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LLT
11-07-2010, 04:07 AM
Steelers pass defense just fine as opponents abandon run
By Mark Kaboly
TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Sunday, November 7, 2010



So what's wrong with the Steelers defense?

How else can you explain how Dick LeBeau's defense is 25th in the NFL against the pass?

How else can you explain how Drew Brees picked apart the Steelers secondary last week to the tune of 305 yards on 34 of 44 passes? How did Roddy White catch 13 passes against the secondary in Week 1? What about Joe Flacco's 256 yards and Colt McCoy's 281 and Chad Henne's 257?

What's wrong? Nothing.

Read More:
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_708101.html

SirHulka
11-07-2010, 05:19 AM
There's a reason why opponents are consistently attempting more than 30 passes per game — because they can't run.


or because they don't have to.

HometownGal
11-07-2010, 05:31 AM
What's wrong with the Steelers D? Going soft in the 4th quarter of just about every game going back to last season, that's what's wrong with 'em. They come out with a fierce intensity in the first half and shut our opponents O's down but by the time the middle of the 3Q comes around, they let up on the pass rushing and go to that damned prevent almost every time. I'd really like to see them with that same intensity in the second half as we are used to seeing in the first half.

LLT
11-07-2010, 05:39 AM
LeBeau preaches to his defensive backs not to let anything get behind them at all costs. LeBeau likes his chances when a team is forced to dink and dunk their way down the field because he feels that eventually somebody will make a play.

Well...I know its easy to look at the surface and say..."something isn't working..we are 25th in pass defense"!! But here is a strange stat....

We are tied at #2 with the Saints for the fewest pass TD's allowed this season. We have given up 6...only the Bears have had fewer with 4.

SirHulka
11-07-2010, 05:48 AM
Well...I know its easy to look at the surface and say..."something isn't working..we are 25th in pass defense"!! But here is a strange stat....

We are tied at #2 with the Saints for the fewest pass TD's allowed this season. We have given up 6...only the Bears have had fewer with 4.

And the Browns are LEADING the league with only 1 rushing TD allowed.

"There are lies, damned lies, and statistics." - Mark Twain

LLT
11-07-2010, 05:58 AM
And the Browns are LEADING the league with only 1 rushing TD allowed.

"There are lies, damned lies, and statistics." - Mark Twain

You are correct in saying that you have to look at the whole picture in regards to stats. Here is what is wrong with your stat about the Browns.

The Browns have allowed 13 pass TD's....which means that teams are taking the easier route to the endzone.

I dont think that you are assuming that the Steelers have so few pass TD's against them because the easier route to the endzone is to run against their defense???

SirHulka
11-07-2010, 06:17 AM
All I'm saying is that statistics lie.

2 Ways to look at it.

1. No one can run on the Steelers, so they have to pass; or

2. Why bother running against the Steelers, because their pass defense is so bad?

There are 17 teams, including the Browns, that have allowed fewer points than the Patriots. Yet they have the best record in the NFL.

Figures don't lie, but liars figure. You can make the stats mean whatever you want. I never pay attention to them.

LLT
11-07-2010, 06:37 AM
All I'm saying is that statistics lie.

2 Ways to look at it.

1. No one can run on the Steelers, so they have to pass; or

2. Why bother running against the Steelers, because their pass defense is so bad?

There are 17 teams, including the Browns, that have allowed fewer points than the Patriots. Yet they have the best record in the NFL.

Figures don't lie, but liars figure. You can make the stats mean whatever you want. I never pay attention to them.

Numbers can definately be twisted....and assumptions can also be wrong when someone else posts a stat.

The stat I posted...and what you failed to understand....is that teams ARE gaining yards by passing but are failing to get into the endzone. Most of the time they are having to settle for 3 points.

IF the other team could score a passing TD...they would. Regardless of what the Browns are doing.

SirHulka
11-07-2010, 06:49 AM
No, I don't fail to understand anything. I know what you're saying. But the fact remains that the Pats have allowed over 50 points more than the Steelers, yet have a better record.

All I'm saying is that statistics lie. Or better yet, statistics don't tell the entire story. For example, you've only given up 6 passing TD's. How many have come in the 4th quarter?

LLT
11-07-2010, 06:59 AM
No, I don't fail to understand anything. I know what you're saying. But the fact remains that the Pats have allowed over 50 points more than the Steelers, yet have a better record.

All I'm saying is that statistics lie. Or better yet, statistics don't tell the entire story. For example, you've only given up 6 passing TD's. How many have come in the 4th quarter?


Still not relevant to the original point.

I didnt post a stat that was decieving....I didnt post a stat that claimed anything other than that our pass defense is allowing yards but not TD's.

Anything else you are reading into it is irrelevent to that point. What the Browns and Pats are doing... does not take yards away from our pass defense ..nor does it add TD's.

You either missed the point or you are creating a rabbit trail.

Count Steeler
11-07-2010, 07:04 AM
We have to stop the 3rd and longs. The defense attacks for the first 2 downs and they end up with a 3rd and 6-15 yards. We can cut the yards way down by being better on 3rd down. If the offense converts, that is another 3 downs at least. I don't mind completions to receivers that are covered, but when they are wide open on 3rd down, it drives me crazy.

Defensive scheme? No pressure? Poor coverage? All 3 areas need to be addressed.

SirHulka
11-07-2010, 07:07 AM
I'm not disagreeing with you. What I'm saying is that stat about yardage doesn't mean anything. The Chargers are #1 in offense, #1 in total defense, #1 in pass defense, and #2 in rush defense. And where does that get them? Last place?
How many TD's you've allowed doesn't mean anything if you can't score more than you've allowed
And I'm not creating a rabbit trail. All I'm saying is that stats lie

Again...stats only lie when they are twisted are they are not used in context.

Count Steeler
11-07-2010, 07:13 AM
You missed MY point, I think. I'm not disagreeing with you. What I'm saying is that stat about yardage doesn't mean anything. The Chargers are #1 in offense, #1 in total defense, #1 in pass defense, and #2 in rush defense. And where does that get them? Last place?

How many TD's you've allowed doesn't mean anything if you can't score more than you've allowed. The only stat that matters is W/L. It's one thing to waste time debating on stats, but in the end, only the W's matter.

And I'm not creating a rabbit trail. All I'm saying is that stats lie.

Only 1 stat matters: # of Super Bowl wins.

LLT
11-07-2010, 07:26 AM
We have to stop the 3rd and longs. The defense attacks for the first 2 downs and they end up with a 3rd and 6-15 yards. We can cut the yards way down by being better on 3rd down. If the offense converts, that is another 3 downs at least. I don't mind completions to receivers that are covered, but when they are wide open on 3rd down, it drives me crazy.

Defensive scheme? No pressure? Poor coverage? All 3 areas need to be addressed.



Agreed...way too much cushion on 3rd downs. Also drives me crazy to see no one picking up the slant. The one thing that I miss about Tyrone Carter was when they would bring him in as an extra DB ... close to the line... and have him jam recievers....then slide off and cover the flat to watch for the pass to the RB. That was so effective in throwing recievers off their route while preventing the outlet pass.

LLT
11-07-2010, 07:40 AM
I'm not disagreeing with you. What I'm saying is that stat about yardage doesn't mean anything. The Chargers are #1 in offense, #1 in total defense, #1 in pass defense, and #2 in rush defense. And where does that get them? Last place?
How many TD's you've allowed doesn't mean anything if you can't score more than you've allowed
And I'm not creating a rabbit trail. All I'm saying is that stats lie

Again...stats only lie when they are twisted are they are not used in context.


Oops...I boogered up your post....by hitting edit instead of reply...my apologies.

Anyway....I agree with your assesment that stats lie when not put into context. When looking at the big picture...The stats show that Lebeau is choosing a bend but dont break pass defense...probably because he can only work within the confines of the talent that he has.
The bad part of that is that it is going to put us into close games with a very good pass oriented team...who will walk away with at least 3 points on most possessions.

The point I was making was in relation to that point. We give up lots of yards but not many TD's.

SirHulka
11-07-2010, 07:55 AM
From my vantage point of looking in from the outside, it's a team that goes flat in the 4th quarter. Not good. (From your point of view, not mine. lol) I wonder exactly how much yardage and points you DO give up in the 4th. Don't get many AFCN games out here in NM. I do go to a sports bar in Albuquerque to watch games each season, but it's 100 miles one way, so I don't go to all of them. I'm gonna have to end up getting a sports package, I guess.

LLT
11-07-2010, 08:01 AM
Unfortunately it appears that we go flat in the 4th quarter by design. We play prevent defense instead of attacking. Those 10 yard cushions drive me absolutely insane. I think the vast majority of the Steeler Universe would like to see us attack the QB instead of giving up 6 yards a pop on dink and dunk passes.

SteelerFanInStl
11-07-2010, 08:48 AM
Brees was 20/22 for 191 yards and 2 TDs passing in the second half last week. That tells me everything that I need to know about our pass defense. Even Joe Montana shouldn't be allowed to complete 91% of his passes against you. We give too much cushion off the line, especially McFadden, and we've got our best rushers dropping back into coverage instead of pressuring the QB. It just doesn't seem like our defense is playing very aggressive any more. More like bend but don't break.