Welcome to day 1 of the illegitimate U.S. government, make your predictions here

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Originally Posted by Fire Goodell

Curious, what would your solution be to bring back well paying US jobs? Or do you believe everything is just fine right now?

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Massive public and private investment in R&D.

Punish corporations that use massive tax breaks to buy back stock and enrich their board instead of reinvesting in their actual company.

In the first world, manufacturing has to do something no one else knows how to do. You can not compete on cost, margins, or volume. So you have to innovate constantly. American manufacturers got complacent during the post WW2 boom as we rebuilt and resupplied the world. The world then closed the skills, knowledge, and innovation gap. Once that took place, no reason to make things here.

We shouldn’t focus on building internal combustion SUVs here. Invent, perfect, and produce what’s next. Requires big $$$ investment that quarterly profit driven corporations won’t make. And whenever government tries to fill the gap, the right wing gets its knickers in a twist.

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Originally Posted by Fire Goodell

Curious, what would your solution be to bring back well paying US jobs? Or do you believe everything is just fine right now?

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In the short term? Bring back the Trump tariffs, but double them. Permanently revoke all COVID restrictions and prohibit new ones. Incentivize hiring by things like removing the payroll tax on desired industries.

In the longer term? Slash away at the thicket of regulations that is a burden to doing business here. Take a sledgehammer to the unions, starting with public employee unions - decertify them all, and simply refuse to deal with or even acknowledge any new ones. Eliminate pensions for new public employees and give them regular retirement plans. The savings to the public treasury from these things would be enough to substantially lower the tax rate. If you want to bring back business, make people want to do business here, by making it easy to do business. Low taxes and low bullshit.

Nuclear option - put a tariff on imported goods equal to the difference between the wage paid there and minimum wage in the U.S. Put the proceeds into a fund to be used for prosecuting lockdown governors, mayors, and public health officials.

You want to end illegal immigration. Start putting the executive officers of these giant corporations in jail when illegal aliens are caught working at these places.

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Originally Posted by EzraTank

You want to end illegal immigration. Start putting the executive officers of these giant corporations in jail when illegal aliens are caught working at these places.

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Or, you know, when you catch people trying to sneak into the country, maybe don't turn around and release them into your country for a hearing they will never show up for.

Good luck getting the average consumer to be chill about the significant price increases all of these domestic manufacturing policies would drive.

Also...serious question...what is the protocol for all the pollution? There is a reason that all of this manufacturing takes place "over there". Are any of us signing up to have toxic materials in our water supplies or work in high exposure situations to solvents and other nasty chemicals?

That's the reality of the global manufacturing cycle. Gross people and environment harming steps are done in some far off (to us) corner of the world where the lure of $$$ is enough to overcome the destruction of the local populace and environment. I just don't see many signing up to "bring that home". Or to pay the significant price increases that raising environmental and health standards would entail.

Again...this isn't attempting to bash any individual, political party, or position. It is just a set of questions that I think about whenever this issue comes up and I feel that no one, on either side, addresses.

Reality, is that we could use the jobs and income (what country couldn't?) but I do not believe that many people will be willing to pay the associated economic and health costs that would come with them. Real easy hypothetical for a Steelers adjacent forum...who want to live in the Pittsburgh of yester-year where things were covered in ash and dust?

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Good luck getting the average consumer to be chill about the significant price increases all of these domestic manufacturing policies would drive.

Also...serious question...what is the protocol for all the pollution? There is a reason that all of this manufacturing takes place "over there". Are any of us signing up to have toxic materials in our water supplies or work in high exposure situations to solvents and other nasty chemicals?

That's the reality of the global manufacturing cycle. Gross people and environment harming steps are done in some far off (to us) corner of the world where the lure of $$$ is enough to overcome the destruction of the local populace and environment. I just don't see many signing up to "bring that home". Or to pay the significant price increases that raising environmental and health standards would entail.

Again...this isn't attempting to bash any individual, political party, or position. It is just a set of questions that I think about whenever this issue comes up and I feel that no one, on either side, addresses.

Reality, is that we could use the jobs and income (what country couldn't?) but I do not believe that many people will be willing to pay the associated economic and health costs that would come with them. Real easy hypothetical for a Steelers adjacent forum...who want to live in the Pittsburgh of yester-year where things were covered in ash and dust?

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Liberals are funny people. Pay a living wage, but I don't want to pay higher prices. Get rid of pollution, but it's too hard. Just shove it somewhere else where I don't see it; that'll have to do. We care about the conditions that the poor and the downtrodden live in, and we care deeply about the environment, and we demand great sacrifice from others in their name. Well, actually we acknowledge that we're just shifting problems around to other people, and our whole life's work was for nothing.

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Originally Posted by steelreserve

Liberals are funny people. Pay a living wage, but I don't want to pay higher prices. Get rid of pollution, but it's too hard. Just shove it somewhere else where I don't see it; that'll have to do. We care about the conditions that the poor and the downtrodden live in, and we care deeply about the environment, and we demand great sacrifice from others in their name. Well, actually we acknowledge that we're just shifting problems around to other people, and our whole life's work was for nothing.

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Solid dodge of legitimate questions so you can retreat back to easy and artificial talking points.

Since your so much smarter and better at reasoning...please...enlighten the rest of us...how do you figure it all out?

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Solid dodge of legitimate questions so you can retreat back to easy and artificial talking points.

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Dodge? I don't know man, I'd be pretty concerned about those things if I were you. Like, if your entire ideology is essentially just a bunch of busy work so that other people can gain power, that's sort of a big deal. But as they say, the first step to recovery is admitting you have a problem.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Since your so much smarter and better at reasoning...please...enlighten the rest of us...how do you figure it all out?

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Sure, I'd be glad to; it's really quite simple. Some people are able to think for themselves, and others are liberals.

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Originally Posted by steelreserve

Dodge? I don't know man, I'd be pretty concerned about those things if I were you. Like, if your entire ideology is essentially just a bunch of busy work so that other people can gain power, that's sort of a big deal. But as they say, the first step to recovery is admitting you have a problem.



Sure, I'd be glad to; it's really quite simple. Some people are able to think for themselves, and others are liberals.

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Gotcha. The typical inability to discuss things outside of preloaded talking points likely cribbed from some vaguely libertarian corner of the internet.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Gotcha. The typical inability to discuss things outside of preloaded talking points likely cribbed from some vaguely libertarian corner of the internet.

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Does that guy think he's a libertarian?

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/7f/16...ea5e015e2f.jpg

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Originally Posted by willy

Does that guy think he's a libertarian?

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/7f/16...ea5e015e2f.jpg

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Either that or a sovereign citizen. It’s the closest match I’m aware of for the preloaded talking points. Notice how when the conversation veers off script there’s no response but to move the goalposts to whatever straw man is within shouting distance?

Original thought isn’t a strong suit of the alt right chorus. Ask a question that isn’t covered in the grumpy guy syllabus and you get crickets.

For instance, relocate all flat screen computer and tv display manufacture to the US. what’s the response to the associated price increase and rise in superfund sites? They don’t have an answer because the internet blowhards that prop up their thinking haven’t told them what to say.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Either that or a sovereign citizen. It’s the closest match I’m aware of for the preloaded talking points. Notice how when the conversation veers off script there’s no response but to move the goalposts to whatever straw man is within shouting distance?

Original thought isn’t a strong suit of the alt right chorus. Ask a question that isn’t covered in the grumpy guy syllabus and you get crickets.

For instance, relocate all flat screen computer and tv display manufacture to the US. what’s the response to the associated price increase and rise in superfund sites? They don’t have an answer because the internet blowhards that prop up their thinking haven’t told them what to say.

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Yeah, maybe that's what he is?

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Sovereign citizens believe that they – not judges, juries, law enforcement or elected officials – should decide which laws to obey and which to ignore.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Can't wait to here how the POTUS is supposed to ensure factories stay open in foreign locations. Or how US Government policy has any impact on the amount of shipping containers in the system. Would be interested to know more about how the POTUS or Feds can have any impact on foreign producers labor shortages.

Should be a fascinating discussion.

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sure , let’s just give Biden admin a pass and hold no one accountable for the current shit show in this country. Buttigedge at home playing butt darts for 2 months while transportation industry crumbling, camela in charge of border yet who knows if she’s even been there, too busy going to pre schools. Who are we holding accountable for worst border chaos ever. Can’t blame Trump yet I’m sure some will try. obviously Biden can’t take blame for examples you mentioned but plenty of screw ups by he and his cabinet and woke military leaders. Yet zero accountability, Trump on other hand impeached for phone call. Are we still not able to blame Sleepy Joe for 4.75 dollar gas prices. It goes with territory getting blame as potus. Libs did it with Trump, is this another double standard from libs. I still remember camela as anti vaxer yet now admin mandating vax wherever possible. no wonder joe’s approval now in the 30s .

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Originally Posted by cubanstogie

sure , let’s just give Biden admin a pass and hold no one accountable for the current shit show in this country. Buttigedge at home playing butt darts for 2 months while transportation industry crumbling, camela in charge of border yet who knows if she’s even been there, too busy going to pre schools. Who are we holding accountable for worst border chaos ever. Can’t blame Trump yet I’m sure some will try. obviously Biden can’t take blame for examples you mentioned but plenty of screw ups by he and his cabinet and woke military leaders. Yet zero accountability, Trump on other hand impeached for phone call. Are we still not able to blame Sleepy Joe for 4.75 dollar gas prices. It goes with territory getting blame as potus. Libs did it with Trump, is this another double standard from libs. I still remember camela as anti vaxer yet now admin mandating vax wherever possible. no wonder joe’s approval now in the 30s .

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https://c.tenor.com/SHFbciEA_3oAAAAd/cry-baby.gif

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Originally Posted by cubanstogie

sure , let’s just give Biden admin a pass and hold no one accountable for the current shit show in this country. Buttigedge at home playing butt darts for 2 months while transportation industry crumbling, camela in charge of border yet who knows if she’s even been there, too busy going to pre schools. Who are we holding accountable for worst border chaos ever. Can’t blame Trump yet I’m sure some will try. obviously Biden can’t take blame for examples you mentioned but plenty of screw ups by he and his cabinet and woke military leaders. Yet zero accountability, Trump on other hand impeached for phone call. Are we still not able to blame Sleepy Joe for 4.75 dollar gas prices. It goes with territory getting blame as potus. Libs did it with Trump, is this another double standard from libs. I still remember camela as anti vaxer yet now admin mandating vax wherever possible. no wonder joe’s approval now in the 30s .

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cool. Well done pivot to preloaded talking points you cribbed from the internet and talk radio. But this thread has explicitly attempted to pin supply chain and manufacturing on the current administration. Yet if asked any follow up questions, you all run out of things to say and just spew tired nonsense.

Guessing because you have no idea what this or any other President could or should do regarding these issues you care so deeply about.

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Originally Posted by willy

https://c.tenor.com/SHFbciEA_3oAAAAd/cry-baby.gif

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https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...at-36-percent/
makes sense why you’re crying. you and other sleepy voters are directly responsible for downward spiraling of our country. Trump says make America great again, since libtards always oppose Trump their slogan is make america weak, woke and broke. doing a great job. lmfao. no worries low hanging fruit, you will be falling off branch and rotting any day now. Enjoy your last few games of bingo.

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Originally Posted by cubanstogie

sure , let’s just give Biden admin a pass and hold no one accountable for the current shit show in this country. Buttigedge at home playing butt darts for 2 months while transportation industry crumbling, camela in charge of border yet who knows if she’s even been there, too busy going to pre schools. Who are we holding accountable for worst border chaos ever. Can’t blame Trump yet I’m sure some will try. obviously Biden can’t take blame for examples you mentioned but plenty of screw ups by he and his cabinet and woke military leaders. Yet zero accountability, Trump on other hand impeached for phone call. Are we still not able to blame Sleepy Joe for 4.75 dollar gas prices. It goes with territory getting blame as potus. Libs did it with Trump, is this another double standard from libs. I still remember camela as anti vaxer yet now admin mandating vax wherever possible. no wonder joe’s approval now in the 30s .

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Liberals holding themselves and other liberals accountable? Good luck with that. These are the same people who blamed Bush (back when Bush was evil before Bush became buddies with the Obamas) for Obama's many failures. I mean Anthony Blinken still hasn't lost his post and John Kerry still hasn't lost his post despite committing treason months ago

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

cool. Well done pivot to preloaded talking points you cribbed from the internet and talk radio. But this thread has explicitly attempted to pin supply chain and manufacturing on the current administration. Yet if asked any follow up questions, you all run out of things to say and just spew tired nonsense.

Guessing because you have no idea what this or any other President could or should do regarding these issues you care so deeply about.

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I don’t claim to know a presidents job better than they do , or a nfl head coach for that matter. It’s not my job. Just like I don’t expect you to know how to intubate, start ivs or fight fire better than I do. I do know it’s not a coincidence that everything Joe’s touched so far has been a disaster. except the stock market. Yet none you hold him, camala , cabinet members or military leaders responsible for all the screw ups. or inflated gas prices. I guess it’s all coincidence.

On a lighter side, let's all enjoy the no. 1 HIP HOP song on Itunes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qr_F_XQrukM

SO here is the thing...Biden sucks. Whatever. He sucks less than the other option. Biden has been an elected official for most of my lifetime. And he's always been "meh" for me. So what? My dislike of Trump had only a little to do with him as a person or his individual opinions. It was his total inability to get stuff done. He passed one piece of legislation in four years. That's it. Held both houses of Congress and got nothing done but a tax cut for his buddies. Or at least the actual rich people he has spent his life trying to impress.

Take the claim that "transportation is crumbling". Ok. Is it? What can the POTUS do about it? Imports are so far up that ports can not process the incoming volume. Not enough truck drivers to move the goods. How is that a government issue? Has the vaunted "free market" not determined capacity and amount of labor that private companies are willing to employ in each sector? Now that it puts a crimp in your life or someone TOLD you that need to care...suddenly all you small-government folks want government mucking about in the private sector. Great. But what do you actually want done? Seems you want to "fix transportation" without spending any tax money and without paying for more workers. So...magic?

It is the same story. You don't actually know anything beyond what someone else told you to think. Cue SR...

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Originally Posted by cubanstogie

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...at-36-percent/
makes sense why you’re crying. you and other sleepy voters are directly responsible for downward spiraling of our country. Trump says make America great again, since libtards always oppose Trump their slogan is make america weak, woke and broke. doing a great job. lmfao. no worries low hanging fruit, you will be falling off branch and rotting any day now. Enjoy your last few games of bingo.

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https://c.tenor.com/SHFbciEA_3oAAAAd/cry-baby.gif

- - - Updated - - -

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Originally Posted by st33lersguy

Liberals holding themselves and other liberals accountable? Good luck with that. These are the same people who blamed Bush (back when Bush was evil before Bush became buddies with the Obamas) for Obama's many failures. I mean Anthony Blinken still hasn't lost his post and John Kerry still hasn't lost his post despite committing treason months ago

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https://c.tenor.com/SHFbciEA_3oAAAAd/cry-baby.gif

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Originally Posted by cubanstogie

I don’t claim to know a presidents job better than they do , or a nfl head coach for that matter. It’s not my job. Just like I don’t expect you to know how to intubate, start ivs or fight fire better than I do. I do know it’s not a coincidence that everything Joe’s touched so far has been a disaster. except the stock market. Yet none you hold him, camala , cabinet members or military leaders responsible for all the screw ups. or inflated gas prices. I guess it’s all coincidence.

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Right. But you can learn enough about a specific part of any one of those things to talk about it beyond reductive hyperbolic statements.

For instance, Petey B appears to mostly offend you because he is gay and has a kid. Or at least you haven't leveled an actual critique related to his policies, agenda, or statements as Transportation Secretary. Or even expressed an understanding of what that position can and can not do to impact whatever it is that you are upset about.

All of those things are well within your capabilities of doing. But you choose not to. As near as I can tell, you are the most angry about Kamela and Petey B both liking dick. So is it Biden and liberals that you are mad at or is it just dicks?

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

Gotcha. The typical inability to discuss things outside of preloaded talking points likely cribbed from some vaguely libertarian corner of the internet.

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That's a good one. A liberal saying that other people are the ones who adhere to political dogma. Classic projection - but of course, that is straight out of the liberal playbook. Always accuse others of that which you are doing yourself. Notice how I said you can't think for yourself and you just follow doctrine, and your response was to say "you can't think for yourself and you just follow doctrine?"

"Preloaded talking points" seems to be your new go-to phrase today. Good one, really zippy. I wonder if next we will get an edgelord screed.

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

SO here is the thing...Biden sucks. Whatever. He sucks less than the other option. Biden has been an elected official for most of my lifetime. And he's always been "meh" for me. So what? My dislike of Trump had only a little to do with him as a person or his individual opinions. It was his total inability to get stuff done. He passed one piece of legislation in four years. That's it. Held both houses of Congress and got nothing done but a tax cut for his buddies. Or at least the actual rich people he has spent his life trying to impress.

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That's the thing. Accomplishing nothing is infinitely better than accomplishing the things that liberals want. Someone who accomplishes nothing, instead of pushing ideas that range from ass-backward nuisances to outright dystopian intrusion? I'll take nothing every day and Sunday.

It should also probably be alarming that the country doesn't actually have a president or a vice president, just a Weekend at Bernie's meat puppet for some ... thing. That doesn't bother you? It probably should. You even admit Biden sucks, and it's clear to anyone that all the ideas The Party is pushing suck. What are you even doing? What do you get out of it? You're a disgrace, a complete joke. Go make yourself feel better by talking down to people and jerking yourself off with intellectual gymnastics, why don't you. Your entire ideology is just a lot of running around for nothing. Except it has the side effect of making everything worse for everybody else. Please quit.

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Originally Posted by willy

https://c.tenor.com/SHFbciEA_3oAAAAd/cry-baby.gif

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Good come back, Dumbass.

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Originally Posted by steelreserve

That's a good one. A liberal saying that other people are the ones who adhere to political dogma. Classic projection - but of course, that is straight out of the liberal playbook. Always accuse others of that which you are doing yourself. Notice how I said you can't think for yourself and you just follow doctrine, and your response was to say "you can't think for yourself and you just follow doctrine?"

"Preloaded talking points" seems to be your new go-to phrase today. Good one, really zippy. I wonder if next we will get an edgelord screed.



That's the thing. Accomplishing nothing is infinitely better than accomplishing the things that liberals want. Someone who accomplishes nothing, instead of pushing ideas that range from ass-backward nuisances to outright dystopian intrusion? I'll take nothing every day and Sunday.

It should also probably be alarming that the country doesn't actually have a president or a vice president, just a Weekend at Bernie's meat puppet for some ... thing. That doesn't bother you? It probably should. You even admit Biden sucks, and it's clear to anyone that all the ideas The Party is pushing suck. What are you even doing? What do you get out of it? You're a disgrace, a complete joke. Go make yourself feel better by talking down to people and jerking yourself off with intellectual gymnastics, why don't you. Your entire ideology is just a lot of running around for nothing. Except it has the side effect of making everything worse for everybody else. Please quit.

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So here was one of my original sets of questions on an important and useful question for everyone to think about (a topic yourself and others brought up):

"Again...this isn't attempting to bash any individual, political party, or position. It is just a set of questions that I think about whenever this issue comes up and I feel that no one, on either side, addresses.

Reality, is that we could use the jobs and income (what country couldn't?) but I do not believe that many people will be willing to pay the associated economic and health costs that would come with them. Real easy hypothetical for a Steelers adjacent forum...who want to live in the Pittsburgh of yester-year where things were covered in ash and dust? "

And we are how many posts past that and no one has been able to provide any thoughts or answers? Just a pivot to stuff that was never brought up or claimed so that you all can post the same sterile nonsense.

If every single one of the right wing representatives on this forum is unable to post an original thought on a pretty straightforward set of questions...I can only assume that you guys aren't writing your own material. So scurry off to wherever you get your bought and paid for opinions from and see if you can dig up an actual response.

FWIW, this is not how a conversation works.
"I think we should build more stuff here."
"Good idea. I wonder if it would cost more?"
"Liberal scum! Your ideas are trash and I wish you would light yourself on fire!"

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Originally Posted by steelcityboyz

Good come back, Dumbass.

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https://c.tenor.com/SHFbciEA_3oAAAAd/cry-baby.gif

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Originally Posted by Mojouw

FWIW, this is not how a conversation works.
"I think we should build more stuff here."
"Good idea. I wonder if it would cost more?"
"Liberal scum! Your ideas are trash and I wish you would light yourself on fire!"

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To be fair, conversations with devout liberals such as yourself definitely ought to include that. Your way of thinking needs to be exterminated, and that is the right word.

But let's see - who would want to live in the Pittsburgh of yesteryear? Well, no one. What a clever point. Too bad it's so far off the mark. There wouldn't be a Pittsburgh of yesteryear because manufacturing processes have improved immensely in the meantime. Factories don't belch smoke into the air anymore. We don't just dump waste in the river anymore. Well, except in countries filled with the poor people that liberals care about so much, where they work in slave-like conditions that liberals abhor, and trash the environment that liberals care about so much. Why, moving more jobs here would be great for the environment, as well as human rights! And what is the liberal response? "No we can't," the only thing they ever know how to say. Let's just pack it in and all be miserable together. What a dogshit way of thinking.

Cue Mojouw. Look at how smart I am for preemptively pointing out the fact that you would respond to a comment in a forum thread. I sure showed you!

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Originally Posted by steelreserve

To be fair, conversations with devout liberals such as yourself definitely ought to include that. Your way of thinking needs to be exterminated, and that is the right word.

But let's see - who would want to live in the Pittsburgh of yesteryear? Well, no one. What a clever point. Too bad it's so far off the mark. There wouldn't be a Pittsburgh of yesteryear because manufacturing processes have improved immensely in the meantime. Factories don't belch smoke into the air anymore. We don't just dump waste in the river anymore. Well, except in countries filled with the poor people that liberals care about so much, where they work in slave-like conditions that liberals abhor, and trash the environment that liberals care about so much. Why, moving more jobs here would be great for the environment, as well as human rights! And what is the liberal response? "No we can't," the only thing they ever know how to say. Let's just pack it in and all be miserable together. What a dogshit way of thinking.

Cue Mojouw. Look at how smart I am for preemptively pointing out the fact that you would respond to a comment in a forum thread. I sure showed you!

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Ok. So...how would the pollution causing manufacturing process be different when moved from say, China, to here? US regulations would likely (??) mandate that they would be modified to be environmentally compliant. For instance, when FOXCON wanted to build LED panels out my way -- it was one of the reasons that the factory really never materialized (well that and FOXCON are frauds...but that is another story). They couldn't figure out how to actually make the things here in a regulatory compliant manner for a $$$ amount that fit in the profit margin.

If you look at it...we don't belch smoke anymore. We don't dump waste into the river. And to accomplish that, we largely let those parts of the manufacturing process move overseas decades ago in order to get compliant with the regulatory protocols that came into being around the 1970's.

Maybe it is that certain components get made elsewhere and then assembled here? I dunno...but it is far from the simple. A follows B conversation that all sides of the American political spectrum want it to be.

"Preloaded talking points", isn't that cnn's new catch phrase of the week.

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Originally Posted by Mach1

"Preloaded talking points", isn't that cnn's new catch phrase of the week.

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Dunno. Haven't watched a minute of CNN in 10+ years.

Still not able to participate beyond simple snarky comments? Maybe read a book or something and try again next week.