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Thread: Israel stations nuclear missile subs off Iran

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    Qui dall'inizio Array title="Vincent is on a distinguished road"> Vincent's Avatar

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    Israel stations nuclear missile subs off Iran

    Thought I'd take advantage of the honeymoon and throw out some red meat for Ric.

    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle7140282.ece
    May 30, 2010
    Israel stations nuclear missile subs off Iran
    Uzi Mahnaimi in Tel Aviv

    Three German-built Israeli submarines equipped with nuclear cruise missiles are to be deployed in the Gulf near the Iranian coastline.

    The first has been sent in response to Israeli fears that ballistic missiles developed by Iran, Syria and Hezbollah, a political and military organisation in Lebanon, could hit sites in Israel, including air bases and missile launchers.

    The submarines of Flotilla 7 — Dolphin, Tekuma and Leviathan — have visited the Gulf before. But the decision has now been taken to ensure a permanent presence of at least one of the vessels.

    The flotilla’s commander, identified only as “Colonel O”, told an Israeli newspaper: “We are an underwater assault force. We’re operating deep and far, very far, from our borders.”

    Each of the submarines has a crew of 35 to 50, commanded by a colonel capable of launching a nuclear cruise missile.

    The vessels can remain at sea for about 50 days and stay submerged up to 1,150ft below the surface for at least a week. Some of the cruise missiles are equipped with the most advanced nuclear warheads in the Israeli arsenal.

    The deployment is designed to act as a deterrent, gather intelligence and potentially to land Mossad agents. “We’re a solid base for collecting sensitive information, as we can stay for a long time in one place,” said a flotilla officer.

    The submarines could be used if Iran continues its programme to produce a nuclear bomb. “The 1,500km range of the submarines’ cruise missiles can reach any target in Iran,” said a navy officer.

    Apparently responding to the Israeli activity, an Iranian admiral said: “Anyone who wishes to do an evil act in the Persian Gulf will receive a forceful response from us.”

    Israel’s urgent need to deter the Iran-Syria-Hezbollah alliance was demonstrated last month. Ehud Barak, the defence minister, was said to have shown President Barack Obama classified satellite images of a convoy of ballistic missiles leaving Syria on the way to Hezbollah in Lebanon.

    Binyamin Netanyahu, the prime minister, will emphasise the danger to Obama in Washington this week.

    Tel Aviv, Israel’s business and defence centre, remains the most threatened city in the world, said one expert. “There are more missiles per square foot targeting Tel Aviv than any other city,” he said.
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    found this older article from april..

    Israel could opt for nuke strikes on Iran
    Published: April 8, 2010 at 3:35 PM

    TEL AVIV, Israel, April 8 (UPI) -- U.S. President Barack Obama and his Russian counterpart, Dmitry Medvedev, may have signed a landmark arms-control treaty, but a U.S. think tank is suggesting Israel could resort to using tactical nuclear weapons to destroy Iran's deeply buried nuclear facilities.

    Whether this is all part of a U.S. effort to crank up the pressure on Iran to be more compliant on the nuclear issue by using scare tactics or if the right-wing government in Israel is actually inclined to resort to nuclear weapons is almost impossible to discern.

    But one day after the Center for Strategic and International Studies in Washington released a report on March 26 noting that "some believe that nuclear weapons are the only weapons that can destroy targets deep underground or in tunnels," The New York Times reported Iran was suspected of preparing to build two more uranium enrichment plants.

    And just to ram the message home, on March 28, the Times' Sunday edition ran an analysis headlined "Imagining an Israeli Strike on Iran."

    The 208-page report, by veteran Middle East analysts Anthony Cordesman and Abdullah Toukan, argued that Israel's air force does not have the firepower to knock out the Iranian facilities and that low-yield tactical nuclear warheads would be the only way to destroy them.

    Israel, of course, has made no comment on this at all, in line with its policy of deliberate ambiguity about its nuclear arsenal, believed to total some 600 warheads, bombs and artillery shells.

    Nor does it discuss its inventory of Jericho II -- and probably some Jericho III -- ballistic missiles capable of carrying nuclear warheads. These are placed in heavily fortified silos in the Judean Hills and near two or three Israeli air bases.

    But if Israel elected to launch a nuclear strike, it is likely that the Jerichos would be the chosen means of delivery.

    They would eliminate Israeli casualties, of which there would be an appreciable number if the air force was thrown at Iran's heavily protected nuclear infrastructure, and the loss of valuable strike aircraft.

    One assessment estimated Israel would need 90-100 long-range F-15I and F-16I aircraft for such strikes, of which around 20 percent would be lost.

    In an assessment in March 2009, Toukan estimated that 42 Jericho IIIs, with 1,650-pound conventional warheads, would be needed to "severely damage or demolish" Iran's core nuclear facilities at Natanz, Isfahan and Arak.

    That, according to most estimates, would be enough to set back Iran's nuclear arms project by two or three years.

    But it would also run the risk of retaliatory attacks on Israel, either with Iran's Shehab-3 intermediate-range ballistic missiles -- Tehran has threatened to unleash 600, although there's no evidence it has that many -- or using local proxies Hezbollah and Hamas.

    Israel could also use its three German-built Dolphin-class submarines, reportedly adapted to launch nuclear-tipped cruise missiles, firing from the Arabian Sea to add to the mayhem.

    Little is known about the Jericho III, but it is believed be a three-stage, solid-fuel missile capable of carrying a nuclear warhead for a minimum range of 2,980 miles.

    Israel has never even hinted at using nuclear weapons against Iran.

    President Shimon Peres, who played a key role in creating Israel's nuclear capability in the 1950s and 60s, has declared the Jewish state "will not be the first to introduce nuclear weapons to the region."

    The Americans have repeatedly warned Israel not to mount unilateral pre-emptive strikes against Iran because that could drag the United States into another war.

    Obama's new version of U.S. nuclear strategy unveiled Tuesday significantly narrows the circumstances in which Americans would employ nuclear arms. But it does allow their use against rogue states like Iran.

    While that's hardly a green light for Israel, former Central Intelligence Agency official Philip Giraldi notes: "Israel is fast becoming a pariah nation … Like South Africa, the Israeli response to criticism has been to become more reactionary … waging unending war against its neighbors to maintain cohesion against foreign enemies.

    "There is a certain danger in isolating the Israelis too much as it … might influence a dangerously unstable government to take action that might include exploiting its nuclear arsenal in search of Armageddon."
    Last edited by MasterOfPuppets; 05-31-2010 at 12:56 AM.

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    Russian foreign minister dismisses Iran criticism

    By JIM HEINTZ, Associated Press Writer Jim Heintz, Associated Press Writer – Thu May 27, 8:11 am ET

    MOSCOW – Russia's foreign minister on Thursday brushed off Iran's recent criticism as an emotional outburst and expressed frustration with Tehran in the standoff over its nuclear program.

    The comments indicated growing dismay with Iran in Russia, whose support had somewhat buffered Tehran against calls in the West for tougher action.

    After long resistance, Russia is now supporting possible new sanctions against Iran over concern that its is developing nuclear weapons. Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad took Russia to task for this on Wednesday, saying it was difficult to gauge whether the Kremlin was a friend or an enemy.

    "This statement is being interpreted as emotional," Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said at a news conference.

    He lamented that, despite Russia's years of efforts to resolve the dispute, "the response from the Iranian side has been unsatisfactory."

    Russia and Iran have cultivated close relations for years, including Russia's construction of the Bushehr nuclear plant that many critics say is connected to Iran's efforts to build nuclear weapons. Russia also signed a contract in 2007 to sell S-300 air-defense missiles to Iran, which would substantially increase Iran's defense capacities, though none have been delivered.

    Despite the ties, Russia has been able to exert little visible leverage on Iran to cooperate with the International Atomic Energy Agency, and its frustration is clearly growing.

    Lavrov appeared to hint that Moscow is concerned that Iran's lack of cooperation could be undermining Russia's image as a major force in the international community.

    "All the decisions that we make on all questions of external policy are based on national interests and on our responsibility as a great state which is involved in an array of international efforts to resolve difficult situations. And Iran is one of these," he said.

    Aside from Ahmadinejad's criticism, Iran in turn has shown other signs this week of growing irritation with Moscow. The Iranian ambassador this week said pointedly that Iran expects Russia to fulfill the S-300 contract.

    Lavrov has suggested the delay in delivery is due to concerns about aggravating regional tensions. Israel vehemently opposes delivery of the missiles.

    Despite the sparring between Tehran and Moscow, Lavrov said Russia supports a proposed nuclear fuel swap deal that advocates say could break the standoff, but which the United States has dismissed as a ploy.

    The swap offer was negotiated last week by Brazil and Turkey, which are opposed to new U.N. sanctions on Iran. It would commit Iran to shipping 1,200 kilograms of low-enriched uranium for storage abroad — in this case to Turkey. In exchange, Iran would get fuel rods made from 20-percent enriched uranium; that level of enrichment is high enough for use in research reactors but too low for nuclear weapons.

    "Very much will depend on how the Iranian side will approach its obligations. If it observes them strictly, then Russia will actively support the realization of the plan proposed by Brazil and Turkey," Lavrov said. "This plan serves the interests of peaceful resolution of the Iranian nuclear program."

    Ahmadinejad, in the same speech in which he criticized Russia, warned the United States that it will miss a historic opportunity for cooperation if it turns down the nuclear fuel swap deal.
    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/iran_nuclear

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    Really hoopy frood Array title="ricardisimo is an unknown quantity at this point">

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    Israel's been quite busy of late propping up their image:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/mid...t/10199480.stm
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    Qui dall'inizio Array title="Vincent is on a distinguished road"> Vincent's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by ricardisimo View Post
    Israel's been quite busy of late propping up their image:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/mid...t/10199480.stm
    It seems to be semantics. The Israelis think they were being beaten with pipes and chains and the "Pro-Palestinian campaigners say the soldiers opened fire unprovoked when they landed on the aid-carrying ships". Maybe it just depends on the neighborhood you're from.

    The video is a little fuzzy. Who are the folks being beaten? And who are the "beaters"? Oh look, they're throwing them off the boat. Huh. Where'd they get all those pipes and chains?

    I'm sort of "old fashioned". If somebody tried to hit me with a pipe or a chain, I'd like to think I'd be in a position to shoot them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent View Post
    It seems to be semantics. The Israelis think they were being beaten with pipes and chains and the "Pro-Palestinian campaigners say the soldiers opened fire unprovoked when they landed on the aid-carrying ships". Maybe it just depends on the neighborhood you're from.

    The video is a little fuzzy. Who are the folks being beaten? And who are the "beaters"? Oh look, they're throwing them off the boat. Huh. Where'd they get all those pipes and chains?

    I'm sort of "old fashioned". If somebody tried to hit me with a pipe or a chain, I'd like to think I'd be in a position to shoot them.
    Yeah, I'm kind of old-fashioned too. When I raid someone else's unarmed boat in full military gear, I expect to be greeted warmly. Whatever happened to manners?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent View Post
    It seems to be semantics. The Israelis think they were being beaten with pipes and chains and the "Pro-Palestinian campaigners say the soldiers opened fire unprovoked when they landed on the aid-carrying ships". Maybe it just depends on the neighborhood you're from.

    The video is a little fuzzy. Who are the folks being beaten? And who are the "beaters"? Oh look, they're throwing them off the boat. Huh. Where'd they get all those pipes and chains?

    I'm sort of "old fashioned". If somebody tried to hit me with a pipe or a chain, I'd like to think I'd be in a position to shoot them.
    Apparently the Israelis were armed with paint guns.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Mach1 View Post
    Apparently the Israelis were armed with paint guns.


    Places ric on ignore.
    D'oh! Already!?!?!
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    Quote Originally Posted by ricardisimo View Post
    Yeah, I'm kind of old-fashioned too. When I raid someone else's unarmed boat in full military gear, I expect to be greeted warmly. Whatever happened to manners?
    North Korea took them....

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    N. Korea blows up a ship and crew - not a peep from the "international community".

    Oh well. What's a few dead S. Koreans?


    But nothing gets the muzzie-loving Jew haters more lathered up than Israel fighting back.



    Anger across Europe over Israeli action

    This latest incident has been described as state terrorism by Turkey’s prime minister.

    Earlier there had been demonstrations in cities across Europe including Paris, Stockholm, Rome and Athens, where police in some cases used teargas against protesters.

    Most European countries have summoned Israeli diplomats to condemn what many described as a disproportionate use of force against the aid flotilla.

    In London, too, there were angry scenes.

    More than a thousand pro-Palestinian demonstrators headed for the Israeli embassy, waving placards saying “Disarm Israel” and accusing the country of “war crimes”.

    http://www.euronews.net/2010/06/01/a...sraeli-action/

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    This is definitely a black eye for Israel. However, it's not like they've never been "tatted" in a tit-for-tat...

    Things is definitely gettin' a mite bit hairy ion the Mideast....

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    this is really no different than what goes on in iraq, afghanistan , or pakistan. an insurgant can blow up 100 civilians and hardly get a peep out of the population, but if we or the U.N. kill 1 civilian by accident the population acts all butt hurt ..

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    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfPuppets View Post
    this is really no different than what goes on in iraq, afghanistan , or pakistan. an insurgant can blow up 100 civilians and hardly get a peep out of the population, but if we or the U.N. kill 1 civilian by accident the population acts all butt hurt ..
    Exactly. Suicide bombers are also state sponsored acts of terrorism. Israel is the only country with balls enough to openly seek justice with similar means of their attackers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killer View Post
    N. Korea blows up a ship and crew - not a peep from the "international community".

    Oh well. What's a few dead S. Koreans?


    But nothing gets the muzzie-loving Jew haters more lathered up than Israel fighting back.



    Anger across Europe over Israeli action

    This latest incident has been described as state terrorism by Turkey’s prime minister.

    Earlier there had been demonstrations in cities across Europe including Paris, Stockholm, Rome and Athens, where police in some cases used teargas against protesters.

    Most European countries have summoned Israeli diplomats to condemn what many described as a disproportionate use of force against the aid flotilla.

    In London, too, there were angry scenes.

    More than a thousand pro-Palestinian demonstrators headed for the Israeli embassy, waving placards saying “Disarm Israel” and accusing the country of “war crimes”.

    http://www.euronews.net/2010/06/01/a...sraeli-action/
    Not a peep? Really?

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/asi...c/10201876.stm

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/asi...c/10160204.stm

    ... as well as continuing (and justified) rage and sanctions over their nuclear tests.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ALLD View Post
    Exactly. Suicide bombers are also state sponsored acts of terrorism. Israel is the only country with balls enough to openly seek justice with similar means of their attackers.
    So, an eye-for-an-eye is justice?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ricardisimo View Post
    So, an eye-for-an-eye is justice?
    It is in that part of the world. Considering the surround of terror and assault the Israelis have weathered since moving to the neighborhood, I think they show remarkable restraint. Almost as ridiculous as us.

    But... "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" ...........
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    Quote Originally Posted by ricardisimo View Post
    Not a peep? Really?

    Phhhthp - I told you Hillary would write her stern letter and that would be the end of it.

    But let the Jews get uppity and fire off a few rounds and all the burka burka's get in an uproar, especially in communist Europe.

    We should have let Hitler have France, Italy and all of Europe and backed them against the Russians. He was easy to eliminate at the end. England was always the weakestm now they're overun with Muslims and are nothing more than an Arab state. Fuck em.

    All that cold war money we could have spent building bases on the moon and Mars.

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    Umm...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent View Post
    It is in that part of the world. Considering the surround of terror and assault the Israelis have weathered since moving to the neighborhood, I think they show remarkable restraint. Almost as ridiculous as us.

    But... "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" "Yes it is" "No it isn't" ...........
    Yes it is.
    Last edited by ricardisimo; 06-01-2010 at 06:02 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ricardisimo View Post
    So, an eye-for-an-eye is justice?
    Defined.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheWarDen86 View Post
    Defined.
    Biblically speaking, "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth." The Israelis do their own fighting and do not rely on a weak international court or UN to do it for them. Otherwise there would be no need for intimidation or a wall through East Jersulaem.
    All Defense!

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    They were told (in advance) that something like this would happen if they entered a certain point in those waters... YET THEY CAME ANYWAY. Makes you wanna go hummmm ???

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    Quote Originally Posted by ALLD View Post
    Biblically speaking, "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth." The Israelis do their own fighting and do not rely on a weak international court or UN to do it for them. Otherwise there would be no need for intimidation or a wall through East Jersulaem.
    What I was saying was "an eye for an eye is justice defined."

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteelerEmpire View Post
    They were told (in advance) that something like this would happen if they entered a certain point in those waters... YET THEY CAME ANYWAY. Makes you wanna go hummmm ???
    We were told ahead of time that Allah's wrath would fall upon us if we didn't remove our troops from Saudi Arabia. So, did 9/11 make you go "hummmmm"?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ricardisimo View Post
    We were told ahead of time that Allah's wrath would fall upon us if we didn't remove our troops from Saudi Arabia. So, did 9/11 make you go "hummmmm"?
    With that line of reasoning... The Jewish bible (you know the one that Islam copied off) (and Christian bible) also tells the muslim world that so many of "the enemies of Israel" will be destroyed that there will be only a small fraction of them left... I hope they are listening...
    In addition. I think the guys that said, and done, that (and their supporters) have suffered A LOT more by American hands... than America has suffered from theirs...
    Last edited by SteelerEmpire; 06-01-2010 at 06:55 PM.

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    I don't really care what Israel does. They are a sovereign nation capable of wearing big boy pants and making their own decisions. I think Obama has made it pretty clear that we aren't going to stand behind them when they go crazy.

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    Israel had every reason to board the ship and defend themselves against what could have possibly been an arm carrying ship, it was not until they were being attacked that they opened fire. Also by putting the subs out there they are protecting their country from what many believe could be an impending attack; so I do not understand the opposition to what they are doing is besides the fact that they took action instead of waiting for more of their citizens to be murdered.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteelersinCA View Post
    I don't really care what Israel does. They are a sovereign nation capable of wearing big boy pants and making their own decisions. I think Obama has made it pretty clear that we aren't going to stand behind them when they go crazy.
    What else would you expect from a closet muslim.


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    Quote Originally Posted by SteelerEmpire View Post
    Makes you wanna go hummmm ???
    North Korea sinks a SK boat and barks that if South Korea responds in any way its an act of war. Hmmmm. An "aid flotilla", (quit it yer killin me!) loaded with pipes and chains , is warned in advance not to cross... Hmmm. Seems like two US clients are being squeezed at once while we have an ineffectual muslim in the White House. Hmmmmmm.

    Nothing to see here folks. Move along.
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    992
    Quote Originally Posted by SteelersinCA View Post
    I think Obama has made it pretty clear that we aren't going to stand behind them when they go crazy.
    oh really


    White House Backs UN Stance on Israeli Flotilla Raid

    The Obama administration is refusing to condemn Israel for its deadly raid on a convoy of ships carrying aid to the Gaza Strip.

    http://www1.voanews.com/english/news...-95347184.html

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