Schefter: Steelers Not Close To Signing Bell Long-Term With Deadline Looming

[Mojouw]

One would think it does.

I don't think there's a lot standing in the way of it; a lot of my skepticism is that I'm just confused because what he is looking for and what was offered are not a hell of a lot different, and they become practically identical after he completes a year or two in either case and practically worthless if he does not. One would think any halfway competent agent could do the math and see that. Anyway, I expect you're right.

That is always the crux of it isn't it?

All I could find is that Bell is repped by the same folks that do Tyrod Taylor and Matt Forte. I think both made sure that there was a high % of guaranteed dough in their last deals. Plus from what I can tell, Bell's agent has only Bell as a super high profile "star" client. He is going to try to cash in on this contract for both the payday and to drive other NFL players his way.

Agents are terrible people.

[pczach]

That is always the crux of it isn't it?

All I could find is that Bell is repped by the same folks that do Tyrod Taylor and Matt Forte. I think both made sure that there was a high % of guaranteed dough in their last deals. Plus from what I can tell, Bell's agent has only Bell as a super high profile "star" client. He is going to try to cash in on this contract for both the payday and to drive other NFL players his way.

Agents are terrible people.

Ultimately, the agent's responsibility is to get his or her client the best deal they can that also fills as many of the players needs and wants as possible.

If Bell is the driving force behind the demands of #1 RB + #2 WR money, he is completely out of control.....but at least he is completely in control of his fate and the consequences of his decisions.

If his agent is pushing him to hold out or to demand unrealistic money in the hopes that the agent, not Bell, makes a killing....he is doing his client a huge injustice. The agent loses nothing if Bell sits out other than his cut of the contract that he negotiates that is unrealized. He will get his money eventually when Bell does sign a contract with somebody, whether that's the Steelers or any other team.

The point is that Bell assumes all the risk and all the loss of money. I hope his agent is explaining the numbers game with him, and making sure he fully understands the ramifications of any decision and the dollars gained or lost going forward with all variables regarding injury, performance, suspensions, etc... completely explained and understood.

I want one of my favorite players and a great player on my team, but I also don't want to see him get financially crushed because of a personal decision. They are not just players.....they are people with families and a lifetime of work already put in to realize their dreams with a small window to make their money. Somewhere in there, there has to be a happy medium.

I think the Steelers made a good faith offer, and they are not an organization that screws their best players over if they perform and hold up their end of the bargain from a personal and team standpoint. I guess that's why this whole thing is so hard to understand from Bell's point of view.

[Mojouw]

Ultimately, the agent's responsibility is to get his or her client the best deal they can that also fills as many of the players needs and wants as possible.

If Bell is the driving force behind the demands of #1 RB + #2 WR money, he is completely out of control.....but at least he is completely in control of his fate and the consequences of his decisions.

If his agent is pushing him to hold out or to demand unrealistic money in the hopes that the agent, not Bell, makes a killing....he is doing his client a huge injustice. The agent loses nothing if Bell sits out other than his cut of the contract that he negotiates that is unrealized. He will get his money eventually when Bell does sign a contract with somebody, whether that's the Steelers or any other team.

The point is that Bell assumes all the risk and all the loss of money. I hope his agent is explaining the numbers game with him, and making sure he fully understands the ramifications of any decision and the dollars gained or lost going forward with all variables regarding injury, performance, suspensions, etc... completely explained and understood.

I want one of my favorite players and a great player on my team, but I also don't want to see him get financially crushed because of a personal decision. They are not just players.....they are people with families and a lifetime of work already put in to realize their dreams with a small window to make their money. Somewhere in there, there has to be a happy medium.

I think the Steelers made a good faith offer, and they are not an organization that screws their best players over if they perform and hold up their end of the bargain from a personal and team standpoint. I guess that's why this whole thing is so hard to understand from Bell's point of view.

I think the Steelers offer is more than reasonable and have not really meant to indicate otherwise. I do feel that Bell and/or his agent see this as once in a decade chance to "recalibrate" the market and for reasons of ego, greed, and actual NFL statistics feel that this is the hill they are going to die on.

While I would like Bell to retire a Steeler, not sure if I am willing to have the franchise wreck the balance sheet to make that happen. If Bell and/or his agent absolutely must just do some other-worldly mega deal - well that is what crappy franchises are for. Have fun in Jacksonville, Buffalo, Detroit, or some other 7 win team.

I do think that if the Steelers were only going say 30% or less on the guarantee and Bell is stuck on a higher # - then maybe go to 40 or 45% and see what he says? That is working from my assumption that the % guaranteed is the sticking point. If it is raw $$ per year, than Bell is loco to think that the Steelers will go 15+ on a RB. Someone undoubtedly will, but not the Steelers.

[pczach]

I think the Steelers offer is more than reasonable and have not really meant to indicate otherwise. I do feel that Bell and/or his agent see this as once in a decade chance to "recalibrate" the market and for reasons of ego, greed, and actual NFL statistics feel that this is the hill they are going to die on.

While I would like Bell to retire a Steeler, not sure if I am willing to have the franchise wreck the balance sheet to make that happen. If Bell and/or his agent absolutely must just do some other-worldly mega deal - well that is what crappy franchises are for. Have fun in Jacksonville, Buffalo, Detroit, or some other 7 win team.

I do think that if the Steelers were only going say 30% or less on the guarantee and Bell is stuck on a higher # - then maybe go to 40 or 45% and see what he says? That is working from my assumption that the % guaranteed is the sticking point. If it is raw $$ per year, than Bell is loco to think that the Steelers will go 15+ on a RB. Someone undoubtedly will, but not the Steelers.

I think we agree on a lot of this.

I agree that the team can't mortgage their entire future to accommodate their RB with a stratospheric contract. I love him as a player, but if you can add 3-4 quality players to your roster for the price of one RB....there's not much of a choice.

[BurghBoy412]

What do you think will happen if Bell goes down before week 8? What will happen come time to negotiate again?

[st33lersguy]

What do you think will happen if Bell goes down before week 8? What will happen come time to negotiate again?

Something like this

Steelers FO: So you still want to be paid like a no.1 RB and a no. 2 WR and get a bunch of money guaranteed?

Bell: Uhhhh, yeah!

Steelers FO: But we're concerned about your health

Bell: F&&& that s&&&, I'm a no. 1 RB and a no. 2 WR

Steelers FO: This is a problem. I don't think we can give you an offer you will like

[Mojouw]

What do you think will happen if Bell goes down before week 8? What will happen come time to negotiate again?

That's the role of the dice on Bell's part.

I'm not surprised that an elite athlete in the prime of his career decides to let it ride on his sobriety and health.

If his knee explodes during the season, well than that bet bites him square in the ass!

[AtlantaDan]

This may not go well

Antonio Brown is putting the pressure on Le'Veon Bell to sign his contract

Antonio Brown is known for using social media to make waves, and he did so again Monday, posting a tweet urging teammate Le’Veon Bell to sign his contract.

He also chimed in from his youth football camp Sunday

“I was talking to him last night for about two hours. And, you know, we need him. I need him … We need every guy a part of the organization, in the helmet, to be there committed to the cause. He’s a special piece. Obviously we know what he brings to the team, his dimension, playing football. But he’s a special individual, and I pray that we have him there.”

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/s...s/201707240136

In other words, says the man who is so committed to the cause he preens on Facebook while his coach is addressing the team, I got my long term contract, you didn't. Get over it.

Maybe Ben can pour some more gas on these flames when he gets to Latrobe later this week

[DesertSteel]

In other words, says the man who is so committed to the cause he preens on Facebook while his coach is addressing the team, I got my long term contract, you didn't. Get over it.

He didn't get it the first time around, so I think that's the position that gives AB some cred on this topic. Plus he's talking to him, not just about him.

[AtlantaDan]

He didn't get it the first time around, so I think that's the position that gives AB some cred on this topic. Plus he's talking to him, not just about him.

He got a $42.5 million contract in 2012 before starting his third year in the league - no question that deal getting done at that time was because Wallace was holding out, but nobody put a gun to the heads of Drew Rosenhaus and AB to sign what was a very good deal at that time

Steelers also agreed to front load money remaining on that contract when AB outperformed it

If AB wants to talk to Bell do it privately rather than give interviews and send out tweets - if it is me I respond do not go public to tell me what to do when it involves how I plan to handle my situation

[steelreserve]

Here's the funny thing about #1 RB + #2 WR money.

What does the highest-paid RB in the league make? $8 million. (after #1 it drops off quickly to about $6 million for most of the top RBs.)

What does a #2 receiver make? $5 million is about the max that most teams can afford for the position - a lot of them can't even spend that much. Maybe you'll get some spending a little more or less, but as less of a "core" position, its budget is almost completely at the mercy of the salary cap and what other players on the team ahead of it are making. So $5M is pretty decent for that.

The original deal we offered him already was for #1 RB + #2 WR money. What he wants is apparently to blow the top off of RB money by almost double, then get paid more on top of that for a position he doesn't play unless he's not playing RB. Forget weed - he and his agent need to put down the crack pipe.

[Count Steeler]

Maybe Ben can pour some more gas on these flames when he gets to Latrobe later this week

You mean after he has a "man to man" with Bryant?

It is going to take a special coaching job by Tomlin and a special leadership role from Ben to get this team on the same page and pointing in the same direction. Someone needs to get an arrow Mohawk ala Ernie Holmes from the 70s.

[teegre]

That was my point earlier, sort of. The Steelers are paying Bell the franchise tags + $4 million to relinquish his control over his income for years 3-x (can't remember how many years the deal was for) of the contract. If that contract, much like AB's, was front loaded as hell; then Bell could be cut after year 3. He plays the two tag years and then hits the open market, want to bet me that he makes the $4 million + year 3 of the Steelers deal + a massive front-loaded bonus in the first year of his post-tag contract from say...the 49'ers?

Sure it is massive gamble by Bell and his agent. But 4 million is simply not enough to buy out the prime FA years of the best overall RB in the league. I really wish it was, but it didn't work out.

Let's say that Bell is transition tagged after the 2018 season (and gets that massive deal from the Niners). The Steelers couldn't afford to match it, but they'd get a top ten pick in the 2019 draft as compensation.

Its a win-win-win.

[teegre]

Are the Steelers better with, or without LeVeon Bell? If you are already paying $12M, is he worthy of another $3M to keep?

I get what you're trying to say, but the last time that the Steelers tried to go "all in" to win now (mortgage the future) it resulted in 2012 & 2013. It almost worked: they were one drive away from winning it all in 2010, and, Ben's ankle injury basically killed 2011. So, I get it, and I'm not necessarily against it... but, I don't think the Steelers will do that again.

Let's think about it this way...

An extra $3 million for Bell... which leads to an extra $3 million for Shazier, an extra $3 million for Tuitt, and an extra $3 million for AV. That's $12 million that could be used for a fifth player (e.g. Bryant).

[steelreserve]

Let's say that Bell is transition tagged after the 2018 season (and gets that massive deal from the Niners). The Steelers couldn't afford to match it, but they'd get a top ten pick in the 2019 draft as compensation.

Its a win-win-win.

I thought the tranny tag got you nothing if the player leaves, just gives you the right to match the offer.

So basically legalized tampering where you have to put out a cap-unfriendly 1-year contract to begin the process. It's not a very attractive process, which is why teams don't use it very much.

[Born2Steel]

I get what you're trying to say, but the last time that the Steelers tried to go "all in" to win now (mortgage the future) it resulted in 2012 & 2013. It almost worked: they were one drive away from winning it all in 2010, and, Ben's ankle injury basically killed 2011. So, I get it, and I'm not necessarily against it... but, I don't think the Steelers will do that again.

Let's think about it this way...

An extra $3 million for Bell... which leads to an extra $3 million for Shazier, an extra $3 million for Tuitt, and an extra $3 million for AV. That's $12 million that could be used for a fifth player (e.g. Bryant).

I'm usually a 'long term' strategist. But when I look forward at this upcoming season, I see us giving up points. 30+ in some cases. If we keep AB, Bell, and Bryant productive, we should easily put up 30+ per game ourselves. My entire thought on Bell is give him enough signing bonus, and a money guarantee worthy of the #1 weapon on this team, to keep him focused on football. (Yes I know he SHOULD ALWAYS be focused)& I do understand what he was offered. Signing bonus, guaranteed money for this year and next, incentive laden beyond that. The hang up seems to be what he's being guaranteed.

[st33lersguy]

An extra $3 million for Bell... which leads to an extra $3 million for Shazier, an extra $3 million for Tuitt, and an extra $3 million for AV. That's $12 million that could be used for a fifth player (e.g. Bryant).

Yeah but will those three get $3 million more than the Steelers want to give them because they want to get paid for a position they don't play?

- - - Updated - - -

Any word on any contract talks between Tuitt and the Steelers? I haven't heard anything, I wonder if others have. Honestly, extending Tuitt should be their new top priority after the deadline. Making sure their D-line is intact should be a very high priority for them

[AtlantaDan]

Good analysis by Bill Barnwell at ESPN regarding Bell's contract expectations and the Steelers offer - excerpts and link to article below

Le'Veon Bell wants to be paid like a No. 1 RB and No. 2 WR. Is he worth it?

We don't know the specifics of the offer, but given what we know about how the Steelers structure deals and the current running back market, it looks to be very generous. Reports suggest the Steelers offered Bell a deal averaging more than $12 million per season, with $30 million due over the first two years and $42 million through three seasons....

The $42 million figure is remarkable given the current state of running back contracts....

Bell averaged only 8.2 yards per reception and is averaging 8.8 yards per catch over the course of his career, which isn't really No. 2 wideout stuff. It's closer to what we might see from a slot receiver ... Those guys aren't making a ton of money on the free market. Bell's point also ignores the fact that the vast majority of starting running backs do contribute something as a receiver....

[L]et's say Bell's starting point as a running back is $35 million over the first three years of a new deal. We can't use that number, though, because the running back figures include some level of receiving ability, and we're going to calculate Bell's receiving value separately. Going through the top 20 rushers from 2016 again, you'll find that 77 percent of their yards from scrimmage come on the ground. Let's use that figure and round up to suggest that Bell is worth $27 million as a runner and blocker without including any money for receiving ability. ...

Slot receivers don't make a ton of money on the free market. .. Taking an average of the three-year values of [the top five slot receiver contracts] gets us to $14.6 million. Combine those two figures and you get to $41.6 million over three years, which is right in line with what the Steelers offered Bell, $42 million.
Is Bell worth that much?

I'd be skeptical, mostly because of the availability concerns. Bell has struggled with injuries throughout his professional career. He has been suspended twice, most recently for missing multiple drug tests. I think he's the most talented running back in football when healthy, but it's hard to say he's the best pure runner in the game when he hasn't even come within 350 yards of winning a rushing title during his first four years in the league.

The league probably won't value Bell at $15 million per year, but it takes only one dissenting team to prove Bell right. It's plausible -- if not probable -- somebody will pay Bell the record deal he wants.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/2...burgh-steelers

So the Steelers and Bell both may be right. Steelers made a very generous offer but are not going to be stupid and grossly overpay. Bell and his agent probably also are correct that there usually is at least one poorly managed franchise that will overpay.

Run the wheels off him for 2 years and see who will pay up after that

[DesertSteel]

I get what you're trying to say, but the last time that the Steelers tried to go "all in" to win now (mortgage the future) it resulted in 2012 & 2013. It almost worked: they were one drive away from winning it all in 2010, and, Ben's ankle injury basically killed 2011. So, I get it, and I'm not necessarily against it... but, I don't think the Steelers will do that again.

Let's think about it this way...

An extra $3 million for Bell... which leads to an extra $3 million for Shazier, an extra $3 million for Tuitt, and an extra $3 million for AV. That's $12 million that could be used for a fifth player (e.g. Bryant).

Yeah but when do I get my $3 million?

[Born2Steel]

Anybody else get the sense that after the 2018 season we may be minus Ben, Bryant, and Bell?

[DesertSteel]

Anybody else get the sense that after the 2018 season we may be minus Ben, Bryant, and Bell?

Dobbs, JuJu and Conner.

- - - Updated - - -

Let's get #7 first though!

[AtlantaDan]

Anybody else get the sense that after the 2018 season we may be minus Ben, Bryant, and Bell?

Dobbs, JuJu and Conner.

Which will probably work out about as well as Mark Malone, Louis Lipps, and Frank Pollard stepping in for Bradshaw, Swann and Franco did

[DesertSteel]

Which will probably work out about as well as Mark Malone, Louis Lipps, and Frank Pollard stepping in for Bradshaw, Swann and Franco did

All good things come to an end

[Born2Steel]

Dobbs, JuJu and Conner.

- - - Updated - - -

Let's get #7 first though!

I can get on board with JuJu. I'm thinking he slipped past all of us but could wind up being a very good Steeler. Conner, I would love to see succeed. Time will tell. He's no Bell though. Dobbs? Same math, he's no BB. Can he be worthy of his pick though is my hope.

[BlackAndGold]

Anybody else get the sense that after the 2018 season we may be minus Ben, Bryant, and Bell?

Bryant will be back since he isn't a FA, and I'll be shocked if they let Bell just walk.

[86WARD]

Which will probably work out about as well as Mark Malone, Louis Lipps, and Frank Pollard stepping in for Bradshaw, Swann and Franco did

That's the reality...

[Dwinsgames]

I thought the tranny tag got you nothing if the player leaves, just gives you the right to match the offer.

So basically legalized tampering where you have to put out a cap-unfriendly 1-year contract to begin the process. It's not a very attractive process, which is why teams don't use it very much.

exactly ....

Transition Tags

A transition player designation gives the free agent's team the right of first refusal. If the player receives an offer from another club, his initial team has seven days after his contract expires to match it and the player stays.
If the team doesn't match the offer, the player moves on and the team receives no compensation at all.
It costs less to retain a transition player. The one-year contract is based on the average of the top 10 salaries for the position he plays instead of five, or 120 percent of the player's previous year's salary, whichever is greater.

[teegre]

Anybody else get the sense that after the 2018 season we may be minus Ben, Bryant, and Bell?

Yes

After back-to-back SuperBowl victories, BB retires.

After back-to-back league MVP seasons, Bell gets $20 million/season from Washington.

After a record-setting 37 total receiving TDs in back-to-back seasons, Dallas makes Bryant the highest paid receiver in history.

[steelreserve]

It costs less to retain a transition player. The one-year contract is based on the average of the top 10 salaries for the position he plays instead of five, or 120 percent of the player's previous year's salary, whichever is greater.

Although as we've seen with Bell, the actual cost of the franchise tag is no longer done that way, but with some weird percentage-of-the-salary-cap formula that means he doesn't get paid the average of the top five salaries, he gets 50% more than the #1 salary. But yeah, with the tranny tag the cost is far less - the downside being that there is literally nothing stopping anyone from making an offer if the player is any good.

[Dwinsgames]

Although as we've seen with Bell, the actual cost of the franchise tag is no longer done that way, but with some weird percentage-of-the-salary-cap formula that means he doesn't get paid the average of the top five salaries, he gets 50% more than the #1 salary. But yeah, with the tranny tag the cost is far less - the downside being that there is literally nothing stopping anyone from making an offer if the player is any good.

bingo compensation went out the window for transition tag in the last collective bargaining agreement