The "N-word".

[zulater]

I was listening to a podcast of Around the Horn the other day and they brought up an incident from 20 odd years ago where Clippers owner David Sterling used the so called "N-word" during the interview process with prospective coach Rollie Massimino. Believe it or not all on the panel believed that Sterling should be disciplined by NBA commisioner David Stern over a word allegedly spoken that long ago. I mean does anyone have a recording of the incident?

But regardless, while I found that amusing that's not why I started this thread. I started this thread because of the silliness of labeling the commonly used word in the black community "******" as the "N-word" anytime a non black person uses it. And further taking that commonly used word and making it career threatening to the user anytime a non black person dares to use it.

Don't get me wrong, I don't use the word ( but admittedly have done so in the past) nor am I seeking permission for whites to use it. But you know who does use the term? Teenagers. That's who. I know this because I'm the father of one and I have heard him and his friends use this term towards each other on several occasions. I didn't let it pass. I made it quite clear to my son that I didn't want his using that word, and also that he was to make it known to his buddies that word was never to be uttered on my property. And if I heard them doing so again they would be asked to exit the property post haste.

This of course pissed off my son, because he tried to explain that they weren't using this term in a negative way. And truth be told his immediate group of friends is pretty much a mixed pot racially. There's a Puerto Rican, a Jew, a couple black kids, a mixed race kid, and a several whites.Anyway they use this term loosely often in reference to the collective of themselves. "come on my ******s".

So where does this come from I ask? Answer black comics and rappers, who these kids listen to all the time. Well I knew rap music was loaded with the usage of the word, but I wasn't really aware that it was that commonplace for black comics to use it. So I took some time and listened to a couple commedians he referenced. Start with Kat Williams. I heard him do several bits where he reference's his young son ( sounded to be somewhere around 3-5 years of age) as comics often do, except that he kept calling his kid "******". "This little ****** did this. That ****** did that." And the audience howled with laughter in the background every single time. I could go on and reference a few more, ( Dave Chappel comes to minds) but most of you know they're out there.

Also from what i can gather in their own neighborhoods blacks have no reservation or hesitation using that term towards one another.


But I did hear some explanation for why it's all right for blacks to use the word and whites not to I think it was from Mr Kat Williams. Something along the lines that the black man's suffering for 300 years granted him that license. But at the same token he made it clear that any white that uses said term is asking for an ass kicking or worse. It's almost as if the word has become some sort of bait and switch tactic. A trap if you will. Use the term loosely among yourselves as if it has no deeper meaning. But let a white use the term and bam, we come down on you and take away anything you've got.

So to start with this is the worst sort of hypocracy. And kids more than anyone see through this bullshit. Thus if you use the word liberally in your raps, your comedy and amongst yourselves in a jocular manner, some kids that aren't the right color but are inversted and immersed in your culture will do so as well.

Now to address the point that the suffering of the past bought you this word. Bullshit!

1) You were never a slave, nor were your parents or grandparents.

2) Most whites don't descend from slave owners. The fact is many of us don't have ancestors that were in this country prior to the civil war. Me personally, my mother is English born, and my dad's descendents arrived in this country in the late 19th century. Even with whites who's ancestory descend back to slave days, most of them came from common folk who were barely doing better than the slaves. It's probably about 75-1 odds against any given white person you come upon descending from slave owners.

3) If you're a black American who's ancestory pre date's the Civil War you could very well have the blood of slave owner(s) coursing through your veins. Not trying to be nasty with this, but it's the truth. Chances are you owe yourself reperations more than your average white.

The new wave of genealogical testing also has reopened one of America's ugliest wounds by confirming with science what historians have contended for generations: In slavery times and beyond, large numbers of black women were impregnated by white slave owners or other white men in positions of power.

About 30% of black Americans who take DNA tests to determine their African lineage prove to be descended from Europeans on their father's side, says Rick Kittles, scientific director of African Ancestry, a Washington, D.C., company that began offering the tests in 2003. Almost all black Americans whom Kittles has tested descended from African women, he says.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/tech/...mericans_x.htm

So what's my point? If the word is that horrible that we can't even type it on this board. That grown newscasters when forced to use the word in a story have to resort to the silliness of calling it the "N-word." The dreaded "N word"!!! It's like Lord Voldemart in Harry Potter for Christ's sake? Anyway if the word is that vile and toxic, don't anyone fucking use it! And if it's really not such a bad word then take away it's value and make it no worse than any other rude word. In other words context! If it has a proper usage in context then it's obviously not the worst word in the world after all! Shocking!

And quit using it as a club every time someone stupidly slips it out, especially if it was 20 effing years ago!

You want a small number. How's this then? The number of people that never used a deragatory racial term in their life!

Sorry for the rant but I'm sick of hypocracy in all forms!

[GBMelBlount]

Unbelievable.

I wonder how liberals would react if a white person with tourettes started screaming it.

Talk about a PC conundrum.

[GoSlash27]

I wonder how liberals would react if a white person with tourettes started screaming it.

Talk about a PC conundrum.

That's funny right there

The whole thing is political correctness run amok IMO. It's all in the context of how it's used. Teens are using the word "nigga" in the same context as the word "dude", which is a fundamentally good thing. It dilutes the meaning of the word to the point where it loses any hurtfulness it might've otherwise had. And while America is not and never will be 100% free of racism, neither are we living in Selma, Alabama in 1962.
We have moved on, and it's time to put on our big boy panties and quit pretending that race is an issue anymore.

[GBMelBlount]

That's funny right there

The whole thing is political correctness run amok IMO. It's all in the context of how it's used. Teens are using the word "nigga" in the same context as the word "dude", which is a fundamentally good thing. It dilutes the meaning of the word to the point where it loses any hurtfulness it might've otherwise had. And while America is not and never will be 100% free of racism, neither are we living in Selma, Alabama in 1962.
We have moved on, and it's time to put on our big boy panties and quit pretending that race is an issue anymore.

Race baiting is a powerful and effective tool.

In fact, liberals have very successfully perpetuated and exploited racism for political gain for many years.

[zulater]

That's funny right there

The whole thing is political correctness run amok IMO. It's all in the context of how it's used. Teens are using the word "nigga" in the same context as the word "dude", which is a fundamentally good thing. It dilutes the meaning of the word to the point where it loses any hurtfulness it might've otherwise had. And while America is not and never will be 100% free of racism, neither are we living in Selma, Alabama in 1962.
We have moved on, and it's time to put on our big boy panties and quit pretending that race is an issue anymore.

Great post slash!

That's the thing, it's just a word. We only make it powerfull by taking such great offense at it.

And by the way I think those black comics for the most part are hilarious.

[GoSlash27]

Unfortunately race baiting is a powerful and effective tool the liberals have very successfully exploited for political gain.

That they have, but they've overplayed their hand and it's starting to work against them.

[X-Terminator]

Slash nailed it, so I don't need to add much more. However, I still don't like the word and never use it in any context.

[smokin3000gt]

That they have, but they've overplayed their hand and it's starting to work against them.

Seems to be working pretty well for them [still] so far..

[Seven]

Great post, Zu. There are many double standards like this in our country that are ridiculous. I've been called "cracker" in settings that would shock you by people that would shock you. But I sure as hell know if I dropped "the N word" (very tempted just to use it since it's ONLY A WORD) in those same settings I would have gotten assaulted, sued or fired. Racial slurs are a product of thin skinned individuals. I get there is a history behind certain words that people deem offensive, but we should honestly be over it by now. And if it is TRULY offensive don't go around using it. I bet the vast majority of my generation of blacks uses the word to refer to friends. All of the black friends I have use it with the exception of maybe one guy. Double standards. We see it with every subset of our culture. I'm not saying whites or Latinos or Asians don't suffer from or benefit from them either, but the N word is a frustrating example and I'm glad you brought the topic up. Everyone should use it or no one should.

[zulater]

Great post, Zu. There are many double standards like this in our country that are ridiculous. I've been called "cracker" in settings that would shock you by people that would shock you. But I sure as hell know if I dropped "the N word" (very tempted just to use it since it's ONLY A WORD) in those same settings I would have gotten assaulted, sued or fired. Racial slurs are a product of thin skinned individuals. I get there is a history behind certain words that people deem offensive, but we should honestly be over it by now. And if it is TRULY offensive don't go around using it. I bet the vast majority of my generation of blacks uses the word to refer to friends. All of the black friends I have use it with the exception of maybe one guy. Double standards. We see it with every subset of our culture. I'm not saying whites or Latinos or Asians don't suffer from or benefit from them either, but the N word is a frustrating example and I'm glad you brought the topic up. Everyone should use it or no one should.

40 years ago the most offensive thing you could call a black man was boy. And it was a cut to the bone racial slam when white's said it.

[X-Terminator]

Great post, Zu. There are many double standards like this in our country that are ridiculous. I've been called "cracker" in settings that would shock you by people that would shock you. But I sure as hell know if I dropped "the N word" (very tempted just to use it since it's ONLY A WORD) in those same settings I would have gotten assaulted, sued or fired. Racial slurs are a product of thin skinned individuals. I get there is a history behind certain words that people deem offensive, but we should honestly be over it by now. And if it is TRULY offensive don't go around using it. I bet the vast majority of my generation of blacks uses the word to refer to friends. All of the black friends I have use it with the exception of maybe one guy. Double standards. We see it with every subset of our culture. I'm not saying whites or Latinos or Asians don't suffer from or benefit from them either, but the N word is a frustrating example and I'm glad you brought the topic up. Everyone should use it or no one should.

It's not that simple, though. I find the word to be highly offensive, and to me, it screams "ignorant racist." Since I am against racism and against ignorance, I am 100% against the use of the word, again, in any context. There's a reason why the word is censored in this forum and in most forums. However, I do understand and recognize when someone uses the word in a positive or negative way, as most of the members of my family use the "positive" connotation. I still cringe when I hear it, regardless.

[stillers4me]

It's not a nice word and I wish that everybody would quit using it. I do agree with Slash, though, that some words get used so much that the real meaning gets watered down to the point where it's just slang, and not necessarily derogatory anymore. The first time I heard my 70+ year old mother say "effin'", I about died!

[steeldawg]

Well its kinda of the same thing as the word bitch, girls call eachother bitch in a good way but you walk into a room full of women and say "yo bitches whats up" you might not walk out.

[vader29]

Well its kinda of the same thing as the word bitch, girls call eachother bitch in a good way but you walk into a room full of women and say "yo bitches whats up" you might not walk out.

Rick James could get away with it.

[steeldawg]

Rick James could get away with it.

That's only because he has incredible hair!

[Hindes204]

Well its kinda of the same thing as the word bitch, girls call eachother bitch in a good way but you walk into a room full of women and say "yo bitches whats up" you might not walk out.

Comparing the word nigga/er to bitch is just ridiculous

[tube517]

Rick James could get away with it.

Man, I miss Dave Chappelle's show.

[Craic]

It's not that simple, though. I find the word to be highly offensive, and to me, it screams "ignorant racist." Since I am against racism and against ignorance, I am 100% against the use of the word, again, in any context. There's a reason why the word is censored in this forum and in most forums. However, I do understand and recognize when someone uses the word in a positive or negative way, as most of the members of my family use the "positive" connotation. I still cringe when I hear it, regardless.

Exactly.

What so many people forget, is that it's not "just a word." Words are powerful. Words create and destroy. don't believe me? Try getting married without the words, "now I pronounce you husband and wife. (or husband and husband, or wife and wife . . . or whatever it is now a days).

Let's go back and look at how words are used in history, shall we? (I'm referring here to way in which words are used to subjugate people, not to the fact that it was Hitler, I'm not going for a Reductio Ad Hitler argument here).

"Jew"

Three words were introduced to the German language in the lead up to the holocaust. "Untermensch," or "subhuman" was used as a way to dehumanize Jews. "Judenschwein" or "Jewpig" and "Jewsow" were used also to dehumanize the Jews. The last two referenced a common depiction of Jews nursing on a sow. Hitler also pushed "Judenscheisse" or "Jewshit" when he "assigned the lowest possible value to something." Also, "verjudet" or "jewed" when a situation went pear shaped.

Doing this helped dehumanize the Jews in the German eyes to the point that most of them didn't blink when it came to the ghettos and subsequent train rides to the camps. Notice that the key here, was how he used "Jew" and turned the word itself into a derogatory name.

"Fetus"

Now before anyone gets their feathers all ruffled, hear me out. Even though Fetus (also faetus) was used since the 1500's, in medical journals, "baby" and "fetus" was synonymous. For instance, 1897 American Journal of Medical Sciences, page 370, "The circumstance were favorable for the descent of the child, and the head was delivered. . . the child's leg." Speaking of a woman shot while pregnant. "the child was killed by the shot."

However, in the lead up to abortion in law, "baby" was faded out, so that it is no longer a "baby" in the mother's stomach. It is ONLY a "fetus." Baby is not the correct term, and you will not find any medical journals that refer to the baby or child as such until after birth. Why? I submit once again, because using "fetus" dehumanizes the child, which then allows for the medical profession and people all over the country to support what would otherwise be considered murder (the taking of a human life, rather than the removal of a fetus).

Those are but two example. I could use "Jap/Nip" to reference how the American military desensitized serviceman in the Japanese theatre of war, not to mention "Kraut" in the western theatre.

In short, using such words allows the human mind to dissociation the object of those words from similarity to self. the result, is that the "other" becomes wholly other, and no longer in connection with any self-identification. Once that line is crossed, then we begin to accept things being done that we wouldn't otherwise accept.

Thus, when N****r is used, it has the same connotations as above. It's why "boy" "colored" etc. etc. all go in and out of fashion. Because in each period of time, a new way to dissociate and thus dehumanize a person is used.


So for those of you saying "it's just a word." No, it's not. Not by a long shot. Words have meaning, power, and create our reality.

[Mach1]

Well its kinda of the same thing as the word bitch, girls call eachother bitch in a good way but you walk into a room full of women and say "yo bitches whats up" you might not walk out.

Go out in public and yell each word and see which one gets your ass kicked the fastest.

[Chidi29]

Louis CK on why the "N Word" offends him.

[ALLD]

[zulater]

Exactly.

What so many people forget, is that it's not "just a word." Words are powerful. Words create and destroy. don't believe me? Try getting married without the words, "now I pronounce you husband and wife. (or husband and husband, or wife and wife . . . or whatever it is now a days).

Let's go back and look at how words are used in history, shall we? (I'm referring here to way in which words are used to subjugate people, not to the fact that it was Hitler, I'm not going for a Reductio Ad Hitler argument here).

"Jew"

Three words were introduced to the German language in the lead up to the holocaust. "Untermensch," or "subhuman" was used as a way to dehumanize Jews. "Judenschwein" or "Jewpig" and "Jewsow" were used also to dehumanize the Jews. The last two referenced a common depiction of Jews nursing on a sow. Hitler also pushed "Judenscheisse" or "Jewshit" when he "assigned the lowest possible value to something." Also, "verjudet" or "jewed" when a situation went pear shaped.

Doing this helped dehumanize the Jews in the German eyes to the point that most of them didn't blink when it came to the ghettos and subsequent train rides to the camps. Notice that the key here, was how he used "Jew" and turned the word itself into a derogatory name.

"Fetus"

Now before anyone gets their feathers all ruffled, hear me out. Even though Fetus (also faetus) was used since the 1500's, in medical journals, "baby" and "fetus" was synonymous. For instance, 1897 American Journal of Medical Sciences, page 370, "The circumstance were favorable for the descent of the child, and the head was delivered. . . the child's leg." Speaking of a woman shot while pregnant. "the child was killed by the shot."

However, in the lead up to abortion in law, "baby" was faded out, so that it is no longer a "baby" in the mother's stomach. It is ONLY a "fetus." Baby is not the correct term, and you will not find any medical journals that refer to the baby or child as such until after birth. Why? I submit once again, because using "fetus" dehumanizes the child, which then allows for the medical profession and people all over the country to support what would otherwise be considered murder (the taking of a human life, rather than the removal of a fetus).

Those are but two example. I could use "Jap/Nip" to reference how the American military desensitized serviceman in the Japanese theatre of war, not to mention "Kraut" in the western theatre.

In short, using such words allows the human mind to dissociation the object of those words from similarity to self. the result, is that the "other" becomes wholly other, and no longer in connection with any self-identification. Once that line is crossed, then we begin to accept things being done that we wouldn't otherwise accept.

Thus, when N****r is used, it has the same connotations as above. It's why "boy" "colored" etc. etc. all go in and out of fashion. Because in each period of time, a new way to dissociate and thus dehumanize a person is used.


So for those of you saying "it's just a word." No, it's not. Not by a long shot. Words have meaning, power, and create our reality.

Yet among normal society it's majoritively blacks that use the word freely.

[X-Terminator]

Chris Rock is the shiznit.

That is all.

[Hindes204]

Chris Rock is the shiznit.

That is all.

Chris Rock is my nigga

wait, is that politically incorrect?

[Hindes204]

I think this whole thing is a product of the society we live in. I grew up in Sheraden...for anyone that knows the Pittsburgh area knows that I was the minority as a white kid. I used the word nigga frequently as a kid, it's just the way I grew up. When I left the comfort of my ghetto for the military, I soon realized that that word was unacceptable. I was a young naive white kid who didnt know any better. It took me one party outside of my circle of friends to realize that is wasnt acceptable. As a 20 year old kid I didn't get it, but it took one incident with quite a few black guys to understand it was a word not to be uttered by white folk like me. I held my own but took a bit of an ass kicking by 7 different guys. I haven't used the word since

[Mach1]

I think this whole thing is a product of the society we live in. I grew up in Sheraden...for anyone that knows the Pittsburgh area knows that I was the minority as a white kid. I used the word nigga frequently as a kid, it's just the way I grew up. When I left the comfort of my ghetto for the military, I soon realized that that word was unacceptable. I was a young naive white kid who didnt know any better. It took me one party outside of my circle of friends to realize that is wasnt acceptable. As a 20 year old kid I didn't get it, but it took one incident with quite a few black guys to understand it was a word not to be uttered by white folk like me. I held my own but took a bit of an ass kicking by 7 different guys. I haven't used the word since

Should have said bitch instead.

[Dwinsgames]

late to the party on this one , but for me it is pretty simple ...

NOBODY should use it , at that point problem solved ...

its a vile word and has no value in any conversation IMO

some of my best friends are people of color and they NEVER use it for the same reasons I stated above

[Hindes204]

late to the party on this one , but for me it is pretty simple ...

NOBODY should use it , at that point problem solved ...

its a vile word and has no value in any conversation IMO

some of my best friends are people of color and they NEVER use it for the same reasons I stated above

racist

[Dwinsgames]

racist

Gee Thanks , Lol

[SCSTILLER]

My quick view on this subject, if the black community doesn't like it being used by anyone other than them (I am talking about "what's up my N!GG@" and blacks comedians using it in stand up comedy) then they shouldn't use it at all.

Also, I wonder what the difference is between individuals/groups that hate the N-word but are OK with the Washington Redskins team name?