Chatter indicates Ben is coming back

[Mojouw]

https://steelersdepot.com/2021/01/report-growing-optimism-roethlisberger-will-play-in-2021-wants-smith-schuster-back-with-him/

So to be like the cool kids...reports are saying that all the "chatter" leads to Ben R coming back in 2021.

To this I say...sure...that was always the most likely outcome....but it is also the one I am the most on the fence about. Head tells me it won't end well. Heart wants to talk head into Ben somehow getting better over the off-season and improving his obvious flaws from 2020.

Also, talk Ben wants a bunch of the FA guys back if he plays. To that I say....put your money where you mouth is. Interesting if Ben does anything with his contract to make that happen or if he just expects the team to break its long term cap "plan" to appease him (which is what has taken place in the past). If it is the later....maybe just tell him to retire?

[st33lersguy]

Ben is done. His prime is over. All he will be doing is start to collect bad games and bad years. Of course they'll let him play as long as he wants even as he sinks further past his prime years

[DesertSteel]

I never had any doubt. But I think his BFF Pouncey will be gone.

[Shoes]

No surprise, same can be said for next years season.

[ShoeHorn]

Thank God. In all seriousness, who were the Steelers gonna get to play qb next year that is better than Ben, even at this stage of his career?

[Edman]

Of course they'll let him play as long as he wants even as he sinks further past his prime years

It's the last year of his contract. He's got 40 million reasons to come back for one more time even with declining play.

I've already accepted that the Steelers have a definitive ceiling with Ben in 2021. Some regular season wins, but December/January is a brick wall.

Just keep developing Rudolph/looking for the future guys in the mean time.


In all seriousness, who were the Steelers gonna get to play qb next year that is better than Ben, even at this stage of his career?

Mason Rudolph is better than this (declined) iteration of Ben. Mason also doesn’t cost a bundle to be mediocre. With Mason, you have hope that he develops, and if he doesn’t, eh, move on. With current Ben, you have no shot At anything whatsoever, and you cost the team valuable talent for the future because of his anchor of a contract.

The Steelers are paying current Ben Super Bowl Quarterback money for drastically lowering ceiling of contention. A Super Bowl is not in the cards anymore.

The only reason he's even back is because its a contract year for him and Tomlin. Make your money while you got it. Not because the Steelers believe he gives them the best chance to win.

I dread has the makings of getting extremely ugly. Like Favre/Packers divorce ugly.

[Shoes]

It's the last year of his contract. He's got 40 million reasons to come back for one more time even with declining play.

I've already accepted that the Steelers have a definitive ceiling with Ben in 2021. Some regular season wins, but the playoffs are a brick wall. Assuming they even get there this time.

Just keep developing Rudolph in the mean time.

Which is why I believe his comment about giving it up if he can't help the team is BS. Most of these guys can't make that decision because of Dollars and pride, that's when someone needs to step in and make it for them.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Thank God. In all seriousness, who were the Steelers gonna get to play qb next year that is better than Ben, even at this stage of his career?

Question is, do you want to pay the $19 Million to Ben so that he can be mediocre and basically do the same thing as this season??

Or, do you use that money on securing some young talent to contracts under the cap, instead of a 39 year old QB that now is about as accurate as Landry Jones was as a rookie? I get that they will spread out the contract for another season or 2, but at what point do you still pay $30 million to a QB that is worth $5million. Its like paying $20 for a T-bone steak that is so old its green.

[86WARD]

Told you...it will be Ben, Rudolph and Dobbs or Duck or Rudolph, Dobbs and Duck...

Maybe they’ll still draft a guy but I’m guessing they go OL or LB with pick number one. Outside chance that it could be TE.

Next year (2022) maybe a QB...

[Shoes]

Told you...it will be Ben, Rudolph and Dobbs or Duck or Rudolph, Dobbs and Duck...

Maybe they’ll still draft a guy but I’m guessing they go OL or LB with pick number one. Outside chance that it could be TE.

Next year (2022) maybe a QB...

Did they pick Duck up again?

[hawaiiansteeler]

Did they pick Duck up again?

trying to get their ducks in a row...

[Fire Goodell]

If he comes back, they absolutely need to give him a running game. Passing the ball 50 times a game at this stage in his career is not a recipe to success.

[86WARD]

Did they pick Duck up again?

Wasn’t he on the super secret Covid roster?

[Edman]

If he comes back, they absolutely need to give him a running game. Passing the ball 50 times a game at this stage in his career is not a recipe to success.

Is Ben willing to shed his ego for just a little to buy into it?

Running the football requires a shift in offensive philosophy. Like multiple formations, implementation of things like motion and play action. And more notably, dropping the Shotgun offense and draw plays. It also requires a shift in mentality. You have to run the football, and commit to physicality.

Is Ben with his diminished athleticism but increased control over the offense, willing to move out of his comfort (The Fichtner Shotgun) to a Game manager role in a run-favored offense? Even If it’s for just one season? I doubt it.

[teegre]

Good-bye, Mike Hilton

[Shoes]

Wasn’t he on the super secret Covid roster?

I thought the steelers booted him?


https://steelersdepot.com/2021/01/2020-stock-watch-qb-devlin-hodges-stock-sold/

[Mojouw]

Time for Ben to sign a fake extension for ZERO additional dollars. Makes his 2021 cap hit about $20 million. Then the other millions are pushed to future years as voidable years. Basically Drew Brees contract.

[BlackAndGold]

He also wants JuJu back lol. Imagine if they really listen to Ben and let players like Hilton/Sutton walk.

How about you take a massive paycut Ben?

[Shoes]

He also wants JuJu back lol. Imagine if they really listen to Ben and let players like Hilton/Sutton walk.

How about you take a massive paycut Ben?

yep, he said he wants to help the team win. That will help the team win.

[86WARD]

I thought the steelers booted him?


https://steelersdepot.com/2021/01/2020-stock-watch-qb-devlin-hodges-stock-sold/

Maybe waiting to see on Dobbs? If they can get Dobbs back, there may be no need to roster Duck again...unless there are COVID protocols into next season?

[that1guy]

I'd much rather Ben retires, the money is needed for retaining players like Hilton and Dupree. Ben isn't a great QB anymore, hell he is average on a good day. Fans need to dump the thought Ben will around for 3-4 more seasons, if the OL wasn't so putrid the Steelers would be smart to trade up and get Bens replacement but RB and OL are desperately needed in the upcoming draft.

[st33lersguy]

Ben coming back will cost enough cap space but now he wants the lesser version of Chad Ochocinco? If they choose Juju over Mike Hilton because of Ben I'm not gonna be happy. Frankly I say release him at a point that will cost the least cap space

[86WARD]

But you don’t know what the contract details will be for next season...these things could (hopefully) change.

[DesertSteel]

All the neighbors have shiny new fast cars and we have an 18-year-old Hummer with high mileage and an oil leak.

[Steeler-in-west]

Been a fan of Ben, but yeah, seems like he’s on his last legs, and don’t know if he has enough for one more year

if I had to choose between Ben and a downgraded defense versus Rudolph and the defense at full strength (with Hilton and Dupree returning) I’d lean toward the latter - assuming the O line is revamped and we get a great RB pickup in the draft (or FA)

[Mojouw]

Ben coming back will cost enough cap space but now he wants the lesser version of Chad Ochocinco? If they choose Juju over Mike Hilton because of Ben I'm not gonna be happy. Frankly I say release him at a point that will cost the least cap space


But you don’t know what the contract details will be for next season...these things could (hopefully) change.

I think you are both kinda right. Franchise QBs that are in their prime and doing awesome franchise QB things get to dictate how their team's spend cap dollars and round out the roster. Just the way of the NFL world. Former franchise QBs in the twilight of their careers that can't just put an entire team on their back and gut out wins, don't get to make those calls any longer.

Which one is Ben at this point? And, more importantly, which one is he willing to acknowledge he is? That will be the story of the Steelers offseason.

[Rotorhead]

Well, if Ben really wants one last shot, he must know he will need to restructure his contract to a Brees type deal. So maybe we get to keep the key pieces and draft OL and find a RB.

[Rotorhead]

I think you are both kinda right. Franchise QBs that are in their prime and doing awesome franchise QB things get to dictate how their team's spend cap dollars and round out the roster. Just the way of the NFL world. Former franchise QBs in the twilight of their careers that can't just put an entire team on their back and gut out wins, don't get to make those calls any longer.

Which one is Ben at this point? And, more importantly, which one is he willing to acknowledge he is? That will be the story of the Steelers offseason.

Exactly this

[Born2Steel]

Good.

[Craic]

I was thinking about this today. What do we know about Ben? His arm is still strong and he is still able to get the ball downfield. So, there are no physical problems (he might not be the Ben of his mid twenties, but he still has physical tools that are at the very least, average).

Another problem with age is decision-making might slow down. But, he got the ball out earlier per play this year than pretty much ever. And, for the first 2/3rds of the season, did it very accurately. So, there's no problem with decision-making speed.

A third problem with age is the ability to recover. That, I think, might have come into play here. But that also has two other mitigating factors. The first one is the lack of a true bye-week. The second one is that he was coming off surgery. Even though he was ahead of schedule, I can't imagine he built his muscle stamina (both in the arm and in general) back up to cope with a full season. That leads me to think that age might have been a factor in the stretch but there are other issues that played into that as well.

So, what about next season? What might there be that would affect Ben positively?



New Offensive Coordinator. The play calling definitely changed as the year progressed. Was that due to Ben's arm not being strong enough or something else? We won the game against the Colts by Ben opening up the offense and going deeper with his passes. I don't think his arm was the problem.
One year removed from surgery. While I don't think his arm was an issue per se (as in the previous post), I do think there is something to be said for not being able to workout like you normally would in the offseason. There's no way you can tell me that a year and a couple of months removed from rehab doesn't find you in a better place that a couple of months removed from rehab.
Matt Canada. I know, I already mentioned a new OC. But, if rumors are correct and Canada has the inside track, then Ben will not only benefit by a new OC, he'll benefit from a new OC that he already knows, and already knows him.
There's also the possibility we get a better line coach and see improvement there, which translates to a better run game, which also translates to a better passing game.


Does all this mean I think we'll get a 2008 Ben who could put the team on his shoulders and will it to a win in the waning moments of a game? No. But it does means I'm willing to let Ben earn his salary next year behind center and spend that first round draft pick on the line or a RB (I'd prefer to trade it for the following year's first-round pick so we can bundle them and move up in the draft, but the Steelers don't do that).

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

All the neighbors have shiny new fast cars and we have an 18-year-old Hummer with high mileage and an oil leak.

I agree. I think even if he comes back and they stretch out the salary to make it able to choke down, the Steelers still need to find the QB of the future in the offseason, or some vet to bridge. Rudolph still has a way to go I think, but if there is somebody in the draft worth trading up, then go for it.

Essentially, we are in the 1983 Terry Bradshaw decline situation. Remembering the glory years, because what we see on the field isnt as impressive. Some fans dont want to believe its over, when it was over a couple years ago, but they just want to feel like they have a chance to win games on sundays and live with mediocrity, and cling to that hope they can get back to 2008 Super Bowl form with Ben one last time.

[86WARD]

All the neighbors have shiny new fast cars and we have an 18-year-old Hummer with high mileage and an oil leak.

That fast, shiny black and purple car that was running yesterday had some sort of electrical problem and conked out...again...

Sometimes it’s not so bad to throw a quart of oil in the engine once a month to get by until you can afford something better.

[pczach]

That fast, shiny black and purple car that was running yesterday had some sort of electrical problem and conked out...again...

Sometimes it’s not so bad to throw a quart of oil in the engine once a month to get by until you can afford something better.



The shiny new fast car put 3 points on the board without a dominant running game and snaps flying by him.....go figure.

[DesertSteel]

That fast, shiny black and purple car that was running yesterday had some sort of electrical problem and conked out...again...

Sometimes it’s not so bad to throw a quart of oil in the engine once a month to get by until you can afford something better.
He still has one more playoff win than Ben the past 4 years.

[teegre]

RAVENS FANS: But, but, but... our top three QBs were out with injuries.

OTHER FANS: Yes... we know. It’s what happens to QBs who run more than they pass.

[Rotorhead]

He still has one more playoff win than Ben the past 4 years.

He also has an OC who game plans around his and his players talents . . .

[EzraTank]

If he comes back and a great QB is available in round #1 they have to draft that QB and send the message loud and clear that this is your last year here. I'm too lazy to go out and look at what would happen if they cut him and what the important dates are to cut him to minimize our CAP hit.

After watching Rodgers play last night and calmly take apart the "#1 defense" in the league it's sad to think what Ben has become. Rodgers didn't look a year younger than Ben, he looked 10 years younger.

[DesertSteel]

He also has an OC who game plans around his and his players talents . . .
Make no mistake. Ben had the OC that HE WANTED.

[86WARD]

He still has one more playoff win than Ben the past 4 years.

True. BUt people don't look twice at a 10-year old Hummer on the side of the road leaking oil. But if you are on the side a little further up the road in your shiny new black and purple speedster, people will definitely slow down and laugh, some may even point and if it's a young punk kid, you may get hit with a chocolate shake from sonic...and that could ruin your paint job...

[DesertSteel]

True. BUt people don't look twice at a 10-year old Hummer on the side of the road leaking oil. But if you are on the side a little further up the road in your shiny new black and purple speedster, people will definitely slow down and laugh, some may even point and if it's a young punk kid, you may get hit with a chocolate shake from sonic...and that could ruin your paint job...
You seem fixated on only one neighbor's car.

[86WARD]

You seem fixated on only one neighbor's car.

A little or maybe I just take offense to people making fun of old Hummer's.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

A little or maybe I just take offense to people making fun of old Hummer's.

The old Hummer was a nice vehicle when it wasnt so old. Now its leaking, the wheel bearings are worn, the engine needs an overhaul, as its burning oil. It might get you to the local grocery store every few days, but its not reliable enough to get you on any kind of long haul. Plus, you still owe $20 million on it, because you kept putting the finance payments on your Discover card at 20% interest.

So if you want to look ok around the neighborhood, but never really travel anywhere, then the old Hummer is your automobile. Otherwise, if you want to actually get to your destination, its time to start looking at a new ride.

[86WARD]

The old Hummer was a nice vehicle when it wasnt so old. Now its leaking, the wheel bearings are worn, the engine needs an overhaul, as its burning oil. It might get you to the local grocery store every few days, but its not reliable enough to get you on any kind of long haul. Plus, you still owe $20 million on it, because you kept putting the finance payments on your Discover card at 20% interest.

So if you want to look ok around the neighborhood, but never really travel anywhere, then the old Hummer is your automobile. Otherwise, if you want to actually get to your destination, its time to start looking at a new ride.

Yeah probably. But the fast shiny sports car isn’t necessarily that great. Maybe something like a Porsche Cayenne? Maybe a Lambo Urus? Even one of those high performance Jeep Grand Cherokees may be nice?

[hawaiiansteeler]

https://i.gyazo.com/5be6ce564ebe3ffa03e815162972b0a5.png

[Born2Steel]

https://i.gyazo.com/5be6ce564ebe3ffa03e815162972b0a5.png

Ben will give YOU half of his $41M or half of his $19M....100% SHOULD NOT RETIRE!

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Ben will give YOU half of his $41M or half of his $19M....100% SHOULD NOT RETIRE!

Ben is getting the $22,250,000, whether fans like it or not, whether they understand it or not! That is signing bonus and deferments of contract that were part of restructures. That money is GUARANTEED ! That counts against the cap, whether he retires, stays, is released, etc.

The extra $19million is what is variable. It is $4mil salary for 2021 and a $15million Roster Bonus that is due the 3rd day of the new league year. (sometime in March I think)

The question is that if the Steelers want him back and he wants to come back, can they do an extension to spread that $41 million over 2 years, so its not cap crippling, or something close. There is zero need to be in cap hell with a $41million cap hit for a QB who has the skills of Ryan Fitzpatrick, when you can just save the $19million and move forward.

I never understood the fans that resent an athlete being paid the money that is contractually owed to him. :confused: They are either bitter people, jealous, uninformed, plain ole dumb, or a combination. Especially in the NFL where there are NO guaranteed contracts.

[Rotorhead]

Combination of all that I think. If we are already paying the guy ~$20m, may as well see if we can get him to restructure to a contract that only pays him that $$ and the rest we could erase the following years (if he agreeable to that) and use him one last year.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Combination of all that I think. If we are already paying the guy ~$20m, may as well see if we can get him to restructure to a contract that only pays him that $$ and the rest we could erase the following years (if he agreeable to that) and use him one last year.

Nope. He should not do that.

$9,750,000 is from restructured money that he already would have been paid, had he not restructured his deal a few years ago, to provide cap relief. Its money the Steelers owe him from going to the "Bank of Ben", so they could sign other players.

$12,500,000 is from his last signing bonus. Its part of the guaranteed money given to a player in the contract. Teams do not pay the guaranteed money all at once, its spread out over the length of the contract. Example, $20million signing bonus on a 5 year deal means the player gets $4million a season in signing bonus over that 5 years(guaranteed).

If I am Ben, or his agent, all of that $22million is owed and I am collecting it. I would want at least another $5 million for the upcoming season. Not sure the mechanics of it, but something like sign an extension that pays an extra $5million in signing bonus and $1 in salary, which defers the roster bonus of $15million to next season and spreads the signing bonus to $8.8 per year for 2021 and 2022, with the $9.75 being paid in 2021. Basically he gets $18.5 in 2021 and another approx $8.8million in 2022 guaranteed.

[Mojouw]

Do people even read the stuff posted about what the options are with Ben's contract? It really isn't hard.

Almost everything posted here about reducing Ben's cap charges is just fantasy.

EGJ has about the best take on it.

[cubanstogie]

Do people even read the stuff posted about what the options are with Ben's contract? It really isn't hard.

Almost everything posted here about reducing Ben's cap charges is just fantasy.

EGJ has about the best take on it.
personally I don’t care if it’s 10 mill, 20 or 40. I don’t want to relive 2020 season with a 39 year old QB who cant do things we’ve come to expect as fans. it’s frustrating and sad to watch. give him his 20 million and cut ties. Maybe Patriots will sign him if he has competitive juices still flowing. There is a small chance if Ettiene or Harris is drafted and get some O line help Ben could manage game and be effective but anymore effective than Mason ? cut the cord, pay him his money and start finding QB of future.

[Born2Steel]

It exhausting to me that "fans" want a guy who lead this team for 17 seasons and ALWAYS gave us a chance to make the playoffs to basically just walk away from money HE has pushed down the road for the benefit of the team. I don't care if it's $2 or $200M it's HIS money. Maybe my memory is fading but it seems just last season the team won 8 games without Ben and won 12 games this season with Ben. His old crippled ass falling forward for 2 yards every play.

It's not that I want the franchise to be hamstrung by not enough money to re-sign FAs or bring in new FAs, but I feel like the guy has earned his payday with the organization. And if that means we as "fans" take a hit with a bad season or 2 then so be it. Again, it's HIS money. The Ben could do this or that so it's not such a burden is totally beside the point and not even what many of you are suggesting about the situation at all.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Do people even read the stuff posted about what the options are with Ben's contract? It really isn't hard.
Almost everything posted here about reducing Ben's cap charges is just fantasy.


let's just cut Ben and use that $41 million to sign Carson Wentz and Deshaun Watson. :yup:

[Mojouw]

let's just cut Ben and use that $41 million to sign Carson Wentz and Deshaun Watson. :yup:

And bring back Dupree and Juju! Plus Mike Hilton - he's so gritty!!

[pczach]

let's just cut Ben and use that $41 million to sign Carson Wentz and Deshaun Watson. :yup:



With all those savings, let's not forget to sign the entire All-Pro roster at Vet minimum. :lol:

[cubanstogie]

It exhausting to me that "fans" want a guy who lead this team for 17 seasons and ALWAYS gave us a chance to make the playoffs to basically just walk away from money HE has pushed down the road for the benefit of the team. I don't care if it's $2 or $200M it's HIS money. Maybe my memory is fading but it seems just last season the team won 8 games without Ben and won 12 games this season with Ben. His old crippled ass falling forward for 2 yards every play.

It's not that I want the franchise to be hamstrung by not enough money to re-sign FAs or bring in new FAs, but I feel like the guy has earned his payday with the organization. And if that means we as "fans" take a hit with a bad season or 2 then so be it. Again, it's HIS money. The Ben could do this or that so it's not such a burden is totally beside the point and not even what many of you are suggesting about the situation at all.
he’s absolutely earned his pay day, the question is is he going to earn 20 mill for being released or 40 mill for playing. either option a great deal for Ben and his family. I don’t have a say as a fan, but my hope is he’s not back. It’s easy for me though, Ben has never been my favorite Steeler. I still appreciate all he’s done and will watch his induction into HOF.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

he’s absolutely earned his pay day, the question is is he going to earn 20 mill for being released or 40 mill for playing. either option a great deal for Ben and his family. I don’t have a say as a fan, but my hope is he’s not back. It’s easy for me though, Ben has never been my favorite Steeler. I still appreciate all he’s done and will watch his induction into HOF.

He is going to get the $21million just because its part of the contract he signed a few years ago. Its already been earned.

I dont really know that the Steelers can afford to pay him the entire $40 million and still sign other good players. I hope they find a way to either stretch it out another year if they want him back, or else just release him and have his contract off the books for 2022.

[teegre]

Ben gets $21 million whether he retires, plays, gets cut, becomes a coach, or starts messaging on here under the username"HelmetsSuck".

The difference is the $19 million.

If he retires, it would be nice to have that $19 million to re-sign Mike Hilton and/or Cam Sutton. (Up until a few days ago, I would have added JuJu to this list, but the vitriol spewing from Pittsburgh has probably burned that bridge.)

If the Steelers traded for Watson/Stafford, they could certainly use that $19 for the younger QB. And, as I mentioned in the other thread (about Watson), he is young enough that his $40 million/year contract can be finagled over the next eight seasons.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Ben gets $21 million whether he retires, plays, gets cut, becomes a coach, or starts messaging on here under the username"HelmetsSuck".

The difference is the $19 million.

If he retires, it would be nice to have that $19 million to re-sign Mike Hilton and/or Cam Sutton. (Up until a few days ago, I would have added JuJu to this list, but the vitriol spewing from Pittsburgh has probably burned that bridge.)

If the Steelers traded for Watson/Stafford, they could certainly use that $19 for the younger QB. And, as I mentioned in the other thread (about Watson), he is young enough that his $40 million/year contract can be finagled over the next eight seasons.

don't be surprised if this happens:

How Voidable Year Contract Extensions Might Play Into Steelers Early Offseason Plans

https://steelersdepot.com/2021/01/how-voidable-year-contract-extensions-might-play-into-steelers-early-offseason-plans/

[Mojouw]

I think the 15 million signing bonus is part of the 2021 cap hit for Ben which he is getting regardless. So, of the 41 million due Ben, he's getting 15 million for sure, that leaves 26 million to spread into future years. If they do a 1 year zero dollar extension, that would be 13 million + 15 million and Ben would still be a 28million cap hit in 2021. I think that is how they do this but I'm not certain, someone check me on this.

That sounds about right. I was just too lazy to check the actual numbers from previously posted sources.

Here is the one I have been using: https://steelersdepot.com/2020/08/looking-ahead-at-2021-ben-roethlisberger-contract-cap-cutting-scenarios/

Which provides this detailed bit: "...he could agree to an extension that would add four more years and not require any new money in 2021 and accept all of his $15 million roster bonus and $2.925 million of his $4 million base salary that he’s due as a signing bonus. In short, all but $1.075 million of the $19 million due Roethlisberger in 2021 would be turned into a signing bonus and four additional voidable years added to the quarterback’s contract...would result in the Steelers saving $14.34 million in 2021 cap space as Roethlisberger’s new cap charge would be $26.91 million."

[teegre]

don't be surprised if this happens:

How Voidable Year Contract Extensions Might Play Into Steelers Early Offseason Plans

https://steelersdepot.com/2021/01/how-voidable-year-contract-extensions-might-play-into-steelers-early-offseason-plans/

Sadly, the one that will be a big cap casualty is Bince.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

don't be surprised if this happens:

How Voidable Year Contract Extensions Might Play Into Steelers Early Offseason Plans

https://steelersdepot.com/2021/01/how-voidable-year-contract-extensions-might-play-into-steelers-early-offseason-plans/

Thanks for sharing. Interesting to know.

At the end of the day, the Steelers are gonna figure out how to make things work. Some guys gonna be kept, some may be cap casualties. I have zero way to impact it. Fans just need to know that anything "guaranteed" in a contract is 100% owed to the player and they deserve every penny of it. Gonna be interesting to see what shakes out.

[Dwinsgames]

I would rather resign Dobbs , Hilton, Sutton and extend Spillain to assume the ILB spot beside Bush with the Likely departure of VW do to his cap number .....

Hand the reigns over to the Reindeer and if by week 4 or 5 he doesnt look like he belongs replace him with Dobbs and let him use his legs and big arm 1970s raiders style offense run run bomb but the added dimension that Dobbs himself can scoot ...

if your offense is going to be questionable your defense better be stellar