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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Born2Steel
That is a whole lot of typing to say absolutely nothing correct about me or my post.
Right. You've been doing a whole lot of typing in a Kenny Pickett thread telling people to stop talking about Kenny Pickett and that he's a bad guy that wasn't willing to compete. He betrayed the team. Tomlin was in his corner. He asked for a trade. That's why this happened.
You've been pushing your company line on multiple message boards. You made a point to say something to me at another place. Don't act like you aren't getting your panties in a bunch over any idea that the team did Pickett wrong or that they were incorrect about anything.
Again, I hope the team is right in making this move. It's just naive to think that they were all in on Kenny Pickett and that Pickett is a baby that won't compete. Russell Wilson got the job. The team wanted Russell Wilson. The team got Justin Fields because they wanted Justin Fields.
Kenny Pickett got kicked to the curb and they have the two quarterbacks they wanted all along. You act as if the front office had no idea that Wilson or Fields would be available. The front office and the coaching staff have been doing their homework and evaluations on these guys for months preparing for the possibility that they became available. That's how the NFL works.
Do you think Khan and Tomlin just opened up the paper one day and said "Whoa!! Russell Wilson was released! Maybe we should check him out!" ?
Or "Wow, Justin Fields is available, but Kenny is our guy. We're only talking and negotiating with the Bears for months because Pickett is our guy!'
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
pczach
Right. You've been doing a whole lot of typing in a Kenny Pickett thread telling people to stop talking about Kenny Pickett and that he's a bad guy that wasn't willing to compete. He betrayed the team. Tomlin was in his corner. He asked for a trade. That's why this happened.
You've been pushing your company line on multiple message boards. You made a point to say something to me at another place. Don't act like you aren't getting your panties in a bunch over any idea that the team did Pickett wrong or that they were incorrect about anything.
Again, I hope the team is right in making this move. It's just naive to think that they were all in on Kenny Pickett and that Pickett is a baby that won't compete. Russell Wilson got the job. The team wanted Russell Wilson. The team got Justin Fields because they wanted Justin Fields.
Kenny Pickett got kicked to the curb and they have the two quarterbacks they wanted all along. You act as if the front office had no idea that Wilson or Fields would be available. The front office and the coaching staff have been doing their homework and evaluations on these guys for months preparing for the possibility that they became available. That's how the NFL works.
Do you think Khan and Tomlin just opened up the paper one day and said "Whoa!! Russell Wilson was released! Maybe we should check him out!" ?
Or "Wow, Justin Fields is available, but Kenny is our guy. We're only talking and negotiating with the Bears for months because Pickett is our guy!'
Maybe you will believe Omar?
https://steelersnow.com/steelers-qua...for-omar-khan/
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Born2Steel
I don't.
My post above explains why. Teams are prepared for things like this. Everybody was talking about these quarterbacks being moved or released by their teams for a long time. Fields has been talked about for a couple years. Wilson was considered a disaster in Denver and it was well known that he wasn't liked there. NFL teams do their homework and are prepared for things like this.
An NFL GM had no idea that quarterbacks they may be interested in could be available?
They did no homework on these quarterbacks?
Really?
The GM, Weidl, and his staff were completely blindsided by something all of us saw as a possibility months ago?
You don't think Khan, Tomlin, Rooney, Weidl, and the new OC Arthur Smith didn't discussed the possibilities or possible changes at QB?
Come on B2S, this is just common sense. They have scouts and evaluators that are deployed to do just that.
And contrary to popular belief, I don't think the Steelers did anything wrong looking for other quarterbacks. If they didn't think Kenny Pickett was the guy, they should be looking to improve. They are trying to get better. I just want people to understand that they say things to put themselves in a better light and help them in negotiations and trades. Misleading players and making promises that don't always come to fruition is part of that. They are playing both sides trying to massage Pickett's ego and convince him that he will get a chance to be the starter, while simultaneously looking for an upgrade. It is part of what teams do, but sometimes they are going to piss people off doing it.
It's part of the process that they don't speak about, but it happens none the less.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Born2Steel
And you really believe Omar is going to say we kicked Kenny to the curb because we wanted Rust Wilson. Really??? How would that make Tomlin, Omar and the Steeler organization look?
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
pczach
I don't.
My post above explains why. Teams are prepared for things like this. Everybody was talking about these quarterbacks being moved or released by their teams for a long time. Fields has been talked about for a couple years. Wilson was considered a disaster in Denver and it was well known that he wasn't liked there. NFL teams do their homework and are prepared for things like this.
An NFL GM had no idea that quarterbacks they may be interested in could be available?
They did no homework on these quarterbacks?
Really?
The GM, Weidl, and his staff were completely blindsided by something all of us saw as a possibility months ago?
You don't think Khan, Tomlin, Rooney, Weidl, and the new OC Arthur Smith didn't discussed the possibilities or possible changes at QB?
Come on B2S, this is just common sense. They have scouts and evaluators that are deployed to do just that.
And contrary to popular belief, I don't think the Steelers did anything wrong looking for other quarterbacks. If they didn't think Kenny Pickett was the guy, they should be looking to improve. They are trying to get better. I just want people to understand that they say things to put themselves in a better light and help them in negotiations and trades. Misleading players and making promises that don't always come to fruition is part of that. They are playing both sides trying to massage Pickett's ego and convince him that he will get a chance to be the starter, while simultaneously looking for an upgrade. It is part of what teams do, but sometimes they are going to piss people off doing it.
It's part of the process that they don't speak about, but it happens none the less.
What are you even talking about? The article is about Kenny blindsided Omar with the trade request. Not about him talking or looking or shopping with anybody.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
steelcityboyz
And you really believe Omar is going to say we kicked Kenny to the curb because we wanted Rust Wilson. Really??? How would that make Tomlin, Omar and the Steeler organization look?
They already HAD Russ when KP asked to be traded. Your question makes no sense.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Born2Steel
What are you even talking about? The article is about Kenny blindsided Omar with the trade request. Not about him talking or looking or shopping with anybody.
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They already HAD Russ when KP asked to be traded. Your question makes no sense.
Never mind. No need to waste any more time with this.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
pczach
Never mind. No need to waste any more time with this.
We agree.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
pczach
I don't.
My post above explains why. Teams are prepared for things like this. Everybody was talking about these quarterbacks being moved or released by their teams for a long time. Fields has been talked about for a couple years. Wilson was considered a disaster in Denver and it was well known that he wasn't liked there. NFL teams do their homework and are prepared for things like this.
An NFL GM had no idea that quarterbacks they may be interested in could be available?
They did no homework on these quarterbacks?
Really?
The GM, Weidl, and his staff were completely blindsided by something all of us saw as a possibility months ago?
You don't think Khan, Tomlin, Rooney, Weidl, and the new OC Arthur Smith didn't discussed the possibilities or possible changes at QB?
Come on B2S, this is just common sense. They have scouts and evaluators that are deployed to do just that.
And contrary to popular belief, I don't think the Steelers did anything wrong looking for other quarterbacks. If they didn't think Kenny Pickett was the guy, they should be looking to improve. They are trying to get better. I just want people to understand that they say things to put themselves in a better light and help them in negotiations and trades. Misleading players and making promises that don't always come to fruition is part of that. They are playing both sides trying to massage Pickett's ego and convince him that he will get a chance to be the starter, while simultaneously looking for an upgrade. It is part of what teams do, but sometimes they are going to piss people off doing it.
It's part of the process that they don't speak about, but it happens none the less.
I would agree that everyone lies or shades the truth.
Teams lie to players. Players lie to teams.
Agents lie as a reflex.
And everyone lies openly and as “unnamed sources” to the press.
It is possible, maybe even probable, that KP thrives elsewhere.
But something happened over the course of last season at an individual player level that had more than a couple of guys sour on KP. Couple that with the bottom falling out of the market for Wilson and Fields and KP was leaving town regardless of what was publicly being said.
Or at least that’s my take. Wilson took less than most prognosticated and Fields trade market cratered.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Zach makes sense above, I’ll add that I think Tomlin is close to the end and wants a fastrack to a last Super Bowl run. Wilson is their only hope in their opinion. They probably had their eye on Fields too and Kenny just happened to make things easy on them. They tried this at the end of Ben’s career too. It doesn’t look like Tomlin is interested in a rebuild. Never was.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
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Originally Posted by
Steeler-in-west
Zach makes sense above, I’ll add that I think Tomlin is close to the end and wants a fastrack to a last Super Bowl run. Wilson is their only hope in their opinion. They probably had their eye on Fields too and Kenny just happened to make things easy on them. They tried this at the end of Ben’s career too. It doesn’t look like Tomlin is interested in a rebuild. Never was.
This also makes sense. Tomlin has repeatedly made very clear comments that he’s got no interest in a full tear down and rebuild.
Recent comments from ownership seem to echo this.
Personally, I disagree. But if they’re intent on “competing “ every year; all their moves make some rational sense from that POV.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
I think people guessing that Tomlin is gearing up for one last hurrah are just engaging in wishful thinking.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
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Originally Posted by
DesertSteel
I think people guessing that Tomlin is gearing up for one last hurrah are just engaging in wishful thinking.
Tomlin gets my vote for “most likely Coach to die in his office”
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
DesertSteel
I think people guessing that Tomlin is gearing up for one last hurrah are just engaging in wishful thinking.
I agree. Tomlin will sign an extension after the draft. No way he is leaving after next year. He is such a football junkie he can't walk away from the changes the Steelers made, particularly before seeing if Fields is the real deal or riding along with Russ, if he revives his career here. As a matter of fact, I would not be surprised if the topic had come up in some of the FA signings. Whatever Tomlin's faults, it is a fact that many players, including many of our recent FA 's, want to play for Tomlin. Tomlin wouldn't be able to give them any guarantees without a signed extension, but I bet he addressed the subject with some of them.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
Tomlin gets my vote for “most likely Coach to die in his office”
Which "Tomlinism" will be his final words?
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
DesertSteel
I think people guessing that Tomlin is gearing up for one last hurrah are just engaging in wishful thinking.
it is partly wishful thinking. He should go, it’s been 18 years and time for a change. Also I think there are signs he’s thinking about the end, like signing Wilson for a last run, rather than give KP a little more time. Who wants to coach at this high level forever? People have families. Even Belichick couldn’t or wouldn’t take on a rebuild.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steeler-in-west
it is partly wishful thinking. He should go, it’s been 18 years and time for a change. Also I think there are signs he’s thinking about the end, like signing Wilson for a last run, rather than give KP a little more time. Who wants to coach at this high level forever? People have families. Even Belichick couldn’t or wouldn’t take on a rebuild.
I agree it is wishful thinking among some (you know - beware of ..............). That said, Belichick is 71 and Tomlin is 52. I'm not saying that Tomlin doesn't have an idea now of how much longer he wants to coach, but I don't think he is seriously thinking about turning down the Steelers extension offer. Of course, Andy Ried just upped the ante for coaches' salaries.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steeler-in-west
it is partly wishful thinking. He should go, it’s been 18 years and time for a change. Also I think there are signs he’s thinking about the end, like signing Wilson for a last run, rather than give KP a little more time. Who wants to coach at this high level forever? People have families. Even Belichick couldn’t or wouldn’t take on a rebuild.
I just see it as greater urgency. That’s the nature of change in the NFL. You can’t stick with a mediocre quarterback for 3-4 years and hope he develops anymore. Khan is the catalyst for these changes and I like them. But I really don’t think Tomlin is thinking of Wilson in the way you hope.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
86WARD
That’s pretty much all untrue. Just the addition of Patrick Queen improves the team, not to mention anything else they’ve done. Will they win one? Maybe not. But the addition of Queen definitely makes it more likely that they will.
Come on, you know Patrick Queen was not what I was talking about.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
feltdizz
I think folks are lying to themselves when they say Kenny ran from competition.
Kenny ran from a stacked deck created by an incompetent coach. Which was the smartest thing he could have done.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
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Originally Posted by
oneforthetoe
Which "Tomlinism" will be his final words?
"When it comes to my pall bearers I'm going to hold an open competition."
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
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Originally Posted by
Born2Steel
What are you even talking about? The article is about Kenny blindsided Omar with the trade request. Not about him talking or looking or shopping with anybody.
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They already HAD Russ when KP asked to be traded. Your question makes no sense.
Kenny didn’t blind side anyone. Once you bring in a QB like Russ and tell Kenny that Russ is in the pole position you know what the response will be.
There isn’t a QB in the world who would stay with the same team.
Every time a team makes this type of move they prepare for the QB that was demoted to request a trade. Trying to frame it like Kenny gave up or ran is admitting you don’t know the business side of the NFL.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steeler-in-west
Zach makes sense above, I’ll add that I think Tomlin is close to the end and wants a fastrack to a last Super Bowl run. Wilson is their only hope in their opinion. They probably had their eye on Fields too and Kenny just happened to make things easy on them. They tried this at the end of Ben’s career too. It doesn’t look like Tomlin is interested in a rebuild. Never was.
If this doesn’t work out, I don’t see Tomlin staying much longer.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mojouw
Tomlin gets my vote for “most likely Coach to die in his office”
I tend to agree but there has not been a contract extension yet…when does that usually occur? Is it before or after the draft?
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
86WARD
I tend to agree but there has not been a contract extension yet…when does that usually occur? Is it before or after the draft?
Last time was in 2021 just before the draft when he had like 1 year left with some option year left in his contract
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Born2Steel
What are you even talking about? The article is about Kenny blindsided Omar with the trade request. Not about him talking or looking or shopping with anybody.
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They already HAD Russ when KP asked to be traded. Your question makes no sense.
Reading comprehension is your best friend.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
This is the first year I think Tomlin is actually on the hot seat. Maybe I’m lying to myself but these moves smell like desperation.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
They've already added Pickett in action for Madden 25.
https://www.facebook.com/reel/440204998454472/?s=single_unit&__cft__[0]=AZXCoC_qy2fUs0Sk57ClHGIfwIFUJuUykXU-HCEX_VmncGVJ_T-_Nx-K7KTPgjr7wpynXgr4-tPxYhcyAg1c4Ea40PaNjxNh0FFO3nSG1NzuPFHSCmicUzqiPK4 OFVkIif46bgX9bwokExmiQqSAd9U_5AoWW_qXH5xgCuPWz2qMG clBWh65SuP-zdnzOOwUpZs&__tn__=H-R
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
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Originally Posted by
polamalubeast
Last time was in 2021 just before the draft when he had like 1 year left with some option year left in his contract
They usually do it with one year left so if they were following suit, they’d do it any day now…but again, not the same team as in the past…
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
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Originally Posted by
steelcityboyz
Reading comprehension is your best friend.
The entire article is about acquiring Wilson and Fields, but somehow he twists it in his head to support his agenda.
You can't make this shit up.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
https://steelersnow.com/steelers-qua...for-omar-khan/
I’ll post it again. Does it not plainly say they planned to go with KP? Does it not say KP came to them and asked for a trade after signing Wilson? Does Omar say in this article that he still believes KP has a bright future in the league? What exactly am I twisting?
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
feltdizz
This is the first year I think Tomlin is actually on the hot seat. Maybe I’m lying to myself but these moves smell like desperation.
Yeah going 10-7 with trash at quarterback put him on the hot seat... maybe not.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
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Originally Posted by
Born2Steel
What are you even talking about? The article is about Kenny blindsided Omar with the trade request. Not about him talking or looking or shopping with anybody.
What are you twisting?
This BS. This response to my post.
The article is 90% about acquiring Wilson and Fields, yet you act as if I'm off my rocker for responding to the article and explaining why what he did say about Pickett only confirms what I am saying.
In the article that YOU posted, Khan said he had "full faith" in Kenny Pickett being the starting quarterback! :toofunny:
Sure thing. They had so much "full faith" that they sign Russell Wilson. A quarterback that Khan says he had no idea would be available. The NFL GM had no idea he would be available! You must love reading fiction.
Oh by the way, Russell is getting the starting snaps now Kenny. How's that for "full faith"?
Kenny wants a trade? OK, lets trade him to the Eagles. That deal happened in about 5 seconds, didn't it? It's almost as if they had talked to the Eagles about Pickett before that. Funny. The Eagles need a backup quarterback and are interested in Fields, so they are now out of the picture. Now they can finish their negotiations with the Bears to get Fields at a low rate.
Again, another quarterback that he had "no idea" would be available. None. Even though the Bears had been contemplating moving on from Fields for a couple years, and they had been seeking and fielding offers from teams from the moment free agency started. Again, an NFL GM had no idea he would be available? This is storybook nonsense. Anyone with a clear head could see this from miles away, yet you cannot.
Sure.....they didn't mislead anyone about anything. They didn't know any of this was possible. Wink wink. And you actually buy the fantasy.
You need to take off your biased glasses. You refuse to see what's right in front of you, and what's worse, you say others are making stuff up. You believe everything that the Steelers put out there. You take it as Gospel.
The only problem is that the Steelers are a business. They are constantly playing poker, which means they are intentionally misleading or lying to the press, people, players, and teams all the time. They leak only the information they want you to hear. They say what you want to hear in press conferences and interviews. It's the only way they can do business. If they show their hand, they can't make these deals happen and get good value. That is reality. You just refuse to accept it.
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Re: Kenny Pickett traded to Eagles.
I honestly believe all of what is being bandied about here can be true at the same time. Free agency and player movement is often a rapidly evolving situation.
The Steelers, like most of the NFL, likely felt that while Wilson would be available, he would be holding out for a 2-3 year deal with big $$$ on the back end of that contract. It seems from the publicly available evidence, the Steelers had no desire to do that deal structure. For whatever the reason, the market for Wilson evolved in a manner that moved him to being open to the one year deal parameters. Perhaps he was always open to that and everyone read the tea leaves wrong. I suspect and can not prove, that the Steelers were always interested in Wilson on a one year minimum deal. They assumed that wouldn't be possible - so their primary plan was to move forward without being able to strike a deal for Wilson. At some point, Wilson likely indicated to the team he would be willing to meet their terms. That then changed the organizations plans.
They likely fully intended to keep KP and install Wilson as a one year starter over him. Then over a day or so, KP and his people made it clear they were not on board for that. The team then likely engaged Chicago in more active talks about what a deal needed to look like. When they found out that it was possible to make a deal that was acceptable to the Steelers - again one that no one predicted would be out there and again almost everyone was wrong in that estimation - the team moved on it.
Then, they had while not a totally unforeseeable situation, a fairly unlikely one. They had 3 QBs for less than they thought. They moved on from the grumpy one.
It is the most parsimonious explanation with the information available to us banging away on our keyboards. Is there more to the story? Almost certainly. I, for one, suspect that Colbert liked KP as a draft prospect more than anyone else in the organization, If for no other reason than Colbert had indicated more than once that he wanted to go out with drafting the next 10 year starter at QB and laying that capstone on his team building record. Ala Ozzie Newsome in Baltimore with Lamar Jackson. It is possible that Khan and Tomlin have had all the time since Colbert retired to dissuade Rooney from following a plan that they may never have fully endorsed - at least in the privacy of their own thinking. No idea...but I suspect it is plausible while maybe not probable.
And since the Steelers never really let coherent information related to these kind of things out of the building...we will likely never know while all these dudes are still playing. And even if the players put out their version...who knows who was lying to them. Likely everyone to a degree. Certainly agents. Almost certainly coaches. Etc...
For me, the real rub is not the various roster construction maneuvers to get this or that QB on or off the roster. It is whether whoever is making the decisions about QB depth charts, playing time, practice time, and offensive infrastructure learned form the absolute failure that was the handling of KP, Trubisky, Rudolph, and the offensive coaching staff over the last several years. None of it was good. And no one really comes out of it looking like a genius. Can there be lessons salvaged from the wreckage and used to build a setting that allows some combination of Wilson and Fields to flourish? I have absolutely no idea. Hopefully someone in the building does.
I have one other mostly disconnected stray thought. But this entire QB saga reminds me of the Jarvis Jones story. They had an immediate need and drafted college production rather than traits. Jones then failed to fit that need at the NFL level. Almost exclusively since that LB pick, they have taken traits with their draft selections at OLB. In some cases, traits were married to production but they have never again gone in for production without traits. Often eye popping ones.
And what was KP? KP was production over traits. His main selling point was his accuracy and mental preparedness for the NFL. Step in right away and be already developed. That didn't happen. Would a different system have allowed that to happen? Probably. But the team has now pivoted to traits. How much of the traits does Wilson still have? That is the open question. Fields has eye-popping natural gifts. He has failed to harness those for consistent reliable NFL production. But what does Tomlin always harp on with young players? Production can be achieved through proper coaching. I think Tomlin is always going to prefer the player with jaw-dropping traits and believes he can coach that player to the desired level of production. Go find the pictures of him making googly-eyes at Malik Willis pro-day. It doesn't mean Tomlin is correct. It just means he has an almost instinctual preference (bias?) as a coach and player evaluator.
