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Thread: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: Hes Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by Craic View Post
    Santonio was also scratched from the roster for that game, and that was all Tomlin.
    That's a valid one.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Eli Rogers sat multiple games already this season. That was "discipline".

    Martavis Bryant was kept off the field for about half his rookie year until he demonstrated the practice habits and learning that the coaching staff demanded. Multiple defensive players over the years been in that boat as well.

    Harrison was re-inserted into the starting line-up when Jones was ineffective and blew assignments last season.

    Over the years, Tomlin has shuffled the deck on who starts and gets a gameday hat based on player conduct in practice and meeting rooms. That is a form of discipline.

    We know from early reports from vets like Hines Ward - Tomlin's use of the "News" in the film room to call players to the carpet for mental or assignment based breakdowns.

    Tomlin has removed players from the game plan during the course of the game for assignment issues (look at Conner last game. Missed a blitz pick-up and then was gone) or ball-security stuff.

    I mean he doesn't yell and scream on the sidelines. He doesn't throw his players to the wolves in front of the media like MacAdoo did this season with Eli. He doesn't rant and rave in post game pressers. But that doesn't mean there isn't disciplinary measures behind closed doors. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't. That's the whole "closed doors" thing.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Rogers doesn't fit the bill as a star player by any stretch. And Harrison no longer does. My contention is that the stars have no discipline or consequences for their misdeeds.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Rogers doesn't fit the bill as a star player by any stretch. And Harrison no longer does. My contention is that the stars have no discipline or consequences for their misdeeds.
    What team really disciplines "star" players? Even Bill Parcells once said something about great players having a different set of rules.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    What team really disciplines "star" players? Even Bill Parcells once said something about great players having a different set of rules.
    I'm not sure that's the case. When behavior stops I can draw a conclusion that there were consequences. AB keeps doing stupid stuff repeatedly. I don't always see repeated stuff from stars on all other teams. Bottom line isn't comparison anyway. Some of this stuff needs dealt with. Even former Steeler players are calling them out.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    I'm not sure that's the case. When behavior stops I can draw a conclusion that there were no consequences. AB keeps doing stupid stuff repeatedly. I don't always see repeated stuff from stars on all other teams. Bottom line isn't comparison anyway. Some of this stuff needs dealt with. Even former Steeler players are calling them out.
    Like Hines Ward? The dude who throw his Qb under the bus on national TV over concussions?

    Like Ryan Clark? A ferocious hitter who was known for playing under control and never displaying his emotions on the field?

    Puuuhhhhlllleeease. These dudes just like to hear themselves talk. Odell Beckahm went 3 rounds with stuff on the sidelines. Not a darn thing was done by the Giants (I might be remembering wrong).

    Like everything on the field that Jay Cutler has ever done. Two weeks ago he just stood there on a wildcat play and the Dolphins staff DEFENDED him!

    Like every star WR ever for a period of time in 1990s and early 2000's. Their continued antics were repeatedly put up with because they scored touchdowns and influenced defenses.

    Brady's twice a season totally yelling at some teammate on the sidelines. Phillip Rivers now weekly shows of disgust and anger at his teammates.

    This is off the top of my head. Bottom line, if you are big $$ NFL player or a QB - no one will say "boo" at anything you do.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Regardless, it's simply my opinion that Tomlin does not like personal confrontation. There is no evidence to the contrary. He's a good coach and I think it'll get turned around. But at this moment, they are grossly under performing. And Clark, Bettis, Hines, et al were great players for the Steelers so I don't dismiss them as easily as you do.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Regardless, it's simply my opinion that Tomlin does not like personal confrontation. There is no evidence to the contrary. He's a good coach and I think it'll get turned around. But at this moment, they are grossly under performing. And Clark, Bettis, Hines, et al were great players for the Steelers so I don't dismiss them as easily as you do.
    Where in the world do you get the impression he does not like personal confrontation? He personally confronted Reggie Nelson after his hit on Le'Veon Bell. He confronts his players every week with his "best of" (or, worst of, actually) film. He sat Santo Holmes, claimed he walked past five superbowl trophies not five rushing trophies in response to Willie P. (and you think that wouldn't cause a personal confrontation?). In fact, there is more evidence to suggest he is more confrontational behind the scenes than he needs to be, especially with how big his doghouse is.
    Life is a series of decisions you make that add up to your reputation. Do the right thing.
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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Rogers doesn't fit the bill as a star player by any stretch. And Harrison no longer does. My contention is that the stars have no discipline or consequences for their misdeeds.
    valid complaint. do you have a valid solution tied in with realistic expectations to boot?
    Quote Originally Posted by XxKnightxX View Post
    We are not Buffalo, We are not Miami. We are the Steelers, we dont blow out teams, we cock tease for ratings and keep games close.
    Final Mock Draft: 1st-OLB TJ Watt, 2nd-S Josh Jones, 3rd-QB Brad Kaaya 3rd- CB Rasul Douglas 4th-RB Marlon Mack, 5th- CB Damontae Kazee 6th- OLB Javancy Jones, 7th WR Jehu Chesson, UDFA: ILB Ben Boulware, SS Tedric Thompson, TE Scott Orndoff, DT Patrick Gamble

    Desired Mock Draft: 1st-OLB TJ Watt, 2nd-S Jabrill Peppers, 3rd-TE Jake Butt, 3rd-RB Marlon Mack, 4th-CB Jourdan Lewis, 5th-CB Rasul Douglas, 6th-OLB Javancy Jones 7th-WR Jehu Chesson, UDFA: SS Tedric Thompson, ILB Ben Boulware, DE Ifeadi Odenigbo, QB Chad Kelly

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by Craic View Post
    Where in the world do you get the impression he does not like personal confrontation? He personally confronted Reggie Nelson after his hit on Le'Veon Bell. He confronts his players every week with his "best of" (or, worst of, actually) film. He sat Santo Holmes, claimed he walked past five superbowl trophies not five rushing trophies in response to Willie P. (and you think that wouldn't cause a personal confrontation?). In fact, there is more evidence to suggest he is more confrontational behind the scenes than he needs to be, especially with how big his doghouse is.
    My read is public bravado - e.g., Nelson, comments to the media, film, etc. Holmes is the best example to him holding stars accountable. But his handling of AB is the best example of failure to hold them accountable. I very well could be wrong in my opinion. I just don't see enough evidence to disprove it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Further, I've read many comments by beat writers that question Tomlin's lack of control with star players. They have a better view than my armchair. And that's all I'm doing - being an armchair psychologist.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: Hes Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    My read is public bravado - e.g., Nelson, comments to the media, film, etc. Holmes is the best example to him holding stars accountable. But his handling of AB is the best example of failure to hold them accountable. I very well could be wrong in my opinion. I just don't see enough evidence to disprove it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Further, I've read many comments by beat writers that question Tomlin's lack of control with star players. They have a better view than my armchair. And that's all I'm doing - being an armchair psychologist.
    Fair enough. I just reread my post and realized it came across a little more snarky/pointed that I meant it to. Thanks for overlooking the tone. <--Preacher's Pepsi.
    Life is a series of decisions you make that add up to your reputation. Do the right thing.
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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    If Tomlin didn't have about the same level of control over star players (which isn't that much) as every other team in the league - then he wouldn't have won 6 out of every 10 games for his career.

    AB's largest "problems" have been stupid crap because he wants to be a brand or something. On the field he has been the most dominant WR in the game.

    What disciplinary measures are we talking about here? Benching him? For being too good at his job?

    Are we advocating that any player who misses a block, or misses a run fill, or drops a pass should get a seat on the bench? Have to run extra laps like a rec league team?

    Everyone on the internet wants to talk about discipline and the lack thereof somehow being a major factor in each and every Steelers loss or less than dominant win. But I have yet to see anyone, forum poster or blogger or beat writer, actually propose some sort of actionable items. What is this "discipline" that is apparently the key to pro football going to look like when Tomlin puts it in place? Guys getting yanked in and out of line-ups? Guys getting benched? Demoted?

    Would it be great if the team never missed an assignment, took no penalties, ran every route properly, made all their reads and keys perfectly, etc? Absolutely. But no team has ever done that ever. Belichick gets held up often as the current best coach and creator of the most "disciplined" teams. Have you watched this team play football this year? All kinds of mistakes, especially on defense. And they lost a few games that everyone expected them to win. Clearly that means the Pats (who apparently have everyone on this board convinced they are the end all be all) are an undisciplined team that has problems with players in the locker room.

    Look, I think the Steelers kinda stink right now too. But I just don't think there has to be all these odd intangible reasons when there are numerous actual football things clearly exhibited on game tape to place the blame on.

    Right now, the o-line can't block, the LBs and DBs don't do run support well, and the QB is pressing to make big plays every down. It just doesn't seem more complicated than that. This team is trying to win the Super Bowl on every down. Like a slugger swinging from their heels at every pitch.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    I'm a Tomlin fan. If you were able to check my record at Steelers Fever for 10 years you'd see I love him as a coach. That said, he seems to have lost some control. I like the fact that we only have 3 coaches in 50 years. But I have started to wonder if that model completely works with today's athletes. The 'tuning out' factor is real. Personally, I hope Tomlin is the coach for another 10 years and we win as least two more Super Bowls with him. But I'm not going to make him immune from criticism. Maybe I'm the one tuning him out when he talks tough in pressers but nothing changes with the player. I don't like how Ben subtly throws him under the bus. I don't like the 'me over team' in AB. I don't like seeing Coordinators shown up on TV. I'd just like to see less bravado and more bite from the head coach.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    I'm a Tomlin fan. If you were able to check my record at Steelers Fever for 10 years you'd see I love him as a coach. That said, he seems to have lost some control. I like the fact that we only have 3 coaches in 50 years. But I have started to wonder if that model completely works with today's athletes. The 'tuning out' factor is real. Personally, I hope Tomlin is the coach for another 10 years and we win as least two more Super Bowls with him. But I'm not going to make him immune from criticism. Maybe I'm the one tuning him out when he talks tough in pressers but nothing changes with the player. I don't like how Ben subtly throws him under the bus. I don't like the 'me over team' in AB. I don't like seeing Coordinators shown up on TV. I'd just like to see less bravado and more bite from the head coach.
    Admittedly, I watch zero press conferences by anyone associated with the Steelers, do not listen to player interviews or radio shows, etc. But I am not sure what this post even means or is referring to.

    I've been solidly on record in the past that I don't think there is any point in reading too much into the cliched nonsense that coaches and athletes spew to the press. None of it is real, it is all just noise to allow them to "communicate" with the press without really saying anything.

    I have long felt these statements are parsed and over-analyzed like we are reading some sort of secret code that contains the plans to the Deathstar or something. In reality, I don't think Ben R is smart or clever enough to encode criticisms in his weekly statements.

    Related to that, I feel that too many assume the public face of the team is the same as the private one. Like Tomlin deals with the press the same way he does players. I highly doubt that. I felt that Tomlin was most pissed about AB's locker room video(s?) because they pulled the curtain back and opened the door to what is intended to stay "in the family". I think in public Tomlin may seem too chill and cliched - but in private? I somehow doubt that he has not learned to clearly communicate his displeasure with folks.
    But that is just me, and no one has to agree.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    I think in public Tomlin may seem too chill and cliched - but in private? I somehow doubt that he has not learned to clearly communicate his displeasure with folks.
    But that is just me, and no one has to agree.
    Then in cases such as AB, he simply doesn't care or has no respect for Tomlin's displeasure.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    These guys don't work for Tomlin. Tomlin doesn't pay the players. Tomlin coaches. Team owners do have some say in players getting benched based on they pay both player and coach. Some are more involved than others, but ALL do have a say. That said, Tomlin is going to do what is best for the team on the football field. Playing AB, whether he throws tantrums, facebooks, dyes his hair pink, whatever, is what is best for the team on the field. AB is NOT getting benched. NO COACH would bench AB for anything he has done up to this point. It makes no sense that AB should be benched for anything he's done up to this point. And by benched, I'm including many forms of 'DISCIPLINE' coaches use. When Shaq was told he needed to run lines for every free throw he missed, Shaq simply told his coach, "I don't run lines". So, I'm thinking there is confusion on just how much power coaches have over the players with just handing out discipline as they see fit. It's a bit more complicated, especially with star players.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    I will put this is simply as I can and not my typically wordy fashion (too late):

    If you were the head coach of the Steelers what, specifically, would you do under the heading of "discipline"? For example, how would you "discipline" AB?

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    I will put this is simply as I can and not my typically wordy fashion (too late):

    If you were the head coach of the Steelers what, specifically, would you do under the heading of "discipline"? For example, how would you "discipline" AB?
    Celebration penalties: Fine him
    Facebook live/ Shoving coach away: Suspend him 1 game

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    Celebration penalties: Fine him
    Facebook live/ Shoving coach away: Suspend him 1 game
    I can see that. Personally, I wouldn't suspend my best player for a play-off game, but there is a totally legitimate case to be made for doing so.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by Mojouw View Post
    I can see that. Personally, I wouldn't suspend my best player for a play-off game, but there is a totally legitimate case to be made for doing so.
    It would've been hard. But wow, what a message it would've sent. And in hindsight it wouldn't have made any difference in the outcome of the game.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I mean, what's next... spitting in a coach's face? Will they come out and say: that's just his competitive juices and do nothing?

    I realize this thread is about Ben and not AB so I don't want to continue to derail. But right now Ben's feet need to be held to the fire a little about his on field play. His side drama will always be there but at least his game performance outweighed it.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: Hes Not Playing Well

    This FiveThirtyEight article contends Ben should be OK

    Dont Give Up On Ben Roethlisberger Just Yet

    We identified several quarterbacks who struggled in the first five games of their age-35 seasons when compared to what they did through age 34.1 In almost every case, these QBs bounced back to something much closer to their established levels. To be sure, theres some selection bias at play here most of these quarterbacks are generally excellent, because erratic and unreliable passers do not usually last in the NFL until they are 35.

    Among the passers on this list, the average QB rating improved from 71.2 in the first five games to 86.0 for the remainder of the season. ...


    The real explanation for Roethlisbergers poor start may be the decline in efficiency of his two top targets, wideout Antonio Brown and running back LeVeon Bell.

    On Roethlisbergers 62 targets to Brown this year, his passer rating has dropped to just 71, down from 112.2 on 480 targets in the past three years. And while its hard to tell from a passer rating whether the quarterback or receiver is more to blame, other stats provide some evidence that the 29-year-old Brown is not quite himself this year. According to the NFL, defenses are playing Brown much more tightly at the snap his average cushion has declined from 5.2 to 4.5 yards, one of the lowest among all receivers. But hes not making defensive backs pay by running by them, as his average separation is unchanged (2.9 yards).

    Bells receiving ability, meanwhile, is downright ordinary this year. The prior three years, Roethlisberger had 105 passer rating when throwing to Bell. This year, its 85.4. Bell is averaging 3.85 yards before contact and just 1.48 after. The prior three years, those figures were 6.64 and 2.20. Its hard to blame Roethlisberger for Bell being unable to get open and make defenders miss.

    Unless Roethlisberger is a huge outlier and suddenly craters at age 35, or Bell and Brown have completely lost their ability to be dominant receiving threats, it seems there actually is little reason for Steelers fans to panic

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...espn:frontpage

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    I heard Matt Williams give what to me came across as an honest assessment of where Ben is and what the problem most likely is. He started off by saying that former Niners coach Bill Walsh always said he could watch a qb from the waist down and tell you how well he was throwing the ball. That much of what determines the consistency of a qb's throws are his lower body mechanics. In example Dan Marino was never the same thrower after blowing out his achillies. The NIners let Montana go because his multiple back injuries affected his throwing motion. Now of course these are two great qb's who still had good seasons after these problems. But the magic was gone. They went from great to merely good. Anyway getting back to Matt's observations on Ben, he says you can see it in practice. All those lower leg injuries over the years have affected how Ben moves ( how could it not?) how he sets up, how he delivers the ball etc... So the answer is he's probably not going to be as consistent of passer as he was 2 seasons ago. That's not to say he's washed up, just that game planning him to throw 35+ times is not going to win you many games anymore. The offense needs to funnel through 26. Plain and simple. If Haley and Ben can accept that we've got a helluva chance this season. After all Elway won two SB's after his prime. Same with Peyton a couple years back. It's all about understanding who and what you are. Keep Ben's attempts at a reasonable number and he'll be fine.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    I heard Matt Williams give what to me came across as an honest assessment of where Ben is and what the problem most likely is. He started off by saying that former Niners coach Bill Walsh always said he could watch a qb from the waist down and tell you how well he was throwing the ball. That much of what determines the consistency of a qb's throws are his lower body mechanics. In example Dan Marino was never the same thrower after blowing out his achillies. The NIners let Montana go because his multiple back injuries affected his throwing motion. Now of course these are two great qb's who still had good seasons after these problems. But the magic was gone. They went from great to merely good. Anyway getting back to Matt's observations on Ben, he says you can see it in practice. All those lower leg injuries over the years have affected how Ben moves ( how could it not?) how he sets up, how he delivers the ball etc... So the answer is he's probably not going to be as consistent of passer as he was 2 seasons ago. That's not to say he's washed up, just that game planning him to throw 35+ times is not going to win you many games anymore. The offense needs to funnel through 26. Plain and simple. If Haley and Ben can accept that we've got a helluva chance this season. After all Elway won two SB's after his prime. Same with Peyton a couple years back. It's all about understanding who and what you are. Keep Ben's attempts at a reasonable number and he'll be fine.
    Ben pretty much knows this about himself and told Bell last year in the playoffs, you are pretty much going to have to shoulder the load. You need to have a Terrell Davis like post season.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    I heard Matt Williams give what to me came across as an honest assessment of where Ben is and what the problem most likely is. He started off by saying that former Niners coach Bill Walsh always said he could watch a qb from the waist down and tell you how well he was throwing the ball. That much of what determines the consistency of a qb's throws are his lower body mechanics. In example Dan Marino was never the same thrower after blowing out his achillies. The NIners let Montana go because his multiple back injuries affected his throwing motion. Now of course these are two great qb's who still had good seasons after these problems. But the magic was gone. They went from great to merely good. Anyway getting back to Matt's observations on Ben, he says you can see it in practice. All those lower leg injuries over the years have affected how Ben moves ( how could it not?) how he sets up, how he delivers the ball etc... So the answer is he's probably not going to be as consistent of passer as he was 2 seasons ago. That's not to say he's washed up, just that game planning him to throw 35+ times is not going to win you many games anymore. The offense needs to funnel through 26. Plain and simple. If Haley and Ben can accept that we've got a helluva chance this season. After all Elway won two SB's after his prime. Same with Peyton a couple years back. It's all about understanding who and what you are. Keep Ben's attempts at a reasonable number and he'll be fine.
    This needed to be bumped... and read by everyone.

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: Hes Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by DesertSteel View Post
    I'm not sure that's the case. When behavior stops I can draw a conclusion that there were consequences. AB keeps doing stupid stuff repeatedly. I don't always see repeated stuff from stars on all other teams. Bottom line isn't comparison anyway. Some of this stuff needs dealt with. Even former Steeler players are calling them out.
    Ernie Holmes shot a law enforcement officer in 1973 and did not miss a down

    Joe Greene threw a football into the stands in the last game of his rookie season and was not pulled from the game by Coach Noll

    I remember the end of Joe's first year. Not a very successful season. Philadelphia had the lead and had just made a first down with less than two minutes to play. As the Eagles broke the huddle, Joe was so frustrated, he picked up the ball and threw it into the stands.

    http://www.profootballhof.com/news/d...nement-speech/

    That was after he had been ejected from two games earlier in the season

    During a galling 13-game losing streak in his rookie season, Greene was thrown out of several games -- one for belting Giants quarterback Fran Tarkenton, and another for flooring two Vikings players on consecutive plays with premeditated forearms.

    http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/s...s/200709070286

    Players may be acting out more these days but it is not as if Coach Noll or Coach Cowher repeatedly sat players

    After a loss to the Cincinnati Bengals in 2006, Cowher, angry about his team taking dumb penalties, including an excessive celebration call against running backs Willie Parker and Verron Haynes and a taunting call on safety Mike Logan, said, "That will not happen again. That's on me. Trust me, that will not happen again." In the next game against the Atlanta Falcons, wide receivers Nate Washington, Hines Ward and Santonio Holmes were penalized for excessive celebration. In the game after that against the Oakland Raiders, linebackers Joey Porter and Larry Foote and safety Anthony Smith were penalized for personal fouls. "I guess never say never," Cowher said.

    http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/r...s/201210160148



  26. #86
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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: Hes Not Playing Well

    This PFF analysis (via the Washington Post) of 2017 Ben

    He has completely lost the ability to throw accurately down the field. In a downfield passing offense like Pittsburgh’s, that’s a big problem.
    His 26.7 adjusted completion percentage on throws targeted 20-plus yards downfield is the second-worst of any starter in the NFL. Pro Football Focus tracks stats called Big Time Throws (impressive downfield throws) and Turnover Worthy Throws (throws put in harm’s way, regardless of if they are intercepted or not). The ratio of BTTs to TWTs comprises the Game Changer Index (GCI), and it’s a good measure of a quarterback’s downfield passing capabilities. Below is Roethlisberger’s Game Changer Index by season.
    Year GCI
    2014 2.1
    2015 2.3
    2016 1.2
    2017 0.9
    If that ratio doesn’t get back to at least somewhere between 2015 and 2016 level, the Steelers are in trouble this season. Unless the defense can pick up the slack....

    That brings us then to Pittsburgh’s coverages. They are currently the single most zone-heavy team in the NFL, employing it on 87.7 percent of their passing snaps so far. They make opposing offenses put together entire drives, and they rarely give up big plays. It is, however, a strategy that is dependent on scheme. And schematic advantage can only take you so far. The Steelers only rank seventh in overall coverage grade at Pro Football Focus, despite facing a fairly easy group of passing offenses.

    While the outlook for the Steelers isn’t rosy, it’s not exactly bleak. Roethlisberger could break out of his funk at any point in time. At 35 years old, it’s tough to imagine he has completely lost it. Also, the rest of the AFC, and the NFL for that matter, is full of flawed teams. Pittsburgh is among them. And its biggest flaw is under center.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.023d2cf63168

  27. #87
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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: ‘He’s Not Playing Well

    “And it’s bigges flaw is under center.”

    Wow! SMH

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: Hes Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post

    Joe Greene threw a football into the stands in the last game of his rookie season and was not pulled from the game by Coach Noll

    [I]I remember the end of Joe's first year. Not a very successful season. Philadelphia had the lead and had just made a first down with less than two minutes to play. As the Eagles broke the huddle, Joe was so frustrated, he picked up the ball and threw it into the stands.

    That was after he had been ejected from two games earlier in the season

    [I]During a galling 13-game losing streak in his rookie season, Greene was thrown out of several games -- one for belting Giants quarterback Fran Tarkenton, and another for flooring two Vikings players on consecutive plays with premeditated forearms.

  29. #89
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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: Hes Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    Ernie Holmes shot a law enforcement officer in 1973 and did not miss a down

    Joe Greene threw a football into the stands in the last game of his rookie season and was not pulled from the game by Coach Noll

    I remember the end of Joe's first year. Not a very successful season. Philadelphia had the lead and had just made a first down with less than two minutes to play. As the Eagles broke the huddle, Joe was so frustrated, he picked up the ball and threw it into the stands.

    http://www.profootballhof.com/news/d...nement-speech/

    That was after he had been ejected from two games earlier in the season

    During a galling 13-game losing streak in his rookie season, Greene was thrown out of several games -- one for belting Giants quarterback Fran Tarkenton, and another for flooring two Vikings players on consecutive plays with premeditated forearms.

    http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/s...s/200709070286

    Players may be acting out more these days but it is not as if Coach Noll or Coach Cowher repeatedly sat players

    After a loss to the Cincinnati Bengals in 2006, Cowher, angry about his team taking dumb penalties, including an excessive celebration call against running backs Willie Parker and Verron Haynes and a taunting call on safety Mike Logan, said, "That will not happen again. That's on me. Trust me, that will not happen again." In the next game against the Atlanta Falcons, wide receivers Nate Washington, Hines Ward and Santonio Holmes were penalized for excessive celebration. In the game after that against the Oakland Raiders, linebackers Joey Porter and Larry Foote and safety Anthony Smith were penalized for personal fouls. "I guess never say never," Cowher said.

    http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/r...s/201210160148


    thats a really fascinating article. thanks for sharing
    Quote Originally Posted by XxKnightxX View Post
    We are not Buffalo, We are not Miami. We are the Steelers, we dont blow out teams, we cock tease for ratings and keep games close.
    Final Mock Draft: 1st-OLB TJ Watt, 2nd-S Josh Jones, 3rd-QB Brad Kaaya 3rd- CB Rasul Douglas 4th-RB Marlon Mack, 5th- CB Damontae Kazee 6th- OLB Javancy Jones, 7th WR Jehu Chesson, UDFA: ILB Ben Boulware, SS Tedric Thompson, TE Scott Orndoff, DT Patrick Gamble

    Desired Mock Draft: 1st-OLB TJ Watt, 2nd-S Jabrill Peppers, 3rd-TE Jake Butt, 3rd-RB Marlon Mack, 4th-CB Jourdan Lewis, 5th-CB Rasul Douglas, 6th-OLB Javancy Jones 7th-WR Jehu Chesson, UDFA: SS Tedric Thompson, ILB Ben Boulware, DE Ifeadi Odenigbo, QB Chad Kelly

  30. #90
    Thread DeRailer Array title="tube517 has a reputation beyond repute"> tube517's Avatar

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    Re: Tomlin On Roethlisberger: Hes Not Playing Well

    Quote Originally Posted by AtlantaDan View Post
    Ernie Holmes shot a law enforcement officer in 1973 and did not miss a down

    Joe Greene threw a football into the stands in the last game of his rookie season and was not pulled from the game by Coach Noll

    I remember the end of Joe's first year. Not a very successful season. Philadelphia had the lead and had just made a first down with less than two minutes to play. As the Eagles broke the huddle, Joe was so frustrated, he picked up the ball and threw it into the stands.

    http://www.profootballhof.com/news/d...nement-speech/

    That was after he had been ejected from two games earlier in the season

    During a galling 13-game losing streak in his rookie season, Greene was thrown out of several games -- one for belting Giants quarterback Fran Tarkenton, and another for flooring two Vikings players on consecutive plays with premeditated forearms.

    http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/s...s/200709070286

    Players may be acting out more these days but it is not as if Coach Noll or Coach Cowher repeatedly sat players

    After a loss to the Cincinnati Bengals in 2006, Cowher, angry about his team taking dumb penalties, including an excessive celebration call against running backs Willie Parker and Verron Haynes and a taunting call on safety Mike Logan, said, "That will not happen again. That's on me. Trust me, that will not happen again." In the next game against the Atlanta Falcons, wide receivers Nate Washington, Hines Ward and Santonio Holmes were penalized for excessive celebration. In the game after that against the Oakland Raiders, linebackers Joey Porter and Larry Foote and safety Anthony Smith were penalized for personal fouls. "I guess never say never," Cowher said.

    http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/r...s/201210160148


    Cowher never reprimanded but Tomlin is the players coach and is too close to the players ???





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