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Thread: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

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    Senior Member Array title="AtlantaDan has a reputation beyond repute"> AtlantaDan's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by NCSteeler View Post
    Difference being Mahommes is a second year player first year starting and his coaches still coach him and tell him to get his shit straight. Does anyone think there is a coach in Pittsburgh getting on Ben's case?

    Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk
    Agreed on Ben being to the stage he can say FU to the coaches and there is not much anyone can do about it (and if they do anyone below the HC level leaves town and Ben picks his successor).

    Difference may also be Mahomes is a different personality from Ben, who reportedly started having issues with his coaches and teammates his rookie year

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    Agreed on Ben being to the stage he can say FU to the coaches and there is not much anyone can do about it (and if they do anyone below the HC level leaves town and Ben picks his successor).

    Difference may also be Mahomes is a different personality from Ben, who reportedly started having issues with his coaches and teammates his rookie year
    You mean the entitled jerk is till an entitled jerk - he just got better at faking it? Weird, who would’ve thunk it?

    Ben R is a HOF QB but a pretty crappy human and a terrible off-field leader. Has been since day one.

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    You mean the entitled jerk is till an entitled jerk - he just got better at faking it? Weird, who would’ve thunk it?

    Ben R is a HOF QB but a pretty crappy human and a terrible off-field leader. Has been since day one.
    So you know him personally? It's so refreshing to get an opinion from someone who really knows Ben from first hand experience. It sure shoots the opinions of posers like Jerome Bettis, Brett Keisel, Maurkice Pouncey, and Merril Hoge down the drain.



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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    You mean the entitled jerk is till an entitled jerk - he just got better at faking it? Weird, who would’ve thunk it?

    Ben R is a HOF QB but a pretty crappy human and a terrible off-field leader. Has been since day one.
    That's an ignorant leap. Yeah we get it. Ben had some early career off the field issues. And granted he sticks his foot in his mouth a few times every season with his comments. But to call him a crappy human being! I call bullshit! Did he not give you an autograph when you interrupted his dinner? Or not tip your bartender friend what he thought he was due? ( I can make leaps too)

    Bottom line from what I gather since he's completed his league mandated suspension his off the field behavior has been completely above board. He's seems to be a dedicated family man. True to his best friends. And a good father, son and husband. He's also fiercely loyal to the Steelers and the Rooneys. Has anyone ever seen any indication that he has any desire to not retire a Steeler?

    Yes he's got some diva- drama queen in him. But to call him a crappy human is bullshit! I lost a lot of respect for you for that comment.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    That's an ignorant leap. Yeah we get it. Ben had some early career off the field issues. And granted he sticks his foot in his mouth a few times every season with his comments. But to call him a crappy human being! I call bullshit! Did he not give you an autograph when you interrupted his dinner? Or not tip your bartender friend what he thought he was due? ( I can make leaps too)

    Bottom line from what I gather since he's completed his league mandated suspension his off the field behavior has been completely above board. He's seems to be a dedicated family man. True to his best friends. And a good father, son and husband. He's also fiercely loyal to the Steelers and the Rooneys. Has anyone ever seen any indication that he has any desire to not retire a Steeler?

    Yes he's got some diva- drama queen in him. But to call him a crappy human is bullshit! I lost a lot of respect for you for that comment.
    "Early career off the field issues" is one way to put it.

    Crappy human being might also be a good fit for what was reported

    https://www.si.com/vault/2010/05/10/...roethlisberger

    But glad he has not been accused of sexual assault or had to pay any civil settlements for any conduct since 2010

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Remember when Ben made AB drive 100 mph down McKnight road? A road I wouldn't drive 60 on at 3 a.m on Christmas morn.

    Remember when Ben made AB throw furniture off a 14th floor balcony in a fit of rage? Possibly putting a toddler in jeopardy.

    Remember Ben making AB pout after finally beating the Patriots because his personal stat line was underwhelming? Find me one instance of Ben not being delighted after a win no matter what his final stats were.

    Remember when Ben told AB to have a self aggrandizing press conference with his kids after the Chargers loss? Just as happy as he could be. Team lost but his numbers were great. So what the hell?

    Hmm here's what I'm thinking. AB has become a complete ass on and off the field. 5 kids, 4 baby momma's. But Ben who's never had a child out of wedlock is the creep right?

    I think I might be done with this board again.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    "Early career off the field issues" is one way to put it.

    Crappy human being might also be a good fit for what was reported

    https://www.si.com/vault/2010/05/10/...roethlisberger



    But glad he has not been accused of sexual assault or had to pay any civil settlements for any conduct since 2010
    Never been arrested, let alone convicted. I read the entire GBI report ( did you?) I not only believe he's entitled to a presumption of innocence I'm also convinced he never committed a crime. Whether he paid off his accusers has nothing to do with it. The situation the second allegation put him on forced his hand in order for him to get back on the field. Perhaps one day I'll explain the case to you where any moron could understand regretted sex after the fact is not the same as non consensual sex?
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    Remember when Ben made AB drive 100 mph down McKnight road? A road I wouldn't drive 60 on at 3 a.m on Christmas morn.

    Remember when Ben made AB throw furniture off a 14th floor balcony in a fit of rage? Possibly putting a toddler in jeopardy.

    Remember Ben making AB pout after finally beating the Patriots because his personal stat line was underwhelming? Find me one instance of Ben not being delighted after a win no matter what his final stats were.

    Remember when Ben told AB to have a self aggrandizing press conference with his kids after the Chargers loss? Just as happy as he could be. Team lost but his numbers were great. So what the hell?

    Hmm here's what I'm thinking. AB has become a complete ass on and off the field. 5 kids, 4 baby momma's. But Ben who's never had a child out of wedlock is the creep right?

    I think I might be done with this board again.
    Consider the possibility they are both jackasses and it is not matter of having to join Team Ben or Team AB.

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Hmmmmm.. ok. I'll bite. Everybody knows the first accusation was a set up. He actually had a counter suit filed against her. Then she got a scumbag lawyer that told her if she was patient and waited long enough, he would pay her to go away to protect his family, present and future. Case #2: Accusers bestie was kicked out of the bar because she called Ben a rapist based on the first false accusation because she was lazy and only read the clickbait headlines. Then the shitfaced accuser was dragged to the ER by her bestie where a rape kit could not confirm a rape took place. Both the little darlings story changed as they sobered up ( I actually read the entire police report in chronological order at one time, not cherry picked for clickbait).

    Pan to the DA, who was running for reelection and realized the big fish had slipped the hook. He grandstands to ruin Ben's career, which it nearly did. The accuser refused to press charges (on the advice of her perceptive lawyer) because there was no evidence of a crime. A carefully worded statement was written by her lawyer so his client would not be accused of filing a false police report. Ben paid in spades for being guilty of putting himself in bad situations. And certainly not a good look for the face of a storied NFL franchise. Apparently, Mr. Rooney had faith in him. Moral of the story....the 2nd accusation probably never happens without the first one....which was a setup by a headcase. He should have never have put himself in the position to begin with. Oh....the stupidity of youth.

    Secondly....from what I've heard about Ben's wife's family, there's no way they would have given their blessing for their daughter to associate with a "crappy human being" and a rapist or sexual assaulter let alone marry and have beautiful children with him.

    But don't let a few facts get in the way of a good smear campaign. He was a young, entitled jerk at one time....but I've know a few of those and that doesn't make them guilty of sexual crimes. Ben was guilty of letting himself be put into those situations, paid the price, did his due diligence above and beyond (with the help of loving family and friends) and has remained loyal and grateful to the Rooney family every since. And has played some pretty good football for them to boot.
    Last edited by stillers4me; 01-13-2019 at 02:09 PM.



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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    Consider the possibility they are both jackasses and it is not matter of having to join Team Ben or Team AB.

    I honestly don't think Ben is a jack ass. How's that? He's been one in the past, no doubt ( and that has little to do with the allegations made against him in the past) Overall I think he's become a good man. I think his K9 charity points towards that. I don't have to hate a guy because he is too honest on his radio show sometimes.

    But go ahead feel free to do so yourself.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by stillers4me View Post
    Hmmmmm.. ok. O'll bite. Everybody knows the first accusation was a set up. Then she got a scumbag lawyer that told her if she was patient and waited long enough, he would pay her to go away to protect his family, present and future. Case #2: Accusers bestie was kicked out of the bar because she called Ben a rapist based on the first false accusation because she was lazy and only read the clickbait headlines. Then the shitfaced accuser was dragged to the ER by her bestie where a rape kit could not confirm a rape took place. Both the little darlings story changed as the sobered up( I actually read the entire report in chronological order at one time, not cherry picked for clickbait).

    Pan to the DA, who was running for reelection and realized the big fish had slipped the hook. He grandstands to ruin Ben's career, which it nearly did. The accuser refused to press charges (on the advice of her perceptive lawyer) because there was no evidence of a crime. A carefully worded statement was written by her lawyer so his client would not be accused of filing a false police report. Ben paid in spades for being guilty of putting himself in bad situations. Moral of the story....the 2nd accusation probably never happens without the first one....which was a setup by a headcase. He should have never have put himself in the position to begin with. Oh....the stupidity of youth.

    Secondly....from what I've heard about Ben's wife's family, there's no way they would have given their blessing for their daughter to associate with a"crappy human being" and a rapist or sexual assaulter let alone marry and have beautiful children with him.

    But don't let a few facts get in the way of a good smear campaign. He was a young, entitled jerk at one time....but I've know a lot of those and that doesn't make them guilty of crimes. He was guilty of letting himself be put into those situations, paid the price, did his due diligence above and beyond and has remained loyal and grateful to the Rooney family every since. And has played some pretty good football to boot.
    Thank you! Thank you, thank you! Put it perfectly! As you say anyone who bothered to read the complete report of the GBI would come away convinced no crime was committed.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    Consider the possibility they are both jackasses and it is not matter of having to join Team Ben or Team AB.
    Ben has done far more for the Steelers than AB ever has. Or ever will.



  12. #42
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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by stillers4me View Post
    Hmmmmm.. ok. I'll bite. Everybody knows the first accusation was a set up. He actually had a counter suit filed against her. Then she got a scumbag lawyer that told her if she was patient and waited long enough, he would pay her to go away to protect his family, present and future. Case #2: Accusers bestie was kicked out of the bar because she called Ben a rapist based on the first false accusation because she was lazy and only read the clickbait headlines. Then the shitfaced accuser was dragged to the ER by her bestie where a rape kit could not confirm a rape took place. Both the little darlings story changed as the sobered up ( I actually read the entire police report in chronological order at one time, not cherry picked for clickbait).

    Pan to the DA, who was running for reelection and realized the big fish had slipped the hook. He grandstands to ruin Ben's career, which it nearly did. The accuser refused to press charges (on the advice of her perceptive lawyer) because there was no evidence of a crime. A carefully worded statement was written by her lawyer so his client would not be accused of filing a false police report. Ben paid in spades for being guilty of putting himself in bad situations. And certainly not a good look for the face of a storied NFL franchise. Apparently, Mr. Rooney had faith in him. Moral of the story....the 2nd accusation probably never happens without the first one....which was a setup by a headcase. He should have never have put himself in the position to begin with. Oh....the stupidity of youth.

    Secondly....from what I've heard about Ben's wife's family, there's no way they would have given their blessing for their daughter to associate with a"crappy human being" and a rapist or sexual assaulter let alone marry and have beautiful children with him.

    But don't let a few facts get in the way of a good smear campaign. He was a young, entitled jerk at one time....but I've know a few of those and that doesn't make them guilty of sexual crimes. Ben was guilty of letting himself be put into those situations, paid the price, did his due diligence above and beyond (with the help of loving family and friends) and has remained loyal and grateful to the Rooney family every since. And has played some pretty good football for them to boot.
    Excellent post. This is the way I see it as well.

    "Zeds dead baby, Zeds dead." - Butch

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    Never been arrested, let alone convicted. I read the entire GBI report ( did you?) I not only believe he's entitled to a presumption of innocence I'm also convinced he never committed a crime. Whether he paid off his accusers has nothing to do with it. The situation the second allegation put him on forced his hand in order for him to get back on the field. Perhaps one day I'll explain the case to you where any moron could understand regretted sex after the fact is not the same as non consensual sex?
    Yeah I did. I also know Lee Parks, the attorney who the family of the young woman retained, specializes in plaintiff's work in areas including sexual harassment (in addition to posting on this board I practiced law in Atlanta and had cases against Lee Parks in addition to Ben's very fine criminal defense attorneys Ed Garland and Don Samuel).

    Not being indicted and convicted becuase conduct cannot be proven beyond a reasonable doubt is not innocence (at least that was how it worked when I was a prosecutor). If you think there was no significant civil settlement paid to the young woman who was with Ben in the Milledgeville bathroom, that there was no merit to the allegations that resulted in a civil settlement but that the payment was made as a gesture of goodwill to simply to put the unfortunate matter behind everyone, and that there was no relationship between a civil settlement being reached and the young woman deciding to no longer cooperate with the prosecutors I have some news about Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny that may disturb you.

    You can lecture me to your heart's content about what the Steelers are doing correctly or incorrectly and very well may be right. I am just a fan with a fan's uneducated perspective.

    But as for "perhaps one day I'll explain the case to you where any moron could understand regretted sex after the fact is not the same as non consensual sex?" Spare me the condescension when as far as I know you have no particular expertise in the subject matter.

    And if you are fine with an adult in his late 20s taking a drunk college girl into a bathroom for at least oral sex good for you.

    FWIW you are not the only one who may be ready for break from here.

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Civil suits have different criteria than criminal charges. There was no basis for criminal charges in Georgia or they would have been brought. But any lawyer is going to persuade their client that they can get a big payout by filing a civil suit against a high profile celebrity or athlete, justified or not. Do you honestly think that the average Joe would have had to make the same kind of payoff in lieu of a civil suit? Certainly not ones who had not signed a 100 million dollar contract.

    So Ben paid her off to make her go away, just like he did the first. Not surprising, since he was engaged and wanted to protect her and his family from something that would get very ugly when he fought back. Turn the page, new chapter.

    No one here is saying he wasn't guilty of bad judgement at the time. And have said so repeatedly. Not everybody goes through life without mistakes and regrets.



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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    Remember when Ben made AB drive 100 mph down McKnight road? A road I wouldn't drive 60 on at 3 a.m on Christmas morn.

    Remember when Ben made AB throw furniture off a 14th floor balcony in a fit of rage? Possibly putting a toddler in jeopardy.

    Remember Ben making AB pout after finally beating the Patriots because his personal stat line was underwhelming? Find me one instance of Ben not being delighted after a win no matter what his final stats were.

    Remember when Ben told AB to have a self aggrandizing press conference with his kids after the Chargers loss? Just as happy as he could be. Team lost but his numbers were great. So what the hell?

    Hmm here's what I'm thinking. AB has become a complete ass on and off the field. 5 kids, 4 baby momma's. But Ben who's never had a child out of wedlock is the creep right?
    I'm pretty sure Ben didn't make AB do any of that so it has to have been Mike Tomlin....cue the Tomlin haters!



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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Amazing how many people are willing to overlook repeated accusations of nonconsensual sex because an individual is married now and chooses to put the word "God" into about every sentence out of his mouth. But can't overlook any of the behavior of the unmarried guy with multiple kids by multiple women.

    They are both HOF caliber football players. They are both egotistical and entitled. They are both totally constructed public personas designed in a PR lab somewhere. Both are poor off-field leaders. I strongly believe both are not individuals worthy of much respect or admiration as human beings.

    I can think all that and it doesnt matter to me. I don't care what these guys do off the field. Stay out of jail, relatively sober, and show up and ball out for 60 minutes once a week.

    I can't wait to root for both on Sundays in 2019 as they headline one of the best offenses the Steelers have ever fielded.

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    AB will be traded to Denver and take Sanders Job. I could see this happening, Elway knows KC is for real.

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    There is nothing wrong with grown men being who they are. However, the door swings both ways. Ben and AB are free to be and do whatever they want. However, they are not entitled to fans liking them. I could care less about either of them and what they do. They just play for the team I root for and once they're gone, I won't give them a second thought.

    No one can deny anymore that Ben is a piss-poor leader and a underachiever, but to call him a garbage human being is pushing it a little. He's just a guy.

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by Edman View Post
    There is nothing wrong with grown men being who they are. However, the door swings both ways. Ben and AB are free to be and do whatever they want. However, they are not entitled to fans liking them. I could care less about either of them and what they do. They just play for the team I root for and once they're gone, I won't give them a second thought.

    No one can deny anymore that Ben is a piss-poor leader and a underachiever, but to call him a garbage human being is pushing it a little. He's just a guy.
    He may be just a guy. But he strikes me as the kinda guy that puts on a persona of being a family man and all that goes with that. Then as soon as he gets out of the house it's all about strippers, blow, and cheap whiskey.

    I don't know a thing about who the true Ben Roethlisberger is or is not. But I do know plenty of people who were accussed both formally and informally of improper sexy time stuff. Not a single one was a good person. I also know plenty of good upstanding guys. Not a single one of them has been accussed of non consensual sex. So I just call it as I see it. Doesnt mean I'm right and it doesn't mean anyone has to agree.

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    Yeah I did. I also know Lee Parks, the attorney who the family of the young woman retained, specializes in plaintiff's work in areas including sexual harassment (in addition to posting on this board I practiced law in Atlanta and had cases against Lee Parks in addition to Ben's very fine criminal defense attorneys Ed Garland and Don Samuel).

    Not being indicted and convicted becuase conduct cannot be proven beyond a reasonable doubt is not innocence (at least that was how it worked when I was a prosecutor). If you think there was no significant civil settlement paid to the young woman who was with Ben in the Milledgeville bathroom, that there was no merit to the allegations that resulted in a civil settlement but that the payment was made as a gesture of goodwill to simply to put the unfortunate matter behind everyone, and that there was no relationship between a civil settlement being reached and the young woman deciding to no longer cooperate with the prosecutors I have some news about Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny that may disturb you.

    You can lecture me to your heart's content about what the Steelers are doing correctly or incorrectly and very well may be right. I am just a fan with a fan's uneducated perspective.

    But as for "perhaps one day I'll explain the case to you where any moron could understand regretted sex after the fact is not the same as non consensual sex?" Spare me the condescension when as far as I know you have no particular expertise in the subject matter.

    And if you are fine with an adult in his late 20s taking a drunk college girl into a bathroom for at least oral sex good for you.

    FWIW you are not the only one who may be ready for break from here.
    A couple things. Assuming there was a settlement, who's side reached out to who? If it was Ben's side that's witness tampering and they still have every right and more grounds to file a civil suite down the road. So that one's obvious. As far as her allegations. I guess you missed the part where the first officer called into it says that the friends were driving the charges? That the eventual accuser giggled and said "whatever ya'll" as her friends made the case she was raped.

    There also a good story from a woman college counselor( I'll look up later) in which she goes on to state that sorority girls often slut shame their sisters into making false sexual assault claims. Rather than admit to regretted sex they follow along and make a false claim to appease their friends.

    Also when the alleged incident occurred Ben was single, unattached, and in his late 20's. A man in his late 20's having a relationship with a 20 year girl doesn't bother me in the slightest! It turns my stomach when a 40 or 50 something married man has an affair with a girl that young. But a guy in his late 20's isn't that much more mature than a lady that's 20. So no that's no big deal.

    And while I understand uncharged nor convicted doesn't prove innocence. But it certainly demands a presumption of such the way I read the law.

    I think the second charge never comes about if the first completely specious claim hadn't been made.

    Lastly leopards don't change their spots. The chance that a multiple rape offender would just pack it up and stop sexually offending woman doesn't go with established norms. Until there comes additional allegations or evidence I really don''t see where giving the man a presumption of innocence isn't the right thing to do, Steelers player or not. As you prosecutors like to say you can get a grand jury to indict a ham sandwich. An uncooperative witness is far from a roadblock to a simple indictment. But none was made. As the prosecutor said when he explained the lack of charges or indictment. We prosecute crimes not bad morals.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    He may be just a guy. But he strikes me as the kinda guy that puts on a persona of being a family man and all that goes with that. Then as soon as he gets out of the house it's all about strippers, blow, and cheap whiskey.

    I don't know a thing about who the true Ben Roethlisberger is or is not. But I do know plenty of people who were accussed both formally and informally of improper sexy time stuff. Not a single one was a good person. I also know plenty of good upstanding guys. Not a single one of them has been accussed of non consensual sex. So I just call it as I see it. Doesnt mean I'm right and it doesn't mean anyone has to agree.
    So you think Ben's going into strip clubs still? Lmao! Guess you've never heard of TMZ sports? Or that everyone has cell phone camera's that go into said clubs? Jeez. If Ben goes out and conducts himself poorly in a public setting that shit's going viral ten seconds later.

    Geezus the hate is strong with this one.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

  22. #52
    Senior Member Array title="Mojouw has a reputation beyond repute"> Mojouw's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    So you think Ben's going into strip clubs still? Lmao! Guess you've never heard of TMZ sports? Or that everyone has cell phone camera's that go into said clubs? Jeez. If Ben goes out and conducts himself poorly in a public setting that shit's going viral ten seconds later.

    Geezus the hate is strong with this one.
    You've missed my point at multiple levels. But I'll confine it to this.

    I don't hate any of these guys. I very little emotional connection to the players one way or the other. Mostly restricted to how they do or don't play the game.

    I think Ben R is one of the greatest QBs I've ever seen play the game. I think during the game he commands respect and admiration from his teammates. They believe Ben can do anything and comeback to win in any situation.

    Off the field I think he is a jerk and a person of low intelligence and poor character.

  23. #53
    Senior Member Array title="pczach has a reputation beyond repute"> pczach's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Ben had his indiscretions all under the undisputed "tremendous leadership" of all those great Steelers leaders everyone keeps talking about. He cleaned up some things in his life and has become a better person and a family man from all accounts and is a good father to his children and a positive figure in their lives. Yet somehow Antonio Brown's indiscretions are the result of Ben's bad leadership and it is Ben that has created the environment as AB's life appears to be circling the bowl and his behavior continues to get more and more concerning?

    People keep saying Ben had great leadership in that locker room. He did stupid things.....and people say that was Ben's fault. Only Bill Cowher, the front office, and ownership could discipline him. He figured it out and put his life in order after much of that leadership was gone.

    People keep saying Antonio Brown has bad leadership in that locker room. He did stupid things....and people say that is also Ben's fault. Only Mike Tomlin, the front office, and ownership could discipline him. Antonio Brown isn't figuring it out, and shows no sign of that happening any time soon.

    In their hearts, everyone knows all of that is true, yet many conclude that this is Ben's fault for one reason or another.

    AB is responsible for his own behavior, and shame on the people that didn't do something to discipline him earlier.

    Intellectual honesty and personal responsibility are being ignored by far too many on this specific issue.

    If some people here would take a step back and really remove personal feelings about each player and listen to their own words and conclusions on the subject, maybe they would place blame where it really belongs.

  24. #54
    Senior Member Array title="Mojouw has a reputation beyond repute"> Mojouw's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by pczach View Post
    Ben had his indiscretions all under the undisputed "tremendous leadership" of all those great Steelers leaders everyone keeps talking about. He cleaned up some things in his life and has become a better person and a family man from all accounts and is a good father to his children and a positive figure in their lives. Yet somehow Antonio Brown's indiscretions are the result of Ben's bad leadership and it is Ben that has created the environment as AB's life appears to be circling the bowl and his behavior continues to get more and more concerning?

    People keep saying Ben had great leadership in that locker room. He did stupid things.....and people say that was Ben's fault. Only Bill Cowher, the front office, and ownership could discipline him. He figured it out and put his life in order after much of that leadership was gone.

    People keep saying Antonio Brown has bad leadership in that locker room. He did stupid things....and people say that is also Ben's fault. Only Mike Tomlin, the front office, and ownership could discipline him. Antonio Brown isn't figuring it out, and shows no sign of that happening any time soon.

    In their hearts, everyone knows all of that is true, yet many conclude that this is Ben's fault for one reason or another.

    AB is responsible for his own behavior, and shame on the people that didn't do something to discipline him earlier.

    Intellectual honesty and personal responsibility are being ignored by far too many on this specific issue.

    If some people here would take a step back and really remove personal feelings about each player and listen to their own words and conclusions on the subject, maybe they would place blame where it really belongs.
    I should clarify. For me, and only speaking for myself - I do not blame anything AB has or hasn't done on Ben. Just as I don't blame or credit anything Ben has done to anyone else. Related, I do not believe that just because a player has poor impulse control, is not a leader off the field, and is more than a bit of jerk, doesn't mean they can not be a prominent member of a successful franchise.

  25. #55
    Senior Member Array title="EzraTank has a reputation beyond repute"> EzraTank's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by Born2Steel View Post
    A reference to something sanders said.
    And he's right from the Ben reference. Manning would have never said that stuff about Brown in public.

  26. #56
    Senior Member Array title="Born2Steel has a reputation beyond repute"> Born2Steel's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra Tank View Post
    And he's right from the Ben reference. Manning would have never said that stuff about Brown in public.
    Probably true.

  27. #57
    Senior Member Array title="Mojouw has a reputation beyond repute"> Mojouw's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by Shoes View Post
    AB will be traded to Denver and take Sanders Job. I could see this happening, Elway knows KC is for real.
    Maybe Sanders comes here then?

  28. #58
    Senior Member Array title="lipps83 has a reputation beyond repute"> lipps83's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    Lastly leopards don't change their spots. The chance that a multiple rape offender would just pack it up and stop sexually offending woman doesn't go with established norms.
    They do when there is literally tens of millions of dollars at stake.

    Ben has a lot more to lose than the average sex offender.

  29. #59
    Administrator Array title="fansince'76 has a reputation beyond repute"> fansince'76's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra Tank View Post
    And he's right from the Ben reference. Manning would have never said that stuff about Brown in public.
    Huh? Manning made a career of throwing his teammates under the bus.

  30. #60
    Senior Member Array title="teegre has a reputation beyond repute"> teegre's Avatar

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    Re: Emmanuel Sanders Puts Blame On Brown And Tomlin; Believes AB Will Be Traded

    Things I trust Ben to do:
    -play QB

    Things I do not trust Ben to do:
    -speak
    -ride motorcycles
    -chaperone college co-ed events

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