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Thread: Pats getting spanked!

  1. #151
    Spaghetti Time Array title="Chidi29 has a reputation beyond repute"> Chidi29's Avatar

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    Re: Pats getting spanked!

    But he has yet to be a hearing officer in any instance. Nor has he overturned any decision made by the appointed hearing officer, even at moments where they have disagreed with Goodell (and there's multiple instances of a player winning an appeal to some degree).

    Until there is any proof that Goodell is changing, checking, or sitting in on an appeal, he is not involved. The fact that he can be an appeals officer is likely only a fail safe in case of an extreme situation (where the other two appointed officers are unable to make it to the appeal) or some crazy situation of blatant abuse by one Shell or Cotrell.

  2. #152

    Re: Pats getting spanked!

    Quote Originally Posted by Chidi29 View Post
    But he has yet to be a hearing officer in any instance. Nor has he overturned any decision made by the appointed hearing officer, even at moments where they have disagreed with Goodell (and there's multiple instances of a player winning an appeal to some degree).

    .
    Again...the discussions that Goodell has with the hearing officers are not publicly made known. You are speculating.


    Until there is any proof that Goodell is changing, checking, or sitting in on an appeal, he is not involved.
    Actually you are mistaken ...he does sit on the appeals. Common knowledge that he has been present.

    The fact that he can be an appeals officer is likely only a fail safe in case of an extreme situation (where the other two appointed officers are unable to make it to the appeal) or some crazy situation of blatant abuse by one Shell or Cotrell

    How did you come by that conclusion????? I see nowhere where it says that he would sit it in for a vacated seat???? Or for that matter, that it was for times of abuse!!!!! Please explain how you made that leap of logic?????!!!!!!!!!!!!
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  3. #153
    Spaghetti Time Array title="Chidi29 has a reputation beyond repute"> Chidi29's Avatar

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    Re: Pats getting spanked!

    Until there is any proof (you're making the claim) that he is talking to the appeals officers to nudge them, it can't be used as evidence. You have to back it up with evidence, the burden of proof falls to you.

    I said it was "likely", not that it was definite. I base that off the fact that Goodell has not heard and ruled on any appeal to my knowledge so far.

    When has Goodell sat on the appeal? When has he made a ruling on an appeal?

  4. #154
    Spaghetti Time Array title="Chidi29 has a reputation beyond repute"> Chidi29's Avatar

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    Re: Pats getting spanked!

    Perry, I get the argument you're making, but can you provide me any instances where Goodell has had a known effect on an appeal?

  5. #155
    Senior Member Array title="steelreserve has a reputation beyond repute"> steelreserve's Avatar

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    Re: Pats getting spanked!

    Quote Originally Posted by Chidi29 View Post
    Perry, I get the argument you're making, but can you provide me any instances where Goodell has had a known effect on an appeal?
    It would be pretty naive to think he didn't have an effect on the Harrison suspension this year. They were pretty much setting new league policy with that one, not to mention completely winging it on the appeal process itself (by making sure it got heard quickly enough that he would be suspended for the Niners game). If you think Goodell wasn't consulted every step of the way on that, and didn't personally sign off on every atom of every letter in the ruling and appeal, you've got to be kidding me.

    Fact of the matter is, you probably will never find any "hard" evidence of his direct involvement ever - because he won't release that kind of information. Well hey, guess what, the mafia doesn't release information about their procedure for laundering money, or the names of the guys running the smuggling business either. It's not too difficult to tell when his fingerprints are all over something, though, and there are many, many cases of that.
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  6. #156
    Spaghetti Time Array title="Chidi29 has a reputation beyond repute"> Chidi29's Avatar

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    Re: Pats getting spanked!

    Quote Originally Posted by steelreserve View Post
    It would be pretty naive to think he didn't have an effect on the Harrison suspension this year. They were pretty much setting new league policy with that one, not to mention completely winging it on the appeal process itself (by making sure it got heard quickly enough that he would be suspended for the Niners game). If you think Goodell wasn't consulted every step of the way on that, and didn't personally sign off on every atom of every letter in the ruling and appeal, you've got to be kidding me.

    Fact of the matter is, you probably will never find any "hard" evidence of his direct involvement ever - because he won't release that kind of information. Well hey, guess what, the mafia doesn't release information about their procedure for laundering money, or the names of the guys running the smuggling business either. It's not too difficult to tell when his fingerprints are all over something, though, and there are many, many cases of that.
    No, I don't think he was consulted "every step of the way". Heck, Goodell even let the former defensive player of the two, Cotrell, be the hearing officer.

    Sticking with the "actual courtroom" angle talked about earlier, without any evidence (and to compare the league to the mafia is laughable), you don't have an argument.

  7. #157
    Senior Member Array title="steelreserve has a reputation beyond repute"> steelreserve's Avatar

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    Re: Pats getting spanked!

    Quote Originally Posted by Chidi29 View Post
    No, I don't think he was consulted "every step of the way". Heck, Goodell even let the former defensive player of the two, Cotrell, be the hearing officer.

    Sticking with the "actual courtroom" angle talked about earlier, without any evidence (and to compare the league to the mafia is laughable), you don't have an argument.
    Just so you know ... if you're talking about actual "evidence," you don't have any argument either. All there is to go by is whatever information a handful of individuals associated with the league dispense, all of whom have a very vested interest in maintaining a certain appearance. You choose to believe they're fundamentally honest; I choose to believe they're willing to blur that line for their own self-interest. History and experience tend to be on my side.
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  8. #158
    Spaghetti Time Array title="Chidi29 has a reputation beyond repute"> Chidi29's Avatar

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    Re: Pats getting spanked!

    Quote Originally Posted by steelreserve View Post
    Just so you know ... if you're talking about actual "evidence," you don't have any argument either. All there is to go by is whatever information a handful of individuals associated with the league dispense, all of whom have a very vested interest in maintaining a certain appearance. You choose to believe they're fundamentally honest; I choose to believe they're willing to blur that line for their own self-interest. History and experience tend to be on my side.
    Again, you guys are the ones making the claim. You have the burden of proof.

    I don't see any reason as to why the appeals officers would be manipulated. They are paid jointly which as I've said, is specifically done to avoid any conflic of interest. Cotrell and Shell are both very experienced people as both players and coaches who are quite competent. The claim you're making is Goodell doing something highly unethical by trying to sway one of them when he could be easily outed by one of them if he attempted to do so and face serious consequences.

    Show me evidence of Goodell EVER influencing an appeal, and I'm more than willing to listen. Otheriwse, there's no reason to get back into a thread that was dead for a week.

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