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Thread: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

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    Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    http://www.ijreview.com/2013/04/4788...a-maher-video/


    When guest Professor Brian Levin tried to allege that religious extremism isn’t only a product of Islam, the longtime critic of Islamist extremism pounced:

    “You know what, yeah, yeah,” Maher said. “You know what — that’s liberal bullsh*t right there … they’re not as dangerous. I mean there’s only one faith, for example, that kills you or wants to kill you if you draw a bad cartoon of the prophet. There’s only one faith that kills you or wants to kill you if you renounce the faith. An ex-Muslim is a very dangerous thing. Talk to Salman Rushdie after the show about Christian versus Islam. So you know, I’m just saying let’s keep it real.”

    The host also felt compelled to pre-empt a reflexive criticism that is a part of the political correctness that conditions nearly all public conversations.

    “I am not an Islamophobe,” Maher said. “I am a truth lover. All religions are not alike. As many people have pointed out — ‘The Book of Mormon,’ did you see the show? … OK, can you imagine if they did ‘The Book of Islam?’ Could they do that? There’s only one religion that threatens violence and carries it out for things like that. Could they do “The Book of Islam” on Broadway?”

    Professor Levin replied ‘possibly so,’ implying that such a show was foreseeable in the United States and Maher duly refuted it.

    “You’re wrong about that and you’re wrong about your facts,” Maher said. “Now, obviously, most Muslim people are not terrorists. But ask most Muslim people in the world, if you insult the prophet, do you have what’s coming to you? It’s more than just a fringe element.”
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    A Christian can leave the faith without fear of death for themselves or their families. Muslims cannot.

    And this is probably why moderate and peaceful Muslims have not been willing to "rat out" the radicals that hide in their communities.. Fear.



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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    I really can't believe I am saying this because I haven't had much of a chance to but what Bill Maher said is absolutely right.

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Maher will speak "his" mind, I give him credit for that. Even though, I disagree with 90% of what he says, and he is often ill-informed, he doesn't toe anybody else's line. I thought when he got kicked off ABC for his comments about the Military (can't remember exactly what he said), it was a big overreaction, because he had said many positive things about US service personnel in the prior weeks.

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by oneforthetoe View Post
    Maher will speak "his" mind, I give him credit for that. Even though, I disagree with 90% of what he says, and he is often ill-informed, he doesn't toe anybody else's line. I thought when he got kicked off ABC for his comments about the Military (can't remember exactly what he said), it was a big overreaction, because he had said many positive things about US service personnel in the prior weeks.
    Maher is just stating the obvious. It's shame so many liberal's have their head's too far up their own ass to see something so readily evident to anyone with eyes and ears that's willing to use them to see what's going on in the world around them. .
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by stillers4me View Post
    A Christian can leave the faith without fear of death for themselves or their families. Muslims cannot.

    And this is probably why moderate and peaceful Muslims have not been willing to "rat out" the radicals that hide in their communities.. Fear.
    Muslims can leave their faith its called apostasy, eventhough the quran calls for the death of muslims who leave the faith its not really practiced anymore only by fundamentalists, but they will excommunicate. Its the same as the christian religion it calls for the death of anyone who leaves the faith (Deuteronomy 13:6-10) but christian dont generally practice it but im sure it has happened.

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    Muslims can leave their faith its called apostasy, eventhough the quran calls for the death of muslims who leave the faith its not really practiced anymore only by fundamentalists, but they will excommunicate. Its the same as the christian religion it calls for the death of anyone who leaves the faith (Deuteronomy 13:6-10) but christian dont generally practice it but im sure it has happened.
    You reallyonly see and hear as you wish. Sad truth is that it's common for Muslim's to punish those that dare to leave the faith. It happens every day.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    You will never settle these matters of religion in a debate. I always say let the God (of whatever religion you, or non religion, you profess) come down and convince the world that their as great as they and their followers say they are. If their a God, they should be able to do that right ? After all, what is it that a "true GOD" can't do ? But until they do, it's just a lot of back and forth.

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Christian Convert Captured and Tortured in Somalia
    http://www.persecution.org/2013/04/1...ed-in-somalia/

    How many of these do you want? 5? 10? Easy for me to do. Now me find me one recent instance of a Christian receiving corporal punishment for converting away from it?
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    While the rest of the world generally believes that if God wanted people dead over their religious beliefs then he would do the job himself, apostasy is taken so seriously by Muslims that it spawned the first of many major internal wars.

    Immediately after Muhammad's death, several tribes wanted to leave Islam and return to their preferred religion. In a conflict known as the Riddah (apostasy) Wars, they were slaughtered in such places remembered as "Garden of Death" and "Gulley of Blood" during the first caliph Abu Bakr's aggressive and violent campaign to force submission (and keep the tribute payments flowing back to Mecca, of course). Within months, a great many people were dead, including Muslims who had memorized the Qur'an by heart.

    As Abu Bakr, Muhammad's closest companion, explained in a letter at the time, his prophet "struck whoever turned his back to Him until he came to Islam, willingly or grudgingly." Thus did Abu Bakr promise to "burn them with fire, slaughter them by any means, and take women and children captive" any who left Islam. (al-Tabari v10 p.55-57)

    Ali, the fourth "Rightly Guided Caliph" was Muhammad's son-in-law and one of the first converts to Islam. He also had people burned alive for wanting to follow their conscience. An old man named Rumahis b. Mansur, who regretted leaving Christianity and vowed not to remain a Muslim, was beheaded by Ali. (al-Tabari v.17 p.191).

    In 1400 years, there has never been a system of Islamic law that did not prescribe the death penalty for any Muslim choosing to leave Islam. Even in modern, ostensibly secular Islamic countries with constitutions "guaranteeing" freedom of religion, there is de facto enforcement of this law with intimidation and the occasional murder of apostates.

    A sound philosophy never requires violence or threats to retain believers. Contemporary Muslim apologists sometimes find it embarrassing that their religion - and theirs alone - endorses killing over a change in opinion (as critic Geert Wilders puts it, "Any religion that invites you in but then will not let you out is no longer a religion"). As such there are various tricks played to deny or explain away this weak and draconian which is so well-ensconced in Islamic tradition.

    Such defenders usually quote verse 2:256 to Western audiences. The verse states "Let there be no compulsion in religion, for truth stands out from error." They may also include a fragment of verse 10:99-100, "Wouldst thou (Muhammad) compel men until they are believers?" What they don't say is that Muslim scholars agree that both verses were spoken by Muhammad during an earlier time in his teachings, when he did not have the power to compel others. They are abrogated by later verses, such as verse 9:29, which clearly commands Muslims to fight unbelievers until they relent and either accept Islam or a state of humiliation under Islamic rule (an obvious illustration of compulsion).

    These apologists also ignore the actions of Muhammad at Mecca and those of his companions following his death, particularly the bloody Ridda Wars. How could those closest to him have felt that there should be "no compulsion in religion" if they were instructed to kill anyone who wanted to leave Islam? How could the mandated killing of apostates have become a part of Islamic law?

    The "Religion of Peace" expanded across the globe by conquering people of other religions and then making life miserable for those who didn't "embrace Islam." Once spoken, a person was locked into the faith. Any sign of false witness - such as raising their children in another faith - was punished with death. Thus did Islam gradually supplant other religions.

    One of the world's most respected Sunni scholars, Yusuf al-Qaradawi, admitted in 2012 that if Muslims had "gotten rid of the apostasy punishment, Islam wouldn't exist today". (Astonishingly enough, he was not apologizing for the beheading, torture, burning and murder of millions but rather trying to justify it).

    And, while some apologists bend the truth in order to distance Islam from one of its most draconian rules, one of the world's most popular recently affirmed that the death penalty should be applied to those who leave Islam and share their faith with others. (Ironically Zakir Naik made his comments on a British television channel called Peace TV).

    At the end of the day, even Muslims who insist that the mandate to kill apostates from Islam isn't a part of the "true" religion, never appear all that bothered when it does happen, nor do they champion the right of other religions to evangelize in Muslim countries; In fact, they discourage it. They know as well as anyone that Islam cannot compete within the arena of free ideas and must rely on brute force at some level to retain believers.

    http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Qu...2-apostasy.htm

    - - - Updated - - -

    A Sample of Modern Day Treatment of Those Who Leave Islam:
    Two Christian Converts Murdered by Islamists...
    Christian Convert Jailed and Tortured for Leaving Islam...
    Imprisoned Pastor's Health Worsens as Beatings Intensify...
    Woman's Entire Family Threatened with Death for Her Leaving Islam...
    Prominent Muslim-American Group Backs Death Penalty for Leaving Islam...
    Ex-Muslim Turned Pastor Gunned Down...
    Teacher, Father of Four Shot to Death...
    Christian Convert Denied Right to See His Children...
    Egypt Imprisons Entire Family of Christian Converts...
    Girl's Face Burned by Parents for Embracing Christianity...
    Islamists Behead Convert to Christianity...
    Ex-Muslim and Family Denied Fresh Water...
    al-Shabaab Shoots 3 Christian Converts in Somalia...
    Teenage Girl Gets Two Years in Prison after Leaving Islam...
    Apostate Preacher Murdered in His Own Home...
    Criminal Past Invented to Punish Christian Convert...
    Convert Released from Solitary Confinement After 105 Days...
    Five Christian Converts 'Disappear' in Iranian Prison System...
    Atheist Sentenced to Three Years for Denying God's Existence...
    Muslims Offer Prayers as They Cut Man's Throat for Embracing Christianity...
    Death Sentence Fatwa Placed on Head of 'Apostate' Rapper...
    Church Pastor Abducted for Baptizing Muslim Girl...
    Apostates Jailed, Families Mocked...
    Christian Converts Describe Torture by Muslim Fundamentalists...
    Ex-Imam and Wife Nearly Beaten to Death for Converting to Christianity
    Girl Severely Beaten, Families Threatened for Showing Interest in Jesus
    Iran: No College for Ex-Muslims
    Two Converts to Christianity Stabbed in Norway
    Uganda Girl Learning to Walk after Brutal Torture for Leaving Islam
    Egyptian Cleric Says to Behead Apostates
    Convert Beheaded for Leaving Islam
    Iran Jails Christian Woman for Two Years over Leaving Islam
    Muslim Father Arrested to Lure Christian Sons Back to Fate
    Zanzibar Christian Suffers in Jail after Incarceration and Torture for Apostasy
    Christian Woman Faints While Being Publicly Flogged for Leaving Islam
    Secularist Endures 'Unbearable' Torture, Prepares for Execution
    Apostate Pastor Blinded with Acid in Uganda
    Children Murdered to Punish Ex-Muslim for Embracing Christianity
    Christian Convert Sentenced to 6 Years in Prison following Baptism
    Iran Orders Ex-Muslim Pastors to Serve Prison Sentences
    Kenyan Convert Stripped and Beaten with Iron Rods at Kenyan Church
    Christian Convert Tied Up and Stomped On
    Five Afghan Christian Converts Martyred...
    Converts from Islam Detained and Beaten
    Christian Convert Survives Brutal Stabbing in "Moderate" Morocco
    Converts to Christianity Ordered to 'Repent' or Face 'Social Boycott'
    Schoolteacher Gunned Down After Converting to Ahmadi Faith
    Man Beheaded for Leaving Islam and Embracing Christianity...
    Christian Girl Tortured and Killed for Leaving Islam...
    Christian Convert Flees after Severe Beating by Family...
    Swedish Imam Calls on Muslims to Kill Converts...
    25 Ex-Muslims Arrested in Iran...
    Morocco Gives Ex-Muslim 15 Years in Jail for 'Proselytizing'...
    14-Year-Old 'Apostate' Girl Unable to Walk after Torture...
    Court Orders Apostate to 'Repent His Christian Faith' or Die...
    Christian Released after 9 Months in prison for Leaving Islam
    New Ground Zero Imam Says Apostates Should be Jailed...
    Muslim Murdered for Intention to Convert to Hinduism...
    Palestinian Couple Declared Apostates, Forcibly Divorced...
    Time Running Out for Apostate Pastor Facing Execution...
    Muslim-American Leaders Challenged to Reject Killing Apostates
    Palestinian Authority Labels Ahmadis 'Apostates'...
    Suicide Bombers Close in on 'Apostate' Pakistan Ahmadi Community...
    'Blessings' Promised to Those who Kill Ahmadiya 'Apostates'
    'Apostate' Ahmadiyahs Brutally Murdered by 'Allah Akbar' Mob
    Man in Britain Beaten with Plank for Leaving Islam...
    Christian Couple Stabbed in Home for Leaving Islam...
    Iranian Christian Beaten to Death by Relative
    21-Year-Old Christian Executed for Leaving Islam...
    Afghan Released after 9 Months in prison for Leaving Islam...
    Christian Father of Ten Executed in Front of Home
    Christian Faces Death Penalty for Leaving Islam...
    Father of 6 Jailed and Beaten for Leaving Islam...
    Tortured Aid Worker Faces Execution for Becoming Christian...
    63-Year-Old Convert & Son Beaten for Leaving Islam...
    Imprisoned Pastor Faces Death Penalty for Leaving Islam...
    Ethiopian Stabbed for Leaving Islam...
    Son Confesses to Killing Father for Leaving Islam...
    17-Year-Old Girl Beaten by Family, in Shackles for Leaving Islam...
    15-Year-Old Girl Attacked with Acid for Leaving Islam...
    Asylum Seekers in Norway Scald Christian Convert with Boiling Water...
    Christian Convert Flees Torture in Bangladesh...
    Christian Convert Beaten to Death...
    False Cattle Theft Charge Used to Stop Christian Convert...
    Egyptian Muslims Attempt to Behead Christian Convert...
    Afghanistan Detains 20 Christian Converts amid Call for Death...
    Torture Fears for Humanitarian Worker Charged with Apostasy...
    Schoolchildren Forced to Watch Execution of Christian Convert...
    Pastor to Hang for Apostasy...
    Islamic Scholars Mull Putting Ex-Muslims to Death...
    Pastors Warned to Return to Islam or Risk Murder...
    Australian Islamists Vow to Murder Ex-Muslims...
    Cleric: Ex-Muslims Should be Reasoned With - Then Killed...
    Egypt Jails Christian Convert Accused of Distributing Bibles...
    Elderly Woman Burned to Death for Converting Family from Islam...
    Christian Convert Executed by Somali Islamists...
    Malaysia: Whipping, Prison and Fines for Anyone Trying to Convert Muslims...
    Bangladeshi Christian Convert Threatened with Death...
    Ethiopian Christian Convert Languishes in Jail over Bibles...
    Bibles Burned, Christian Converts Threatened with Same Fate...
    Family Ordered to 'Sacrifice' Christian Convert Son...
    Judge Tells Christian Convert of His Desire to Kill Her...
    Police Round Up Christian Converts in Iran...
    Comoros Imam who Converts to Christianity is Forced into Hiding
    Elderly Christian Converts Driven from Home...
    Police Rape and Torture Christian Convert - Promise to Release Her if She Will Return to Islam...
    Christian Converts Hunted Down and Beaten in Comoros...
    Son of Murdered Christian Convert Also Faces Death...
    Iran's Parliament Votes to Kill Christian Converts...
    Christian Convert Shot to Death by Devout Muslims...
    Mob Pelts Christian Converts with Rocks...
    Innocent Man Slain After Cleric Declares Ahmadis to be Wajibul Qatl...
    'Moderate' Malaysia Sends Christian Converts to Re-Education Camps...
    Jordan Annuls Marriage of Christian Convert...
    Christian Convert & Wife Beaten, Flee to Save Children...
    New Zealand Christian Convert Goes Underground to Stay Alive...
    Christian Convert Needs Police Protection - in the UK!...
    Genital-Shocking Egyptian Police Detain Christian Convert...
    Ethiopian Islamists Stab Christian Convert's Son...
    Christian Convert (Father of 4) Murdered by Islamists...
    Christian Convert Murdered by Islamic Radicals...
    16-Year-Old Christian Convert has Muslim Man Forced on Her...
    Imam Calls for His Own Son's Murder for Leaving Islam...
    Somali Christian Shot to Death for Leaving Islam...
    Father of Two Shot to Death for Leaving Islam...
    Palestinian Terrorists Butcher and Cut Christian Man into Four Pieces...
    Iran Holds Women in Notorious Prison for Leaving Islam...
    Christian Woman Divorced and Beaten for Leaving Islam...
    Libya Urged to Stop Torturing Christians for Leaving Islam...
    Graphic Video Posted of Man Beheaded for Leaving Islam...
    Christian Beheaded for Leaving Islam...
    Saudi Cuts Out Daughter's Tongue and Burn Her Alive for Leaving Islam...
    Prominent Canada Threatens to Kill Daughter for Leaving Islam...
    Yemen Arrests Nine for Leaving Islam...
    Maldives Cleric Vows to Kill Anyone Leaving Islam...
    Four Christians Sent to Jail for Leaving Islam...
    Elderly Woman Burned to Death for Leaving Islam...
    Malaysia Officially Bars Muslims from Leaving Islam...
    Young Christian Murdered after Leaving Islam...
    Apostate Woman's Fingernails Torn Out by Family...
    Apostate Spat on in the UK, Threatened with Death...
    Poll: 4 in 5 Pakistanis Support Stoning Adulterers, Apostates...
    Iraqi Mujahideen Post Video of 'Apostate' Beheading...
    Harvard Chaplain Defends Killing Apostates...
    Executed Somali Christian was Accused of Apostasy...
    Man Under House Arrest over Son's Apostasy...
    (Canada) Mother Threatens to Kill Apostate Son...
    Apostasy: Iran to Enforce Death Penalty Worldwide?...
    Apostates Suffer Religious Persecution in Britain...
    UK Clerics Refuse to Denounce Killing Apostates...
    Somali Christian Casually Executed for Apostasy...
    Dutch Muslims Assault Apostate...
    Non-Muslims Horrified by Details of Apostate Family's Murder...
    Apostate and Christian Father of 7 Shot Dead in Ethiopia...
    Islamists Post 'Hit List' of Apostates...

    When And Muslims brag that theirs is the "fastest growing" religion... Now you know why!

    http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Quran/012-apostasy.htm
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    Muslims can leave their faith its called apostasy, eventhough the quran calls for the death of muslims who leave the faith its not really practiced anymore only by fundamentalists, but they will excommunicate. Its the same as the christian religion it calls for the death of anyone who leaves the faith (Deuteronomy 13:6-10) but christian dont generally practice it but im sure it has happened.
    Go ahead, find one instance in the last decade of this happening.

    I can give you hundreds of examples of this happening in recent years, in fact I have. Now put up or shut up.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Steeldawg clearly just posts to be contrary. Bill Maher, an avowed atheist comments truthfully on the hypocracy of comparing the dangers of religious extremism equally between Islam and any other faith, and rather than admit that there is no sensible counter argument he makes patently false and unsupported claims. When will the powers that be on this board recognize Steeldawg for what he is?
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Senior Cleric for American Muslim Group: Islamic Punishment for Apostasy Is Death

    Dr. Hatem al-Haj, a senior committee member for the Assembly of Muslim Jurists of America (AMJA), confirmed in the below fatwa from July 2011 that the Islamic punishment for apostasy is death. A couple of things stand out to me about this fatwa.

    First, this fatwa was taken down from AMJA’s website as far back as October 2011, along with other fatwas on the same topic, possibly in response to an article written by my colleague Andrew Bostom exposing the rulings in that same month. (See the fatwa on archive.org, while the link on AMJA’s website is broken.) So either AMJA changed their minds about the penalty for apostasy; or, more likely, they just don’t want non-Muslims seeing what they really think on controversial topics. If that’s the case, then what else are they not telling us?

    Second, the question that leads to the fatwa is tellingly not asking what the ruling is on apostasy, but rather how to explain this ruling to others, including non-Muslims. While Dr. al-Haj confirms that the penalty for apostasy from Islam is death, he also recommends that when explaining this to others, you should start with the caveat that this is something which should only be carried out in a Muslim country through the court system.

    AMJA likes to hide behind that caveat, but at the same time they encourage Muslims in the United States to use the American legal system in order to establish Islamic law (see here and here). So isn’t it fair to assume that Dr. al-Haj and AMJA would like to eventually make death for apostates the law of the land here in the United States as well?

    http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.o...tasy-is-death/
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Indonesian man jailed for two-and-a-half years for writing ‘God doesn’t exist’ on his Facebook page

    An Indonesian man was jailed for 30 months after writing "God doesn't exist" on his Facebook page.
    Alexander Aan, 30, was imprisoned on Thursday for sharing explicit material about the Prophet Mohammed online.
    He started an atheist group on Facebook on which he shared comic strips of the prophet having sex with his servant, a court in western Sumatra heard today.




    Aan was beaten by an angry mob and arrested by police in his hometown of Pulau Punjung in western Sumatra in January after posting the material online and declaring himself an atheist.
    The court had earlier indicted Aan with two other charges - persuading others to embrace atheism and blasphemy.

    Alexander Aan has been jailed for setting up an atheist Facebook group
    Prosecutors had sought a three-and-a-half-year jail term for him.
    But the court convicted him of the most serious charge and dropped the other two.
    Aan's arrest sparked outrage among Indonesians and international activists, who showed their support on his Facebook group and circulated petitions to have his charges dropped.
    Indonesia, the world's largest Muslim-majority nation, guarantees freedom of religion in its constitution and the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights, but only recognises six faiths: Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, Catholicism, Protestantism and Confucianism
    Its courts have in recent years given light sentences to perpetrators of violent attacks on Christians and Islamic minority Ahmadis, some of which have been fatal.


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz2R9trQ1YI
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    - - - Updated - - -

    Liberal talk show host Tawfiq Okasha recently appeared on "Egypt Today," airing a video of Muslims slicing off a young man's head off for the crime of apostasy -- in this instance, the crime of converting to Christianity and refusing to renounce it. The video—be warned, it is immensely graphic—can be seen here (the actual execution appears from minute 1:13-4:00) [Editor's Note: YouTube recently took this video down]. For those who prefer not to view it, a summary follows:

    A young man appears held down by masked men. His head is pulled back, with a knife to his throat. He does not struggle and appears resigned to his fate. Speaking in Arabic, the background speaker, or "narrator," chants a number of Muslim prayers and supplications, mostly condemning Christianity, which, because of the Trinity, is referred to as a polytheistic faith: "Let Allah be avenged on the polytheist apostate"; "Allah empower your religion, make it victorious against the polytheists"; "Allah, defeat the infidels at the hands of the Muslims," and "There is no god but Allah and Muhammad is his messenger."

    Then, to cries of "Allahu Akbar!"— Allah is greater!"—the masked man holding the knife to the apostate's throat begins to slice away, severing the head completely after approximately one minute of graphic knife-carving, as the victim drowns in blood. Finally, the severed head is held aloft to more Islamic slogans of victory.

    Visibly distraught, Tawfiq Okasha, the host, asks: "Is this Islam? Does Islam call for this? How is Islam related to this matter?...These are the images that are disseminated throughout the electronic media in Europe and America…. Can you imagine?" Then, in reference to Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood and Salafis, whose political influence has grown tremendously, he asks, "How are such people supposed to govern?"

    Only the other day, a prominent Egyptian Salafi leader -- referring to the canonical hadiths, including Muhammad's command, "Whoever leaves his religion, kill him" -- openly stated that no Muslim has the right to apostatize, or leave Islam.

    Any number of Islamic legal manuals make explicitly clear that apostasy is a capital crime, punishable by death. The first "righteous caliph," a model of Muslim piety, had tens of thousands of former Muslims slaughtered—including by burning, beheading, and crucifixion—simply because they tried to break away from Islam. According to the Encyclopaedia of Islam, the most authoritative reference work on Islam in the English language, "there is unanimity that the male apostate must be put to death."

    Finally, a word on the "prayers" or supplications to Allah made by the Muslim executioners in the video: these are standard and formulaic. In other words, these are not just masked, anonymous butchers who pray to Allah as they engage in acts of cutting throats and holding up heads, these are top-ranking Muslim leaders, who appear regularly on TV, who invoke such hate-filled prayers. See here for examples of Muslims supplicating Allah to strike infidels with cancer and disease "till they pray for death and do not receive it;" there are even formalized prayers in Mecca, blasted on megaphones as Muslims honor their obligation to go on a pilgrimage at least once in their lives, supplicating Allah to make the lives of Christians and Jews "hostage to misery; drape them with endless despair, unrelenting pain and unremitting ailment; fill their lives with sorrow and pain and end their lives in humiliation and oppression."

    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/30...ghter-apostate
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    Muslims can leave their faith its called apostasy, eventhough the quran calls for the death of muslims who leave the faith its not really practiced anymore only by fundamentalists, but they will excommunicate. Its the same as the christian religion it calls for the death of anyone who leaves the faith (Deuteronomy 13:6-10) but christian dont generally practice it but im sure it has happened.
    Oh please. You quote a JEWISH law and attribute it to CHRISTIANITY? Just so you're familiar, Jesus said He was the fulfillment of the law. Paul continually rails against those, even Peter, who fall into following the law. I don't know where you get your information from, but quoting a Deuteronomic text for what "Christianity" believes is the same as if the NY Giants pulled out the gamefilm from when John Michelosen was coaching and trying to apply it to how the Steelers will play them this year.


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    Senior Member Array title="zulater has a reputation beyond repute"> zulater's Avatar

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    OK Dawg, still waiting for one of your many recent examples of born Christians being punished by their own for the crime of converting to another faith?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Preacher View Post
    Oh please. You quote a JEWISH law and attribute it to CHRISTIANITY? Just so you're familiar, Jesus said He was the fulfillment of the law. Paul continually rails against those, even Peter, who fall into following the law. I don't know where you get your information from, but quoting a Deuteronomic text for what "Christianity" believes is the same as if the NY Giants pulled out the gamefilm from when John Michelosen was coaching and trying to apply it to how the Steelers will play them this year.
    Thanks for setting the record straight Preacher!
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Sweden: Imam calls to kill converts on Radio Sweden
    Sweden: Imam calls to kill converts on Radio Sweden Via Dagen (Swedish): "It is the duty of every Muslim to kill those who leave Islam." This statement was made on Radio Sweden recently when an Imam from Rinkeby (Stockholm) was allowed to speak about how people should act against Somalis who convert to Christianity.

    http://europenews.dk/en/node/47273
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    A mother and her seven children have been jailed for 15 years for converting back to Christianity from Islam in Egypt.

    Nadia Mohamed Ali was raised a Christian but converted to Islam 23 years ago when she married Mohamed Abdel-Wahhab Mustafa.

    Following his death, she planned to convert back to her original faith, along with the rest of her family.

    But a criminal court in Beni Suef, in central Egypt, sentenced them to jail for 15 years last week, according to reports.

    Seven other people, who were involved in the case, were also sentenced to five years in jail.

    Human rights advocates have now warned the sentence is a sign of things to come in Egypt under the Islamist government, according to Fox News.

    The conversion came to light after the family attempted to get new identity cards in 2004.

    According to Sky News, one of her children was arrested two years later and confessed the documents had been changed illegally when police noticed he had changed his name and became suspicious.

    Nadia, her children and the clerks who processed the identity cards were subsequently arrested and charged.

    Christians in the country have said they face difficulties if they have converted to Islam and wish to switch back, leading some to forge the documents, which could land them in jail.

    Samuel Tadros, a research fellow at Hudson Institute's Center for Religious Freedom, has said while similar conversions had been common, the new Sharia-based constitution in Egypt was 'a real disaster' for religious freedom, according to Fox News.

    He said: 'The cases will increase in the future.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ity-Islam.html

    - - - Updated - - -

    Dawg, time for you to put up or shut up. Either admit you were wrong on this one or show how you're not. And if you do admit you're wrong on this one, it's not as though you have to agree with me, you instead get to agree with your fellow atheist Bill Maher. That's not so bad is it?
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    You reallyonly see and hear as you wish. Sad truth is that it's common for Muslim's to punish those that dare to leave the faith. It happens every day.
    No its common for fundamentalists and extremists its not common for muslims not all muslims are extreme fundamentalists, christians live in islamic countrys hell the even have churches there. It depends on where you are if your in east asia america bangladesh somwhere where its not a theocracy run by fundamentalist madmen you can convert and your fellow muslims wont kill you. His comment was a generalization that you cant leave islam or you die which is simply not true people around the world leave islam everyday.

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    This is the 2nd time in as many months that Maher has surprised me with his comments.

    I thought he was the spokes person for liberals? If he's "balanced" in his assessments, you'd be hard-pressed to convince me this isn't new thinking on his part.

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    ‘Terrorista#1′: Bragging license plate of friends of Tsarnaev

    The two men arrested last night in connection with the Boston Marathon bombings drive a car with the licence plate that reads: ‘Terrorista #1’

    The students, named be neighbours by their first names Azmat and Diaz, drive a black BMW 330XI with the personalised plate and a sticker on the back which reads: ‘F*** you, you f****** f****’.

    They are thought to be from Kazakhstan and had not been seen since the bombings until last night when their ground floor apartment in New Bedford, MA, was raided by a dozen FBI agents at gunpoint


    Read more: http://blog.beliefnet.com/watchwoman...#ixzz2RC3W72m8


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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    No its common for fundamentalists and extremists its not common for muslims not all muslims are extreme fundamentalists, christians live in islamic countrys hell the even have churches there. It depends on where you are if your in east asia america bangladesh somwhere where its not a theocracy run by fundamentalist madmen you can convert and your fellow muslims wont kill you. His comment was a generalization that you cant leave islam or you die which is simply not true people around the world leave islam everyday.
    You're either naive, uninformed, or just being belligerent. There's not a country in this world with a Muslim majority where Christains or any other religion operates with any degree of comfort or equality.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by Spike View Post
    ‘Terrorista#1′: Bragging license plate of friends of Tsarnaev

    The two men arrested last night in connection with the Boston Marathon bombings drive a car with the licence plate that reads: ‘Terrorista #1’

    The students, named be neighbours by their first names Azmat and Diaz, drive a black BMW 330XI with the personalised plate and a sticker on the back which reads: ‘F*** you, you f****** f****’.

    They are thought to be from Kazakhstan and had not been seen since the bombings until last night when their ground floor apartment in New Bedford, MA, was raided by a dozen FBI agents at gunpoint


    Read more: http://blog.beliefnet.com/watchwoman...#ixzz2RC3W72m8


    If this lead bears fruit then so much for the lone wolf theory many on the left have been espousing.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    You're either naive, uninformed, or just being belligerent. There's not a country in this world with a Muslim majority where Christains or any other religion operates with any degree of comfort or equality.
    Indonesia, India, Bangledesh, Nigeria, Turkey, Algeria, Sudan, Just to name a few, alot of these laws and things you bring up are not practiced by muslims globaly they ae usually practiced by theocracies in the middle east which only makes up about 20% of the muslim population, actually most muslims live in the asia-pacific region, there are not that many countries that are governed by strict sharia law. Sharia law is disgusting ya i get it but it is not something all muslims practice, its just not.

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by Preacher View Post
    Oh please. You quote a JEWISH law and attribute it to CHRISTIANITY? Just so you're familiar, Jesus said He was the fulfillment of the law. Paul continually rails against those, even Peter, who fall into following the law. I don't know where you get your information from, but quoting a Deuteronomic text for what "Christianity" believes is the same as if the NY Giants pulled out the gamefilm from when John Michelosen was coaching and trying to apply it to how the Steelers will play them this year.
    Umm excsuse me "Preach" but is dueteronomy part of the holy bible? Is that not the same bible christians regard as the word of god? The same god who is also jesus? Sorry but you cant just pick and choose which parts of the rekligion you would like to apply. But hey lets take it from jesus mouth.

    Luke 19:27 (see 19:11-27)

    "But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them - bring them here and kill them in front of me."

    I dont think it gets much clearer than that.

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    Indonesia, India, Bangledesh, Nigeria, Turkey, Algeria, Sudan, Just to name a few, alot of these laws and things you bring up are not practiced by muslims globaly they ae usually practiced by theocracies in the middle east which only makes up about 20% of the muslim population, actually most muslims live in the asia-pacific region, there are not that many countries that are governed by strict sharia law. Sharia law is disgusting ya i get it but it is not something all muslims practice, its just not.
    Don't have time now, I can find multiple instances of attrocities commited against "infidels" in every one of the countries you just mentioned.

    Go to Turkey, pick any major population center and hand out Bibles on the corner. Guess what's going to happen? You'll either be killed assaulted or arrested within a half hour. Most likely some combination of the aforementioned in fact.

    And when exactly are you going to get around to posting a link to an instance where a non Muslim was killed or jailed for leaving his religion?

    You bascially made the case that apostate's aren't just punished by those that leave Islam. So make your case.

    I've linked about 20 or so intances so far, I can easily give you several hundred more, but I don't want to spam. So give us one recent example of a person leaving Judism, or Christianity who were killed or jailed for changing faiths or denouncing their birth religion. One instance ? We're waiting.........
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    Don't have time now, I can find multiple instances of attrocities commited against "infidels" in every one of the countries you just mentioned.

    Go to Turkey, pick any major population center and hand out Bibles on the corner. Guess what's going to happen? You'll either be killed assaulted or arrested within a half hour. Most likely some combination of the aforementioned in fact.

    And when exactly are you going to get around to posting a link to an instance where a non Muslim was killed or jailed for leaving his religion?

    You bascially made the case that apostate's aren't just punished by those that leave islam. So make your case.

    I've lined about 20 so far, I can easily give you severla hundred more, but I don't want to spam. So give us one recent example of a person leaving Judism, or Christianity who were killed or jailed for changing faiths or denouncing their birth religion. One instance ? Wer'e waiting.........
    Are you kidding Turkey, the same turkey that has Constantinople (Istanbul) and Antioch (Antakya). Antioch was also the place where the followers of Jesus were called "Christians" for the first time in history, as well as being the site of one of the earliest and oldest surviving churches, established by Saint Peter himself. For a thousand years, the Hagia Sophia was the largest church in the world. The National Liberation Front of Tripura I suggest you give them a look http://www.stephen-knapp.com/thirtee...in_tripura.htm

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    I suggest you find a link supporting your assertion that all religions punish apostates at more or less the same rate as Islam does.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    I suggest you find a link supporting your assertion that all religions punish apostates at more or less the same rate as Islam does.
    I never made that claim at all. I said you find the same penalty in the koran as in the bible, i also pointed out that its not prcaticed by christians anymore but it has happened. Stop trying to make a strawman arguement.

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    Re: Bill Maher: Equating Islamist and Christian Violence is 'Liberal BS'

    Turkey was once a Christian country.
    However, from the Fall of Constantinople until now, Christians have been subjected to severe discrimination and violence. This violence reached its peak with the Armenian Genocide early in the 20th Century.
    I have seen the tiny corners of society into which Christians are pushed in Turkey. I stood at the spot where the Patriarch was hung by a mob in the early 20th Century. Christians can not build churches there, and there are severe restrictions on ordination of new priests.
    Turkey is a beautiful country with many wonderful people. Their hospitality is incredible. I believe that Turkey can become a great nation. But it must move past its history of discrimination and violence against Christians to do this.
    An important German politician recently took the same position regarding Turkey’s admission into the European Union. Volker Kauder, chairman of Chancellor Angela Merkel’s Christian Democrats, says that Turkey must allow Christians to build churches in Turkey before it can be admitted to the EU.
    Frankly, I think that is a bare minimum. Christians in Turkey should have the same rights as all other citizens. They should be free to worship, and to witness for their faith publicly.

    http://www.patheos.com/blogs/publicc...sh-christians/

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    I never made that claim at all. I said you find the same penalty in the koran as in the bible, i also pointed out that its not prcaticed by christians anymore but it has happened. Stop trying to make a strawman arguement.
    You need to reread the OP and watch the attached video.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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