar Jackson's strengths)
    O-line coach: Sarrett doesn't need more time, he was inherited an elite o-line and promptly ruined it. He needs to be replaced with someone who isn't a legacy pick
    O-linemen: Foster's done, AV was horrible, The only time Pouncey didn't look disinterested was when he was defending Rudolph against Myles Garrett, the other o-linemen were horrible. Without a high quality o-line coach, they need to devote some resources to on polished technically sound o-linemen. Sign quality veteran o-linemen in free agency and draft polished players in the draft
    Receivers and TEs: They don't have a reliable no. 1 WR or TE. Juju was proven to be mediocre at best without AB and he chokes in the clutch. They need a game-breaking receiving threat who can help open up the offense. The offense suffered without AB.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, Steelers need to get rid of Danny Smith and Jordan Berry and replace them. These two should have been canned years ago

    As for Bud, he's a no. 2 OLB at best, at worst he's playing for a contract. Since TJ likes him I would be willing to pay $9 million at best, if he won't agree to that, let him leave and sign with Miami or Washington. Breaking the bank for him when they need veteran help elsewhere would be a misuse of cap space
    Some very good points.

    Like you, I have concerns with our o line and receivers..

    Our pass protection was ok but what about run blocking?

    It starts in the trenches.
    "With love, with patience, and with Faith
    ....She'll make her way" ~ Natalie Merchant

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  3. #63
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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    With almost a year of starting experience, wouldn't Mason now qualify to be a veteran backup? Honestly unless they're going after an upper-tier backup like Bridgewater or Fitzpatrick, I don't think any of the options on the market are much better than Rudolph, if at all. Also I think it's unwise to give up on Mason just yet.

  4. #64

    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by Fire Goodell View Post
    With almost a year of starting experience, wouldn't Mason now qualify to be a veteran backup? Honestly unless they're going after an upper-tier backup like Bridgewater or Fitzpatrick, I don't think any of the options on the market are much better than Rudolph, if at all. Also I think it's unwise to give up on Mason just yet.
    No. "Veteran Backup" in this instance usually means a previous starter (multiple seasons) who can still play, but isn't gathering interest from other teams. We've brought several of them in over the years and I think it's time we bring another one in. I'm okay with Mason coming back, but I want a veteran backup as well.


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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackAndGold View Post
    I really like Deon Cains potential as a vertical threat. He an ideal #4 WR Imo. Big, fast, young.

    WR's should they bring back Cain.
    JuJu
    Washington
    Johnson(He's going to be a star people)
    Cain
    Switzer(blah)
    Holton(He's one hell of a gunner, DHB 2.0)

    They'll draft a receiver but there is no strong need to do so Imo. Though it's a deep WR class so it may be hard not to take one.
    No receiver in the NFL this season drew a higher rate of pass interference penalties from opponents than Cain did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwinsgames View Post
    you are a Kenny Pickett enabler

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by 86WARD View Post
    No receiver in the NFL this season drew a higher rate of pass interference penalties from opponents than Cain did.
    Good stat. Cain has a lot of talent as a vertical threat, I'm sure Ben will be a fan.
    1. Amarius Mims, OT, Georgia 2. Zach Frazier, C, West Virginia 3. Roman Wilson, WR, Michigan 3. ​Renardo Green, CB, FSU 4. Mo Kamara, OLB, Colorado State 6. Logan Lee, DT, Iowa 6.Khristian Boyd, NT, Northern Iowa

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by Craic View Post
    No. "Veteran Backup" in this instance usually means a previous starter (multiple seasons) who can still play, but isn't gathering interest from other teams. We've brought several of them in over the years and I think it's time we bring another one in. I'm okay with Mason coming back, but I want a veteran backup as well.
    It sounds like you're talking about Joe Flacco. I'd be alright with that.

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  9. #69

    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    So,
    In another thread someone posted about getting a RB to return us to champion caliber football.

    I don't think one equals the other (as I posted in that thread). However, I do think it'd be nice to have a RB that can put the team on his shoulders once or twice a year. This year, I've learned I can't count on Conner to do so because of injury. Does that continue into the future? I don't know. But I'm not sure I want to go into next year with him as our number 1 back.

    What do you all think? Do you trust Conner healthwise to make a contribution next year and be available throughout the year? How ticked will you be if you hear, "The Steelers, with the 49th pick in the draft, choose D'Andre Swift (or Jonathan Taylor, or Travis Etienne, or even Zack Moss)"?


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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by RunNGun View Post
    It sounds like you're talking about Joe Flacco. I'd be alright with that.
    FLACCO IS ELITE

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    I think adding a Good TE(Blocks, catches and can play an entire season) via the draft or picking up a vet will do wonders for the run game. I also think it will do wonders for the QB. If you invest in a good TE you just don't have to think about that position for 10-11 years. You also have safety valve success like Ben to Heath which almost always led to a 1st down or TD. Here is a list of TE's that have come and (most) gone since Heath retired and I'm sure I missed a few.


    1. Ladarius Green
    2. Xavier Grimble
    3. Jesse James
    4. David Johnson
    5 .D.J. Reeves
    6. Jay Rome
    7. Paul Lang
    8. Mandel Dixon
    9. Matt Spaeth
    10. David Reese
    11. Jake Phillips
    12. Michael Cooper
    13. RaShaun Allen
    14. Rob Blanchflower
    15. Vance McDonald
    16. Ryan Malleck
    17. Scott Orndoff
    18. Pharoah McKever
    19. Zach Gentry
    20. Kevin Rader
    21. Nick Vannett

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    That Giants game displayed why acquiring Ladarius Green was a great idea.

    The other 15 games (that he didn’t play) showed why it was one of the most painful misses ever in free agency.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by Shoes View Post
    I think adding a Good TE(Blocks, catches and can play an entire season) via the draft or picking up a vet will do wonders for the run game. I also think it will do wonders for the QB. If you invest in a good TE you just don't have to think about that position for 10-11 years. You also have safety valve success like Ben to Heath which almost always led to a 1st down or TD. Here is a list of TE's that have come and (most) gone since Heath retired and I'm sure I missed a few.


    1. Ladarius Green
    2. Xavier Grimble
    3. Jesse James
    4. David Johnson
    5 .D.J. Reeves
    6. Jay Rome
    7. Paul Lang
    8. Mandel Dixon
    9. Matt Spaeth
    10. David Reese
    11. Jake Phillips
    12. Michael Cooper
    13. RaShaun Allen
    14. Rob Blanchflower
    15. Vance McDonald
    16. Ryan Malleck
    17. Scott Orndoff
    18. Pharoah McKever
    19. Zach Gentry
    20. Kevin Rader
    21. Nick Vannett
    You forgot Grey Poupon! Christian whatever whatever from the practice squad/International Player Pathway/Rugby dude.



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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by tube517 View Post
    You forgot Grey Poupon! Christian whatever whatever from the practice squad/International Player Pathway/Rugby dude.
    Thanks, I probably forgot a few more. Our TE list is getting the the Browns QB list, but at least they weren't R1 picks.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    Some people will say bring in a new QB but honestly the backups we had were thrust into horrible situations
    -Shit O-line the caliber of the late 00s o-lines
    -No reliable WR or TE
    -No real QBs coach
    -Probably the worst OC in the NFL, a guy who struggles with basic concepts as play construction, situational football, and the idea that if a play doesn't work it shouldn't be run

    Honestly I think there may have been 4 QBs in the NFL that would have had any success with this shit supporting cast around him: Russell Wilson, Patrick Mahomes, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers. The fact that even Ben looked bad when he was healthy speaks volumes

    Moving forward the Steelers need the following
    A better OC: I don't care if he is Ben's buddy, he is horrible. This year unequivocally proved that without elite talent around him, Fichtner is clueless. If Ben doesn't recover or he gets injured again this offense is toast. A good OC can help elevate a QB and maximize a QB's potential (you know like how Greg Roman has designed an offense around maximizing Lamar Jackson's strengths)
    O-line coach: Sarrett doesn't need more time, he was inherited an elite o-line and promptly ruined it. He needs to be replaced with someone who isn't a legacy pick
    O-linemen: Foster's done, AV was horrible, The only time Pouncey didn't look disinterested was when he was defending Rudolph against Myles Garrett, the other o-linemen were horrible. Without a high quality o-line coach, they need to devote some resources to on polished technically sound o-linemen. Sign quality veteran o-linemen in free agency and draft polished players in the draft
    Receivers and TEs: They don't have a reliable no. 1 WR or TE. Juju was proven to be mediocre at best without AB and he chokes in the clutch. They need a game-breaking receiving threat who can help open up the offense. The offense suffered without AB.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, Steelers need to get rid of Danny Smith and Jordan Berry and replace them. These two should have been canned years ago

    As for Bud, he's a no. 2 OLB at best, at worst he's playing for a contract. Since TJ likes him I would be willing to pay $9 million at best, if he won't agree to that, let him leave and sign with Miami or Washington. Breaking the bank for him when they need veteran help elsewhere would be a misuse of cap space
    that name makes me sick.
    He's so grossly overrated i vomit.
    I'm praying he's one and done Sunday. But if not I hope the 49ers win and he gets his ass handed to him out west like he did in week 9 or 10 BWA HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Fuck that guy!

    The only one on that list that has a resume and could work with the current Oline is Wilson.
    Mahomes is still too fresh
    Brees is like Ben against time

  16. #76

    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelersNorth View Post
    that name makes me sick.
    He's so grossly overrated i vomit.
    I'm praying he's one and done Sunday. But if not I hope the 49ers win and he gets his ass handed to him out west like he did in week 9 or 10 BWA HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Fuck that guy!

    The only one on that list that has a resume and could work with the current Oline is Wilson.
    Mahomes is still too fresh
    Brees is like Ben against time
    Why the hate for Rodgers? Moreover, what do you mean overrated? His QB INT percentage is 1.4 percent lifetime, which leads all NFL QBs career stats. His career passer rating is 102.4, which leads all QBs to every play the game (and that includes Tom Brady at 97, Drew Brees at 98.4, Peyton Manning at 96.5, and Steve Young (among others) at 96.8. Moreover, this is a 14-year sample size. He's tied for 11th with Ben for passing yards per game, tied for 13th for yards per pass at 7.7 (Ben is tied for 9th at 7.8, and there are four QBs tied for 5th at 7.9). he's 8th for all-time passing TDs, and will move to seventh if he throws two more this week. he's 10th for pass completions.

    So, he protects the ball better than any QB has every done in the NFL and is more efficient with the ball than any QB in the NFL, and he does it not by dinking and dunking, but by throwing the ball downfield. What, exactly, makes him overrated?


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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by Craic View Post
    Why the hate for Rodgers? Moreover, what do you mean overrated? His QB INT percentage is 1.4 percent lifetime, which leads all NFL QBs career stats. His career passer rating is 102.4, which leads all QBs to every play the game (and that includes Tom Brady at 97, Drew Brees at 98.4, Peyton Manning at 96.5, and Steve Young (among others) at 96.8. Moreover, this is a 14-year sample size. He's tied for 11th with Ben for passing yards per game, tied for 13th for yards per pass at 7.7 (Ben is tied for 9th at 7.8, and there are four QBs tied for 5th at 7.9). he's 8th for all-time passing TDs, and will move to seventh if he throws two more this week. he's 10th for pass completions.

    So, he protects the ball better than any QB has every done in the NFL and is more efficient with the ball than any QB in the NFL, and he does it not by dinking and dunking, but by throwing the ball downfield. What, exactly, makes him overrated?
    first off stats are great but they as in the NFL also hide lots from you because they fail to tell you the truth
    Rogers became overrated in 2014 when he was 'gifted' his second MVP award, how do you ask well look at what JJ Watt did that season that guy literally made the Texans relevant had I think 22 sacks scored roughly 7TDs on OFFENSE & DEFENSE yet ahhhh lets give it to A-A-Ron.
    Then last flash forward to that same seasons NFC title game in Seattle
    Packers were up 16-0 at the HALF
    they lost in OT because all anyone remembers is the muffed onside kick to send it to OT
    FACT his STELLAR defense GIFTED him 5 EXTRA possessions he did nothing with...so the reality is he fucking blew it.
    2016 against the Falcons all you heard was the entire team was on IR...BFD they were in the game and got blown out to the tune of 31-0 before he did anything and that's only because the Falcons ALLOWED it to happen.
    before I continue there's other things that have happened just these stick out
    now to this year
    he has his FiRST and ONLY perfect passer rated game in week 6 or 7 and the week after was who do you pick for MVP? the media basically was going to hand it to him right then and there like it was the greatest game ever by a QB.
    Ben has had 4...4! which is an NFL record yet crickets? how does that make sense.
    Then he goes on the road to play the 49ers where he was 20/33 for a whopping 104 yards passing...yet not his fault because he's Aaron Rodgers its everyone BUT him right?
    I'll openly admit and won't argue that he's good but is he far and away THAT much better than the rest, the answer is NO.
    He's the epitome of what overrated is.
    Which is why i want them one and done so I don't have to listen to the NFL wanks build up the fake legend they keep trying to create.
    I had a packers fan once tell me Rodgers is amazing he's got 2 MVP awards...I said yeah, that's cool but Ben has 2 SUPER BOWLS so you keep your MVPs I'll take my world titles

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    It’s easy to paint a narrative by pointing out some bad games. Should we do that exercise with Ben?? Your argument is very unconvincing about Rodgers. While I don’t think he’s the GOAT, he’s a top 10 all-time QB.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Offensive line is old and suspect. With the depth at this position in the draft I hope we double dip this year. This is a simpler solution than having to hit it out of the park at skill positions with later round picks, especially when our receiving corp is so young and has a lot of potential.
    "With love, with patience, and with Faith
    ....She'll make her way" ~ Natalie Merchant

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    It’s easy to paint a narrative by pointing out some bad games. Should we do that exercise with Ben?? Your argument is very unconvincing about Rodgers. While I don’t think he’s the GOAT, he’s a top 10 all-time QB.
    I'll be the first to point out a bad game by Ben
    Just equal terms is all im saying don't sweep shit under the rug and BLAME everyone ELSE but the QB.
    The game has happened yet but if the Seahawks go and win & Rodgers plays pedestrian at best (much of this season) who do you blame? The defense? running game? receivers running the wrong routes which i hear game in and game out? what's the excuse I'd like to know
    fact is if the QB ain't getting it done it should usually fall on the QB ESPECIALLY one of his stature much like I think it should with Ben and it usually does so I'm fine with it.

    Top 10 that's a bit much...his career isn't over yet

    I think the sad part is that you've been brainwashed with too much ESPN and NFL Network saying AR can do no wrong.
    I picked specifics that I remember off the top of my head for Rodgers but they are glaring.
    I can do the same for Ben but with a more fine tooth comb because I haven't missed a game in the 15 years plus 6 quarters he's played.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Brainwashed lol.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Brainwashed lol.
    you say I'm 'unconvincing' yet you have no argument back
    sooooooooo...... ...... ...... ......

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelersNorth View Post
    you say I'm 'unconvincing' yet you have no argument back
    sooooooooo...... ...... ...... ......
    It's not worth the time and energy.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    It's not worth the time and energy.
    either you know or you don't it's pretty simple
    I openly admitted that I've picked certain things because they stuck out in my mind and the hype specifically after those incidents
    I did ZERO research. I watch enough football and read enough horseshit from the NFL media to know the difference.
    but you've proven my point

    on a brighter note hopefully Super Bowl Sunday they have an update on Ben as he's scheduled for a check up the day before

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Brainwashed lol.
    You, me, and all of the GM’s and coaches in the NFL must also be brainwashed.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by FrancoLambert View Post
    You, me, and all of the GM’s and coaches in the NFL must also be brainwashed.
    yeah all the GMs and Coaches always say X guy is the best or he does X & O really well so we gotta be prepared...c'mon man!
    Even Jamies Winston gets praise once a week during the year.

    you guys just hate the truth like most Packers fans.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    On one side we have everyone and in the other we have one dude. And he's yelling about the other side needing proof.

    This is the internet in a nutshell. And when you boil it all down, the argument is essentially that the NFL media is mean to his favorite QB and nicer to a different QB.

    Did you guys hear about how the earth is flat? I mean where's the proof it's round?!!!

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    In addition to a healthy Ben R, would also like to see a real QB coach and new OC. Too many questionable game strategies trotted out by Fichtner this season. Ben should fall in line with this, for the betterment of the team moving forward - there are other needs, specially on offense but I think this is a major one.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    On one side we have everyone and in the other we have one dude. And he's yelling about the other side needing proof.

    This is the internet in a nutshell. And when you boil it all down, the argument is essentially that the NFL media is mean to his favorite QB and nicer to a different QB.

    Did you guys hear about how the earth is flat? I mean where's the proof it's round?!!!
    No wrong again don't pick and choose bud.
    I'm citing specific instances where AR should be taking all the flack much like BR as he SHOULD (which I clearly stated).
    I've also stated AR is a good QB I haven't nor would I argue that. BUT saying he's far and away better than EVERYONE is ludicrous.

    And yeah i say proof because i can man up and give specifics you and buddy boy haven't and probably can't.
    You're right it is the interweb so I can't expect much in return but it would be nice...ah well such is life.

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    Re: Going Forward; What You Want to See

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelersNorth View Post
    No wrong again don't pick and choose bud.
    I'm citing specific instances where AR should be taking all the flack much like BR as he SHOULD (which I clearly stated).
    I've also stated AR is a good QB I haven't nor would I argue that. BUT saying he's far and away better than EVERYONE is ludicrous.

    And yeah i say proof because i can man up and give specifics you and buddy boy haven't and probably can't.
    You're right it is the interweb so I can't expect much in return but it would be nice...ah well such is life.
    So you have constructed an entirely emotional argument/straw man based on YOUR feelings being hurt that the crappy NFL media coverage you watch and read isn't as mean to Aaron Rodgers as they are to Ben R?

    As far as I can tell that is your position. Both are good QBs but Rodgers is too fawned over by idiots on TV and your angry that Ben gets crapped on by either those same idiots or other idiots somewhere else.

    I spent 35 seconds on Google and found dozens of articles spread over the last several years making arguments about Rodgers "elite" status or whether or not he is properly rated. Here is one: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...e-quarterback/

    As to the MVP thing, the QB always always wins. We could brainstorm, as a group, dozens or non QB players who had staggeringly amazing seasons that didn't win the award. I don't know but maybe, like myself, you live in the upper midwest and grow tired of the Packers homers swearing that Aaron Rodgers walks on water and can achieve world peace if only Davonte Adams could get open consistently. I get that. But, again, it seems your argument is solely that Rodgers is viewed as surpassing every QB ever. Who thinks that aside from talking heads trying to generate conversation/debate?

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