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Thread: MSNBC: UPDATE, OBAMA ECONOMIC DISCUSSION

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    MSNBC: UPDATE, OBAMA ECONOMIC DISCUSSION

    http://www.baltimoresun.com/entertai...,7266571.story

    In writing about the Pew study released today, I was struck by the big story of how negative coverage on several levels of presidential politics had become.

    I think this is big trouble for democracy, especially the hostile level of discourse in social media. And that it's something the media need to address collectively after the election.

    But here's one of several fascinating smaller findings of the study that are kind of stunning -- even if they seem obvious and ho-hum to some of my more jaded, postmodern, aren't-we-cleverly-ironic colleagues:

    ON MSNBC, the ratio of negative to positive stories on GOP candidate Mitt Romney was 71 to 3.

    That's not a news channel. That's a propaganda machine, and owner Comcast should probably change Phil Griffin's title from president to high minister of information, or something equally befitting the work of a party propaganist hack in a totalitarian regime. You wonder how mainstream news organizations allow their reporters and corrdespondents to appear in such a cauldron of bias.




    Hope you're proud of yourself MSNBC.



    Not that this is really news to anyone who pays attention.

    - - - Updated - - -

    http://www.journalism.org/analysis_r..._campaign_2012

    The study also reveals the degree to which the two cable channels that have built themselves around ideological programming, MSNBC and Fox, stand out from other mainstream media outlets. And MSNBC stands out the most. On that channel, 71% of the segments studied about Romney were negative in nature, compared with just 3% that were positive-a ratio of roughly 23-to-1. On Fox, 46% of the segments about Obama were negative, compared with 6% that were positive-a ratio of about 8-to-1 negative. These made them unusual among channels or outlets that identified themselves as news organizations.
    "A man's got to know his limitations."

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    This is stuff a lot of us already knew, but to put numbers to it is really eye opening. I loved this paragraph..

    "That's not a news channel. That's a propaganda machine, and owner Comcast should probably change Phil Griffin's title from president to high minister of information, or something equally befitting the work of a party propagandist hack in a totalitarian regime. You wonder how mainstream news organizations allow their reporters and correspondents to appear in such a cauldron of bias."



    I really hope these numbers will turn around going forward but I doubt it. The Republic is in real danger I'm afraid.


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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    No doubt on that one. MSNBC has veered so wildly left that even most registered Democrats won't watch it!
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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Seems to me that there is a 21st Century Civil War going on. Truth is the first casualty of any war.

    Politics has become a beast unto itself, where re-election is the prime objective and the well being of the country is secondary. A true recipe for disaster.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Rachel Maddow has a strange name for a guy.
    Last edited by ALLD; 11-03-2012 at 09:18 AM.
    All Defense!

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Count Steeler View Post
    Seems to me that there is a 21st Century Civil War going on. Truth is the first casualty of any war.

    Politics has become a beast unto itself, where re-election is the prime objective and the well being of the country is secondary. A true recipe for disaster.
    Too true. It's gotten to the point where partisan politics have overridden party identity. Neither party cares if their candidates actually uphold their principles anymore. It's all about "our team", even though "our team" is no longer looking out for *us*.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ALLD View Post
    Rachel Maddow has a strange name for a guy.
    Rachel Maddow is actually Justin Beiber in disguise. IOW not a guy at all.
    "You've heard people brag about 'being in the zone'. They don't know what the Hell being in the zone is about. I played in the NFL for 15 years and I was only in the zone that one time." - "Mean" Joe Greene on the 1974 playoff victory over Oakland

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Count Steeler View Post
    Seems to me that there is a 21st Century Civil War going on. Truth is the first casualty of any war.

    Politics has become a beast unto itself, where re-election is the prime objective and the well being of the country is secondary. A true recipe for disaster.
    Great post. That's never been closer to the truth than it is now. At this point it's more about electing the lesser of two evils than anything else.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Seven View Post
    Great post. That's never been closer to the truth than it is now. At this point it's more about electing the lesser of two evils than anything else.
    Not even necessarily the lesser anymore. It's "our" evil vs. "their" evil and they're pretty much the same.

    That's what they're getting at in the video I posted yesterday.
    http://www.steelersuniverse.com/foru...ama-s-policies
    "You've heard people brag about 'being in the zone'. They don't know what the Hell being in the zone is about. I played in the NFL for 15 years and I was only in the zone that one time." - "Mean" Joe Greene on the 1974 playoff victory over Oakland

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    It's not msnbc, it's msdnc.


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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    I dont watch msnbc or fox, both networks are completely slanted and are not good sources when searching for political facts.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Seven View Post
    Great post. That's never been closer to the truth than it is now. At this point it's more about electing the lesser of two evils than anything else.
    The only thing I disagree with is the idea that this is new. Sadly, it's been that way for a long time. Bush vs. Mondale. Bush vs. Clinton. Clinton vs. Dole. Bush vs. Gore. Bush vs. Kerry. Obama vs. McCain. Obama vs. Romney. There's a reason why the country has steadily declined since at least the early 90s. Even the "great" economy of the mid-90s was just smoke and mirrors. All the new jobs that were created had nothing to do with Clinton. It was because of the computer and Internet revolution. The growth during that period happened in spite of the government. But while that was happening, Clinton was busy playing hide the cigar, giving our nuclear secrets to China, and laying the foundation for the devastation of our manufacturing sector. It's been the "lesser of two evils" for a long time now. And this time around, Romney is the lesser of the two evils.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallace108 View Post
    The only thing I disagree with is the idea that this is new. Sadly, it's been that way for a long time. Bush vs. Mondale. Bush vs. Clinton. Clinton vs. Dole. Bush vs. Gore. Bush vs. Kerry. Obama vs. McCain. Obama vs. Romney. There's a reason why the country has steadily declined since at least the early 90s. Even the "great" economy of the mid-90s was just smoke and mirrors. All the new jobs that were created had nothing to do with Clinton. It was because of the computer and Internet revolution. The growth during that period happened in spite of the government. But while that was happening, Clinton was busy playing hide the cigar, giving our nuclear secrets to China, and laying the foundation for the devastation of our manufacturing sector. It's been the "lesser of two evils" for a long time now. And this time around, Romney is the lesser of the two evils.
    Couldn't agree more.

    The scary point which you bring up is that when you think about all the times our economy has really thrived, it was either due to a groundbreaking development that inflated the job market for a while (automobile, computer-technology) or war.

    And that theme is pretty consistent throughout world history. So maybe what it all comes down to is that without one of those two nation-changing variables a true booming economy just can't exist - no matter what the policy makers do.

    Even if that is the case, I'd rather go down under a conservative government than one that tries to push itself into our everyday lives.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Seven View Post
    Couldn't agree more.

    The scary point which you bring up is that when you think about all the times our economy has really thrived, it was either due to a groundbreaking development that inflated the job market for a while (automobile, computer-technology) or war.

    And that theme is pretty consistent throughout world history. So maybe what it all comes down to is that without one of those two nation-changing variables a true booming economy just can't exist - no matter what the policy makers do.

    Even if that is the case, I'd rather go down under a conservative government than one that tries to push itself into our everyday lives.
    Good post.

    As a conservative, I'm always going to choose the more conservative candidate. That's why I prefer Romney over Obama. Well, plus the fact that Obama is a radial, even if we're not allowed to say it and get branded a conspiracy theorist.

    I agree with everything in your post except for one point:

    I'd rather go down under a conservative government than one that tries to push itself into our everyday lives.
    I agree that a conservative government is always better than a liberal government. Where I disagree is the inference that Republicans aren't as guilty as Democrats at pushing themselves into our everyday lives. They just have different ways of going about it. Most Republicans on the national level have forgotten (or don't know) what it means to be a conservative.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Seven View Post
    Couldn't agree more.

    The scary point which you bring up is that when you think about all the times our economy has really thrived, it was either due to a groundbreaking development that inflated the job market for a while (automobile, computer-technology) or war.

    And that theme is pretty consistent throughout world history. So maybe what it all comes down to is that without one of those two nation-changing variables a true booming economy just can't exist - no matter what the policy makers do.

    Even if that is the case, I'd rather go down under a conservative government than one that tries to push itself into our everyday lives.
    As long as conservative goverment keeps following trickle down economics you will get your wish to go down under a conservative goverment.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Freedom and limited government is hands down what made the United States the most prosperous country in the history of the world.

    In fact, has a country EVER taxed and spent it's way to prosperity....

    It's not even debateable
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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    As long as conservative goverment keeps following trickle down economics you will get your wish to go down under a conservative goverment.
    "Trickle down economics" is a cute phrase created by liberals in an effort to demonize the other side (quite successfully, I might add). No one ever starts a business in order to create jobs. People start businesses in order to make money. As a result, jobs are created. It takes money to start a business and hire workers. So by definition, money always has to "trickle down." Money doesn't "trickle up." People who have no money (or very little money) don't create jobs.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    As long as conservative goverment keeps following trickle down economics you will get your wish to go down under a conservative goverment.
    I'm not sure you were able to comprehend the point, but I'll play ball.

    Say what you will about cutting taxes for the wealthy to promote business, but at least it promotes some of the ideals that this country was built upon. Raising taxes on successful citizens and ridistributing those resources to Americans who don't work for them or deserve them is just pitiful. Increasing government involvement in the free market has never worked and it never will. The sinking ship President Obama has created over the last four years is proof enough of that. He has bitched so much about the mess he inherited when being sworn in. Just imagine how Governor Romney is going to feel when he inherits an economy that has sputtered out of control under one of the dullest minds to have ever served as President.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallace108 View Post
    "Trickle down economics" is a cute phrase created by liberals in an effort to demonize the other side (quite successfully, I might add). No one ever starts a business in order to create jobs. People start businesses in order to make money. As a result, jobs are created. It takes money to start a business and hire workers. So by definition, money always has to "trickle down." Money doesn't "trickle up." People who have no money (or very little money) don't create jobs.
    Apparently neither do people who make money, they outsource them. Just look at the numbers, corporate profits are as high as they have ever been, yet unemployment remains high. The reason because we thought hey lets let businesses out source our jobs overseas and they will have so much more money for quality jobs for americans, didnt work. Then we said ok lets give them tax cuts and they will create jobs, didnt work. So what happened was we thought by creating more money for the top it would trickle down to the middle class but it did not they just kept it.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Seven View Post
    I'm not sure you were able to comprehend the point, but I'll play ball.

    Say what you will about cutting taxes for the wealthy to promote business, but at least it promotes some of the ideals that this country was built upon. Raising taxes on successful citizens and ridistributing those resources to Americans who don't work for them or deserve them is just pitiful. Increasing government involvement in the free market has never worked and it never will. The sinking ship President Obama has created over the last four years is proof enough of that. He has bitched so much about the mess he inherited when being sworn in. Just imagine how Governor Romney is going to feel when he inherits an economy that has sputtered out of control under one of the dullest minds to have ever served as President.
    Just imagine how Obama is going to feel if he's re-elected.


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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallace108 View Post
    "Trickle down economics" is a cute phrase created by liberals in an effort to demonize the other side (quite successfully, I might add). No one ever starts a business in order to create jobs. People start businesses in order to make money. As a result, jobs are created. It takes money to start a business and hire workers. So by definition, money always has to "trickle down." Money doesn't "trickle up." People who have no money (or very little money) don't create jobs.


    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Seven View Post
    I'm not sure you were able to comprehend the point, but I'll play ball.

    Say what you will about cutting taxes for the wealthy to promote business, but at least it promotes some of the ideals that this country was built upon. Raising taxes on successful citizens and ridistributing those resources to Americans who don't work for them or deserve them is just pitiful. Increasing government involvement in the free market has never worked and it never will. The sinking ship President Obama has created over the last four years is proof enough of that. He has bitched so much about the mess he inherited when being sworn in. Just imagine how Governor Romney is going to feel when he inherits an economy that has sputtered out of control under one of the dullest minds to have ever served as President.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Seven View Post
    I'm not sure you were able to comprehend the point, but I'll play ball.

    Say what you will about cutting taxes for the wealthy to promote business, but at least it promotes some of the ideals that this country was built upon. Raising taxes on successful citizens and ridistributing those resources to Americans who don't work for them or deserve them is just pitiful. Increasing government involvement in the free market has never worked and it never will. The sinking ship President Obama has created over the last four years is proof enough of that. He has bitched so much about the mess he inherited when being sworn in. Just imagine how Governor Romney is going to feel when he inherits an economy that has sputtered out of control under one of the dullest minds to have ever served as President.
    the economy is better than it was when obama took office. The tax cuts only helped inflate the debt and created more money for companies to keep, im not going to go into all this again because the economic impact of the tax cuts is well documented and can easily be found. Obama no he did not fix the economy, but he did stabalize it. I will ask you now name the obama policies that sent the economy out of control?

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    the economy is better than it was when obama took office. The tax cuts only helped inflate the debt and created more money for companies to keep, im not going to go into all this again because the economic impact of the tax cuts is well documented and can easily be found. Obama no he did not fix the economy, but he did stabalize it. I will ask you now name the obama policies that sent the economy out of control?
    Sometimes we pay too much attention to statistics and don't recognize what's really happening. Do you notice how something like job numbers can be reported and both Republicans and Democrats will use the same numbers to argue completely opposite points?

    Obama did nothing to stabilize the economy. The economy stabilized itself. Because of the world economy (which goes way beyond this discussion), companies had to shed jobs to stay competitive (or stay in existence). Things were set in motion that no president could have stopped. In order to survive, companies had to lay off workers and restructure. That's what we saw happen for a few years (even in the first year of Obama's presidency). Companies slimmed down and restructured, but they can't lay off every employee and still operate. They laid off as many as they had to in order to stay competitive. Once companies eliminated the necessary number of jobs and restructured, the economy stabilized. In other words, the "free fall" stopped. The stabilization had nothing to do with Obama. It was because companies eliminated all the jobs they had to in order to stay competitive, or all the jobs they were able to and continue to stay in business.

    The economy stabilized itself early in 2009. The past three years, there has been little or no growth despite throwing trillions of tax dollars away. Right now, unemployment is higher than when Obama took office. This is the slowest recovery since the Great Depression. Obama's policies haven't aided the recovery. His policies have strangled the recovery.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallace108 View Post
    Sometimes we pay too much attention to statistics and don't recognize what's really happening. Do you notice how something like job numbers can be reported and both Republicans and Democrats will use the same numbers to argue completely opposite points?

    Obama did nothing to stabilize the economy. The economy stabilized itself. Because of the world economy (which goes way beyond this discussion), companies had to shed jobs to stay competitive (or stay in existence). Things were set in motion that no president could have stopped. In order to survive, companies had to lay off workers and restructure. That's what we saw happen for a few years (even in the first year of Obama's presidency). Companies slimmed down and restructured, but they can't lay off every employee and still operate. They laid off as many as they had to in order to stay competitive. Once companies eliminated the necessary number of jobs and restructured, the economy stabilized. In other words, the "free fall" stopped. The stabilization had nothing to do with Obama. It was because companies eliminated all the jobs they had to in order to stay competitive, or all the jobs they were able to and continue to stay in business.

    The economy stabilized itself early in 2009. The past three years, there has been little or no growth despite throwing trillions of tax dollars away. Right now, unemployment is higher than when Obama took office. This is the slowest recovery since the Great Depression. Obama's policies haven't aided the recovery. His policies have strangled the recovery.


    Really? Without the stimulus and the auto industry bailouts, the economy wouldve stabilized itself? Well i guess thats it then, anything thats bad under obama is because of his policies and anything thats good well that occured on its own. I saw a funny poll the other day, republicans in ohio were asked who desreves more credit for the death of osama bin laden Mitt Romney or Barrack Obama? 38% Obama 47% Unsure and 15% MITT ROMNEY???? Wow just goes to show no matter what he does it will not be acknowledged by republicans.

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by GBMelBlount View Post
    Freedom and limited government is hands down what made the United States the most prosperous country in the history of the world.

    In fact, has a country EVER taxed and spent it's way to prosperity....

    It's not even debateable

    Has there ever been a successful country without goverment, taxes, or spending?

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Again, we do not have a tax problem. We have a SPENDING problem, meaning the feds are spending money at a rate that isn't sustainable. The country may not be in the shitter NOW, but if we do not get spending under control, it WILL be in the shitter, and much sooner than anyone thinks. We MUST cut spending back to sustainable rates for this country to survive. Simply raising everyone's taxes will not get the job done, not to mention the fact that the LAST people we should be raising taxes on are the middle class and small business owners.








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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by Wallace108 View Post
    "Trickle down economics" is a cute phrase created by liberals in an effort to demonize the other side (quite successfully, I might add). No one ever starts a business in order to create jobs. People start businesses in order to make money. As a result, jobs are created. It takes money to start a business and hire workers. So by definition, money always has to "trickle down." Money doesn't "trickle up." People who have no money (or very little money) don't create jobs.
    Great post!
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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    GBMelBlount
    Freedom and limited government is hands down what made the United States the most prosperous country in the history of the world.
    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg response
    Has there ever been a successful country without goverment, taxes, or spending?
    Who but a liberal would interpret "limited government" as "without goverment"?

    How utterly ignorant.

    Admittedly I have lost count of how many liberals have ignorantly tried to equate any desire to limit government as being anti government or pro anarchy. It is beyond embarrrassing. Of course most who twist these words usually live off the government teet or benefit from big government at the the expense of tax payers....and have no other response than to twist and deflect....so it is a "convenient" ignorance in most cases.
    Last edited by GBMelBlount; 11-03-2012 at 08:27 PM.
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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by steeldawg View Post
    Really? Without the stimulus and the auto industry bailouts, the economy wouldve stabilized itself? Well i guess thats it then, anything thats bad under obama is because of his policies and anything thats good well that occured on its own. I saw a funny poll the other day, republicans in ohio were asked who desreves more credit for the death of osama bin laden Mitt Romney or Barrack Obama? 38% Obama 47% Unsure and 15% MITT ROMNEY???? Wow just goes to show no matter what he does it will not be acknowledged by republicans.

    Another Obama myth is that the president “saved” GM while Romney wanted to let the auto companies go bankrupt.
    People forget that GM did go bankrupt, and that taxpayers are still on the hook for $42 billion in monies funneled to GM and its financial arm Ally Capital – more than half the TARP funds that are still outstanding.
    Obama upended traditional (and legal) bankruptcy proceedings in order to rig the outcome heavily in favor of the UAW – payback for the $400 million in contributions from organized labor that fueled his 2008 campaign.
    For the UAW, each one percent ownership interest in GM cost $629 million; taxpayers paid $834 million and secured bondholders, the top of the credit chain, paid $2.7 billion for one percent of the company.
    Romney’s push was for a legal and legitimate sorting out of the company’s debts, a restructuring that would ensure the company’s competitiveness going forward, more harmonious labor relations and investment in energy-saving and innovative technology. Does that sound like a prescription for killing the autos?


    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/...#ixzz2BDMCY5MI
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  29. #29
    1 at a time Array title="Count Steeler has a reputation beyond repute"> Count Steeler's Avatar

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    Another Obama myth is that the president “saved” GM while Romney wanted to let the auto companies go bankrupt.
    People forget that GM did go bankrupt, and that taxpayers are still on the hook for $42 billion in monies funneled to GM and its financial arm Ally Capital – more than half the TARP funds that are still outstanding.
    Obama upended traditional (and legal) bankruptcy proceedings in order to rig the outcome heavily in favor of the UAW – payback for the $400 million in contributions from organized labor that fueled his 2008 campaign.
    For the UAW, each one percent ownership interest in GM cost $629 million; taxpayers paid $834 million and secured bondholders, the top of the credit chain, paid $2.7 billion for one percent of the company.
    Romney’s push was for a legal and legitimate sorting out of the company’s debts, a restructuring that would ensure the company’s competitiveness going forward, more harmonious labor relations and investment in energy-saving and innovative technology. Does that sound like a prescription for killing the autos?


    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/...#ixzz2BDMCY5MI
    I am so fed up with bailing out the autos. Seems like every 10-12 years they need bailing out.

  30. #30
    Senior Member Array title="steeldawg is a jewel in the rough">

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    Re: MSNBC really is more partisan than Fox, according to Pew study

    Quote Originally Posted by zulater View Post
    Another Obama myth is that the president “saved” GM while Romney wanted to let the auto companies go bankrupt.
    People forget that GM did go bankrupt, and that taxpayers are still on the hook for $42 billion in monies funneled to GM and its financial arm Ally Capital – more than half the TARP funds that are still outstanding.
    Obama upended traditional (and legal) bankruptcy proceedings in order to rig the outcome heavily in favor of the UAW – payback for the $400 million in contributions from organized labor that fueled his 2008 campaign.
    For the UAW, each one percent ownership interest in GM cost $629 million; taxpayers paid $834 million and secured bondholders, the top of the credit chain, paid $2.7 billion for one percent of the company.
    Romney’s push was for a legal and legitimate sorting out of the company’s debts, a restructuring that would ensure the company’s competitiveness going forward, more harmonious labor relations and investment in energy-saving and innovative technology. Does that sound like a prescription for killing the autos?


    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/...#ixzz2BDMCY5MI
    thats not even what i said, i said the stimulus and auto bailouts helped stabilize an economy that was in free fall. Also the restructuring of the auto companies were part of obamas plan too.

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