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polamalubeast
06-08-2010, 03:44 AM
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/s_684884.html

Harris: Tomlin contract not a done deal
By John Harris, PITTSBURGH TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Tuesday, June 8, 2010


Since the close of the 2009 season, I've deliberated over when — and why — Steelers coach Mike Tomlin will sign a eagerly anticipated contract extension. Or, if he deserves one.

As we enter the second week in June, with offseason workouts concluding Thursday and Tomlin entering the final year of his contract, my thoughts are clear.

I don't believe the Steelers' brass is completely sold on Tomlin.

Several factors nudged me toward that opinion.

When Tomlin won Super Bowl XLIII in his second season, becoming the youngest coach in NFL history to do so, his star was never higher. Yet, the Steelers didn't pull the trigger on a new deal.

Maybe Tomlin's asking price is too high. Or, maybe the Steelers want more time to determine if Tomlin is another George Seifert or Barry Switzer — coaches who won a Super Bowl with someone else's players.

Does Tomlin deserve a contract extension? Of course he does.

But contract extensions should be a joyous occasion for both sides. The lack of urgency toward a new deal for Tomlin has become quite painful.

What strikes a nerve for me about the lack of a new deal for Tomlin is the team's track record for taking care of its coaches who win.

Tomlin's three-year coaching record is 31-17 with two playoff appearances. He's 3-1 in the postseason.

Consider that Steelers management never failed to re-sign Bill Cowher with fewer than two years on his contract until the last moment.

In 2006, the sides failed to agree on a new deal. When Cowher resigned following the 2006 season, he had one year left on his contract.

In January, team president Art Rooney II told the Tribune-Review, "I think Mike's going to be our coach for a long time. That's certainly what we're shooting for, and that's his intention, so we'll deal with it at the appropriate time."

The "appropriate time" might have been a few months ago, but a lot has happened since January. Not the least of which is that quarterback Ben Roethlisberger will open the season apart from his teammates after violating the league's personal conduct policy.

Other significant changes have also taken place.

Rooney promised the Steelers will concentrate more on the run despite a record- setting passing output in 2009 — not at all what Tomlin and offensive coordinator Bruce Arians envisioned following last year's high-octane attack.

For another, the Steelers re-signed two players from other teams who lost their starting jobs under Tomlin — linebacker Larry Foote and cornerback Bryant McFadden.

Rarely does a coach, particularly a Steelers coach, bring back players he determined were no longer starters after letting them go — not to mention signing both players to contract extensions upon their return.

What's telling for me is a slight shift in philosophy — on offense and defense — away from Tomlin's point of view.

For instance, while Tomlin spoke repeatedly about his secondary needing to create more splash plays — for example, interceptions — during the team's five-game losing streak last season, defensive coordinator Dick LeBeau told me recently, "I don't really use interceptions as an evaluating criteria. I think they're nice, they're good — you want them. (But) the No. 1 thing is the other guy doesn't catch the ball."

Of course, the Steelers could sign Tomlin to a new deal before the end of the week. Management may want to have Tomlin's contract situation settled before the start of training camp July 30 so as to not create another distraction along with the media circus that's sure to shadow Roethlisberger around Latrobe.

After all, the last thing management wants to do is give players the impression that Tomlin, even though the team holds an option on his contract for the 2011 season, isn't going to be their coach for a long time — unless he's not their long-term choice.

The same holds true for some of the assistants hired when Tomlin took over in 2007. That includes Arians, who was the target of offseason media reports that Tomlin considered letting him go — a charge Tomlin denies.

Put another way: If the Steelers don't sign Tomlin to a new deal before the start of the season, it's a vote of no-confidence for a coach who made history in his second season.

Galax Steeler
06-08-2010, 03:59 AM
I feel like he is worth a new contract. I believe that he can and will be a good coach in the NFL.

venom
06-08-2010, 05:53 AM
He deserves a new contract. Players like him and hes a proven winner , so far .

zulater
06-08-2010, 06:19 AM
I still wonder how much of a factor the pending CBA expiration has to do with this? Unlike players coaches contracts are guaranteed during a work stoppage. This could simply be a matter of the Steelers looking for someone else in the league to set the precedent for some sort of two way contract wherin the coach gets paid but less than his contract demands in the case of a lockout? Or maybe they'll be the trailblazers in that regard? But in my opinion that's the probable source of the delay. They just don't want to be on the hook for 5-6 million dollars if no football gets played in 2011.

BlastFurnace
06-08-2010, 07:28 AM
I certainly hope he gets extended. I like having him as our coach. This year will tell alot though.

steelpride12
06-08-2010, 08:54 AM
Anyone who thinks he doesn't deserve a contract is nuts. He won a Super Bowl his second season! He led this team to the playoffs the season before may I add and has proven he knows how to win games. I hope this comes sooner rather than later.

MULLDOG24
06-08-2010, 09:20 AM
I hope a deal gets done as I hope Tomlin is the Steeler coach for along time.

Michael
06-08-2010, 10:23 AM
I hope The Rooneys wait. I am not at all convinced . My observations are as follows: His critical side line calls are terrible , the team's second half performances are way below par suggesting he is getting outcoached at the point of "half time adjustments". His cliche based communications style is projecting no substance of real thought , I am still waiting for the Wrath of Hell, and when you go public and staate you are going to bench players back it up with action or run the risk of being considered a bullshiter (constent with cliches) his side line demeanor is at best a managment style I do not like and at worst he is lost, in short he does not seem involved in the game , Art Rooney going public with his stated goal "return to the run" is unusal for a Rooney to go on the record, his support for Bruce Arians is in my mind indicative of a guy that does not understand Steeler offensive football. Perhaps the players like him. They may like him for the wrong reasons.

I am not righteous in my opinion I want to be wrong because I want very much for Tomlin to succeed because the Steelers will benefit and that is what I am most focused on. The players are under pressure to perform so be it for Mike Tomlin. I am not interested in how Cowher and Noll were handled by the Rooney's. They proved themselves and Tomlin still has a chance to prove himself but I want to wait and see if he's got IT .

polamalubeast
06-08-2010, 11:05 AM
I hope The Rooneys wait. I am not at all convinced . My observations are as follows: His critical side line calls are terrible , the team's second half performances are way below par suggesting he is getting outcoached at the point of "half time adjustments". His cliche based communications style is projecting no substance of real thought , I am still waiting for the Wrath of Hell, and when you go public and staate you are going to bench players back it up with action or run the risk of being considered a bullshiter (constent with cliches) his side line demeanor is at best a managment style I do not like and at worst he is lost, in short he does not seem involved in the game , Art Rooney going public with his stated goal "return to the run" is unusal for a Rooney to go on the record, his support for Bruce Arians is in my mind indicative of a guy that does not understand Steeler offensive football. Perhaps the players like him. They may like him for the wrong reasons.

I am not righteous in my opinion I want to be wrong because I want very much for Tomlin to succeed because the Steelers will benefit and that is what I am most focused on. The players are under pressure to perform so be it for Mike Tomlin. I am not interested in how Cowher and Noll were handled by the Rooney's. They proved themselves and Tomlin still has a chance to prove himself but I want to wait and see if he's got IT .



The steelers were the better team in the league in 2008 at the 3rd quarter.:coffee:

Steely McSmash
06-08-2010, 11:22 AM
I think he's earned an extention but I do have some of the same concerns as Michael.

I felt that the team was kind of hot and cold under Cohwer and I wanted to see a more consistent intellectual versus emotional approach to the motivation. Tomlin's speaking and thinking follows along those lines. The results haven't been in-line with the rhetoric this last year. It may take some time to be able to scout and develop players that are motivated in that way.

I can speculate that he made some conservative moves by not benching some guys in the secondary but I of course have no idea if the replacements last year would have been an improvement.

He might want some more say over football operations in a new contract. He may not like the city. Who knows. I'd like to see another 3 years min.

fansince'76
06-08-2010, 11:29 AM
Anyone who thinks he doesn't deserve a contract is nuts. He won a Super Bowl his second season!

Doesn't matter to some because they claim he did it with "Cowher's players." Yet when "Cowher's players" get in hot water, that's his fault.

steelpride12
06-08-2010, 12:35 PM
Doesn't matter to some because they claim he did it with "Cowher's players." Yet when "Cowher's players" get in hot water, that's his fault.
Oh well the media will find anything to throw at him at this point until a deal is done. It doesn't matter with who or how he will always be known for winning AT LEAST 1 Super Bowl with the Steelers in only his second season.

Killer
06-08-2010, 12:40 PM
So if we're giving Tomlin the boot....would you rather have Cowher back or get Gruden?

ALLD
06-08-2010, 01:16 PM
Cowher is definitely a better coach, especially after the rest he's had.

Butch
06-08-2010, 04:01 PM
I still wonder how much of a factor the pending CBA expiration has to do with this? Unlike players coaches contracts are guaranteed during a work stoppage. This could simply be a matter of the Steelers looking for someone else in the league to set the precedent for some sort of two way contract wherin the coach gets paid but less than his contract demands in the case of a lockout? Or maybe they'll be the trailblazers in that regard? But in my opinion that's the probable source of the delay. They just don't want to be on the hook for 5-6 million dollars if no football gets played in 2011.

Good perspective and one I never really thought of. I think you may have hit the nail on the head after all we don't give up so quickly on coaches in Pittsburgh. I guess only time will tell.

On a side note man I hope they get the deal done I can not even fathom another season without football.

Chidi29
06-08-2010, 05:00 PM
I'm a bit curious as to what the hold up may be myself. The uncertainty of the CBA is a good point.

I've really liked what Tomlin has done here. In a way, what he did last year spoke volumes about how good of a coach he can be. Although overall, we didn't meet expectations, you don't go out on a three game winning streak, beating a couple good teams in the process, without keeping morale up and maintaining the players' trust. He did not lose this team. They still back and believe in him.

This is one of the few times where I'll pull out the "I'll trust what the FO is doing" card. None of us know much about the details of what Tomlin is'is not doing; we just don't have access to it. There are few stats you can use; there of course isn't any game tape you can watch. What Tomlin would be evaluated on is found during Monday through Saturdays as much as it is game day.

Prok
06-08-2010, 06:49 PM
So if we're giving Tomlin the boot....would you rather have Cowher back or get Gruden?

Hell i'd take Gruden in a heartbeat. I LOVE his aggressive demeanor on the field.

No way in hell we do not re-sign coach Tomlin though. C'mon, this is the Steelers we are talking about. Tomlin's our guy until he decides otherwise.

Prok
06-08-2010, 06:50 PM
I'm a bit curious as to what the hold up may be myself. The uncertainty of the CBA is a good point.

I've really liked what Tomlin has done here. In a way, what he did last year spoke volumes about how good of a coach he can be. Although overall, we didn't meet expectations, you don't go out on a three game winning streak, beating a couple good teams in the process, without keeping morale up and maintaining the players' trust. He did not lose this team. They still back and believe in him.

This is one of the few times where I'll pull out the "I'll trust what the FO is doing" card. None of us know much about the details of what Tomlin is'is not doing; we just don't have access to it. There are few stats you can use; there of course isn't any game tape you can watch. What Tomlin would be evaluated on is found during Monday through Saturdays as much as it is game day.

Excellent post, as usual Chidi. :)

Vincent
06-08-2010, 07:21 PM
I hope The Rooneys wait. I am not at all convinced . My observations are as follows: His critical side line calls are terrible , the team's second half performances are way below par suggesting he is getting outcoached at the point of "half time adjustments". His cliche based communications style is projecting no substance of real thought , I am still waiting for the Wrath of Hell, and when you go public and staate you are going to bench players back it up with action or run the risk of being considered a bullshiter (constent with cliches) his side line demeanor is at best a managment style I do not like and at worst he is lost, in short he does not seem involved in the game , Art Rooney going public with his stated goal "return to the run" is unusal for a Rooney to go on the record, his support for Bruce Arians is in my mind indicative of a guy that does not understand Steeler offensive football. Perhaps the players like him. They may like him for the wrong reasons.

I am not righteous in my opinion I want to be wrong because I want very much for Tomlin to succeed because the Steelers will benefit and that is what I am most focused on. The players are under pressure to perform so be it for Mike Tomlin. I am not interested in how Cowher and Noll were handled by the Rooney's. They proved themselves and Tomlin still has a chance to prove himself but I want to wait and see if he's got IT .

I'm inclined to agree with you here Michael.

Harris pointed out the Stitzer / Siefert factor. Both inherited a dynasty.

Siefert took a championship team to two more SBs and had them in the NFCCG in 5 of his 8 years as HC. Whether or not he was a great coach is arguable, and certainly his visit to Carolina is a blemish on an otherwise impressive resume.

Switzer is the linear comparison to this point and the similarities are telling. He inherited a reigning champion and repeated in his second year. He made the playoffs in 96, then stunk the place up in 97 and was dispatched.

Unlike Switzer, Tomlin didn't make the playoffs in his 3rd year. And IMHO (which I posted and banged heads back in the dark place) Tomlin handled the team very poorly last year. We heard a lot of "coach speak" and saw a deer in the headlights. We saw fixable problems go unfixed, and a champion melt down to bush league teams over a 5 game losing streak. He lost the team.

I don't think he deserves an extension at this point. I think it is gracious and reasonable of management to offer him the opportunity to return the team to championship form in 2010. Anything less and I would pass on the option year.

Vincent
06-08-2010, 07:25 PM
So if we're giving Tomlin the boot....would you rather have Cowher back or get Gruden?

If the choice were those two, definately William Laird Cowher. Gruden has found his calling in the booth where he's great.

You can make exactly the same case against Gruden in Tampa as has been made against MT here. Both inherited winners, won one, then tanked.

Butch
06-08-2010, 07:27 PM
I wouldn't call what he did last year remarkable by any stretch of the word. Losing to the lowly chefs, clowns, and the raiders was pretty untollerable if you ask me.

I agree that the reason we are not extending him is due to the uncertainty of the CBA. Tomlin is great when the team is healthy, but when things go awry he falters. Yes the players are the ones playing the game but the coach has a very integral part in the outcome of games. When the offense did not exploit the run against the clowns last year I was completely befuddled. In this case the right players were not on the field and that is the fault of both the o-coordinator and the head coach. Hell I don't even care if you pass the ball but at least give the appearance that you will run.

Just my 2 cents for whatever it is worth

SMR
06-08-2010, 07:28 PM
No, no, no! Resign the man! Tomlin is gooood!

pepsyman1
06-08-2010, 07:29 PM
I still wonder how much of a factor the pending CBA expiration has to do with this? Unlike players coaches contracts are guaranteed during a work stoppage. This could simply be a matter of the Steelers looking for someone else in the league to set the precedent for some sort of two way contract wherin the coach gets paid but less than his contract demands in the case of a lockout? Or maybe they'll be the trailblazers in that regard? But in my opinion that's the probable source of the delay. They just don't want to be on the hook for 5-6 million dollars if no football gets played in 2011.

That is certainly a thought, but it's something that every team will have to contend with regardless. It's not like they can go and gamble that there isn't going to be season and not have a coach in place. Either way you have to have a coach, you'll either be extending Tomlin or paying someone else. It's not like you can leave the spot vacant because you think there MIGHT not be a season.

In either case, I think they should extend him although I also have concerns. As others have stated, he didn't back up any of the declarations he made to the media near the end of the year, he didn't do anything to shake up a defense that although was missing two all-pro players managed to play fine for 3 quarters in almost all their games. Why NO adjustments at all in the 4th quarter? Many of us complain about the focus of Arians offense, but Tomlin is still the coach. He LET Arians keep calling passing plays in the high winds at Cleveland against a weak running offense while his QB was getting sacked every 4th pass attempt. I like Tomlin, I think he DOES have IT, but at this point I'm not sure that any of us can really put a finger on what his team is all about philosophically. He has described a type of football that he expects the Steelers to play, but they didn't reflect that description at all last season. I'm hopeful that this year will be different and we will get better idea of what Tomlin envisions his team to be. For good or bad we NEVER had to guess what Cowher's team or philosophy was all about.

Vincent
06-08-2010, 07:36 PM
That is certainly a thought, but it's something that every team will have to contend with regardless. It's not like they can go and gamble that there isn't going to be season and not have a coach in place. Either way you have to have a coach, you'll either be extending Tomlin or paying someone else. It's not like you can leave the spot vacant because you think there MIGHT not be a season.

In either case, I think they should extend him although I also have concerns. As others have stated, he didn't back up any of the declarations he made to the media near the end of the year, he didn't do anything to shake up a defense that although was missing two all-pro players managed to play fine for 3 quarters in almost all their games. Why NO adjustments at all in the 4th quarter? Many of us complain about the focus of Arians offense, but Tomlin is still the coach. He LET Arians keep calling passing plays in the high winds at Cleveland against a weak running offense while his QB was getting sacked every 4th pass attempt. I like Tomlin, I think he DOES have IT, but at this point I'm not sure that any of us can really put a finger on what his team is all about philosophically. He has described a type of football that he expects the Steelers to play, but they didn't reflect that description at all last season. I'm hopeful that this year will be different and we will get better idea of what Tomlin envisions his team to be. For good or bad we NEVER had to guess what Cowher's team or philosophy was all about.

This is why it isn't getting done, and why they haven't resigned him. He hasn't proven his worth. They have him locked up for two more seasons. Let him prove himself one way or the other this year.

Prok
06-08-2010, 08:28 PM
I guess we differ on what value coach Tomlin brings to the Steelers?

I think season's like last season happens to the best of 'em. Tomlin has alot of good traits as HC and i don't think the team is doubting that a bit.

If you're going to use that losing streak last year as an excuse then you may as well include the injuries to Troy and Aaron IMO. Losing 2 players of that calibur damn sure is hard to overcome. And i'm not excusing LeBeau or the fact that we let B-Mac get away either. But the team did win their last 3 and could have easily folded late but they kept on fighting and coach Tomlin made some gutsy decisions in the process.

Like that onside kick against the Packers, for instance. Even if we lose that game i applaud his bold decision to try to win a game the defense was intent on losing.

Tomlin is the classic example of a coach coaching to win rather than coaching not to lose IMO. And while both kinds of coaches can get good results, i believe Tomlin's style lends to us having more success in the big games. And surely we won't win 'em all. But our team does not let the big games overwhelm them and that is due in large part to coach Tomlin's style of coaching IMO.
No way we let him get away.

Vincent
06-08-2010, 08:42 PM
Two words. Barry Switzer. Until he proves otherwise.

fansince'76
06-08-2010, 08:49 PM
I don't think he deserves an extension at this point. I think it is gracious and reasonable of management to offer him the opportunity to return the team to championship form in 2010. Anything less and I would pass on the option year.

IOW, it's Lombardi #7 or a pink slip, huh?

HometownGal
06-08-2010, 09:15 PM
Anyone who thinks he doesn't deserve a contract is nuts. He won a Super Bowl his second season! He led this team to the playoffs the season before may I add and has proven he knows how to win games. I hope this comes sooner rather than later.

Exactly. I think the Tomlinator has more than proven that he has what it takes to be a winner and the fact that his players support him 100% speaks volumes on what a positive impact he has on them.

Get him signed long-term Art!

Vincent
06-08-2010, 09:28 PM
IOW, it's Lombardi #7 or a pink slip, huh?

If the team gels and plays for him and they win 11 and "show up" in the playoffs, I think he's probably OK. That's championship form. Anything can happen in the second season. 10 wins - on the bubble. 9 - toast.

That is my read of management. And I agree with them. If they extend him before camp , then I have read them wrong. We'll see.

steelpride12
06-08-2010, 09:31 PM
Exactly. I think the Tomlinator has more than proven that he has what it takes to be a winner and the fact that his players support him 100% speaks volumes on what a positive impact he has on them.

Get him signed long-term Art!
I can't believe anyone would say he doesn't deserve an extension of any sort. So what he had a bad season. So did Cowher and so did so many other coaches in the league. He leads them to the playoffs, and then wins a championship his second, that may be repetitive, but a point you can't argue.

X-Terminator
06-08-2010, 09:34 PM
Yep, welcome to the Washington Redskins. Because judging from the way some people are thinking, that's what they want us to become. Changing coaches the way people change their underwear.

I PRAY to God that Art II follows in the footsteps of his father and grandfather, and allows Tomlin to grow into the role of HC the way they did with Noll and Cowher. I DO NOT want to see this team changing head coaches every 3-4 years. As much as people love Cowher, he had plenty of faults himself, including missing the playoffs 3 straight seasons and 4 out of 6 after making the playoffs his first 6 seasons as head coach. It also took him 13 years to do what Tomlin did in 2, and some of you want Tomlin fired? Are you nuts?

steelpride12
06-08-2010, 09:39 PM
Yep, welcome to the Washington Redskins. Because judging from the way some people are thinking, that's what they want us to become. Changing coaches the way people change their underwear.

I PRAY to God that Art II follows in the footsteps of his father and grandfather, and allows Tomlin to grow into the role of HC the way they did with Noll and Cowher. I DO NOT want to see this team changing head coaches every 3-4 years. As much as people love Cowher, he had plenty of faults himself, including missing the playoffs 3 straight seasons and 4 out of 6 after making the playoffs his first 6 seasons as head coach. It also took him 13 years to do what Tomlin did in 2, and some of you want Tomlin fired? Are you nuts?
Yupp exactly. What coach hasn't had a bad or off season? I can't believe this is even a subject other than yes he deserves a new deal because he has don exactly what Art expects of him and I know a deal will be done. The Steelers have had obvious great success keep in trust a coach for many seasons, why change now?

cold-hard-steel
06-08-2010, 09:55 PM
If Tomlin isn't here for at least 10-15 years,then i will be surprised. We have never been a team to throw away coaches like they grow on trees. I think they will get it done. Tomlin doesn't seem to be that concerned about it,which tells me he puts the team first. To me that is a good thing. I believe Tomlin does know footaball,but is still learning as a headcoach. I think he will only get better,and to give up on him now would have meant we wasted time. That's something that is uncharactoristic of the Steelers.

BlastFurnace
06-09-2010, 09:05 AM
Yep, welcome to the Washington Redskins. Because judging from the way some people are thinking, that's what they want us to become. Changing coaches the way people change their underwear.

I PRAY to God that Art II follows in the footsteps of his father and grandfather, and allows Tomlin to grow into the role of HC the way they did with Noll and Cowher. I DO NOT want to see this team changing head coaches every 3-4 years. As much as people love Cowher, he had plenty of faults himself, including missing the playoffs 3 straight seasons and 4 out of 6 after making the playoffs his first 6 seasons as head coach. It also took him 13 years to do what Tomlin did in 2, and some of you want Tomlin fired? Are you nuts?

I couldn't agree more. Tomlin is a really good coach. The only thing I could seriously see getting in the way of an extension is if Mike wants a boatload of money.

The WH
06-09-2010, 10:03 AM
Dude lost alot of respect when he talked a big game (unleash hell in december) and immediately followed it up with nothing.

steel9guy
06-09-2010, 10:38 AM
The guy won the superbowl in his second season. Give him a deal. And I know everyone is gonna say it was Cowhers team but our secondary that year was better from Tomlin's coaching then it was of late under Cowher.

Psycho Ward 86
06-09-2010, 10:48 AM
Dude lost alot of respect when he talked a big game (unleash hell in december) and immediately followed it up with nothing.

Tomlin handled the pressure. The rest of the team just didn't. Can't dump all the blame on him. When a team as talented as this one goes on a 5 game losing streak, there needs to be a spark, and that's all Tomlin was trying to do. He had to do something.

The WH
06-09-2010, 11:34 AM
Tomlin handled the pressure. The rest of the team just didn't. Can't dump all the blame on him. When a team as talented as this one goes on a 5 game losing streak, there needs to be a spark, and that's all Tomlin was trying to do. He had to do something.
Shows how much salt his words carry with the team he is coaching.

Carolina Steelers
06-09-2010, 11:57 AM
the 5 game losing streak did suck but they did win their last 3 gms to give them a shot at playoffs a small shot but at least gave us something to hold on to for the rest of season. This will be a big season for Tomiln. I like the way he carries himself and being so young he could be here for another 10 yrs.

Butch
06-09-2010, 01:22 PM
Tomlin handled the pressure. The rest of the team just didn't. Can't dump all the blame on him. When a team as talented as this one goes on a 5 game losing streak, there needs to be a spark, and that's all Tomlin was trying to do. He had to do something.

How did Tomlin handle the pressure? You are right can't dump all the blame on him, but it would be a lot easier to defend him if he would have benched someone other than Mendenhaul, or if he implemented some changes in the play calling. I don't see how you can say he was a spark last year, he may have tried through his words but his follow through was weak at best.

I am all for giving Tomlin his just dues for winning a Superbowl early on, but I really hope last season was a fluke not the norm. I hope Tomlin gets to face some adversity and shows us how good of a coach he can be. At least we are talking Steeler football again.

Prok
06-09-2010, 02:44 PM
Dude lost alot of respect when he talked a big game (unleash hell in december) and immediately followed it up with nothing.

I dunno how anyone can hold that "unleash hell" thing against Tomlin. it's not like the team just got blown out or anything. They were in every single game until the end. They had a legit shot at winning even the 2nd clowns game IMO. Every coach and every team is gonna have adversity at times. The man is a stand-up kinda guy and gives his best every single game. And the team play's their heart out for him IMO.

steelpride12
06-09-2010, 02:51 PM
Dude lost alot of respect when he talked a big game (unleash hell in december) and immediately followed it up with nothing.
Lost respect for what. Keeping the team in all those games during December. They make one big play and they win those games and he is a hero. So in no way does his actions or words of last season have anything to do with whether he will re-sign or not.

Psycho Ward 86
06-09-2010, 03:22 PM
How did Tomlin handle the pressure?

You just answered your own question

I don't see how you can say he was a spark last year, he may have tried through his words but his follow through was weak at best.

Follow through? Tomlin can't do anything about that. It's the job of the rest of the team to follow through on what he expects out of the team.


I think this will be the true year that defines what Tomlin is made of. He's been through this rough patch before in '07 when we lost 3 of the last 4 games i believe it was? He followed it up with a Superbowl win. Let's see what he does this time.

Butch
06-09-2010, 04:44 PM
Originally Posted by BigBen'sSwagger
How did Tomlin handle the pressure?

You just answered your own question

I don't see how you can say he was a spark last year, he may have tried through his words but his follow through was weak at best.

Follow through? Tomlin can't do anything about that. It's the job of the rest of the team to follow through on what he expects out of the team.
Sure he can he benches guys like he did with Mendenhaul that is a follow through. He is a head coach and as such it is up to him to put the players in a winning situation not over think the situation. We pass against the lowly browns when they are suseptable to the run. Hell we don't even put in a running back to at least make them think we might run. Results Ben gets sacked and we go on to lose the game. Mike didn't make the call B.A. did but Mike is the one who could have and probably should have over riddin the call. Put your players in a winning situation.

Prok
06-09-2010, 05:05 PM
Another point on the 2nd clowns game: And please note that i am not an Arians fan, by any stretch. But that first match-up with them Ben torched their secondary for well over 400 yards IIRC. I mean, their secondary couldn't cover our recievers at all. So i can kinda see why BA went in the 2nd match with a heavy pass ratio. The blame wasn't in the passing game so much IMO as it was play-calling and execution. Ben did take alot of sacks that he usually avoids that day IIRC.

Psycho Ward 86
06-09-2010, 05:08 PM
Sure he can he benches guys like he did with Mendenhaul that is a follow through. He is a head coach and as such it is up to him to put the players in a winning situation not over think the situation. We pass against the lowly browns when they are suseptable to the run. Hell we don't even put in a running back to at least make them think we might run. Results Ben gets sacked and we go on to lose the game. Mike didn't make the call B.A. did but Mike is the one who could have and probably should have over riddin the call. Put your players in a winning situation.

Well he benched Rashard and Gay which both turned out to be brilliant moves. Hey, i'll agree with any derogatory bruce arians related comment, cant quarrel on that subject :bored:

Prok
06-09-2010, 05:13 PM
Well he benched Rashard and Gay which both turned out to be brilliant moves. Hey, i'll agree with any derogatory bruce arians related comment, cant quarrel on that subject :bored:

LMAO.

I have to bite my tongue every time i come close to defending ole' BA. LOL

Butch
06-09-2010, 05:29 PM
Another point on the 2nd clowns game: And please note that i am not an Arians fan, by any stretch. But that first match-up with them Ben torched their secondary for well over 400 yards IIRC. I mean, their secondary couldn't cover our recievers at all. So i can kinda see why BA went in the 2nd match with a heavy pass ratio. The blame wasn't in the passing game so much IMO as it was play-calling and execution. Ben did take alot of sacks that he usually avoids that day IIRC.

Fair enough but do you by any chance remember what the winds were like in both games?

Prok
06-09-2010, 05:36 PM
Fair enough but do you by any chance remember what the winds were like in both games?

Oh yeah it was very windy that 2nd meeting. Like I said, it's hard for me to defend Arians in any way. lol

But still, if we get some better execution and actually put a TD on the board in the first half we'd have won imo. I don't even think our D woulda choked against Brady freaking Quinn, of all people.
I think Tomlin puts alot of trust in LeBeau and BA. But he's a good HC and we'll be fine with him.

Butch
06-09-2010, 07:38 PM
For me the jury is still out on Tomlin. I don't know about you but I was sorely disappointed when B.A. didn't get canned this off season. I just knew he was on his way out and that was going to be the one good thing I was gonna hang my hat on about this past season. Boy was I in for a let down. :jaw:

Now that isn't all on Tomlin but I would highly doubt that B.A. would still be here if it wasn't for Mike throwing his support behind him I also think if Tomlin was adamantly wanting him gone he would be gone. That all being said if the offense fails yes it will be B.A.'s fault but as Head coach a good chunk will fall on Mike as well.

Chidi29
06-09-2010, 07:50 PM
Fair enough but do you by any chance remember what the winds were like in both games?

This argument is actually fairly week. The winds would have the biggest chance to effect the ball on deep passes. An attempted in route on 3rd and 2 (Like was the route on the first sack of the game) isn't going to have any effect. And if the wind is at your back, it's really not much of an issue.

According to ESPN's definition of the word "deep", we got a first down half the time (4 of 8) on such passes. Three were completed passes, one was due to a penalty. 50% isn't that shabby. Curious as to what the seasonal average would be.

Link: http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playbyplay?gameId=291210005&period=0

And let's not act like the running game was going well either. Mendenhall averaged 3.3 YPC. And if you recall, he couldn't convert a 3rd and 1 when we tried running it after being sacked twice out of the empty set on 3rd and short.

It was a bad game all around. No doubt. Not trying to sugarcoat it at all. But let's not act like there was some sort of route to take that was staring Arians in the face all along that he just missed. An unacceptable, but a really bad game for all parties sporting black and gold.

Butch
06-09-2010, 08:04 PM
3.3 yard average and was only given a single chance to prove himself. Also as I had said before why go empty set??? Even if you pass why not try putting some doubt in their minds that you may just run??? Hell if nothing else it gives you an extra blocker maybe just maybe he picks up the blitz. Seems to me that Tomlin is harder on Mendy than any other player on the team and for the life of me I just can't figure that out.

Who knows maybe they were overly enamored with Ben after his heroics in the Superbowl. Oh well let's just hope that this year is as good as last year was bad. Can't we just start the season already!!!

Chidi29
06-09-2010, 08:17 PM
3.3 yard average and was only given a single chance to prove himself. Also as I had said before why go empty set??? Even if you pass why not try putting some doubt in their minds that you may just run??? Hell if nothing else it gives you an extra blocker maybe just maybe he picks up the blitz. Seems to me that Tomlin is harder on Mendy than any other player on the team and for the life of me I just can't figure that out.

Who knows maybe they were overly enamored with Ben after his heroics in the Superbowl. Oh well let's just hope that this year is as good as last year was bad. Can't we just start the season already!!!

A "single chance"? What do you base that on?

If teams were to do their homework, they'd know we rarely run out of the shotgun. They'd be playing pass first anyway.

The sacks from empty set were from either good coverage or miscommunication on the line. The first came when Elam got inside posiiton on Heath, who was running a three yard in route. That play isn't designed to have a blocker. It doesn't need one.

The second came when Hartwig snapped the ball before Ben was ready. I don't know if an extra blocker helps with that or not, as the whole team was a step slow off the snap. Especially against a CB blitz.

Prok
06-09-2010, 08:24 PM
3.3 yard average and was only given a single chance to prove himself. Also as I had said before why go empty set??? Even if you pass why not try putting some doubt in their minds that you may just run??? Hell if nothing else it gives you an extra blocker maybe just maybe he picks up the blitz. Seems to me that Tomlin is harder on Mendy than any other player on the team and for the life of me I just can't figure that out.

Who knows maybe they were overly enamored with Ben after his heroics in the Superbowl. Oh well let's just hope that this year is as good as last year was bad. Can't we just start the season already!!!

When we go empty set i don't think BA's concerned about forcing the D to guess run or pass. He's trying to find a match-up advantage or a simple defensive error causing a guy to be wide open with so many recievers lined up. Again, i don't like defending BA but that's not as bad a game-plan as some folks think.

We have the franchise QB that can run an aggressive offense like that. I get that part of BA's scheme and don't have that much problem with it.

My problem with BA has been some play calling though and especially in the red zone.

Prok
06-09-2010, 08:27 PM
And i find it funny how this thread morphed into a BA thread. lol

But hey, at least we're having good, civil discussion so i'm cool with that.

steelpride12
06-09-2010, 08:29 PM
And i find it funny how this thread morphed into a BA thread. lol

But hey, at least we're having good, civil discussion so i'm cool with that.
Yes mods please change this to a Bash B.A. Thread. :sarcasm:

Killer
06-09-2010, 09:46 PM
Getting back on track




So if we're giving Tomlin the boot....would you rather have Cowher back or get Gruden?


Hell i'd take Gruden in a heartbeat. I LOVE his aggressive demeanor on the field.


Everybody loves chukky - - and with Ben he has a QB....it could work


Time for some Tomlin quotes

http://www.donnan.com/Mike-Tomlin.htm

"That is the only guaranteed ticket to this dance that we're not participating in. If you want a team to be championship caliber, it starts with division dominance."
Referring to the Steelers 2-4 division record in 2009

"Big men on blades of grass... the most violent team is going to win."
Comments before the first 2009 regular season game vs the Titans

"We're going to guard against feelings of entitlement. We're simply going to be blue collar humble and start a process of building our football team."
Coach Tomlin looking ahead to the 2009 season

"Good to win one for our fans. Got the greatest fans in the world. Good performance for them, get them something to be excited about here at Heinz Field. Today I'm just as excited about that as getting that 5-week monkey off our back."
Following a last second 37-36 win over the Packers while breaking a 5 game losing streak


"We're going to be a humble group. We're going to be a grounded group. We're going to be a selfless group."
Part of Mike Tomlin's preparation philosophy for Super Bowl XLIII

"Hungry is a word that I've been analyzing here of late. It's not hunger that drives me, it's not hunger that needs to drive our football team. Hunger and thirst are things that can be quenched. We have to be a driven group, we have to seek greatness."
Preparing for the 2009 season

"Be where you're at."
Coach Tomlin as defensive backs coach