Who is most in danger of being cut/traded because of draft?

[oneforthetoe]

I'll wait for Steelerette to update the 53 to think about a complete roster. And, I know none of these draft picks have made the field yet, but that's what we do here is speculate. I would be shocked if at least 6 of the picks don't make the 53. I think Anderson could end up on the P.S., but apparently, he is the quite the "Swiss Army Knife" of offensive linemen, and we know how much Tomlin likes that.

So, which players presently on the team are most likely to be cut?

Gentry - I'd like to see them keep Gentry. And then, go with the 4 TE's using Connor to cover at FB as well. However, the
Steelers might feel that would blunt Heyward's transition to TE. We also signed a rookie FA full back so we shall
see.

McCollum - Said before they have a lot of guys who can play center - and now they added a possible additional....

Adams - I have always liked him, but he could be 3rd on the depth chart at nose tackle. It's not 20 years ago, I don't
think they will keep three. Leal being able to play linebacker could permit the Steelers to keep an extra d'
lineman.

Crowder -Muse or Roche - take your pick. If Leal can cover the back-up OLB spot, and/or Herbig can jump inside in a
pinch, then I think they go with one less linebacker maybe.

Maulet, Wallace or Pierre -- I think they value Witherspoon more than the others.

Edited to add that I guess I forgot Green was still one team. Sometimes reliving nightmares is just unnerving.

[RunNGun]

I might be in the minority here, but I'd rather lose Heyward than Gentry if it came down to it. I do like the idea of keeping all 4 and having Heyward cover the fullback/h-back role and that's likely what happens.

[Dwinsgames]

I might be in the minority here, but I'd rather lose Heyward than Gentry if it came down to it. I do like the idea of keeping all 4 and having Heyward cover the fullback/h-back role and that's likely what happens.

not me ...I take Heyward 10 times out of 10 ...

Gentry is a blocking TE first and foremost he is limited as a receiver struggles to get any sort of separation , Heyward can get open and has great hands and Washington gives you everything Gentry gives you in terms of blocking and then some all the while being not only a better receiver but much more of a mismatch because of his speed and body control (he isnt stiff like Gentry)

so for me as soon as the draft card was handed in Gentry's spot on this team became in Jeopardy ... now I agree keeping them all is possible esp if they do not roster a pure FB

[86WARD]

I think they keep all 4 TEs.

Hopefully Maulet, Miller and Green find their ways off the roster…

[Mojouw]

Follow the cap $$$

Dotson is an expensive 3rd string guard.
McCollum is in a fight with the last draft pick so why pay him?
Witherspoon is the second most expensive CB on the roster and the least reliable.

Not a draft pick but Chandon Sullivan might make Maulet an expensive run stopping DB.

I think they’re telling us they’re going to find a way to keep 4-5 players at FB/TE/H back.

[Psycho Ward 86]

We are now chalk full of outside corners. The slot is looking real thin. That being said I think we run with Porter, Peterson, Wallace, Sullivan, Pierre, and Trice. Maybe we'll run with 5, but I just dont see a scenario where the streakiest, 2nd most expensive option is part of that 5. Maulet is the only guy left on the team with a lot of snaps in the slot. I cant imagine Sullivan was signed DURING the draft if the front office wasnt certain he would kick Maulet out of here for good.

How many Dlinemen do we typically carry? That will be a a tough camp battle for most of the guys there.

Gentry's shitty athleticism instantly negate his height and weight by 8 inches and 30 pounds. I think we'll end up running with Heyward's fringe potential instead. Maybe an early mock 53 would make it easier to see a scenario where Gentry and Heyward are here at the same time, but H-back/tight end + blocking only tight end? I think the modern offense can survive without that niche. Canada sure as hell wont know what to do with it anyways

[RunNGun]

Sure, Heyward is listed as a TE, but Heyward isn't a TE. He's an H-back. He's never going to be your TE in single TE sets. Ever.

My thinking is if PF or DW were to get hurt I'd much rather have Gentry taking one of their spots than a converted RB who can't block.

[Orion]

it all will boil down to $$$ and who can play special teams. does Gentry play special teams ? Connor Heyward does and is the cheaper option..

https://steelersdepot.com/2022/08/film-room-connor-heywards-strong-special-teams-start-and-other-sts-musings/

[DesertSteel]

See ya Gentry!

[RunNGun]

Gentry is going nowhere

[Orion]

they need to trim cap fat somewhere. cutting gentry save 1.25 mill. Heyward will at least get playing time on special teams and assuming he takes over fullback duties. last year heyward played 200 ST snaps compared to Gentry's 72 which was reduced from 139 in 2021.

[pczach]

I guess the million dollar question is if keeping Watt at fullback is because they want to keep his brother happy? I think Derek Watt has done a good job on special teams, but he rarely plays fullback. If TJ wasn't on the team, would the Steelers keep him and pay him the money he is making for basically a special team specialist.

I think they legitimately like Watt, but Connor Heyward can play fullback....and he's cheaper. There are legit things to consider with both players.

If push comes to shove, I think they keep Watt and Heyward.....and Gentry is gone. I just think it is the most likely scenario.

Keeping Watt gives you a solid FB option and a great special teamer whose brother is an All-World player.

Keeping Connor Heyward gives you a player that can play both TE and FB.....and his brother is the heart and soul of the locker room, the leader and elder statesman of the team, and a great player.

I think Gentry is the odd man out with Washington in the building.

At the other positions, the players listed in the original post make sense. I think much will depend not only on how well they play in preseason, but also if there are significant injuries that will hurt availability.

[RunNGun]

Derek Watt isn't under contract at the moment. I think Heyward takes his roster spot and we roll with the 3 TEs.

Everyone in Pittsburgh is talking about being physical...It doesn't make a lot of sense to cut one of your better blocking TEs in favor of a tweener that has no potential as a run blocker or pass blocker. Let's also not pretend like CH is some kind of receiving threat.

2022 stats

Gentry- 19 rec, 132 yards
Heyward- 12 rec 151 yards

I'm keeping Gentry and it's an easy decision. But like PCZach said...keeping Watt and Heyward to keep their brothers happy may be worth it.

[Orion]

derick watts contract has expired. he is no longer on the roster. i doubt they bring him back unless it is for very little money.

[Orion]

Derek Watt isn't under contract at the moment. I think Heyward takes his roster spot and we roll with the 3 TEs.

Everyone in Pittsburgh is talking about being physical...It doesn't make a lot of sense to cut one of your better blocking TEs in favor of a tweener that has no potential as a run blocker or pass blocker. Let's also not pretend like CH is some kind of receiving threat.

2022 stats

Gentry- 19 rec, 132 yards
Heyward- 12 rec 151 yards

I'm keeping Gentry and it's an easy decision. But like PCZach said...keeping Watt and Heyward to keep their brothers happy may be worth it.
well it makes a lot of sense when you draft a better option. a better receiver and a better blocker. who would you take off the field to put gentry in ? Gentry will never get on the field. heyward has already shown to be a better special teams player. the snap count speaks to that.

[RunNGun]

well it makes a lot of sense when you draft a better option. a better receiver and a better blocker. who would you take off the field to put gentry in ? Gentry will never get on the field. heyward has already shown to be a better special teams player. the snap count speaks to that.

I wouldn't take anyone off the field, but if one of them were to get hurt I'd much rather have Gentry replacing them than Heyward, simply because Heyward isn't capable.

But like I said, I believe we will roll with all 4 of them. If Heyward was the odd man out I don't believe replacing his special teams duties with a RB, S, or LB would be too much to handle.

[Mojouw]

They may list Heyward as a TE but he simply isn’t. He’s a poor blocking FB or an H back.

I honestly think he’d be a better traditional RB than anyone thinks.

If Heyward is moved to the RB/FB discussion, the Steelers have the exact number of TEa they need.

[Orion]

They may list Heyward as a TE but he simply isn’t. He’s a poor blocking FB or an H back.

I honestly think he’d be a better traditional RB than anyone thinks.

If Heyward is moved to the RB/FB discussion, the Steelers have the exact number of TEa they need.
but wasn't heyward the 3rd TE last year ?

[RunNGun]

They may list Heyward as a TE but he simply isn’t. He’s a poor blocking FB or an H back.

I honestly think he’d be a better traditional RB than anyone thinks.

If Heyward is moved to the RB/FB discussion, the Steelers have the exact number of TEa they need.

Exactly

[Mojouw]

but wasn't heyward the 3rd TE last year ?

He was. But Watt was also on the roster and so was Snell.

[Orion]

the point is they thought he was good enough to be the 3rd TE and get a helmet on sundays in his rookie year. so why would it be different this year ? TE wasnt a problem last year, the lines were. i just think it makes more sense to carry an extra linemen on either side of the ball to evaluate or rotate than a TE that will never see the field.

[RunNGun]

It's different because Derek Watt and Benny Snell are off the roster. Heyward can now fill the FB roster spot.

[Orion]

It's different because Derek Watt and Benny Snell are off the roster. Heyward can now fill the FB roster spot.
derick watt was an extremely overpaid special teams player considering he rarely saw the field as a fullback. if i remeber correctly it was something like 5% of the O snaps . Heyward is also a decent special teamer. i posted a link to an article speaking of it above. unless canada radically alters his playbook and approach, heyward be the starting FB and 3rd TE would still see a small snap count percentage , but it would still be higher than Gentry's which would be zero. gentry had his special teams count go from 139 in 21 to 72 in 22. you can speculate it may have been because he was #2 and they wanted to limit the risk of injury, or you can speculate he just wasnt that effective on ST's.

[RunNGun]

derick watt was an extremely overpaid special teams player considering he rarely saw the field as a fullback. if i remeber correctly it was something like 5% of the O snaps . Heyward is also a decent special teamer. i posted a link to an article speaking of it above. unless canada radically alters his playbook and approach, heyward be the starting FB and 3rd TE would still see a small snap count percentage , but it would still be higher than Gentry's which would be zero. gentry had his special teams count go from 139 in 21 to 72 in 22. you can speculate it may have been because he was #2 and they wanted to limit the risk of injury, or you can speculate he just wasnt that effective on ST's.

I'm not factoring in CH's special teams abilities. While it is important I feel it can easily be replaced by one of the new comers on the defensive side of the ball.

I would be really surprised if CH could match his production from last season, with the additions of Robinson, Washington, as well as Austin. Not to mention the emergence of George Pickens.

He may still see his 1 to 2 targets a game to throw the defense off, but that's not enough to warrant a roster spot over a player that can actually play the position. I also like the idea of having 3 capable blocking TEs for inside the opponents 10 yard line. If they're really wanting to be physical this could be utilized as much as CH's 1-2 targets per game.

[DesertSteel]

How many game changing plays did Gentry have last year?

[RunNGun]

0. Don't pretend like Conner Heyward is a weapon though. He made one big play last season. I don't see him building off of that either. Too many mouths to feed.

[DesertSteel]

0. Don't pretend like Conner Heyward is a weapon though. He made one big play last season. I don't see him building off of that either. Too many mouths to feed.
So one more than Gentry — for his career. Lol

[RunNGun]

So one more than Gentry — for his career. Lol

Lol yeah I guess so. I don't think that's quite a deal breaker though.

[DesertSteel]

Lol yeah I guess so. I don't think that's quite a deal breaker though.
Cheaper and more upside offensively. Washington gives them the blocking. They can’t keep 4. Guys like Gentry can be found on other teams’s practice squad, if needed.

[RunNGun]

Cheaper and more upside offensively. Washington gives them the blocking. They can’t keep 4. Guys like Gentry can be found on other teams’s practice squad, if needed.

I don't see the more upside argument. They are both below average route runners with decent hands. Gentry can block and Heyward can't.

Out of the 32 teams in the NFL...this is the only roster Heyward is making. Same couldn't be said about Gentry.

[Mojouw]

I’m assuming that the 2023 Steelers are going to play a ton of 2 TE sets. Then I look at what the possible players can do.

PF can do detached TE in space things really well. But he’s a liability as an attached in line blocker. Kozora had a detailed post towards the end of las season of missed blocks by PF that killed plays before they started.

Gentry is a better but still not great in line blocker. But he struggles to impact in space.

Washington should be an immediate upgrade as an in-line blocker with potential to offer more than Gentry in the passing attack.

Heyward isn’t a factor as an in-line blocker but is a potential playmaker out in space and in the screen game.

So, ignoring the precise terminology and exact roster numbers for the moment, that leaves the following pecking order for a 12 personnel grouping:

PF is the “move” TE starter. Washington is the in line “blocking” TE starter.

Gentry slots in as the backup blocking TE and Heyward serves as the backup “move” TE.

Or put it another way…assuming 12 personnel is going to be a “primary” package, they need to be two deep with both “flavors” of TEs. They now need and have 4.

Previous versions of the Steelers were built to be an 11 personnel team. So they only needed to be three deep at TE.

[Mojouw]

I should’ve added that the pick of a TE and not a WR in the draft signals a fundamental shift in offensive philosophy to me.

In the Ben era, they almost always drafted a WR to keep that pipeline flowing. They needed/wanted to be 5-6 deep there.

If you’re only going to play 2 most of the time, you can likely get away with only have 3 credible NFL WRs plus CA3 as a potential addition there. Boykin can serve as emergency depth.

Which is why I also suspect they’re going to find their way to a few more RBs coming to the off-season roster.

[Dwinsgames]

Derek Watt isn't under contract at the moment. I think Heyward takes his roster spot and we roll with the 3 TEs.

Everyone in Pittsburgh is talking about being physical...It doesn't make a lot of sense to cut one of your better blocking TEs in favor of a tweener that has no potential as a run blocker or pass blocker. Let's also not pretend like CH is some kind of receiving threat.

2022 stats

Gentry- 19 rec, 132 yards
Heyward- 12 rec 151 yards

I'm keeping Gentry and it's an easy decision. But like PCZach said...keeping Watt and Heyward to keep their brothers happy may be worth it.

include the snap count to gain perspective ... Heyward didnt play much until the end of the year , he produced more receiving yards with less balls going his way and way way way less snaps , hell Gentry started a game or two last year with PF out with a concussion ....

[RunNGun]

include the snap count to gain perspective ... Heyward didnt play much until the end of the year , he produced more receiving yards with less balls going his way and way way way less snaps , hell Gentry started a game or two last year with PF out with a concussion ....

Snap count has nothing to do with it. I'm not making an argument of which one is a better receiver. But there is a reason Gentry played more snaps. Gentry is a better TE. Heyward is a better H-back.

Is Gentry worth cutting for Heyward's role that sees 1-2 targets (max) per game? It's a no for me.

[DesertSteel]

Snap count has nothing to do with it. I'm not making an argument of which one is a better receiver. But there is a reason Gentry played more snaps. Gentry is a better TE. Heyward is a better H-back.

Is Gentry worth cutting for Heyward's role that sees 1-2 targets (max) per game? It's a no for me.
It's not Heyward replacing Gentry, it's Washington.

[RunNGun]

It's not Heyward replacing Gentry, it's Washington.

They're quite possibly fighting for a roster spot. That's what I meant by that.

[HollywoodSteel]

I don’t know how in demand Gentry will be to other teams. Seems like someone we could potentially put on the PS. With the addition of Washington, I don’t see Gentry ever getting a hat on Sunday unless there’s an injury. Hayward on the other hand has game day value as a special teamed and for a few plays as a pass catcher. They could even put him in to take the occasional hand off.

I like Gentry, and would love to stash him on the PS if possible, but at the end of the day I think he’s expendable, and can save a bit of cap money if cut.

Did Rader end up on another team? If not, he’s a guy we could probably put on the PS in case of emergency.

[Orion]

well this is surprising. Gentry seen half the snaps.
snap count
FRIERMUTH - 743 offense 64.05%
gentry - 577 offense 49.74%...72 St 16.44%
heyward - 174 offense 15%.....284 ST 64.84%

[HollywoodSteel]

well this is surprising. Gentry seen half the snaps.
snap count
FRIERMUTH - 743 offense 64.05%
gentry - 577 offense 49.74%...72 St 16.44%
heyward - 174 offense 15%.....284 ST 64.84%

There’s a little overlap with a few two TE sets but I assume Gentry might have been in to block on running downs. It’s actually kind of a good sign for Washington. He should get all of those blocking snaps, but with the possibility of running routes mixed in.

I imagine we’ll run a lot more two TE sets this year. I mean if Canada even considers designing plays to best utilize the talent he has. And that’s a big if.

[86WARD]

They’ll keep all 4. It only makes sense. There’s no point in cutting any one of them. Watt won’t be re-signed. He’s been replaced “offensively” by Heyward (upgrade). Heyward has been upgraded by Washington. Watts special teams contributions have been replaced by Muse. It would be a waste of draft picks, free agent signings and cap space if they were to re-sign Watt.

Muth, Gentry, Wash, Heyward (potentially)>>> Muth, Gentry, Heyward, Watt.

On a side note: to expect Canada do anything different than what they did last season is just imaginary thinking.

[Born2Steel]

One thing you guys are not talking about with the TE position. PF has already had 3 concussions, I think. We may see a good portion of 2023 snap with Gentry, Washington, and Heyward. His previous concussions have all been grade1. All it takes is a grade2 to cost significant playing time. I don’t think any of these guys are outside looking in.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

How many game changing plays did Gentry have last year?

Agreed. I watched a lot of Michigan games when Gentry played there and at best he is a #3 TE that has developed as a blocker, but athletically doesnt make much of an impact in the receiving game. If he doesnt make the 53 its not a big deal.

[DesertSteel]

One thing you guys are not talking about with the TE position. PF has already had 3 concussions, I think. We may see a good portion of 2023 snap with Gentry, Washington, and Heyward. His previous concussions have all been grade1. All it takes is a grade2 to cost significant playing time. I don’t think any of these guys are outside looking in.
But Tua said that having multiple concussions doesn't make you more vulnerable. He got that straight from the Dolphins' medical staff.

[Dwinsgames]

It's not Heyward replacing Gentry, it's Washington.

B00M

the entire point summed up in 7 words.............


Bonus points to Heyward for also having the elder statesman brother as the team leader , even tho Heyward is by far the better player anyways , you know the old saying "the more ya can do"

TE , H-Back , Special teams .........

[RunNGun]

Agreed. I watched a lot of Michigan games when Gentry played there and at best he is a #3 TE that has developed as a blocker, but athletically doesnt make much of an impact in the receiving game. If he doesnt make the 53 its not a big deal.

Agreed. I'm surely not saying he's any type of playmaker. What he is though is a better TE than Conner Heyward.

Some are acting like cutting Conner Heyward would be more of a loss than Gentry. I don't buy it. Conner is only on this roster because his brother is Cam.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Agreed. I'm surely not saying he's any type of playmaker. What he is though is a better TE than Conner Heyward.

Some are acting like cutting Conner Heyward would be more of a loss than Gentry. I don't buy it. Conner is only on this roster because his brother is Cam.

Some would say that Heyward is a better athlete and can get open in the pass game better than Gentry. They might also say that he is more valuable on Special Teams and his versatility of being able to play FB, TE, H-back or even RB if needed, should get him on the 53 before Gentry.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7Jtn5G4y8A

[DesertSteel]

Some would say that Heyward is a better athlete and can get open in the pass game better than Gentry. They might also say that he is more valuable on Special Teams and his versatility of being able to play FB, TE, H-back or even RB if needed, should get him on the 53 before Gentry.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7Jtn5G4y8A
Some would include me on all those points. CH is a Swiss Army knife.

[RunNGun]

Some would include me on all those points. CH is a Swiss Army knife.

Some would also say that if PF or DW gets hurt Conner Heyward has no value. Special teams is irrelevant. There will be plenty of defensive players that can fill his role there.

[oneforthetoe]

It seems like the majority here are in favor of keeping 4 TE's, with Heyward covering the fullback or h'back spots. But, I have just a little twist to that idea. What about keeping 4 TE's, a full back, but only keeping 3 running backs? If Heyward is really the Swiss Army Knife we are attributing to him, would he be able to help cover the running back spot in an emergency? Is so, why keep 4 running backs?

I know running backs tend to be good special team's players. In addition, maybe it's wanting to make sure that any running back that comes into the game can pick up a blitz and not get your QB killed, but otherwise, why do you need more than 3 running backs? We can simply keep two backs on the PS. Just a thought.

[DesertSteel]

Some would also say that if PF or DW gets hurt Conner Heyward has no value. Special teams is irrelevant. There will be plenty of defensive players that can fill his role there.
So keep a TE3 just in case? Are TE3's hard to find?

[RunNGun]

He's only under contract for 1 more year. It's not like it's killing us to keep him. He at least has value.

[Psycho Ward 86]

If you told me last month that we would be having a serious discussion about keeping 4 tight ends I would have told you to punch yourself in the face.

But here we are.

And everyone is making good points :lol:

[RunNGun]

If you told me last month that we would be having a serious discussion about keeping 4 tight ends I would have told you to punch yourself in the face.

But here we are.

And everyone is making good points :lol:

:applaudit: Can never walk away from a good football debate. It will be the death of me. Lol.

[DesertSteel]

I think under the new rules that Gentry is eligible for the practice squad, as is Heyward.

[Dwinsgames]

Gentry is going nowhere







I'm told #Steelers (https://twitter.com/hashtag/Steelers?src=hashtag_click) TE Zach Gentry has been informed he is being released, per source.