Tomlin Ruined Kenny

Kenny hasn't thrown over 300 yards since his first game as a starter against the Bills. Granted Kenny was throwing a lot of ints the few games after but Tomlin put the training wheels on him since then, instead of letting him go through the growing pains and become a better QB. Peyton Manning threw more of his share of ints his rookie year but look what became of Peyton.

Tomlin's winning season record came first and where did it get the Steelers last season ? This season Kenny's completion percentage has drop and he looks like warn out goods. Not throwing over the middle is unheard of for a starting pro QB in the NFL. Tomlin will get his usual winning season this year but Kenny is toast because of being held back and I'm afraid he is headed for a David Carr fate.

I am not a buyer in this logic ....

what I believe is simple ...

it took KP 5 years of college QB play to put up draftable numbers at which point he had reached his ceiling and the growth was finished , he was tapped out and had utilized all his talent as a player .... he excels at nothing talent wise he doesn't have great arm strength , great processing , great accuracy , great anticipation , nothing nadda ... he is average at best across the board and he has been exposed ... teams have tape on him they know his tendencies and they take those plays away as best they can leaving him with throws he is not comfortable making thus he checks it down and that is why 85% of his passes are within 5 yards ( 15 feet or less ) or the line of scrimmage ... there is nothing debatable about this go chart his passes or look at charts that are plenty available and I am telling no lies here ..... he is a 60% completion kinda guy playing the game he is currently playing ... when he throws beyond 5 yards his completion percentage drops to around 50% and beyond 15 it drops to around 35% .... he is not an NFL worthy QB .... his TD percentage totals is the lowest percentage of any QB to play the game and accrue 500 snaps since the Merger at 1.9% , NOBODY has been less effective in HISTORY , Nobody ................


but hey I am a hater according to some , so I guess my hate makes him historically bad .... it couldnt possibly be I hate him because he is bad now could it ???

Tomlin is not coaching KP to throw passes 4’ over the head of open receivers.
Canada is not designing/ calling plays for KP to throw passes 4’ over the head of open receivers.
The poor O-Line play is not forcing KP to throw passes 4’ over the head of open receivers.

There is plenty of blame to go around. BUT, KP is at the very least an equal contributor to this historically bad offense.

I’ve mentioned before that operating on the premise that “KP should be a good NFL QB” may be a flawed premise.

At this point we have to ask whether an offense guru and QB whisper equivalent to Bill Walsh could help.

I'm in the "Kenny sucks because Canada sucks" mindframe but they need to bench him. Not sure what happened between preseason and regular season but his play in the early part of the games aren't cutting it. At least get in FG range and he can't even do that.

Now, that doesn't excuse:

Matt Canada
Mike Sullivan (not the hockey one)
Pat Meyer
Frisman Jackson
Glenn Thomas
Alfredo Corley

And, yes, Tomlin


Because all the excuses to "miscommunication" are all over the place.

I'm with tube, KP sucks because Canada's system sucks. I know what i saw last year, the guy displayed intangibles and made things happen out of busted plays. Maybe he had more time, maybe the line played better, probably Canada didn't have time to get his hooks into him yet.

As far as benching him, i don't know, i'd rather they bench (fire) Canada. We're basically throwing in the towell by benching Kenny and playing Mitch (?, seriously? or MR but with our line play i don't think the results would be that great either)

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Originally Posted by Dwinsgames

I am not a buyer in this logic ....

what I believe is simple ...

it took KP 5 years of college QB play to put up draftable numbers at which point he had reached his ceiling and the growth was finished , he was tapped out and had utilized all his talent as a player .... he excels at nothing talent wise he doesn't have great arm strength , great processing , great accuracy , great anticipation , nothing nadda ... he is average at best across the board and he has been exposed ... teams have tape on him they know his tendencies and they take those plays away as best they can leaving him with throws he is not comfortable making thus he checks it down and that is why 85% of his passes are within 5 yards ( 15 feet or less ) or the line of scrimmage ... there is nothing debatable about this go chart his passes or look at charts that are plenty available and I am telling no lies here ..... he is a 60% completion kinda guy playing the game he is currently playing ... when he throws beyond 5 yards his completion percentage drops to around 50% and beyond 15 it drops to around 35% .... he is not an NFL worthy QB .... his TD percentage totals is the lowest percentage of any QB to play the game and accrue 500 snaps since the Merger at 1.9% , NOBODY has been less effective in HISTORY , Nobody ................


but hey I am a hater according to some , so I guess my hate makes him historically bad .... it couldnt possibly be I hate him because he is bad now could it ???

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The one issue i have with this logic is the check down 5 yard pass theory. The reason i have a problem with this is there are 2 other QB's on this roster currently along with a Future HOF QB that under Canada and Tomlin's directions threw the same passes. Now that isn't to say that i think Kenny is great cause i don't. I think his ceiling is average at best with a long shot of being just above average.

However Tomlin's approach of rushing him into starting duty was not the best idea. The OC's scheme is horrible and is further hampered by a head coach that mandates they limit the turnovers by minimizing the use of the middle of the field and the long ball. Yes Kenny will throw more int's but it is part of the growing pains with a Rookie QB. Especially when he was never meant to be a first rd draft pick. He should have had time to learn first and then put into the game and allowed to continue to learn. Its a three headed monster of a not so great QB mixed with a bad OC and a head coach that despite all his bravado of "not living in his fears" that's exactly what he does. Its a compounded problem. On top of all that you are starting to hear and see grumbling from players now. This is the sign of a coach starting to lose the locker room and we are witnessing that happen in real time now.

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Originally Posted by Steeler-in-west

I'm with tube, KP sucks because Canada's system sucks. I know what i saw last year, the guy displayed intangibles and made things happen out of busted plays. Maybe he had more time, maybe the line played better, probably Canada didn't have time to get his hooks into him yet.

As far as benching him, i don't know, i'd rather they bench (fire) Canada. We're basically throwing in the towell by benching Kenny and playing Mitch (?, seriously? or MR but with our line play i don't think the results would be that great either)

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Benching him now is kicking can down road. Going nowhere with any QB on our roster. Only option is get new OC and see if he performs. If not find a new QB. At this point I’m actually thinking it’s highly unlikely a new OC puts his ceiling any higher than a Chad Pennington type guy. Theres nothing wrong with a first round pick not panning out , it happens frequently especially with QBs. My worry is the failure of management to cut the cord like the Bills did. Starting with Canada and possibly with KP eventually if no improvement with new offense .

This situation feels a lot like road racing, when you're trying to tune a car to the track and driver.

You can't change multiple things at once or you'll never know what's working and what isn't. You make one change at a time. Test it. Scrap it if it doesn't work. Rinse. Repeat.

Because I don't see Tomlin firing Canada mid-season, I truly think it's time to start Mason Rudolph. If the results are the same, then maybe give Mitch another shot.

If that nets the same result, it may not be the driver (QB) as much as it is the set up (Canada).

If Tomlin doesn't see the light after that testing, then he may need to hit the bricks with Canada.

My concern is that Tomlin will be too hung up on his "never a losing season" legacy to take a chance on benching KP.

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It's a combination of Pickett is inaccurate; mixed with Canada being a clown. And Tomlin living in his fears of limiting the offense to minimize possible mistakes by Pickett. That's all one big Gumbo.

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Originally Posted by Steel Maniac

It's a combination of Pickett is inaccurate; mixed with Canada being a clown. And Tomlin living in his fears of limiting the offense to minimize possible mistakes by Pickett. That's all one big Gumbo.

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hey, look who's here?

please tell us when you joined this board again.

lmao....

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Originally Posted by hawaiiansteeler

hey, look who's here?

please tell us when you joined this board again.

lmao....

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YEP!!

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Originally Posted by cubanstogie

Benching him now is kicking can down road. Going nowhere with any QB on our roster. Only option is get new OC and see if he performs. If not find a new QB. At this point I’m actually thinking it’s highly unlikely a new OC puts his ceiling any higher than a Chad Pennington type guy. Theres nothing wrong with a first round pick not panning out , it happens frequently especially with QBs. My worry is the failure of management to cut the cord like the Bills did. Starting with Canada and possibly with KP eventually if no improvement with new offense .

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Agreed, i’m all for getting rid of Canada as soon as possible and giving KP the rest of the season to improve or get back some of his mojo from last year. If we were to be in position to get a better QB option in the first round I’m all for it, but not if KP is showing real improvement and not at the cost of a top rated center or safety. Truth be told I never liked KP’s release, not quick enough, nor the gloves, which really have no place in NFL postseason play, but I thought he showed the right intangibles last year and still think he’s capable of it if given the opportunity. As far as Canada, I hope they get rid of him now but knowing how conservative they are with these things, probably have to wait till the season is over. No way Canada lasts beyond that. That would be totally bizarre

I wanted Howell. I supported the Pickett selection because I figured Colbert was smarter than me. I was wrong

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Originally Posted by DuckHodges

I wanted Howell. I supported the Pickett selection because I figured Colbert was smarter than me. I was wrong

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I liked Pickett and I liked Howell as the two best QBs. I kind of hoped they wouldn't take Pickett in the first round and could get him maybe in the second or just fall back to take Howell a little later. When they took Pickett I understood the move, wished for the best, and supported the move hoping he would have a chance to be real good.

I wouldn't have taken him in the first round, but figured they got a great read on him from seeing so much of him.

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Originally Posted by pczach

I liked Pickett and I liked Howell as the two best QBs. I kind of hoped they wouldn't take Pickett in the first round and could get him maybe in the second or just fall back to take Howell a little later. When they took Pickett I understood the move, wished for the best, and supported the move hoping he would have a chance to be real good.

I wouldn't have taken him in the first round, but figured they got a great read on him from seeing so much of him.

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I think I was on record as not wanting any QB that draft. I did draft Howell a lot in my mock drafts because he would drop. I should go back and look. Matt Corral was my “off the beaten path”/contrarian sleeper. I think he’s still sleeping…

Well, if there is anything we definitely praise Kenny for, he finally rid the organization of Canada. But at what cost?

That means he has seven games left to prove himself. I don't think this fixes him, though. The dude is broken.

Everywhere around the NFL world Kenny is being compared to guys like Zach Wilson, who has been benched to 3rd string now. The guy has physical tools, just not the understanding or confidence to be a starting QB.

Guess we’ll find out.

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Originally Posted by Born2Steel

Everywhere around the NFL world Kenny is being compared to guys like Zach Wilson, who has been benched to 3rd string now. The guy has physical tools, just not the understanding or confidence to be a starting QB.

Guess we’ll find out.

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How could he not be?

Well, he seems to have a new lease on life after the Canada firing. Let's give him some leeway and see what he now does against the Cardinals.

Imagine if Tomlin had done the right thing and fired Canada before the season. I think Kenny would be much further along.

I don’t think it’s all on Tomlin, I think he and Khan had to get Art jr’s buyoff to let go of Canada, I think they all read the writing on the wall, the offenses futility and the locker room was starting to revolt, that’s probably what made them act

who decided to hire this guy in the first place? That’s what I’m wondering

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Originally Posted by Steeler-in-west

I don’t think it’s all on Tomlin, I think he and Khan had to get Art jr’s buyoff to let go of Canada, I think they all read the writing on the wall, the offenses futility and the locker room was starting to revolt, that’s probably what made them act

who decided to hire this guy in the first place? That’s what I’m wondering

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He wasn't hired without Tomlins input.

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Originally Posted by Mach1

He wasn't hired without Tomlins input.

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probably right, he ‘obviously’ didn’t do his homework on the guy. Really after 18 years, I think he’s getting close to the end of his coaching career with the Steelers, making stupid decisions like this bears that out. Who cares if he’s still relatively young for a coach, it’s the mileage not the age, that can make a coach careless and his message stale.

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Originally Posted by Steeler-in-west

probably right, he ‘obviously’ didn’t do his homework on the guy. Really after 18 years, I think he’s getting close to the end of his coaching career with the Steelers, making stupid decisions like this bears that out. Who cares if he’s still relatively young for a coach, it’s the mileage not the age, that can make a coach careless and his message stale.

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Totally agree!!

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by Steeler-in-west

probably right, he ‘obviously’ didn’t do his homework on the guy. Really after 18 years, I think he’s getting close to the end of his coaching career with the Steelers, making stupid decisions like this bears that out. Who cares if he’s still relatively young for a coach, it’s the mileage not the age, that can make a coach careless and his message stale.

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Sometimes you just need to hit the refresh button. Look at Andy Reid, obviously a good coach. The eagles moved on and found some success, Reid moved on and clearly found success. Sometimes things get stale even with a good coach. At this point this team just needs something new. Tomlin has some good qualities. Lets be real about that. Hes not the worst coach in the league. However he may do better in a different environment as well. The problem is the guy walked into a dream situation with an amazing team and culture already in place. With that said, he could also go somewhere else and be shown to be completely inept. The truth is we simply do not know. We do not know how much influence he has truly in the draft, in the hiring process, how much he influences both sides of the ball. They are pretty good at keeping everything under wraps. We read interviews and get little bits of information and form our opinions accordingly but none of us truly know. The two things we do know for sure is that players love playing for him and his teams are constantly unprepared. These two most likely go hand in hand as he doesn't appear to be a very hard nosed coach. More of like a camp cupcake type deal.

just my 2 cents

Gee.....what was it that changed for Andy Reid....was it Alex Smith....no........oh yeah.....drafting the best QB in the league by a country mile.


Take an honest look at the Steelers and tell me how they have any right to be 7-5, let alone better than that?

They have the worst offense in football that isn't the Jets.
They are starting guys from Giant Eagle raffles at ILB.
They have a rookie CB that can cover and then a bunch of CBs that are physically incapable of covering NFL caliber WRs.
They have been playing almost random players at safety for about half a season.
Their best DL is still not fully healthy.
They replaced their starting RT on the fly during the season with a rookie playing a different position.
They have like 1.5-2.5 functional NFL WRs. Problem is they need to play 2-3 of them at a time.

The Steelers and the Brows are likely the two teams with a "winning" record that have faced the most adversity this season. And I think the Steelers have and will continue to weather it better than the Browns.

When is the last time a team in playoff contention fired an offensive coordinator? I think it was that one Ravens year many have cited and that is about it.

This is a team with bottom 1/3 of the league play from the following positions: QB, LT, ILB, CB, and "non-Minkah Fitzpatrick Safety".

I am honestly shocked that they have won more than 4 games.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Gee.....what was it that changed for Andy Reid....was it Alex Smith....no........oh yeah.....drafting the best QB in the league by a country mile.


Take an honest look at the Steelers and tell me how they have any right to be 7-5, let alone better than that?

They have the worst offense in football that isn't the Jets.
They are starting guys from Giant Eagle raffles at ILB.
They have a rookie CB that can cover and then a bunch of CBs that are physically incapable of covering NFL caliber WRs.
They have been playing almost random players at safety for about half a season.
Their best DL is still not fully healthy.
They replaced their starting RT on the fly during the season with a rookie playing a different position.
They have like 1.5-2.5 functional NFL WRs. Problem is they need to play 2-3 of them at a time.

The Steelers and the Brows are likely the two teams with a "winning" record that have faced the most adversity this season. And I think the Steelers have and will continue to weather it better than the Browns.

When is the last time a team in playoff contention fired an offensive coordinator? I think it was that one Ravens year many have cited and that is about it.

This is a team with bottom 1/3 of the league play from the following positions: QB, LT, ILB, CB, and "non-Minkah Fitzpatrick Safety".

I am honestly shocked that they have won more than 4 games.

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pretty much i told my friend who's a cardinals fan that they actually had a good chance of winning that game yesterday, because this year's steeler team is a paper tiger. they could just as easily be 2-10 as they were 7-4 by how this year went.

that and you can't ever underestimate tomlin's ability to play down to the opponent's level

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Originally Posted by DuckHodges

pretty much i told my friend who's a cardinals fan that they actually had a good chance of winning that game yesterday, because this year's steeler team is a paper tiger. they could just as easily be 2-10 as they were 7-4 by how this year went.

that and you can't ever underestimate tomlin's ability to play down to the opponent's level

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Maybe?

I am not sure they are "playing down" to anyone's level. This is not some stacked team that "should" beat any team. This is a deeply flawed team with systematic issues on the offensive side of the football and significant talent/injury issues on defense.

Honestly, any team that loses to the 2023 Steelers should be more upset about that than Steelers fans/team should be about losing to any other NFL team.

No one "ruined" Pickett. He's just an Alex Smith analogue surrounded by a mediocre offense. Ceiling is average. A great team around him could prop him up to be acceptable. Still never going to win you shit unless something changes.

An above average coach and a below average quarterback. Why aren't they going undefeated?