Bill to allow gay marriage in Pennsylvania

[GoSlash27]

Up to Slash. Personally, not that interested. Just didn't want to see another page of your denials when you had not understood what Slash had said.

Nope. As I said, I'm not interested in arguing about his previous posts. If anyone has any doubts about what he did or did not say, it's a simple matter to go back and look.

I am still interested in discussing polygamy, tho'....

[steeldawg]

Nope. As I said, I'm not interested in arguing about his previous posts. If anyone has any doubts about what he did or did not say, it's a simple matter to go back and look.

I am still interested in discussing polygamy, tho'....

im not trying to argue it but your saying I said something I didn't say or even infer. I went back and looked I just asked for one example of me talking about how perfect gay life is.

[GoSlash27]

im not trying to argue it but your saying I said something I didn't say or even infer. I went back and looked I just asked for one example of me talking about how perfect gay life is.

Yeah you are trying to argue it, and for the last time I'm not interested. I say you did and you say you didn't, and anyone who cares to know can go back, look, and decide for themselves.

Polygamy, anyone?

[silver & black]

Polygamy, anyone?

Not sure how I feel about relationships in general, be they polygamous, polyamorous or monogamous.

I'm in the process of getting divorced after 27 years of marriage. I'm probably not the guy to give an opinion on any type of relationship.

[steeldawg]

Not sure how I feel about relationships in general, be they polygamous, polyamorous or monogamous.

I'm in the process of getting divorced after 27 years of marriage. I'm probably not the guy to give an opinion on any type of relationship.

why would anyone want to be a polygamist, one wife is bad enough. Could you imagine the alimony after a divorce.

[silver & black]

why would anyone want to be a polygamist, one wife is bad enough. Could you imagine the alimony after a divorce.

I'm in the process of imagining it right now. In a few months, I'll be experiencing it... probably to the point of living in a box under a bridge.

Sorry for the thread derail.

[steeldawg]

I'm in the process of imagining it right now. In a few months, I'll be experiencing it... probably to the point of living in a box under a bridge.

Sorry for the thread derail.

Im sorry buddy ive never gone through it but I know many who have, its not really a derail because divorce would be a real interesting dynamic of a polygamist marriage.

[GoSlash27]

I'm in the process of imagining it right now. In a few months, I'll be experiencing it... probably to the point of living in a box under a bridge.

Sorry for the thread derail.

I feel ya, Bro'. Divorce is no fun, and usually the folks who make out like fat bandits are the lawyers.

I almost fell into the polyamory trap once myself, so I can relate to folks who might want to do it. But in my case, it would've been the biggest mistake of my life. <-- not that *that* is an argument against legalizing it.

I personally have no issue with other people who want to live that way, but how such arrangements would get regulated legally could turn into a real hairball. Even the paperwork would be a nightmare.

^ Like Steeldawg said; how would divorce work? I have no idea...

[smokin3000gt]

Child support is one thing but alimony is f'n rediculius and a good reason by itself to never get married in modern times. Until divorce court gets with the times there will be a ton of of people like myself who will never get married. My GF of 8 years isnt real excited about it but I dont feel I have a choice.

Sent from my Samsung Doo Hicky using Tapatalk 2.

[7SteelGal43]

Here is the perspective of one conservative Christian lesbian. (that'd be me). Since the original topic is same sex marriage, I'll address that first. Simply put, no. I do not support same sex marriage. Maybe because I am a Christian first and would never want to see the govt forcing the Church to go against it's beliefs. After all, libs love to remind anyone who will listen that there is a separation of Church and state, right ? Don't infringe. Personally, I've never felt denied anything. I mean, I can shack up with whomever I want. I can even have a ceremony to commemorate the union. So what if it isn't in a Church with the Church's blessing ? Let me point out here that I have attended Church all my life and never felt uncomfortable nor been shunned nor been asked to leave. And no, I've never attended a 'gay is ok' church. As for certain civil rights the gay and lesbian community are stating aren't afforded them, same sex civil unions is a viable and perfectly acceptable answer. The same percentage opposed to same sex marriage do support same sex civil unions (give or take few percentage points). Heck, some companies already offer benefits to workers and their partners. 'Partners' pffft...what am I in business with them ? I plan on calling my future soulmate my 'wife'. In the end, I think it's an effort on the part of the gay and lesbian community to feel validated way more than it is about 'civil rights' or the same rights as hetero married couples. I mean, if it WERE about rights, why would they (we) not jump on same sex civil unions and leave the Church out of it ? Again, why infringe if the same outcome can be acheived without doing so ? I'm sure 'in your face' is nowhere in the book 'how to win friends and influence people'.

Born that way or a choice ? I try not to argue this point with such dogma because honestly, I know me. I was 'born this way'. I've known since my earliest memories, my very first crushes. But at the same time, I know a girl who suddenly, in her mid 20s, decided to go (with her husband) to a lesbian bar. She picked up some random chick. Next thing you know, she's divorced and has only been with women since. Yeah. Kinda whack. Knowing this girl like I do, I believe she thrives on 'being shocking'. And though that might, on the surface, prove that homosexuality is a mental disorder, I have never thought of myself as having a mental disorder. In my case, it's a matter of the heart, not the mind. In the example I used of the 20 something, well, she is 'mental', but not just because she now loves women.

And since it's been brought up in many posts - procreation, infidelity, promiscuity, breakups, stds, divorce...I'm not sure those are valid arguments (pro or con) when it comes to same sex unions. Granted, hiv/aids (the 'gay' disease) is the worst of the worst std's without a doubt. But std's have been around for ions in the hetero and homo community. Nearly half of all marriages end in divorce. Hell, my grandmother, a hetero woman, was married 5 times. Some hetero married couples can't have children. Should they not be allowed to 'couple up' because they can't procreate ? I'll be honest, I haven't done a lot of research as far as whether cheating and promiscuity are more prevalent in the hetero or homo community or if stds are more rampant in the hetero or homo community, but let's be honest. If you use any of those as a reason to oppose same sex marriage or unions, then I suppose you'd have to oppose hetero marriage or unions too, since they are by no means exclusive to the homo community.

Now, allow me to end with a little levity. Ever seen a lesbian with a hardon ?

[zulater]

Here is the perspective of one conservative Christian lesbian. (that'd be me). Since the original topic is same sex marriage, I'll address that first. Simply put, no. I do not support same sex marriage. Maybe because I am a Christian first and would never want to see the govt forcing the Church to go against it's beliefs. After all, libs love to remind anyone who will listen that there is a separation of Church and state, right ? Don't infringe. Personally, I've never felt denied anything. I mean, I can shack up with whomever I want. I can even have a ceremony to commemorate the union. So what if it isn't in a Church with the Church's blessing ? Let me point out here that I have attended Church all my life and never felt uncomfortable nor been shunned nor been asked to leave. And no, I've never attended a 'gay is ok' church. As for certain civil rights the gay and lesbian community are stating aren't afforded them, same sex civil unions is a viable and perfectly acceptable answer. The same percentage opposed to same sex marriage do support same sex civil unions (give or take few percentage points). Heck, some companies already offer benefits to workers and their partners. 'Partners' pffft...what am I in business with them ? I plan on calling my future soulmate my 'wife'. In the end, I think it's an effort on the part of the gay and lesbian community to feel validated way more than it is about 'civil rights' or the same rights as hetero married couples. I mean, if it WERE about rights, why would they (we) not jump on same sex civil unions and leave the Church out of it ? Again, why infringe if the same outcome can be acheived without doing so ? I'm sure 'in your face' is nowhere in the book 'how to win friends and influence people'.

Born that way or a choice ? I try not to argue this point with such dogma because honestly, I know me. I was 'born this way'. I've known since my earliest memories, my very first crushes. But at the same time, I know a girl who suddenly, in her mid 20s, decided to go (with her husband) to a lesbian bar. She picked up some random chick. Next thing you know, she's divorced and has only been with women since. Yeah. Kinda whack. Knowing this girl like I do, I believe she thrives on 'being shocking'. And though that might, on the surface, prove that homosexuality is a mental disorder, I have never thought of myself as having a mental disorder. In my case, it's a matter of the heart, not the mind. In the example I used of the 20 something, well, she is 'mental', but not just because she now loves women.

And since it's been brought up in many posts - procreation, infidelity, promiscuity, breakups, stds, divorce...I'm not sure those are valid arguments (pro or con) when it comes to same sex unions. Granted, hiv/aids (the 'gay' disease) is the worst of the worst std's without a doubt. But std's have been around for ions in the hetero and homo community. Nearly half of all marriages end in divorce. Hell, my grandmother, a hetero woman, was married 5 times. Some hetero married couples can't have children. Should they not be allowed to 'couple up' because they can't procreate ? I'll be honest, I haven't done a lot of research as far as whether cheating and promiscuity are more prevalent in the hetero or homo community or if stds are more rampant in the hetero or homo community, but let's be honest. If you use any of those as a reason to oppose same sex marriage or unions, then I suppose you'd have to oppose hetero marriage or unions too, since they are by no means exclusive to the homo community.

Now, allow me to end with a little levity. Ever seen a lesbian with a hardon ?

Good posting! Thanks for opening up to us.

[zulater]

Of course now we all await the inevitable post by Steeldawg telling Steelgal how she's all wrong on the lesbian thing.

[smokin3000gt]

Of course now we all await the inevitable post by Steeldawg telling Steelgal how she's all wrong on the lesbian thing.

Yup.

Steeltrollin to argue all of SG's real world experiences in 3... 2... 1...

[GoSlash27]

Good posting! Thanks for opening up to us.

^ What he said.
<-- Lesbian with a hard- on

[Dwinsgames]

Of course now we all await the inevitable post by Steeldawg telling Steelgal how she's all wrong on the lesbian thing.

he won't now just to prove you wrong ....

then again maybe he will to prove me wrong ??? /thinking

[steeldawg]

Of course now we all await the inevitable post by Steeldawg telling Steelgal how she's all wrong on the lesbian thing.

Why most of what she said I agree with the promiscuity disease is just as prevelant in straight relationships. The only thing I disagree with is the idea that churches will be forced to perform marriage ceremonies I don't think legally they can. Also in the example she used of her friend that's not uncommon many homosexuals don't come to terms with their sexuality until later in life but her attraction to women I don't think was a spontaneous occurrence.

[7SteelGal43]

Why most of what she said I agree with the promiscuity disease is just as prevelant in straight relationships. The only thing I disagree with is the idea that churches will be forced to perform marriage ceremonies I don't think legally they can. Also in the example she used of her friend that's not uncommon many homosexuals don't come to terms with their sexuality until later in life but her attraction to women I don't think was a spontaneous occurrence.

Well, I know the difference between somone who's been on a journey of self discovery and a whackadoodle

"i don't think legally they can".....so why not just grant civil unions and not take the chance ? I mean the govt doesn't have the best track record of not infringing when they said they wouldn't.

[steeldawg]

Well, I know the difference between somone who's been on a journey of self discovery and a whackadoodle

"i don't think legally they can".....so why not just grant civil unions and not take the chance ? I mean the govt doesn't have the best track record of not infringing when they said they wouldn't.

I don't think they are taking a chance, churches can refuse to marry who ever they want hell in Mississippi a church just refused to marry a black couple, there are many that refuse interracial, gay, and intereligous marriages and they are not subject to lawsuits.

"The bottom line on all of this: Multiple fact-checking news outlets have found absolutely no merit to Schubert's claims. A Seattle Times national investigation "checked with human rights commissions in four of the six states where marriage is legal; the commissions said there was not an increase in discrimination findings or suits involving same sex marriage." A Maine Today Media "Truth Test" also called around and found that "[t]here were no gay-marriage related claims against religious organizations in any of the states."

As far as civil unions go that's fine as long as its civil unions for everyone, I don't think gays fought for the right to marry to settle for civil unions, they want to be recognized as being married just as heterosexuals, I don't see anything wrong with that or why their relationship should be discounted in any way under the law.

[zulater]

he won't now just to prove you wrong ....

then again maybe he will to prove me wrong ??? /thinking

He's an officious prigg, so of course he'll answer and correct her. That's his nature, he can't or wont ever stop himself. I don't even think it's within his control anymore. I'm not sure if we should loathe him, laugh at him or just feel sorry for him.

If Charles Winchester from M*A*S*H* and Cliff Clavin from Cheers were to form a gay union and by some miracle conceive I would imagine the reuslting offspring would very much resemble this.

[GoSlash27]

Le sigh...

- - - Updated - - -

Getting back on track...

It's really no surprise that many lesbians make a conscious choice to go that way. Most women aren't that far away to begin with.

[steeldawg]

Le sigh...

- - - Updated - - -

Getting back on track...

It's really no surprise that many lesbians make a conscious choice to go that way. Most women aren't that far away to begin with.

I actually had this conversation with my girlfriend, I was saying a lot of women have a natural attraction to each other but she resented the fact that I thought that about women but I think it was just because she thought I was trying to talk her into a threesome.

[Seven]

It's really no surprise that many lesbians make a conscious choice to go that way. Most women aren't that far away to begin with.

I'd be careful about making this generalization.

[GoSlash27]

I'd be careful about making this generalization.

As you're no doubt aware, being careful with generalizations isn't one of my strong suits
Besides, it's true...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23563096

[Spike]

I'm confused....does this mean liberals now hate Africans?


Nigerian Parliament Bans “Gay Marriage”

Nigerian lawmakers have approved a bill banning same-sex marriage, setting jail terms of up to 14 years for offenders.

The measure backed by the House of Representatives also makes it illegal to form gay groups or organisations

“Same-sex marriage cannot be allowed on moral and religious grounds. The Muslim religion forbids it. Christianity forbids it and the African traditional religion forbids it,” the bill’s sponsor, Senator Domingo Obende, previously said..

Any public showing of same-sex romantic relationships will also be against the law, and gay couples who marry could face up to 14 years behind bars. Those who help them or serve as witnesses to such a marriage could get up to 10 years’ imprisonment.

http://www.africanglobe.net/africa/n...-gay-marriage/

[fansince'76]

It's really no surprise that many lesbians make a conscious choice to go that way. Most women aren't that far away to begin with.

From a guy's point of view, I can't really say I blame them - to take a quote from Seinfeld, "I find them (men) repugnant and unappealing."

[Count Steeler]

I'm confused....does this mean liberals now hate Africans?


Nigerian Parliament Bans “Gay Marriage”

Nigerian lawmakers have approved a bill banning same-sex marriage, setting jail terms of up to 14 years for offenders.

The measure backed by the House of Representatives also makes it illegal to form gay groups or organisations

“Same-sex marriage cannot be allowed on moral and religious grounds. The Muslim religion forbids it. Christianity forbids it and the African traditional religion forbids it,” the bill’s sponsor, Senator Domingo Obende, previously said..

Any public showing of same-sex romantic relationships will also be against the law, and gay couples who marry could face up to 14 years behind bars. Those who help them or serve as witnesses to such a marriage could get up to 10 years’ imprisonment.

http://www.africanglobe.net/africa/n...-gay-marriage/

I guess the African will cry "Racist" and the liberal will cry "homophobe". And they will live happily ever after.

[steeldawg]

I'm confused....does this mean liberals now hate Africans?


Nigerian Parliament Bans “Gay Marriage”

Nigerian lawmakers have approved a bill banning same-sex marriage, setting jail terms of up to 14 years for offenders.

The measure backed by the House of Representatives also makes it illegal to form gay groups or organisations

“Same-sex marriage cannot be allowed on moral and religious grounds. The Muslim religion forbids it. Christianity forbids it and the African traditional religion forbids it,” the bill’s sponsor, Senator Domingo Obende, previously said..

Any public showing of same-sex romantic relationships will also be against the law, and gay couples who marry could face up to 14 years behind bars. Those who help them or serve as witnesses to such a marriage could get up to 10 years’ imprisonment.

http://www.africanglobe.net/africa/n...-gay-marriage/

Do conservatives support this and do they hold up Africa as a model for human rights? I don't think you have to be a liberal to realize that jail time for being gay is completely ridiculous. If our laws where based off of Christianity, islam, or any other religion I would be on the first plane out of here.

[Count Steeler]

Do conservatives support this and do they hold up Africa as a model for human rights? I don't think you have to be a liberal to realize that jail time for being gay is completely ridiculous. If our laws where based off of Christianity, islam, or any other religion I would be on the first plane out of here.

Well, maybe you should destine yourself for Nigeria so you can show them the right way to live.

[Seven]

Russia, anyone?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013...gay-propaganda

Most of this stuff came to a head last month, but I thought with the direction this conversation was going, it'd be interesting to alert some of you to Russia's stance on gays. Basically, if you are a tourist found to be gay in Russia, you will be detained for 14 days then deported. 75% of Russian's are against gay rights and most of that number think it's a sin or evil, similar to pedophilia.

- - - Updated - - -

Olympics in Sochi next year. This should get good.

[Vis]

Congrats PA! Finally on the right side of history.