Buy Or Sell: Mark Barron Will Start And Play More Than Vince Williams

[polamalubeast]

Topic Statement: Mark Barron will both start and play more snaps than Vince Williams.

Explanation: The Steelers have a bit of an abundance at inside linebacker this year after that splurged in both free agency and the draft, ending up with both Mark Barron and 10th-overall pick Devin Bush. Joining them is eighth-year veteran Vince Williams, who has been a full-time starter for the past two years. Less athletic than the other two, it’s fair to wonder if he will start, or if he will play more snaps than Barron.

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https://steelersdepot.com/2019/09/bu...ince-williams/

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Sell. I think Barron was signed as insurance that they would not find their ILB in the draft. I think that Barron, Bush and Williams will all split time, but Williams gives them a thumper of an ILB that the other 2 are not. I think Mark Barron will only be a 1 year Steeler unless he plays really well and outshines Bush.

[polamalubeast]

Sell. I think Barron was signed as insurance that they would not find their ILB in the draft. I think that Barron, Bush and Williams will all split time, but Williams gives them a thumper of an ILB that the other 2 are not. I think Mark Barron will only be a 1 year Steeler unless he plays really well and outshines Bush.

I would be very surprised if Bush is not our 3 down LB, even in week 1

I think Mark Barron is going to be in the passing situation and Williams is going to be in the other down ... So I think Barron is going to have more snap that Williams and Bush are going to be our LB in every down ... That's their goal...

Just look at the preseason week 3

It's just preseason, but I always thought that's the way the Steelers need to rotate their ILBs ...I think they'll use Barron or Williams depending on matchups from the other team.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

I would be very surprised if Bush is not our 3 down LB, even in week 1

I think Mark Barron is going to be in the passing situation and Williams is going to be in the other down ... So I think Barron is going to have more snap that Williams and Bush are going to be our LB in every down ... That's their goal...

Just look at the preseason week 3

It's just preseason, but I always thought that's the way the Steelers need to rotate their ILBs ...I think they'll use Barron or Williams depending on matchups from the other team.

Interesting. I agree its gonna depend on the matchups vs other teams. I was thinking with all the talk of playing 3 safeties more often that it would limit Barron on the field and it may, or it may all be smoke like how they were gonna play that way last season as well.

I recall that Barron's contract seemed like it was structured so they could get out if it after one year pretty decently and I think that happens if Bush shows himself to be productive.

[polamalubeast]

Interesting. I agree its gonna depend on the matchups vs other teams. I was thinking with all the talk of playing 3 safeties more often that it would limit Barron on the field and it may, or it may all be smoke like how they were gonna play that way last season as well.

I recall that Barron's contract seemed like it was structured so they could get out if it after one year pretty decently and I think that happens if Bush shows himself to be productive.

It's possible that this is Barron's only year with us, but it's going to depend on how important he is going to be with us.

Also, we must not forget that Mark Barron was drafted in the first round (7 overall) as safety who has changed his position a few years later because the style of the NFL has changed a lot, so if one thing Barron should to do well as ILB is in coverage ... Much better than what the steelers had at this position last year and this is maybe the only LB of this team that I can live with that if he need to cover a WR in the slot (important that this is not a WR of the caliber of Michael Thomas, Keenan Allen, AJ Green or others too!)

[Six Rings]

BUY.


Vince Williams is a good team guy, however he's not suited for most formations. His speed and range are limited.


If we play nickel or dime, which we do more often than not, Williams is on the bench. Bush is or will be our dime ILB, Barron the other nickel LB.


If we play 4-3, Bush is our guy.


If we pay 3-4, MAYBE Williams plays a bit, but not on third down and long. The Steelers don't play base 3-4 often.


Essentially Williams is an in the box run defender and top middle blitzer. He's not a fit for situational football in general. I could care less if his name appears on the screen as the " starter " IMO, his snap count will be below 45% this season, barring injuries. I always want Bush on the filed over Williams.

[polamalubeast]

Maybe Bush will not play in every down in the first regular season game of his career.....

I can understand, especially against Brady.

[steelreserve]

tbh Williams does certain things very well, but unless the opponent is in a run-oriented formation, his speed and coverage ability means there is going to be a bad matchup for us. Since Barron is less of a liability there, I would expect him to be on the field most of the time against 3+ WR sets, which is basically 70% of the time now.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

It's possible that this is Barron's only year with us, but it's going to depend on how important he is going to be with us.

Also, we must not forget that Mark Barron was drafted in the first round (7 overall) as safety who has changed his position a few years later because the style of the NFL has changed a lot, so if one thing Barron should to do well as ILB is in coverage ... Much better than what the steelers had at this position last year and this is maybe the only LB of this team that I can live with that if he need to cover a WR in the slot (important that this is not a WR of the caliber of Michael Thomas, Keenan Allen, AJ Green or others too!)

Yup, Barron was drafted as a safety and really didn't pan out great with the Bucs. He was measured at the combine at 6'1" , 213lbs and now is listed at 6'2", 230lbs. Barron ran a 4.54 at his pro day and since he has bulked up he is likely slower, so I don't really tout him as a guy that is considered fast. He was a box safety, not a guy with great range, that was converted to a hybrid LB and the 8 career INT don't really say he is a ball hawk.

Good guy, said to be a leader in the room, but never lived up to the #7 pick hype and had some injury issues. I'm really not banking on a lot from Barron if Bush picks things up quickly, but he is there as insurance in case he doesn't IMO. I think Barron has the potential to draw the ire of Steeler fans for having $6million salary and possibly not producing much this season.

[polamalubeast]

Yup, Barron was drafted as a safety and really didn't pan out great with the Bucs. He was measured at the combine at 6'1" , 213lbs and now is listed at 6'2", 230lbs. Barron ran a 4.54 at his pro day and since he has bulked up he is likely slower, so I don't really tout him as a guy that is considered fast. He was a box safety, not a guy with great range, that was converted to a hybrid LB and the 8 career INT don't really say he is a ball hawk.

Good guy, said to be a leader in the room, but never lived up to the #7 pick hype and had some injury issues. I'm really not banking on a lot from Barron if Bush picks things up quickly, but he is there as insurance in case he doesn't IMO. I think Barron has the potential to draw the ire of Steeler fans for having $6million salary and possibly not producing much this season.

The only thing I ask Barron is to be above average in coverage for a player at this position and I will be happy.

[polamalubeast]

Kozora has a very good point the use of the ILB in New England ... I think Bush is going to be much better as the season goes forward for the communication, but since the first game for Bush is against Brady, they need to be sure that the communication is fine

[Fire Goodell]

Not to mention you can't really overplay the passing game against NE. They have 2 good running backs in Michel and White. NE won the AFCCG and Super Bowl leaning a lot on the running game, there will be a need for Vince.

[polamalubeast]

Not to mention you can't really overplay the passing game against NE. They have 2 good running backs in Michel and White. NE won the AFCCG and Super Bowl leaning a lot on the running game, there will be a need for Vince.

Yeah and many forget about that last year

I do not know what's going to be their identity this year but in the last 5 games last year after losing to the Steelers, the Pats had just one game under 150 rushing yards and it was 131 yards ... They won every game last year when they had over 100 rushing yards (12-0) .. Against the Steelers, the Pats had had 5.2 yards per run, but they only had 19 rushing attempts in this game (96 yards) vs 37 pass attempts ... We must also said that it also depends on the down and the distance and in this game, the Pats had a lot of penalty.

[polamalubeast]

Another comment,this time by a former steelers...

[pczach]

I think that they are going to find out if opposing offenses isolate Williams on early downs and beat him like a drum in coverage. If he gets tested and can't hold up reasonably well, they will go with more athletic personnel to see if they hold up against the run. Teams are going to test them either way.

In a perfect world, Bush and Barron are able to stay mostly clean because the DL is so disruptive and can run to the ball. With that speed and athleticism, it will be very hard for offenses to put together drives when LB's are taking away easy yards on easy throws, and they are also struggling to run the football.

I'm sure they will all get snaps, but if Barron can show that he makes a difference...Williams sits more IMO.

[polamalubeast]

Chris Hoke again,this time on Barron...

[teegre]

Time for the classic Denny Green line...

When asked about how he’d get enough snaps to share among his three stand-out receivers (Reed, Carter, Moss), Green replied, “It’s a good problem to have.”



A few seasons ago, Bince had 8 sacks. I don’t remember the exact stats, but it was something like top 25 of all players... and, easily the top for ILBs. In fact, I recall it being the most sacks by an ILB in like six seasons.

[Mojouw]

Offenses in the NFL are now attacking the middle of the field relentlessly. I do not see how it is or will be a bad thing for the Steelers to actually have a collection of players who can make a variety of plays down the middle of their defense. Classic run stoppers in VW and Big Dan. Pass defenders in Barron, Edmunds, and Davis. Pass rusher in Hargrave. And Bush as the straw that stirs the drink. Whether all these guys will be as good as it looks on paper, who knows. But at least they have finally been able to throw enough athletes at the area of the field that teams are trying to gouge every defense over.

[teegre]

Offenses in the NFL are now attacking the middle of the field relentlessly. I do not see how it is or will be a bad thing for the Steelers to actually have a collection of players who can make a variety of plays down the middle of their defense. Classic run stoppers in VW and Big Dan. Pass defenders in Barron, Edmunds, and Davis. Pass rusher in Hargrave. And Bush as the straw that stirs the drink. Whether all these guys will be as good as it looks on paper, who knows. But at least they have finally been able to throw enough athletes at the area of the field that teams are trying to gouge every defense over.

For example... when the FB goes into the game for the opposition, VW should automatically be on the field.