Okay.Originally Posted by polamalubeast
I once say a picture of Kate Upton that wasn't very good.
Michael Jordan occasionally missed a shot. Or, two.
And, YES, the Steelers did not score on every single 2-minute drill... just more so than every other team in the NFL.
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Please enough with the stats. If you can't see the Steelers have trouble executing a 2 minute offense or even a 5 minute offense then you just haven't been paying attention for the past few seasons.
The Steelers burn more clock on less plays when they try to score in a hurry than any team out there. I'm in a hurry now, but if you need examples then you probably just need a new team, because you sure as hell haven't paid much attention to this one.
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A lot more fg's than td's, and how many of those were of no consequense? I mean that last td against Pats meant nothing, but if you want to credit it as a success, good for you. I wont.Okay.
I once say a picture of Kate Upton that wasn't very good.
Michael Jordan occasionally missed a shot. Or, two.
And, YES, the Steelers did not score on every single 2-minute drill... just more so than every other team in the NFL.
The Steelers hurry up offense is as often as not painful to watch.
"A man's got to know his limitations."
Wait... earlier someone said that Tomlin was more concerned with TOP than with scoring points.
Ergo, I talked about the only stat that matters: points scored during those 2-minute drills.... and, the Steelers were #1.
But, YES, other teams sure did look great while simultaneously not scoring points.
100% agree
A lot of teams have "meaningless" TDs scored in the final 2-minutes... not just the Steelers.
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When I get to Ky I'll offer you up some of the Steelers Chinese fire drill type 2 minute drills if you like. The ones where they waste time outs and clock with equal aplomb. But I'm out the door now so it will have to wait a day.
"A man's got to know his limitations."
KY???
The Chargers sure looked pretty on their 2-minute drill at the end of the half. River was flawlessly using the clock... and threw an INT. Zero points.
BB looked like a baffoon: wasting time outs, not getting out of bounds, and having Heyward-Bey drop that TD. At least the Steelers got 3 points.
Except that the table ACTUAL says that the Steelers played as the 8th FASTEST team when they were down 7 or more points. Also, the site clearly indicates that "The intent is to describe pace as dictated by each team's game plan or style of play, not pace that is situation-induced. The current definition discards plays when the score differential is greater than 10 points in the first half, plays when the score differential is greater than 8 points in the 3rd quarter, plays in the 4th quarter or overtime, and plays in the last five minutes of the first half.". So it discounts ALL of the plays that we were originally talking about, the end of half/game.
The only column that SORT of takes that into account is losing by 7 or more, and then they really ramp up the pace (this is the 2nd to last column). Looking at the last column, other teams that are similar to the Steelers overall slow ranking (24) are Dallas (31), Seattle (28), and SF (23). Those are all similarly RB centric offenses. Hmmmm....wonder what the pattern could be there...
If you are scoring the 7th most points in the league, running the 6th most offensive plays, 4th in percentage of drives ending in points, still lead the league in taking the longest per drive (2 minutes and 59 seconds - which is only 30 seconds LONGER than the league average and 53 seconds longer than the shortest team - the Eagles), AND be 2nd in time of possession per game behind the best rushing team in football (Dallas) - how is that a bad thing?
Does anyone want this defense on the field more frequently?
Yeah... but, BB looked stupid.
Yeah. Let's ignore stats and trends.
But we can look at outliers and biased personal perceptions as sound evidence instead!
Good lord, this is a waste of time.
I just can't help myself. You do realize that NONE of the things said in your post are facts? They are ALL personal perceptions?
In 2014 the Steelers had 9 touchdowns that came in the 2 minute drill tied for second in the league. Roethlisberger threw for 224 more yards in the 2 minute drill than any other QB in the league and produced 7 TDs against 1 INT.
If you go to five minutes or less in a half or game the Steelers are tied for 3rd in TDs @ 13. Roethlisberger continues to be a stats leader.
These are facts. Perhaps what you are really railing against is the red zone or overall drive efficiency rates? Let's take a look (Oh NO! More stats!):
In 2014, the Steelers were 4th in % of drives ending in scores. However, you are more than right that their efficiency in the red zone stinks. Coming in at #19 in the league with 51.72% of red zone possessions resulting in a TD. But that is not the end all be all stat, as Oakland lead the league at over 70%.
So the Steelers play fast enough, they just can't put it in the endzone more than 50% of the time they get inside the 20. That is likely where the real problem lies, not in pacing.
But we can talk about pacing all damn day if you guys want.
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I have been a proponent of taking penalties when we are in the red zone so that we can get out of the red zone and increase our chance of scoring. I kid, somewhat.
I am not just talking to play faster at the end of each half, but also in the first and third quarter!
The Steelers were 20th for points scored in the first quarter and 29th in the 3rd quarter.
https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/sta...oints-per-game
https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/sta...oints-per-game
The Steelers must be more aggressive in this situations, otherwise it wastes the talent on offense.
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The steelers are always been terrible in the situation football and this is a another problem
And they were 2nd in second quarter points and 1st in fourth quarter points. That gives us 6th in first half points and 10th in second half points. Not great, but top third of the league in either measure.
I think what you and others are really frustrated by is not the pace (# of plays run) but the result of those plays. In other words, getting into the red zone 3 times and instead of coming away with 21 points, coming away with 9 or less! No that is something I can get on board with.
Joking aside, RED-ZONE efficiency is the offense's biggest problem... (not how pretty the 2-minute drill looks).
I've averred for years, that if they could turn two FGs per game into TDs, this offense would be #1 in the league. They've improved, but not by much. As in: they should have easily put up 35 last Thursday. Alas...
They should have hung 40+ on them, even without Bell and Bryant. For as much as people are on the "OMG! The Steelers defense is a steaming pile of shit!" bandwagon, the Patriots defense looks almost as bad.
With the exception of last year, the Patriots have always been one of the worst teams in yards given, but they were always in the top 10 in points allowed because they are great in the red zone defense and good for create turnovers.
The Steelers are terrible in defense in the red zone since the start of the season including the preseason and of course, they create no turnovers,this is the big difference between the pats defense and the steelers defense
Last Thursday night, the Steelers offense stopped themselves, was my point.
I know, huh.
They were slobbering all over Malcolm Butler... who gave up the second most passing yards of the entire weekend.
why, because they don't support your argument and in fact contradict what you're saying?
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Abbreviation for Kentucky. Where I spent the last thirteen hours driving to. Now I'm going to get some sleep. Later I'll give examples. r
"A man's got to know his limitations."
KY for Kentucky.
In my defense, I am so used to these young people using letters for phrases (BRB = be right back, FWIW = for what it's worth) that the abbreviation for a state never even crossed my mind.
I was was racking my brain trying to figure out "KY". I settled on the phrase "key you" (as in: I'll use a keyboard and type you a response.) Anyway...
Ouch!...This is pathetic!
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Those cool shades make everything rosy.
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KY for Kentucky.
In my defense, I am so used to these young people using letters for phrases (BRB = be right back, FWIW = for what it's worth) that the abbreviation for a state never even crossed my mind.
I was was racking my brain trying to figure out "KY". I settled on the phrase "key you" (as in: I'll use a keyboard and type you a response.) Anyway...
No problem. And listen, I'm not anti Tomlin. I don't want him fired. I think he's a very good coach. Sure I blow off a bit of steam in his general direction after a loss, but I realize he's not going anywhere nor do I want him to.
But all that said I don't think a lot of the criticism directed his way is unfair.( though obviously some is) I think there's a lot of rationale posters and fans who point out valid points of concern. For instance I think there's been multiple times the Steelers have butchered clock management at critical moments, though at the moment due to overwork my brain is fried and I can't put my finger on specific instances. For example I remember SB XV there was some real sloppy clock management at the end of the game. It didn't seem as though we got nearly as many plays off as we should have.
Also a couple games last year where I vaguely remember using time outs and clock and getting few actual plays off. Maybe Tampa Bay, and Saints game last year? Again my brain is fried, been driving to the legal limit for about 3 weeks and I can't quite put my finger on it, nor will I probably get around to remembering the specifics I need to support my argument anytime soon, so I'll concede the point.
I got more important things to do with my time at the moment than arguing Steelers clock management.
So there you go. You win.
"A man's got to know his limitations."
Those cool shades make everything rosy.
Just listened to this and couldn't believe it. I really wish David Todd would just respond straight up to that like "are you fucking serious with that answer?".
I made a thread after his post game presser about some of the stuff he says and once again there are only 2 ways I can see this. Tomlin is either the biggest bullshitter in the world or he is really that dumb. Honestly I am leaning towards the latter. I know he bullshits some, but this would just be beyond believable. He is a moron.
I hear you. I really do.No problem. And listen, I'm not anti Tomlin. I don't want him fired. I think he's a very good coach. Sure I blow off a bit of steam in his general direction after a loss, but I realize he's not going anywhere nor do I want him to.
But all that said I don't think a lot of the criticism directed his way is unfair.( though obviously some is) I think there's a lot of rationale posters and fans who point out valid points of concern. For instance I think there's been multiple times the Steelers have butchered clock management at critical moments, though at the moment due to overwork my brain is fried and I can't put my finger on specific instances. For example I remember SB XV there was some real sloppy clock management at the end of the game. It didn't seem as though we got nearly as many plays off as we should have.
Also a couple games last year where I vaguely remember using time outs and clock and getting few actual plays off. Maybe Tampa Bay, and Saints game last year? Again my brain is fried, been driving to the legal limit for about 3 weeks and I can't quite put my finger on it, nor will I probably get around to remembering the specifics I need to support my argument anytime soon, so I'll concede the point.
I got more important things to do with my time at the moment than arguing Steelers clock management.
So there you go. You win.
Obviously, no coach is perfect. Noll wasn't. Cowher wasn't. And, Tomlin isn't. I've had my qualms about each of them... and, Yes, fans have the "right" (for lack of a better word) to vent after a loss.
But, threads entitled "Fire _____!!!" are generally just bitch-fest, filled with fans seeking (unattainable) perfection.
From having been on many different boards, the problem is that sometimes Steelers fans have a sense of entitlement. (I'm not saying you do... at all. But, some fans do.) For example, there was a certain board where I got banned for celebrating after XLIII. All that the mods wanted to do was rip Richard BeLeau for allowing the Cardinals to come back. They couldn't even enjoy the victory, because the victory wasn't "perfect." Those are the same types of fans who get angry when the opposition scores ANY points in a game.
Perfection is not reality, and in turn, some fans never happy... and in turn, they come here to create threads about firing people.
Have Tomlin's teams misused timeouts on occasion? Yes
Have Tomlin's teams led the league in scoring on 2-minute drives? Yes
While I understand the plight (the 2-minute offense could be better), and while I admit that a timeout might get wasted here & there, the Steelers still run the most productive 2-minute drill in the NFL. Make sense?
If we are going to talk gripes, I am far more concerns about the drives that stall in the red-zone.
SUMMATION:
Worrying about the 2-minute drill is akin to worrying about the gas mileage on your Lamboughini. Whereas, the red-zone efficiency is a broken radiator hose. The latter is a "fix now."
Re: SB XLV
There was plenty of time; so, they did not need to stop the clock. That said, YES, Tomlin should have called a time out to get everyone on the same page*. As it was Randle El ran the wrong play, wasting a down.
*(Tomlin called a timeout during the middle of the final drive of SB XLIII, to do just that: get everyone on the same page. Alas...)
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Fair enough teegre.
I will disagree slightly one thing though. Noll wasn't perfect, but damn was he good.Looking back in retrospect he made some terrible personell moves. Sometimes his loyalty outweighed his commons sense. For instance I had a neighbor who was one of the ground crew at 3 Rivers. He said at the time when Mark Malone was given shot after shot to hold the qb job that one of the reasons Noll kept with it was because he felt guilty that Malone blew out his knee playing wr at Noll's request. People don't remember Malone was one of the fastest guys on the team prior to blowing out his knee. Genuine 4.5 speed when that was a rarity. Anyway Noll felt he owed Mark more of a chance than what his talent after the injury warranted. Also there were examples of keeping a washed up Dwight White over an emerging Dwayne Board. etc...
But to the point. Talent aside. Find me the team or the time Noll got beat by an inferior team? Very rare. His record as a favorite was virtually without parallel.He got the most out of the talent he had. And unlike today's coaches, he could coach every single position on the field with competency . .
"A man's got to know his limitations."
I gotta find me a pair so I can be cool too:Those cool shades make everything rosy.
9 years is long enough for coach Switzer. Time to move on and hire a real head coach.
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