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HometownGal
12-06-2010, 11:16 AM
Watch the video and judge for yourselves. Not only do I feel McClain deserved a 15 yarder on that helmet-to-helmet cheap shot, I feel he deserves a big fat FINE. You can clearly hear on the audio portion of the video that both Michaels and Collinsworth are absolutely horrified that no flag was thrown. What say you Steeler Nation?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJK5xVei-i0

Heath Miller Hit Should Have Drawn Penalty, NFL Admits
By FanHouse Staff

The vicious hit Pittsburgh tight end Heath Miller took from Baltimore's Jameel McClain during Sunday night's Steelers win should have been penalized, the NFL's head of officiating, Carl Johnson, told NBC shortly after the play occurred.

Miller suffered a concussion when McClain delivered a high blow as Miller attempted to haul in a Ben Roethlisberger pass. As McClain hit Miller, the Steelers star's neck appeared to snap back and he immediately fell motionless to the turf. Trainers rushed to Miller's side and immobilized his head and neck.

Fortunately, after several minutes, Miller was able to walk with minimal help back to the Pittsburgh sideline. But the delay in the game allowed NBC announcers Al Michaels and particularly ex-NFL wide receiver Cris Collinsworth to wonder aloud why McClain was not flagged for a penalty on the play.


Read more: http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2010/12/06/heath-miller-hit-should-have-drawn-penalty-nfl-admits/

fansince'76
12-06-2010, 11:18 AM
Not holding my breath for a fine....

Merchant
12-06-2010, 11:27 AM
There's the understatement of the year.

Burghfan58
12-06-2010, 11:32 AM
If there is no fine on the McClain hit to Miller, Kim Jong Goodell, and his henchmen will look foolish. It will be just one more reason for the players to hold out for revisions to this unfair and inconsistent fining system.

LLT
12-06-2010, 11:32 AM
The head of officiating admitting they botched the call after the game....is the equivelent of the chief surgeon at a hospital admitting that one of his doctors made a mistake....after the patients funeral.


Thanks for nothing.

zulater
12-06-2010, 11:36 AM
So what about the Haloti Ngata hit on Ben, NFL got anything to say about that? Because I tell you what if that isn't getting a flag or fine I'm telling Harrison to make that your new move. Just go club the qb in the facemask full force a couple times a game.

By the way anyone notice that piece of shit Harbaugh's interview before the game? Basically he more or less says the current enforcment of "devastating hits" is correct and that any team struggling with the policy has only themselves to blame, and pretty much says his team is above that sort of thing. Asswipe, what do you have to say now?

Devilsdancefloor
12-06-2010, 11:38 AM
better be 75k fine on the way down from the kommish office, but i am not holding my breath

HometownGal
12-06-2010, 11:54 AM
I'm not holding my breath, either, but if Goodumbell and his cronies don't levy a fine on McClain and quite possibly that fat beefalo Ngata for his deliberate punch to Ben's nose, they are going to look even more foolish in the eyes of the owners, some of who will be gunning for them in the offseason.

HollywoodSteel
12-06-2010, 12:02 PM
So what about the Haloti Ngata hit on Ben, NFL got anything to say about that? Because I tell you what if that isn't getting a flag or fine I'm telling Harrison to make that your new move. Just go club the qb in the facemask full force a couple times a game.

By the way anyone notice that piece of shit Harbaugh's interview before the game? Basically he more or less says the current enforcment of "devastating hits" is correct and that any team struggling with the policy has only themselves to blame, and pretty much says his team is above that sort of thing. Asswipe, what do you have to say now?

There were three missed personal fouls calls on the Ravens by my count. Nose strike on Ben, helmet to helmet on Heath, and Suggs grabbing the bottom of Bens' helmet during Ben's great escape.

To be consistent, they should fine the helmet to helmet, but I doubt the nose strike will be fined. It was an unfortunate location, but I don't see it as flagrant or an intentional punch. However, if it were James we all know they'd cut his hand off for it.:chuckle:

st33lersguy
12-06-2010, 12:12 PM
better be 75k fine on the way down from the kommish office, but i am not holding my breath

Adolf Goodell and the Nazi Football League will not give him a fine because he hit a steeler player

zulater
12-06-2010, 12:13 PM
There were three missed personal fouls calls on the Ravens by my count. Nose strike on Ben, helmet to helmet on Heath, and Suggs grabbing the bottom of Bens' helmet during Ben's great escape.

To be consistent, they should fine the helmet to helmet, but I doubt the nose strike will be fined. It was an unfortunate location, but I don't see it as flagrant or an intentional punch. However, if it were James we all know they'd cut his hand off for it.:chuckle:

Actually according to Tunch and Ron Cook there was one more roughing the passer call against Ben that should have been called and was missed not only by the officials, but by the NBC crew as well. Roethlisberger also thought he was roughed up when Ravens safety Dawan Landry hit him late after a pass in the second quarter. He got up and looked to McAulay for a flag before gesturing angrily at him. Asked if he was surprised there were no personal-foul penalties called on the Ravens, Roethlisberger shrugged and said, "No

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10340/1108685-87.stm

SCSTILLER
12-06-2010, 12:34 PM
Adolf Goodell and the Nazi Football League will not give him a fine because he hit a steeler player

When a Steeler gets injured, Goodell laughs!

zulater
12-06-2010, 12:39 PM
When a Steeler gets injured, Goodell laughs!

He probably thinks an angel gets wings when a Steeler goes down. :lol:

The WH
12-06-2010, 12:41 PM
everytime a steeler gets injured goodell feels like he drank a redbull.

Zu.....we posted that at the same time....weeiiirrd

Steeldude
12-06-2010, 01:35 PM
BR received a two separate hits to the head by two by suggs and ngata.

will roger "limp" noodell do anything about it? no.

Akagi
12-06-2010, 01:44 PM
Tell you what... according to the rules as they are now interpreted, sure, there should have been a flag on either the hit on Miller, or Roethlisberger's broken nose. But I defy you to tell me either hit was intentional, or how either player could have avoided the hit (I didn't see the Landry hit). McClain's hit was almost the exact same as Harrison's hit earlier this year; if Miller stays high, there's no concussion. I agree with what Harrison said in the post game interview on NBC: "First, I don't think that play should be penalized. But if it was me, 9 times out of 10 it would be flagged." (I would say 10 of 10, but whatever.)

It's all "safety theater". The NFL wants it to look like they're cracking down, but the players themselves have said they're just going to play the game and let the fines fall as they may. If the NFL really wanted to make the game safer, they would mandate safer equipment, not fine guys after the fact.

SteelerFanInStl
12-06-2010, 03:06 PM
By the way anyone notice that piece of shit Harbaugh's interview before the game? Basically he more or less says the current enforcment of "devastating hits" is correct and that any team struggling with the policy has only themselves to blame, and pretty much says his team is above that sort of thing. Asswipe, what do you have to say now?

That interview was laughable. Harbaugh said that his team "gets it" and that the other teams needed to change. :lol: Yea, right. As we saw last night, and as I've seen during other Ravens games, the Ravens are committing the same penalties as the Steelers, they're just not getting flags thrown on them for some unknown reason.

zulater
12-06-2010, 03:08 PM
That interview was laughable. Harbaugh said that his team "gets it" and that the other teams needed to change. :lol: Yea, right. As we saw last night, and as I've seen during other Ravens games, the Ravens are committing the same penalties as the Steelers, they're just not getting flags thrown on them for some unknown reason.



Thanks, I couldn't remember the exact quotes.

HometownGal
12-06-2010, 03:12 PM
Tell you what... according to the rules as they are now interpreted, sure, there should have been a flag on either the hit on Miller, or Roethlisberger's broken nose. But I defy you to tell me either hit was intentional, or how either player could have avoided the hit (I didn't see the Landry hit). McClain's hit was almost the exact same as Harrison's hit earlier this year; if Miller stays high, there's no concussion. I agree with what Harrison said in the post game interview on NBC: "First, I don't think that play should be penalized. But if it was me, 9 times out of 10 it would be flagged." (I would say 10 of 10, but whatever.)

It's all "safety theater". The NFL wants it to look like they're cracking down, but the players themselves have said they're just going to play the game and let the fines fall as they may. If the NFL really wanted to make the game safer, they would mandate safer equipment, not fine guys after the fact.

The whole thing boils down to consistency. If the NFL is going to issue strict edicts, every player on every team should be subject to those mandates. If that hit on Heath was the same as Harrison's earlier in the season and Harrison was fined - McClain should be fined as well.

beSteelmyheart
12-06-2010, 03:27 PM
I was so upset with that whole situation that I had tears in my eyes. The refs & the league have made their preferences so blatantly obvious that it has become unethical & it disgusts me. My only hope is that after seeing this with his own 2 eyes, D.Rooney will step up & have something to say about it.
But they still won, so take that, you Ratbird peices of sh*t.

HometownGal
12-06-2010, 03:32 PM
Just heard on KDKA Sports that the NFL has announced McClain WILL BE FINED for his brutal hit on Heath last night. More details when they are available.

solardave
12-06-2010, 03:35 PM
I'm not holding my breath, either, but if Goodumbell and his cronies don't levy a fine on McClain and quite possibly that fat beefalo Ngata for his deliberate punch to Ben's nose, they are going to look even more foolish in the eyes of the owners, some of who will be gunning for them in the offseason.

You're right and I think Dan and Art Rooney will be up in arms if something isn't done. I say 75k each and slap Harbaugh just because he's an asshole.

Merchant
12-06-2010, 03:35 PM
Just heard on KDKA Sports that the NFL has announced McClain WILL BE FINED for his brutal hit on Heath last night. More details when they are available.

Nice to see us get one in our favor I guess.

7SteelGal43
12-06-2010, 03:45 PM
The head of officiating admitting they botched the call after the game....is the equivelent of the chief surgeon at a hospital admitting that one of his doctors made a mistake....after the patients funeral.


Thanks for nothing.


^this

Count Steeler
12-06-2010, 03:52 PM
We will be lucky to see $12,500 for the hit. First time offender? The hit, in the interest of player safety and if Goodell is serious about sending the players a message and not just picking on the Steelers, deserves a fine of $100,000 and a 2 game suspension, to be extended as long as Miller is out. THAT IS IF, Goodell is serious.

And Ngata should be tagged as well.

Galax Steeler
12-06-2010, 03:54 PM
He will deserve every penny they fine him this is the first of several that should have been fined.

Akagi
12-06-2010, 03:57 PM
The whole thing boils down to consistency. If the NFL is going to issue strict edicts, every player on every team should be subject to those mandates. If that hit on Heath was the same as Harrison's earlier in the season and Harrison was fined - McClain should be fined as well.

I agree, completely. I think that's part of why the players have given up trying to figure out in the heat of battle what to do, and are simply going to let it play out. Hey, maybe you can take out a guy (Miller) or hurt a guy enough to impair his effectiveness (Roethlisberger, didn't happen), without getting the flag; might as well take the shot and see what happens. Everyone is clueless, from the players to the refs to Goodell himself, who can only say what is and isn't legal after the fact and after watching the tape.

zulater
12-06-2010, 04:10 PM
We will be lucky to see $12,500 for the hit. First time offender? The hit, in the interest of player safety and if Goodell is serious about sending the players a message and not just picking on the Steelers, deserves a fine of $100,000 and a 2 game suspension, to be extended as long as Miller is out. THAT IS IF, Goodell is serious.

And Ngata should be tagged as well.

If not then I think we should have our defensive players slap opposing qb's in the chops whenever possible. Make it our new S.O.P. if it's legal.

cakmakli
12-06-2010, 04:11 PM
He will deserve every penny they fine him this is the first of several that should have been fined.

I agree. I won't lose any sleep if they take all of his Christmas money.

fansince'76
12-06-2010, 04:16 PM
Just heard on KDKA Sports that the NFL has announced McClain WILL BE FINED for his brutal hit on Heath last night. More details when they are available.

Glad to hear it - I had my doubts.

smokin3000gt
12-06-2010, 04:54 PM
I say a fine is all well and good but where the hell was the 15 yd penalty? The fine doesn't affect the game one ioda. The only thing that happened was we lost a great TE for the rest of the game. I think he will get a 25k fine.

stillers4me
12-06-2010, 06:00 PM
http://a0.twimg.com/profile_images/657785492/alex__mcfadden_normal.jpg
mortreport (http://twitter.com/#!/mortreport) Chris Mortensen



Filed to espn: mcclain fined $40g & Ngata 15g

BPS3akaWirels3
12-06-2010, 06:01 PM
I do not have a link yet but news is McClain is going to get $40,000 fine and Ngata will get $15,000 on Big Ben... I will post more..

stillers4me
12-06-2010, 06:01 PM
gregaiello (http://twitter.com/#!/gregaiello) Greg Aiello RT by AdamSchefter



Now confirming fines of $40K for Jameel McClain & $15K for Haloti Ngata of Ravens for illegal blows to head of defenseless players vs Pitt.

stillers4me
12-06-2010, 06:03 PM
RyanClark25 (http://twitter.com/#!/RyanClark25) Ryan Clark



Fines for the Balt more game but where were the flags. The flags hurt more than the fines. Why error on the side of caution on us

Chidi29
12-06-2010, 06:04 PM
Fines seem just to me.

kmsteelerwr15
12-06-2010, 06:11 PM
I think those fines seem about right

Merchant
12-06-2010, 06:12 PM
TWO fines? Wow, the tables are turning..

steelpride12
12-06-2010, 06:12 PM
That's a pretty good fine for both of them and pretty happy to see the league do something for once.

zulater
12-06-2010, 06:13 PM
gregaiello (http://twitter.com/#!/gregaiello) Greg Aiello RT by AdamSchefter



Now confirming fines of $40K for Jameel McClain & $15K for Haloti Ngata of Ravens for illegal blows to head of defenseless players vs Pitt.

Good.

fansince'76
12-06-2010, 06:16 PM
Well, I think almost all of the recent fines are pretty much complete bullshit, but considering the current environment, these seem about right.

tube517
12-06-2010, 06:18 PM
:applaudit:


http://a0.twimg.com/profile_images/657785492/alex__mcfadden_normal.jpg
mortreport (http://twitter.com/#!/mortreport) Chris Mortensen



Filed to espn: mcclain fined $40g & Ngata 15g

Count Steeler
12-06-2010, 06:19 PM
Sorry, can't agree with the fine to McClain. Should at least match the fine on Harrison for the hit on Massaquoi and I think it should have been the first suspension of the season. There was clear intent to injure. Miller will probably miss next week's game, so should he.

stillers4me
12-06-2010, 06:20 PM
Fines...good start. But what about the 30 yards of field and the 2 first downs we were cheated out of?? When is the Nfl going to acknowledge that the refs are gretting worse...not better every year??

On a side note...did anyone see Harbaugh's interview before the game where he insinuated that Tomlin and the Steelers don't get how easy it is to follow the rules and that his guys have no problems with them??

Karma's a bitch, asshole.

GutterflowerSteel
12-06-2010, 06:21 PM
http://a0.twimg.com/profile_images/657785492/alex__mcfadden_normal.jpg
mortreport (http://twitter.com/#!/mortreport) Chris Mortensen



Filed to espn: mcclain fined $40g & Ngata 15g

That's all?! Ngata's should have been at least $25K! Oh, well ... at least they did something. And Harbaugh should be bitchslapped for running his mouth. I heard him on the local news today - wah wah wah :Cry: That just makes my heart sing :sofunny: He's a silly little peckerwood :sofunny:

tube517
12-06-2010, 06:24 PM
Yeah "his guys" have no problem?? Wasn't he (a coach) fined earlier this year for getting physical with the ref ??


Fines...good start. But what about the 30 yards of field and the 2 first downs we were cheated out of?? When is the Nfl going to acknowledge that the refs are gretting worse...not better every year??

On a side note...did anyone see Harbaugh's interview before the game where he insinuated that Tomlin and the Steelers don't get how easy it is to follow the rules and that his guys have no problems with them??

Karma's a bitch, asshole.

Count Steeler
12-06-2010, 06:28 PM
I think the refs should start getting fined for missing calls. Especially that idiot Corrente that reffed the Oakland game.

If the logic is to change players patterns and bring player safety to the forefront, how about applying the same logic to the refs? You miss calls that are obvious penalties, you don't get paid for the week.

43Hitman
12-06-2010, 06:29 PM
That's all?! Ngata's should have been at least $25K! Oh, well ... at least they did something. And Harbaugh should be bitchslapped for running his mouth. I heard him on the local news today - wah wah wah :Cry: That just makes my heart sing :sofunny: He's a silly little peckerwood :sofunny:


:sofunny: :sofunny: :sofunny:

zulater
12-06-2010, 06:33 PM
Fines...good start. But what about the 30 yards of field and the 2 first downs we were cheated out of?? When is the Nfl going to acknowledge that the refs are gretting worse...not better every year??

On a side note...did anyone see Harbaugh's interview before the game where he insinuated that Tomlin and the Steelers don't get how easy it is to follow the rules and that his guys have no problems with them??

.

Karma's a bitch, asshole.

Yeah I saw it, without mentioning them by name, he pretty much said the Steelers problems were of their own doing, and more or less implied that they were the only team that was having difficulty following the rules. He comes out looking like a jack ass now doesn't he.

zulater
12-06-2010, 06:39 PM
I think the refs should start getting fined for missing calls. Especially that idiot Corrente that reffed the Oakland game.

If the logic is to change players patterns and bring player safety to the forefront, how about applying the same logic to the refs? You miss calls that are obvious penalties, you don't get paid for the week.

In all honesty, even though it hurt us last night, I'll take the non call over the phantom call every day of the week.

And outside of the two non call's there, I thought overall the officiating was pretty good last night. Certainly much better than what we witnessed the two games prior.

I loved the fact that they actually called Oher on his false starts this game. Remember last game where Oher got away with those, and had they been called as they should have been, the Ravens would have lost significant plays, and the resulting penalty yards as well.

pepsyman1
12-06-2010, 06:39 PM
I think last night's non-call's and fines immediately today might actually work in our favor going forward. The pregame show made a fairly big story about the Steelers and their belief that they were being targeted and not getting even treatment from the refs, followed by quotes from Ray Anderson saying we "misguided" in believing that, then the game happens and we get HOSED by the refs in front of a national audience. The league knew they were under the spotlight and was forced today to cover there ass with the fines. How many other fines have you seen levied on the Monday following? Maybe with the extra scrutiny that this game with the Ravens brought, we might get a little less brutal treatment from the refs moving forward. The league covered THEIR OWN asses, the REFS now have to cover theirs.

SMR
12-06-2010, 06:42 PM
I think the refs should start getting fined for missing calls. Especially that idiot Corrente that reffed the Oakland game.

If the logic is to change players patterns and bring player safety to the forefront, how about applying the same logic to the refs? You miss calls that are obvious penalties, you don't get paid for the week.

BEST POST OF THIS THREAD!!!!

:tt03::tt03::tt03::tt03::tt03::tt03::tt03::tt03::t t03::tt03::tt03:

SteelerFanInStl
12-06-2010, 06:43 PM
They sure jumped on that quick! Where's the official statement that all 3 of those should have been personal fouls? The officials need to be fined big time for missing those calls.

BigNastyDefense
12-06-2010, 06:59 PM
They will probably appeal their fines, and using the arguments that they hurt Steelers players, the fines will be reduced to about $5k.

Honestly, I don't give a damn about the fines. Those come after-the-fact and have no bearing on the game that was played. What I want is consistency in the calling of fouls. If a helmet-to-helmet hit is a 15-yard personal foul, then call is every fucking time. If hitting a QB in the head/helmet/neck area is roughing the passer, then call it every fucking time.

If any of the missed calls on Ben happen to Brady or Manning, the fouls are called if not immediately, then when the QB whines to the ref.

Yes, I know Ben is tough and rugged. I know he isn't easy to be brought down and a sprained/broken foot and broken nose would cause Manning or Brady to miss parts of or whole games but Ben plays through it. However, the edict from the NFL front office and the competition committee is to protect the quarterback.......and DAMNIT, Ben Roethlisberger is a quarterback, so fucking protect him like you would the others!

What if we lost the game? The NFL cannot go back and assess the penalties afterward. We punted after the missed RTP call on Ben's broken nose....maybe if we get that call we go down the field and score. We punted after they didn't throw a flag on the Heath Miller hit, maybe we go down the field and score if we get the flag.

If the refs cannot do the job correctly, then get some people in that will.

stillers4me
12-06-2010, 07:01 PM
They will probably appeal their fines, and using the arguments that they hurt Steelers players, the fines will be reduced to about $5k.

Honestly, I don't give a damn about the fines. Those come after-the-fact and have no bearing on the game that was played. What I want is consistency in the calling of fouls. If a helmet-to-helmet hit is a 15-yard personal foul, then call is every fucking time. If hitting a QB in the head/helmet/neck area is roughing the passer, then call it every fucking time.

If any of the missed calls on Ben happen to Brady or Manning, the fouls are called if not immediately, then when the QB whines to the ref.

Yes, I know Ben is tough and rugged. I know he isn't easy to be brought down and a sprained/broken foot and broken nose would cause Manning or Brady to miss parts of or whole games but Ben plays through it. However, the edict from the NFL front office and the competition committee is to protect the quarterback.......and DAMNIT, Ben Roethlisberger is a quarterback, so fucking protect him like you would the others!

What if we lost the game? The NFL cannot go back and assess the penalties afterward. We punted after the missed RTP call on Ben's broken nose....maybe if we get that call we go down the field and score. We punted after they didn't throw a flag on the Heath Miller hit, maybe we go down the field and score if we get the flag.

If the refs cannot do the job correctly, then get some people in that will.

^^^^^^^Post of the week!

SMR
12-06-2010, 07:06 PM
They will probably appeal their fines, and using the arguments that they hurt Steelers players, the fines will be reduced to about $5k.

Honestly, I don't give a damn about the fines. Those come after-the-fact and have no bearing on the game that was played. What I want is consistency in the calling of fouls. If a helmet-to-helmet hit is a 15-yard personal foul, then call is every fucking time. If hitting a QB in the head/helmet/neck area is roughing the passer, then call it every fucking time.

If any of the missed calls on Ben happen to Brady or Manning, the fouls are called if not immediately, then when the QB whines to the ref.

Yes, I know Ben is tough and rugged. I know he isn't easy to be brought down and a sprained/broken foot and broken nose would cause Manning or Brady to miss parts of or whole games but Ben plays through it. However, the edict from the NFL front office and the competition committee is to protect the quarterback.......and DAMNIT, Ben Roethlisberger is a quarterback, so fucking protect him like you would the others!

What if we lost the game? The NFL cannot go back and assess the penalties afterward. We punted after the missed RTP call on Ben's broken nose....maybe if we get that call we go down the field and score. We punted after they didn't throw a flag on the Heath Miller hit, maybe we go down the field and score if we get the flag.

If the refs cannot do the job correctly, then get some people in that will.

Beautiful. That is a post that can make even grown men cry.

Bravo sir! :D

steelreserve
12-06-2010, 07:13 PM
In all honesty, even though it hurt us last night, I'll take the non call over the phantom call every day of the week.

^^ This. I don't support any fines at all under the "new rules," whether they're for hits against our guys or anyone else. To be glad that someone is getting fined, even your opponent, is passively buying into the pussification of the game.

However, I do think the Miller hit was such a dangerous play that they probably would've fined it even under the old rules. I'm just glad he's going to be OK.

The "blow to the head" by Ngata? I think that one's horseshit. In the game of FOOTBALL, sometimes the QB is going to get accidentally bonked in the head with a stray arm and there's nothing anyone can do about it. Even though it happened to the other team this time, it sucks that people are getting fined for something that basically happens randomly a couple times a game and nobody has any control over it.

Yes, I get that everyone wants consistency -- "If they're handing out bullshit fines to us, they'd better apply the same rules to everyone" -- but I still think that's far outweighed by the sheer amount that it sucks for the game of football.

hotrodder07
12-06-2010, 07:17 PM
Fines...good start. But what about the 30 yards of field and the 2 first downs we were cheated out of?? When is the Nfl going to acknowledge that the refs are gretting worse...not better every year??

On a side note...did anyone see Harbaugh's interview before the game where he insinuated that Tomlin and the Steelers don't get how easy it is to follow the rules and that his guys have no problems with them??

Karma's a bitch, asshole.

Oh yeah, that really ticked me off when I saw that. He was saying how the rules are simple, and his team adjusted so quickly. Yeah, so much for that. Two fines in one game. Yep, they sure adjusted well to the rule changes...

Nighthawk
12-06-2010, 07:45 PM
I accept the fines but wasn't the fines basically set previously?
25k for a punch to the face to a qb (by Seymor on Ben)
75k for a helmet-to-helmet hit on a defenseless reciever (Harrison on Mossiquoai)

Chidi29
12-06-2010, 07:52 PM
I think the NFL is doing all it can. They obviously can't go back and enforce the penalties now. They refs acknowledged that it was a blown call on the Heath hit and the league acted swiftly and handed out pretty tough fines (To my knowledge, McClain hadn't been fined so far. That's 40K on the first offense. Harrison didn't even get close to that).

That's all I can ask out of them after the fact.

salamander
12-06-2010, 07:54 PM
I'm satisfied with the fines. Doesn't really mean much after the fact but it helps.

Chidi29
12-06-2010, 07:54 PM
I think the refs should start getting fined for missing calls. Especially that idiot Corrente that reffed the Oakland game.

If the logic is to change players patterns and bring player safety to the forefront, how about applying the same logic to the refs? You miss calls that are obvious penalties, you don't get paid for the week.

No offense, but that's a terrible idea that would really hurt the league.

You think the refs are concerned about making the right calls and erring on the side of caution now? If you threaten to take away a full check, the refs will call everything remotely close to a penalty.

I do know refs have to file reports after each game. The calls they made, what they saw, why they made it. They probably have to do the same with iffy no-calls. They are forced to hold themselves accountable.

Craic
12-06-2010, 08:22 PM
I accept the fines but wasn't the fines basically set previously?
25k for a punch to the face to a qb (by Seymor on Ben)
75k for a helmet-to-helmet hit on a defenseless receiver (Harrison on Mossiquoai)

Actually, no. I think the fines are just about right.

The punch to the head by Seymor was after the play and was completely unsportsmenlike. Here, Ngata was actually in the middle of the play, reaching, being blocked, and brought his heavy mitt down on Ben. If he hits Ben in the shoulder or chest, there is no fine, no penalty, no nothing-as it should be. Actually, I think maybe the fine is a little too much, should be probably 10,000 or so.

On McClain- this is only his first "infraction" which is why he only got a 25,000 fine. Harrison was fined 75000 on his SECOND hit.

THe other thing though... is that Harrison didn't hit a "defenseless receiver", if I remember right, he was still trying to catch the ball. Whereas, the ball had already passed Heath by. So, while I do thing the fine against Harrison was off for a number of reasons, I agree with fining players that crank other players AFTER THE BALL PASSES THEM BY.

zulater
12-06-2010, 08:31 PM
No offense, but that's a terrible idea that would really hurt the league.

You think the refs are concerned about making the right calls and erring on the side of caution now? If you threaten to take away a full check, the refs will call everything remotely close to a penalty.

I do know refs have to file reports after each game. The calls they made, what they saw, why they made it. They probably have to do the same with iffy no-calls. They are forced to hold themselves accountable.

Agreed. Obviously it'd be nice to see them get the calls right. Or at least most of them anyway. But given the choice between an overzelous ref crew or one that let's them play on and will miss the occasional call, I'll take the latter every time.

VTsteel
12-06-2010, 08:35 PM
Honestly, If Big Snack did that to Flacco - I'd be up in arms if he got fined. To me that broken nose Ben got was most unfortunate, but also offered him the opportunity to (once again) prove what a warrior he is . . . But it is one of those incidental things that are just a part of the game. I don't think Ngata should've been fined at all.

McClain on the other hand did intend to lay the lumber - In the "new NFL" he has to actually try to prevent putting somebody's lights out. All the players know that the rules have changed and as such McClains fine seems just. I don't really like it - but, if Harrison gets nailed for that, everybody else should as well - I guess.

Texasteel
12-06-2010, 08:40 PM
Fines...good start. But what about the 30 yards of field and the 2 first downs we were cheated out of?? When is the Nfl going to acknowledge that the refs are gretting worse...not better every year??

On a side note...did anyone see Harbaugh's interview before the game where he insinuated that Tomlin and the Steelers don't get how easy it is to follow the rules and that his guys have no problems with them??

Karma's a bitch, asshole.


I agree with you. I want an answer as to why in a flag happy league, all of a sudden the refs couldn't find theirs. This is beyond ridiculous, but what I have come to expect from this deteriorating league.

Chidi29
12-06-2010, 08:41 PM
McClain on the other hand did intend to lay the lumber - In the "new NFL" he has to actually try to prevent putting somebody's lights out. All the players know that the rules have changed and as such McClains fine seems just. I don't really like it - but, if Harrison gets nailed for that, everybody else should as well - I guess.

Yup. Not everyone is going to like the rules. To try and do so isn't practical. But you have to be consistent with how you call them.

HometownGal
12-06-2010, 08:45 PM
Good to see McClain and that fat load Ngata got what they deserved (though I felt the fine should be more than $15,000 on Ngata - Ben had to have surgery on that nose). The NFL had no choice but to take action here as they are already under a ton of scrutiny from not only the fans but some of the owners. I'm sure Dan Rooney played a HUGE part in Goodumbell and his cohorts taking action here.

X-Terminator
12-06-2010, 09:11 PM
Good to see McClain and that fat load Ngata got what they deserved (though I felt the fine should be more than $15,000 on Ngata - Ben had to have surgery on that nose). The NFL had no choice but to take action here as they are already under a ton of scrutiny from not only the fans but some of the owners. I'm sure Dan Rooney played a HUGE part in Goodumbell and his cohorts taking action here.

Yep. This has Dan Rooney written all over it. When the camera panned to him in the stands last night, Der Kommissar decided it might be a better idea to kiss The Don's rings rather than have to take an offer he can't refuse. :heh:

Craic
12-06-2010, 09:16 PM
Honestly, If Big Snack did that to Flacco - I'd be up in arms if he got fined. To me that broken nose Ben got was most unfortunate, but also offered him the opportunity to (once again) prove what a warrior he is . . . But it is one of those incidental things that are just a part of the game. I don't think Ngata should've been fined at all.

McClain on the other hand did intend to lay the lumber - In the "new NFL" he has to actually try to prevent putting somebody's lights out. All the players know that the rules have changed and as such McClains fine seems just. I don't really like it - but, if Harrison gets nailed for that, everybody else should as well - I guess.


I agree with you completely on McClain. So let's put that one aside.

on Ngata- I am split. One side, I agree with you. go back to what I posted. It was in the play, it he was being blocked, etc. etc. Whether or not Ben wears a facemask with a bar going up the center of the eye space shouldn't be the determining factor concerning a fine.

Yet, on the other side, players are supposed to be in control of their own body. He was being pushed, but he could have drawn his arm back/away/reached for the shoulder. Using your reverse scenario, how would I feel? Hmm. Good question. OK, if he got a 10 yard penalty-and no fine, I would be ok with that. If he was fined.. hmm. it would depend on the situation. If he could have pulled his hand back, but didn't, then I would be ok with it. If he couldn't, then no. How do you judge that though? I don't know.

GutterflowerSteel
12-06-2010, 09:18 PM
Yep. This has Dan Rooney written all over it. When the camera panned to him in the stands last night, Der Kommissar decided it might be a better idea to kiss The Don's rings rather than have to take an offer he can't refuse. :heh:

ha - I thought the same thing when I saw Mr.Rooney in the stands - he wasn't there just to watch the game. He came home from Ireland to bust some balls :tt02:

Nighthawk
12-06-2010, 09:45 PM
Actually, no. I think the fines are just about right.

The punch to the head by Seymor was after the play and was completely unsportsmenlike. Here, Ngata was actually in the middle of the play, reaching, being blocked, and brought his heavy mitt down on Ben. If he hits Ben in the shoulder or chest, there is no fine, no penalty, no nothing-as it should be. Actually, I think maybe the fine is a little too much, should be probably 10,000 or so.

On McClain- this is only his first "infraction" which is why he only got a 25,000 fine. Harrison was fined 75000 on his SECOND hit.

THe other thing though... is that Harrison didn't hit a "defenseless receiver", if I remember right, he was still trying to catch the ball. Whereas, the ball had already passed Heath by. So, while I do thing the fine against Harrison was off for a number of reasons, I agree with fining players that crank other players AFTER THE BALL PASSES THEM BY.

On Harrison - it was his first Helmet-to-Helmet hit, first infraction for it. No other infraction should matter as far as I'm concerned as it wasn't a penalty for this type of hit (where the Cribbs hit was legal).

Whether Ngata's fine was in the action of the play or not, it could be argued it was intentional. An intentional punch to the head no matter how it happens.

I think the fines were fine myself, I'm just arguing Harrison's fine shouldn't have been as severe. Doesn't really matter any way you dice it right now the fines are set.

stillers4me
12-06-2010, 10:02 PM
Harrison got 75K for his second hit (more than any other player has gotten) but 25K for his 3rd hit. How is that consistant with a repeat offender policy?

Craic
12-06-2010, 10:13 PM
On Harrison - it was his first Helmet-to-Helmet hit, first infraction for it. No other infraction should matter as far as I'm concerned as it wasn't a penalty for this type of hit (where the Cribbs hit was legal).The thing is, it basically falls as a subcategory of "roughing the passer" in this context. That was his second fine for it. So no, it really wasn't his first infraction. Furthermore, whether they admit it or not, Harrison was fined for both hits that game. I know, I know: they said the first hit was legal. But that fine was meant to send a message-as the words that came with it that day was "suspensions will follow very soon". I still don't agree with the fine. But I think it takes a VERY narrow interpretation of the rules and situation to argue your argument.



Whether Ngata's fine was in the action of the play or not, it could be argued it was intentional. An intentional punch to the head no matter how it happens. No. It matters a great deal. You do NOT hit someone after the play is over. That is simply being a thug. Ngata's hit on Ben was as purposeful and intentional as Harrison's head-first tackles. You are TAUGHT to go after the QB, ALL the time. If he could get his hand on Ben's shoulder pads, he gets a sack. If he gets his hand up in Ben's face for a second, he disrupts Ben's vision. If he hits Ben in the facemask, but doesn't grab it as he is being pushed past, he completely disrupts Ben's vision. There is nothing wrong with ANY of that IMO.

In order to say it was intentional- and even in the same LEAGUE, let alone the same ballpark as Seymor's punch, you gotta show that he INTENTIONALLY put his arm OUT TO Ben to hit him, instead of driving to Ben and being pushed passed him with his arm extended. You gotta show that he turned his wrist in order to get his hand through the face-mask. YOu ALSO have to show that he flattened out his hand enough. If he doesn't do ALL of those things, then it was simply a Football play. A play that should be penalized? Sure. But an intentional punch like Seymor? IMO, Absolutely no way.

I think the fines were fine myself, I'm just arguing Harrison's fine shouldn't have been as severe. Doesn't really matter any way you dice it right now the fines are set.

Craic
12-06-2010, 10:14 PM
Harrison got 75K for his second hit (more than any other player has gotten) but 25K for his 3rd hit. How is that consistant with a repeat offender policy?

LOL... Now that is a completely different discussion-

steelerdude15
12-06-2010, 11:32 PM
Good, glad to see this happened.

GodfatherofSoul
12-06-2010, 11:36 PM
Harrison got 75K for his second hit (more than any other player has gotten) but 25K for his 3rd hit. How is that consistant with a repeat offender policy?

Der Kommish blinked. It's that simple. Harrison has called him out and essentially dared him to penalize him for a legitimate hit. And ESPECIALLY after the Ravens game, all of fandom is on board with him. Der Kommish pushes it too far and he'll look like an asshole rather than Mr. Tough-on-Crime. Think of all of his decisions in the context of a corporate PR hack with no real management skills.

NCSteeler
12-07-2010, 12:05 AM
I think last night's non-call's and fines immediately today might actually work in our favor going forward. The pregame show made a fairly big story about the Steelers and their belief that they were being targeted and not getting even treatment from the refs, followed by quotes from Ray Anderson saying we "misguided" in believing that, then the game happens and we get HOSED by the refs in front of a national audience. The league knew they were under the spotlight and was forced today to cover there ass with the fines. How many other fines have you seen levied on the Monday following? Maybe with the extra scrutiny that this game with the Ravens brought, we might get a little less brutal treatment from the refs moving forward. The league covered THEIR OWN asses, the REFS now have to cover theirs.

No doubt, fines usually come out Thursday or Friday, although they did jump on Pollard from the thursday night game before the weekend was even over.

NCSteeler
12-07-2010, 12:16 AM
Agreed. Obviously it'd be nice to see them get the calls right. Or at least most of them anyway. But given the choice between an overzelous ref crew or one that let's them play on and will miss the occasional call, I'll take the latter every time.

I'd settle for a ref crew that actually does this for a living. How about they actually hire them full time. All week they could go to a refing academy where they actually study the game, watch film work to get better at the task at hand, instead of going off to be a lawyer or what the hell ever it is they do all week. If the league cared to make the situation better, they certainly could. Once they were trained properly you could mix and match any ref with any crew with little effect.

Craic
12-07-2010, 02:07 AM
I'd settle for a ref crew that actually does this for a living. How about they actually hire them full time. All week they could go to a refing academy where they actually study the game, watch film work to get better at the task at hand, instead of going off to be a lawyer or what the hell ever it is they do all week. If the league cared to make the situation better, they certainly could. Once they were trained properly you could mix and match any ref with any crew with little effect.

I think the problem with that is, you are essentially hiring someone to work 22 days a year. There's only so much you can study. There's only so much you can do to see around 6'8, 300+ pound players who run sub 5.5 40's. At some point, the problem is no longer the refs, but rather the speed of the game itself and the complexity of the rules. There is simply NO WAY a ref can watch to see if a LB shoots a gap and hits a QB in the shoulder, and then rides up to the helmet, or directly to the helmet, while also looking for holding. Or a ref can look to see a head to head hit, when he is more focused on whether the ball hits the ground, juggles in his hands, and his feet are both in bounds. I know, there are supposed to be others helping, but how far off are they?

At some point, whether we like it or not, we are going to get to the place where all the refs have an earpiece, and a second set of eyes in the booths watch the plays right along with them, calling down to them to throw the flag if they miss something.

stillers4me
12-07-2010, 05:06 AM
At some point, whether we like it or not, we are going to get to the place where all the refs have an earpiece, and a second set of eyes in the booths watch the plays right along with them, calling down to them to throw the flag if they miss something.

I don't think that's a bad idea at all. But of course, someone will tell me why it isn't. :chuckle:

The WH
12-07-2010, 05:18 AM
I don't think that's a bad idea at all. But of course, someone will tell me why it isn't. :chuckle:
i think its a great idea.

HometownGal
12-07-2010, 07:46 AM
At some point, whether we like it or not, we are going to get to the place where all the refs have an earpiece, and a second set of eyes in the booths watch the plays right along with them, calling down to them to throw the flag if they miss something.

I'd be totally down with that. :drink: While I realize that refs are human and make errors just like we do, what I'm bitching about the most is consistency. There is no rhyme or reason anymore with regard to what a crew will call in any particular game and I really think they all need to be on the same page.

SirHulka
12-07-2010, 07:53 AM
Another example of inconsistancy:

Ngata accidently (and no matter what you say, he didn't intend to hit #7 in the face) hits Roethlisberger, no penalty, and gets fined $15,000. Suh deliberately grabs Delhomme by the helmet with both hands, and intentionally throws him down by his head. He gets flagged. But only fined $7,000. It's either very inconsistant, or the fine varies by whether or not the player getting hit is a star. Either way, it's wrong.

43Hitman
12-07-2010, 08:07 AM
Personally I think the fines should be tiered by flagrancy across the board and then when applying them on players it should be a percentage of their pay. That way its the same hit, pardon the pun, no matter if the offending player is a scrub or a super star.

steeldawg
12-07-2010, 09:43 AM
Another example of inconsistancy:

Ngata accidently (and no matter what you say, he didn't intend to hit #7 in the face) hits Roethlisberger, no penalty, and gets fined $15,000. Suh deliberately grabs Delhomme by the helmet with both hands, and intentionally throws him down by his head. He gets flagged. But only fined $7,000. It's either very inconsistant, or the fine varies by whether or not the player getting hit is a star. Either way, it's wrong.

I agree with this IMHO i think ngata should have been flagged but not fined. It would of only cost ngata 10,000 more to rip off ben's helmet and punch him in the face. Essentially its a face mask penalty , we wouldnt fine someone for a face mask penalty.

GodfatherofSoul
12-07-2010, 10:22 AM
I think the problem with that is, you are essentially hiring someone to work 22 days a year.


How's that different from the players? With dedicated refs, you can spend more time on training them and place more demands on them during the work week. This was brought up a few years back (I hadn't realized it wasn't implemented). I agree though that overall reffing in the NFL isn't that bad. My problem is with deliberate inconsistency; Jordan calls, crunch-time leniency, Goodellisms, et al.

As for ref ear pieces, I think that contradicts the existence of a ref. They're by nature supposed to call what they see. If you've got a guy making calls in a booth, why bother having him call it in from the press box? Plus, just as sports is a contest of human ability, so is reffing. Kind of takes away from the game to think that we might have a hundred cameras watching every aspect of the game and a guy throwing down a bag of cheetos hitting a big yellow button.

SteelerFanInStl
12-07-2010, 06:09 PM
Another example of inconsistancy:

Ngata accidently (and no matter what you say, he didn't intend to hit #7 in the face) hits Roethlisberger, no penalty, and gets fined $15,000. Suh deliberately grabs Delhomme by the helmet with both hands, and intentionally throws him down by his head. He gets flagged. But only fined $7,000. It's either very inconsistant, or the fine varies by whether or not the player getting hit is a star. Either way, it's wrong.

And how exactly do you know that he didn't do it intentionally? You seem pretty matter of fact about that. The FACT is that no one, other than Ngata knows if it was deliberate or not.

I've seen the replay many times and what I see is him taking a swat at Ben's face with his left hand. You don't try to tackle someone by swatting at their head.

HometownGal
12-07-2010, 06:19 PM
And how exactly do you know that he didn't do it intentionally? You seem pretty matter of fact about that. The FACT is that no one, other than Ngata knows if it was deliberate or not.

I've seen the replay many times and what I see is him taking a swat at Ben's face with his left hand. You don't try to tackle someone by swatting at their head.

:thumbsup: My thoughts exactly.

NCSteeler
12-08-2010, 01:19 AM
How's that different from the players? With dedicated refs, you can spend more time on training them and place more demands on them during the work week. This was brought up a few years back (I hadn't realized it wasn't implemented). I agree though that overall reffing in the NFL isn't that bad. My problem is with deliberate inconsistency; Jordan calls, crunch-time leniency, Goodellisms, et al.

As for ref ear pieces, I think that contradicts the existence of a ref. They're by nature supposed to call what they see. If you've got a guy making calls in a booth, why bother having him call it in from the press box? Plus, just as sports is a contest of human ability, so is reffing. Kind of takes away from the game to think that we might have a hundred cameras watching every aspect of the game and a guy throwing down a bag of cheetos hitting a big yellow button.

I wonder if some of the piss poor reffing can be linked to relying on review. Seems there were a few plays a year you wished could be changed , now it's dozens. And then you have a handful of plays reviewed and changed (megatron no catch) that should have stood.

Akagi
12-08-2010, 08:47 AM
John McClain got fined? For what, unnecessary roughness on Hans Gruber?


:bounce:

zulater
12-08-2010, 09:14 AM
:thumbsup: My thoughts exactly.

Ditto!

Anyone really think James Harrison could get away with that move, think it wasn't a calculated cheap shot?

SCSTILLER
12-08-2010, 09:37 AM
John McClain got fined? For what, unnecessary roughness on Hans Gruber?


:bounce:

Ok, that was a good one

BPS3akaWirels3
12-09-2010, 03:43 PM
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December 8, 2010

Jameel McClain works at Food Lion?!?

OK, not really. Ravens linebacker Jameel McClain will appeal his $40,000 fine (http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/blog/2010/12/jameel_mcclain_will_appeal_his_fine.html) for Sunday's hit on Steelers tight end Heath Miller. Teammate Kelly Gregg give us a great one-liner when asked about McClain's fine: "I saw him last night at Food Lion. I thought he was shopping, but he was working trying to pay that fine."
McClain reportedly is making $470,000 in 2010, so that $40,000 fine is nearly one-twelfth of his salary. Ouch


http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/bthesite/vensel/2010/12/jameel_mcclain_works_at_food_l.html

HometownGal
12-09-2010, 05:40 PM
McClain reportedly is making $470,000 in 2010, so that $40,000 fine is nearly one-twelfth of his salary. Ouch




Boo fookity hoo. Maybe next time he thinks about head-hunting someone, he'll think twice about the possibility that with the next fine, he could be standing in the Food Lion line using food stamps.

BPS3akaWirels3
12-09-2010, 05:45 PM
Boo fookity hoo. Maybe next time he thinks about head-hunting someone, he'll think twice about the possibility that with the next fine, he could be standing in the Food Lion line using food stamps.

I'm surprised he grocery shops there.. One of the more expensive grocery chains in Baltimore...