PDA

View Full Version : Week 1 Thoughts



Chidi29
09-14-2011, 11:08 AM
I knew there was a chance we could lose, but to lose by that much in that way is what makes it so frustrating. Into the notes.

First Half

- Kickoff times: 4.3 (-8), 4.22 (-9, TB)

- Boldin touchdown. Why is McFadden playing so close on Boldin with just a single high safety, Clark, who is rolling over to the X receiver in Evans? Troy is on the TE Dickson leaving McFadden on an island. McFadden should be playing off and be able to see the deep route develop or at least, take it away by playing off. Plus, Harrison is dropping into coverage underneath. Let Boldin run something underneath and have Harrison take away any throwing lanes. Doesn't make any sense.

- Heyward and Johnson still on wedge team.

- Opening day offensive line. Reference for later since things have and will probably continue to change throughout the year. J.Scott, Kemoeatu, Pouncey, Legursky, Colon.

- Mewelde Moore entered the game on 3rd down during the first series.

- 1st team gunners. Lewis and it looks like Gay.

- Great manipulation by Flacco on his second throw, the Bang 8 looking play by Boldin.

But first, let's look at the play before. Because this was really impressive stuff by either Flacco or Cam Cameron, and shows that they had a better grasp on the details and little things than we did.

Simple run play to Ray Rice. Motion Dickson. Troy follows him, Clark has his coverage roll the other way, meaning the CB has to back off into a deep shell (Probably a Cover 3 look, didn't get the proper angle to see it) after playing relatively tight coverage before the motion.

The Ravens see that and on the next play, they do the same thing. Motion Dickson over, Troy follows, Clark rolls, and McFadden starts to back off. This allows Boldin to get inside position on his post. Plus, Dickson runs into the flats occupying Troy.

Here's a picture of McFadden right after the snap. Notice how he's already turning his hips and getting upfield to protect against the deep ball. http://i51.tinypic.com/2ljjmkh.jpg

- Don't think we were used to the speed of their TEs. Especially since they have two in Dickson and Pitta. Used to covering old, slow Todd Heap.

- Antonio Brown smartly lets a booming punt over his head bounce into the end zone.

- Great job by the Ravens going PA on the post to Pitta right after our first turnover. We're suspectible enough as it is with playaction because we're cheating to stop the run, and Rice was running well early making us focus on it even more.

- First time I can remember us splitting Heath out wide outside the numbers like we did on his slant.

- Couple new wrinkles in the offense. Faked a WR sweep, inside trap to Mendenhall, who lined up as a WR. RT Colon on the trap.

- Ben still able to read hot at times, just not consistently enough which has always been my biggest complaint. Hit a slant to Wallace on an Ed Reed blitz, 3rd down drag to Sanders on Baltimore's "A" gap blitz.

- Still running angle routes with the RB in red zone as we did in the past with Mewelde Moore (think pick by Joe Haden in Ben's first game back last year. Angle route to Moore.).

- Foote replaced Farrior with roughly 10:00 left in the second quarter.

- Bad decision by Ben when he tried to extend play on the near interception by Reed. Wasn't much of an effort to block Suggs on that play either. Basic schematic problems on our part.

- Even Colon was struggling against Suggs who played a lot of strong side OLB in this one.

- Timmons getting put on his butt by Leach when he rushed on one pass play. Ugly.

- Heyward getting first pro snaps at weak end in the second, replacing Keisel.

- Foote, for whatever reason, doubles TE on 3rd and 6 leaving Rice as a wide open checkdown underneath for a big gain. More miscommunication.

- Worilds gave Harrison a breather. New number by the way, 93. Heyward is wearing his college number 97. Cortez Allen sporting 28.

- Hard to fault Timmons on Rice receving TD. Jerk route is tough to stop. Can only cover for so long too and Flacco had plenty of time.

- Ike has some sort of soft cast on his broken thumb hand.

Second Half

- My theory for what happened on the Ngata forced fumble to start the second half. Kinda convulded because there's a lot going on but here's my take. I don't think David Johnson ever knew there was an audible.

You can hear Pouncey and Ben's voices picked up over a mic. We hear Pouncey say "52, 52" which I may be him identifying the MIKE for run. MIKE means "mine" so Ray Lewis would be Pouncey's guy. Then he says "Check, check" so some sort of audible. Ben's voice comes over and he says "Let's go Pouncey" leading to a hurried snap. On the play. Legursky ends up getting to the second level and blocking 52, Lewis. It appears the check is made that Pouncey will now pick up Cody and Legursky gets Lewis. So far, so good.

While all this is going on, David Johnson is being motioned from TE to into the backfield. With the crowd noise and the hurriedness of the snap right aftet the check, I don't think he knew what was going on. I think he thought Legursky was still going to block Ngata and Pouncey would be on Lewis. You can even see him after the snap and Ngata blows by, he looks confused. Doesn't know where to go or who to block.

The thing that makes this even worse is this was the first play coming out of halftime. There shouldn't be miscommunication, everyone should be calmed and on the same page. Instead, there is a big screwup and a turnover. Sickening.

- Again, Ravens use playaction to their advantage. A touchdown to Dickson this time around. 1st and 10, run heavy set (22 personnel), their run game working well. You can see Troy definitely sell out on the run.

- Here's a picture of our FG formation on their two point conversion. Just three players to that side. Been doing that all game and they called us on it.

http://i53.tinypic.com/1jc6o.jpg

One over guard, one over end man on the left, and one player lined up wide.

- 3rd quarter for us this year felt like the 3rd quarter for the Ravens last year. Turnover after turnover.

- On Lewis' interception off the tipped pass by Ngata. Happens when you have a 6'1 guard against a 6'4 tackle. He can see when Ben is ready to throw and get his hand up.

- 4th and 1 stop by Harrison. There's the Deebo we all know and love. Fights off the block by Pitta and stops Rice cold. Big key here being we didn't shift our line when they motioned the TE away from the run as window dressing. I'll get into that more later when I break down the Ravens' runs. Credit to McFadden for again launching himself into Vonta Leach.

- Noticeable absense of Kemoeatu trap blocks. Only a few.

- Saw Wes Saunders in goalline package. Actually had a good block on Suggs. The rook is now wearing #82.

- Ran the same WR fake sweep later in the game only this time, the play was designed to go into the flats to Ward. He gets lit up by Jarrett Johnson and Ben throws a pick to Reed.

- When we got down big later in the game as we did, the Ravens could pin their ears back and send the house. And they did.

- Looks like Lewis and Cortez Allen were gunners in the 3rd quarter.

- Ike celebrates a 3rd down stop then headbutts Oher to give the Ravens a first down. Doh!

- Didn't see us run our first CB blitz until the start of the 4th quarter.

- Ben with two red zone picks. Reminds me of two years ago against teams like Oakland and KC when this was his real trouble spot. Absolutely going to kill you.

- Some saw Harrison had a bad game and while he wasn't as good as he usually is, keep in mind he did have at least 8 tackles.

- Interesting pass protection look by us. Pulled both our guards out wide on OLB blitzes. The only time I've ever seen us pull interior lineman is when the center will come out wide against CB blitzes. Maybe it's a concession of how bad our tackles were?

- Did like Ben talking to/rallying the offense line late in the game. Being a leader.

- Late in the game. Ben extending the play, throws deep ball to Heath, who catches it over Reed, huge gain. But....holding on Colon. Microcosm of our day.

- Interesting stunt by Baltimore as if they really needed to get creative to pick apart our offensive line. They have the UT basically drive himself into the RG (sorta looks like a cut block in a sense) and then loop the strong side end to the inside. The tackle can't pick that up obviously and the guard can't pass off the tackle or block the stunt because he's trying to fight off the UT. This also creates a wide open lane for the end to run through.

- Ravens last FG attempt. Still had just three to one side but we did back off Clark and Foote and rolled them to that three side.

http://i56.tinypic.com/2jd3otc.jpg

- Props to Colon for finishing the game with a torn triceps. Though I don't think he realized it because he was talking to the media after the game.

Sacks

- 1st and 10, 3:18 left in first. 01 (empty) personnel, shotgun. Stunt by Suggs, looping inside. I didn't see anything that would indicate a stunt pre-snap. No difference in the stagger of his feet. Actually going to blame Ben on this one. He calls a slide protection to his right meaning Pouncey is crashing hard that way from the snap. Really doesn't have a chance to pick up the stunt.

- 1st and 10, 11:39 left in 4th. Empty. Looks like a good blitz from the Ravens. Didn't tip their hand to the right overload blitz, timed the snap well (clock wasn't down to zero either). Block/release from Heath, so two rushers come in free, Ben with no chance.

- 3rd and 18, 4:08 left in 4th. Shotgun, 10. Forced fumble, recovered by Ravens. Big mistake. Letting the playclock get down to one. Defense can jump the snap without worry, especially in an obvious passing situation. Suggs gets a great jump, Scott can't push him upfield. Johnson or Kruger fights off Colon too. Ben sandwiched. So part on Ben, part on Colon. This is also likely where Colon tore his triceps. His body weight and Suggs' body falls on his right arm.

- 4th and 10, :05 left in 4th. Empty. Suggs with good leverage on Scott. Ben with happy feet, anxious to leave pocket.

Sack Counter (Game)

Ben Roethlisberger: 2
Good defensive scheme: 1
Willie Colon: .5
Jonathan Scott: .5

Sack Counter (Season)

Ben Roethlisberger: 2
Good defensive scheme: 1
Willie Colon: .5
Jonathan Scott: .5

Injuries

Willie Colon out for year with torn triceps. Team has signed Jamon Meredith. Marcus Gilbert to start at RT Sunday.

----------

One of my biggest concerns of the game was our run defense. Definitely not our usual self, and if we don't stop the run, we don't stand a chance. That's what this whole defense is centered around. So I broke down every Ravens' run up until the end of the 3rd, with the exception of two runs right before halftime that were meaningless.

1. 1st and 10. 21 personnel vs 34. Rice over tackle on left side. Harrison slides down pre-snap and gets engulfed by Leach. McKinnie to second level on Farrior. 36 yard gain.

2. 1st and 10. 22 (Dickson motioned to backfield) vs 34. Timmons from backside to make the tackle. 3 yard gain.

3. 1st and 10. 21 vs 34. Run up middle. Cut by Birk on Hampton, Timmons with the tackle. 5 yard gain.

4. 2nd and 29. 11 vs 2-4-5 Nickel. Draw. Ziggy with good job getting off block, little gain.

5. 1st and Goal. 21 vs 34. Rice over LG, down at one after being tripped by Big Snack. Tons of cut blocks from the Ravens. Hampton, Aaron Smith, and Farrior all cut. Howard Mudd would be proud.

6. 3rd and Goal. 23 vs GL. TD over RG. Key block as Phil Simms pointed out. Marshal Yanda plows over Aaron Smith. Farrior can't fill the lane in time.

7. 1st and 10. 22 vs 34. Run to left side. Harrison with good outside containment. Hampton good first step and getd in the backfield for a loss.

8. 1st and 10. 21 vs 34. Run to left, Rice cutback right for a 9 yard gain. Clark caught on safety blitz. Woodley and Timmons slip as they react to cutback. Nice tackle by McFadden. Stopped Rice cold.

9. 3rd and 1. 22 vs 34. Harrison again slides down inside after Pitta motions away because he no longer has responsibility to the TE. When in reality, and this is obviously difficult to detect if you're Harrison, it's just window dressing. Dickson is able to seal him to the inside. McFadden smashes into Leach to take him out, but Larry Foote tries to one-arm it and goes to high. Rice breaks free for a big gain.

10. 1st and 15. 20 vs 34. Middle draw. About an 8 yard gain. Foote stonewalled by Leach. Dickson with a good block on Woodley, creating a running lane.

11. 1st and 10. 21 vs 34. Over RG, jump cut from Rice. Harrison on backside contain, Heyward also helps to make tackle after short gain. Aaron Smith turned, blown out. Ravens lineman does a good job of getting to second level and engaging Foote. Picture of Aaron below.
http://i54.tinypic.com/28jfgvl.png

12. 1st and 10. 22 vs 34. Run off tackle to left. Again TE motion as window dressing. Gets line to shift away from run. Worilds does a nice job fighting off two blocks and helps to make the tackle along with McFadden. Short gain.

13. 1stand 10. 21 vs 34. Middle draw. 4 yard gain. Oher puts Aaron Smith on his back.

14. 1st and 10. 22 vs 34. Harrison fights off cut, Timmons slashes through for stop.

15. 1st and 10. 21 vs 34. Good penetration, short loss on the run. Casey and Keisel get in the backfield. Smith blown out. Again. Noticing a pattern?

16. 1st and 10. 12 vs 34. Williams big urn up middle plus a Troy horsecollar. Cut block took out Hamp and Farrior got caught in the congestion. Grubbs takes out Heyward and Timmons. Wide open running lane.

17. 2nd and 10. 21 vs 34. Run up gut for short gian. Casey cleans him up. Smith blindsided (no pun intended) by Oher.

18. 1st and 10. 21 vs 34. Run up middle. Hampton with good penetration, short gain.

19. 2nd and 8. 12 vs 34. Run to the right side. Harrison comes from backside to get Rice. Farrior on blitz, out of posiiton. 7 yard gain.

20. 3rd and 10. 22 vs 34. Loss. Troy on a blitz, defense clogs all running lanes.

----------

Couple things to take away.

Aaron Smith had the worse game I've seen of anyone at any position in a long time. I pray it's just rust from being away from the game with the injry and the lockout but I think that's naive at this point. So sad to see because he's ben such a key guy for us.

Ravens zone blocking concepts worked well. I've talked in the past teams should do this more often against us.

The little things. Especialy with the TE motion. Ate us up time after time. The devil is in the details and this past Sunday, the Baltimore Ravens were the devil.

SteelerFanInStl
09-14-2011, 11:38 AM
Thanks Chidi. I always enjoy reading your game breakdown. I saw the same thing with Aaron Smith. I think that it's time for Ziggy to be the starter and Smith to come off the bench for relief.

I'm not worried about the Steelers run D mainly because there are very few teams in the NFL that will run the ball as much or as well as the Ravens. The whole NFL has shifted to a pass first mentality and are running the ball less and less. We've also proven year after year that we can stop the run and I'm sure that LeBeau will make the needed adjustments. I'm more worried about our pass D.

Bluecoat96
09-14-2011, 11:44 AM
How do you ever find time to study? :)

Chidi29
09-14-2011, 11:49 AM
Thanks Chidi. I always enjoy reading your game breakdown. I saw the same thing with Aaron Smith. I think that it's time for Ziggy to be the starter and Smith to come off the bench for relief.

I'm not worried about the Steelers run D mainly because there are very few teams in the NFL that will run the ball as much or as well as the Ravens. The whole NFL has shifted to a pass first mentality and are running the ball less and less. We've also proven year after year that we can stop the run and I'm sure that LeBeau will make the needed adjustments. I'm more worried about our pass D.

I'm sure we'll be better, but it's something we have to do in order to be successful. And I'm concerned that Aaron Smith will hold us back if he continues seeing a lot of playing time. Our pass defense looks a lot worse when teams can't run the ball on us and have to throw.

Maybe the motions and shifts were one of those things Tomlin talked about not knowing some of these guys and them knowing more about us than we did about them.

suitanim
09-14-2011, 11:53 AM
One thing I know I will get my head bit of for saying, but I'm saying it anyway, is that other then getting away from the run maybe a bit early, I didn't think the offensive gameplan was all that bad, especially earlier in the game. We obviously had planned on pressure, Ben was taking some 3-step drops, and we ran some misdirection and showed some new looks/plays to counter that. But the OL looked bad, and execution was putrid.

A perfect example is the fake sweep/flat pass to Ward outlined above. This was set-up nicely by the earlier play (and people don't always realize that sometimes it doesn't even matter if the set-up play fails, as it's main function is actually to SET-UP a later play), but totally blown up when Hines was slobberknockered. Great concept, failed execution, result: Reed picks Ben off. That play was a microcosm of the whole game in my book.

SteelerFanInStl
09-14-2011, 11:58 AM
I'm sure we'll be better, but it's something we have to do in order to be successful. And I'm concerned that Aaron Smith will hold us back if he continues seeing a lot of playing time. Our pass defense looks a lot worse when teams can't run the ball on us and have to throw.

Maybe the motions and shifts were one of those things Tomlin talked about not knowing some of these guys and them knowing more about us than we did about them.

That's what I think was the big problem in this game. We just weren't prepared because we didn't know what they were going to do. This wasn't the same Ravens team that we'd seen so many times before. OTOH the Ravens knew exactly what to expect from us. I think that quite often we become too predictable in what we do, both on offense and defense.

SteelerFanInStl
09-14-2011, 12:00 PM
One thing I know I will get my head bit of for saying, but I'm saying it anyway, is that other then getting away from the run maybe a bit early, I didn't think the offensive gameplan was all that bad, especially earlier in the game. We obviously had planned on pressure, Ben was taking some 3-step drops, and we ran some misdirection and showed some new looks/plays to counter that. But the OL looked bad, and execution was putrid.

A perfect example is the fake sweep/flat pass to Ward outlined above. This was set-up nicely by the earlier play (and people don't always realize that sometimes it doesn't even matter if the set-up play fails, as it's main function is actually to SET-UP a later play), but totally blown up when Hines was slobberknockered. Great concept, failed execution, result: Reed picks Ben off. That play was a microcosm of the whole game in my book.

We did a decent job of moving the ball on offense but the turnovers killed us. We also didn't do a good job of converting 3rd downs.

suitanim
09-14-2011, 12:03 PM
That's what I was thinking of before the game, saying that in a close game, just one turnover could make all the difference. Well, we turned the ball over a lot more then once, and, just as GB did in the SB, the Rats made us pay for each and every one. All those TO's turned this into a route, and when the infection of poor execution sets in, that only makes it worse...

Chidi29
09-14-2011, 12:45 PM
One thing I know I will get my head bit of for saying, but I'm saying it anyway, is that other then getting away from the run maybe a bit early, I didn't think the offensive gameplan was all that bad, especially earlier in the game. We obviously had planned on pressure, Ben was taking some 3-step drops, and we ran some misdirection and showed some new looks/plays to counter that. But the OL looked bad, and execution was putrid.

A perfect example is the fake sweep/flat pass to Ward outlined above. This was set-up nicely by the earlier play (and people don't always realize that sometimes it doesn't even matter if the set-up play fails, as it's main function is actually to SET-UP a later play), but totally blown up when Hines was slobberknockered. Great concept, failed execution, result: Reed picks Ben off. That play was a microcosm of the whole game in my book.

I was actually surprised how little flack Arians got. Saw some of it but wasn't as bad as I thought. And you're right, the playcalls weren't the issue. It's hard to do much as an OC when your team turns the ball over 7 times.

Looking and thinking about it some more, LeBeau did a way worse job than Arians.

suitanim
09-14-2011, 03:32 PM
Yes, I was definitely thinking of saying that LeBeau was the worse of the two coordinators, but I have to be careful here...supporting the scapegoat AND criticizing the sacred cow all in one thread could invite a lot of ignorance....

Chidi29
09-14-2011, 03:39 PM
Yes, I was definitely thinking of saying that LeBeau was the worse of the two coordinators, but I have to be careful here...supporting the scapegoat AND criticizing the sacred cow all in one thread could invite a lot of ignorance....

Now if only I could get you to say nice things about William Gay. :chuckle:

shutdown
09-14-2011, 03:56 PM
PFF's stats just came in today. Here was their feedback:



1) Tale of the Tackles
With no Willie Colon last season the Steelers were hurting in a major way at OT and this game he showed why they missed him. Even with allowing a hit and another pressure he recorded a +1.6 game, grading well against both the run and pass. Unfortunately for the Steelers he’s already been placed on IR with a triceps injury and is done for the year, putting the Steelers back in a hole. On the other side Jonathan Scott was far from as good with a -4.4 grade, allowing two sacks, a hit and three further pressures. The Steelers can’t continue to rely on Ben Roethlisberger bailing them out from poor offensive line play. Think how good he might be if they actually protected him?


2) Time taking its toll on Aaron Smith?

Aaron Smith has had to deal with a laundry list of injuries. He’s not a young guy anymore and he’s spent a long time away from the field in recent seasons. Is this game evidence that the injuries are more than he can overcome to return to the player he once was? In this game he was blanked entirely from the scoresheet. He failed to register pressure on any of his 27 pass rushes, and was routinely handled at the point of attack by Michael Oher and others in the run game.


3) Polamalu is human

We all know the score: When Troy Polamalu plays the Steelers are great, when he doesn’t they look like a shadow of the side we expect and everybody anoints Polamalu defensive MVP. Well this time they were torn to shreds with him in the lineup and what’s more, actually contributing in no small way to the collapse. Polamalu (-2.3) was beaten in coverage on more than one occasion and was at fault for one of the Ravens touchdowns, but he was also much less of a force than we expect against the run or on the blitz, rushing just once in the game.

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/09/14/re-focused-steelers-ravens-week-1/

crcsnail
09-14-2011, 04:01 PM
nice post as usual chidi29. i also thought a.smith had a really bad game but then so did many others :(

Count Steeler
09-14-2011, 04:02 PM
Thanks again Chidi. This game is going to take a few weeks to get over, because it will always be in the back of mind that they can lay another egg at anytime.

fansince'76
09-14-2011, 04:53 PM
How do you ever find time to study? :)

Well, Chidi is majoring in Sports Journalism, so maybe this is part of his homework? :wink02: :chuckle:

Awesome breakdown as always, Chidi! :thumbsup:

zulater
09-14-2011, 07:17 PM
Did the Steelers ever go no huddle? If so when? It seems a lot of teams throughout the league had success with the no huddle offense, not letting defense's put the right personnel groupings on the field, and tiring out the players on there.

Bluecoat96
09-14-2011, 07:52 PM
Well, Chidi is majoring in Sports Journalism, so maybe this is part of his homework? :wink02: :chuckle:

Awesome breakdown as always, Chidi! :thumbsup:

Well good job then, Chidi!

Chidi29
09-14-2011, 08:04 PM
Well, Chidi is majoring in Sports Journalism, so maybe this is part of his homework? :wink02: :chuckle:

Awesome breakdown as always, Chidi! :thumbsup:

Sadly no, but that would be the greatest homework in the world.

Shoes
09-14-2011, 08:05 PM
Nice work Chidi!

Chidi29
09-14-2011, 08:10 PM
Did the Steelers ever go no huddle? If so when? It seems a lot of teams throughout the league had success with the no huddle offense, not letting defense's put the right personnel groupings on the field, and tiring out the players on there.

May have been some muddle huddle. Not sure.

Tough to go no huddle though. On the road in a very loud atmosphere. We had enough miscommunications as it was.

zulater
09-14-2011, 09:58 PM
May have been some muddle huddle. Not sure.

Tough to go no huddle though. On the road in a very loud atmosphere. We had enough miscommunications as it was.

I see teams go no huddle on the road in loud atmosphere's all the time. Not a valid excuse. If they didn't go no huddle, that's on our boy Bruce. Sorry, I know everyone hates it here when Bruce gets any blame. And I'm certainly not meaning to imply that his blame is greater than about 60 odd other guys. But offensively we weren't prepared. going no huddle might have provided a needed change up. If that wasn't deployed, again shame on Bruce.

Chidi29
09-14-2011, 10:11 PM
I see teams go no huddle on the road in loud atmosphere's all the time. Not a valid excuse. If they didn't go no huddle, that's on our boy Bruce. Sorry, I know everyone hates it here when Bruce gets any blame. And I'm certainly not meaning to imply that his blame is greater than about 60 odd other guys. But offensively we weren't prepared. going no huddle might have provided a needed change up. If that wasn't deployed, again shame on Bruce.

I'd have to call you on that claim. I don't think it happens that often especially in loud places like what Baltimore was. Maybe if you get up and get the crowd quiet or really good with your silent count, but it can't be used a lot.

We had an offense that couldn't even get on the same page with a huddle. And you want to try to run the no huddle? God knows what'll go wrong.

zulater
09-14-2011, 10:18 PM
I'd have to call you on that claim. I don't think it happens that often especially in loud places like what Baltimore was. Maybe if you get up and get the crowd quiet or really good with your silent count, but it can't be used a lot.

We had an offense that couldn't even get on the same page with a huddle. And you want to try to run the no huddle? God knows what'll go wrong.

Hard to be any worse than it already was. Anyway you cut it, Bruce did a poor job having his offense prepared last Sunday. In fact the entire coaching staff did a lousy job. But Arains and LeBeau deserve the most blame imo. The coordinaters have more responsibility in putting the game plan together and making in game adjustments than the head coach. And they did a lousy job.

Oh well, at least 15 more weeks for everyone to redeem themselves.

Chidi29
09-14-2011, 10:24 PM
Hard to be any worse than it already was. Anyway you cut it, Bruce did a poor job having his offense prepared last Sunday. In fact the entire coaching staff did a lousy job. But Arains and LeBeau deserve the most blame imo. The coordinaters have more responsibility in putting the game plan together and making in game adjustments than the head coach. And they did a lousy job.

Oh well, at least 15 more weeks for everyone to redeem themselves.

What is a OC supposed to do when his offense turns the ball over 7 times? When Ben lobs lollipops in the end zone? When Ben calls a slide protection and gets popped by Suggs, resulting in a fumble. When Willie Colon holds ot negate a long throw? When Moore gets hit from behind and loses the ball? What's he supposed to do?

shutdown
09-14-2011, 10:37 PM
I like this quote from Wexell - "That first-and-10, empty-set, five-wides play-call that could’ve landed Ben in the hospital, but luckily only caused him to fumble." :noidea:

zulater
09-14-2011, 10:37 PM
What is a OC supposed to do when his offense turns the ball over 7 times? When Ben lobs lollipops in the end zone? When Ben calls a slide protection and gets popped by Suggs, resulting in a fumble. When Willie Colon holds ot negate a long throw? When Moore gets hit from behind and loses the ball? What's he supposed to do?

Have them know what the hell they're supposed to do would be a good start.

So you think the coaches are above blame here? Or just Bruce the almighty?

Seriously Chidi, I'm not suggesting anyone should be fired, or is completely inadequate. But the Steelers weren't prepared for what they were up against on either side of the ball. The respective game plan's failed, and no effective adjustments were ever made.

zulater
09-14-2011, 10:41 PM
I like this quote from Wexell - "That first-and-10, empty-set, five-wides play-call that could’ve landed Ben in the hospital, but luckily only caused him to fumble." :noidea:

Tomlin was nuts to let Ben play in garbage time. Particularly going so pass happy against a defense that didn't have to respect the run.

Chidi29
09-14-2011, 10:57 PM
I like this quote from Wexell - "That first-and-10, empty-set, five-wides play-call that could’ve landed Ben in the hospital, but luckily only caused him to fumble." :noidea:

Which one are we talking about exactly?

Chidi29
09-14-2011, 10:57 PM
Have them know what the fuck they're supposed to do would be a good start.

So you think the coaches are above blame here? Or just Bruce the almighty?

I think Ben knows not to throw lobs to Ed Reed.

Does that need to be taught at this point of his career?

Remember we were moving the ball well. At least decently. It was the turnovers that killed us.

zulater
09-14-2011, 11:05 PM
I think Ben knows not to throw lobs to Ed Reed.

Does that need to be taught at this point of his career?

Remember we were moving the ball well. At least decently. It was the turnovers that killed us.

So Ben was just "lobbing them up there" like a rookie, a bad one at that? Had nothing to do with missed blocking assignments, predictable play calling, etc... All on Ben, the coaches should be completely absolved?

If so why even pay coaches anything above minimum wage? If they have no influence on game events it sure seems like they were a waste of money last week.

Mach1
09-14-2011, 11:32 PM
Have them know what the hell they're supposed to do would be a good start.

So you think the coaches are above blame here? Or just Bruce the almighty?

Seriously Chidi, I'm not suggesting anyone should be fired, or is completely inadequate. But the Steelers weren't prepared for what they were up against on either side of the ball. The respective game plan's failed, and no effective adjustments were ever made.

The only adjustments airians makes is to the wedgie in his pants.

NCSteeler
09-15-2011, 12:03 AM
- Boldin touchdown. Why is McFadden playing so close on Boldin with just a single high safety, Clark, who is rolling over to the X receiver in Evans? Troy is on the TE Dickson leaving McFadden on an island. McFadden should be playing off and be able to see the deep route develop or at least, take it away by playing off. Plus, Harrison is dropping into coverage underneath. Let Boldin run something underneath and have Harrison take away any throwing lanes. Doesn't make any sense.



Because everyone here thinks if he's playing off the line he's stupid and our Lebeau has lost it.

Once again another great breakdown, Thanks

Chidi29
09-15-2011, 06:32 AM
So Ben was just "lobbing them up there" like a rookie, a bad one at that? Had nothing to do with missed blocking assignments, predictable play calling, etc... All on Ben, the coaches should be completely absolved?

If so why even pay coaches anything above minimum wage? If they have no influence on game events it sure seems like they were a waste of money last week.

Missed blocking assignments is Arians' fault? If a player misses it, it's on the OC?

Predictable play calling? Oh yeah, I totaly saw the fake WR sweep, throw into the flats to Ward play coming from the time we were in the huddle. Everyone around me knew exactly what was coming. It was so obvious.

suitanim
09-15-2011, 09:05 AM
Missed blocking assignments is Arians' fault? If a player misses it, it's on the player?

Predictable play calling? Oh yeah, I totaly saw the fake WR sweep, throw into the flats to Ward play coming from the time we were in the huddle. Everyone around me knew exactly what was coming. It was so obvious.

You are fighting a losing battle here. As explained, the fake sweep/flats pass was the fruition of something set up earlier. I don't have the tape in front of me, but I'm pretty sure that had Ward not been blasted when he was scraping across, he would have snuck out into the flats and been wide open. It was a CLASSIC case of excellent playcalling and of failed execution.

SteelerFanInStl
09-15-2011, 10:05 AM
Remember we were moving the ball well. At least decently. It was the turnovers that killed us.

I completely agree. We were moving the ball. You just can't win with 7 turnovers. Add in 3 turnovers in the Super Bowl. I think this is the thing that bothers me the most about game 1.

Chidi29
09-15-2011, 11:26 AM
You are fighting a losing battle here. As explained, the fake sweep/flats pass was the fruition of something set up earlier. I don't have the tape in front of me, but I'm pretty sure that had Ward not been blasted when he was scraping across, he would have snuck out into the flats and been wide open. It was a CLASSIC case of excellent playcalling and of failed execution.

You're right. He would have been open. I actually think Brown would have had a shot to score on that play. Ran a corner route to the end zone and you can see him get some separation.

I assume the play you're referring to that set up this one was the fake sweep inside trap to Mendenhall?

suitanim
09-15-2011, 11:50 AM
Yeah...you referred to it in your OP.

But that's immaterial. EVERY OC from high school on uses this trick. Sometimes you run set-up plays in hopes they will work as a stand-alone (and how many times do you see a play called that works, and then the next play is the same play is called to the opposite side? It's called "I'm going to run it til you stop it"), sometimes you run it and see how the other team reacts then never run the follow-up, and a lot of times you run the set-up play, it doesn't work, but it does it's job and you read how the defense responds and then add "the wrinkle" that makes it work on the follow-up. Playcalling 101.

Not every play is supposed to score a TD. If you line-up in the "I" and run off-tackle right 15 times in a row with only limited success, then line up in the I, run play action and hit a wide open WR streaking down the sideline because the defense has been conditioned to cheat run against the I, are you stupid for calling 15 running plays prior, or clever for setting up the defense?

That's why it's intellectually lazy to just reflexively blame the OC when it appears on the surface that "it's the plays!".

zulater
09-15-2011, 11:54 AM
Missed blocking assignments is Arians' fault? If a player misses it, it's on the OC?

Predictable play calling? Oh yeah, I totaly saw the fake WR sweep, throw into the flats to Ward play coming from the time we were in the huddle. Everyone around me knew exactly what was coming. It was so obvious.

Look I'm not saying that Arains is fully to blame, or most to blame, for the woefull offensive performance. But please stop with the complete absolution. Arians along with all of the coaching staff, along with Ben, the line, and anyone else who stood on the Steelers sideline deserves a big fat F for that abomination of a game. Everyone needs to self reflect. Tell me do you really want our coaching staff thinking, "damn we did a great job, too bad the players screwed it all up.? And more to the point, do you really believe they prepared their unit's was satisfactorily?


I'm no more demanding Arains head than I'm calling for Ben's benching. But please, just admit it, the coaching staff fell short of expectations right across the board along with the rest of the team. And to my way of thinking the coordinaters, both LeBeau, and Arains bear more responsibility than most. It comes with the job.

zulater
09-15-2011, 11:57 AM
Yeah...you referred to it in your OP.

But that's immaterial. EVERY OC from high school on uses this trick. Sometimes you run set-up plays in hopes they will work as a stand-alone (and how many times do you see a play called that works, and then the next play is the same play is called to the opposite side? It's called "I'm going to run it til you stop it"), sometimes you run it and see how the other team reacts then never run the follow-up, and a lot of times you run the set-up play, it doesn't work, but it does it's job and you read how the defense responds and then add "the wrinkle" that makes it work on the follow-up. Playcalling 101.

Not every play is supposed to score a TD. If you line-up in the "I" and run off-tackle right 15 times in a row with only limited success, then line up in the I, run play action and hit a wide open WR streaking down the sideline because the defense has been conditioned to cheat run against the I, are you stupid for calling 15 running plays prior, or clever for setting up the defense?

That's why it's intellectually lazy to just reflexively blame the OC when it appears on the surface that "it's the plays!".

If you're the boss of a division of a company, and the presentation your unit is assigned goes hideously wrong, you're not in any way to blame?

Sounds like a government job.

suitanim
09-15-2011, 12:10 PM
If you're the boss of a division of a company, and the presentation your unit is assigned goes hideously wrong, you're not in any way to blame?

Sounds like a government job.

If I implement a plan to, say, pave a street, and I have all the equipment, and a good plan for traffic control, and all the things are in place, and then the staff (and I'm not in charge of hiring) gets drunk, steals the equipment and wrecks it, and redirects traffic so that there are crashes, is it really MY fault that they fucked up my perfectly good plan?

I'm sorry, I watched the game, and I don't think the playcalling was that bad. I remember when we played the Eagles a few years ago and everyone was saying how against all that pressure Ben should have been throwing screens, running misdirection, taking 3-step drops, etc. Fast forward a few years, we face pressure again, all the things that were called for (and are actually standard operating procedure to slow-down a pressure defense) a few years ago are employed, and THOSE solutions are no longer valid, and there's a whole OTHER set of complaints. It reeks of scapegoating.

As I said before, the blocking was bad. The execution was bad. Mistakes were made, fumbles were lost, passes were inaccurate, passes were deflected, little things compiled, but the playcalling wasn't that bad. It wasn't predictable. Ben was taking 3 step drops. We were running some misdirection. The execution was simply shitty. We DID get away from running the ball too early, and I'm not saying Arians is 100% exonerated, but it's scapegoating plain and simple to try and gloss over a fucking putrid effort by the players by blaming it on the OC. Bill Walsh could have game-planned against the Rats, and we still would have gotten pumped. The players played like shit for nearly 60 minutes. That is NOT the OC's fault!

zulater
09-15-2011, 12:15 PM
If I implement a plan to, say, pave a street, and I have all the equipment, and a good plan for traffic control, and all the things are in place, and then the staff (and I'm not in charge of hiring) gets drunk, steals the equipment and wrecks it, and redirects traffic so that there are crashes, is it really MY fault that they fucked up my perfectly good plan?

I'm sorry, I watched the game, and I don't think the playcalling was that bad. I remember when we played the Eagles a few years ago and everyone was saying how against all that pressure Ben should have been throwing screens, running misdirection, taking 3-step drops, etc. Fats forward a few years, we face pressure again, all the things that were called for (and are actually standard operating procedure to slow-down a pressure defense) a few years ago are employed, and there's a whole OTHER set of complaints.

As I said before, the blocking was bad. The execution was bad. Mistakes were made, fumbles were lost, passes were inaccurate, passes were deflected, little things compiled, but the playcalling wasn't that bad. It wasn't predictable. Ben was taking 3 step drops. We were running some misdirection. The execution was simply shitty. We DID get away from running the ball too early, and I'm not saying Arians is 100% exonerated, but it's scapegoating plain and simple to try and gloss over a fucking putrid effort by the players by blaming it on the OC. Bill Walsh could have game-planned against the Rats, and we still would have gotten pumped. The players played like shit for nearly 60 minutes. That is NOT the OC's fault!

I understand what you're saying, and for the first 3 quarters I'm not going to blame the play calling. Not even the game plan outside of not incorporating the no huddle at some point. But lack of preparation by the players for a game has to in some way reflect upon the coaching staff.

We need a lot of people to step up to see that this doesn't happen again this season. Coaches included.

suitanim
09-15-2011, 12:16 PM
I've been posting on Steelers MB's since the mid-90's. I've been on several. We have had several OC's over that period of time, some better than others. The offense has been better in almost every category under Arians than any of his predecessors, but I could predict by the middle of the 2nd quarter that Arians would get an inordinate amount of blame for this blowout loss. Why?

Because a good 60% of the posters do it every game we lose, regardless of the playcalling, regardless of the OC, regardless of how good the team we faced was or how good THEIR gameplan was, regardless of any mitigating factors. It's a broken record. It's classic knee-jerk reactionary overblow. This game is no different.

zulater
09-15-2011, 12:25 PM
I've been posting on Steelers MB's since the mid-90's. I've been on several. We have had several OC's over that period of time, some better than others. The offense has been better in almost every category under Arians than any of his predecessors, but I could predict by the middle of the 2nd quarter that Arians would get an inordinate amount of blame for this blowout loss. Why?

Because a good 60% of the posters do it every game we lose, regardless of the playcalling, regardless of the OC, regardless of how good the team we faced was or how good THEIR gameplan was, regardless of any mitigating factors. It's a broken record. It's classic knee-jerk reactionary overblow. This game is no different.

So you really don't believe there was anything that Arains or LeBeau could have or should have done differently? Be it game plan, in game adjustments, player preparation or substitutions etc...? Going forward there's nothing the coaching staff should do in regards to the aforementioned differently?

suitanim
09-15-2011, 12:37 PM
In hindsight, I think Arians should have settled everyone down and went back to basics. Run the ball to set up the pass. I think they hit the panic button a little too soon. Even a couple drives that ate up clock in the 2nd and 3rd quarters could have changed the whole complexion of that game.

But, no. I don't think that either LeBeau or Arians were lazy or took the game for granted. I think they both worked hard and gameplanned to beat the Ravens and it just didn't work out.

zulater
09-15-2011, 12:46 PM
In hindsight, I think Arians should have settled everyone down and went back to basics. Run the ball to set up the pass. I think they hit the panic button a little too soon. Even a couple drives that ate up clock in the 2nd and 3rd quarters could have changed the whole complexion of that game.

But, no. I don't think that either LeBeau or Arians were lazy or took the game for granted. I think they both worked hard and gameplanned to beat the Ravens and it just didn't work out.

I disagree with nothing you've said here. Just as was true with the players they got swept up in the momentum of the day.

zulater
09-15-2011, 12:50 PM
As stupid as it may sound I can't help but wonder what if any influence Woodley's jabs at Flacco had on this game? This was like a Super bowl to the Ravens, their emotional edge was so much greater than the Steelers.

Chidi29
09-15-2011, 01:01 PM
Look I'm not saying that Arains is fully to blame, or most to blame, for the woefull offensive performance. But please stop with the complete absolution. Arians along with all of the coaching staff, along with Ben, the line, and anyone else who stood on the Steelers sideline deserves a big fat F for that abomination of a game. Everyone needs to self reflect. Tell me do you really want our coaching staff thinking, "damn we did a great job, too bad the players screwed it all up.? And more to the point, do you really believe they prepared their unit's was satisfactorily?


I'm no more demanding Arains head than I'm calling for Ben's benching. But please, just admit it, the coaching staff fell short of expectations right across the board along with the rest of the team. And to my way of thinking the coordinaters, both LeBeau, and Arains bear more responsibility than most. It comes with the job.

Let's go back to the original statement I made. All I said that was LeBeau had a worse game than Arians. That doesn't mean he had a great game. Which he didn't. You can't say you did you job to your expectation level when your offense scores just seven points. So yes, Arians does get blame. Everyone does, as you said. But if I had to create a list of problems on offense, his playcalling would be low on it.

Chidi29
09-15-2011, 01:03 PM
Well, Chidi is majoring in Sports Journalism, so maybe this is part of his homework? :wink02: :chuckle:

Awesome breakdown as always, Chidi! :thumbsup:

By the way, for those who saw me mention it in the other forum, my first show was this past Tuesday. Went pretty well. There was a mic issue in the beginning but they got it fixed and it was smooth sailing the rest of the way.

suitanim
09-15-2011, 04:23 PM
It would be a good (and brave) thing if you used your platform to educate the masses on the nuances and subtleties of the Offensive Coordinator position in Pittsburgh.

Chidi29
09-15-2011, 05:28 PM
It would be a good (and brave) thing if you used your platform to educate the masses on the nuances and subtleties of the Offensive Coordinator position in Pittsburgh.

At this point, nothing is going to work. And I'm not talking about people like zulater who actually know what they're talking about and simply have a different people. I'm talking about another group. The ones that blame Arians regardless of what happens and spew the same vague phrases all the time.

NCSteeler
09-16-2011, 01:14 AM
You are fighting a losing battle here. As explained, the fake sweep/flats pass was the fruition of something set up earlier. I don't have the tape in front of me, but I'm pretty sure that had Ward not been blasted when he was scraping across, he would have snuck out into the flats and been wide open. It was a CLASSIC case of excellent playcalling and of failed execution.

Speaking of which, I'm not always up on nuances of the rules and what not, but is it ok for a Lber to just blow up a wr OR te running a slant?

Chidi29
09-16-2011, 07:14 AM
Speaking of which, I'm not always up on nuances of the rules and what not, but is it ok for a Lber to just blow up a wr OR te running a slant?

Yes it is.

SteelerFanInStl
09-16-2011, 08:51 AM
Yes it is.

As long as it's within 5 yards of the line of scrimmage.

NCSteeler
09-16-2011, 08:35 PM
Yes it is.

You don't see it happen much. I sure would like to see Timmons lay out some TEs