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Thread: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

  1. #121
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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    I noticed my comment was on there, I hope I didn't imply that Tomlin didn't inherit an excellent team (because I was implying that he did).
    As for your comment, it puts to rest the insane idea that Tomlin didn't inherit a loaded team. Plus had Ben not been rushed back after the apendectomy (and especially after the concussion he suffered in Atlanta) they make the playoffs in 2006. Even with Ben being rushed back with the appendectomy, the 2006 team was a Ricardo Colclough fumble, a Nate Washington false start, and a Charlie Batch start (after Ben's concussion) away from 11-5
    No, he inherited a team with talent, but a team that had a lot of problems brewing as well. Porter couldn't shut his mouth, so he was gone. Alan Faneca was actively/verbally opposing coaches telling players to ignore what the OC was saying (there were a bunch of articles written on it at the time), so he was gone. Jeff Hartings was at the end of his career and retired along with Cowher. Marvel Smith was a shell of his former self his last two years (first two years with Tomlin). Kendall Simmons was losing his ability to play effectively due to his diabetes (strength issues, had to drop weight as well). Who were their backups? We were left with an aging line and no one situated to replace them. The stake through the heart was Faneca's childish behavior.

    Hines Ward was the only good/reliable WR—Santonio Holmes was a rookie. He has a nice place in our heart because of his punt return and catch in the SB, but career wise, he sucks. His career target to reception rate stands at 53 percent, 3 percent LESS than Wallace's 56 percent. Outside of him, we were relying on Cedric Wilson (56 percent reception rate) and hoping that a kid named Nate Washington would come along. A kid who, wait for it . . . has a 52 percent career reception rate.

    In the running game, we'd lost the bus the previous year, and Cowher replaced him with Dookie to be Willie P's change-up back, because the Duce Staley experiment had failed.

    On the defense, two of our linebackers were Clark Haggans and Larry Foote, both of whom were journeyman level at best. Haggains benefited tremendously from having Porter on his other side. Foote only grew to anything more than journeyman after he came back from Detroit and took over the LILB position the following year.

    ________

    So, did we have a talented team? Yes. But anyone who thinks that all Tomlin had to do was come in and make sure he stayed out of the way is fooling themselves. He dealt with a host of potentially locker room splitting problems, two accusations against his franchise QB, complete turnover on his o line with nobody waiting in the wings that was anything close to ready to play (thank you very much, Russ Grimm), a host of wide receivers that couldn't catch the football except for Hines Ward, a one-man run game with no one who could relieve him effectively, and the two biggest moves on defense to stabilize a very short bench was bringing in old man Chad Brown, Rodney Bailey (our cut from the previous year) and hoping beyond hope that Travis Kirschke could still play if called upon.


  2. #122
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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by steelreserve View Post
    No, I didn't mean it that way; I just had yours in there as the start of the argument that people were responding to you. 2006 was really a letdown year for a lot of reasons, including the coach and probably a lot of the veteran players mailing it in. That doesn't excuse the performance, but I don't think the record was really a true characterization of the talent level of that team.
    OK, just wanted to make sure

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by fansince'76 View Post
    A 15-1 team that went 6-10 the season before and peaked in late October of that year and got embarrassed at home in yet another AFCCG, and won the SB team as a 6th seed that barely made the playoffs and played so poorly in the SB that everyone that isn't a Steelers fan still think they got gifted the game by the refs.

    IOW, a very flawed team.
    The 2004 (15-1) team barely beat the Jets in the playoffs. Barely. The Jets' kicker missed 2 FGs and we played at home. We struggled and barely won. People forget that game. I don't. I was in a Steelers bar and we all had 911 on speed dial and too many shots of I can't remember.



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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by tube517 View Post
    The 2004 (15-1) team barely beat the Jets in the playoffs. Barely. The Jets' kicker missed 2 FGs and we played at home. We struggled and barely won. People forget that game. I don't. I was in a Steelers bar and we all had 911 on speed dial and too many shots of I can't remember.
    The problem in 2004, the Steelers have had their peak too soon...But it was a special season for me, since the Steelers had finally had a franchise QB and a 15-1 seasons are very rare in the NFL.

    Cowher would have deserved to win the COY in 2004 too.

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by polamalubeast View Post
    The problem in 2004, the Steelers have had their peak too soon...But it was a special season for me, since the Steelers had finally had a franchise QB and a 15-1 seasons are very rare in the NFL.

    Cowher would have deserved to win the COY in 2004 too.
    They peaked too soon and got tired. That was the last great "running" team of the Steelers. It was power running and Sweatpants model Duce probably would have come close to the rushing title had he not gotten injured. They did what they could with a rookie QB.

    Cowher's masterpiece was the playoff run of 2005. 8 straight games to the title. He finally had the balls to play to win.



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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by st33lersguy View Post
    I noticed my comment was on there, I hope I didn't imply that Tomlin didn't inherit an excellent team (because I was implying that he did).
    As for your comment, it puts to rest the insane idea that Tomlin didn't inherit a loaded team. Plus had Ben not been rushed back after the apendectomy (and especially after the concussion he suffered in Atlanta) they make the playoffs in 2006. Even with Ben being rushed back with the appendectomy, the 2006 team was a Ricardo Colclough fumble, a Nate Washington false start, and a Charlie Batch start (after Ben's concussion) away from 11-5
    Besides Ben, how was the offense "loaded?" The offensive line sucked - for years. Willie Parker was the feature back - a HUGE step down from the Bus. Ward was our best WR - for years. That's NOT a loaded offense. And 2/3 of our salary cap was tied up in - wait for it - the defense during the same time period, which is exactly why it wasn't a loaded offense. A part of me still wonders why Ben didn't ask for a trade years ago.

    I'll say it again - a good team. Not a great one.

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by fansince'76 View Post
    Besides Ben, how was the offense "loaded?" The offensive line sucked - for years. Willie Parker was the feature back - a HUGE step down from the Bus. Ward was our best WR - for years. That's NOT a loaded offense. And 2/3 of our salary cap was tied up in - wait for it - the defense during the same time period.

    I'll say it again - a good team. Not a great one.

    Wait, wait ... I thought Parker was supposed one of the best backs in the league. You're just one of those fans who can never seem to stop being obsessed with Bettis and hates on Parker just because he has a different style!

    Everyone knows that force equals velocity plus SPEED, so if you have 4.3 speed in the 40 and crashed directly into a lineman's ass at a dead sprint, you would theoretically move the pile about 4 inches more than an average running back. Parker was balls-out the greatest RB in the history of the Steelers, or maybe the world ... *BAM!* the world.
    See you Space Cowboy ...

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by steelreserve View Post
    Wait, wait ... I thought Parker was supposed one of the best backs in the league.
    NEVER made that claim. Just said he didn't suck out loud as badly as many claimed. He certainly wasn't as bad as Walter Abercrombie.

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by fansince'76 View Post
    Besides Ben, how was the offense "loaded?" The offensive line sucked - for years. Willie Parker was the feature back - a HUGE step down from the Bus. Ward was our best WR - for years. That's NOT a loaded offense. And 2/3 of our salary cap was tied up in - wait for it - the defense during the same time period, which is exactly why it wasn't a loaded offense. A part of me still wonders why Ben didn't ask for a trade years ago.

    I'll say it again - a good team. Not a great one.
    He inherited a championship caliber team with a slew of pro bowlers who have made contributions to 2 Super Bowl wins in just 4 years (1 before and 1 after tomlin's arrival). It was a team with a lot of talent and championship pedigree. That is more than just a good team to me. No they weren't the caliber of the 70s steelers but extremely few teams in nfl history were. It is very tough to win just one Super Bowl in the nfl, let alone 2 in 4 years

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by fansince'76 View Post
    NEVER made that claim. Just said he didn't suck out loud as badly as many claimed. He certainly wasn't as bad as Walter Abercrombie.

    If you couldn't tell I was being a doof, then I must be off my game.

    Besides, everyone knows Bettis has been dead for years - I heard it on Meatspin.
    See you Space Cowboy ...

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Parker was balls-out the greatest RB in the history of the Steelers, or maybe the world ... *BAM!* the world.
    I seem to remember a guy named Bo Jackson. Just sayin'.

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    No reason to fire tomlin. Steelers went to the superbowl in 2010 season. Arians is around and they go 12-4 in 2011. So what do they do to a great team? They fire the OC (whose doing a bang-up job in ARZ) and bring in Haley who promptly brings the team to the gutters. With the arrival of Haley came more frequent trap games. He is the reason. Keep tomlin. I don't know why haley was hired in the first place.

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by steelreserve View Post
    If you couldn't tell I was being a doof, then I must be off my game.

    Besides, everyone knows Bettis has been dead for years - I heard it on Meatspin.
    Sorry - my sarcasm meter's on the blink today.

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Did Tomlin turn the ball over 4 times yesterday?



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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    No reason to fire tomlin. Steelers went to the superbowl in 2010 season. Arians is around and they go 12-4 in 2011. So what do they do to a great team? They fire the OC (whose doing a bang-up job in ARZ) and bring in Haley who promptly brings the team to the gutters. With the arrival of Haley came more frequent trap games. He is the reason. Keep tomlin. I don't know why haley was hired in the first place.

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    No reason to fire tomlin. Steelers went to the superbowl in 2010 season. Arians is around and they go 12-4 in 2011. So what do they do to a great team? They fire the OC (whose doing a bang-up job in ARZ) and bring in Haley who promptly brings the team to the gutters. With the arrival of Haley came more frequent trap games. He is the reason. Keep tomlin. I don't know why haley was hired in the first place.
    If the Steelers miss the playoffs this year and next year, the Steelers have no reason to have Tomlin as HC in 2016

    His contract ends in 2016, so if the Steelers continue to have the same problems, the Steelers will need a change and I include Colbert.

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by steelreserve View Post
    If you couldn't tell I was being a doof, then I must be off my game.

    Besides, everyone knows Bettis has been dead for years - I heard it on Meatspin.





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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    I'm not one advocating firing Tomlin. But he and his staff did get out x's and o'd by Rex Ryan and his staff. Rex can't make that claim too often. Not a good thing when you're the only nitwit that managed to get outcoached by Rex.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPgh View Post
    that is not a good reason

  20. #140
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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Tomlin came in was told to stay out of lebeaus way and won a super bowl, with possibly. One of the best defenses ever Wow.
    Merry Christmas

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by polamalubeast View Post
    If the Steelers miss the playoffs this year and next year, the Steelers have no reason to have Tomlin as HC in 2016

    His contract ends in 2016, so if the Steelers continue to have the same problems, the Steelers will need a change and I include Colbert.
    I think Kevin would be gone before Mike.

  22. #142
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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by stillers4me View Post
    Did Tomlin turn the ball over 4 times yesterday?

    no but he signed off on a game plan that not only permitted it to happen but also would show a sign brighter than the brightest of billboards with flashing neon lights saying WTF you thinking to anyone with any football sense to attack the strength of the opponent instead of their weakness ...

    so yes in a way he not only turned the ball over 4 times but did so with malice and premeditation

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    The Steelers wanted to get Bell into the game early, and that's what they did. Bell touched the ball on 11 of the first 19 plays, but on only 10 of the final 42 plays. Bell had 69 total yards.

    • The Jets continued a recent trend in how to control Bell — grab him out of the backfield and not let him get into the route. The Jets were called with holding once but had trouble getting free when he wasn't lined up wide as a receiver.



    Roethlisberger threw passes behind the line of scrimmage on seven of his first 10 throws, including five in a row.

    Read more: http://triblive.com/sports/steelers/...#ixzz3Il5cgfVv
    Follow us: @triblive on Twitter | triblive on Facebook

    To expand on what Dwins said. This was your early game plan. Force feed the ball to Bell. Which of course plays to the Jets defensive strength. And throw short passes. Again "taking advantage" of the Jets exceptional front 7.

    The Jets did game plan to take away or limit the Steelers downfield passing, playing their corners way off the wr's and keeping their safeties back. ( when not blitzing) Had we recognized what they were doing early and meaningfully adjusted we could have destroyed them on intermediate routes all game. Unlike the Patriots we don't adjust and adapt specific to opponent and particularly on the fly.

    Our staff got it's ass handed to them by Rex Ryan. Again think that over, then tell me how it was all about our players lack of execution.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

  24. #144
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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    when you are out coached by coaches with an hour glass sitting beside their soon to be negated contracts , it should tell you something about yourself ... Tomlin refuses to look into that mirror

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwinsgames View Post
    no but he signed off on a game plan that not only permitted it to happen but also would show a sign brighter than the brightest of billboards with flashing neon lights saying WTF you thinking to anyone with any football sense to attack the strength of the opponent instead of their weakness ...

    so yes in a way he not only turned the ball over 4 times but did so with malice and premeditation
    I'm not disagreeing with you or anybody that is criticizing you any anyone else about the game plan. It was awful. Ben said something about there being no one open to throw to. Now, I'm just a chick so I know next to nothing about a game that I've never played, right? So, we line up for a play and they read it and line up the defense to defend what they are seeing. Must have been pretty obvious. The worst secondary in the league just covered all our receivers to the point where we had no options? And we kept calling running plays against a third string secondary? Because they were working so well? The game plan for the last three games worked so maybe we'll go back and try that other stuff and this time they work better? I guess my little female brain doesn't understand this big, bad macho game enough.




    Neither Tomlin nor Haley turned the ball over. Ball security is a basic fundamental, even in a poorly designed game plan. Period. That's the players job.

    Blame goes to everybody in this loss. Coaches and players=big fat goats.



  26. #146
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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by stillers4me View Post
    I'm not disagreeing with you or anybody that is criticizing you any anyone else about the game plan. It was awful. Ben said something about there being no one open to throw to. Now, I'm just a chick so I know next to nothing about a game that I've never played, right? So, we line up for a play and they read it and line up the defense to defend what they are seeing. Must have been pretty obvious. The worst secondary in the league just covered all our receivers to the point where we had no options? And we kept calling running plays against a third string secondary? Because they were working so well? The game plan for the last three games worked so maybe we'll go back and try that other stuff and this time they work better? I guess my little female brain doesn't understand this big, bad macho game enough.




    Neither Tomlin nor Haley turned the ball over. Ball security is a basic fundamental, even in a poorly designed game plan. Period. That's the players job.

    Blame goes to everybody in this loss. Coaches and players=big fat goats.
    lets skip past the chick not understanding the game as I do not know how well or little you understand the intimate details of the game , nor is it important here really

    just 1 example ....

    The brown fumble 2 yards past LOS ...

    Its not a smart play to throw the football against an aggressive front 7 to the LOS where 300 pound men are throwing their bodies around and you are expecting a 185 pound man to not only make the catch but battle those men to get free ... bad things happen in short order with little men vs big men in small areas ...

    Brown could not have been covered down field when he was at the LOS when the pass took place , neither could anyone else in that short order hence it was the play call not a dump off because nobody was open ... result fumble falling forward 2 yards from the point of the catch being made

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    After playing lights out the past 3 weeks, how can you NOT BE UP for the jets. Supposedly and easy win game to more or less seal the division and you let it crap itself. This team is pathetic. I just can't watch anymore. I don't need this crap. Not entertaining anymore. If THEY aren't wanting to win, why the hell do I need to want them to ? Screw 'em.

  28. #148
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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose View Post
    After playing lights out the past 3 weeks, how can you NOT BE UP for the jets. Supposedly and easy win game to more or less seal the division and you let it crap itself. This team is pathetic. I just can't watch anymore. I don't need this crap. Not entertaining anymore. If THEY aren't wanting to win, why the hell do I need to want them to ? Screw 'em.
    see ya hear next Sunday right after the game

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwinsgames View Post
    see ya hear next Sunday right after the game
    LOL, yea, you're probably right. You just never know how they are going to play week to week. The only NFL team that is inconsistent as hell. You would think they would have to make changes sometime, somewhere, to somebody.....please.

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    Re: FIRE MIKE TOMLIN!!

    Been thinking about the Harrison insertion on first and goal. Has he blinded these coaches to the point where they think he is the second coming? Why oh why was Harrison brought in? Not to block either, but to catch a pass. Whoever came up with this plan needs 40 lashes and if it wasn't Tomlin, he deserves 40 himself for letting this play get called.

    Is Harrison going for some kind of record? If he wants a TD, go get a pick 6, other wise, stay off the field on any Offensive plays.

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