Results 1 to 30 of 30

Thread: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array title="DesertSteel has a reputation beyond repute"> DesertSteel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Arizona
    Gender
    Posts
    4,123

    Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Apparently, not a great draft year for our positions of need. These rankings place CB next to last (10th) and LB dead last (11th).

    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...est-to-weakest

    10) Cornerback: Your team picked a bad year to need a cornerback -- well, at least a CB1. Over the past three drafts, at least four cornerbacks have been picked in the first round (counting the versatile Minkah Fitzpatrick in last year's group). It could happen again this season, but some of those picks will be reaches. The trend of bigger, longer cornerback continues, and this is a fast cornerback group overall, but it lacks a bona fide star. Potential first-rounders like Deandre Baker and Byron Murphyare 4.5 40 guys. There is actually intriguing value on Day 3 in this group.
    11) Linebacker: I wouldn't call this a "bad linebacker draft," but it definitely thins out earlier than many teams would probably like. Devin White and Devin Bush are legitimate first-round talents, but Mack Wilson may be the only true second-round candidate, while a relatively small group of linebackers could fill out Rounds 3 and 4. There is decent backup/special teams depth available on Day 3.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    First up is everyone's #1 ILB in 2019 draft. Devin White games vs. Auburn then Miami.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sYaQyNKIW0

    This is White vs Georgia then Ole Miss.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7x6v21BHOI

  3. #3
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    This is Devin Bush game tape vs Mich State then Penn State.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5z2VuUBu0ZI

  4. #4
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Here is Mack Wilson vs Arkansas then Missouri then LSU.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IulezWjBy8k

  5. #5
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Minnesota's Blake Cashman vs Ohio State then Northwestern.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkzkZKUhseg

  6. #6
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Germaine Pratt vs Clemson

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AigLyFJIg_Y

    Germaine Pratt vs Wake Forest

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbfbr4UHJcI

    Germaine Pratt vs Georgia State

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4zG318EXUs

  7. #7
    Senior Member Array title="st33lersguy has a reputation beyond repute">

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    12,384

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    After the devins there isn't a quality ilb difference maker. Makes me wish they would have nabbed Leonard at pick 28

  8. #8
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    After the devins there isn't a quality ilb difference maker. Makes me wish they would have nabbed Leonard at pick 28
    And this is what I disagree with pretty much everyone about. The 5 ILBs I posted above are all about the same skill level, IMO. Watch the links I posted and decide for yourselves.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Array title="teegre has a reputation beyond repute"> teegre's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    8,933

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    After the devins there isn't a quality ilb difference maker. Makes me wish they would have nabbed Leonard at pick 28
    After Day1, everyone wanted Leonard n R2, and talked about whether he’d be there for us or if we needed to trade up a few spots to get him. No one predicted he’d go that early in R2 (let alone that we should have taken him at 28).

    But, Yes, in hindsight... it would have been a great choice.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by teegre View Post
    After Day1, everyone wanted Leonard n R2, and talked about whether he’d be there for us or if we needed to trade up a few spots to get him. No one predicted he’d go that early in R2 (let alone that we should have taken him at 28).

    But, Yes, in hindsight... it would have been a great choice.
    I honestly don't understand how after watching Blake Cashman's game tapes he can still be considered a reach. From everything I have watched on him I would take Cashman OVER the Devins tbh. Devin White I can understand with his size and speed and production in SEC play, 286 tackles, 28.5 TFL in 34 games. Not going to debate that pick. But apples to apples: Bush 172 tackles, 18.5 TFL in 32 games. Cashman 179 tackles, 30.5 TFL in 33 games. Both played in the Big10. I took away Cashman's Freshman year to make the years of production match. If both Devin Bush and Blake Cashman were available at 20, I would take Blake Cashman. I know the shoulder surgery on both sides raises an eyebrow. I can find NOTHING on the severity of his injuries. CJ Mosley had the same scare coming out and has been an iron man of sorts at ILB. I am not concerned about that without more info than just he had surgery. I believe this kid is a 1st round ILB.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array title="st33lersguy has a reputation beyond repute">

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    12,384

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by teegre View Post
    After Day1, everyone wanted Leonard n R2, and talked about whether he’d be there for us or if we needed to trade up a few spots to get him. No one predicted he’d go that early in R2 (let alone that we should have taken him at 28).

    But, Yes, in hindsight... it would have been a great choice.
    Thing is though he wasn't rated lower than or expected to go later than the guy they actually took at pick 28

  12. #12
    Senior Member Array title="Mojouw has a reputation beyond repute"> Mojouw's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Gender
    Posts
    9,270

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    Thing is though he wasn't rated lower than or expected to go later than the guy they actually took at pick 28
    Unless you take into the account the late-breaking pre-draft and draft day reports that Edmunds was shooting up more than one draft board across the actual NFL. I remember hearing that like a day or so and early on draft day that this guy no one had ever really thought about was getting late buzz. Then, of course, the Steelers picked him.

    In contrast, and we know this was incorrect, almost all the draft pundits were talking about Leonard as a 3rd or 4th round pick.

    What is my point? We still don't know what the proper grade was for either guy. But we do know that the talking heads, twitter warriors, and internet draft sites all typically have about 3-6 guys that they value totally differently than the NFL does. Sometimes they have guys way higher (the Billings/Butler DT draft class from a few years back) or they have guys far lower (Leonard and Edmunds are solid examples of this). This year, who will it be? I have no idea. But it will be someone...

  13. #13
    Senior Member Array title="teegre has a reputation beyond repute"> teegre's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    8,933

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    Thing is though he wasn't rated lower than or expected to go later than the guy they actually took at pick 28
    Maybe. And, maybe Edmunds was a bad pick.

    That doesn’t change the point: After R1 was done, no one was saying “Oh man, we should have taken Leonard at 28.” Again, people were discussing Leonard at 50 (or “maybe” trading up to the early 40s)... but, no one was thinking he’d go at 36 (let alone at 28).

  14. #14
    Senior Member Array title="DesertSteel has a reputation beyond repute"> DesertSteel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Arizona
    Gender
    Posts
    4,123

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by Born2Steel View Post
    I honestly don't understand how after watching Blake Cashman's game tapes he can still be considered a reach. From everything I have watched on him I would take Cashman OVER the Devins tbh. Devin White I can understand with his size and speed and production in SEC play, 286 tackles, 28.5 TFL in 34 games. Not going to debate that pick. But apples to apples: Bush 172 tackles, 18.5 TFL in 32 games. Cashman 179 tackles, 30.5 TFL in 33 games. Both played in the Big10. I took away Cashman's Freshman year to make the years of production match. If both Devin Bush and Blake Cashman were available at 20, I would take Blake Cashman. I know the shoulder surgery on both sides raises an eyebrow. I can find NOTHING on the severity of his injuries. CJ Mosley had the same scare coming out and has been an iron man of sorts at ILB. I am not concerned about that without more info than just he had surgery. I believe this kid is a 1st round ILB.
    Are you suggesting they take him at #20 or in later rounds? I know nothing about him, but NFL website projects him for 5th-6th round.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Are you suggesting they take him at #20 or in later rounds? I know nothing about him, but NFL website projects him for 5th-6th round.
    Which is why I posted all those game tapes above so you can watch White, Bush, Wilson, Cashman, and Pratt and come to your own conclusion. The NFL site has Cashman as a 5th-6th round and projects as a backup or ST guy. The Draft Network analysts all have him as a 2nd/3rd round guy. Most draft sites have Cashman as their 4th ranked ILB behind White, Bush, and Wilson. I think they are all just copying each other. When I watch the game tapes I put them in this order, 1.Devin White 2.Blake Cashman 3.Devin Bush 4.Mack Wilson 5.Germaine Pratt. So yes, if it comes to pick 20 and White is gone, I would select Cashman over the other ILBs. Just watch the first qtr of Cashman vs Ohio State and I think you will see it too.

  16. #16
    Senior Member Array title="DesertSteel has a reputation beyond repute"> DesertSteel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Arizona
    Gender
    Posts
    4,123

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by Born2Steel View Post
    Which is why I posted all those game tapes above so you can watch White, Bush, Wilson, Cashman, and Pratt and come to your own conclusion. The NFL site has Cashman as a 5th-6th round and projects as a backup or ST guy. The Draft Network analysts all have him as a 2nd/3rd round guy. Most draft sites have Cashman as their 4th ranked ILB behind White, Bush, and Wilson. I think they are all just copying each other. When I watch the game tapes I put them in this order, 1.Devin White 2.Blake Cashman 3.Devin Bush 4.Mack Wilson 5.Germaine Pratt. So yes, if it comes to pick 20 and White is gone, I would select Cashman over the other ILBs. Just watch the first qtr of Cashman vs Ohio State and I think you will see it too.
    As much as I love the actual draft and talking about it on here, I really don't have time to watch game film on guys. I watch games as they're both compelling and available to me. I'll take your word along with theirs and reach the uneducated conclusion that he could be a sleeper in R3. Thanks for the tip.

  17. #17
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Fair enough. I would love to get Greedy Williams at 20 and Blake Cashman at 52. I think there is a better chance of Greedy being there at 20 than Cashman being there at 52. I think there will be a better player at CB available at 52 than there will be for ILB. I could see taking Cashman at 20 and a DB at 52. Everything depends on how the board falls of course. I honestly believe the Steelers have Devin Bush in their sights though.

  18. #18
    Senior Member Array title="hawaiiansteeler has a reputation beyond repute"> hawaiiansteeler's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    The Aloha State
    Gender
    Posts
    6,037

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by Born2Steel View Post
    Fair enough. I would love to get Greedy Williams at 20 and Blake Cashman at 52. I think there is a better chance of Greedy being there at 20 than Cashman being there at 52. I think there will be a better player at CB available at 52 than there will be for ILB. I could see taking Cashman at 20 and a DB at 52. Everything depends on how the board falls of course. I honestly believe the Steelers have Devin Bush in their sights though.
    fwiw, Charley Casserly just predicted that Greedy Williams will fall completely out of the first round.

  19. #19
    Senior Member Array title="Mojouw has a reputation beyond repute"> Mojouw's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Gender
    Posts
    9,270

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by hawaiiansteeler View Post
    fwiw, Charley Casserly just predicted that Greedy Williams will fall completely out of the first round.
    Wonder I'd that's because he didn't do visits?

  20. #20
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by hawaiiansteeler View Post
    fwiw, Charley Casserly just predicted that Greedy Williams will fall completely out of the first round.
    Did he give reasons for that prediction? That’s interesting.

  21. #21
    Senior Member Array title="DesertSteel has a reputation beyond repute"> DesertSteel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Arizona
    Gender
    Posts
    4,123

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Greedy’s stock seems to be plummeting for some unknown reason.

  22. #22
    Senior Member Array title="Dwinsgames has a reputation beyond repute"> Dwinsgames's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    in a cave
    Gender
    Posts
    3,645

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Greedy’s stock seems to be plummeting for some unknown reason.
    ( perhaps a positive test or medical red flag ) that has not been disclosed to the rest of the world at the combine ?
    Follow me on Twitter @Dwinsgames

  23. #23
    Senior Member Array title="st33lersguy has a reputation beyond repute">

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    12,384

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Greedy’s stock seems to be plummeting for some unknown reason.
    Hes stated he will not be going to any predraft visits or workouts

  24. #24
    Senior Member Array title="st33lersguy has a reputation beyond repute">

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    12,384

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    I've stated LBs but I agree on CBs as well. There isn't a CB worth taking at pick 20 IMO

  25. #25
    Senior Member Array title="Mojouw has a reputation beyond repute"> Mojouw's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Gender
    Posts
    9,270

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    So how good is Greedy? His testing numbers look great. But so did Artie's. On the other hand LSU has been churning out pretty good DBs.

  26. #26
    Senior Member Array title="DesertSteel has a reputation beyond repute"> DesertSteel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Arizona
    Gender
    Posts
    4,123

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    Hes stated he will not be going to any predraft visits or workouts
    I interpreted it that he wasn’t invited. Are you saying he refused?

  27. #27
    Senior Member Array title="st33lersguy has a reputation beyond repute">

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    12,384

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    I interpreted it that he wasn’t invited. Are you saying he refused?
    He is choosing not to attend pre-draft visits/workouts

  28. #28
    Senior Member Array title="Mojouw has a reputation beyond repute"> Mojouw's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Gender
    Posts
    9,270

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    He is choosing not to attend pre-draft visits/workouts
    I couldn't tell if refused or got no invites. Either way it's odd.

  29. #29
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Posts
    5,928

    Re: Not a Great Year for CB/LB...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    So how good is Greedy? His testing numbers look great. But so did Artie's. On the other hand LSU has been churning out pretty good DBs.
    Could just be nursing an injury. He’s already tested at the combine and pro day. Plus there is a ton of film. His knock has been he isn’t a tackler and holds off in run support. They don’t run tackling drills for DBs at visits anyway. I can’t see him falling off 32 first round boards over that. Really sounds more like an undisclosed injury to me.

  30. #30
    Senior Member Array title="Shoes has a reputation beyond repute"> Shoes's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Gender
    Posts
    8,866
    Last edited by Shoes; 04-17-2019 at 09:20 PM.
    "The first principle is that you must not fool yourself--and you are
    the easiest person to fool."

    --Richard Feynmann

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •