2016 DRAFT

[tube517]

We need a NT/DE who can spell Tuitt and Heyward as well. We play 2 DLineman alot and those guys need a break. Any draft pick fit that mold?

[katmandu]

the problem is that other teams are now spreading the Steelers out in order to get the NT off the field...

Which is why we need a DT that can "get after it". McClendon can do it on a consistent basis.

Big Dan is too slow. However, he does over-power and push back OLs frequently. Just wish he had a nasty attitude to go along with his size and strength!

[Born2Steel]

How does a spread formation take the NT off the field? Honest question.

[Steeldude]

How does a spread formation take the NT off the field? Honest question.

Because you need to add an extra DB. The odd man out is the NT.

[steelreserve]

Because you need to add an extra DB. The odd man out is the NT.

Doesn't have to be. You can play a 3-3-4 nickel as well as a 2-4-5. It depends on who's the most effective.

And since you never rush less than three guys, and usually four - really the question is whether a Casey Hampton-alike would be more effective at making the QB uncomfortable, or whether Jarvis Jones/Arthur Moats would. I think that one's not even close. The problem is that while a Casey Hampton could destroy the pocket and make the QB move, a Steve McLendon cannot.

In other words, with our current personnel, it makes sense to get the nose tackle the hell off the field because he sucks. If you had someone more talented, that changes things a lot. And so far it looks like our new defensive coordinator is smart enough to see those kinds of situations and make the right move.

It's a mistake to think that the rushers in a nickel all have to be speedy edge rushers who are going to get you sacks. A big fat guy can force the QB to scramble, throw on the run, throw off his back foot, throw the ball away, which is just as effective. I probably wouldn't advise that strategy against Russel Wilson or Cam Newton, but someone like Manning or Flacco? Fuck yeah I would.

[Born2Steel]

Doesn't have to be. You can play a 3-3-4 nickel as well as a 2-4-5. It depends on who's the most effective.

And since you never rush less than three guys, and usually four - really the question is whether a Casey Hampton-alike would be more effective at making the QB uncomfortable, or whether Jarvis Jones/Arthur Moats would. I think that one's not even close. The problem is that while a Casey Hampton could destroy the pocket and make the QB move, a Steve McLendon cannot.

In other words, with our current personnel, it makes sense to get the nose tackle the hell off the field because he sucks. If you had someone more talented, that changes things a lot. And so far it looks like our new defensive coordinator is smart enough to see those kinds of situations and make the right move.

It's a mistake to think that the rushers in a nickel all have to be speedy edge rushers who are going to get you sacks. A big fat guy can force the QB to scramble, throw on the run, throw off his back foot, throw the ball away, which is just as effective. I probably wouldn't advise that strategy against Russel Wilson or Cam Newton, but someone like Manning or Flacco? Fuck yeah I would.

How I was thinking of the situation. Not that replacing the NT wasn't an option, just why is that the way we view our defense. ShadeTree can cause problems up the middle on must pass downs. I believe that is why we kept him.
Not really the thread though, sorry for taking it off track.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Doesn't have to be. You can play a 3-3-4 nickel as well as a 2-4-5. It depends on who's the most effective.

you meant 3-3-5 or 2-4-5...

[teegre]

We need a NT/DE who can spell Tuitt and Heyward as well. We play 2 DLineman alot and those guys need a break. Any draft pick fit that mold?

Kenny Clark, DL, UCLA

He can play the nose, but he can also slide out to DE (to be a part of that rotation).

I agree.

Steve McLendon only played 17 snaps against Denver, is that worth using a first round pick for?

In the Denver game, when the Broncos marched down the field, Tuitt and Heyward were off of the field. McClendon was in... but, not very effective. It might only be 17 snaps, but it was HUGE.

So, drafting a DL (who can play both NT and DE) in the first round makes a ton of sense.

[Steelman]

Kenny Clark, DL, UCLA

He can play the nose, but he can also slide out to DE (to be a part of that rotation).



In the Denver game, when the Broncos marched down the field, Tuitt and Heyward were off of the field. McClendon was in... but, not very effective. It might only be 17 snaps, but it was HUGE.

So, drafting a DL (who can play both NT and DE) in the first round makes a ton of sense.

Jonathan Allen would've been a great fit for this role, IMO, but he's returning to school. Although he probably isn't big enough to play a nose position. But you slide Heyward there and move Allen to the right side...boom. Stacked.

[teegre]

But you slide Heyward there and move Allen to the right side...boom. Stacked.

Exactly.

Heyward has played the nose before (and played it well). Now, we don't want Heyward there all of the time, but that is not really a problem, because the Steelers use two DEs lined up as DTs on the majority of their snaps.

DRIVE #1-3, #5-7, #9-11
First down: Tuitt - Heyward - rookie
Second down: Tuitt - (no one) - Heyward
Third down: Heyward - (no one) - rookie

DRIVE #4, #8, #12
First down: Tuitt - Heyward - rookie
Second down: Tuitt - (no one) - rookie
Third down: Tuitt - (no one) - rookie

[tube517]

Kenny Clark, DL, UCLA

He can play the nose, but he can also slide out to DE (to be a part of that rotation).



In the Denver game, when the Broncos marched down the field, Tuitt and Heyward were off of the field. McClendon was in... but, not very effective. It might only be 17 snaps, but it was HUGE.

So, drafting a DL (who can play both NT and DE) in the first round makes a ton of sense.

Bring Kenny on!!

[polamalubeast]

Exactly.

Heyward has played the nose before (and played it well). Now, we don't want Heyward there all of the time, but that is not really a problem, because the Steelers use two DEs lined up as DTs on the majority of their snaps.

DRIVE #1-3, #5-7, #9-11
First down: Tuitt - Heyward - rookie
Second down: Tuitt - (no one) - Heyward
Third down: Heyward - (no one) - rookie

DRIVE #4, #8, #12
First down: Tuitt - Heyward - rookie
Second down: Tuitt - (no one) - rookie
Third down: Tuitt - (no one) - rookie

We can also use the 3 very often at the same time much like the jets have done this year with their 3 3-4 DE.

[teegre]

We can also use the 3 very often at the same time much like the jets have done this year with their 3 3-4 DE.

That's the beauty of having a good group of D-linemen: options.

[EzraTank]

We definitely need a cover guy but one thing we really need is a pass rusher that can get to the QB. I don't care how good your secondary is if any NFL QB has time they will find people.

We can't expect 99 year old James Harrison to play like it's 2008 the rest of his playing days. Our front 3/4 struggled at getting pressure all year.

[teegre]

I don't think that there is really many positions that you can take off of Pittsburgh's draft board.

D-LINE:
I'm not going to spend any time arguing NT, but there can definitely be an upgrade there. Billings and Robinson make is D-line stout on the first two downs. Kenny Clark is my favorite, because he can play two downs at NT, and then be a part of the rotation at DE.

O-LINE:
Beachum is gone. Foster is most likely gone. Is Hubbard the answer? The good news for most of you (who do not want an O-lineman taken in R1) is that there is not an "obvious" LG in this draft; there is no DeCastro. But, there are plenty of OT converts.

QUARTERBACK:
I could see a backup being groomed. This would not surprise me. I'm not for it, especially not in R1... but, it is not illogical.

CORNERBACK:
Duh. Yes x 1000.

SAFETY:
Golden has played well, but he an upgrade is definitely in order. I like Su'a Cravens at 25. (Note: I also like Karl Joseph on day two).

OUTSIDE LINEBACKER:
There's Bud Dupree, an aging Silverback, an underwhelming Jarvis Jones, and a possible in Chickllo. Considering that the Steelers need a pass rush, an OLB would not be a "bad" choice (although, I'd bet that they wait a year to see if Jones and Chickillo pan out).

INSIDE LINEBACKER:
No

RUNNING BACK:
No

WIDE RECEIVER:
No

TIGHT END:
There's not really a guy worthy of a R1 pick.

SUMMATION:
I would prefer Kenny Clark (DL) or Su'a Cravens (SS). But, I would obviously be fine with a CB, and I can see the logic in drafting a LG or an OLB.

[Mojouw]

I don't think that there is really many positions that you can take off of Pittsburgh's draft board.

D-LINE:
I'm not going to spend any time arguing NT, but there can definitely be an upgrade there. Billings and Robinson make is D-line stout on the first two downs. Kenny Clark is my favorite, because he can play two downs at NT, and then be a part of the rotation at DE.

O-LINE:
Beachum is gone. Foster is most likely gone. Is Hubbard the answer? The good news for most of you (who do not want an O-lineman taken in R1) is that there is not an "obvious" LG in this draft; there is no DeCastro. But, there are plenty of OT converts.

QUARTERBACK:
I could see a backup being groomed. This would not surprise me. I'm not for it, especially not in R1... but, it is not illogical.

CORNERBACK:
Duh. Yes x 1000.

SAFETY:
Golden has played well, but he an upgrade is definitely in order. I like Su'a Cravens at 25. (Note: I also like Karl Joseph on day two).

OUTSIDE LINEBACKER:
There's Bud Dupree, an aging Silverback, an underwhelming Jarvis Jones, and a possible in Chickllo. Considering that the Steelers need a pass rush, an OLB would not be a "bad" choice (although, I'd bet that they wait a year to see if Jones and Chickillo pan out).

INSIDE LINEBACKER:
No

RUNNING BACK:
No

WIDE RECEIVER:
No

TIGHT END:
There's not really a guy worthy of a R1 pick.

SUMMATION:
I would prefer Kenny Clark (DL) or Su'a Cravens (SS). But, I would obviously be fine with a CB, and I can see the logic in drafting a LG or an OLB.

I think it will be the same as the last 3 drafts. They will take the highest rated "falling" guy. I also think that OLB is a high possibility early in this draft. I think they have learned their lesson with Jarvis Jones. They backed themselves into a corner there and drafted for "need". I don't think Colbert is going to put himself there again. He will, if anything, draft a year early for an upcoming "need". With Harrison gone in a year at most, Jones' option up in a year. That would leave the Steelers with Dupree, Moats, and Chickillio. That is at least one OLB short.

Long story short, I will be shocked if the Steelers do not draft an OLB in the first 3 rounds this year.

[Steelman]

Is the FO and staff high on Chickillo? With Harrison mulling retirement, depth at OLB is thin even before Jones presumably leaves after his contract is up. Maybe they find a veteran like Moats to fill that the need instead of through the draft this time.

Teegs, I'd be interested to hear your take on Cravens. I personally am not real high on him, way too much of a project player for a 1st rounder, especially with the DL talent that will be available at #25.

[steelreserve]

Dupree is supposed to be the next Porter/Harrison. Jones or Moats can be the next Clark Haggans, which is all they have to be. If we keep throwing draft picks at OLB as a band-aid, guess what, we're going to keep being disappointed. With some good line play, that can happen. The great pass-rushing linebackers of our past teams had THREE dominant defensive linemen, not two plus a scrub. As far as OLB goes, we've got to trust that we've probably got the guys we need on the roster already.

[Psycho Ward 86]

would have been nice if we didnt try to skimp on Shaq Barrett's rookie contract, moving him to the broncos, or kept HoJo.

Having just one of those guys would have been such a boon for our OLB depth.


Yeah yeah i know everyone misses on draft picks oh wait they werent even drafted...

[Born2Steel]

Where did HoJo end up?

[Drazo85]

Where did HoJo end up?

Buccaneers I think.

[teegre]

I think it will be the same as the last 3 drafts. They will take the highest rated "falling" guy. I also think that OLB is a high possibility early in this draft. I think they have learned their lesson with Jarvis Jones. They backed themselves into a corner there and drafted for "need". I don't think Colbert is going to put himself there again. He will, if anything, draft a year early for an upcoming "need". With Harrison gone in a year at most, Jones' option up in a year. That would leave the Steelers with Dupree, Moats, and Chickillio. That is at least one OLB short.

Long story short, I will be shocked if the Steelers do not draft an OLB in the first 3 rounds this year.

Melding this topic (OLB) with another topic from another thread...

Someone mentioned that maybe the Steelers should be trying to "win now", and get an impact defensive player. There is a guy who would be a "steal" at 25, but could also be a complete bust: Noah Spence.

Spence has top 5 talent, but major baggage (drug addiction, run-ins with the law). These types of guys can usually hold it together for one season... but, long-term, they almost always implode. It would essentially be "rent a player" type of thing, with almost no hope for him to be there in the future.

Mind you, I'm not advocating this; I am merely bringing up an interesting "would you...???" scenario, in order to foster a discussion.

[teegre]

Teegs, I'd be interested to hear your take on Cravens. I personally am not real high on him, way too much of a project player for a 1st rounder, especially with the DL talent that will be available at #25.

I see Cravens as a perfect weapon for the modern NFL.

Is is he an ILB? OLB? SS?
The answer is: Yes.

A few years ago, when the Steelers drafted Sean Spence, I predicted that they'd use him in an LB/SS type of role. Then, he destroyed his leg, and that plan was shelved. Still, LeBeau wanted to have a LB/SS so badly, that he played Troy there for a while. When the Steelers drafted Shazier, I was positive that that is how they'd use him... and, they still might.

Anyway, Cravens is the perfect type of player to cover a TE. He is fast like a SS, but big like a LB. More importantly, imagine the types of blitzes that you could run if you have Shazier and Cravens in the field. Cravens drops back, and Shazier blitzes... or, Shazier drops into coverage, and Cravens blitzes.

Taking packages and/or schemes out of it, Cravens started as a CB... and played well. He switched to SS... and played well. Then, he switched to OLB... and played well. He's just this spectacular athlete, who you can ask to do just about anything on the field... and he will do it well.

[hawaiiansteeler]

I see Cravens as a perfect weapon for the modern NFL.

Is is he an ILB? OLB? SS?
The answer is: Yes.

A few years ago, when the Steelers drafted Sean Spence, I predicted that they'd use him in an LB/SS type of role. Then, he destroyed his leg, and that plan was shelved. Still, LeBeau wanted to have a LB/SS so badly, that he played Troy there for a while. When the Steelers drafted Shazier, I was positive that that is how they'd use him... and, they still might.

Anyway, Cravens is the perfect type of player to cover a TE. He is fast like a SS, but big like a LB. More importantly, imagine the types of blitzes that you could run if you have Shazier and Cravens in the field. Cravens drops back, and Shazier blitzes... or, Shazier drops into coverage, and Cravens blitzes.

Taking packages and/or schemes out of it, Cravens started as a CB... and played well. He switched to SS... and played well. Then, he switched to OLB... and played well. He's just this spectacular athlete, who you can ask to do just about anything on the field... and he will do it well.

Su'a Cravens could be used a lot like how the Arizona Cardinals currently employ Deone Bucannon.

and what I really like about selecting Cravens is we could trade down into the high second round and pick up an extra 3rd round pick from another team and still have him be there on the board for us...

[teegre]

Su'a Cravens could be used a lot like how the Arizona Cardinals currently employ Deone Bucannon.

and what I really like about selecting Cravens is we could trade down into the high second round and pick up an extra 3rd round pick from another team and still have him be there on the board for us...

Yes, YES, YES!!!

As you know, the guy that I wanted in the 2014 draft was Bucannon. Now you have me pumped up!!!


You know, as far as trading down goes, I just checked a few mock drafts, and many of them have Cravens going around 50ish. Either I'm way off (very possible) in thinking he's a good value at 25, or everyone else is waaaay off. I've always thought that he'd be perfect at about 31 ( )... but, 50??? No way.

I still say that he goes 25-35, but if they are indeed correct that his value is around 50... what if...

25: Kenny Clark, DT, UCLA
58: Su'a Cravens, SS, USC

[86WARD]

If Cravens can cover a TE, he's a must draft for this team...lol.

[Mojouw]

Here is my prediction for the draft, super vague, but I bet I get the "plan" right:

1. Highest rated talent on the board regardless of position
2. Best defensive player on the board
3. Big, tall, fast, WR w/ supposedly suspect hands and/or concentration
4. Interior OL
5. Boykin
6. Rotational DE
7. Dart throw at DB or maybe a Punter
7. Annual "Gronk Lite" TE that no one really thinks will make the team

[hawaiiansteeler]

Here is my prediction for the draft, super vague, but I bet I get the "plan" right:

1. Highest rated talent on the board regardless of position
2. Best defensive player on the board
3. Big, tall, fast, WR w/ supposedly suspect hands and/or concentration
4. Interior OL
5. Boykin
6. Rotational DE
7. Dart throw at DB or maybe a Punter
7. Annual "Gronk Lite" TE that no one really thinks will make the team

you can scratch that rotational DE off your list since we have no 6th round selection this year due to the Josh Scobee trade...

[Mojouw]

you can scratch that rotational DE off your list since we have no 6th round selection this year due to the Josh Scobee trade...

Forget that one. So move that to one of the 7th round selections then.

[Mojouw]

I see Cravens as a perfect weapon for the modern NFL.

Is is he an ILB? OLB? SS?
The answer is: Yes.

A few years ago, when the Steelers drafted Sean Spence, I predicted that they'd use him in an LB/SS type of role. Then, he destroyed his leg, and that plan was shelved. Still, LeBeau wanted to have a LB/SS so badly, that he played Troy there for a while. When the Steelers drafted Shazier, I was positive that that is how they'd use him... and, they still might.

Anyway, Cravens is the perfect type of player to cover a TE. He is fast like a SS, but big like a LB. More importantly, imagine the types of blitzes that you could run if you have Shazier and Cravens in the field. Cravens drops back, and Shazier blitzes... or, Shazier drops into coverage, and Cravens blitzes.

Taking packages and/or schemes out of it, Cravens started as a CB... and played well. He switched to SS... and played well. Then, he switched to OLB... and played well. He's just this spectacular athlete, who you can ask to do just about anything on the field... and he will do it well.

Looking at the Broncos comments that most of their offensive calls were keyed on where Shazier lined up (remind anyone here of anyone else that recently wore a Steelers uni?) and it instantly springs to mind that adding another player in that mold - could make this defense really hard to gamelan.

Also it would seem to fit with the Steelers recent trend in the draft. Identify and obtain players with high end physical traits and figure out where and how they fit on the football field later.

However, if this kid is half the athlete everyone says he is, no way he stays with a second round grade all the way through the pre-draft process.