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Thread: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    LeBron James has no say in coach and GM hires says Cleveland Cavaliers owner

    Cleveland Cavaliers owner Dan Gilbert said superstar free agent LeBron James will not be consulted during the team's search for a new coach.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...060805012.html

    *gasp* what a slap in the face of the best player in history, hometown hero, super-duper-star.

    does anyone really believe this? "bu..bu..bu..the owner said it so it must be true".

    this can only mean one of two things. either the owner is blowing smoke, or they could care less about what james thinks.

    wexell.

    check.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by tony hipchest View Post
    LeBron James has no say in coach and GM hires says Cleveland Cavaliers owner

    Cleveland Cavaliers owner Dan Gilbert said superstar free agent LeBron James will not be consulted during the team's search for a new coach.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...060805012.html

    *gasp* what a slap in the face of the best player in history, hometown hero, super-duper-star.

    does anyone really believe this? "bu..bu..bu..the owner said it so it must be true".

    this can only mean one of two things. either the owner is blowing smoke, or they could care less about what james thinks.

    wexell.

    check.

    I think as great as LBJ is, Dan Gilbert, or any person with that kind of money, is not going to be told what to do with their investment by a person in LBJ's position. LBJ is great and a worldwide icon, but Dan Gilbert is in another echelon of rich. People like that don't go around asking for business advice from people like LBJ. Just not happening. Now are there some discussions about what LBJ would like to see happen, i.e. what kind of help does he expect? Sure. But to say that LBJ has any impact on what coach gets hired is ludicrous. Even if LBJ leaves Cleveland and the Cavs go under, Gilbert will have made his money on this investment.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelersinCA View Post
    I think as great as LBJ is, Dan Gilbert, or any person with that kind of money, is not going to be told what to do with their investment by a person in LBJ's position. LBJ is great and a worldwide icon, but Dan Gilbert is in another echelon of rich. People like that don't go around asking for business advice from people like LBJ. Just not happening. Now are there some discussions about what LBJ would like to see happen, i.e. what kind of help does he expect? Sure. But to say that LBJ has any impact on what coach gets hired is ludicrous. Even if LBJ leaves Cleveland and the Cavs go under, Gilbert will have made his money on this investment.
    Agreed.

    There is some similar talk here in Atlanta with Joe Johnson. I realize he isn't the caliber of a LBJ, but the thought of having a player influence these types of decisions, especially when he's not signed to the team (I know, LBJ is all but a lock... yada, yada) seems a bit outlandish. Sure, ask their opinion, but don't give him the power to choose when he's not a definite to be there himself. Because you could be left with a coach that wasn't necessarily at the top of your list, and the player walks anyway.

  4. #34
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Taking the high road here...

    As I stated, Mike Brown is being given serious consideration for the NY job. Even if he's not, he WILL be considered and almost certainly hired by one of the teams currently shopping for a coach. That is one team that is a stone cold, iron clad 100% LOCK to not retain the services of Lebron James.

    If the Cavs are taking the Spurs route (which they did to re-sign Tim Duncan) of simply trying to make the organization as strong as possible without the input of the player in question, that's fine. There have also been rumors flying that James has had NO contact at all with the Cavs since the end of the season, which would support that. But I think the proof is in the pudding: Mike Brown was fired in spite of having the best record two years in a row with James approval. Does anyone SERIOUSLY think for a moment that if LBJ went to Gilbert and said "Brown is solid, please keep him" he'd have been fired?

    James has a hand in this decision...probably a big one. Gilbert is simply responding and defending against the scuttlebutt that's he's somehow lost control over his organization, which he hasn't. But, if Gilbert ignores James thoughts and input in regards to who his new coach will be, then the Cavs deserve for James to walk. It's not the tail wagging the dog, but you've got to prioritize pleasing the leagues best player.
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by suitanim View Post
    Does anyone SERIOUSLY think for a moment that if LBJ went to Gilbert and said "Brown is solid, please keep him" he'd have been fired?

    James has a hand in this decision...probably a big one.
    wrong.

    if ben has no influence on retaining arians, im sure the same goes for LeAdvisor.

    Speaking at a news conference, Gilbert strongly refuted theories that James has had input on previous hires, the firing of coach Mike Brown and general manager Danny Ferry's recent departure.
    "The concept that LeBron James has been involved in any way, shape or form with firing our head coach, involved in the transition to General Manager Chris Grant and will be involved in future coaching decisions and hires is totally, 100 percent and patently false," Gilbert said. "The truth is the truth.

    oh, and i totally agree about the cavs deserving for james to walk.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    I though there was some similarity.

    Mike Woodson did nothing but improve the team every year as far as wins , and getting to the playoffs, but that didn't save his job. Getting over the hump "IN" the playoffs was one the biggest reasons. Same as the cavs. Joe Johnson and Josh Smith were both at odds, and unreceptive to Woodson in the playoffs. Isn't that similar to what your saying about LBJ's relationship with his coach?

    All I meant was the coach always seems to take the hit in these situations, and it shouldn't be the same disgruntled players being asked how to fix it by influencing the next hire. Rick Sund is trying to squash the same ideas here.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Yeah, I think most of the Free Agency in the NBA is pretty much settled, but they are just waiting for the Finals to finish and then start the media frenzy as per league rules. I think Lebron is gonna stay.

    Not sure if Izzo make the jump to the NBA. He apparantly told a group of auto dealers that he wanted to stay at MSU instead of taking $4mil and going to Oregon.....but nothing was said about Cleveland.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    If you have a clash of egos, which could be the possibility in Shitland, Gilbert is going to win.

    http://www.forbes.com/lists/2006/54/...bert_LIVH.html
    http://www.celebritynetworth.com/ric...mes-net-worth/

    Gilbert is 10 times as rich as LBJ, take a minute, sit back and contemplate that. 10 times as rich. If you think Dan Gilbert the guy who went from $5000 from pizza money in college to worth 1.1 billion and rising is letting LBJ or any other monkey he pays to dance for him call the shots, you're crazy. There is a difference between feeling LBJ out, even though Gilbert says no way shape or form and letting him make decisions. Bottom line is, no way in the world someone of Gilbert's status gets bullied into making decisions by someone in LBJs position. Not happening.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Oh, the many, many ways are people wrong in this thread…shall we count the ways?

    First, Gilbert vs. LBJ wealth. Wrong and wrong. Conservatively, LBJ is worth about 200 mil (as I quoted earlier) just in endorsements. He had a 93 million dollar deal with Nike (which shoots the erroneous 90 million number right out of the water). He also has deals with Microsoft, Upper Deck, Coke, Allstate, et al…that Nike deal was recently re-upped, so it’s safe to assume that deal will be bigger than before.


    As for Gilbert, that data is 4 years old...and everyone in Cleveland knows that Gilbert has been off Forbes billionaires list for a couple years now. He writes home loans...in a depressed home buying market in a recession where the average home price has dropped by double digits.

    And here’s a link proving the braintrust wrong on James worth...

    http://www.usatoday.com/money/advert...ate-farm_N.htm


    James, a State Farm customer since 2004, also has deals with Nike (MKE), Coca-Cola (KO), Microsoft (MSFT), Upper Deck and others. Fortune Magazine estimated he has about $170 million in endorsements.


    Again, this is conservative because the terms of the new Nike deal are not disclosed...and this data is a couple years old, BEFORE he re-upped the old 7 years 93 million dollar deal with Nike. There are whispers that the new Nike deal itself is several hundred million dollars...

    And LOL at Gonzo...I posted the link on that one...asked and answered. Just to run salt in the braintrusts’ collective open wound, here’s a few links. First, the schedule of the show:

    http://www.cleveland.com/autoshow/in..._schedule.html

    Then the report FROM the show:
    http://blog.cleveland.com/sports/200...in_clevel.html

    …and a bonus link from the PPG.

    http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07175/796764-87.stm

    And why not pile on? Here’s Terry Pluto, Purlitzer prize nominated Cleveland sports writer and author of several books on Cleveland sports on the James/Gilbert situation.

    http://blog.cleveland.com/plutoblog_..._james/rss.xml

    Granted, there’s a lot of information here, and it’ll be tough for people who “know more” to listen to someone who actually has his pulse on the situation, but, well, there it all is…
    Fire Goodell

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    checkmate.



    Quote Originally Posted by suitanim View Post
    Oh, the many, many ways are people wrong in this thread…shall we count the ways?

    sure.


    Quote Originally Posted by suitanim View Post
    James has a hand in this decision...probably a big one. .
    WRONG! lmao. as for the rest of the gibberish and deflection/diversion and blogwriters and cowher speaking schedules, it doesnt hide that YOU ARE WRONG!

    jim wexell > some random clevelaaand "sports" hack who happens to have a blog.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Wexell is a fuckin' piker compared to Pluto...

    http://www.terrypluto.com/

    Triple fail, and bad even by the uber low standards of bad prevailing in your garbage posting, Bunker....

    I'll wait for the better elements (relative, of course) of the braintrust to reply...if they can. This is pretty much game set, and match...
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Maybe someone needs a lessons on pay vs net worth.

    'For an individual, the value of a person's assets, including cash, minus all liabilities. The amount by which the individual's assets exceed their liabilities is considered the net worth of that person.'

    Topping out at 190 mil in endorsements does not mean he is worth 190 mil.

    But the numbers gave is just a diversion from the truth. No one in Gilbert's position is getting told what to do by someone in LBJs.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelersinCA View Post
    Maybe someone needs a lessons on pay vs net worth.

    'For an individual, the value of a person's assets, including cash, minus all liabilities. The amount by which the individual's assets exceed their liabilities is considered the net worth of that person.'

    Topping out at 190 mil in endorsements does not mean he is worth 190 mil.

    But the numbers gave is just a diversion from the truth. No one in Gilbert's position is getting told what to do by someone in LBJs.
    Good point...in fact, James' worth is probably already approaching a billion, which is his goal (and I know what the numbers are...and how net worth versus gross worth is factored)...and this data is old, too...

    http://money.cnn.com/2007/11/28/news...une/index3.htm

    Other than that, nothing from either of you worth noting. Other than the usual telling me I'm wrong, whether I am or not...

    Oh, just as an aside, this article was "The Power 25" or the most powerful 25 people in business from Fortune magazine. Lebron was the only athlete featured. Dan Gilbert was nowhere to be seen.

    Ask 10 people on the street in the US who Dan Gilbert is, and 3 might know. Ask 10 about LBJ and nine will. Go to Brazil, or China, or South Africa and repeat the same. 1 out of ten for Gilbert, and probably 7 out of 10 for LBJ.

    I'm sorry you guys are biased and angry at me, but it does nothing to change the facts...James has a say in his next coach.
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by suitanim View Post
    Wexell is a fuckin' piker compared to Pluto...

    http://www.terrypluto.com/

    Triple fail, and bad even by the uber low standards of bad prevailing in your garbage posting, Bunker....

    I'll wait for the better elements (relative, of course) of the braintrust to reply...if they can. This is pretty much game set, and match...
    homer.

    you can take your link and flush it. i dont care about cleveland. i dont care about cleveland sports, and i most certainly dont care about some cleveland hack whos word you take as gospel. if he were so great he wouldnt be writing about the browns, indians, and cavs.

    even peter king was smart enough to get out of that shithole cincinnatti.

    what i do appreciate is the connundrum you are faced with and the stance that now has you painted in a corner.

    cavs owner > pluto piker

    oh and wexell still knows 1,000,000X more than you about the steelers and THAT is what ultimately matters the most on a steelers board.

    you were owned in this thread. time to move on to something new.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by suitanim View Post

    I'm sorry you guys are biased and angry at me, but it does nothing to change the facts...James has a say in his next coach.

    Speaking at a news conference, Gilbert strongly refuted theories that James has had input on previous hires, the firing of coach Mike Brown and general manager Danny Ferry's recent departure.
    "The concept that LeBron James has been involved in any way, shape or form with firing our head coach, involved in the transition to General Manager Chris Grant and will be involved in future coaching decisions and hires is totally, 100 percent and patently false," Gilbert said. "The truth is the truth.


    -the owner of the cleveland cavaliers

    run along now with your squeaky red nose, rainbow afro wig, and ovesized red honking shoes.

    be sure not to trip or you may make us laugh even more.


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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Yaaaaaaaaaawn....

    Any intelligent posts from the upper tier of the braintrust are welcomed. Any actual logical and factual disputing of the facts will be refreshing as well...I'm pretty much done with the third string...in fact, I feel a little low and dirty having responded to the dimmest and lowest at all....
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.


    "The concept that LeBron James has been involved in any way, shape or form with firing our head coach, involved in the transition to General Manager Chris Grant and will be involved in future coaching decisions and hires is totally, 100 percent and patently false," Gilbert said. "The truth is the truth.






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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by suitanim View Post
    Good point...in fact, James' worth is probably already approaching a billion, which is his goal (and I know what the numbers are...and how net worth versus gross worth is factored)...and this data is old, too...

    http://money.cnn.com/2007/11/28/news...une/index3.htm

    Other than that, nothing from either of you worth noting. Other than the usual telling me I'm wrong, whether I am or not...

    Oh, just as an aside, this article was "The Power 25" or the most powerful 25 people in business from Fortune magazine. Lebron was the only athlete featured. Dan Gilbert was nowhere to be seen.

    Ask 10 people on the street in the US who Dan Gilbert is, and 3 might know. Ask 10 about LBJ and nine will. Go to Brazil, or China, or South Africa and repeat the same. 1 out of ten for Gilbert, and probably 7 out of 10 for LBJ.

    I'm sorry you guys are biased and angry at me, but it does nothing to change the facts...James has a say in his next coach.
    This isn't a question of fame. Notoriety is not an issue at all. I guarantee if you look at the world's 50 most wealthy men, the average person on the street wont know 45 of them. I'm not sure what that proves when we are talking about who has the power. LBJ is the face of the organization, Gilbert is the money.

    That article says the road to 1 billion, not that he is even sniffing it yet. 190 mil is a far cry from 1 billion. Surely you can see that? I'm not biased or angry at you, maybe I just know that people with that kind of money don't listen to people who work for them when it comes to strategic decisions about their investments. I'm sure middle management loves to think the CEO listens to the suggestion box, but that doesn't make it so.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    I'm trying to be patient here...This was 3 years ago...
    http://money.cnn.com/2007/06/14/comm...sbiz/index.htm

    Beyond that qualification, Carter said James is very interested in putting his money to work for him, rather than just look to income from pay and endorsements to build his net worth.

    In March he announced that he had bought a stake of undisclosed size in privately-held, high-end bicycle maker Cannondale. Carter says James also has lower profile investments in a number of business start ups and in real estate.

    "It's impossible to get to a billion dollars by endorsement deals," said Carter. "The biggest deals only take you so far. It's how you make money when you're asleep that's going to get you there."


    Cavs James team...
    http://www.cleveland.com/livingston/...re_lebron.html

    Maybe half, maybe more of Gilbert's net worth IS the Cavs.
    http://www.forbes.com/lists/2007/32/...rs_324902.html

    LeBron alone boosts Cavs value by 100 million...
    http://blogs.forbes.com/sportsmoney/...iteglove_yahoo
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Hey, it appears that the Cavs have a "Brain Trust" too. Any of you guys in on that one??

    Although Izzo, Scott and Van Gundy are at the top of the Cavs' list, the team has a handful of other candidates on its radar as well, according to league sources.

    Some members of the Cavaliers' brain trust are not sold on Izzo and would prefer to consider candidates with NBA experience before settling on the Spartans' coach.

    "Whether LeBron stays or not is the million-dollar question, I'm sure, for Tom," said South Florida coach Stan Heath,
    http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=5268981

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson View Post
    Hey, it appears that the Cavs have a "Brain Trust" too. Any of you guys in on that one??

    Although Izzo, Scott and Van Gundy are at the top of the Cavs' list, the team has a handful of other candidates on its radar as well, according to league sources.

    Some members of the Cavaliers' brain trust are not sold on Izzo and would prefer to consider candidates with NBA experience before settling on the Spartans' coach.

    "Whether LeBron stays or not is the million-dollar question, I'm sure, for Tom," said South Florida coach Stan Heath,
    http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=5268981
    The thing I don't get is why would Lebron want an unproven college coach in Izzo or a proven loser of a coach at the NBA level in calipari? If that's the case, maybe Gilbert is right in not listening to him.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Dribble Drive Motion offense? Maybe LBJ likes the idea of no offensive plays...

    Also, Calipari had a little success with New Jersey...they made the playoffs one year. He was in the league at a bad time, and it wasn't a great time for the Nets either. Calipari makes infinitely more sense than Izzo, as he has a few years in the NBA and one year as Larry Brown's assistant. Izzo is 100% through and through a college coach....I never put much stock in this Izzo stuff anyway. i just think it's a red herring to divert attention away from other things the Cavs have cooking...
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by suitanim View Post
    Dribble Drive Motion offense? Maybe LBJ likes the idea of no offensive plays...

    Also, Calipari had a little success with New Jersey...they made the playoffs one year. He was in the league at a bad time, and it wasn't a great time for the Nets either. Calipari makes infinitely more sense than Izzo, as he has a few years in the NBA and one year as Larry Brown's assistant. Izzo is 100% through and through a college coach....I never put much stock in this Izzo stuff anyway. i just think it's a red herring to divert attention away from other things the Cavs have cooking...


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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Thank you for your in-depth analysis and invaluable contribution to the discussion.
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by suitanim View Post
    Dribble Drive Motion offense? Maybe LBJ likes the idea of no offensive plays...

    Also, Calipari had a little success with New Jersey...they made the playoffs one year. He was in the league at a bad time, and it wasn't a great time for the Nets either. Calipari makes infinitely more sense than Izzo, as he has a few years in the NBA and one year as Larry Brown's assistant. Izzo is 100% through and through a college coach....I never put much stock in this Izzo stuff anyway. i just think it's a red herring to divert attention away from other things the Cavs have cooking...
    Ok, but word is Izzo is taking the job. I mean this in all seriousness, if Izzo indeed is offered and accepts the job, do you still believe LBJ had input into that hiring? If so, why would he want Izzo?

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    I honestly have no idea. They know each other through Nike. The real word is that no one knows anything, other than Izzo is taking a close look. He said just last week (and emphatically, I might add) that he would not leave MSU until the won another championship. Gilbert is being secretive...BUT they have also talked with Byron Scott, and may have, in fact, even gone as far as interviewing him.

    There are more than a few reports floating around that Izzo is (wisely) waiting on James. I have to believe that James approval, and NOT FA decision, since they honestly cannot wait that long to hire a a coach. This sums it up nicely and has some info from someone close to Izzo...

    http://ncaabasketball.fanhouse.com/2...-lebron-james/
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    That's the rub, I can't see anyone taking the job without some sort of confirmation that LBJ is staying.

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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Which moves us BACK to square one...If they hire a coach prior to "Le Tour", it almost HAS to be with the tacit approval of LBJ...meaning he's staying.

    If they wait, it means the Cavs have no idea either way, and James probably has no say.

    It's complicated...who wants the job without LBJ? Probably any assistant in the league would take it, but no marquee coach is going to take the gig and then be baited and switched if and when James bails. So, James has a big say in this process one way or the other (directly or indirectly)...if they sign some no-name assistant, that action alone could prompt him to walk, and Gilbert will watch 1/5 to 1/4 of the worth of his team (which accounts for 1/2 or more of his total worth) evaporate in one day.

    I don't think LeBron is lording over Gilbert. But the owner most definitely has to be giving very careful and deliberate consideration as to how his actions over the next 2-3 weeks will impact the next 10 years of the franchise, both in net worth as well as ability to compete in the NBA. It's also important to note that one of the reasons that Ferry left was the fact that Gilbert wants to be more involved in the day-to-day, and maybe even play-by-play actions of the team. A guy that hands-on is certainly going to place very high priority on pleasing the heart and soul of his team.
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    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    I agree with your last paragraph, but a hands on owner is never good. I also agree James has a huge indirect say which is a far cry from direct input. I think Izzo is more a product of Gilbert's Michigan ties than any tie to LBJ.

  30. #60
    Klaatu barada nikto Array title="suitanim has a brilliant future"> suitanim's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    6,872

    Re: LeBron says Cavs have edge.

    Now the media is creating "a frayed relationship" between the Cavs and James.

    Guess the story, as is, isn't sexy enough already...
    Fire Goodell

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