Heroes/Goats vs Dolphins

[Edman]

Steelers almost blow it, but beat Miami to move to 3-4.

Heroes: Second Half Team.

Goats: First Half Team.

[Mojouw]

Juju and Watt.

Rudolph almost gets the goat.

[AtlantaDan]

Heroes - Conner (Tomlin says AC joint shoulder injury), JuJu, Watt, Minkah (like this trade more & more)

Goats - Fichtner (at last I have found the heir to Arians as the weekly recipient of my postgame angst)

[Fire Goodell]

Conner and Watt

[Shoes]

Tomlin, he won a challenge! :lol:

[BlackAndGold]

1189023269871067136

[Edman]

Rudolph almost gets the goat.

First game coming back from a concussion, horrible start (His first really bad play all season), fans booing him to death, Duck chants, and he didn't fall apart and leads the Steelers O to another 20+ points.

If that makes him a goat, then I wonder if he'll win the hero someday.

[smokin3000gt]

First game coming back from a concussion, horrible start (His first really bad play all season), fans booing him to death, Duck chants, and he didn't fall apart and leads the Steelers O to another 20+ points.

If that makes him a goat, then I wonder if he'll win the hero someday.

I gotta give it to the kid as well. I thought he'd be skiddish after getting his marbled knocked out but he didn't even flinch in the pocket

[Mojouw]

First game coming back from a concussion, horrible start (His first really bad play all season), fans booing him to death, Duck chants, and he didn't fall apart and leads the Steelers O to another 20+ points.

If that makes him a goat, then I hate to see him win the hero someday.

He caused 7 of the Phins points and left at least 14 “easy” points on the field. This is the NFL. It’s hard. First half and portions of the second, Rudolph looked uncertain and confused.

Two scores were a blown coverage and an amazing play by Juju.

Against not the Dolphins, Rudolph largely contributes to a loss.

[Mojouw]

Rudolph was late on almost every throw. His ball placement was atrocious. He misfired on multiple open deep balls. He also was off schedule all night on screens. Plays that should've went for big gains were stopped short because of late throws.

[Mojouw]

All that being said, Rudolph battled and made just enough plays to put the team ahead and gut out a win.

So, yeah, almost goat.

[Fire Goodell]

So we got 2 dong TD's and Mason gave the dolphins one :chuckle:

[st33lersguy]

Game Ball: TJ is a beast. I don't know what the T stands for but it should stand for terror, also Minkah for the revenge picks and Juju had his best game of the season

Goat: Tomlin had his team ill-prepared again for a shitty team going down by 14, he's just merely lucky the Dolphins are more suited for the FBS. Seriously what did he do during the bye week? Also Fichtner, his playcalls make me miss Todd Haley

[HollywoodSteel]

He caused 7 of the Phins points and left at least 14 “easy” points on the field. This is the NFL. It’s hard. First half and portions of the second, Rudolph looked uncertain and confused.

Two scores were a blown coverage and an amazing play by Juju.

Against not the Dolphins, Rudolph largely contributes to a loss.

All true, but I’m absolutely happy that we let him play rather than turtle and win without giving him a chance to go through his growing pains.

I figure Mason either is the man or he isn’t. This is the season to find that out. Our number one priority this season is to give him maximum opportunity to grow and succeed or fail and let us know that he isn’t the future.

I don’t care about winning a few games to go 6-10 through brilliant play calling and utilizing his “strengths” if his strengths don’t involve being able to throw accurate passes like an NFL QB.

[Mojouw]

So we got 2 dong TD's and Mason gave the dolphins one :chuckle:

You get a dong TD. AND YOU GET A DONG TD! Everyone gets a dong TD!!

[Mojouw]

All true, but I’m absolutely happy that we let him play rather than turtle and win without giving him a chance to go through his growing pains.

I figure Mason either is the man or he isn’t. This is the season to find that out. Our number one priority this season is to give him maximum opportunity to grow and succeed or fail and let us know that he isn’t the future.

I don’t care about winning a few games to go 6-10 through brilliant play calling and utilizing his “strengths” if his strengths don’t involve being able to throw accurate passes like an NFL QB.

All of this is spot on. I'd never bench Rudoplh unless he's hurt. Gotta see what he can become.

[Shoes]

I think Mason cleaned it up as the game went on. At least he isn't "seeing ghosts" like Sam Darnold. He's a gutsy kid, it will be good to see how he develops.

[Edman]

All true, but I’m absolutely happy that we let him play rather than turtle and win without giving him a chance to go through his growing pains.

I figure Mason either is the man or he isn’t. This is the season to find that out. Our number one priority this season is to give him maximum opportunity to grow and succeed or fail and let us know that he isn’t the future.

I don’t care about winning a few games to go 6-10 through brilliant play calling and utilizing his “strengths” if his strengths don’t involve being able to throw accurate passes like an NFL QB.

They stopped pretending Mason is Ben Roethlisberger and started calling plays that make him throw in rhythm. The quick slant was a good play, Dolphins blown coverage or not. Once that happened, he took off.

I concede that he pulls too late and that results in throwing behind, but he can get better at that.

If the Steelers go into the Colts game and try to turn Mason into Ben and still act like we have Antonio Brown, then the game is lost before its even played. I do not trust Fichtner to get the message.

[Mojouw]

They stopped pretending Mason is Ben Roethlisberger and started calling plays that make him throw in rhythm. The quick slant was a good play, Dolphins blown coverage or not. Once that happened, he took off.

I concede that he pulls too late and that results in throwing behind, but he can get better at that.

If the Steelers go into the Colts game and try to turn Mason into Ben, then the team is fucked. I do not trust Fichtner to get the message.

What does any of that even mean?

Rudolph missed easy short throws repeatedly.

In second half he hit the same throws he missed in first half.

Then he missed several late.

You keep posting something you feel very strongly about, but doesn't seem to always jive with what we all see on TV.

Honestly trying to understand.

[Edman]

What does any of that even mean?

Rudolph missed easy short throws repeatedly.

In second half he hit the same throws he missed in first half.

Then he missed several late.

You keep posting something you feel very strongly about, but doesn't seem to always jive with what we all see on TV.

Honestly trying to understand.

What I mean is that the Steelers should've focused more on establishing an early rhythm for Rudolph instead of making him overthink. You said it yourself. He's slow on the decisions, so make him decide faster. Quick reads and throws. Tonight's gameplan was Mason being thrust into the role of a gunslinger offense. We've seen the warts.

The first throw were developing routes to grab an early chunk, but Mason missed it badly and resulted in the pick. I get that you want your shots early and prove a point, but theres a difference between wanting a player to grow and making him be someone he's not. Even worse, it was an awful throw.

[Craic]

Game Ball: TJ is a beast. I don't know what the T stands for but it should stand for terror, also Minkah for the revenge picks and Juju had his best game of the season

Goat: Tomlin had his team ill-prepared again for a shitty team going down by 14, he's just merely lucky the Dolphins are more suited for the FBS. Seriously what did he do during the bye week? Also Fichtner, his playcalls make me miss Todd Haley

:doh: If there were a way, you'd pin the Kennedy assassination on Tomlin, too.

[Fire Goodell]

Miami vs the Jets next week? who's gonna win? I honestly don't know lol. I mean other than a lucky win against Dallas I don't really see much of a diff between the two teams

[Craic]

Game Ball: TJ is a beast. I don't know what the T stands for but it should stand for terror, also Minkah for the revenge picks and Juju had his best game of the season

Goat: Tomlin had his team ill-prepared again for a shitty team going down by 14, he's just merely lucky the Dolphins are more suited for the FBS. Seriously what did he do during the bye week? Also Fichtner, his playcalls make me miss Todd Haley

If there were a way, you'd pin the Kennedy assassination on Tomlin, too.

We had a QB who gifted the team the ball twice. A defense that was getting tired because they were on the field so much. And then, the team took control of the game and put up 27 unanswered points. And you're statement here is. Tomlin is the goat? :doh:

[HollywoodSteel]

:doh: If there were a way, you'd pin the Kennedy assassination on Tomlin, too. :Doh:

The Kennedys are just dead Indians in his cowboy movie. Obviously.

[Fire Goodell]

ok fine game balls, no one. if it wasn't for losing, the dolphins totally would've won.

[Craic]

The Kennedys are just dead Indians in his cowboy movie. Obviously.

I read that as, "Kennedys are just dead Italians . . ." It was a real head-scratcher for a few seconds, there!

[DesertSteel]

Minkah and TJ.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

I haven't seen the game yet. Funny thing is that by the tone of this thread its hard to tell if the Steelers won or lost.

I mean, all the sports websites show the Steelers with a victory, but there doesn't seem to be many pleased by it in this thread.

[Mojouw]

What I mean is that the Steelers should've focused more on establishing an early rhythm for Rudolph instead of making him overthink. You said it yourself. He's slow on the decisions, so make him decide faster. Quick reads and throws. Tonight's gameplan was Mason being thrust into the role of a gunslinger offense. We've seen the warts.

The first throw were developing routes to grab an early chunk, but Mason missed it badly and resulted in the pick. I get that you want your shots early and prove a point, but theres a difference between wanting a player to grow and making him be someone he's not. Even worse, it was an awful throw.

They were the same routes he hit later. They weren't big slow developing plays. Rudolph just waited too long and throw a horrific ball.

Ben was on the sidelines showing him that if he put the ball high and on an arc, juju pulls it in and rumbles for some big yards.

Slow to pull the trigger and bad ball placement is a deadly combo in the NFL.

Rudolph missed screens and passes to his backs for the same reasons.

The simplified gunslinger versus quick trigger you are painting just isn't true.

[DesertSteel]

They were the same routes he hit later. They weren't big slow developing plays. Rudolph just waited too long and throw a horrific ball.

Ben was on the sidelines showing him that if he put the ball high and on an arc, juju pulls it in and rumbles for some big yards.

Slow to pull the trigger and bad ball placement is a deadly combo in the NFL.

Rudolph missed screens and passes to his backs for the same reasons.

The simplified gunslinger versus quick trigger you are painting just isn't true.
Have you seen Ben play worse games than Mason played tonight?

[Fire Goodell]

Have you seen Ben play worse games than Mason played tonight?

I have. The 2 pick six games vs the Raiders and pretty much any game vs Jacksonville except the playoff game we lost 42-45

[Mojouw]

Have you seen Ben play worse games than Mason played tonight?
Sure. The one after he ate a Buick comes to mind. There have been others for sure. But I’ve never seen Ben look as indecisive and hesitant play after play like Rudolph did early tonight.

Look, I am a Mason Rudolph fan. I believe in his potential. But I refuse to let this false narrative that his struggles are rooted in “deep ball bad” and “slow developing plays”.

Mason’s struggles are solely linked to his inexperience and desire to not make big mistakes leading to a slow process to pulling the trigger, throws then coming out late giving defenders time to make a break on the ball after the WR has hit the top of their routes, and then the throw being behind the WR - again allowing defenders to break to the ball and contest the catch point. On top of that, early in the Miami game (and others) Rudolph has almost seemed to short-arm balls trying to place them, rather than just letting it rip.

Rudolph, like any QB (including Ben R), needs to trust what he sees, process really really fast, hit his drop back, plant and fire. Almost every time he did that, he looked really good. Borderline impressive. When he held the ball and just kinda stared down the field, bad things compounded and awful results ensued.

Like I said in the game thread, I don’t think it is predominantly a schematic problem. It is largely that Rudolph is still all over the place as a QB. Makes it hard to cut through the “noise” and identify what is working and what isn’t.

[Steeler-in-west]

Heroes: OL for the running game and giving Rudolph enough time to throw, juju, and the defense

goats: baron and a couple others for the atrocious tackling on that second TD

Honorable mention: Rudolph for getting it together in the second half. He’s started to throw some real accurate passes out there. Even though he also missed a couple deep balls - I think he’s turned a corner and will only get better and more consistent from here on out (Just a guess, he could also crack against a better colt D too, but I don’t think so)

[86WARD]

Heroes: Conner, JuJu, Watt, Minkah

Goats: Early coaching, O-Line

[teegre]

ok fine game balls, no one. if it wasn't for losing, the dolphins totally would've won.

This was a dong victory. It doesn’t count as a win. The Steelers record should be 2-4 still.

[AtlantaDan]

Rudolph, like any QB (including Ben R), needs to trust what he sees, process really really fast, hit his drop back, plant and fire. Almost every time he did that, he looked really good. Borderline impressive. When he held the ball and just kinda stared down the field, bad things compounded and awful results ensued.

Like I said in the game thread, I don’t think it is predominantly a schematic problem. It is largely that Rudolph is still all over the place as a QB. Makes it hard to cut through the “noise” and identify what is working and what isn’t.

On the TD the Dolphins gifted the Steelers at the end of the first half, DeCastro said Rudolph recognized the max blitz defense the Dolphins were in because the Steelers had seen it on video and audibled the blocking scheme to pick it up - so after the horrid start there were nuggets of improvement

Will see if that continues against a real NFL team Sunday - with Conner likely out and other RBs banged up Rudolph will have to do more

[teegre]

HERO: Rudolph stepping into throws

GOAT: Rudolph not stepping into throws

[Born2Steel]

Heroes: The outside run blocking. Downfield game. Conner. JuJu. Fichtner. The Steeler’s defense all around. Butler. The Dolphin’s defense blitzing everyone on 3rd and 20.

Goats: Steelers win-no goats.

[NCSteeler]

Rudolph was late on almost every throw. His ball placement was atrocious. He misfired on multiple open deep balls. He also was off schedule all night on screens. Plays that should've went for big gains were stopped short because of late throws.No excuse but he looked alot like Ben coming back from an injury

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

[Shoes]

I mean, Mason started his 4th game last night after being KO'ed three week ago. He's going to be fine, sure he has to make quicker decisions and better throws but we won the game. Why does every thread have to turn into a pissing contest?

[tube517]

This was a dong victory. It doesn’t count as a win. The Steelers record should be 2-4 still.

If we beat Indy it's because we beat their "backup". Another dong victory lol

[EzraTank]

All true, but I’m absolutely happy that we let him play rather than turtle and win without giving him a chance to go through his growing pains.

I figure Mason either is the man or he isn’t. This is the season to find that out. Our number one priority this season is to give him maximum opportunity to grow and succeed or fail and let us know that he isn’t the future.

I don’t care about winning a few games to go 6-10 through brilliant play calling and utilizing his “strengths” if his strengths don’t involve being able to throw accurate passes like an NFL QB.

His receivers really bailed him out in the second half on some really bad throws. He played "good enough" against a really bad team to win, but IMHO he is not the man and here is why:

- His deep balls lack zip and accuracy.
- He under throws guys horribly (again lack of zip).
- He misses wide open guys.
- He has no mobility whatsoever (I'm not asking him to be Lamar Jackson, just not a statue).

Yes I know it's only this 4th NFL start but compare and contrast him to Ben at that point of his career. Ben took the reigns and ran with it. Yes Ben had a great defense to back him up but that 2004 season Ben played lights out without fear.

[DesertSteel]

Mason’s struggles are solely linked to his inexperience and desire to not make big mistakes leading to a slow process to pulling the trigger, throws then coming out late giving defenders time to make a break on the ball after the WR has hit the top of their routes, and then the throw being behind the WR - again allowing defenders to break to the ball and contest the catch point. On top of that, early in the Miami game (and others) Rudolph has almost seemed to short-arm balls trying to place them, rather than just letting it rip.

I think this is a fair assessment. He made 2-3 really stupid throws and 2-3 really bad throws. I can live with overthrowing a couple guys a matter of a foot or two. Maybe they under ran it as much as he overthrew it. He did have 4-5 throws that were really pretty. Grading it as a whole, it's a C+ for me.

[Dissolv]

Time for a Dong Superbowl!

[steel striker]

Look I don't care the Steelers got the win that is all that matters remember no style points for winning pretty. You got to remember also Mason was coming off the a concussion that he does not recall in anyway shape or form. Mason is going to make mistakes he is a young QB and, he played some nice throws after near the end of half time. Great plays from the Johnson & JUJU and, wow TJ Watt is something special plus Mika Fitz with two big INT"s. Let's hope Mason will play better next week and, a nice game from Conner I hope is okay.

[HollywoodSteel]

Sure. The one after he ate a Buick comes to mind. There have been others for sure. But I’ve never seen Ben look as indecisive and hesitant play after play like Rudolph did early tonight.

Look, I am a Mason Rudolph fan. I believe in his potential. But I refuse to let this false narrative that his struggles are rooted in “deep ball bad” and “slow developing plays”.

Mason’s struggles are solely linked to his inexperience and desire to not make big mistakes leading to a slow process to pulling the trigger, throws then coming out late giving defenders time to make a break on the ball after the WR has hit the top of their routes, and then the throw being behind the WR - again allowing defenders to break to the ball and contest the catch point. On top of that, early in the Miami game (and others) Rudolph has almost seemed to short-arm balls trying to place them, rather than just letting it rip.

Rudolph, like any QB (including Ben R), needs to trust what he sees, process really really fast, hit his drop back, plant and fire. Almost every time he did that, he looked really good. Borderline impressive. When he held the ball and just kinda stared down the field, bad things compounded and awful results ensued.

Like I said in the game thread, I don’t think it is predominantly a schematic problem. It is largely that Rudolph is still all over the place as a QB. Makes it hard to cut through the “noise” and identify what is working and what isn’t.

This is exactly right. We aren’t in a situation where Ben is coming back this year and Mason is just holding down the fort. If that were the case, I’d be FINE playing to his “strengths” and trying to scheme our way to a few close victories.

I was totally fine with that mentality when Duck was in there, holding down the fort for Rudolph.

But since Mason IS the QB for the entire season, the ONLY way we have a chance at a playoff run is if Mason turns out to be more than a stop-gap QB. It’s pointless to say things like “don’t expect him to be Ben.” My expectations don’t matter. I don’t expect one thing or another. We either have a franchise QB (or a guy who can BECOME a franchise QB with experience) or we don’t. He HAVE to get him as close to his ceiling as possible to have ANY chance at a meaningful season, and to find out if Mason is Ben’s successor.

Scheming to protect him so that we end up 7-9 rather than 5-11 means NOTHING for me, and won’t help this team in the long run.

I’m not convinced one way or the other about Mason, but I am kind of happy that he was put in a position where he had to throw the ball and come from behind to win. If he DOES end up being a QB who can win games for us, it will be BECAUSE he got the necessary experience and worked through his issues.

If we had run the ball on every down, and wildcatted our way to a victory over the Dolphins, to me it kind of would have been like a worthless preseason game where we didn’t use the game for its best purpose.

Now at least Mason has a lot of film to look at see what he needs to do to fix his issues.

[Squeegee Thompson]

Heroes:

1) TJ Watt - This guy's becoming a serious force to be reckoned with in the NFL whom offenses now have to specifically game plan around. Moving him to the left side is the smartest thing Butler may have ever done and is almost enough to make an argument that he should keep his job. ... Almost. He should've been credited with two strip sacks and causing an INT - the one where the phantom whistle probably saved Miami from giving up another TD. He was a human wrecking ball. Damn! - that was fun to watch.

2) Connor - Dude balled out and was playing violently all game. When the entire stadium knew the ball was going to him and the box was stacked with 9, sometimes 10 defenders - he still was grinding out big chunks, mostly after first contact. I think his YPC was nearly 7 yards last night. Losing him for any length of time would just put the icing on the cake of this already snake-bitten season.

3) JuJu - What's to say that already hasn't been said? Largely held in check until Xavien Howard went away, he was making every catch that was even in his zip code (and most of Mason's throws weren't). But that TD was a thing of beauty. Mason underthrew it and pretty much had thrown a pick until JuJu stole the ball from the corner. Mason needs to send JuJu a nice chianti and some fava beans for bailing out his statistics on an otherwise forgettable evening slinging the rock.

4) MFF - Rapidly becoming one of the best trade deals since LA sent us a fat running back in the 90s. He's always around the football. His first pick was a result of being in the right position in zone defense, and the second one was just a fantastic display of athleticism and concentration. Amazing diving catch with a clean securing of the ball before hitting the ground. Hopefully James Washington will study film of that pick long and hard this week so he can see how to apply it to his own craft.

5) Ironhead, Jr. - I was really worried what the loss of Tuitt would do to the pass rush and Heyward would be largely neutralized. Let's face it, he's on the wrong end of 30 and probably only has 1 or 2 effective years left to his career - but he played like a man possessed last night. That was a 24-year-old Heyward who showed up last night, and hopefully the one we'll see through the rest of the season.

6) Diontae Johnson - Starting to look like another Kevin Colbert 2nd-day gem. He's showing week over week that the stage isn't too big for him - and is really bringing it for prime time games. His OPI call was an absolute travesty of justice. A beautifully-thrown touch pass that he secured one-handed while Howard was holding back his left hand. (I may not be the sharpest knife in the drawer, but I'm pretty sure that's called 'defensive pass interference', Riveron). Had that call not been blown, horribly, the ESPN morons in front the microphone whom they pay to actually notice these types of things would've actually seen that he crossed the goal line cleanly as well. I had to throw a middle finger at the TV and choke back some choice words so the kids in the next room over wouldn't hear me when that lame-ass call stood after review.

Then, two plays later, Johnson took that crosser on blown coverage and turned on the jets. Some beautiful blocking by Washington (who took out 2 guys inside the 10), and the OPI was redeemed. I had to throw two birds at the TV - directed at Al Riveron and his merry band of Robert-Kraft-paid-off New York suits. Between the one-handed catch for what should've been a TD and the open field acceleration, DJ is starting to remind me of a certain other unemployed WR that used to grace Heinz Field on Sundays who would routinely come up huge in the biggest moments.


GOATS

1) Mason - Let's face it. That was ugly. His pre-game interview where he said he'd fully put the concussion behind him was utter horseshit on Nancy-Pelosian-levels of utter horseshit. I give him a bit of a pass since he hasn't played in 3 weeks and is coming back from having his lights put out. We've seen Ben look absolutely horrid many times in his first game back from injury, then turn it on by the 2nd week back. I'm really hoping that's the case for Mason, and this was just a matter of shaking off the rust and getting back in the saddle.

His throws were late, off-balance, and off-target. He's extremely lucky not to have at least 3 picks last night (one foot out of bounds by the defender, and JuJu simply stealing Ryan Lewis' lunch for his TD). He was holding the ball waaay too long, and even then, wasn't stepping up in the pocket at all. If you rewatch the game, all of his throws that were a little short were coming off his back foot. He couldn't even hit McDonald cleanly on a 5 yard checkdown in the 3rd quarter.

He frankly just looked scared in the pocket to me. I like Mason - a lot, and I'm really pulling for him. But he's gotta do better than that if he's gonna prove to be NFL-worthy, certainly black-n-gold worthy. I give him a mulligan for last night. He's got another home game next Sunday against a much better team. I won't give him another pass if he stinks up the joint again.

2) James Washington - Another guy I really like, but he's rapidly playing his way off of the team. On Mason's 2nd pick (or what should've been a pick), that pass clanged right off of both hands and into the defender's lap. The morons in the booth were too busy piling on Mason's decision-making to notice that the fault should've landed squarely on the receiver's shoulders. Then, later in the game when they were targeting Ryan Lewis on every deep throw, he had another one go right between his hands. He better turn it on and turn it on in a hurry because there's a rookie 3rd rounder on the roster who's showing him how to play WR at the NFL level. I'm not ready to give him the Limas Sweed 2.0 moniker just yet, but I'm getting really close.

His one solid contribution last night was that beautiful downfield blocking to secure DJ's TD. He took out not one but two guys to secure the TD in an incredibly important moment of the game down 14-3. I know that coaches saw what I did, and Tomlin was immediately complimenting Washington after that score.

3) Mark Barron - How is this guy actually getting playing time let alone residing on any NFL roster? Every time I see him in the MLB spot, my sphincter starts involuntarily twitching. His attempt at trying to strip the football on Miami's 2nd TD rather than ... ya know ... actually trying to tackle the guy in the white jersey had me absolutely fuming. I'm not sure Miami would be interested in this lazy waste of a 53-man spot if we shipped him over along with our 2021 first-round pick. Just dreadful. Mark Barron needs to go up to the nearest houseplant and apologize for working so hard to make the oxygen that he's wasting on a daily basis. Okay ... I feel better now. That was cathartic.

4) Rosie Nix - Odd to put him on the GOAT list, but did anyone else notice how the running game was actually worse with our pro-bowl FB in there compared to when Zack Banner was kept in as a tackle-eligible? Again, hopefully just first-game-back rust for Rosie, but he was getting stuffed when he was in there, against a defense that wasn't exactly the 1985 Bears ...

5) Pouncey - Not a terrible night, but not exactly a pro-bowl center night either. I believe he got called for 2 holds, and got walked right back into Mason's lap on his pick in the first quarter. The standard is the standard ... blah, blah, blah ... and that was definitely below the line.


All-in-all, just happy to get any win this season. And not terribly surprised at how sloppy the Steelers came out of the gate. Whether it's the first game of the season, or the first game after a bye week (post-season included), Tomlin never seems to have his guys ready to go. I kept telling myself that this was just the case when they were down 14-0, and lo-and-behold, they ripped off 27 unanswered.

3 and 4, with some very winnable games coming up, and all of sudden this team is relevant again. Beat the Colts next week and I'll start thinking that this team can make some noise later in the season.

[HollywoodSteel]

This was a dong victory. It doesn’t count as a win. The Steelers record should be 2-4 still.


I know you’re kidding... but the truth is, this wasn’t a dong victory, but it totally could have been if we had protected Rudolph from any possible mistakes and possible growth by just wildcating and scoring on defense or something.

This way, at least we are letting Mason work his way into trying to be a real NFL QB. I’m glad he made his horrible mistakes in this game where at least he has a chance to learn from them and grow.

I don’t want him swimming with floaties and never find out if he’s our guy who actually win a real swimming race.

[SteelMember]

Watt, MFF, Heyward and even Dupree had nice moments. Overall, I think the entire defense played better after the 1st quarter. 4 turnovers and 4 sacks is always a great sign.

Conor, Johnson, Juju were all good.

I actually though Mason played decent enough. He did have throws that were behind the crosses on multiple occasions, but he kept challenging their secondary deeper down the field. I mean, wasn't this the moan about his last starts. Folks bitch he doesn't throw it more than 5 yards, then he does and gets the same result. His deep ball was only off by a little on overthrows. Better than under throws, imo. That little bit can be the wr's release, his pocket and protection time... there's a lot to consider missing a 40 yard pass by 2 yards or less. It's not like I saw them sailing 10 yards over their heads. He put air under the ball, so I don't get the "zip" on the deep ball thoughts either. I mean, you can't zip a rainbow for 30-40 yards.

I actually like the fact that he tried to stay in the pocket and read the field. Sure, he did hold it longer than he should have with some of his decisions, but usually went with the check down. At least he's making more than one read and bailing. He knows scrambling is not his strength. Decisions do need to come quicker though.

Overall, I'd say a lot of his success/failures we based on the play of the o-line. Given a clean pocket, he was able to plant and made much better throws. Get his feet moving, and he was off. It's a difficult thing throwing on the run... not everybody has that talent to flick the ball while running and hit a moving target like the Russell Wilson's or Patrick Mahomes of the world. I think that is the baseball background those guys have.

[Edman]

The simplified gunslinger versus quick trigger you are painting just isn't true.

The touchdown pass Mason threw was a short quick pass to beat the blitz. Mason's "slow to pull the trigger" didn't seem to happen on that play. I wonder why.

Mason was thrust into a Ben-centric gunslinger Offense Monday. Read one side of the field, look deep and fire. Mason was asked to be Ben, and played just as jekyll-and-hyde as Ben. Mason's performance last night was not unlike some of Ben's performances over the past few years. He even pitched in with the head-scratching turnovers as well. Here's hoping the Steelers are reasonable enough to adjust the Offense a little more to Mason's skillset. What is encouraging is they did make adjustments. Granted Mason has to throw better, but that's the growing pains.

Great. We got to see what Mason's strengths and weaknesses are in a "real" offense. Got away with it because the Dolphins are so terrible, but we may have to take it a little differently.

[Mojouw]

The touchdown pass Mason threw was a short quick pass to beat the blitz. Mason's "slow to pull the trigger" didn't seem to happen on that play. I wonder why.

Mason was thrust into a Ben-centric gunslinger Offense Monday. Read one side of the field, look deep and fire. Mason was asked to be Ben, and played just as jekyll-and-hyde as Ben. Mason's performance last night was not unlike some of Ben's performances over the past few years. He even pitched in with the head-scratching turnovers as well. Here's hoping the Steelers are reasonable enough to adjust the Offense a little more to Mason's skillset.

Great. We got to see what Mason's strengths and weaknesses are in a real offense. Got away with it because the Dolphins are so terrible. If the Steelers trot out the same offensive gameplan against the Colts, you can pretty much erase any hope of winning. Period.

Dude was late and off target on screens, checkdowns, curls, and short crossers.

That is hardly gunslinger fling it around offense. It's rudimentary stuff.

[Edman]

Dude was late and off target on screens, checkdowns, curls, and short crossers.

That is hardly gunslinger fling it around offense. It's rudimentary stuff.

I attribute that to having a brain scrambled weeks prior and having next to no game time action since. Mason is usually able to hit the simple stuff. It was the big knock on him. Taking the simple stuff instead of taking risks.

[Craic]

Gameballs


Receivers as a unit, and specifically, JuJu and Johnson. Kept their head about them. Came back to the ball. Fought for it when they had to. Lots of effort on their part. They really helped a young, struggling QB find his rhythm.
Watt. I don't get it. Watching him, there's nothing that makes me go, "Wow!" on a consistent basis except that he is there making plays. He simply gets the job done. That's part of that, "Motor that never quits" mentality.
Heyward - specifically towards the end of the game. Seems he almost took over towards the end.
DBs. We let them score 14 points. Not good. Then, they figured out what was going on and fixed it. I know, "But it's Miami! Why did they score any points?" Well, you have a veteran QB that would make our team instantly better by half if he were playing on it right now. Old veteran wisdom is tough to beat if the veteran still has average skills to put the wisdom to use.
Conner. Great game. Sad to see him injured.


HM

Second-half Mason for sticking it out and turning his game around. I still doubt he's the answer for the future, but he had some plays in there that weren't "okay but the WR helped" type plays. It was nice to see.
Washington's hit on the Diontae Johnson's TD just before half time deserves its own special mention.



Goats:
Special Teams. Sure, they didn't make big mistakes tonight, but they don't help the team, either. (Punt and Kick coverage and return units).
First half Mason. If anyone doesn't think first-half Mason belongs here, I suggest not carpooling Cheech and Chong for a few days.

[HollywoodSteel]

I attribute that to having a brain scrambled weeks prior and having next to no game time action since. Mason is usually able to hit the simple stuff. It was the big knock on him. Taking the simple stuff instead of taking risks.

I guess what some of us are saying is that you can’t really be a successful QB in the NFL by just doing simple stuff. Now if Mason is just not there yet... great. I can accept that. But I absolutely want him working through those issues to get there. Especially against a team like the Dolphins. I’m glad he made those mistakes in that game if he learns from them and eventually becomes the QB that can make all the throws in the NFL.

But if Mason’s ceiling is short passes, so that’s what we have to cater the offense to, then I cannot accept that. Even if we could get a couple extras wins against bad teams that way. What’s the point of that?

When you say that I can’t expect him to be Ben... fine. Tell me who I can expect him to be. If that guy can put the game on his shoulders and win championships, then I’m happy with Mason. If he can’t ever do that, then this is the year to find that out.

The paradigm isn’t gunslinger vs. not gunslinger. Let’s just ditch that term now. We are not asking for a guy who takes chances just to take chances. Nobody is suggesting that he just chuck it downfield and see what happens.

[AtlantaDan]

Dude was late and off target on screens, checkdowns, curls, and short crossers.

That is hardly gunslinger fling it around offense. It's rudimentary stuff.


With regard to being late on throws this gets back to the recurring problems of the receivers being unable to get separation and/or Mason not seeing the field when a receiver breaks open

NFL.com publishes some esoteric data as NextGen Stats.

One stat for passers is Aggressiveness (AGG%). "Aggressiveness tracks the amount of passing attempts a quarterback makes that are into tight coverage, where there is a defender within 1 yard or less of the receiver at the time of completion or incompletion. AGG is shown as a % of attempts into tight windows over all passing attempts."

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/stats/passing#aggressiveness

The top 8 passers with the lowest % of passes thrown into tight coverage are Brees, Cousins, Mahomes, Ryan, Flacco :noidea: , Jimmy G, Rodgers and Brady. With the exception of Flacco, 5 of those 8 are respected veteran QBs, one (Mahomes) is a prodigy, and the 7th (Jimmy G.) is the beneficiary of playing for one of the most respected offensive coaches (Shanahan) in the NFL who can scheme open a receiver

The bottom 5 passers with the highest % of passes thrown into tight coverage are Mason, Stafford :noidea: , FitzMagic, Tannehill, and Daniel Jones (another first year starter).

Hopefully as Mason gets more reps that % will decline for him over the next 2 months.

[Mojouw]

With regard to being late on throws this gets back to the recurring problems of the receivers being unable to get separation and/or Mason not seeing the field when a receiver breaks open

NFL.com publishes some esoteric data as NextGen Stats.

One stat for passers is Aggressiveness (AGG%). "Aggressiveness tracks the amount of passing attempts a quarterback makes that are into tight coverage, where there is a defender within 1 yard or less of the receiver at the time of completion or incompletion. AGG is shown as a % of attempts into tight windows over all passing attempts."

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/stats/passing#aggressiveness

The top 8 passers with the lowest % of passes thrown into tight coverage are Brees, Cousins, Mahomes, Ryan, Flacco :noidea: , Jimmy G, Rodgers and Brady. With the exception of Flacco, 5 of those 8 are respected veteran QBs, one (Mahomes) is a prodigy, and the 7th (Jimmy G.) is the beneficiary of playing for one of the most respected offensive coaches (Shanahan) in the NFL who can scheme open a receiver

The bottom 5 passers with the highest % of passes thrown into tight coverage are Mason, Stafford :noidea: , FitzMagic, Tannehill, and Daniel Jones (another first year starter).

Hopefully as Mason gets more reps that % will decline for him over the next 2 months.

I think it will. Right now, Mason is throwing guys into coverage instead of open. From what I can see on the TV broadcast (admittedly not a great method for figuring this stuff out), it looks like WRs are starting to get open more than the first few weeks of the season. But instead of throwing with anticipation and decisiveness, the throws are coming out late and with not a lot of zip on them. Allows defenders to close on the ball and slam the window shut.

Just my theory, could be way wrong.

[AtlantaDan]

I think it will. Right now, Mason is throwing guys into coverage instead of open. From what I can see on the TV broadcast (admittedly not a great method for figuring this stuff out), it looks like WRs are starting to get open more than the first few weeks of the season. But instead of throwing with anticipation and decisiveness, the throws are coming out late and with not a lot of zip on them. Allows defenders to close on the ball and slam the window shut.

Just my theory, could be way wrong.


At least Mason threw more balls that went at least 10 yards beyond the line of scrimmage on Monday night, which should deter defenses from just sitting on the short stuff. NFL NextGen charts for pass distribution for his 4 starts


https://charts-cdn-b.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-3_1569199817016.jpeg https://charts-cdn-c.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-4_1569899935788.jpeg https://charts-cdn-a.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-5_1570394270822.jpeg https://charts-cdn-c.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-8_1572320193982.jpeg

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/mason-rudolph/RUD321216

[HollywoodSteel]

At least Mason threw more balls that went at least 10 yards beyond the line of scrimmage on Monday night, which should deter defenses from just sitting on the short stuff. NFL NextGen charts for pass distribution for his 4 starts


https://charts-cdn-b.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-3_1569199817016.jpeg https://charts-cdn-c.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-4_1569899935788.jpeg https://charts-cdn-a.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-5_1570394270822.jpeg https://charts-cdn-c.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-8_1572320193982.jpeg

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/mason-rudolph/RUD321216

That’s a good point, and it just underscores my opinion that I’m glad we won the way we did, even if it would have been safer to call a game that only played to Rudolph’s current strengths at the expense of him working towards becoming the QB we ultimately need him to be.

That said, I don’t necessarily want the coaches to do the same thing vs. the Colts. With the Dolphins I figured it was the perfect learning opportunity with cushion to make mistakes and recover. Against the Colts I am fine with taking a few less chances if that’s what it takes to secure the victory. I have no doubt that Mason will have some opportunities down the field, and hopefully he improves at it.

But now the Colts don’t know what to expect and can’t just load the box. And I’m fine with Rudolph taking advantage of that.

I’m really curious what the Steelers offensive game will be for this one.

[Mojouw]

At least Mason threw more balls that went at least 10 yards beyond the line of scrimmage on Monday night, which should deter defenses from just sitting on the short stuff. NFL NextGen charts for pass distribution for his 4 starts


https://charts-cdn-b.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-3_1569199817016.jpeg https://charts-cdn-c.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-4_1569899935788.jpeg https://charts-cdn-a.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-5_1570394270822.jpeg https://charts-cdn-c.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-8_1572320193982.jpeg

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/mason-rudolph/RUD321216

I was really happy to see that on 3rd downs (even deep in their own end) the Steelers were calling for plays that had Rudolph throwing for the sticks instead of short/safe and hoping someone makes a ridiculous play. That was a pretty new development.

[tube517]

At least Mason threw more balls that went at least 10 yards beyond the line of scrimmage on Monday night, which should deter defenses from just sitting on the short stuff. NFL NextGen charts for pass distribution for his 4 starts


https://charts-cdn-b.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-3_1569199817016.jpeg https://charts-cdn-c.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-4_1569899935788.jpeg https://charts-cdn-a.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-5_1570394270822.jpeg https://charts-cdn-c.nextgenstats.nfl.com/static-charts/300/pass-chart_RUD321216_2019-reg-8_1572320193982.jpeg

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/mason-rudolph/RUD321216

Dong passes since it was vs the Dolphins

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Dong passes since it was vs the Dolphins

exactly!

-3rd and 11......throws a 12 yard completion to Johnson.....DONG
-3rd and 5......throws a 22 yard completion to JuJu………….DONG
-drops a 30 yard pass over the CB into the hands of Johnson for a completion, but Johnson guilty of PI...….DOUBLE DONG pass for the incompletion and the OPI.

[Fire Goodell]

exactly!

-3rd and 11......throws a 12 yard completion to Johnson.....DONG
-3rd and 5......throws a 22 yard completion to JuJu………….DONG
-drops a 30 yard pass over the CB into the hands of Johnson for a completion, but Johnson guilty of PI...….DOUBLE DONG pass for the incompletion and the OPI.

Every pass that doesn't go past 10 yards that isn't into double coverage or against the #1 CB is a dong completion. Since Xavien Howard went out early they're basically all dong completions.

Juju proved the fraud he was, this jackass lumbering he-man only had receptions by stealing INT's from defenders, showing the inability to create 5+ yards of separation on every play. What an overrated turd.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Every pass that doesn't go past 10 yards that isn't into double coverage or against the #1 CB is a dong completion. Since Xavien Howard went out early they're basically all dong completions.

Juju proved the fraud he was, this jackass lumbering he-man only had receptions by stealing INT's from defenders, showing the inability to create 5+ yards of separation on every play. What an overrated turd.

5+ yards?!?!?!? He should be getting minimum 10 yds separation from those JV Tanking Dolphins CB's !! Nothing but dong completions from anybody not named Ben throwing him the ball. Steelers should sign Ben Carson.

[teegre]

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard pass that completes a 3rd-&-2... is that a dong completion?

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard TD pass... is that a dong TD?

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard, game winning TD pass... is that a dong victory?

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard, game winning TD pass against the opposing team’s #1 CB... is that the other team tanking? (because their #1 CB was obviously told to allow the TD)

[smokin3000gt]

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard pass that completes a 3rd-&-2... is that a dong completion?

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard TD pass... is that a dong TD?

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard, game winning TD pass... is that a dong victory?

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard, game winning TD pass against the opposing team’s #1 CB... is that the other team tanking? (because their #1 CB was obviously told to allow the TD)


You must be new here. First you have to predetermine how you're going to feel about the situation/coaches/ect. Then you twist the narrative and numbers around to fit your feelings/thoughts. Then repeat yourself in every thread regardless of the topic.

[GoSlash27]

You must be new here. First you have to predetermine how you're going to feel about the situation/coaches/ect. Then you twist the narrative and numbers around to fit your feelings/thoughts. Then repeat yourself in every thread regardless of the topic.
With all that being said, the answer to all of your questions is "yes". :D

[SteelMember]

Pfft... any 3 yard pass is a dong play. :rulez:

[HollywoodSteel]

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard pass that completes a 3rd-&-2... is that a dong completion?

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard TD pass... is that a dong TD?

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard, game winning TD pass... is that a dong victory?

If Mason Rudolph throws a 3-yard, game winning TD pass against the opposing team’s #1 CB... is that the other team tanking? (because their #1 CB was obviously told to allow the TD)

Yes, but we can cut Rudolph a little slack seeing as he might still be feeling the effects of that dong concussion. :)