Without comment....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjS0Novt3X4
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Without comment....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjS0Novt3X4
http://bbs.mediumpimpin.com/images/smilies/Bravo.gif
here's the problem. the elected dirtbags have already shown time and time again they DON'T CARE ABOUT PUBLIC OPINION... sure you can vote em out... only to be replaced by more of the same.
I agree with everything the man said. You can also push Americans so far, but when they go too far all hell breaks loose.
If we had an alternative to importing most of our oil and gasoline we would not be having this conversation. Real leadership is needed to find alternative energy and domestic production as a matter of national security.
We import oil because it's cheaper. There is no end of oil in the US but it is relatively expensive because it's more difficult to get to. "Our dependence on foreign oil" is bull@#$%.Quote:
Originally Posted by ALLD
One could even speculate that the dirty rotten corporations keep us believing "our dependence on foreign oil". I wouldn't though. That's why we have Ric.
While we're disregarding freedom of religion, can we get rid of Calvinists too?
Looks like so many here are grouping all Muslims into one category as psycho extremists and therefore they must all be murderous nut jobs, just like those terrorists that blew up the towers.
Muslim population in our country is vast, and I think we should all take into account that the fuckers of 9/11 aren't anywhere affiliated to them, and recognize that the vast Muslim community here was as sickened as we were ourselves that day.
Of course there is always the exception, as there is in anything in life, but let's please keep in mind that it's way beyond the majority of their population.
Call me crazy, but I think a mosque - which would be further than you might think from ground zero - would be something to show how much more educated we are, and a confirmation of what our country is all about and founded upon - differences in culture.
BTW, I have a cousin that could be the spitting image of Timothy McVeigh. :nervous:
Get what I'm saying here??
I say build it, and let's start to hopefully be able to heal because of it.
Let's go for peace and understanding.
I have a cousin that died at the Pentagon that day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shea
And, I was on my way to the Murrah building the morning that McVeigh blew it up. We were half an hour late. We finally pulled over to a gas station because we were getting passed by police, state troopers, fire trucks and ambulances one after the other. That's when we found out.
So yeah, I get what you're saying here. However,
I say kill them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shea
Sorry if that's not the popular sentiment.
No apology is necessary. They would gleefully kill us.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattsme
If Obama is all for it , its sure to never get built
http://roguejew.files.wordpress.com/...bama-fail1.jpg
Patriot* , are you saying you'd have no problem with a mosque at ground zero in NYC ?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Patriot
I think most people here know the difference between Muslims and extremist terrorist jihadist murdurous dirtbag Muslims. However, no matter how ya slice it, building a Mosque and ground zero is an asshat move. I pray it never gets built.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shea
Yep.Quote:
Originally Posted by 7SteelGal43
Not all Muslims are extremists.
I'm with Patsy on this one. Being from the area I've read the countless stories in the paper and I read why they wanted to do it. The Muslims who want this are trying to extend an olive branch. And as The Patriot said, not all Muslims are extremists; in fact a very small percentage of them are. Some Muslims were murdered on 9-11 by terrorists as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Patriot
I think it's too easy to blame Muslims and point fingers and protest this one; and I think it's all for the wrong reasons. Muslims are fighting the Taliban right along side our Soldiers and Marines in Afghanistan.
From my understanding, the Mosque would be blocks away from the site that the Towers were built upon and then sadly destroyed.Quote:
Originally Posted by 7SteelGal43
That's sacred ground and I don't know what will become of it, or what will be built there, but I do know it won't be a Mosque
And this is what I was trying to say earlier in the thread, but Warden did a much better job of it than I.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWarDen86
With all due respect to Patriot and WarDen, and I do respect you guys, I disagree.
Of course "the project" is being sold as an "olive branch". There is no other acceptable way to package it. Otherwise it's just an affront, a slap in the face. No, spitting in our eye.
mosques are a symbol of the religion of submission, and that is in fact what the word "islam" means - submission. It doesn't matter a hill of @#$% what the mosque means to rank & file muslims. What matters is what the mosque means to islam, and more importantly to us - they took down two of the central pillars of our society and culture, the World Trade Centers, with OUR own planes. Then they're building a @#$%ing mosque in close proximity to the atrocity. All symbolic. All "in your face".
As Patriot correctly points out, not all muslims are extremists. Indeed most experts put the extreme element at no more than 10% of islam. But there are 1.3 billion muslims. 10% of that figure is nearly half our total population. It's nearly all of Russia's population. Its twice the UK's population. The extreme element is beyond "significant". It has had us occupied in two theaters for nearly a decade, with no end in sight. That extreme element in those theaters is financed by mosques in every country from the hard earned money of rank & file muslims and the contributions the symbols of submission draw from the communities..
islam plays us like a violin because of our better nature, our tolerance, and our liberalism. If we don't snap out of it and realize what we're up against, our better nature is what will cost us our freedom to the religion of submission.
This is all about symbolism here. Building that mosque anywhere on the island of Manhattan is symbolic. It's symbolic in the same way as if we had had leadership that would have incinerated mecca and medina on 9/12/2001 to say "We heard you. Now hear us muslim bastards".
We're in a zero sum game. Its for all the marbles. They declared war on us. It is a war of the entirety of islam against us. You'll see the outcome in your lifetime.
Let the bastards build their symbol. Hopefully some Americans will return the gesture.
i personally feel like NO religious buildings should be built at ground zero.
i'll give it another 10 - 20 years, and this is what we'll be seeing in every country...
Quote:
Nigerian Christians Riot, Kill Muslims in Retaliation
James Joyner | Tuesday, February 21, 2006
Nigerian Christians have gone on an anti-Muslim killing spree, apparently in retaliation for earlier murderous riots by Muslims angered over cartoons.
Christian mobs rampaged through a southern Nigerian city Tuesday, burning mosques and killing several people in an outbreak of anti-Muslim violence that followed deadly protests against caricatures of the Prophet Muhammad over the weekend.
Residents and witnesses in the southern, predominantly Christian city of Onitsha said several Muslims with origins in the north were beaten to death by mobs which also burned two mosques there. “The mosque at the main market has been burnt and I’ve counted at least six dead bodies on the streets,” Izzy Uzor, an Onitsha resident and businessman, told The Associated Press by telephone. “The whole town is in a frenzy and people are running in all directions.”
The violence appeared to be in reprisal for anti-Christian violence Saturday in the mostly Muslim northern city of Maiduguri in which thousands of Muslims protesting caricatures of the Prophet Muhammad attacked Christians and burned churches, killing at least 18 people.
Lovely. Not particularly surprising, I suppose, but nonetheless tragic.
guess none of the ...."good muslims" ... thought to bring this guy to the attention of the authorities while he was preaching hate here in the good ole USA mosque's ...
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE64M0OR20100523Quote:
U.S. cleric urges Muslims to kill U.S. soldiers
(Reuters) - A U.S.-born militant cleric has urged Muslims to kill U.S. soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan and vowed to step up attacks against the U.S. military, according to a videotape released on Sunday.
(Reuters) - A U.S.-born militant cleric has urged Muslims to kill U.S. soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan and vowed to step up attacks against the U.S. military, according to a videotape released on Sunday.
Anwar al-Awlaki, wanted dead or alive by U.S. authorities, is a leading figure linked to al Qaeda's Yemen-based wing. He is believed to be on the run in the impoverished Gulf Arab state.
"Muslims should object to what's going on either verbally or by physical action," Awlaki said in the 45-minute interview posted on an Islamist website. Reuters could not immediately verify the authenticity of the recording.
Awlaki praised the actions of U.S. Army psychiatrist Nidal Malik Hasan who shot dead 13 people at Fort Hood, a Texas army base, in November.
"Nidal was my student ... I'm proud of Nidal Hasan and this was a heroic act," he said, adding: "Who can object to what he did? He killed soldiers on their way to Iraq and Afghanistan."
Hasan had sent emails to the cleric but they were intercepted by U.S. intelligence agencies and examined by U.S. joint terrorism task forces.
"If the situation remains we will see new Nidal Hasans appearing," Awlaki said in the tape. "These American soldiers on their way to Afghanistan and Iraq, we will kill them."
Asked by an interviewer if killing U.S. soldiers would have a negative impact on Muslims in the United States, Awlaki said defending Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan was a larger priority.
"Is protecting the reputation of Muslims in America more important than bombs dropping on millions of Muslims elsewhere?"
U.S. officials said in April that President Barack Obama's administration had authorized operations to capture or kill Awlaki. Yemen has said it will not hand over Awlaki, whose family is well-known in Yemen, but instead put him on trial if he is arrested.
Born in New Mexico, Awlaki led prayers at U.S. mosques. He returned to Yemen in 2004 where he taught at a university before he was arrested and imprisoned in 2006 for suspected links to al Qaeda and involvement in attacks. He was released in late 2007.
Western countries fear that al Qaeda's resurgent regional wing is exploiting instability in Yemen, which borders oil giant Saudi Arabia, to launch attacks in the region and beyond.
(Reporting by Amena Bakr; Editing by Maria Golovnina)
MOP, I wonder what the percentage is of U.S. mosques that have ties to terrorism. I did a quick search and found reports saying anywhere from 50% all the way up to 80% (quick google glances).Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterOfPuppets
Also, I wonder if the parents of that three year old future jihadist have a bumper sticker on the back of their car that states "My child is student of the month at suicide bomber school"
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Patriot
While I agree that not all Muslims are militant, you have to wonder where all the religious community leaders that should be on the news condemning the violence? It rarely exists. I work with a gentleman who is expatriated from Kuwait. In his words, when asked why there was so much violence in the Muslim world, "They are stupid people who let their religion consume their brains so they don't think." In fact, his entire family disowned him when he moved to Canada because he was becoming "westernized."Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWarDen86
I think building a mosque on that site is, at best, in bad taste and, at worst, a complete intentional slap to the politically correct West.
This is my biggest problem with peaceful Islam at the moment. It would only take a Gandhi like figure in the Muslim world to bring some of this violence under control.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer67
And btw, the Mosque is being built several blocks from ground zero. These websites make it sound like it's being built on the actual site. Remember, before all these terrorist groups emerged in the 1970s, Americans used to vacation in Baghdad just to look at the beautiful Mosques. The ancient culture isn't our enemy, it's this modern extremism which we must destroy.
I had lapsed in a moment of insensitivity and neglected to express my respect and disagreement with Shea as well. Please forgive me Shea, and accept my hostility to all things islamic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent
+1Quote:
Originally Posted by Devilsdancefloor
-1
There are those that would differ.Quote:
Originally Posted by Devilsdancefloor
Attachment 173
Although, I'm sure they oppose the mosque as well.
Let me be clear about one thing with regards to my stance: I understand that it's not the popular view, and I also find myself feeling strange about supporting it. I just do and for the reasons I stated.
That said, should they be found to have abused this privilege awarded them rather than continue to mend and plant the seed to future relations with the rest of us, then by all means: evict them in the most hostile way allowed.
My feeling is that if they can succeed in what they say they want to do, we will all be the better for it.
I don't hate Muslims; I hate terrorists and or anyone wishing to negatively impact the American way of life.
I take your point but point out that the fundamental differences between Gandhi's religion and "the religion of peace" preclude such a scenario. They're violent by nature. Their "religion" "gives" them a license to violence in general, and a mandate in specifics. As the late Mrs. Meir pointed out, "We will have peace with the Arabs when they love their children more than they hate us." It isn't in muslims to love. I've yet to meet one that had the vaguest concept of love.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Patriot
I have no issue with religious expressions at Ground Zero except if they are islamic. Ground Zero exists because of islam. No expression of any kind by islam in any capacity is appropriate or acceptable. The only "expression of regret" I would ever accept from them would be the self incineration of one of their "holy" cities.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWarDen86
1,300 years of islam tells us there is no prospect for such an "if".Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWarDen86
I don't disagree with you often my Friend, and trust me, it goes against what I feel is the easier emotion for me as well, but Islam is not to blame IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent
I blame men like him:
Attachment 174
Not folks like them:
Attachment 175
You must be sniffing the same glue I'm using, mein freund.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWarDen86
:puke:Quote:
Originally Posted by ricardisimo
C'mon Ric, it's already been a shitty day man.
:chuckle:
A good dose of toluene will fix that, trust me. :bananalama: :faint: :rip:Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWarDen86
I don't think we disagree by much.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWarDen86
My issue is not with "folks like these" anymore than I had any issue with Ivan and Ludmilla Q. Public during the Cold War. They're all victims of oppression. "Folks like these" just don't know it because they're beaten into submission by their "religion".
My issue is with islam which breeds terrorism. mo himself was a terrorist. islam will not rest until you, I, Ric, everybody in this forum, all our families, and everybody we know have been beaten into submission, or have died in the process.
No, we can't just get along. Ground Zero tells us that.
And 'sides, I'm not arguing with you, you're arguing with me. :wink02:
pay close attention to the bold parts...
Peace march for new mosque gets ugly
Opponents of proposed Sheepshead Bay mosque outnumbered by supporters
A peace march in support of a controversial proposed mosque in Sheepshead Bay turned ugly last Thursday after residents jeered marchers, most of whom were from outside the area.
“This is a Jewish neighborhood — build a mosque in your own neighborhood,” yelled Stan Yunatanov, who lives across the street from the proposed house of worship and cultural center planned for Voorhies Avenue between East 28th and East 29th streets.
Another woman, who refused to give her name, yelled, “[Muslims] don’t love America. They hate America.”
There were no arrests, but tension — which has been high ever since the Muslim American Society purchased the property earlier this year — was definitely of Biblical proportions during the “Children of Abraham Interfaith Peace Walk,” the seventh annual march for the Park Slope-based group.
The peace group originally planned to have its march in Coney Island, but decided to have it in Sheepshead Bay to support the embattled mosque project.
“It’s a show of support for the right of all faiths to worship,” said Rabbi Ellen Lippmann, one of the event organizers and the head of Kolot Chayeinu, a Jewish congregation that holds its services in a Park Slope church.
The show of support had a distinct “outsider” feel, however. Organizers said that they tried to get locals involved, but failed.
“We tried to recruit local clergy, but nobody wanted to join the walk,” said Rev. Tom Martinez, another Park Slope-based cleric.
And the original starting place for the parade — St. Mark’s Catholic Church on the corner of Ocean Avenue and Avenue Z — was changed after the church pulled out, citing local complaints, organizers said.
As a result, the march started on Voorhies and Ocean avenues. In all, about 200 children and adults -— many waving American flags — walked peacefully down Emmons Avenue and up Bedford Avenue before turning down Voorhies, where they were greeted with the catcalls. Some opponents held photos of Muslims burning an American flag and denounced the mosque’s affiliation with the Muslim American Society, which has been tied to Hamas and Hezbollah.
That’s balderdash, said Ahmed Allowey, a longtime neighborhood resident who is working with the Muslim group to create the mosque because the “organization has programs for young people [to] maintain their Islamic identity as well as their American identity so they can grow up to be proud Muslims and proud Americans.”
Despite the ugly catcalls, the majority of anti-mosque residents said that their opposition was not about religion at all, but about traffic. The mosque would be on a very narrow street with little parking.
“I would say the same thing if it were a Catholic church because this isn’t a good spot for a house of worship,” said Amelia McMahon, who lives a block from the site. “This is a residential neighborhood. There’s nowhere to park, and I don’t want all the noise and traffic around here.”
That said, there is a growing Muslim population in the neighborhood, and many said they will walk to the mosque. As it is now, followers of Islam have no local place to worship and teach the religion to their children, supporters said.
“We are more than 100 families in this neighborhood,” said Salle Colagi, who lives with his wife and three children near the site. “This is a good spot for the mosque because usually when we go to worship, or to teach our kids, we have to travel all the way to Bay Ridge or Canarsie. Once this is built, we can walk here.”
Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/b...#ixzz0r8QnulVH
They're all tied to hamas and hezbollah.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterOfPuppets
This book details the islamic "program" from the inside of "CAIR" (Council on American-Islamic Relations), the "happy face" of terror that operates in the US. http://www.amazon.com/MUSLIM-MAFIA-U...6743458&sr=8-1 The author is a former federal agent, is a U.S. State Department-trained Arabic linguist and counterterrorism specialist. He has the goods.
Sad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent
C'mon Vincent, you're smarter than that.
http://wcbstv.com/local/staten.islan...2.1745014.htmlQuote:
STATEN ISLAND (CBS) ―
Muslim American Society Questioned Over Mosque
Mohamed Sadeia of the Muslim American Society responds to heated audience members at a hearing over a proposed mosque on Staten Island on June 9, 2010.
A confrontational hearing on Staten Island over a proposed mosque touched off so much emotion that it's prompted a closer look at the group that wants to build it: the Muslim American Society.
Thursday night at a packed hearing, a proposal to build a mosque on Staten Island ran into some heated opposition.
The group that wants to build a mosque and community center on what had been a Catholic convent is the Muslim American Society. Founded in Virginia in 1993, they have built mosques and community centers in the Bath Beach section of Brooklyn, they say, to promote understanding. One of the people at the hearing challenged the leader of the mosque, Mohamed Sadeia, to denounce Hamas and Hezbollah:
Those in attendance felt Sadeia twice avoided a direct answer, until he finally spoke out against terrorism generally.
"There is no relationship, as we stand today, between MAS, the Muslim American Society, and any foreign entity," Sadeia said.
While the Muslim American Society is not on any government list of terrorist organizations, Hamas and Hezbollah are. Annemarie McAvoy, a former federal prosecutor, saw a video on the Internet, like many people at Wednesday night's meeting, which shows a current director of the Muslim American Society eight years ago cheering at a Washington rally when the crowd is asked, "Who supports Hamas?" and then "Who supports Hezbollah?"
Sadeia said that man's eight-year-old opinion did not speak for his group, but strong doubts about the Muslim American Society remain:
"A couple of the founders apparently are members of the Muslim Brotherhood," said McAvoy. "Apparently the Muslim Brotherhood has a lot of ties to Muslim extremists
CBS 2 made repeated efforts to interview Sadeia on Thursday or some other leader from the Muslim American Society, but messages were not answered. After facing such strong opposition Wednesday night, it is not clear if the group still plans to build the mosque.
Shea, there is tons of very well documented evidence of direct domestic support of hamas, hezbollah, et al. Yes, you have to look for it because "the media" won't touch it. While there are many books and articles, the one I referenced above is a good look into the operations of CAIR by one of our professionals. One of the more visible and painful examples of the relationship between a mosque and terror is the case of the Ft Hood massacre. Its all out there in black and white, yet our gubmint can't bring themselves to call that what it is because of their fear of offending muslims.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shea
I don't involve myself in this stuff because I'm bored. They are destroying Europe and the UK, and have a substantial base to do the same here.
No, the muslim brotherhood ARE muslim extremists. "The Brotherhood was founded in accordance with al-Banna’s proclamation that Islam be “given hegemony over all matters of life.” Accordingly, the Brotherhood seeks to establish an Islamic Caliphate spanning the entire Muslim world. It also aspires to make Islamic (Shari’a) law the sole basis of jurisprudence and governance. Toward this purpose -- encapsulated in the Brotherhood’s militant credo: “God is our objective, the Koran is our Constitution, the Prophet is our leader, struggle is our way, and death for the sake of God is the highest of our aspirations” -- the Brotherhood since its founding has supported the use of armed struggle, or jihad. The Brotherhood supports the waging of jihad against non-Muslim “infidels,” and has expressed support for terrorism against Israel, whose legitimacy the Brotherhood does not recognize, and against the West, particularly the United States."Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterOfPuppets
Everybody gets all wee-wee'd up over things like the "aryan brotherhood", and they should. But those lowlife are pretenders compared to the muslim brotherhood and their "associates".
Okay, to all those against the Mosque, I can't judge the intentions of these particular Muslims (I hope they're good), but let's pretend that they're ill-intentioned and are actually doing this to show that they have conquered New York... Unless you can prove that they support terrorism or violence, there isn't much you can do to prevent them from building their Mosque.
One of the primary purposes of the constitution was to protect religion from the government. We can't even stop the Church that goes to funerals to celebrate the deaths of soldiers! If we tried to stop the Mosque, it would go to the Supreme Court and they would win.