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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steeler-in-west
they found a way for guys like wilson and brees by the o line creating passing lanes. Takes a good o line to do that. And sometimes Wilson had to use his legs to move around and get a better view. In the cinci game late Wilson had a few passing lanes where he targeted PF in the middle of the field. But at his age, this is just not a recipe for success. And our line is not good enough.
You keep blaming anyone but Russell Wilson. Why? Look at his entire career. Behind good, bad, and ugly lines, it has been the same. Wilson avoids the middle of the field. Most short(er) QBs do. Wilson's solution has been to leave the pocket, reset and target guys for big plays. It no longer works. It didn't in Denver and it wasn't at the end the of his time in Seattle.
In contrast, Brees worked by sliding within the pocket and making surgically precise throws. Once his velocity dipped due to age and those throws were not as precise and on time, his game slipped as well.
Father Time remains undefeated. Wilson and everyone associated with him might want to acknowledge that.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
lipps83
You may have misunderstood what I was trying to say.
I never said having expectations was a problem. You can set expectations for anything in life that you desire to have expectations for. You can place your expectations of others into the stratosphere, if you wish to do so. You could even set your expectations so incredibly high that it would be impossible for anyone, or anything, to meet them.
However, the Steelers failing to meet your expectations over a long period of time is not their fault.
Let me know when you get it.
Truer words have rarely appeared here.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
Again, we must not watch the same non-Steelers games. I see what you are describing all the time. Just watched it in the Carolina-Atlanta game repeatedly. Saw it in the Bears-Packers game from both sides. And I only watched maybe 4 dozen plays across those two games.
As bad as you think the Steelers defense is....it is better than many. A good defense in 2024 would have been a mediocre defense at best in many other decade of the NFL. It is is what it is.
I think this team is a QB away from being a power in the AFC. And without a QB...two DB's, a WR, and some DL pieces away from being a threatening team anyways.
A QB, a head coach and a good OC
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
You keep blaming anyone but Russell Wilson. Why? Look at his entire career. Behind good, bad, and ugly lines, it has been the same. Wilson avoids the middle of the field. Most short(er) QBs do. Wilson's solution has been to leave the pocket, reset and target guys for big plays. It no longer works. It didn't in Denver and it wasn't at the end the of his time in Seattle.
In contrast, Brees worked by sliding within the pocket and making surgically precise throws. Once his velocity dipped due to age and those throws were not as precise and on time, his game slipped as well.
Father Time remains undefeated. Wilson and everyone associated with him might want to acknowledge that.
Wilson doesnt avoid the middle of the field. He attacks it when hes got a field of vision. Thats when his blockers can clear out some space. Sometimes its not there so he has to fall further back in the pocket or scramble to the right or left. Brees did this too more or less, specially when he was more mobile. But if he was in the pocket and there was no passing lane and he couldnt get out of the pocket he, lo and behold he passed to the sideline, threw to the outlet or took a sack.
i said at the beginning of the season Russ’s skill set could go down suddenly during the season and it looks like his legs cant get him out of trouble like they used to. The Steelers gambled on Russ and i thiught it was a decent gamble but it takes more than a Qb. Our playcalling is predictable by trying to establish the run without stretching the defense. And we seem to have scheme problems on defense. Seemed like a half thought out gamble.
you seem to blame players almost exclusively. Never the coaches. Seems we havent been able to aquire players good enough for Mike Tomlin to be successful with for the last 14 years. Ben wasnt good enough, AB and Bell werent good enough. We couldnt overcome any injuries. So while Russ may be having trouble its not all his fault, hardly. The coaches should be held accountable also, including Tomlin.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Not sure if this is gonna work....but how do you explain this? http://www.steelersuniverse.com/foru...559#post876559
What coach was at fault there? That is Wilson turning down a wide ass open WR at the sticks for a RB at the LOS.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
All I see is a photo of the end of the play. works better when you can see the whole play develop.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steeler-in-west
Wilson doesnt avoid the middle of the field. He attacks it when hes got a field of vision. Thats when his blockers can clear out some space. Sometimes its not there so he has to fall further back in the pocket or scramble to the right or left. Brees did this too more or less, specially when he was more mobile. But if he was in the pocket and there was no passing lane and he couldnt get out of the pocket he, lo and behold he passed to the sideline, threw to the outlet or took a sack.
i said at the beginning of the season Russ’s skill set could go down suddenly during the season and it looks like his legs cant get him out of trouble like they used to. The Steelers gambled on Russ and i thiught it was a decent gamble but it takes more than a Qb. Our playcalling is predictable by trying to establish the run without stretching the defense. And we seem to have scheme problems on defense. Seemed like a half thought out gamble.
you seem to blame players almost exclusively. Never the coaches. Seems we havent been able to aquire players good enough for Mike Tomlin to be successful with for the last 14 years. Ben wasnt good enough, AB and Bell werent good enough. We couldnt overcome any injuries. So while Russ may be having trouble its not all his fault, hardly. The coaches should be held accountable also, including Tomlin.
Because we can isolate the variables here and it isn't Arthur Smith. It is Wilson. Full Stop. https://steelersdepot.com/2024/03/ti...-for-steelers/
Smith has never had a QB throw over the middle less than 12% of his passes. In 2023, Wilson did it less than 6%.
Here is the last several years of his career:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FLkgWDnX...g&name=900x900
Here is Tannehill under Arthur Smith:
https://www.dkpittsburghsports.com/i...F-original.jpg
There is zero evidence that Smith has changed all that much about his offense.
Russell Wilson refuses to attack the middle of the field. His game is limited to moonshots and checkdowns. Multiple opposing coaches have publicly stated it. Defenses have adjusted and taken it away.
The fault in the Steelers coaching is not benching Wilson at this point.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steeler-in-west
All I see is a photo of the end of the play. works better when you can see the whole play develop.
For crying out loud....do you want to see the whole play? Would you admit your guy was cooked then?
https://static01.nyt.com/athletic/up...E2%80%AFAM.png
https://static01.nyt.com/athletic/up...E2%80%AFAM.png
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
There are two guys in front of pickens. again, its not a question of refusing to, he cant throw there if doesnt have a passing lane. The failure of the coaches might be getting Wilson to begin with and not more prudently giving KP a chance to prove himself this year.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
Those photos just look like that’s his first read and where the coverage led him in the first place. It’s hard to analyze this stuff without knowing exactly what the reads and plays are. It’s easy to speculate with single photos about what he didn’t do and did do correctly but overall, unless you are “in the know”, it’s hard to tell exactly what is happening.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
I will grant that we do not know ANYTHNG about the play as designed. And as to guys being in the passing lane.....I guess. Again...this is just one guy trying to work through stuff as best I can....but I see other QBs of supposedly lesser ability than Wilson hit windows like pictured all the time. Again, I grant I could not be understanding something but the original source I took this from usually posts well researched, thought out, and balanced analysis.
But I think we can all agree that:
1. Wilson has a pattern of "deep shots or layups".
2. He has a career long track record of not attacking in the intermediate middle of the field.
3. Pickens is open while Wilson still has the ball in his hand and a clean pocket.
I take that together to mean that it was there and Wilson refused it. Meaning the deep ball to Williams was taken away when the safety played over. And Wilson's eyes immediately drop to the checkdown. Even if that is the progression as designed and whatnot, then Wilson is a 14 year vet, he can't get baited into making that throw. He needs to do better and it appears the play provided him an in structure alternative.
I believe this was either the exact play Aikman highlighted or one eerily similar.
Also there is the linked stuff in this post from before the season: http://www.steelersuniverse.com/foru...l=1#post857321
This is what Wilson has done his entire career. It is not new. It is how he plays the QB position. It is not how ANY of Smith's previous QBs have played the position.
Putting it all together, I lay this at Wilson's feet. It is on him. For better or worse.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
I will grant that we do not know ANYTHNG about the play as designed. And as to guys being in the passing lane.....I guess. Again...this is just one guy trying to work through stuff as best I can....but I see other QBs of supposedly lesser ability than Wilson hit windows like pictured all the time. Again, I grant I could not be understanding something but the original source I took this from usually posts well researched, thought out, and balanced analysis.
But I think we can all agree that:
1. Wilson has a pattern of "deep shots or layups".
2. He has a career long track record of not attacking in the intermediate middle of the field.
3. Pickens is open while Wilson still has the ball in his hand and a clean pocket.
I take that together to mean that it was there and Wilson refused it. Meaning the deep ball to Williams was taken away when the safety played over. And Wilson's eyes immediately drop to the checkdown. Even if that is the progression as designed and whatnot, then Wilson is a 14 year vet, he can't get baited into making that throw. He needs to do better and it appears the play provided him an in structure alternative.
I believe this was either the exact play Aikman highlighted or one eerily similar.
Also there is the linked stuff in this post from before the season:
http://www.steelersuniverse.com/foru...l=1#post857321
This is what Wilson has done his entire career. It is not new. It is how he plays the QB position. It is not how ANY of Smith's previous QBs have played the position.
Putting it all together, I lay this at Wilson's feet. It is on him. For better or worse.
This is exactly the reason why I'm still on board with keeping Smith. I see Wilson and Fields to maybe a lesser extent are problematic at running Smiths Offense. I'm for keeping Fields as I see his ceiling is higher because of his youth and you are definitely not changing Wilson style of play this late in his career. The 2 coaches that need to be sent packing are Austin and Meyer. Mikey probably needs to go as well if he still has all the say so on the defensive side. Not saying the defense is terrible but it's very vanilla and more thought needs to be put into it especially with the talent they have. Hell, maybe our guys are too dumb to run anything complex, that's another set of issues.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Refuse is not the right word. No Qb refuses to look for or hit the open man. I strongly suspect Russ sometimes cant see the middle of the field and has no choice but to scramble to find the open guy. The Steelers GM and HC chose to go in this direction, theyd get all the praise if it turned out well but should also get all the blame if it doesn’t.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
lipps83
However, the Steelers failing to meet your expectations over a long period of time is not their fault.
Let me know when you get it.
What are you talking about? It is EXACTLY their fault. If the way a team performs is not their fault, then whose fault is it? :huh:
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steeler-in-west
you seem to blame players almost exclusively. Never the coaches. Seems we havent been able to aquire players good enough for Mike Tomlin to be successful with for the last 14 years. Ben wasnt good enough, AB and Bell werent good enough. We couldnt overcome any injuries. So while Russ may be having trouble its not all his fault, hardly. The coaches should be held accountable also, including Tomlin.
At least SOMEONE here gets it. :salute:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
What coach was at fault there? That is Wilson turning down a wide ass open WR at the sticks for a RB at the LOS.
Um, the coach who brought him to Pittsburgh?
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
fansince'76
Making the Steelers/Ravens wildcard game only available on Prime? Goodell strikes again. :upyours:
It can't be viewed on Pittsburgh or Baltimore TV channels?
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Gotta agree ! I don"t like Wilson, he is a has been, not the future. They"re too conservative, do not have a run offense or defense. Need majore changes or they will be behind Balt. and Cincy for the future.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steeldude
It can't be viewed on Pittsburgh or Baltimore TV channels?
Looks like it will be on local TV in Baltimore.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Broadcast locally in Pittsburgh over the air.
Not local? Get a free 30 day trial of Prime.
https://www.steelers.com/news/steele...the-game-x8284
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
fansince'76
Looks like it will be on local TV in Baltimore.
I finally cut the cord and moved away from Directv. I now have youtubeTV, prime, and a bunch of streaming services.
It really sucks that the NFL doesn't make every game available free to the entire country on broadcast tv. For those that aren't already set up to do it, the whole experience is aggravating and infuriating. Once again, the greed of the NFL rules over giving access to the games to the most people.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
Thanks for posting that for everyone.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steeldude
It can't be viewed on Pittsburgh or Baltimore TV channels?
Not true. Prime games also get the local affiliates.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
The streaming only games are usually shown by the local affiliates in the city of each team playing
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
You need IPTV. App only $20/month get everything. PM me if you want a link.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Voice of Reason
What are you talking about? It is EXACTLY their fault. If the way a team performs is not their fault, then whose fault is it? :huh:
I see his point. To a degree.
Over the years, I have seen many Steelers fans whose “expectations” are a Super Bowl win every year. That is an unrealistic expectation. Yeah, if you’re a Steelers fan, it’s a beautiful dream, but it’s not realistic by any stretch of the imagination.
Winning the AFCN? That’s a realistic expectation. Winning a playoff game in 8 seasons? That’s definitely a realistic expectation. So when that doesn’t happen, then yeah, it’s not the fan’s fault for having unrealistic expectations. It’s simply not.
I would say most fans of any team really do not want to see their team end the season at 3-14, but I think a long spell of 10-7 or 9-8 seasons gets the win % above .500, but likely a quick exit in the post-season and a spot in the next year’s draft that will never get you a franchise QB. And that’s the Steelers dilemma.
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I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
You cant win playoff games consistently without a bad aws QB. The Steelers haven't had one since like 2018 or so.
I honestly believe that 2019 team would've won a few playoff games if Ben's elbow held together.
After the injury, he was physical diminished and yoked to a terrible system.
After that, the QB's have been comically limited.
Until the Steelers get high capabilities from the QB position, it doesn't matter what else you have on the roster or who is coaching. They're going to lose the overwhelming majority of games they play against other playoff caliber teams because they have the worse QB. That's the crushing and overwhelming reality of the last 10 years or so of the NFL.
The Vikings may prove that by going one and done this year. Broncos will be a test. Can coaching overcome the disparity at QB?
And honestly, the 2021-23 Steelers should've won about 4-6 games each season. The fact that they were competitive for anything besides draft position is staggering.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
And honestly, the 2021-23 Steelers should've won about 4-6 games each season. The fact that they were competitive for anything besides draft position is staggering.
Couldn’t be coaching as to why they had more wins than what you mentioned. That’s impossible…
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ALLD
You need IPTV. App only $20/month get everything. PM me if you want a link.
This
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Voice of Reason
What are you talking about? It is EXACTLY their fault. If the way a team performs is not their fault, then whose fault is it? :huh:
He is saying you have unrealistic expectations, and it's not the team's fault if you have unrealistic expectations.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
Not local? Get a free 30 day trial of Prime.
Considering the BILLIONS (with a "B") that the NFL is already raking in from CBS and Fox, I shouldn't have to do that, particularly for a playoff game.
It's the principle of the thing.The unfettered greed is beyond tiresome at this point, particularly for a product (NFL football) that, in my humble opinion at least, peaked in the '70s/'80s and has been on a downhill slide ever since.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Crow-Magnon
Winning the AFCN? That’s a realistic expectation. Winning a playoff game in 8 seasons? That’s definitely a realistic expectation. So when that doesn’t happen, then yeah, it’s not the fan’s fault for having unrealistic expectations. It’s simply not.
Thank you. A Raven fan with more common sense than a lot of the Steeler fans on here.
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Re: I really don’t enjoy Steelers games anymore.
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Originally Posted by
86WARD
Couldn’t be coaching as to why they had more wins than what you mentioned. That’s impossible…
Or it could be that, in order to protect Tomlin, Mojouw's claims that those teams should only have won five or six games are too low.
As a matter of fact, one could make a good case that last year had Tomlin not bungled the QB situation by bringing in Trubisky instead of Rudolph when Pickett got hurt, that last year's team should have won MORE than the ten games they did.
