Gregg Williams Saints Bounty Audio

[polamalubeast]

GREG WILLIAMS/SAINTS DEFENSIVE MEETING in San Francisco on Jan. 13th, 2012

[ShutDown24]

That was DISGUSTING. He needs to be banned for life.

[suitanim]

My high school coach used a lot of the same kind of terminology.

Not sure I appreciate the references to taking out ACL's though. As James Harrison said, "I want to hurt the other player, but I don't want to injure him".

Some of this will be overly shocking to younger people because they simply were never exposed to the game as it was in the 70's (and earlier, when it was even more violent), so there are some mitigating circumstances here, but the deliberate call to injure is too much.

[ShutDown24]

"We need to find out, the little wide receiver number 10, about his concussion. We need to fuckin put a lick on him. Right now."

"[Crabtree] becomes human when we fuckin take out that outside ACL."

"We need to decide how many times we can put Vernon Davis' ankles over the pile."

Honestly... I thought it was ridiculous when criminal charges were mentioned this entire time, but after hearing these quotes... If the audio is confirmed as Williams that should be enough to prosecute.

[ALLD]

The entire world thought the Steelers was the dirtiest team in the NFL.

[86WARD]

I can't see any possible way he ever returns to the NFL. Just based on what he said in regards to the concussion and the sensitivity to that issue that the NFL has nowadays...I wouldn't be surprised if the league lawyers tell Goodell that there's no chance he comes back...

[ShutDown24]

I can't see any possible way he ever returns to the NFL. Just based on what he said in regards to the concussion and the sensitivity to that issue that the NFL has nowadays...I wouldn't be surprised if the league lawyers tell Goodell that there's no chance he comes back...

I hope you're right.

[st33lersguy]

He can't be allowed to coach anymore

[Edman]

But you see, Goodell wanted to go after the Steelers, though. It was the Steelers who were labeled the dirty scumbags of the league.

But lo and behold, the NFL's darlings (Saints, like the Patriots) turn out to be the actual scumbags.

[fansince'76]

But lo and behold, the NFL's darlings (Saints, like the Patriots) turn out to be the actual scumbags.

Speaking of which, I'm surprised this evidence wasn't destroyed and swept under the rug as well...

[XxKnightxX]

And thats youre dagger from receiving a lifetime ban. He uttered every word that would just basically convict him of a crime. Hes as good as done.

[Craic]

I had no problem with the audio. . . right up until he started specifically calling for headshots and ACL injuries.

Things like, calling a Crabtree a PrimaDonna who needs to get hit so he decides whether he wants to play football or not, that's within the boundaries, definitely. Vernon Davis's ankles over the pile (If I'm interpreting it correctly - as pushing or hitting him back into the lineman or into every tackle so that he's worn out and always looking over his shoulder) - with that I have no problem. Even "touching the head" in a pile I have no problem with. Great mind-game strategy.

I don't think it should be a lifetime ban (this time), but I do think it should be a five year ban from ANY coaching or involvement with the game at ANY level (enforced by not allowing him back into the NFL until he's gone five years without coaching). I also think it should be mandatory that he sits with the owners and players of San Francisco and any other teams an investigation turns up, an apologizes face to face with them, staring them in the eyes and trying to justify a call to injure them. Last, and overall, I think the Saints should lose first round draft pick and be fined a quarter million for it.

I would say a million, but I don't consider this as bad as what the Pats* did, because they Saints were doing it within the confines of the game, not trying to change the confines by cheating. Yeah, I still consider cheating a worse crime than playing dirty. At you have to be good enough and fast enough and talented enough to get to the players when you play dirty. When you cheat, you just have to be placed in the right spot.

But sadly, I don't hear anything illegal in this tape. There was no offer of money for a hit, there was no direct call for hits outside of field of play, and the old "Sweep the leg" angle, while completely dirty, as Suit has said, is quite commonplace in sports. Heck, I don't even have a problem with them testing the weak points of the team... if a player comes back from a head injury or ACL injury, line 'em up and make 'em hurt. Find out if he's 100 percent back in the game. But the line was crossed when the coach called for inflicting injuries. Calling for ACL's and deliberate headshots is sickening.

[ALLD]

All I know if he was the DC of the Steelers they would be trying to burn the city down and lynch everybody on the team including the kicker.

[BigNastyDefense]

Saying to give the player with a concussion history a good lick, I have no problem with that. The guy is either going to try to protect himself and muff a punt (like he did against the Giants in the NFC Championship Game) or he's going to go all out to protect the football and leave himself open to possible injury.

Saying that Crabtree is a PrimaDonna (he is) and saying to hit him and make him decide if he wants to play football, no problem with that. Telling players to take out his ACL however I have a big problem with. That's an injury that can cause a player to lose an entire season or even end a career if the injury is bad enough (normally more gets torn than an ACL).

I am not exactly sure what "ankles over the pile" means. However if it means to attempt to injure him, then I have a problem with it. However, if it means to wear him down by knocking him around at the snap, no problem with it.

Football is a violent game. It's a very violent game. I love big, hard hits as long as they are legal. I do not condone intentionally injuring another player. Leaving a guy hurting, sore, bruised...that's fine. That's the game. If you don't want to get hit, don't play.

But for Gregg Williams telling his players to take out a guy's ACL and to give players concussions (especially with the NFL's focus on preventing concussions) , that's just wrong and it's not within the spirit of the game. To tell a player you'll give him money if he causes an important player to be carted off of the field, that's not right.

To be honest, even if they choose to reinstate him after the completion of the 2012 postseason, I don't think a single team will show him any interest. He won't get a single phone call.

[steelreserve]

Whatever. This kind of thing has probably been going on at all levels of football for decades, and it's only since the media started jumping on "Player Safety" thanks to ESPN Concussion Sunday that something like this would be a big deal.

Yeah, the guy does cross the line by telling players to "take out his ACL" and such - but I don't think any players are actually going to stoop so low as to actually carry out that kind of order. Career-threatening cheapshots, the players know better than to try anyway, out of a healthy respect for how precarious their own careers are.

The "beat 'em up, play dirty, hit 'em in the head," that kind of thing yeah, they'd do it. But I also don't see a heck of a lot wrong with that. So what it boils down to is basically a bunch of low-level enticements to play dirty, plus some other stuff that he should be embarrassed about saying as a professional football coach, but nobody was actually going to do. So BIG FUCKING YAWN.

I could see if he got fired over it, because it reflects pretty piss-poorly on the team. Maybe nobody else would want to hire him either, for the same reason. But all the people saying "OMG lifetime ban" and calling for him to be prosecuted - get your heads out of your asses. You can't seriously be THAT bought in to Goodell's new vision of Lawyerball, can you? Because that's what comments like that make you sound like.

[suitanim]

Speaking of which, I'm surprised this evidence wasn't destroyed and swept under the rug as well...

Actually, I think this is "The patsy". ALL the attention will be focused on this tape, which will allow the others teams to sneak out of the spotlight.

[NCSteeler]

Speaking of which, I'm surprised this evidence wasn't destroyed and swept under the rug as well...

Commish doesn't hold this evidence. An outsider does, wish it had been that way with the cheats

[NCSteeler]

I had no problem with the audio. . . right up until he started specifically calling for headshots and ACL injuries.

Things like, calling a Crabtree a PrimaDonna who needs to get hit so he decides whether he wants to play football or not, that's within the boundaries, definitely. Vernon Davis's ankles over the pile (If I'm interpreting it correctly - as pushing or hitting him back into the lineman or into every tackle so that he's worn out and always looking over his shoulder) - with that I have no problem. Even "touching the head" in a pile I have no problem with. Great mind-game strategy.

I don't think it should be a lifetime ban (this time), but I do think it should be a five year ban from ANY coaching or involvement with the game at ANY level (enforced by not allowing him back into the NFL until he's gone five years without coaching). I also think it should be mandatory that he sits with the owners and players of San Francisco and any other teams an investigation turns up, an apologizes face to face with them, staring them in the eyes and trying to justify a call to injure them. Last, and overall, I think the Saints should lose first round draft pick and be fined a quarter million for it.

I would say a million, but I don't consider this as bad as what the Pats* did, because they Saints were doing it within the confines of the game, not trying to change the confines by cheating. Yeah, I still consider cheating a worse crime than playing dirty. At you have to be good enough and fast enough and talented enough to get to the players when you play dirty. When you cheat, you just have to be placed in the right spot.

But sadly, I don't hear anything illegal in this tape. There was no offer of money for a hit, there was no direct call for hits outside of field of play, and the old "Sweep the leg" angle, while completely dirty, as Suit has said, is quite commonplace in sports. Heck, I don't even have a problem with them testing the weak points of the team... if a player comes back from a head injury or ACL injury, line 'em up and make 'em hurt. Find out if he's 100 percent back in the game. But the line was crossed when the coach called for inflicting injuries. Calling for ACL's and deliberate headshots is sickening.

I don't it's that hard to make the connection between him rubbing two fingers together saying "i go the first one".
I think a year maybe two should be sufficient, but I really think the owners and GMs doing the hiring would take care not to touch the guy anyhow. It's not like he is worth the risk at this point.

[NCSteeler]

Saying to give the player with a concussion history a good lick, I have no problem with that. The guy is either going to try to protect himself and muff a punt (like he did against the Giants in the NFC Championship Game) or he's going to go all out to protect the football and leave himself open to possible injury.

Saying that Crabtree is a PrimaDonna (he is) and saying to hit him and make him decide if he wants to play football, no problem with that. Telling players to take out his ACL however I have a big problem with. That's an injury that can cause a player to lose an entire season or even end a career if the injury is bad enough (normally more gets torn than an ACL).

I am not exactly sure what "ankles over the pile" means. However if it means to attempt to injure him, then I have a problem with it. However, if it means to wear him down by knocking him around at the snap, no problem with it.

Football is a violent game. It's a very violent game. I love big, hard hits as long as they are legal. I do not condone intentionally injuring another player. Leaving a guy hurting, sore, bruised...that's fine. That's the game. If you don't want to get hit, don't play.

But for Gregg Williams telling his players to take out a guy's ACL and to give players concussions (especially with the NFL's focus on preventing concussions) , that's just wrong and it's not within the spirit of the game. To tell a player you'll give him money if he causes an important player to be carted off of the field, that's not right.

To be honest, even if they choose to reinstate him after the completion of the 2012 postseason, I don't think a single team will show him any interest. He won't get a single phone call.

I completely agree. I remember hearing one of the Giants players even saying at the time after the 49ers game that getting after the returner hard was in their plan. That is how football is played you take advantage of weaknesses and you test the guy out. The calling for intention injuries takes it over the line. I also think his general language and demeanor makes him sound like a total ass. Could you imagine Lebeau cussing up a storm like that or even holding a meeting discussing things like that

[The Duke]

I completely agree. I remember hearing one of the Giants players even saying at the time after the 49ers game that getting after the returner hard was in their plan. That is how football is played you take advantage of weaknesses and you test the guy out. The calling for intention injuries takes it over the line. I also think his general language and demeanor makes him sound like a total ass. Could you imagine Lebeau cussing up a storm like that or even holding a meeting discussing things like that

certainly can't imagine Williams reciting Night Before Christmas

[O'Malley]

Just the NFL trying to cover their butts against future lawsuits... They should put a waiver in all contracts stating you cannot sue them after your career is over..

[7willBheaven]

I had no problem with the audio. . . right up until he started specifically calling for headshots and ACL injuries.

Things like, calling a Crabtree a PrimaDonna who needs to get hit so he decides whether he wants to play football or not, that's within the boundaries, definitely. Vernon Davis's ankles over the pile (If I'm interpreting it correctly - as pushing or hitting him back into the lineman or into every tackle so that he's worn out and always looking over his shoulder) - with that I have no problem. Even "touching the head" in a pile I have no problem with. Great mind-game strategy.

I don't think it should be a lifetime ban (this time), but I do think it should be a five year ban from ANY coaching or involvement with the game at ANY level (enforced by not allowing him back into the NFL until he's gone five years without coaching). I also think it should be mandatory that he sits with the owners and players of San Francisco and any other teams an investigation turns up, an apologizes face to face with them, staring them in the eyes and trying to justify a call to injure them. Last, and overall, I think the Saints should lose first round draft pick and be fined a quarter million for it.

I would say a million, but I don't consider this as bad as what the Pats* did, because they Saints were doing it within the confines of the game, not trying to change the confines by cheating. Yeah, I still consider cheating a worse crime than playing dirty. At you have to be good enough and fast enough and talented enough to get to the players when you play dirty. When you cheat, you just have to be placed in the right spot.

But sadly, I don't hear anything illegal in this tape. There was no offer of money for a hit, there was no direct call for hits outside of field of play, and the old "Sweep the leg" angle, while completely dirty, as Suit has said, is quite commonplace in sports. Heck, I don't even have a problem with them testing the weak points of the team... if a player comes back from a head injury or ACL injury, line 'em up and make 'em hurt. Find out if he's 100 percent back in the game. But the line was crossed when the coach called for inflicting injuries. Calling for ACL's and deliberate headshots is sickening.

Very well said!