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Thread: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

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    NFL's Dirtiest Player Array title="86WARD has a reputation beyond repute"> 86WARD's Avatar

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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    All those Game Plans were great and what ever process they used to develop those, should be used on a weekly basis. The other weeks though...




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    The voice of reason Array title="GoSlash27 has a reputation beyond repute"> GoSlash27's Avatar

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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    Quote Originally Posted by 86WARD View Post
    All those Game Plans were great and what ever process they used to develop those, should be used on a weekly basis. The other weeks though...
    I think that's what they're trying to do; create a defense that is so flexible that it doesn't have an identity. They can just 'morph' into a defense that is tailored to defeat whatever opponent they're facing that week.

    It worked a few times this season, failed miserably other times. Whoever is responsible for it should be given the credit and the blame. I'm just curious who you folks believe that person is.
    "You've heard people brag about 'being in the zone'. They don't know what the Hell being in the zone is about. I played in the NFL for 15 years and I was only in the zone that one time." - "Mean" Joe Greene on the 1974 playoff victory over Oakland

  3. #33
    Well there you have it... Array title="NCSteeler has much to be proud of"> NCSteeler's Avatar

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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    Quote Originally Posted by GoSlash27 View Post
    Bump? I never got an answer to this.
    Who the hell knows. Do you have insight as to who is building each game plan? Hey even a blind squirrel can find a nut every once in a while.

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  4. #34
    Well there you have it... Array title="NCSteeler has much to be proud of"> NCSteeler's Avatar

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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    Quote Originally Posted by Born2Steel View Post
    Are you serious? You expect people on this forum to give credit to our coaches? If you read the posts in most of the threads the Steelers ONLY win win the players take it upon themselves to win in spite of the coaching. And that is ONLY when the players are not being selfish divas and me first millennials. There is simply no way a team of this culture could possibly put together a winning gameplan. So no, you will receive no honest or well thought out answers, only snarky responses. Welcome to the new Steelers Universe.
    IDK lots of folks say we shouldn't guess or comment on something we don't know. I can't imagine anyone on this board has any idea who is building the game plans each week but I would suspect a big part of the Carolina game was typical road team play on a Thursday, and a small notice to the fact that the mighty Panthers went on a horrendous slide because Newton played hurt

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  5. #35
    The voice of reason Array title="GoSlash27 has a reputation beyond repute"> GoSlash27's Avatar

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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    Quote Originally Posted by NCSteeler View Post
    IDK lots of folks say we shouldn't guess or comment on something we don't know. I can't imagine anyone on this board has any idea who is building the game plans each week but I would suspect a big part of the Carolina game was typical road team play on a Thursday, and a small notice to the fact that the mighty Panthers went on a horrendous slide because Newton played hurt

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    No, that wasn't the case at all. The defensive scheme against Carolina was deliberate, and a radical departure from preceding and subsequent Steelers defenses. The Panthers were using 3 running threats to keep defenses in a reactive scheme, and it was working up until the Steelers game.
    The Steelers *intentionally* over- committed on Newton personally, largely ignoring the other threats even when it burned them. The strategy was brilliant and simple: If Newton presented himself as a possible running threat, nail him... even if you're not sure he has the ball. Rinse and repeat as necessary until the Panthers get the hint and are forced to protect him. Once that happens, the Panthers are forced into a conventional scheme where Newton isn't so hot.

    This isn't a mode that the Steelers operated in before (or after) this one specific game. Likewise the other games mentioned upstream. The Steelers defense "morphed" to control the opposing offense, showing schemes that weren't on film and couldn't be planned for.

    Somebody somewhere was saying "here is how we beat these effers" and then spent the week practicing a defense that wasn't in the play book. I don't know if that "somebody" was Tomlin or Butler, but whoever it was deserves credit for the successes as well as blame for the failures.
    "You've heard people brag about 'being in the zone'. They don't know what the Hell being in the zone is about. I played in the NFL for 15 years and I was only in the zone that one time." - "Mean" Joe Greene on the 1974 playoff victory over Oakland

  6. #36
    Senior Member Array title="Shoes has a reputation beyond repute"> Shoes's Avatar

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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    Quote Originally Posted by GoSlash27 View Post
    I think that's what they're trying to do; create a defense that is so flexible that it doesn't have an identity. They can just 'morph' into a defense that is tailored to defeat whatever opponent they're facing that week.

    It worked a few times this season, failed miserably other times. Whoever is responsible for it should be given the credit and the blame. I'm just curious who you folks believe that person is.



    That's just it, no one knows because both Tomlin & Butler are involved and they haven't said who is doing what.
    "The first principle is that you must not fool yourself--and you are
    the easiest person to fool."

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    The voice of reason Array title="GoSlash27 has a reputation beyond repute"> GoSlash27's Avatar

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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    Quote Originally Posted by Shoes View Post
    [/B]

    That's just it, no one knows because both Tomlin & Butler are involved and they haven't said who is doing what.
    But are they though? Is Tomlin involved in the strategic planning of defensive schemes and coaching players in their execution? I haven't read anything suggesting that.
    "You've heard people brag about 'being in the zone'. They don't know what the Hell being in the zone is about. I played in the NFL for 15 years and I was only in the zone that one time." - "Mean" Joe Greene on the 1974 playoff victory over Oakland

  8. #38
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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    Quote Originally Posted by GoSlash27 View Post
    But are they though? Is Tomlin involved in the strategic planning of defensive schemes and coaching players in their execution? I haven't read anything suggesting that.
    From what I've read Butler is involved with the game planning and does some play calling but Tomlin can and does overrule him in critical situations. This could be the problem with the defense. There are other questions also like is someone else involved in the game planing with Butler? What plays does Tomlin call? And why would you overrule your DC unless you didn't have complete trust in him? And why would you keep him as DC?
    "The first principle is that you must not fool yourself--and you are
    the easiest person to fool."

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  9. #39
    NFL's Dirtiest Player Array title="86WARD has a reputation beyond repute"> 86WARD's Avatar

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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    Quote Originally Posted by GoSlash27 View Post
    But are they though? Is Tomlin involved in the strategic planning of defensive schemes and coaching players in their execution? I haven't read anything suggesting that.
    Iím still convinced that they donít always scheme for a specific team.




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    One bad JuJu Array title="43Hitman has a reputation beyond repute"> 43Hitman's Avatar
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    Re: Looking like Butler may be here to stay :(

    Quote Originally Posted by 86WARD View Post
    Iím still convinced that they donít always scheme for a specific team.
    I think they scheme specifically for teams they deem a threat, which on its face sounds absurd, but then you look at their track record and it makes perfect sense. Which points to arrogance. And we've all seen this team in the last five years go out of their way to be arrogant. It shows on the field and in interviews with players and coaches. I don't know who the problem resides with as I have no knowledge of the internal workings of the Steelers, but the buck should stop at Tomlin and ultimately with Rooney. The fact, in my opinion, that they don't scheme specifically for EVERY team is just ridiculous and is simply not to the standard we expect, especially when we were told by this coaching staff that they would do just that. I really thought that this shit show would be flushed with the season, but it appears to me that there is a plugged pipe somewhere and now all the shit is backing up on the floor. Someone hand Tomlin a mop.






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