What has happened to the Democratic party?

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

But I think your unhinged rant has gone a long way towards proving my point. As well as underscoring what El Gonzo posted just a bit ago as well.

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Pretty much.

One side thinks that if you support anti-racism and disproportionate police violence against minorities, that you condone the destruction of innocent peoples property. While the other side thinks that if you are supportive of lower corporate tax rates, that you also support the prejudicial treatment of minorities and the "white power" movement.

There are some that can view things as simple right and wrong, or that both sides have some good beliefs... such as that its wrong to shoot a drunken man in the back, or wrong to kneel on a man's neck until he dies and its also wrong to loot stores and burn buildings.

Sadly, a lot of people cannot admit to somebody on the other side of the discussion, that they have some good points. They often attack or deflect as a coping mechanism.

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Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson

Pretty much.

One side thinks that if you support anti-racism and disproportionate police violence against minorities, that you condone the destruction of innocent peoples property. While the other side thinks that if you are supportive of lower corporate tax rates, that you also support the prejudicial treatment of minorities and the "white power" movement.

There are some that can view things as simple right and wrong, or that both sides have some good beliefs... such as that its wrong to shoot a drunken man in the back, or wrong to kneel on a man's neck until he dies and its also wrong to loot stores and burn buildings.

Sadly, a lot of people cannot admit to somebody on the other side of the discussion, that they have some good points. They often attack or deflect as a coping mechanism.

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True. I do it far more often than I would like. I think part of it is that it can all get so tiring. For instance, I get really tired with just because I am for high corporate tax rates and high(er) tax rates on the upper %'s that it is just assumed that I want to give away $$$ for nothing on the back-end or wouldn't have a military or whatever else the "left" stands for in some people's minds. Then I have to waste so much energy trying to separate those ideas in people's minds that I just get worn out and frustrated.

I imagine that it goes the other direction as well.

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Originally Posted by st33lersguy

I know right. It's the left that wants a kid show cancelled just because a character happens to be a dog that is a cop. It's the left that is calling for a boycott of Dominos pizza because they tweeted appreciation for Kayliegh McEnany being a loyal customer 8 YEARS AGO! The left is always most boisterous over cancelling anything that isn't 100% in line with their views

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Happens both ways. Remember when we were all supposed to stop shopping at Target because of bathrooms? Or whenever we are supposed to stop watching this or reading that because of either sex or Jesus?

I don't disagree with you at all, but as others have pointed out both sides have their loud voices that prevent either side from being totally blameless.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Happens both ways. Remember when we were all supposed to stop shopping at Target because of bathrooms? Or whenever we are supposed to stop watching this or reading that because of either sex or Jesus?

I don't disagree with you at all, but as others have pointed out both sides have their loud voices that prevent either side from being totally blameless.

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It most definitely does NOT happen both ways. The conservative equivalent of "cancel culture" is a few fanatics calling to boycott something and then nobody really pays much attention to them. The liberal version is tracking individual people down and harassing them, threatening them, harassing their employers until they are fired from their jobs.

Which side will vandalize your property? Which side uses violence? Which side mobs people in the street? Which side uses the media as a weapon? Which side stages phony hate crimes? Which side bans opposing views from being discussed in public? If you parked a car with a Trump bumper sticker in downtown San Francisco, and parked another car with a Bernie bumper sticker in a town in rural Texas, and came back 4 hours later, which one do you think would be trashed with the tires cut and the windows smashed?

What conservatives do is mainly the standard ways of applying political pressure, and the ones who cross the line (largely religious extremists) are frowned upon even by other conservatives. Leftists use personal bullying and intimidation as their bread and butter.

It is not even close, and saying "both sides do it" is just a weak attempt to distance themselves from the outright disgusting behavior that is widespread among those who share those beliefs. No, it is not the same, and it is not just a few bad apples doing it who are ostracized by the rest. It is widespread and It is cheered on by a large part of the Democratic base. There is no downplaying it. That is the behavior that you are either rationalizing or pretending doesn't exist if you are a modern liberal.

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Originally Posted by steelreserve

It most definitely does NOT happen both ways. The conservative equivalent of "cancel culture" is a few fanatics calling to boycott something and then nobody really pays much attention to them. The liberal version is tracking individual people down and harassing them, threatening them, harassing their employers until they are fired from their jobs.

Which side will vandalize your property? Which side uses violence? Which side mobs people in the street? Which side uses the media as a weapon? Which side stages phony hate crimes? Which side bans opposing views from being discussed in public? If you parked a car with a Trump bumper sticker in downtown San Francisco, and parked another car with a Bernie bumper sticker in a town in rural Texas, and came back 4 hours later, which one do you think would be trashed with the tires cut and the windows smashed?

What conservatives do is mainly the standard ways of applying political pressure, and the ones who cross the line (largely religious extremists) are frowned upon even by other conservatives. Leftists use personal bullying and intimidation as their bread and butter.

It is not even close, and saying "both sides do it" is just a weak attempt to distance themselves from the outright disgusting behavior that is widespread among those who share those beliefs. No, it is not the same, and it is not just a few bad apples doing it who are ostracized by the rest. It is widespread and It is cheered on by a large part of the Democratic base. There is no downplaying it. That is the behavior that you are either rationalizing or pretending doesn't exist if you are a modern liberal.

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So Charlottesville didn't happen? I mean that was what 3 years ago? Guess it doesn't count. The multiple incidents of people driving through protesters this summer aren't real?

Pizzagate shooting didn't happen?

IF one really wanted to get into it one could make an argument that the right doesn't have to resort to street violence because they just have the police do it for them...not like you have to protest and what not to advocate for MORE police with military style weapons and tactics.

I think the fact that no one pays attention to conservative protests and tons of people (according to this board they run the world) pay attention to liberal protests speaks volumes in and of itself.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

So Charlottesville didn't happen? I mean that was what 3 years ago? Guess it doesn't count. The multiple incidents of people driving through protesters this summer aren't real?

Pizzagate shooting didn't happen?

IF one really wanted to get into it one could make an argument that the right doesn't have to resort to street violence because they just have the police do it for them...not like you have to protest and what not to advocate for MORE police with military style weapons and tactics.

I think the fact that no one pays attention to conservative protests and tons of people (according to this board they run the world) pay attention to liberal protests speaks volumes in and of itself.

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"Multiple incidents of driving through protesters," are you smoking crack?

Look at a video clip of any one of those, and it is the same exact thing:

- Car stops to avoid plowing through protesters

- Crowd surrounds stopped car

- Crowd starts throwing shit at stopped car, smashing windows and trying to pull the driver out to beat him/her to a pulp

- Car starts moving as driver tries to get the hell out of there, slowly at first and trying to go around

- Idiots run in front of the car and push on it trying to stop it as the others trying to drag out the driver go into a frenzy

- Driver says fuck it and hits the gas, idiots still try to stop the car by pushing on the hood and get knocked on their asses

- Outrage! How dare he not stay put and let us beat him to death! Now let's all run after him, we can chase down a car on foot for sure!

Did that not describe every single one of those incidents? Is there something I missed? The leftists were the ones getting violent every time. They were in the wrong. Too bad.

Not to mention it is beyond ridiculous to compare a handful of isolated incidents in which people fleeing violent street mobs caused injuries to members of said mobs, to thousands of continuous, deliberate acts of physical violence or intimidation over the course of years. The liberals are nearly ALWAYS the aggressors. It does NOT go both ways. That is straight bullshit and everyone can see it, stop playing dumb.

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Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson

Pretty much.

One side thinks that if you support anti-racism and disproportionate police violence against minorities, that you condone the destruction of innocent peoples property. While the other side thinks that if you are supportive of lower corporate tax rates, that you also support the prejudicial treatment of minorities and the "white power" movement.

There are some that can view things as simple right and wrong, or that both sides have some good beliefs... such as that its wrong to shoot a drunken man in the back, or wrong to kneel on a man's neck until he dies and its also wrong to loot stores and burn buildings.

Sadly, a lot of people cannot admit to somebody on the other side of the discussion, that they have some good points. They often attack or deflect as a coping mechanism.

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No.... I don't think that. I just feel,that the Left is way more unhinged than the right at this particular time.The right is definitely not correct on a lot of things. I do agree with the left on some tings. I just think that as of right now... the left is floundering... and grasping at straws to unseat Trump at any and all costs. Surely... no one on the left with a brain can honestly think that Biden can lead this country, at this point in time????

Belichick for President

Newton for Vice President


https://usatpatriotswire.files.wordp...ewton_swap.png

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Originally Posted by silver & black

[/B]

No.... I don't think that. I just feel,that the Left is way more unhinged than the right at this particular time.The right is definitely not correct on a lot of things. I do agree with the left on some tings. I just think that as of right now... the left is floundering... and grasping at straws to unseat Trump at any and all costs. Surely... no one on the left with a brain can honestly think that Biden can lead this country, at this point in time????

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That captures the difference quite well if you ask me. Conservatives have some ideas that suck, just like liberals (although if you ask me, one side has more bad ideas than the other). But only one side uses threats, intimidation, and actual violence on a recurring basis. And the threats and intimidation are carried out constantly on an ongoing basis; they are an acknowledged part of their game plan. What's more, they are mostly carried out against ordinary people, which is despicable.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

So Charlottesville didn't happen? I mean that was what 3 years ago? Guess it doesn't count. The multiple incidents of people driving through protesters this summer aren't real?

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Most of those were one-offs rather than being coordinated by national groups from the left like Antifa. Moreover, I can remember as far back as the middle of the Clinton years when Democrats were using the argument, "If this bill passes, Republicans will be making senior citizens eat dog food because they can't afford anything else" as a legitimate argument.

Yes, it does come from both sides, but I'd argue the coordination and intention is heavily on the left side rather than the one-offs we see on the right side from idiots doing stupid things.

Antifa is an "organization" with no central leadership or organization. The FBI concluded they have little or nothing to do with current protests.

Right wing rhetoric about "destroying the fabric of America"; "immigrants having anchor babies"; "tax and spend liberals funding welfare queens"; "death panels"; "killing seniors by bankrupt social security"; I remebe4 being told if Democrats were in charge we would burn in nuclear fire; and on and on.

Both sides regularly suck and use fear to motivate.

To me, that is separate from the 2016 and 2020 street violence. While the organized American political left may be attempting to co-opt the energy and attention of protests; they aren't coordinating it. It's grassroots ad-hoc organizations mobilizing on the fly from what I've read. This recent protests and everything that has folks so scared and angry isn't coming top down. It's directly from the bottom. Often started by people who've never been part of the political conversation before. Many of the people and groups prominent in my area are putting both parties on full blast. This is what people who feel no one represents them, no one hears them, and no one cares look like. It should scare the heck out of all of us. Good. Maybe someone who can actually do something will finally hear.

Again, only to me, that grabs my attention and makes me want to understand where that action comes from far more than what any politician could ever say.

Antifa isn't an organization in the same way the Crips aren't an organization. Sure, they don't have a national office and a CEO, but damned if they don't all show up together in well-supplied violent mobs to start shit for liberal causes. As a bonus, they even have their own logo, matching outfits and official social media accounts. It's like a really stupid Project Mayhem. But all this about them being our "imaginary friends" is nonsense, and another one of those things where anyone can see it.

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Originally Posted by steelreserve

Antifa isn't an organization in the same way the Crips aren't an organization. Sure, they don't have a national office and a CEO, but damned if they don't all show up together in well-supplied violent mobs to start shit for liberal causes. As a bonus, they even have their own logo, matching outfits and official social media accounts. It's like a really stupid Project Mayhem. But all this about them being our "imaginary friends" is nonsense, and another one of those things where anyone can see it.

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Well the Crips are a highly organized and hierarchical organization. So not sure the comparison holds up.

And if the left has to answer for ANTIFA, why does the right not have to answer for the Proud Boys, all the boogaloo folks, or the white supremacists that show up at political events and protests for their side?

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Originally Posted by Six Rings

According to polls, they prefer socialism over capitalism?
This can't be correct, I doubt most in the poll understand what socialism really is.


Then we have the angry Islamic tyyes, one of which recently said she was at five with the Nazi holocaust. A racist statment, which was not even called out by Democrat leaders.


What's going on here?

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the Democratic Party ceased being democratic a long time ago, this is hardly our fathers’ or fathers’ fathers’ party that helped the middle class rise out of the ashes of the Great Depression. I tend to go with Carlin’s idea now : it’s a big party, and unless your a fat cat, your not invited. Political parties have become largely irrelevant.

Trump stole Hillarys' chair. He pulled it out right as she was bending to sit down. How dare the american people steal "elect" a loud mouth non-politician to sit in that chair that gives him enough power to dig into,and uncover some of the immense corruption of the Obama administration? How dare that be allowed to happen? Even some on the Republican party side seemed to be appalled. So it seems that Obama and V.P. took immediate actions to begin a smear campaign that has been on going even before the newly elected had a chance to take his seat in the oval office.104 allegations ensued. Each one proven wrong time and time again. Well lets go back to more Russia allegations,but lets link it it to the men who fight for our country.That just might do the trick. In the mean time lets keep pushin this corona thing that China seems to have unleashed onto the globe because that's an ingenious way that we can keep our candidate out of the public eye, plus we can pick questions that will be ask by only the media we chose and here are the answers Joe. I'm not a teacher by any means,but i know there are those that are. Isn't that called cheating? Boy we are in for some really big news to break any day now.

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Originally Posted by cold-hard-steel

...............................In the mean time lets keep pushin this corona thing that China seems to have unleashed onto the globe because that's an ingenious way that we can keep our candidate out of the public eye, plus we can pick questions that will be ask by only the media we chose and here are the answers Joe. I'm not a teacher by any means,but i know there are those that are. Isn't that called cheating? Boy we are in for some really big news to break any day now.

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Huh?

https://scontent-bos3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...b2&oe=5F210F1A

V.P. candidate must be Female and one of color. So lets discriminate on sex and color of skin and leave out the content of character part that we so strongly support.

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Originally Posted by tom444

https://scontent-bos3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...b2&oe=5F210F1A

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lol! Shouldn't you be down in Florida sniffing and being in charge of handling Toms' jock?

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Originally Posted by cold-hard-steel

lol! Shouldn't you be down in Florida sniffing and being in charge of handling Toms' jock?

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Ah duh, shouldn't you be down in Florida sniffing and being in charge of handling Toms' jock?, duh.

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Originally Posted by tom444

Ah duh, shouldn't you be down in Florida sniffing and being in charge of handling Toms' jock?, duh.

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1) What has Joe done for the good of the Black community?

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Originally Posted by tom444

Ah duh, shouldn't you be down in Florida sniffing and being in charge of handling Toms' jock?, duh.

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I would never want your job. never!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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2) What has Joe done for the good of the Black community?

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Originally Posted by cold-hard-steel

V.P. candidate must be Female and one of color. So lets discriminate on sex and color of skin and leave out the content of character part that we so strongly support.



lol! Shouldn't you be down in Florida sniffing and being in charge of handling Toms' jock?

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Someone is off their TDS meds.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Well the Crips are a highly organized and hierarchical organization. So not sure the comparison holds up.

And if the left has to answer for ANTIFA, why does the right not have to answer for the Proud Boys, all the boogaloo folks, or the white supremacists that show up at political events and protests for their side?

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Why doesn't the right have to answer for it? Because groups like the Proud Boys and white supremacists are condemned and marginalized by other conservatives. That's their answer for it.

Antifa is widely supported and defended by leftists, and public officials in Democrat-controlled cities and states give them the green light with a wink and a nod. Others on the left try to wave off their violence as a right-wing conspiracy theory - and if I had to guess why, it's because they are in an uncomfortable situation where they can see what is happening is wrong, but since they are on the same side, they try to bury their heads in the sand and downplay it. Ends justify the means and all, so if we just deny and delay for a little while longer, justice will be served in November and all will be right with the world, so then we can put all this ugliness behind us and pretend it never happened.

The "Boogaloo" was another 4chan prank that made its way into the mainstream, who completely fell for it - like the "OK" sign meaning "white power," or the "Islam is right about women" posters. Not that the bogaloo people were really central to the point, but just in case you or anyone else weren't aware that thing in particular was a complete joke.

As for the Crips, you may be right. I remember back a few years ago, I was looking for Crips gear for a Christmas present, but I was having problems ordering off their website. So I called their 800 number, and their phone menu was really easy and got me to a live person in just a couple of minutes. She was super helpful, and explained that they were having problems with their online store's credit card processing, but she was able to have my order delivered to the Crips Store in Los Angeles for pick-up the next day. Overall a much smoother and more professional experience than trying to order from Antifa, where their support team just called me a racist and sent someone to throw a bottle at me.

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Originally Posted by cold-hard-steel

V.P. candidate must be Female and one of color. So lets discriminate on sex and color of skin and leave out the content of character part that we so strongly support.


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lol! Shouldn't you be down in Florida sniffing and being in charge of handling Toms' jock?

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Yeah, Mike Pence is the gold standard for VP candidates. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by FrancoLambert

Yeah, Mike Pence is the gold standard for VP candidates. :rolleyes:

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3) What has Joe done for the good of the Black community?

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Originally Posted by Mach1

- - - Updated - - -https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...7f&oe=5F20E369

Someone is off their TDS meds.

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I think i know who it is .

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Originally Posted by tom444

https://scontent-bos3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...b2&oe=5F210F1A

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:rofl: thats a big crowd depicted in the picture. I bet 45 is proud of it.

:chuckle:

https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...8d&oe=5F215EA3

Use your brain? How novel.

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Miami-Dade, Broward to require masks, face coverings in public at all times — including outdoors

7 News WSVNJeff Lennox
July 1, 2020
MIAMI (WSVN) - Leaders in Miami-Dade and Broward counties have announced new orders requiring the use of masks or face coverings in public at all times.
Miami-Dade Mayor Carlos Gimenez announced he will be signing an order requiring the public to wear a face mask in public at all times.
The order is an expansion on a previous order issued in April, requiring masks and face coverings in public spaces inside. The order now requires people to wear masks or face coverings while outdoors.

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https://wsvn.com/news/local/miami-da...ding-outdoors/

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Originally Posted by tom444

Use your brain? How novel.



https://wsvn.com/news/local/miami-da...ding-outdoors/

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Speaking of using your brain... I love how they are still allowing alcohol and food to be sold, but technically, it can't be consumed as a person must unmask in order to consume it.

:chuckle:

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Originally Posted by Craic

Speaking of using your brain... I love how they are still allowing alcohol and food to be sold, but technically, it can't be consumed as a person must unmask in order to consume it.

:chuckle:

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Who says you're not allowed to unmask to eat?

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Originally Posted by Craic

Speaking of using your brain... I love how they are still allowing alcohol and food to be sold, but technically, it can't be consumed as a person must unmask in order to consume it.

:chuckle:

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So if somebody wears a cloth mask to reduce the amount of airborne droplets they emit, but then grabs that mask by the cloth part of it to take it off and eat or drink, then they just contaminated their hands and everything they touch will spread some virus, until they wash their hands.

While masks can prevent spread, people that arent going to bother and educate themselves on how to handle it and not cause further spread, nor use diligent hand hygiene and still respect distancing guidelines, will still spread the virus. Its not a matter of politics, but rather science. So a stupid Republican wearing a mask in Florida is going to spread as much virus as the stupid Democrat that wears a mask in Florida. It should still be less than if they aren't wearing a mask.

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Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson

So if somebody wears a cloth mask to reduce the amount of airborne droplets they emit, but then grabs that mask by the cloth part of it to take it off and eat or drink, then they just contaminated their hands and everything they touch will spread some virus, until they wash their hands.

While masks can prevent spread, people that arent going to bother and educate themselves on how to handle it and not cause further spread, nor use diligent hand hygiene and still respect distancing guidelines, will still spread the virus. Its not a matter of politics, but rather science. So a stupid Republican wearing a mask in Florida is going to spread as much virus as the stupid Democrat that wears a mask in Florida. It should still be less than if they aren't wearing a mask.

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Anything less is more at this point. If people want to go back to work and school - wear a mask even if badly done.

I can not wrap my head around the idea that we are willing to do active shooter drills in elementary schools and discuss bullet stopping backpacks for kindergartners but putting essentially an elastic bandanna over your mouth and nose is too far for many people to consider.

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Originally Posted by Craic

Speaking of using your brain... I love how they are still allowing alcohol and food to be sold, but technically, it can't be consumed as a person must unmask in order to consume it.

:chuckle:

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https://66.media.tumblr.com/741041d5...c9719cfc0d.gif

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Anything less is more at this point. If people want to go back to work and school - wear a mask even if badly done.

I can not wrap my head around the idea that we are willing to do active shooter drills in elementary schools and discuss bullet stopping backpacks for kindergartners but putting essentially an elastic bandanna over your mouth and nose is too far for many people to consider.

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Why can you not wrap your head around it? Mathematically, an individual American high school can expect a mass shooting on average once every 8,000 years; for all schools it would be about once every 40,000 years.

One out of every few million students is a crazed killer - not really out of line with what you would expect in society in general. Yet you would think it was everywhere, a critical problem out of control.

People have no idea just how incredibly huge the country is, or what a million actually means. It has been figured out by some that if you make enough noise over individual events, people will have no idea whether it is rare or common, but will tend toward thinking it is far more common than it actually is. In terms of people's gut feeling about how "big" something is, there is no appreciable difference between one-in-a-million and one-in-a-hundred. But it is a very effective tool for persuasion.

In that respect, the parallel between the outsized recations to both school shootings and the coronavirus makes a lot of sense. Although the conclusion is obvious: We don't really need active shooter drills.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Anything less is more at this point. If people want to go back to work and school - wear a mask even if badly done.

I can not wrap my head around the idea that we are willing to do active shooter drills in elementary schools and discuss bullet stopping backpacks for kindergartners but putting essentially an elastic bandanna over your mouth and nose is too far for many people to consider.

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I agree with this. I will happily wear a mask if I can go back to work. I don't believe the masks make a damn bit of difference, but if that's what it takes, I'll wear one.

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Originally Posted by silver & black

I agree with this. I will happily wear a mask if I can go back to work. I don't believe the masks make a damn bit of difference, but if that's what it takes, I'll wear one.

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Agreed. If more people had just had that attitude the last several months, we would be talking about putting this in the rearview instead of confronting it all over again.

I think it is pretty darn telling that McConnell, Pence, Cruz, DeSantis, etc are all pushing masks big-time the last week or so. Previously none of them had or had even done the opposite. I strongly suspect that political leadership across the spectrum is getting briefings that are scaring the hell out of them.

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Originally Posted by silver & black

I agree with this. I will happily wear a mask if I can go back to work. I don't believe the masks make a damn bit of difference, but if that's what it takes, I'll wear one.

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Imagine?

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Psychopathic traits linked to non-compliance with social distancing guidelines amid the coronavirus pandemic

Eric W. DolanJune 7, 2020
[COLOR=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.65)]http://www.steelersuniverse.com/foru...sk-770x515.jpg[/COLOR]
New research provides some initial evidence that certain antagonistic personality traits are associated with ignoring preventative measures meant to halt the spread of the novel coronavirus SARS-CoV-2.

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https://www.psypost.org/2020/06/psyc...pandemic-56980


http://www.steelersuniverse.com/foru...ine=1556086101

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Originally Posted by silver & black

I agree with this. I will happily wear a mask if I can go back to work. I don't believe the masks make a damn bit of difference, but if that's what it takes, I'll wear one.

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Yeah, I don't get the mask outrage either, just another political argument far removed from the real issue. If you want to require me to wear a mask to enter your store, then fine, whatever. (Even though the governor has no legal authority to do it, you still have the right to refuse service. You could require customers to wear shoes on their heads or leave if you wanted to.)

The symbolism is pretty unmistakable, but if you have half a brain, you can see the mask itself is not the issue, it is just a microcosm of the bigger problem. People get distracted by that shit and look stupid, fighting a mostly useless argument anyway.

Consumer confidence and spending are the keys to economic recovery. So mask refusal seem to cutting of your nose to spite your face.

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Imagine?

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All the people?