Receiver James Washington To Miss “A Few Weeks”

[86WARD]

ESPN is reporting that “a source” says
James Washington is expected to miss a few weeks with a shoulder injury.

Moncrief’s chance to step up!

[steel striker]

Yep time for Stone hands Moncrief to shine. LOL

[tube517]

Time for Tevin Jones to get called up?

[vasteeler]

Remember when we were loaded at the receiver position...

[Shoes]

Remember when we were loaded at the receiver position...

and talented

[86WARD]

Sign AB. Shit can’t get any worse...lol.

[Born2Steel]

I would use Tevin Jones.

[Fire Goodell]

https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/000/063/Rage.jpg

[Shoes]

He really hasn't done much anyway. He seems to have a good preseason then vanishes

[steelreserve]

You shitting me?

[Fire Goodell]

He really hasn't done much anyway. He seems to have a good preseason then vanishes

Hasn't had many opportunities. Mason likes the checkdowns and Washington is more of a downfield receiver. He did catch 3 for 52 last game which isn't bad.

[DesertSteel]

When people check the box score will they even notice that he isn’t playing? It’ll look the same.

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

Hasn't had many opportunities. Mason likes the checkdowns and Washington is more of a downfield receiver. He did catch 3 for 52 last game which isn't bad. He did get the Interference call down the field that lead to the Johnson TD on the next play a few weeks back. So there is that.

[pczach]

Washington caught the pass from Rudolph when Mason got knocked out of the game.

Washington got knocked out of the game when Hodges set him up to get blasted on a short pass.

A rough game all the way around.

[Shoes]

Hasn't had many opportunities. Mason likes the checkdowns and Washington is more of a downfield receiver. He did catch 3 for 52 last game which isn't bad.

I agree, I like him but he didn't do much last year with Ben.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WashJa00.htm

[Mojouw]

At some point we have to look at the available evidence and conclude that James Washington is not an effective NFL WR.

Maybe next year?

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

At some point we have to look at the available evidence and conclude that James Washington is not an effective NFL WR.

Maybe next year? Not giving up on him yet but think wr is a high priority again next year because of the whole group.

[86WARD]

Washington starting to slide over to the Troy Edwards, Charles Johnson, Lima’s Sweed, Willie Reid, Fred Gibson area...

[Born2Steel]

Wash had 3 catches for 52 yards when he got hurt. That’s being productive in an anemic offense IMO. He has definitely improved over his rookie season. I think he could better use some support for his effort this season than fans just bagging on him because he got injured trying. Not ready to put him in a star player category yet but he has shown improvement. The question is simply, are we better with Wash or without him? My opinion is better with him. 0.02

[steelreserve]

At some point we have to look at the available evidence and conclude that James Washington is not an effective NFL WR.

Maybe next year?

Thankfully, there is a handy standard of comparison right next to him ... take JuJu's season last year, now THAT is the definition of how an effective Round 2 draft pick looks in his second year.

Can you expect everybody to have that level of success right away? Nope.

Does Washington look like he is even remotely on the same track, though? Not even close.

Natural talent, big hype to start the season, a couple nice plays here and there, but mostly invisible, and seemingly always dogged by nagging problems ... starting to think I've seen this one before.

[Mojouw]

Thankfully, there is a handy standard of comparison right next to him ... take JuJu's season last year, now THAT is the definition of how an effective Round 2 draft pick looks in his second year.

Can you expect everybody to have that level of success right away? Nope.

Does Washington look like he is even remotely on the same track, though? Not even close.

Natural talent, big hype to start the season, a couple nice plays here and there, but mostly invisible, and seemingly always dogged by nagging problems ... starting to think I've seen this one before.

An interesting take. And not much I can do to easily push back on it.

I will say that, for me, I'm kinda "out" on Washington for the following reasons:

1. Touted as a deep threat. Can't beat out Holton for that role. That isn't good if you can't climb past a career special teams guy on the depth chart for your "one trick".
2. I know that they play different WR positions, but D. Johnson passed by Washington in the blink of the eye as he shot up the depth chart.
3. When I heard that he was hurt, I reacted with a shrug and a "so nothing changes" thought.

The kid just hasn't impacted at all outside of looking good in the preseason. Maybe another year of learning more about running the whole route tree and better quarterback play. And maybe Limas Sweed will make a come back...

[steelreserve]

An interesting take. And not much I can do to easily push back on it.

I will say that, for me, I'm kinda "out" on Washington for the following reasons:

1. Touted as a deep threat. Can't beat out Holton for that role. That isn't good if you can't climb past a career special teams guy on the depth chart for your "one trick".
2. I know that they play different WR positions, but D. Johnson passed by Washington in the blink of the eye as he shot up the depth chart.
3. When I heard that he was hurt, I reacted with a shrug and a "so nothing changes" thought.

The kid just hasn't impacted at all outside of looking good in the preseason. Maybe another year of learning more about running the whole route tree and better quarterback play. And maybe Limas Sweed will make a come back...

That's the one that really does it for me, as far as the "eye test" is concerned.

One guy seizes the opportunity, pushes his way into the lineup with play that you cannot ignore, and keeps raising his ceiling.

The other guy is patiently given chances to show what he can do, and is still struggling to find his floor. Two players with completely different trajectories, maybe for a reason.

I am not against giving Washington more chances to prove himself this season - I mean, our situation is so fubar that finding out those kinds of things is probably more important than maximizing every chance of winning every last game. On the other hand, though, is it more exciting to see what Washington can do with extra opportunities, or what Johnson or Holton can do? Or even whether Moncrief really just had a couple bad games. Basically, what anybody other than Switzer has to offer. By that standard, he does not look to have a bright future.

[Shoes]

anyone know if Moncrief is getting out of the doghouse

[pczach]

Thankfully, there is a handy standard of comparison right next to him ... take JuJu's season last year, now THAT is the definition of how an effective Round 2 draft pick looks in his second year.

Can you expect everybody to have that level of success right away? Nope.

Does Washington look like he is even remotely on the same track, though? Not even close.

Natural talent, big hype to start the season, a couple nice plays here and there, but mostly invisible, and seemingly always dogged by nagging problems ... starting to think I've seen this one before.




JuJu isn't doing much either. The quarterbacks haven't been throwing the ball down the field. Rudolph in particular threw almost exclusively to backs and within a few yards of the line of scrimmage. We're not going to be able to judge Washington's progress until there is a quarterback playing for this team that will consistently push the ball down the field and not be looking to check down on every play. He didn't get his chance with Hodges because one of his first short passes to Washington put him on the injured list.

Nobody wants to hear it, but this is going to require more time to find out what Washington can do.

[Squeegee Thompson]

I am not against giving Washington more chances to prove himself this season - I mean, our situation is so fubar that finding out those kinds of things is probably more important than maximizing every chance of winning every last game. On the other hand, though, is it more exciting to see what Washington can do with extra opportunities, or what Johnson or Holton can do? Or even whether Moncrief really just had a couple bad games. Basically, what anybody other than Switzer has to offer. By that standard, he does not look to have a bright future.

This season will be Washington's last real chance to prove he belongs on an NFL roster. If he can't get it going with his old college QB under center, it's not going to happen next year with Ben back under center. He has about 10 games to show he's not Limas Sweed 2.0.

[Mojouw]

JuJu isn't doing much either. The quarterbacks haven't been throwing the ball down the field. Rudolph in particular threw almost exclusively to backs and within a few yards of the line of scrimmage. We're not going to be able to judge Washington's progress until there is a quarterback playing for this team that will consistently push the ball down the field and not be looking to check down on every play. He didn't get his chance with Hodges because one of his first short passes to Washington put him on the injured list.

Nobody wants to hear it, but this is going to require more time to find out what Washington can do.

That needs to be considered as well. The QB play has been really bad. There is a cool breakdown on Behind the Steel Curtain today with two plays where Washington got loose, and Rudolph took far too long to deliver the ball.

[Six Rings]

anyone know if Moncrief is getting out of the doghouse



At this point, he has to. Out of the dog house, but on a short leash.


With Washington looking like a 2nd round bust, and Moncrief teetering on being an expensive free agent bust rookie Johnson must step up.

[Edman]

Wildcat Shenanigans aside, The Steelers are trying to run a budget Patriots Offense. With a Budget Brady (Rudolph) under center.

Word to to wise and those who do not know what the Pats do: James Washington (or anyone for that matter), will not stand out on the stat sheet whatsoever in this offense. This is the difficult reality that some may have to face and comprehend.

The Offense May look ugly on the stat line and rankings, but for as much as be complain about Fichtner being Ben’s valet, the Offense’s so-called “ineptitude” is not the reason why the team is 2-4. Fun Fact: Since That 3-point debacle in New England, The Steelers have scored 20+ in five straight games. I think that is pretty substantial with an improving Defense playing better.

If you want this team to finish 6-10, by all means air it out like we have Antonio Brown and Martavis Bryant to throw to, and see where that leads.

[86WARD]

Josh Gordon anyone?

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

Wildcat Shenanigans aside, The Steelers are trying to run a budget Patriots Offense. With a Budget Brady (Rudolph) under center.

Word to to wise and those who do not know what the Pats do: James Washington (or anyone for that matter), will not stand out on the stat sheet whatsoever in this offense. This is the difficult reality that some may have to face and comprehend.

The Offense May look ugly on the stat line and rankings, but for as much as be complain about Fichtner being Ben’s valet, the Offense’s so-called “ineptitude” is not the reason why the team is 2-4. Fun Fact: Since That 3-point debacle in New England, The Steelers have scored 20+ in five straight games. I think that is pretty substantial with an improving Defense playing better.

If you want this team to finish 6-10, by all means air it out like we have Antonio Brown and Martavis Bryant to throw to, and see where that leads. Stop It! This post makes to much sense!

[Mojouw]

I mean if you mean the Patriots offense without the precision route running, impeccable timing, ridiculously accurate pass placement, and staggeringly complex scheming —- then yeah. Steelers are doing exactly that.

[Edman]

I mean if you mean the Patriots offense without the precision route running, impeccable timing, ridiculously accurate pass placement, and staggeringly complex scheming —- then yeah. Steelers are doing exactly that.

Hence why I said "budget" Patriots Offense. Run it for a while more and it may develop into the real thing.

If the Offense were costing the Steelers games, then we would have a point of opening it up, but poor plays in critical moments (Defense against Seattle, Conner's fumble up 20-17 in San Fran, Juju's fumble in overtime) have cost the Steelers wins, not from our "inability" to throw deep and keep "defenses honest". I am not a fan of Fichtner, but the results speak for themselves. 20+ points in five straight games. I think 20 points is sufficient enough to win in the NFL, unless our Defense is so awful then it doesn't matter regardless. The team isn't going anywhere anyway.

Let the Defense stack the box every play. Big deal. Take what they give you. That has been the Patriots' mentality on Offense for years.

But let's just sling it deep and intermediate every down. We have a howitzer cannon armed QB, top-flight receivers who put Jerry Rice to shame, a Jimmy Graham clone and the second coming of Gronk at TE, nothing but elite offensive talent popping through the seams, and just another Antonio Brown waiting in the wings, so we're better off slinging it intermediate and deep every play in five receiver sets, and the Offense starts to die for real and the Steelers begin stacking losses.

[Mojouw]

Look at the third down conversion rates between the Pats and the Steelers offenses.

“Opening it up” is not as simplistic as “huck it deep”. It’s running multiple formations and threatening defenses horizontally and vertically simultaneously in order to give yourself relatively easy plays that gain enough yardage to stay ahead of the chains.

The current version of the Steelers offense converts something around 20-25% of its third downs and faces disadvantageous down and distances far far too often to consistently threaten good defenses.

[Born2Steel]

Sometimes the offense has to throw deep low percentage passes in the same vein as they must have a threat to run the ball on any down and distance. You don't need to be great at completing down field but so long as the defense knows it's likely it helps the run game and short pass game. I have not watched any 'all 22' game films but I am reading post game reports and listen to podcasts of Steelers games by people that say they do watch those films. Rudolph has had opportunities in the down field passing game and just hasn't taken his shots. Either he's not seeing WRs open downfield, he's afraid to take the chance, or he decides the checkdown is the better option. Fichtner may not be the best play caller to ever hold an OC position but he's not some moron pretending to know this team and how to do his job either. I'm 99% positive Fichtner has not told Rudolph to keep all his passes within 2-8 yards of the line of scrimmage. A lot of the offensive issues fall on Rudolph at this point too. The team played well and inspired with Duck. Not saying Duck is the answer either(at all) but if Rudolph can't seem to find JuJu this Monday night maybe Duck gets the nod when the Colts come to town. Even if you don't complete the pass, you must throw it deep about once per quarter to keep it an option and a safety back at least a little. Just my thoughts on the struggle.

[Edman]

“Opening it up” is not as simplistic as “huck it deep”. It’s running multiple formations and threatening defenses horizontally and vertically simultaneously in order to give yourself relatively easy plays that gain enough yardage to stay ahead of the chains.

And who is the elite receiver we have who threatens the Defense horizontally and vertically? The player that the defense has to account for on every down?


The team played well and inspired with Duck. Not saying Duck is the answer either(at all) but if Rudolph can't seem to find JuJu this Monday night maybe Duck gets the nod when the Colts come to town.

The team played well and inspired because they are a better overall team than in the past, and Duck was just as downgraded and safe as Mason was. He didn't exactly light it up either. Because the Steelers are playing as more cohesive unit, Duck didn't need to be the hero unlike the reliance on Ben and AB.

Duck also threw a pick that completely shifted the momentum of the game. .

Start "opening up the offense" and playing above our means, and watch the Offense grind to a halt. Here's to Monday Night's gameday thread, as we start cursing Fichtner's name again when the Steelers are dead locked with Miami in the third quarter in an offensive slopfest where we can't move the ball worth a damn, but at least we got those deep shots to "scare" the defense.

[HollywoodSteel]

Sometimes the offense has to throw deep low percentage passes in the same vein as they must have a threat to run the ball on any down and distance. You don't need to be great at completing down field but so long as the defense knows it's likely it helps the run game and short pass game. I have not watched any 'all 22' game films but I am reading post game reports and listen to podcasts of Steelers games by people that say they do watch those films. Rudolph has had opportunities in the down field passing game and just hasn't taken his shots. Either he's not seeing WRs open downfield, he's afraid to take the chance, or he decides the checkdown is the better option. Fichtner may not be the best play caller to ever hold an OC position but he's not some moron pretending to know this team and how to do his job either. I'm 99% positive Fichtner has not told Rudolph to keep all his passes within 2-8 yards of the line of scrimmage. A lot of the offensive issues fall on Rudolph at this point too. The team played well and inspired with Duck. Not saying Duck is the answer either(at all) but if Rudolph can't seem to find JuJu this Monday night maybe Duck gets the nod when the Colts come to town. Even if you don't complete the pass, you must throw it deep about once per quarter to keep it an option and a safety back at least a little. Just my thoughts on the struggle.

I don’t seem to recall Duck throwing many downfield passes either. Except the interception.

But I do agree with your point about Rudolph and it falling on his shoulders to find the open man further than 3 yards downfield.

Hopefully we’ll start seeing that vs. Miami. I do think Rudolph is the better option over Duck going forward.

[Mojouw]

Part of the problem in thinking through all this is both Duck and Mason are simply not very good NFL quarterbacks right now.

That obscures all discussion of scheme and strategy. These two and Darnold are playing some of the worst games of the 2019 season.

[Born2Steel]

I don’t seem to recall Duck throwing many downfield passes either. Except the interception.

But I do agree with your point about Rudolph and it falling on his shoulders to find the open man further than 3 yards downfield.

Hopefully we’ll start seeing that vs. Miami. I do think Rudolph is the better option over Duck going forward.

I think Rudolph is the better QB too(pure pro QB ability). If the guys watching the "ALL 22" are correct though, Rudolph just isn't playing like a pro at this point. AGAIN! DUCK is not the answer but if the TEAM plays better on offense with him, I would keep the option open to consider making that change. Ben is gone for the season. This is not our SB year. IF this team plays harder for one backup QB over the other backup QB then play THAT GUY. That's all I'm saying, not that one of these guys is the future. Just let's go play football. What do we have to lose really?

[GoSlash27]

IF this team plays harder for one backup QB over the other backup QB then play THAT GUY. That's all I'm saying, not that one of these guys is the future. Just let's go play football. What do we have to lose really?

If the roles were reversed and it was Duck that went out on a stretcher, they'd have played every bit as hard for Rudolph.
The team rallied around Duck out of desperation. Not knocking his game or leadership skills, but he was the only guy they had left and they knew he was being leaned on to do more than is reasonably expected from a practice squad QB. They were determined to protect and help him succeed because they still believe they can right the ship.
Those guys definitely aren't operating with a 'what do we have to lose' mentality. They're not giving up on this season.

[steelcityboyz]

Sign AB. Shit can’t get any worse...lol.Wouldn't make a difference. Remember when Ben was out AB didn't produce shit. Bottom line AB needs Ben.

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

Wouldn't make a difference. Remember when Ben was out AB didn't produce shit. Bottom line AB needs Ben. Not many WR's would produce shit with Jones and Vick. That said screw AB.

[Born2Steel]

If the roles were reversed and it was Duck that went out on a stretcher, they'd have played every bit as hard for Rudolph.
The team rallied around Duck out of desperation. Not knocking his game or leadership skills, but he was the only guy they had left and they knew he was being leaned on to do more than is reasonably expected from a practice squad QB. They were determined to protect and help him succeed because they still believe they can right the ship.
Those guys definitely aren't operating with a 'what do we have to lose' mentality. They're not giving up on this season.

I'm not giving up on the season either but my expectations have been tempered a bit. What do you think the expectation for this season should be? Is it still SB or bust in your mind? I think a winning season will be a victorious season. A wildcard birth is possible but is currently unlikely unless we pull out some upsets. Winning the division is an enormous uphill battle. But just win the games on the schedule and only good things will happen. I'm just poking the thought machine, checking under rocks, and throwing out this thought and that thought for discussion about what might give us THAT edge moving forward. "What do we have to lose" is meant as a positive motivator in my mind here, not some negative outlook response to an already negative season. I'm not trying to speak for any player or coach either for what that's worth.

[steelreserve]

I'm not giving up on the season either but my expectations have been tempered a bit. What do you think the expectation for this season should be?

I think the expectation for the season should be to do a LOT of cocaine.

[GoSlash27]

I'm not giving up on the season either but my expectations have been tempered a bit. What do you think the expectation for this season should be? Is it still SB or bust in your mind? I think a winning season will be a victorious season. A wildcard birth is possible but is currently unlikely unless we pull out some upsets. Winning the division is an enormous uphill battle. But just win the games on the schedule and only good things will happen. I'm just poking the thought machine, checking under rocks, and throwing out this thought and that thought for discussion about what might give us THAT edge moving forward. "What do we have to lose" is meant as a positive motivator in my mind here, not some negative outlook response to an already negative season. I'm not trying to speak for any player or coach either for what that's worth.

What I think *my* expectation should be? I don't do 'expectations', so I never have a problem managing them. I consider any playoff appearance a win and I'm not disappointed by anything other than a losing season. For the team... the expectation should only ever be a superbowl win.
As for the rest of it, I don't presume to know how to run a team better than the organization, so I don't see any point to these discussions. The FO isn't following these threads and doesn't consult me. We're all just along for the ride.

[Butch]

I'm not giving up on the season either but my expectations have been tempered a bit. What do you think the expectation for this season should be? Is it still SB or bust in your mind? I think a winning season will be a victorious season. A wildcard birth is possible but is currently unlikely unless we pull out some upsets. Winning the division is an enormous uphill battle. But just win the games on the schedule and only good things will happen. I'm just poking the thought machine, checking under rocks, and throwing out this thought and that thought for discussion about what might give us THAT edge moving forward. "What do we have to lose" is meant as a positive motivator in my mind here, not some negative outlook response to an already negative season. I'm not trying to speak for any player or coach either for what that's worth.

I am looking to see how things pan out with Rudolph at the helm. How does coaching fair especially with all the injuries we have sustained. I am also looking to see how the D performs, Busch, Watt, and Fitzpatrick amongst others. I don't think a winning season is out of the question, as we have been within a score of most of our losses. Plenty to look forward to would love to see us make the playoffs but that is a looooong ways away right now.

[Born2Steel]

What I think *my* expectation should be? I don't do 'expectations', so I never have a problem managing them. I consider any playoff appearance a win and I'm not disappointed by anything other than a losing season. For the team... the expectation should only ever be a superbowl win.
As for the rest of it, I don't presume to know how to run a team better than the organization, so I don't see any point to these discussions. The FO isn't following these threads and doesn't consult me. We're all just along for the ride.

You’re a sports fan with zero expectations for any season? Then I’m not directing my posts to you.

[DesertSteel]

I've really missed his 2 catches for 21 yards.

[Shoes]

I've really missed his 2 catches for 21 yards.

:chuckle:

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

4 Dong receptions yesterday. Was basically allowed to catch the football, when Rudolph actually got it farther than over the head of Samuels.