Stop over-using D Will

[TeeTee]

Tomlin is infamous for "running the wheels" off his main back. That is horse shit and it must end. D Will is a good back, but if you force him to have too many carries he will get hurt.

If we make the playoffs, but end up without an effective back like last year, due to Tomlin not sharing some of the carries and wearing down D Will, Tomlin should he fired.

He should take at least 5-10 touches away from D Will to keep him fresh. We are gonna need him come playoff, or we will limp into the playoffs with no decent back like last year.

Cool Shades must reduce his stupid decisions for us to have a chance.

[polamalubeast]

If we look at the last game against the browns, Williams has not had many carries in this games, but yes I agree, it can be a concern.But even if Williams gets injured because he was overly used, Tomlin will kept his job!

[TeeTee]

I just don't understand the logic of running a back into the ground, and he brags about it like it's something to be proud of. It just pisses me off.

[st33lersguy]

It's not like we have a lot of effective backs that can share carries with him. Also, he hasn't been used that much this season. He has only had more than 20 carrries three times this year including once in the last 8 games. In the 6 game span from St. Louis to Cinci, he had a combined 22 carries and 5 catches. If you add up rush attempts and catches he has 120 on the year, an average of 12 per game. The idea that they have been overusing him especially since last week he ran the ball 17 times, I am not seeing it

[86WARD]

I tend to agree, but who is going to take he carries?

[hawaiiansteeler]

It's not like we have a lot of effective backs that can share carries with him.

TeeTee is absolutely right, we have a tendency to run the wheels off of our feature back and not use our 2nd RB to lighten the load no matter who he is.

take Le'Veon Bell's first game back from suspension this season against the Rams as an example. D-Will had done an outstanding job filling in for Bell the first two games but as soon as Bell returned we gave him 19 carries to only one for D-Will. the next game versus the Ravens, Bell gets 22 carries and D-Will only gets two...

[st33lersguy]

TeeTee is absolutely right, we have a tendency to run the wheels off of our feature back and not use our 2nd RB to lighten the load no matter who he is.

take Le'Veon Bell's first game back from suspension this season against the Rams as an example. D-Will had done an outstanding job filling in for Bell the first two games but as soon as Bell returned we gave him 19 carries to only one for D-Will. the next game versus the Ravens, Bell gets 22 carries and D-Will only gets two...

I get that, but why complain about it now when D-Will hasn't gotten a lot of carries this season, coming off a week where he had 17 carries, and when there is no viable option at no. 2. The time to make this post was when Bell was healthy and D-Will was rotting the bench, not now

[steelreserve]

We have six games to go; at this point it is all down to luck. Williams could get 150 more carries and come out fine. Or, he could get one carry next week and pull his hamstring. Complete roll of the dice. He basically sat out five and a half games already, so there's your reduced workload. And he was only getting about 20 carries a game as a starter, except for the Raiders game. I think it will be fine.

The point is that we had a good backup for Bell to begin with - now that it's his turn, you use him. The Haley Turtle is bad enough with backup QBs; the last thing we need is to extend it to running backs as well.

[ALLD]

I tend to agree, but who is going to take he carries?

Brandon Boykin...

[86WARD]

Brandon Boykin...

[lipps83]

Dri Archer is available. That kid is pretty fast.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Brandon Boykin...

yeah, he's still fresh. we can run him until his wheels fall off and at least feel we got something for that 5th round pick we gave up...

[Mojouw]

Remember when 30 carries was normal use for a RB? The studies show that as long as you don't put your back on pace for 350-400 touches per season you're not really going to "break" the player.

I hardly think that 20-25 touches per game for Deangelo is really crossing in to over-use territory.

Be really interesting to see what Todmann's role is now that the team has had the bye week to get him some serious practice reps. What about Pead? Anything more than an emergency contingency?

[TeeTee]

I get that, but why complain about it now when D-Will hasn't gotten a lot of carries this season, coming off a week where he had 17 carries, and when there is no viable option at no. 2. The time to make this post was when Bell was healthy and D-Will was rotting the bench, not now

The only reason they haven't run D Will ragged yet is game situations didn't allow it. It was even more true when Bell was around and I could have posted the trend then. WTF is in Tomlin's brain that tells him it's better to run your main back into tethers than give another back more touches? It's moronic. As far as options, we bothered to pick up Todman, so why not use him some?

[ALLD]

Sometimes the RB doesn't get warmed up and a game feel until he gets a few carries in a row over several series. But that is still no reason not to give the other guys a few carries unless they are no good or are fumblers which in that case they should not be on the team.

[st33lersguy]

The only reason they haven't run D Will ragged yet is game situations didn't allow it. It was even more true when Bell was around and I could have posted the trend then. WTF is in Tomlin's brain that tells him it's better to run your main back into tethers than give another back more touches? It's moronic. As far as options, we bothered to pick up Todman, so why not use him some?

So why post a title that says "stop" over-using D-Will when you just admitted they haven't done so yet

[GBMelBlount]

Remember when 30 carries was normal use for a RB? The studies show that as long as you don't put your back on pace for 350-400 touches per season you're not really going to "break" the player.

I hardly think that 20-25 touches per game for Deangelo is really crossing in to over-use territory.

Be really interesting to see what Todmann's role is now that the team has had the bye week to get him some serious practice reps. What about Pead? Anything more than an emergency contingency?

At his age it may not take as many carries to wear him out.

[86WARD]

But...Williams is "injury prone"!

[Mojouw]

You play your best players. Take a look at Bell's touches per game (carries + receptions) and he is right in line with other 3 down running backs that are the focal point of their team's offense (Forte, Charles, AP, Murray, Lacy (before he got fat), etc). Bell is better than Williams, so you feed your guy.

This whole running back by committee approach all came about because teams did not want to spend high draft picks on backs and most teams could not find a single player that could be an adequate rusher, a pass blocker, and a receiving threat. So they cobbled together a backfield out of guys that specialized in one or more of those roles. Bell is excellent at ALL of those things. Why take him off the field?

Along a similar line of thought, WIlliams is better than Todman. Why shouldn't he get all 20-25 touches? That is hardly "running the wheels off". I mean, if we are just making up concerns now, then I think we really need to talk about how the Steelers are overusing AB and run the risk of dramatically shortening his career.

[Craic]

I think something else people don't realize is that running the ball has a cumulative affect on both the Running Back and the Defense. I can't tell you how many games I've watched Bettis look like he's getting shut down almost in the first couple quarters, and then he simply railroads people in the third and fourth. Why? Because RBs want to get the touches. They get warmed up and start chugging away like a Diesel engine - the more they work, the more powerful they are. On the opposite end is the defense. All those 1 yard and 2 yard runs in the first and second quarter wears out a defense. It's a whole lot harder to play when you're taking on blockers and RBs, rather than driving into blockers and rushing the QB.

So, giving DW 20-22 runs a game makes complete sense. If it goes much over twenty-five, then if we're up by two scores, I before Todman to come in and finish it out - especially when coming in with fresh legs. But RB by committee throughout the game? No, absolutely not.

[hawaiiansteeler]

I think something else people don't realize is that running the ball has a cumulative affect on both the Running Back and the Defense. I can't tell you how many games I've watched Bettis look like he's getting shut down almost in the first couple quarters, and then he simply railroads people in the third and fourth. Why? Because RBs want to get the touches. They get warmed up and start chugging away like a Diesel engine - the more they work, the more powerful they are. On the opposite end is the defense. All those 1 yard and 2 yard runs in the first and second quarter wears out a defense.

I have the perfect solution:

use all the other RBs for those 1 and 2 yard runs and only use D-Will for runs of 3 yards and longer...

[fansince'76]

You play your best players.

It really is that simple. The injuries that Bell has suffered (and the broken leg that Willie Parker suffered in 2007 that started the whole "Tomlin is an idiot who doesn't know how to use RBs" meme to begin with) could have happened on their first carry of the season or their 250th carry of the season. They had nothing to do with them being overused.

[TeeTee]

So why post a title that says "stop" over-using D-Will when you just admitted they haven't done so yet

I should have worded it more accurately. I am anticipating his over-use because Tomlin takes some kind of perverse pride in over-using his main back. I am not in favor of total back by committee, I just don't want the #1 back overburdened. It's more than fine to have one back get most of the touches, but it's not OK to give one, single touch to another back all game long. That is a plan of FAIL.

[j-d-s]

We should not let someone else take carries instead of D-Will, because I do not think that any of the other guys will produce more than 2 or 3 yards per carry. Those are just wasted downs. Then it's probably the better option to let Ben throw it downfield (especially since you can get first downs by penalty very easy on those plays) or some weird trick play.

[LLT]

I should have worded it more accurately. I am anticipating his over-use because Tomlin takes some kind of perverse pride in over-using his main back. I am not in favor of total back by committee, I just don't want the #1 back overburdened. It's more than fine to have one back get most of the touches, but it's not OK to give one, single touch to another back all game long. That is a plan of FAIL.

Well...to be accurate...you think EVERY plan Tomlin has is one of failure...so I guess we should take this thread with a grain of salt.

[Mojouw]

How it is a plan of fail? What is the failure? What is the evidence of failure?

None of Bell's injuries are or have been associated with overuse. None occurred in games where he should have been on the bench because the team was winning by multiple scores late.

Last year the failure was not having a capable back-up on the roster. This has been redressed in depth with Williams, Todman, and Pead.

Is playing AP all the snaps a fail? What about Lynch? What about Gurley? This is another joke of a thread with no context or basis.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Bye Week Rethink: DeAngelo Williams and Lightening Load

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2015/11...ghtening-load/

[Rotorhead]

He has barely been used this year, he will be fresh for the stretch run which is what we need. You play your best players, period. Our passing game is our strength, so I don't see us over using him anyway. This is a terrible argument . . . what would you have Tomiln do, not run at all for the rest of the season so we can lose just enough games to not make the playoffs?

[Mojouw]

Bye Week Rethink: DeAngelo Williams and Lightening Load

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2015/11...ghtening-load/

And that article is sloppy and plays more than a bit fast and loose with the #'s. For most of Williams career, he split time in the Carolina backfield. So even if he was the starter - others got a decent # of carries. Stewart, Tolbert, etc.

Lazy article. And here I have to go to an actual job to make my house payment. What did that article take, 9 minutes to write? No actual context, no real research into the impact specific #'s of carries have on RB performance and health - despite the fact that there is a TON of just that kind of research available only a short Google search away.

I really like Steelers Depot - I really do. I could not and can not do a ton of what they do. Their film breakdowns and cap stuff is really great. Their draft and training camp articles are top notch. But then they just crap out posts like these. It doesn't even really say anything. Maybe Williams hasn't gone over 275 or so carries ever because since 2008 he has been sharing a backfield with either Jonathan Stewart or Leveon Bell. Weird. Whatever. Is 20-25 carries a game out of line with usage rates across the NFL for other backs Williams age, size, style, etc. Is it historically off for older backs? Does Williams even qualify as old because he had multiple years of lighter use due to time shares? All questions that impact how one might feel about Williams current usage.

[Steel Peon]

Tomlin is infamous for "running the wheels" off his main back.

Agree, especially in DW's case who isn't a young buck at 32 yrs old.