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Thread: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

  1. #61
    Senior Member Array title="steelreserve has a reputation beyond repute"> steelreserve's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    Is there any evidence for these blanket statements?

    Slot WRs get X yards by showing up.
    OLBs get Y sacks by having a pulse.

    Using hyperbolic statements backed by nothing other than a strong gut feeling severely undercuts what is otherwise an argument that many would be prone to agree with.

    This kinda says that 500 yards puts you around the top 10 in slot WRs league wide. Didn't totally do the prorated math. https://www.profootballfocus.com/new...ugh-13-weeks-2

    It isn't really that anyone thinks Wheaton is all that great shakes. It is more that the justifications used to downgrad him are seemingly made up out of whole cloth and based on little empirical evidence. I mean that is the cool thing about the NFL, we have how many years and decades of statistics to develop reasonable baselines for performance off of. No need to just pull #'s out of the ether. Taking a 2 minute tour through some recent yearly stat compilations and it seems that Markus Wheaton was a high side of average WR out of the slot and a mediocre WR when asked to be the explosive vertical element in an offense. Then injuries and cost bounced him right out the of the league.

    It's one of those things that you just know when you're awesome.

    But you can kind of reverse engineer things with the same kind of projections. Like for example ... what's the least amount of passing yards you could have as a starting QB for the whole year? Zero yards, right? Well, no, you'd lose your job well before that. What about 3,000 yards? That's actually about right. (Look at last year's stats, low 3000s is where people either missed some games or lost their job https://www.pro-football-reference.c...sing::pass_yds)

    So out of that 3,000 yards, how are they split up? Well, what's the worst you can do as a #1 receiver without being hurt or losing your job? 800 yards? That comes out about right too. What's the worst as a #2 WR? Call it 700. Another 400 for your baseline TE and 400 for your baseline RB group, you're at 2,100. So you've got 900 yards to split up among everyone else, which is basically your slot receiver, and the backup TEs, and WRs 4-5-6 who are like the sub-150 yard guys. The slot receiver ought to be getting the most out of that group, by virtue of getting the most playing time and targets. So if you're not pulling 400 yards as a #3 WR, sorry, but you really suck. (Well what if you have a really good #1 or #2 receiver taking more of the yards? Well, then your QB's overall passing yards probably aren't the worst in the league, we're talking about baseline replacement value).

    Same idea with OLBs. How many sacks do the worst defenses in the league get per year? Low 30s is pretty typical. So what's the average player's share? About 3 a year, give or take. Well, your DBs probably only get 1 or 2, and the guys whose main job is actually rushing should get more. So 4-5 sacks is what the position is good for even if you are bad. That's also what YOU get by showing up, if you aren't so bad you lose your job.

    That's the thing that's left out of these "______th best in the league" stats. People on the bottom half of the list lose their jobs a lot and don't always get a full season's worth of stats. Or sometimes they're down there because they missed games due to injury. You can get "league average" or even slightly "above-average" looking stats (Wheaton's 700-yard fluke) just based on the fact that you didn't get hurt and the coaches left you in!

    There might be 100 OLBs who could produce Dupree's 3.5-4 sacks a year, but most of them get yanked halfway for playing like that, so they only get 2.5 sacks. "Dupree is doing better, see!" No, not really. We have a few players like that from time to time, who get THE MAXIMUM time to prove themselves because we want to see them succeed so badly. Wheaton's stats are basically what you get from giving a low-average player extended playing time, and the 700 year was a lucky break.

    Back to the point again: If Washington's career turns out like Wheaton's, I would call that a big disappointment. Not really a ton of evidence to go by yet, although a lost year is not necessarily encouraging ... but that is what I hope he does NOT turn out to be.
    See you Space Cowboy ...

  2. #62
    Senior Member Array title="hawaiiansteeler has a reputation beyond repute"> hawaiiansteeler's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers


  3. #63
    Senior Member Array title="Mojouw has a reputation beyond repute"> Mojouw's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    The estimation of how many players get benched is pretty far off. I can't think of a team that casts about for starting players like that.

    The logic being laid out is sound. But it does not align with what we know actually happens. In other words the NFL is often really illogical.

    That's what I kinda think is the problem with any discussion of x player or coach is the z best in the NFL. RARELY are the parameters for that evaluation laid out.

  4. #64
    Senior Member Array title="teegre has a reputation beyond repute"> teegre's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson View Post
    HOF-dogshit scale Teegre is working on?
    1. Hall of Famer
    2. does not compute
    3. does not compute
    4. does not compute
    5. does not compute
    6. does not compute
    7. does not compute
    8. does not compute
    9. dogshit
    10. Limas Sweed

  5. #65
    Senior Member Array title="steelreserve has a reputation beyond repute"> steelreserve's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by teegre View Post
    1. Hall of Famer
    2. does not compute
    3. does not compute
    4. does not compute
    5. does not compute
    6. does not compute
    7. does not compute
    8. does not compute
    9. dogshit
    10. Limas Sweed
    You forgot "Hall of Fame dogshit." This rating scale is obviously garbage. Have you ever even been to a football game?
    See you Space Cowboy ...

  6. #66
    Senior Member Array title="hawaiiansteeler has a reputation beyond repute"> hawaiiansteeler's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    JuJu: James Washington will 'sneak up on everybody'

    By Jeremy Bergman
    Around The NFL Writer
    Published: July 8, 2019

    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...p-on-everybody

  7. #67
    NFL's Dirtiest Player Array title="86WARD has a reputation beyond repute"> 86WARD's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by hawaiiansteeler View Post
    JuJu: James Washington will 'sneak up on everybody'

    By Jeremy Bergman
    Around The NFL Writer
    Published: July 8, 2019

    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...p-on-everybody
    That would be nice. I think Moncrief is going to do a little sneaking of his own.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwinsgames View Post
    you are a Kenny Pickett enabler

  8. #68
    Senior Member Array title="teegre has a reputation beyond repute"> teegre's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    I heard that Washington can fly...

  9. #69
    Senior Member Array title="hawaiiansteeler has a reputation beyond repute"> hawaiiansteeler's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    James Washington happy to be “just thinking about playing football”

    Posted by Josh Alper on July 9, 2019

    https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...ying-football/

  10. #70
    Senior Member Array title="HollywoodSteel has a reputation beyond repute"> HollywoodSteel's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by teegre View Post
    I heard that Washington can fly...
    I believe that was R. Kelly.

  11. #71
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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    James Washington’s Offseason Positional Self-Scouting Included Learning QB Perspective

    By Dave Bryan
    Posted on July 9, 2019

    https://steelersdepot.com/2019/07/ja...b-perspective/

  12. #72
    Senior Member Array title="teegre has a reputation beyond repute"> teegre's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by HollywoodSteel View Post
    I believe that was R. Kelly.
    When I hear the name “R. Kelly” all that I can think of is Dave Chappelle’s impersonation of him.




  13. #73
    Senior Member Array title="HollywoodSteel has a reputation beyond repute"> HollywoodSteel's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by teegre View Post
    When I hear the name “R. Kelly” all that I can think of is Dave Chappelle’s impersonation of him.



    I think of this:

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qAtvxFFsoeg

  14. #74
    Senior Member Array title="DesertSteel has a reputation beyond repute"> DesertSteel's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by teegre View Post
    I heard that Washington can fly...
    I heard he can chop down a cherry tree.

  15. #75
    Senior Member Array title="pczach has a reputation beyond repute"> pczach's Avatar

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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    I heard he can chop down a cherry tree.

    I heard he could never tell a lie and he has wooden teeth.

  16. #76
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    Re: James Washington sheds weight, puts rookie season behind him in Year 2 with Steelers

    Quote Originally Posted by pczach View Post
    I heard he could never tell a lie and he has wooden teeth.
    Super Bowl!!

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