Antonio Brown: the thread that never ends

[DesertSteel]

I haven't seen other outlets report on it yet, but here it is...

https://dailysnark.com/breaking-antonio-brown-accused-of-three-separate-incidents-of-sexual-assault-and-rape/?fbclid=IwAR2xu0yfKTRo5SjP7nzSqAEEY6CZ-wzaSB-XZ8x9bwiWABHKU5tLgiFYzo0

[stillers4me]

New England Patriots receiver Antonio Brown has been accused of raping his former trainer, according to a federal lawsuit filed Tuesday in the Southern District of Florida.


The lawsuit says that Brown — in three separate incidents, two in June 2017 and another in May 2018 — sexually assaulted a woman named Britney Taylor, a gymnast whom he met while they were attending Central Michigan together and whom he later hired as a trainer.


“Mr. Brown denies each and every allegation in the lawsuit,” said a statement from Darren Heitner, a lawyer representing Brown.


According to the lawsuit, Brown sexually assaulted Taylor twice during training sessions in June 2017. First, he exposed himself and kissed her without her permission, the lawsuit says. Later that month, the lawsuit says, while she was watching a television program at his home, Brown started masturbating behind her and ejaculated on her back. Brown bragged about the incident in profane text messages that are copied in the lawsuit..........

Read more @ https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/10/sports/football/antonio-brown-sexual-asssault-patriots.html

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https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EEJOVMKXoAAxWJ_?format=jpg&name=medium

[stillers4me]

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I said to my husband right after he signed with the Patriots*...........we should send Belichick a 6 month supply of Excedrin Migraine and a U-Haul packed with Jack Daniels. He's going to need it. :lol:

[GoSlash27]

1171586813573640192

This is the guy that many forum members believe was playing 3 dimensional chess to get on the Pats. The same guy who they believe has the self-discipline to act like an angel to stay there.

He's literally so dumb that he doesn't know how to spell 'dumb'.

[stillers4me]

6 game suspension..........precedent set in 2010.

[tom444]

She waits until the very day he becomes a Patriot? She couldn't have accused him when he was a Steeler or a Raider?

Well, that may have been quick.

[stillers4me]

If you look at the timeline (2017-2018)...that's when he started to show what a wackadoodle he really is.

[st33lersguy]

It just doesn't end does it

[stillers4me]

https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi.imgflip.com%2Fqgkxz.jpg&f=1&nofb=1

[Mojouw]

I’m usually a wait until all the facts are in not rush to judgement and all that.

But this just seems like it should be true.

[stillers4me]

I’m usually a wait until all the facts are in not rush to judgement and all that.

But this just seems like it should be true.

Funny how hundreds of people on twitter are saying to wait for the facts, innocent until proven guilty..yadayada....but still call Ben a rapist.

[AtlantaDan]

If you look at the timeline (2017-2018)...that's when he started to show what a wackadoodle he really is.

Yep - when I read the final alleged sexual assault occurred in May 2018 I checked back on when the furniture toss and multiple calls to the cops for thefts from safes and the "stolen" Rolls Royce happened - April 2018

https://archive.triblive.com/local/pittsburgh-allegheny/alleged-speeding-incident-latest-in-string-of-police-calls-involving-steelers-antonio-brown/

Spring of 2018 was a busy time for AB

[DesertSteel]

https://i.postimg.cc/GhPZTDGq/62709-DA7-ABC9-4-CBB-81-B9-6-AC68-F207-F2-B.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Devilsdancefloor]

https://i.postimg.cc/0NQ88fm9/karma.jpg

[tom444]

It may have been Roethlisberger and she's confused.

[Devilsdancefloor]

It may have been Roethlisberger and she's confused.

awww its ok maybe you and tommy can spoon

[fansince'76]

Gotta admit, some of the replies to that tweet were quite amusing...

1171587871414730752

:chuckle:


This is the guy that many forum members believe was playing 3 dimensional chess to get on the Pats. The same guy who they believe has the self-discipline to act like an angel to stay there.

He's literally so dumb that he doesn't know how to spell 'dumb'.

Yep. No way he's picking up the Patriots' playbook...

[tom444]

From Concord bridge to Bunker Hill the people of the Commonwealth of Massachusettes have fought for liberty and freedom. We will continue to fight for the common man against the evils of speculation and false accusations.

"One of the most sacred principles in the American criminal justice system, holding that a defendant is innocent until proven guilty. In other words, the prosecution must prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, each essential element of the crime charged."

Give me Liberty or give me death.


https://skn-wp-assets.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/North-Bridge-Concord-Bridge-1775-RGB-1000.jpg



We are all Patriots.

[Mojouw]

That’s some solid trolling right there.

Except this is in civil court. Whole other ballgame.

[tom444]

New England patriots from the 20th Maine at Little Round Top.

https://specialoperations.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Chamberlain-Little-Round-Top.jpg

[teegre]

That’s some solid trolling right there.

Except this is in civil court. Whole other ballgame.

Before AB paid off the mom in the “furniture throwing” incident, I averred that if it actually went to court (whether he was found guilty or not), AB would be suspended for “acts detrimental to the league”.

-speeding ticket
-furniture throwing
-rape allegations

True or not, the rape allegations might be the straw that warrants a suspension. And, if AB is suspended, Belichick will cut him faster than AB can misspell a word in a tweet.

[tom444]

Before AB paid off the mom in the “furniture throwing” incident, I averred that if it actually went to court (whether he was found guilty or not), AB would be suspended for “acts detrimental to the league”.

-speeding ticket
-furniture throwing
-rape allegations

True or not, the rape allegations might be the straw that warrants a suspension. And, if AB is suspended, Belichick will cut him faster than AB can misspell a word in a tweet.

Yeah. Well, the Patriots have to be careful. Right now we only have accusations, from both sides.

[Fire Goodell]

Good maybe he can go Aaron Hernandez himself when he's in jail

[tom444]

To further complicate the issue AB may be staying in Brady's house at this very moment. Also in that house are children who are old enough to have some grasp of this.

[teegre]

To further complicate the issue AB may be staying in Brady's house at this very moment. Also in that house are children who are old enough to have some grasp of this.

100% :nod: Which is why I think that the Taperiots had no idea about this... and which is why I also feel like they could simply cut ties with AB.

[Fire Goodell]

Maybe AB gone jack his dick on Giselle when she's asleep :chuckle:

[Fire Goodell]

https://i.imgflip.com/3a8vgn.jpg

[Craic]

6 game suspension..........precedent set in 2010.

??? When was this? I don't remember anyone's first accusal ending in a six game suspension. Maybe I missed something? :huh:

[stillers4me]

Yeah. Well, the Patriots have to be careful. Right now we only have accusations, from both sides.

Roethlisberger was issued a 6 game suspension (reduced to 4) for allegations only.

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??? When was this? I don't remember anyone's first accusal ending in a six game suspension. Maybe I missed something? :huh:

Ben got 6 games from the league.....reduced to 4. We won 3 of those games going through all of our back up quarterbacks.

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1171614585734008832

[stillers4me]

Probably too late for the Patriots to get Demaryius Thomas back, right?

[stillers4me]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EEJ5XSoW4AIPXhM?format=jpg&name=medium

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How could the Patriots* not have known about this before they signed him.......I saw this stuff on Twitter on Saturday. I didn't retweet because it wasn't being nationally reported but it was there.

1171627406504779776

[tom444]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EEJ5XSoW4AIPXhM?format=jpg&name=medium

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How could the Patriots* not have known about this before they signed him.......I saw this stuff on Twitter on Saturday. I didn't retweet because it wasn't being nationally reported but it was there.

1171627406504779776

The tweeting friend of a friend of a tweeter says that some things that may be tweeted on twitter may not always be tweeted accurately.

[stillers4me]

Saw this one, too..... Bill needs to get a crash course on InstaFace. :heh:

1171627562369474561

[teegre]

??? When was this? I don't remember anyone's first accusal ending in a six game suspension. Maybe I missed something? :huh:

Ezekiel Elliott (games 9-14 in 2017)

[AtlantaDan]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EEJ5XSoW4AIPXhM?format=jpg&name=medium

OTOH we are good with the owner violating the law by stopping off at a low rent massage parlor for a quick blow job on his way to the AFC championship game

[86WARD]

I mean the emails he wrote or tried to write?? That’s a
Iittle more evidence than required?

[AtlantaDan]

I mean the emails he wrote or tried to write?? That’s a
Iittle more evidence than required?

This observation in a column published yesterday that applauded AB for manipulating the NFL contractual system that I linked in the AB signs with the Pats thread has not aged well. :coffee:

The narrative that Brown is too much the diva and lacks the self-control to be a Patriot is nonsense. Brown is all about self-control; it’s just not the brand that certain NFL martinets seek.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/nfl/dont-blame-antonio-brown-for-putting-himself-first-no-one-else-was-going-to/2019/09/09/76a6601c-d34d-11e9-86ac-0f250cc91758_story.html

[GoSlash27]

Minor point, but "sexual assault" isn't the same thing as "rape".

[Bluecoat96]

Z",88m cc ZzUm...did you just "butt post" on this thread? [emoji23]

Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk

[stillers4me]

Um...did you just "butt post" on this thread? [emoji23]



Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk

:lol: yep

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Minor point, but "sexual assault" isn't the same thing as "rape".


The accuser says he raped her on the third accusation. And yes, I believe you can rape the person who is trying to extort you...if that was the case.

[stillers4me]

1171592367465476096

[JnK]

This is almost better than watching the Giants beat the Cheats in the Super Bowl. TWICE.

[AtlantaDan]

Wonder who the “known football player” who went clubbing with AB and the plaintiff that evening and returned with them to Brown’s residence when the plaintiff allegedly was raped was?

50. On approximately May 20, 2018, Brown invited Ms. Taylor, another football player who trained with them, and a few friends for a night out while they were in Miami.
51. The group went to a club.
52. Ms. Taylor, Brown, and the other known football player left the club together in
Ms. Taylor’s rental car. She drove the two men back to Brown’s home, where they were staying.

https://haaslawpllc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/1_Complaint.pdf?smid=nytcore-ios-share

Breakdown by the SI.com legal analyst on what is described with somewhat of an understatement as a “disturbing twist” to the AB saga

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/09/11/patriots-antonio-brown-accused-sexual-assualt-former-trainer?utm_source=si.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=social-share-article&utm_content=20190911

[EzraTank]

This is the guy that many forum members believe was playing 3 dimensional chess to get on the Pats. The same guy who they believe has the self-discipline to act like an angel to stay there.

He's literally so dumb that he doesn't know how to spell 'dumb'.

The guy playing three dimensional chess looks like this:

https://specials-images.forbesimg.com/imageserve/55e9fbffe4b0ffa7afe4677b/416x416.jpg?background=000000&cropX1=121&cropX2=519&cropY1=60&cropY2=458

Don't believe me ... even Belichick asked him (https://sports.yahoo.com/bill-belichick-asks-agent-drew-001223807.html) to "dummy up" on this one.


I posted this in the other thread as well: The rape allegations sounds like complete bullshit. When you make a statement like, "He used manipulation and false promises to lure her into his world" you sound like a gold digging loony. If he assaulted her in 2017, then why did she not report it then? Why did she go back out with him in 2018? Who is her lawyer, Dr. Christine Ford Blasey?

The story about how she drove him and two other men home after going clubbing with them ... come on. Then she "had to use his bathroom". If you know he's already assaulted you twice, why in the hell would you use this guys bathroom? She wanted 1.6 million to start a business ... isn't that convenient.

One thing this is obviously clear is how corrupt the NCAA is. How does a person with the writing skills of Antonio Brown EVER get accepted into any college (let alone middle school)?

[tom444]

https://twitter.com/AlbertBreer/status/1171780783717191680

"In the guarantee language in Antonio Brown's Patriots contract: If Brown "takes any action that materially undermines the public's respect for, or is materially critical of, the Club, the Player's teammates or the Club's ownership, coaches," etc., guarantees will "null and void."

[EzraTank]

Coming from a rub and tug owner that wording is hilarious.

[AtlantaDan]

https://twitter.com/AlbertBreer/status/1171780783717191680

"In the guarantee language in Antonio Brown's Patriots contract: If Brown "takes any action that materially undermines the public's respect for, or is materially critical of, the Club, the Player's teammates or the Club's ownership, coaches," etc., guarantees will "null and void."

What if the player took the action before he signed the contract rather than takes the action after he signs the contract? :scratchchin:

[stillers4me]

AB still hasn't been assigned a jersey number.....just sayin'

[tom444]

What if the player took the action before he signed the contract rather than takes the action after he signs the contract? :scratchchin:

I would say, without being a lawyer, that could be a problem for the Patriots.

[Born2Steel]

Don’t let this shithead football player take the focus from remembering what today means. Remember the towers today. Remember the 3 planes and thousands of people. Remember the first responders and the volunteers. The lives lost, changed forever, and how we as a nation united that 9/11.

[Mojouw]

I posted this on the other thread as well, but I feel it bears repeating.

Please, let us all stop with the questioning the accuser because she returned to having some sort of relationship (whatever it was/is) with AB. Maybe she is lying. Maybe she is not. We do not know yet. But we can know that it is extremely common for individuals in an abusive or toxic relationship to return to that relationship over and over again. I am not trying to individually target anyone with this comment. Nor am I attempting to say that all of us can not question the validity of the accusations. But lets not do AB's lawyers work for them and start with an assumption that the accuser makes no sense.

[86WARD]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190911/a1f97fe3871a8ab6f2d8c9fbbc5f92ab.jpg

Funny how it’s becoming buried below everything else....

[tom444]

I posted this on the other thread as well, but I feel it bears repeating.

Please, let us all stop with the questioning the accuser because she returned to having some sort of relationship (whatever it was/is) with AB. Maybe she is lying. Maybe she is not. We do not know yet. But we can know that it is extremely common for individuals in an abusive or toxic relationship to return to that relationship over and over again. I am not trying to individually target anyone with this comment. Nor am I attempting to say that all of us can not question the validity of the accusations. But lets not do AB's lawyers work for them and start with an assumption that the accuser makes no sense.


This.

[T&B fan]

Don’t let this shithead football player take the focus from remembering what today means. Remember the towers today. Remember the 3 planes and thousands of people. Remember the first responders and the volunteers. The lives lost, changed forever, and how we as a nation united that 9/11.


4 planes

[tom444]

5 minutes ago: Belichick's presser did not go well. To say the press ran him off the podium wouldn't be an exaggeration.

[Mojouw]

5 minutes ago: Belichick's presser did not go well. To say the press ran him off the podium wouldn't be an exaggeration.

I didn't even think of that! Doesn't he barely tolerate the press when the talk mostly about football? I'm guessing he had no interest/patience for this one...not sure I watch like zero NFL press conferences. So actually asking.

[AtlantaDan]

5 minutes ago: Belichick's presser did not go well. To say the press ran him off the podium wouldn't be an exaggeration.

Master trolling by Belichick would have been to say On To Miami then drop the mic

Will be interesting to see if the Boston media goes after the Pats on this. He can count on his amen corner in the national media to explain that whatever the Pats do is all that should be done

[tom444]

I didn't even think of that! Doesn't he barely tolerate the press when the talk mostly about football? I'm guessing he had no interest/patience for this one...not sure I watch like zero NFL press conferences. So actually asking.

Of course, the press had one thing on its mind, after fielding those, AB questions, for no more than 2 minutes he stomped off the stage. Not good. First time I've seen BB that rattled by the press.

[AtlantaDan]

Master trolling by Belichick would have been to say On To Miami then drop the mic

Which apparently is what he did

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In other news

1171808131724324865

[steelreserve]

Holy shit, the karma surrounding this guy is just unreal.

Normally it'd take years for this whole sequence to play out, but he's really moving at hyper speed!

At this rate, he'll be in jail by Friday and dead by Monday.

[tube517]

Of course, the press had one thing on its mind, after fielding those, AB, questions for no more than 2 minutes he stomped off the stage. Not good. First time I've seen BB that rattled by the press.

Saw a tweet that said Rosenhaus is going on ESPN to talk about this mess. Didn't BB tell him to STFU.

And why would Rosenhaus be on TV talking about it. Smart thing would be to shut the hell up and refer to lawyers.

But what do I care.

[Mojouw]

Of course, the press had one thing on its mind, after fielding those, AB, questions for no more than 2 minutes he stomped off the stage. Not good. First time I've seen BB that rattled by the press.

oh, boy. That's not a good look. Seems to be "on brand" for him -- but not a good look.

[AtlantaDan]

Holy shit, the karma surrounding this guy is just unreal.

Normally it'd take years for this whole sequence to play out, but he's really moving at hyper speed!

At this rate, he'll be in jail by Friday and dead by Monday.

It is like one of those Behind The Music rockumentaries where the star rises to fame then faces ruin

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Saw a tweet that said Rosenhaus is going on ESPN to talk about this mess. Didn't BB tell him to STFU.

And why would Rosenhaus be on TV talking about it. Smart thing would be to shut the hell up and refer to lawyers.

But what do I care.

Rosenhaus once again carrying water for his high maintenance client

1171817357334982656
(https://twitter.com/fieldyates/status/1171817357334982656?s=21)

[Mojouw]

Rosenhaus once again carrying water for his high maintenance client

1171817357334982656
(https://twitter.com/fieldyates/status/1171817357334982656?s=21)

Wouldn't it basically be impossible to have "facts" to disprove any of this? I mean unless AB wears a bodycam 24/7...

[ALLD]

It smells a little like the SCOTUS Brett Kavanaugh railroading because of the timing, but if somebody was going to screw with him they timed it perfectly. I guess in other words,

"Business is Booming!"



P.S.

If Brown was still on the Steelers he would already be suspended by the NFL. The league is rigged.

[Born2Steel]

4 planes

Dang my fat fingers!

[86WARD]

Holy shit, the karma surrounding this guy is just unreal.

Normally it'd take years for this whole sequence to play out, but he's really moving at hyper speed!

At this rate, he'll be in jail by Friday and dead by Monday.

*whispers*

Madden




Curse

[86WARD]

So a 3rd and a 5th?

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

Holy shit, the karma surrounding this guy is just unreal.

Normally it'd take years for this whole sequence to play out, but he's really moving at hyper speed!

At this rate, he'll be in jail by Friday and dead by Monday. Sounds like Epstein.

[Fire Goodell]

Wouldn't it basically be impossible to have "facts" to disprove any of this? I mean unless AB wears a bodycam 24/7...

especially when one of his emails pretty much admits guilt of at least one count of sexual assault.

I really overestimated the intelligence of this guy to mastermind a plan to end up on NE, the dude really is just that stupid.

[Squeegee Thompson]

"Dear, Mr. Belichick,

Eat a bag of dicks.

Yours truly,
The collective cities of Pittsburgh and Oakland"

[Mach1]

Kraft should take AB out for a nice relaxing massage. A guarantee to a happy ending.

[T&B fan]

Kraft should take AB out for a nice relaxing massage. A guarantee to a happy ending.

well it did happen in FL , and Kraft knows a place !! in FL ..

[AtlantaDan]

AB still hasn't been assigned a jersey number.....just sayin'

1171829767999541248

On to Miami :thumbsup:

[steelreserve]

Sounds like Epstein.

Not quite. The part like Epstein was the blatantly illegal way the Patriots signed him, and that not being investigated at all ("It was suicide, you crazy conspiracy theorists, nothing to see here!")

This part is like if Hillary just happened to get caught red-handed for an unrelated murder like a week after the Epstein thing.

[steel striker]

He is OUT OF CONTROL and, I'm glad he is no longer on the Steelers.

[Butch]

NFL is considering putting AB on the commissioner's exempt list. "IF" he is put on this it would mean he could not play but he would still get paid.

Read the article
https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2019/09/11/nfl-will-consider-placing-antonio-brown-paid-leave-making-him-ineligible-play/?noredirect=on

[tom444]

1171829767999541248

On to Miami :thumbsup:

And he had on the usual NFL helmet without complaint.

[Shoes]

And he had on the usual NFL helmet without complaint.

Who is he going to complain to Bill? He'd be golfing with OJ if he did.

[DesertSteel]

Wouldn't it basically be impossible to have "facts" to disprove any of this? I mean unless AB wears a bodycam 24/7...
He'd have to pass a lie detector for me to believe him about anything at this point.

[AtlantaDan]

He'd have to pass a lie detector for me to believe him about anything at this point.

Polygraph exam results would not be anything to which I would give much credence

Polygraphs can be beaten and questions can be framed in a way that the subject “passes”

In her complaint the AB plaintiff is said to have passed a polygraph exam (paragraph 74 of linked complaint), which I regard as a nothingburger

https://haaslawpllc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/1_Complaint.pdf?smid=nytcore-ios-share

[steelreserve]

He'd have to pass a lie detector for me to believe him about anything at this point.

Is it possible for someone to be so stupid and/or crazy that a polygraph can't tell the difference between when they're telling the truth and lying? Because if there's one case where it's important to know that, this is it.

[Butch]

Polygraph exam results would not be anything to which I would give much credence

Polygraphs can be beaten and questions can be framed in a way that the subject “passes”

In her complaint the AB plaintiff is said to have passed a polygraph exam (paragraph 74 of linked complaint), which I regard as a nothingburger

https://haaslawpllc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/1_Complaint.pdf?smid=nytcore-ios-share

We aint talkin about just any ole Polygraph we are talkin bout Steve Wilkos Polygraph with Dan Ribacoff.

[DesertSteel]

Polygraph exam results would not be anything to which I would give much credence

Polygraphs can be beaten and questions can be framed in a way that the subject “passes”

In her complaint the AB plaintiff is said to have passed a polygraph exam (paragraph 74 of linked complaint), which I regard as a nothingburger

https://haaslawpllc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/1_Complaint.pdf?smid=nytcore-ios-share
I'm not sure AB can 'beat' any test at this point, unless it's catching a football, which he hasn't done in a while...

[GoSlash27]

The accuser says he raped her on the third accusation. And yes, I believe you can rape the person who is trying to extort you...if that was the case.

So I believe we can agree that the first two allegations definitely don't count as 'rape'. The third incident... I don't put that in the same category either. I don't approve of the conflation of sexually inappropriate behavior or even sexual assault with 'rape'. Rape is a vile and brutal act that deserves its own category. Diluting it with lesser offenses merely cheapens it.

[AtlantaDan]

This observation in a column published yesterday that applauded AB for manipulating the NFL contractual system that I linked in the AB signs with the Pats thread has not aged well. :coffee:

The narrative that Brown is too much the diva and lacks the self-control to be a Patriot is nonsense. Brown is all about self-control; it’s just not the brand that certain NFL martinets seek.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/nfl/dont-blame-antonio-brown-for-putting-himself-first-no-one-else-was-going-to/2019/09/09/76a6601c-d34d-11e9-86ac-0f250cc91758_story.html

One bright side of AB continuing to find new ways to make the news is having writers outside of Pittsburgh who parachute in to pontificate about AB being such a savvy guy having to admit they perhaps are clueless about what he is like.

After the rape allegations, this column today from the Washington Post writer who said yesterday that AB is "all about self-control."

On Tuesday, I congratulated Brown (https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/nfl/dont-blame-antonio-brown-for-putting-himself-first-no-one-else-was-going-to/2019/09/09/76a6601c-d34d-11e9-86ac-0f250cc91758_story.html?tid=lk_inline_manual_7)for having the smarts and self-control and self-determination to get himself to the Patriots, as opposed to letting himself be powerlessly trapped on a bad team. Today, after reading the messages included in the lawsuit filed by his accuser, I feel compelled to state that I don’t know who Brown really is.

https://beta.washingtonpost.com/sports/nfl/i-dont-know-what-antonio-brown-did-but-hes-already-damned-by-misogynist-language/2019/09/11/3f42c4e8-d4c0-11e9-9343-40db57cf6abd_story.html#comments-wrapper

No kidding :coffee:

[T&B fan]

I don't think anyone has asked . but this happened in 2017 and early 2018 . ?? DID the Steelers Know ??

[AtlantaDan]

So I believe we can agree that the first two allegations definitely don't count as 'rape'. The third incident... I don't put that in the same category either. I don't approve of the conflation of sexually inappropriate behavior or even sexual assault with 'rape'. Rape is a vile and brutal act that deserves its own category. Diluting it with lesser offenses merely cheapens it.

The Florida Uniform Crime Reports program defines Rape as the penetration, no matter how slight, of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another person or object, without the consent of the victim.

https://www.fdle.state.fl.us/FSAC/Crime-Data/Forcible-Sex-Offenses/Rape-(1).aspx

From the plaintiff's lawsuit
54.They chatted for a few minutes, and when Ms. Taylor went to walk out of the room, Brown cornered her and pulled her down on the bed on her stomach, pushing her face down into the mattress.
55.She attempted to physically resist, but he pinned her down so that she was unable to fight back.
56.As she struggled, he lifted her dress and told her, “you know you want this.”
57.Ms. Taylor pleaded with him, shouting “no” and “stop.” But Brown refused and proceeded with great violence to penetrate her.
58.Ms. Taylor protested and cried the entire time

https://haaslawpllc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/1_Complaint.pdf

Those of course are only allegations, which AB denies. But if those allegations are correct it seems pretty clearly to be rape under Florida law.

[vader29]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=picEz29zcRw

[GoSlash27]

The Florida Uniform Crime Reports program defines Rape as the penetration, no matter how slight, of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another person or object, without the consent of the victim.

https://www.fdle.state.fl.us/FSAC/Crime-Data/Forcible-Sex-Offenses/Rape-(1).aspx

From the plaintiff's lawsuit
54.They chatted for a few minutes, and when Ms. Taylor went to walk out of the room, Brown cornered her and pulled her down on the bed on her stomach, pushing her face down into the mattress.
55.She attempted to physically resist, but he pinned her down so that she was unable to fight back.
56.As she struggled, he lifted her dress and told her, “you know you want this.”
57.Ms. Taylor pleaded with him, shouting “no” and “stop.” But Brown refused and proceeded with great violence to penetrate her.
58.Ms. Taylor protested and cried the entire time

https://haaslawpllc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/1_Complaint.pdf

Those of course are only allegations, which AB denies. But if those allegations are correct it seems pretty clearly to be rape under Florida law.


Now *that* allegation, if true, would constitute rape. The other stuff, while not meaningless, isn't in the same category and shouldn't be treated as such.

[AtlantaDan]

Now *that* allegation, if true, would constitute rape. The other stuff, while not meaningless, isn't in the same category and shouldn't be treated as such.

Plaintiff's lawsuit agrees on that - the allegations under the complaint's subheading "Brown's Aggression Escalates To Rape" picks up with paragraph 50 of the complaint.

The other two alleged incidents precede that subheading and are under the subheading "Brown Engages In Inappropriate Behavior And Sexualized Behavior" in paragraphs 32 through 39 of the complaint. Paragraphs 81 and 82 of the complaint charge the alleged non-consensual kissing while AB exposed himself and alleged ejaculation on the plaintiff to be battery, not rape.

https://haaslawpllc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/1_Complaint.pdf

Going to be a lot of code words rather than what is stated in the complaint used to describe these allegations by the TV talking heads and other sports media this week.

[GoSlash27]

Going to be a lot of code words rather than what is stated in the complaint used to describe these allegations by the TV talking heads and other sports media this week.

Which is totally understandable, so long as one of those code words used to describe them isn't "rape".
Honestly, I have an emotional interest in seeing him get nailed for something... but I don't see this going anywhere. There's no proof. She never filed a police report or went to the hospital, and he never texted about the alleged incident. It's "he says/ she says", and our standard of law is "innocent until proven guilty". So even if it did happen... it didn't happen (unless some evidence comes to light).

[EzraTank]

Don’t let this shithead football player take the focus from remembering what today means. Remember the towers today. Remember the 3 planes and thousands of people. Remember the first responders and the volunteers. The lives lost, changed forever, and how we as a nation united that 9/11.4 planes. Never forget the heroes that fought back against "some people, that did something"

EDIT: Just read the other response

[EzraTank]

Which is totally understandable, so long as one of those code words used to describe them isn't "rape".
Honestly, I have an emotional interest in seeing him get nailed for something... but I don't see this going anywhere. There's no proof. She never filed a police report or went to the hospital, and he never texted about the alleged incident. It's "he says/ she says", and our standard of law is "innocent until proven guilty". So even if it did happen... it didn't happen (unless some evidence comes to light).Exactly. I hope the POS goes down put this post covers the legal side of things. Without a rape kit, witnesses or any other form of proof under our legal system there is no case.

[ALLD]

NFL is considering putting AB on the commissioner's exempt list. "IF" he is put on this it would mean he could not play but he would still get paid.

Read the article
https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2019/09/11/nfl-will-consider-placing-antonio-brown-paid-leave-making-him-ineligible-play/?noredirect=on


Why would the Pats keep him and pay him if he cannot even play? That's absurd if you are the Pats.

[DesertSteel]

Which is totally understandable, so long as one of those code words used to describe them isn't "rape".
Honestly, I have an emotional interest in seeing him get nailed for something... but I don't see this going anywhere. There's no proof. She never filed a police report or went to the hospital, and he never texted about the alleged incident. It's "he says/ she says", and our standard of law is "innocent until proven guilty". So even if it did happen... it didn't happen (unless some evidence comes to light).
Exactly why would the third incident not be considered rape, if true?

[tom444]

Is there anybody here who wouldn't believe this asshole wouldn't do exactly what she claims he did if you were on a jury?

[fansince'76]

Is there anybody here who wouldn't believe this asshole wouldn't do exactly what she claims he did if you were on a jury?

Hard to say - she's made some pretty damning accusations.

[smokin3000gt]

"he exposed himself to me so I came back a second time in which he cam on my back so naturally I went to his house after a night out drinking in Miami for food and a squat"

sounds legit to me

[GoSlash27]

DS,
Items 54-58 in the lawsuit *is* rape if true. It's the other 3 (kissing, exposing himself, and ejaculating on her) that aren't.

[tom444]

"he exposed himself to me so I came back a second time in which he cam on my back so naturally I went to his house after a night out drinking in Miami for food and a squat"

sounds legit to me

I refer you to Mojouw's post:

Mojouw (http://www.steelersuniverse.com/forums/showthread.php/31075-Antonio-Brown-accused-of-Rape/member.php/779-Mojouw)


"Re: Antonio Brown accused of Rape


I posted this on the other thread as well, but I feel it bears repeating.

Please, let us all stop with the questioning the accuser because she returned to having some sort of relationship (whatever it was/is) with AB. Maybe she is lying. Maybe she is not. We do not know yet. But we can know that it is extremely common for individuals in an abusive or toxic relationship to return to that relationship over and over again. I am not trying to individually target anyone with this comment. Nor am I attempting to say that all of us can not question the validity of the accusations. But lets not do AB's lawyers work for them and start with an assumption that the accuser makes no sense."


Just because a woman, or anyone, gets caught up in a violent relationship it doesn't forgive the actions of the violent partner.

[EzraTank]

Is there anybody here who wouldn't believe this asshole wouldn't do exactly what she claims he did if you were on a jury?

Burden of proof. Look it up. There is a reason you simply cannot just SAY someone did something to you in our legal system. I think it sucks but unless she has proof nothing is happening to him.


And on top of that who here really expects Goodell to suspend one of Robert Kraft's players without overwhelming evidence?

[EzraTank]

I refer you to Mojouw's post:

Mojouw (http://www.steelersuniverse.com/forums/showthread.php/31075-Antonio-Brown-accused-of-Rape/member.php/779-Mojouw)


"Re: Antonio Brown accused of Rape

I posted this on the other thread as well, but I feel it bears repeating.

Please, let us all stop with the questioning the accuser because she returned to having some sort of relationship (whatever it was/is) with AB. Maybe she is lying. Maybe she is not. We do not know yet. But we can know that it is extremely common for individuals in an abusive or toxic relationship to return to that relationship over and over again. I am not trying to individually target anyone with this comment. Nor am I attempting to say that all of us can not question the validity of the accusations. But lets not do AB's lawyers work for them and start with an assumption that the accuser makes no sense."


Just because a woman, or anyone, gets caught up in a violent relationship it doesn't forgive the actions of the violent partner.




Is Mojouw word here now the rules? I see Mojouw's point but if people have a different opinion isn't that the point of this forum? To discuss your opinion. NONE of us know all the facts in this case just what the press is telling us and they most definitely do not know all the facts. So we are drawing our conclusions based on what we have been told. There are a lot of people that would lie to accomplish things for money. If this woman had been just a person trainer to AB ... but the fact that she wanted him to float $1.6 million for her gym ownership. I'll bring up the Brett Kavanaugh hearings. It's pretty clear that Dr. Ford they threw out there was clearly lying to keep him off the Supreme Court. Every person she said was at her "sexual assault" denying being there or even knowing Kavanaugh. It's disgusting what people will do to other people for power and money. All that said I hope this woman DOES have evidence and I hope AB pays for it, the guy is a class A asshole.

But at this point all we can do is wait for a more thorough investigation.

[AtlantaDan]

Is Mojouw word here now the rules? I see Mojouw's point but if people have a different opinion isn't that the point of this forum? To discuss your opinion. NONE of us know all the facts in this case just what the press is telling us and they most definitely do not know all the facts. So we are drawing our conclusions based on what we have been told. There are a lot of people that would lie to accomplish things for money. If this woman had been just a person trainer to AB ... but the fact that she wanted him to float $1.6 million for her gym ownership. I'll bring up the Brett Kavanaugh hearings. It's pretty clear that Dr. Ford they threw out there was clearly lying to keep him off the Supreme Court. Every person she said was at her "sexual assault" denying being there or even knowing Kavanaugh. It's disgusting what people will do to other people for power and money. All that said I hope this woman DOES have evidence and I hope AB pays for it, the guy is a class A asshole.

But at this point all we can do is wait for a more thorough investigation.

If you want to bring up the Brett Kavanaugh hearings I would respectfully suggest you take it to The Soapbox forum

Thank you

[EzraTank]

If you want to bring up the Brett Kavanaugh hearings I would respectfully suggest you take it to The Soapbox forum

Thank you

Why? I didn't bring Justice Kavanaugh up to discuss him just to orchestrate it as a comparison point. Both these situations have a woman with no proof accusing a man of sexual assault. My point was that people will do anything for power and money and that's what I feel is happening in this case. But I then went on to mention let's wait and see if there is any proof.

[teegre]

From what I have read, and lawyerese is like a foreign language to me (Dan, I could use some help here)...

She skipped the part where AB could have settled out of court. (AB had no option to quietly make this go away.) She wants a trial.

Now, I know someone will pick apart the semantics and/or certain words, but again, I’m not a lawyer.

[AtlantaDan]

Why? I didn't bring Justice Kavanaugh up to discuss him just to orchestrate it as a comparison point. Both these situations have a woman with no proof accusing a man of sexual assault. My point was that people will do anything for power and money and that's what I feel is happening in this case. But I then went on to mention let's wait and see if there is any proof.

I am not a moderator - the mods may have a different view

Just expressing my view

Thank you

[EzraTank]

From what I have read, and lawyerese is like a foreign language to me (Dan, I could use some help here)...

She skipped the part where AB could have settled out of court. (AB had no option to quietly make this go away.) She wants a trial.

Now, I know someone will pick apart the semantics and/or certain words, but again, I’m not a lawyer.

And add to the fact that this is a CIVIL lawsuit, which is about damages (aka MONEY). She simply skipped the criminal part of what happened and went right after his wallet.

[teegre]

And add to the fact that this is a CIVIL lawsuit, which is about damages (aka MONEY). She simply skipped the criminal part of what happened and went right after his wallet.

From what I’ve heard about rape cases (which is based on the past few days’ worth of readings), one can generally win a CIVIL case, but it’s much more difficult to win a COURT case. Burden of proof and such.

My question was more about her skipping the part where AB’s lawyer could have simply settled out of court/simply paid her off. She wants a trial.

[EzraTank]

From what I’ve heard about rape cases (which is based on the past few days’ worth of readings), one can generally win a CIVIL case, but it’s much more difficult to win a COURT case. Burden of proof and such.

My question was more about her skipping the part where AB’s lawyer could have simply settled out of court/simply paid her off. She wants a trial.

Yeah this whole case is weird. And it's strange how all this stuff with him on the Raiders, Patriots and now this all hit at once.

Oh well I'm just glad the POS isn't a Steeler anymore.

[Mojouw]

And add to the fact that this is a CIVIL lawsuit, which is about damages (aka MONEY). She simply skipped the criminal part of what happened and went right after his wallet.

Like many rape victims it seems she did not turn to the police immediately thus making a criminal proceeding difficult or even more impossible.

I and to this point no one else has not said that you can’t question the validity of the entire thing. In no sane world is the starting point just assuming one side or the other is true. But to base your doubts in the fact that this young woman did not respond to abuse, assault, and rape in a way that makes sense to you is wrong. All of the information from traumatic relationships and sexual assaults indicates that there is a wide array of responses by victims. Many include repeated and ongoing interactions with their abuser.

Honestly, when you post the stuff you do, you simply sound like an ignorant misogynist. I’m pretty sure your not. So take a moment. Educate yourself. And be better.

Don’t take my word for it. Read any of the dozens of articles from the last few days on the AB lawsuit and the responses to it.

The possibility that this is a false allegation can not be ruled out at this point. But the reason it is false can not be assumed to rest on our belief that there was a proper sequence of events this young woman should’ve went through.

[Steelerschik]

Like many rape victims it seems she did not turn to the police immediately thus making a criminal proceeding difficult or even more impossible.

I and to this point no one else has not said that you can’t question the validity of the entire thing. In no sane world is the starting point just assuming one side or the other is true. But to base your doubts in the fact that this young woman did not respond to abuse, assault, and rape in a way that makes sense to you is wrong. All of the information from traumatic relationships and sexual assaults indicates that there is a wide array of responses by victims. Many include repeated and ongoing interactions with their abuser.

Honestly, when you post the stuff you do, you simply sound like an ignorant misogynist. I’m pretty sure your not. So take a moment. Educate yourself. And be better.

Don’t take my word for it. Read any of the dozens of articles from the last few days on the AB lawsuit and the responses to it.

The possibility that this is a false allegation can not be ruled out at this point. But the reason it is false can not be assumed to rest on our belief that there was a proper sequence of events this young woman should’ve went through.

Thank you for this response. As a woman there's a lot I want to scream about in this thread but will keep my opinions to myself. However I'm just going to say, as someone with personal experience (not rape) in the distant past of sexual assault, I can't stand when the woman gets bashed from the very beginning. There are reasons women don't go to authorities or the proper channels right away. There's a lot of things women block from their minds to suppress memories. To demean ANY woman for her reasons of any of the above is disgusting. Until you walk in those shoes, you have no idea.

[EzraTank]

LOL. Okay. What "stuff" am I posting that deviates from logic? Do not say the word misogynist and brush it off with "I'm pretty sure you're not". That's nonsense and a backhanded accusation which isn't cool. Here's the definition of a misogynist:


noun: misogynist;



a person who dislikes, despises, or is strongly prejudiced against women.



I have a mother, sister, wife and daughter that I would take a bullet for and love. I respect PEOPLE based on who they are not what is between their legs. I was raised to respect women by a strong mother but she also taught me to use logic when dealing with situations...


Yes women usually know their abuser that's a well known fact in most abuse cases, but the circumstances of this story are way too sketchy to be ignored. How many assault victims were asking for $1.6 million from their abuser before the abuse started? And yes I do find it odd that after getting away from someone that you would see them a whole year later then go "clubbing" with him and need to use his bathroom after driving him and his friends home. Does that make me a misogynist because I question that logic? The fact that society is blindly saying "she needs to be believed" in today's world without the burden of proof is scary. I also have a son so I'm looking at it from both sides. I pray neither of my kids EVER have to deal with anything like this.

Again, we can only comment on WHAT we are being told.

[AtlantaDan]

From what I have read, and lawyerese is like a foreign language to me (Dan, I could use some help here)...

She skipped the part where AB could have settled out of court. (AB had no option to quietly make this go away.) She wants a trial.

Now, I know someone will pick apart the semantics and/or certain words, but again, I’m not a lawyer.

Personal injury civil cases are for $$$ - this is not a case where plaintiff is contending AB allegedly did something improper to gain leverage in a non-$$$ matter such as a child custody dispute.

If a plaintiff and her attorneys (who in all probability expect to get the preponderance of their fees satisfied through the standard practice of a contingent share of any recovery) can receive what they regard as a satisfactory payment without going through the expense of a federal district court lawsuit in which the defendant has the resources for a very aggressive defense they are going to take it.

I would be very surprised if there have not been discussions of settlement or at least an inquiry from plaintiff’s attorney if AB wanted to settle before the lawsuit was filed - AB simply may have said get lost I will not be subjected to a shakedown or perhaps not have been willing to enter into a confidential settlement agreement for an amount plaintiff was willing to take

It is not as if AB did not see the lawsuit coming until it was announced Tuesday night - this comment from Rosenhaus indicates Team AB and the plaintiff’s attorney had been communicating

Based off Rosenhaus’s admission Wednesday that “Antonio and I have been unfortunately anticipating this possibility” of a lawsuit and internet rumors of the allegations cropping up in the early Saturday morning hours, it can be safely assumed (but not confirmed) that the allegations contained in Taylor’s complaint Tuesday night were known by Brown and his camp, at least in part, at the time of the [Patriots] signing.”

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/09/12/antonio-brown-sexual-assault-accusations-lawsuit-patriots-bill-belichick-drew-rosenhaus?utm_source=emailshare&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=email-share-article&utm_content=20190912

[EzraTank]

Thanks Dan, that makes sense.

[AtlantaDan]

Thanks Dan, that makes sense.

You are welcome

All of us are on the outside looking in and can only speculate about the merits of these allegations.

It is sometimes helpful to check out the named attorneys in a lawsuit to get an initial idea if one side or the other looks to be hopelessly outgunned

AB is going to retain top flight defense attorneys just as Ben did for his Nevada and Georgia matters

Looking at the signature block on the complaint my guess is the attorney who plaintiff initially has been working with is Marshelle Brooks.

https://haaslawpllc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/1_Complaint.pdf

Her website indicates she is a young solo practitioner.

https://www.mibrookslegal.com/about-2/

If it was just Ms. Brooks I would wonder if the plaintiff's attorney was just throwing a Hail Mary after AB said go ahead and try to litigate against who I can bring in.

However, the attorney at the top of the signature block is David Haas, who was probably retained for reasons including but not limited to Mr Haas being admitted to practice before judges in the USDC SDFL where the lawsuit was filed, which Ms Brooks is not, and having trial experience well beyond that of Ms. Brooks. According to his website Mr. Haas is a former state and federal prosecutor and IMO would be less likely to get tied up in something that is clearly doomed.

https://haaslawpllc.com/about-haas-law/

The third attorney listed in the signature block is Jonathan Abady out of New York. According to his website Mr. Abady has been involved in a number of high profile cases (including representing Bob Kraft's friend Meek Mill). His firm presumably will be able to provide assistance on how to handle a high profile case that is going to include dealing with the media. As with Mr. Haas, Mr. Abady has a successful enough practice that it is unlikely he enjoys signing up for lost causes.

https://www.ecbalaw.com/our-people/jonathan-s-abady/

IMO this ultimately settles with a confidential agreement with plaintiff where we will never know the terms (as happened with Ben in Nevada and I bet happened with Ben in Georgia to resolve any civil claims by the young woman involved in that matter), but I admit that is just my guess.

[DesertSteel]

Just remember, AB is a deadbeat who has to be forced to pay child support. He’s not gonna settle because in his world business is always boomin.

[tom444]

LOL. Okay. What "stuff" am I posting that deviates from logic? Do not say the word misogynist and brush it off with "I'm pretty sure you're not". That's nonsense and a backhanded accusation which isn't cool. Here's the definition of a misogynist:



I have a mother, .................


Please, this "I wouldn't do this or that to women because I have a mother" is hilarious. Do you know anybody who doesn't have a mother?

[tom444]

Burden of proof. Look it up. There is a reason you simply cannot just SAY someone did something to you in our legal system. I think it sucks but unless she has proof nothing is happening to him.


And on top of that who here really expects Goodell to suspend one of Robert Kraft's players without overwhelming evidence?

I didn't say he was guilty. I said is there anyone here who wouldn't believe he was capable of what he is being accused of?

[DesertSteel]

Please, this "I wouldn't do this or that to women because I have a mother" is hilarious. Do you know anybody who doesn't have a mother?
Mike Tyson: "I don't hate all women. My mother was a woman."

[Mojouw]

LOL. Okay. What "stuff" am I posting that deviates from logic? Do not say the word misogynist and brush it off with "I'm pretty sure you're not". That's nonsense and a backhanded accusation which isn't cool. Here's the definition of a misogynist:



I have a mother, sister, wife and daughter that I would take a bullet for and love. I respect PEOPLE based on who they are not what is between their legs. I was raised to respect women by a strong mother but she also taught me to use logic when dealing with situations...


Yes women usually know their abuser that's a well known fact in most abuse cases, but the circumstances of this story are way too sketchy to be ignored. How many assault victims were asking for $1.6 million from their abuser before the abuse started? And yes I do find it odd that after getting away from someone that you would see them a whole year later then go "clubbing" with him and need to use his bathroom after driving him and his friends home. Does that make me a misogynist because I question that logic? The fact that society is blindly saying "she needs to be believed" in today's world without the burden of proof is scary. I also have a son so I'm looking at it from both sides. I pray neither of my kids EVER have to deal with anything like this.

Again, we can only comment on WHAT we are being told.

If you can not think through what you are being told on this forum and literally anywhere else that address these types of issues and see how some of what you are posting could be taken as targeted against women (or at least a specific woman in this case); then there isn't much more I or anyone else can do to explain it to you. I was by no means assuming you held any particular views. Just trying to let you know that if you continue to talk about this case and similar in the way you are posting here, people are going to assume you hold certain views. Views that you do not hold and do not wish to be assumed to hold.

Using "logic" and framing it as "No one would do this or that unless they are lying or some other less than ideal purpose because I strongly believe that Path A is the appropriate course of action and not Path B" is a wildly inappropriate way to approach things when you are dealing with toxic interpersonal relationships and potentially significant trauma.

Honestly, don't take my word for it. Take literally anyone else's -- its all over the internet.

[EzraTank]

It's cool I respect your opinion, but "it's all over the internet" doesn't mean it's right.

Let's just agree to disagree on this point. I think EVERY person who thinks they are a victim should definitely be heard. But based on what evidence (and there's very little) presented here, it appears she is not telling the truth. THAT IS JUST MY OPINION on this matter.

[steelreserve]

I think it has gotten out of hand that you are basically not allowed to say "that story sounds fishy," at the risk of being labeled some kind of terrible hatemonger.

I mean, yes, some people will go way overboard in attacking the victim / accuser / whatever in these cases, which is not cool at all ... but the opposite reaction, that no one is permitted to question the facts of the case in any way, or form their own opinion using their own judgment, is also going to rub a lot of people the wrong way, and it's easy to see why they resent it. Both are extreme stances and very ugly.

However, it does seem the latter is the one increasingly being rammed down our throats with a vicious mob mentality. It is good that there is pushback against that. People need to be allowed to think for themselves, full stop.

In this particular case - who the hell knows. Are there things about the woman's story that sound kind of odd? Yeah. Does it seem plausible that Tony Brown is a total douche who just might be involved in shit like that. Sure. Bottom line, I don't know what the answer is because I wasn't there and don't know any of these people!

But the fact that this, in itself, is an increasingly dangerous opinion to hold, is not ok. Or, by extension, the fact that it is unacceptable to some to hold the opinion, "I think it is more likely that this one guy, based on clearly crazy recent public behavior, would be more likely to bust a load on the back of some random female than a Supreme Court justice would be." The rabid toxicity over every iota of these kinds of discussions has just gotten way out of hand.

[EzraTank]

Thank You Steelreserve. This is why I brought up the Kavanaugh thing (as an example). There were people in the Senate blatantly ignoring the complete lack of evidence blindly saying, "I believe her, no matter what". We had a sitting Senator from Hawaii tell men they need to sit down, shut up, because their opinion didn't count, and anything they said would make them bigots, and misogynists.

That kind of shaming of thought is very scary as you pointed out. It's happening all over the world right now and it needs to stop. Labeling someone something usually means you've already lost the debate.

[tom444]

That kind of shaming of thought is very scary as you pointed out.


Here's a thought, see if you shame it?: The Patriots never cheated in their franchise's history. The NFL has just been playing victim.

https://media1.tenor.com/images/ee29b03aa45a3bf42df1d3c7e4021d6d/tenor.gif?itemid=5019872

[steelreserve]

Saying a plaintiff is "a POS" does not seem to be the same as saying "that story sounds fishy" but that of course is just my personal opinion

Yeah, that kind of stuff is pretty uncalled for IMO unless there's a real clear reason, but I do think the "how dare you" outrage mob also goes far beyond that kind of behavior. There are those people - and no small number of them, I might add - who will attempt to shout you down, denounce you as a terrible bigot, and worse, if you do not simply take the accusation as fact. No "he said, she said," just "she said." No critical thinking allowed.

That's the kind of thing that goes beyond merely "disagreeing on the facts" or "disagreeing about sexual assault," and gets into a lot more serious, and frankly dangerous, area of prohibiting speech, prohibiting thought, and of angry mob justice and public shaming as a substitute for justice.

I think Tony Brown is a huge piece of shit, but am not willing to jump on the trial-by-media and unilateral NFL suspension bandwagon. (Still don't think the NFL should be in the business of operating its own extrajudicial investigation and punishment system at all, but that's a different tangent). The worse thing is that they do not go after the very real violations of their own rules, and this is the straw at which people are left grasping.


Thank You Steelreserve. This is why I brought up the Kavanaugh thing (as an example). There were people in the Senate blatantly ignoring the complete lack of evidence blindly saying, "I believe her, no matter what". We had a sitting Senator from Hawaii tell men they need to sit down, shut up, because their opinion didn't count, and anything they said would make them bigots, and misogynists.

That kind of shaming of thought is very scary as you pointed out. It's happening all over the world right now and it needs to stop. Labeling someone something usually means you've already lost the debate.

The Kavanaugh situation was scary to me because it was basically a litmus test for "Just how far can we push this before people have had enough." That they could use accusations as a weapon, and can do the same to anyone if they don't like them, and all you can do is shut up and fall in line, and Kamala Harris will tell you what to think and you'll goddamn like it. Politics aside (I am neither a huge fan of him nor a detractors in any case), I am glad that effort failed, because it did show that there is some limit to how much people will put up with. That is pretty much the whole reason for Trump and his movement in a bigger sense, but now this really does risk veering off course into Soapbox material, so that's where I'll stop.

[Fire Goodell]

As much as I dislike AB right now, I think something is fishy about the timing and the fact the accuser asked for a huge sum of money in the first place.

Best case scenario this gets dragged out and causes all kinds of drama to the point the Patriots decide it's not worth it and cut him, but probably won't happen. Pats will win #7 and AB will likely be the MVP

[steelreserve]

As much as I dislike AB right now, I think something is fishy about the timing and the fact the accuser asked for a huge sum of money in the first place.

Best case scenario this gets dragged out and causes all kinds of drama to the point the Patriots decide it's not worth it and cut him, but probably won't happen. Pats will win #7 and AB will likely be the MVP

I've heard a lot of people talk about the timing, but I don't get it. He's got LESS money now and less to lose than he did a few weeks or months ago.

The behavior and sequence of events seems a bit odd, but as Mojouw said, who the hell knows what people are liable to do in these situations. It's a wack state of affairs when Tony Brown's involved.

[Craic]

Ben got 6 games from the league.....reduced to 4. We won 3 of those games going through all of our back up quarterbacks.



No, he didn't. Not on his first allegation. The league did nothing concerning his first allegation. Unless I missed something, this is Brown's first allegation. So, going by precedent based on actions concerning Ben R., the league would not have to act.

- - - Updated - - -


The Kavanaugh situation was scary to me because it was basically a litmus test for "Just how far can we push this before people have had enough." That they could use accusations as a weapon, and can do the same to anyone if they don't like them, and all you can do is shut up and fall in line, and Kamala Harris will tell you what to think and you'll goddamn like it. Politics aside (I am neither a huge fan of him nor a detractors in any case), I am glad that effort failed, because it did show that there is some limit to how much people will put up with. That is pretty much the whole reason for Trump and his movement in a bigger sense, but now this really does risk veering off course into Soapbox material, so that's where I'll stop.

Wait, you think the Kavanaugh situation was a litmus test for seeing how far something could be pushed before people had enough? IMO you're almost thirty years too late. That litmus test was the Clarence Thomas fiasco.

[AtlantaDan]

No, he didn't. Not on his first allegation. The league did nothing concerning his first allegation. Unless I missed something, this is Brown's first allegation. So, going by precedent based on actions concerning Ben R., the league would not have to act.

Lots of change inside the league (Ray Rice) and the outside world (#MeToo) since the Lake Tahoe allegations against Ben. Whether that is good or bad, fair or unfair, it is the world in which the NFL exists as it tries to protect the image of The Shield and keep those TV ratings up

Goodell makes up his disciplinary standards as he goes along but if the same first wave Lake Tahoe allegations were raised against Ben today, along with Ben sending the sort of charming texts AB sent to the plaintiff, IMO the league would not be taking the same boys will be boys attitude it did with Ben in 2009 and just wave it away

[steelreserve]

Wait, you think the Kavanaugh situation was a litmus test for seeing how far something could be pushed before people had enough? IMO you're almost thirty years too late. That litmus test was the Clarence Thomas fiasco.

Well, same idea, but IMO orders of magnitude more brazen this time. And also very different because of the way both mainstream and social media have changed things (very much for the worse IMO).

Like, I don't completely know how to explain it, except that the Clarence Thomas thing seemed like a political game being played by politicians against other politicians. Whereas the Kavanaugh thing was also a direct test on the public to see how far we would bend. It was much more sinister.

"Here is a story that is clearly very suspect, and riddled with glaring omissions and problems, and stinking to high heaven of manipulation for political gain - but that's the official story! Do you buy it and not rock the boat? Or do you question it and risk being unpopular?" And you can be sure they were watching closely for things like, how risky WAS it to question the story? and, how much peer pressure is needed to make how many people go with the flow?

In essence, it was the Democratic Party of the United States asking, "How many fingers, Winston?"

As I said, the changed role of the media in that cannot be overstated. As some famous asshole said, "It used to be that the news reported what happened, and it was up to you to figure out what you thought about it. Now the news tells you what you thought about it, and it's up to you to figure out whether anything happened." A big, big problem - much bigger than a lot of people realize.

It's four fingers, by the way. FOUR.

[GoSlash27]

^ Pretty much everything steelreserve said. :yup:
It's ridiculous that people aren't allowed to question a narrative without being judged (or even attacked). The irony is that the judgmental zealots are the self- described "tolerant and inclusive" crowd.

[43Hitman]

I almost got into a physical altercation with a guy at work over the Kavenaugh thing. Simply because I was questioning her motives and dissecting the ridiculous narrative the media was pushing down our throats. The dude at work totally lost his shit and started calling me all kinds of names. I just laughed at him and told him that he was showing how intolerant his side really is. That's when he tried to come at me, I just side stepped him and let his fat ass belly take him to the ground. By the way, he was fired and nothing happened to me, thank God for an honest witnesses.

[tom444]

This isn't brain surgery. The point is this. Just because a person appears to remain in, or continues to return to, an abusive relationship it doesn't mean the relationship, and the abuse didn't occur.

[86WARD]

This isn't brain surgery. The point is this. Just because a person appears to remain in, or continues to return to, an abusive relationship it doesn't mean the relationship, and the abuse didn't occur.

Pretty much sums it up.

[Mojouw]

This isn't brain surgery. The point is this. Just because a person appears to remain in, or continues to return to, an abusive relationship it doesn't mean the relationship, and the abuse didn't occur.

Well said.

[AtlantaDan]

So after reviewing the posts in this thread at this point all we know for certain is if Roger Goodell was Chief Justice then Brett Kavanaugh would potentially have been suspended from up to six cases during the past Supreme Court term?

For everyone who had a discussion of what Antonio Brown and a Supreme Court Justice have in common as a potential thread subject this season props to you. :hatsoff:

[AtlantaDan]

If true, nice cover story for the Pats and Raiders having to explain why they apparently missed doing full due diligence on asking Rosenhaus about any potential red flags in AB's background

Representatives for New England Patriots (https://www.espn.com/nfl/team/_/name/ne/new-england-patriots) receiver Antonio Brown (https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/_/id/13934/antonio-brown) and Britney Taylor were in discussions over the past few months, but agreed their communication would remain confidential until the filing of Taylor's civil sexual assault lawsuit, sources told ESPN on Thursday.

This, the sources say, is why the Patriots and the Oakland Raiders (https://www.espn.com/nfl/team/_/name/oak/oakland-raiders), who released Brown last weekend, would not have known about the matter unless there was a breach in the confidentiality of those discussions.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/27602699/pats-unaware-ab-involved-civil-matter

[steelreserve]

So after reviewing the posts in this thread at this point all we know for certain is if Roger Goodell was Chief Justice then Brett Kavanaugh would potentially have been suspended from up to six cases during the past Supreme Court term?

For everyone who had a discussion of what Antonio Brown and a Supreme Court Justice have in common as a potential thread subject this season props to you. :hatsoff:

If Goodell was Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, he would be liable to overturn Roe v. Wade, because it's your own business how you get across a river.

Then Tony Brown would run in and nut all over his back.

[NCSteeler]

What if the player took the action before he signed the contract rather than takes the action after he signs the contract? :scratchchin:Yup, a half assed lawyer beats that

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

[NCSteeler]

"he exposed himself to me so I came back a second time in which he cam on my back so naturally I went to his house after a night out drinking in Miami for food and a squat"

sounds legit to meYou'd be surprised what a woman trying to start a business with millionaire athletes would be willing to over look

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

[NCSteeler]

From what I have read, and lawyerese is like a foreign language to me (Dan, I could use some help here)...

She skipped the part where AB could have settled out of court. (AB had no option to quietly make this go away.) She wants a trial.

Now, I know someone will pick apart the semantics and/or certain words, but again, I’m not a lawyer.Didn't pick up on that. A gold digger would for sure offer a quiet settlement

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

[teegre]

Didn't pick up on that. A gold digger would for sure offer a quiet settlement

:nod: Yep. That is my point. That is what stuck out to me through the many different “takes” on the subject.

If this were indeed a “cash grab” (as some have suggested), then her lawyer would have had that moment where a settlement discussion occurred. As the article stated (paraphrasing): “She skipped that part.” Why? Because, she wants a trial.

It reminds me of Fred Goldman. Fred didn’t care about the money. He wanted everyone to know exactly what OJ had done. Likewise, this woman is not about the money; she wants everyone to know, read about, hear about what a sick person AB truly is.

[AtlantaDan]

Too bad for AB insanity is not available as a potential defense to liability in civil lawsuits for monetary damages - his lawyers must be dreading him potentially going on social media to discuss plaintiff

1172293936934785025

[NCSteeler]

:nod: Yep. That is my point. That is what stuck out to me through the many different “takes” on the subject.

If this were indeed a “cash grab” (as some have suggested), then her lawyer would have had that moment where a settlement discussion occurred. As the article stated (paraphrasing): “She skipped that part.” Why? Because, she wants a trial.

It reminds me of Fred Goldman. Fred didn’t care about the money. He wanted everyone to know exactly what OJ had done. Likewise, this woman is not about the money; she wants everyone to know, read about, hear about what a sick person AB truly is.Although, o could easily see crazy Brown and his I'm bigger than everyone craziness staying screw you I didn't do anything wrong.

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

[EzraTank]

This isn't brain surgery. The point is this. Just because a person appears to remain in, or continues to return to, an abusive relationship it doesn't mean the relationship, and the abuse didn't occur.

And just because she asked for $1.6 million and was turned down doesn't mean she wouldn't make up a story, apply a CIVIL law suit for "damages" to get the money.


[see it works both ways]



For everyone who had a discussion of what Antonio Brown and a Supreme Court Justice have in common as a potential thread subject this season props to you. http://www.steelersuniverse.com/forums/images/smilies/hatsoff.gif

Come on Dan, you know what I meant by using the comparison. Of course these two have nothing in common, but the comparison was being applied to the fact that people were saying we're not even allowed to question her story without being labeled something. That comparison is 100% accurate.





If this were indeed a “cash grab” (as some have suggested), then her lawyer would have had that moment where a settlement discussion occurred. As the article stated (paraphrasing): “She skipped that part.” Why? Because, she wants a trial.



You're assuming she wants a trial, but we do not know all the facts. AB might have told his lawyers to tell her to go pound sand she's not getting a dime. If that was the case then she would have no other option but either drop the case or push for a trial.

Believe me if any of this happened I hope AB goes to jail and she takes every last dime of his but good luck proving it. I'm not a lawyer but the only thing she has going for her would be to push this in front of a jury and hope they read (if that's even possible) AB's texts/emails and feels it warrants some $$$. But for the millionth time NONE of us know all the facts.

[NCSteeler]

TB12 better think about their brand association. Surely if he's as dumb as we think he'll blown so crap up on social media one night soon

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

[JnK]

Whether or not he raped her there's evidence he jacked off on her back from the texts he wrote. That right there should get him kicked out of the league. It's a really good look for the so-called Shield of the NFL. He's a pig and a poor excuse of a human being. Oh... but wait.... he can catch the shit out of a football.

[tom444]

And just because she asked for $1.6 million and was turned down doesn't mean she wouldn't make up a story, apply a CIVIL law suit for "damages" to get the money.


[see it works both ways]

You just can't get it, can you? No one said she couldn't have made shit up.

[AtlantaDan]

Loooong article on AB in USA Today that I assume was in the works before the lawsuit was announced. Main quoted source on AB’s alleged history of abusing women is stepfather Larry Moss, who has his own issues and no doubt has his own ax to grind

But if this is true it is another stunning example of AB being all and only about AB

Talking about Brown, Moss grew angry while noting Brown's mother said she is starting to look for a second job.


“There’s no way in the world his mother should be looking for no second job with the kind of money he has and what she did for him,’’ Moss said.



https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2019/09/13/antonio-brown-nfl-wrs-troubling-past-shines-light-current-woes/2298810001/

[Mojouw]

You just can't get it, can you? No one said she couldn't have made shit up.
Some people are incapable of learning.

Also, when was the last time someone made something like this up about an athlete? People, including AB, act like it happens all the time. I try not to pay attention to horrendous off field stuff, but I feel like all the claims I can remember ending up being true...

- - - Updated - - -


Loooong article on AB in USA Today that I assume was in the works before the lawsuit was announced. Main quoted source on AB’s alleged history of abusing women is stepfather Larry Moss, who has his own issues and no doubt has his own ax to grind

But if this is true it is another stunning example of AB being all and only about AB

Talking about Brown, Moss grew angry while noting Brown's mother said she is starting to look for a second job.


“There’s no way in the world his mother should be looking for no second job with the kind of money he has and what she did for him,’’ Moss said.



https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2019/09/13/antonio-brown-nfl-wrs-troubling-past-shines-light-current-woes/2298810001/

Hasnt He been estranged from his family since high school? Thought I read somewhere once that he lived with a coach or something...

[steelreserve]

Also, when was the last time someone made something like this up about an athlete? People, including AB, act like it happens all the time. I try not to pay attention to horrendous off field stuff, but I feel like all the claims I can remember ending up being true...

Wasn't there some guy who played quarterback for the Steelers one time that that happened to? Can't remember his name ... Brent Hamburger ... Ben Hackenschleimer ... something like that ... ah, no bells.

But in all seriousness, I think false or at least dubious sexual assault accusations do happen a LOT against pro athletes, because it is one of the best possible ways to blackmail them, or just get revenge. Also by its nature, something that is hazy and difficult to definitively disprove. So really a great tool for anyone looking to start some shit. People are not necessarily good by nature.

There have been a few in the recent past that turned out that way ... if I recall, there was one NFL player (on the 49ers?) who countersued for extortion and won, and others that have gone away after it was discovered the whole intention was to blackmail someone. Many start this simply by "threatening to release sex tapes" (cases such as Zeke Elliott, Von Miller, Jaromir Jagr - most boss response ever, by the way), and it is not too far from there to making accusations, depending on who the person is and how twisted their motivation. Hell, there was even a scheme many years ago to blackmail Jerome Bettis with a trumped-up assault accusation, but that was discredited:


http://old.post-gazette.com/steelers/20020912bettis0912p4.asp

... then you have cases like Brian Banks, where false accusations successfully derailed a guy's career and ruined his life. So this "it never happens" line is just not true.

The ones that DO seem to almost always be true are the accusations of violence. I can recall very few, if any, where there wasn't at least something to it.

Having said all of that, there is really nothing in this case that would lead me to believe Tony Brown's word is any better than this woman's, or she's making it up and should be dismissed out of hand, or anything like that. Who knows, have to wait and see.

Oh! It was Rapistberger. Ben RAPISTBERGER! That was the guy I was thinking of.



Hasnt He been estranged from his family since high school? Thought I read somewhere once that he lived with a coach or something...

Makes sense, if I had to put up with that guy for any length of time, I'd probably be estranged from him too.

[EzraTank]

Meet Tom444 and Mojouw the social justice warriors of Steelers Universe!

Remember when they virtue signal it's the law! I only hope someday we're all capable of learning from their great wisdom.

[tom444]

Some people are incapable of learning.

Also, when was the last time someone made something like this up about an athlete? People, including AB, act like it happens all the time. I try not to pay attention to horrendous off field stuff, but I feel like all the claims I can remember ending up being true...

Yeah, clearly there's smoke here. How much fire, not for me to say at this juncture.

[Fire Goodell]

I'm wondering why people can't have a discussion without taking backhanded shots at people, seriously, let the case play itself out, none of us knows shit right now

[86WARD]

Regardless of how the case plays out and whether he is guilty or not, the emails he sent and the things he’s written is enough for him to suffer the old “conduct detrimental” penalty.

[EzraTank]

Regardless of how the case plays out and whether he is guilty or not, the emails he sent and the things he’s written is enough for him to suffer the old “conduct detrimental” penalty.

Agreed, but this is the Patriots and Kraft and Goodell are buds. And as of right now he's still allowed to play this weekend.

[DesertSteel]

Regardless of how the case plays out and whether he is guilty or not, the emails he sent and the things he’s written is enough for him to suffer the old “conduct detrimental” penalty.
But I guess after your team has had a serial killer, stuff like sex trafficking, cocaine, sexual harassment, et al are not all that detrimental by comparison.

[steelreserve]

Agreed, but this is the Patriots and Kraft and Goodell are buds. And as of right now he's still allowed to play this weekend.

Well, I'm not above wishing he gets hurt.

[86WARD]

But I guess after your team has had a serial killer, stuff like sex trafficking, cocaine, sexual harassment, et al are not all that detrimental by comparison.

True. Probably just sounds like a Friday/Saturday night at the Kraft Compound...

[AtlantaDan]

No surprise here and IMO the correct decision since Roger & Friends have not yet even spoken to plaintiff.

NFL not placing AB on exempt list

And no surprise Belichick is not going to do anything on his own

Asked Friday whether Brown would play, Patriots coach Bill Belichick answered, "We'll do what's best for the team." He later added that the team is trying to get Brown, who signed Monday, up to speed as quickly as possible.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/27606855/sources-nfl-not-placing-ab-exempt-list

[tom444]

https://images.theconversation.com/files/135475/original/image-20160825-6595-981zwe.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=926&fit=clip

[Mojouw]

Wasn't there some guy who played quarterback for the Steelers one time that that happened to? Can't remember his name ... Brent Hamburger ... Ben Hackenschleimer ... something like that ... ah, no bells.

But in all seriousness, I think false or at least dubious sexual assault accusations do happen a LOT against pro athletes, because it is one of the best possible ways to blackmail them, or just get revenge. Also by its nature, something that is hazy and difficult to definitively disprove. So really a great tool for anyone looking to start some shit. People are not necessarily good by nature.

There have been a few in the recent past that turned out that way ... if I recall, there was one NFL player (on the 49ers?) who countersued for extortion and won, and others that have gone away after it was discovered the whole intention was to blackmail someone. Many start this simply by "threatening to release sex tapes" (cases such as Zeke Elliott, Von Miller, Jaromir Jagr - most boss response ever, by the way), and it is not too far from there to making accusations, depending on who the person is and how twisted their motivation. Hell, there was even a scheme many years ago to blackmail Jerome Bettis with a trumped-up assault accusation, but that was discredited:


http://old.post-gazette.com/steelers/20020912bettis0912p4.asp

... then you have cases like Brian Banks, where false accusations successfully derailed a guy's career and ruined his life. So this "it never happens" line is just not true.

The ones that DO seem to almost always be true are the accusations of violence. I can recall very few, if any, where there wasn't at least something to it.

Having said all of that, there is really nothing in this case that would lead me to believe Tony Brown's word is any better than this woman's, or she's making it up and should be dismissed out of hand, or anything like that. Who knows, have to wait and see.

Oh! It was Rapistberger. Ben RAPISTBERGER! That was the guy I was thinking of.




Makes sense, if I had to put up with that guy for any length of time, I'd probably be estranged from him too.

Thanks for pointing some of those out. Like I said, I try to pay as little attention as possible to this kinda stuff.

FWIW, I think Ben did exactly what was alleged to an extent. He totally had sex with that lady in a bathroom in a crap bar in podunk Georgia. That I have almost always been convinced of. What I am not certain about is the events leading up to and the aftermath of it all. If I remember correctly, that was the crux of the whole thing. So long ago, I don't actually remember or really care to look back into it.

- - - Updated - - -

This whole issue raises another tangent for me about the NFL and sports leagues in general. I am not sure I am on board with non-criminal off-field stuff impacting whether these guys play or not.

Drug testing is another thing, so let's leave that aside for the moment. But I have always thought if the players are not actually in jail or in criminal court proceedings, then they can play. Isn't that basically how it is out in the regular world?

I get that it is about PR and avoiding protests and bad news cycles for the league. But I am not sure it is the teams or the leagues responsibility to keep up the mythology that all pro-athletes are role models and not crappy human beings. Which, in my opinion, most of the league suspensions are driven by.

[steelreserve]

Thanks for pointing some of those out. Like I said, I try to pay as little attention as possible to this kinda stuff.

FWIW, I think Ben did exactly what was alleged to an extent. He totally had sex with that lady in a bathroom in a crap bar in podunk Georgia. That I have almost always been convinced of. What I am not certain about is the events leading up to and the aftermath of it all. If I remember correctly, that was the crux of the whole thing. So long ago, I don't actually remember or really care to look back into it.

There is no doubt he at least got a sloppy blowjob from a half-drunk chick in the men's room crapper, although who did what and why was all uncertain ... I think the police chief said "It's unclear whether any crime occurred, so we can't press charges, but nobody has anything to be proud of here," which is about as good a way of putting it as I can think of.

The one a couple years BEFORE that was the real suspicious one. Remember that woman who worked in a hotel in Lake Tahoe, and said Ben coaxed her up to his room, and then just forcibly pinned her down and raped her for no reason at all? And then before long it came out that she had, like ... severe issues ... and they found a whole series of emails and text messages to other people talking about her imaginary boyfriend Ben (which I think began a few days before he was supposed to be there, for some celebrity golf tournament or something), and she made up this whole fantastical double life that actually didn't exist at all? That all happened too.

I think that there are people out there who get it in their heads that, because they met a famous person, or know a famous person, or slept with a famous person, they ought to share some of that fame, and when it doesn't work that way, it drives them out of their minds. Sure, most people know better than that, but not all of them. Something like 4-5% of the general population has a serious mental illness, which - besides being a pretty frightening statistic by itself - goes a long way toward explaining a LOT of (very real) terrible behavior by crazy athletes and celebrities, and also the odd crazy accusation that doesn't add up.




This whole issue raises another tangent for me about the NFL and sports leagues in general. I am not sure I am on board with non-criminal off-field stuff impacting whether these guys play or not.

Drug testing is another thing, so let's leave that aside for the moment. But I have always thought if the players are not actually in jail or in criminal court proceedings, then they can play. Isn't that basically how it is out in the regular world?

I get that it is about PR and avoiding protests and bad news cycles for the league. But I am not sure it is the teams or the leagues responsibility to keep up the mythology that all pro-athletes are role models and not crappy human beings. Which, in my opinion, most of the league suspensions are driven by.

That's exactly how it ought to be if you ask me. Employers, colleges, sports leagues, etc. are not the police, they are not the courts, and they do not have access to the same information as the police and courts. Most "investigations" conducted by them are a joke, and wouldn't even meet the most basic legal standards, and everyone can see this.

Not to mention, as I've said repeatedly in these kinds of discussions, the effect of the league investigating and suspending players for ordinary street crime is actually to draw MORE attention to it. There was NO shortage of the same type of behavior in the past, but without all these public airings and official statements, people just kind of grumbled and went, "Well, that guy sounds like an asshole, but if it was that important, I'm sure he'd be in jail; at least he can play ball."

Like ... if all the suspensions actually caused athletes to stop getting arrested, then you could consider it a success at cleaning up your image. If you just keep suspending them, and they keep getting arrested, and you keep suspending them some more - well, that's how you make your image even worse. I don't think the image of the NFL is any better today than it was before the player conduct policy; in fact, it's probably about the worst it's ever been.

Unfortunately, out in the regular world, I think it's starting to not work the way it should either. Getting more and more common for people to be fired for anything that could be considered controversial at all - and in fact, that's increasingly used as a weapon by people with certain political leanings (guess which ones) to scare their opponents into silence for fear of losing their livelihoods.

And so now we've come full circle back to the whole debate over "believe all women," #MeToo, Brett Kavanaugh ... how much skepticism are you allowed to express publicly before your job is at stake? Which opinions can you hold before the Thought Police come for you? Some things with much deeper implications. And I think that a good reason why the Kavanaugh case was brought up repeatedly was that you can be certain there was some ... thing ... behind the scenes watching the outcome. Not even the results of the case itself, but of what other people were able to get away with saying and thinking publicly. And if things had been slightly different - if signs were clear that the muzzle was on tight enough and asking certain questions was no longer accepted - that would be a big green light for all sorts of things that you don't want to think about. That battle is not over, by the way, and I think the escape was very narrow.

[Mojouw]

Tucker Carlson having a job single-handedly proves there are no thought police.

Thought police and what not is just a scare tactic used by the people who want to say the quiet parts out loud and are pissed off that they can't.

But we are veering off into murky waters that have nothing to do with football.

I think we do both agree that the NFL's policies on a variety of issues are utter nonsense driven by bizarre and unverified gauges of public opinion. Which the NFL typically mistakes as being represented by who shouts loudest on Twitter first.

[steelreserve]

Tucker Carlson having a job single-handedly proves there are no thought police.

Thought police and what not is just a scare tactic used by the people who want to say the quiet parts out loud and are pissed off that they can't.

But we are veering off into murky waters that have nothing to do with football.

I think we do both agree that the NFL's policies on a variety of issues are utter nonsense driven by bizarre and unverified gauges of public opinion. Which the NFL typically mistakes as being represented by who shouts loudest on Twitter first.

I think you could remove "the NFL" from that post and have a statement that is just as true!

[tom444]

No surprise here and IMO the correct decision since Roger & Friends have not yet even spoken to plaintiff.

NFL not placing AB on exempt list

And no surprise Belichick is not going to do anything on his own

Asked Friday whether Brown would play, Patriots coach Bill Belichick answered, "We'll do what's best for the team." He later added that the team is trying to get Brown, who signed Monday, up to speed as quickly as possible.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/27606855/sources-nfl-not-placing-ab-exempt-list

The Patriots can sit AB but I would think they have to be careful about going too much further. At some point they'd be getting into denying AB the right to work when he hasn't been proven guilty of anything but being an asshole.

[Mojouw]

I think you could remove "the NFL" from that post and have a statement that is just as true!

For sure. With any "customer facing" business venture there is a rush to listen to the first/loudest thing that they hear.

I think some companies are starting to get it. Just make whatever decision you think is best, and take it on the teeth for like 4 days and everyone moves on to the next thing. The NFL (and others) are convinced there is a way to thread the needle where you don't take it on the teeth. With the internet drive "outrage culture" we live in, there is no path to avoiding taking it on the teeth.

Remember when no one was going to ever shop at Target again because bathrooms or predators or something or other? That blew over in like a hot minute.

[DesertSteel]

Drug testing is another thing, so let's leave that aside for the moment. But I have always thought if the players are not actually in jail or in criminal court proceedings, then they can play. Isn't that basically how it is out in the regular world?

In high profile jobs or senior management positions? Not even close. You don't get to keep showing up to work like nothing happened.

[AtlantaDan]

The Patriots can sit AB but I would think they have to be careful about going too much further. At some point they'd be getting into denying AB the right to work when he hasn't been proven guilty of anything but being an asshole.

IMO the ticking time bomb for the Pats this season is if AB thinks he is being deprived of a fair opportunity to hit the incentive clauses in his contract

AB may go ballistic if anyone sits him to reduce his ability to hit those incentive numbers but if Belichick sits him rather than the league that lights the fuse

[tom444]

In high profile jobs or senior management positions? Not even close. You don't get to keep showing up to work like nothing happened.

But those employees usually aren't operating under a CBA.

"Given that the American workforce is increasingly non-unionized, many employees do not have experience with workplaces governed by CBAs. As a result, many assume that the NFL is like any other at-will employer and can suspend whoever it wants, for any reason and for any length of time. This, however, is not the case: As we learned in the Tom Brady matter, and as we are learning in the Elliott case, the CBA and individual contracts determine the extent of the NFL’s power, and if the players believe that the NFL has exceeded that power, they can bring suit in federal court. Here, the NFL has, through the CBA, relatively broad authority to discipline its players. In light of the most recent decision, Elliott is now serving his suspension."

https://www.theharmanfirm.com/blog/collective-bargaining-employee-rights-nfl/

[GoSlash27]

Thought police and what not is just a scare tactic used by the people who want to say the quiet parts out loud and are pissed off that they can't.

I'm afraid you just torpedoed your own argument. There is a reason "they can't say the quiet parts out loud", and that reason is what they call the 'thought police'.

In this case, people are allowed to say "AB is a scumbag and I think he's lying", but they are not allowed to say "This chick seems shady AF, her story doesn't check out, and I think *she's* lying. At least not out loud. That part, they keep quiet. And yeah, it pisses them off.

[vader29]

1172613457465827328

[tom444]

......................... but they are not allowed to say "This chick seems shady AF, her story doesn't check out, and I think *she's* lying. At least not out loud. That part, they keep quiet. And yeah, it pisses them off.

Sure they are. What we've grown beyond is the notion that because a woman stays in an abusive relationship the abuse is somehow negated.

[Mojouw]

I'm afraid you just torpedoed your own argument. There is a reason "they can't say the quiet parts out loud", and that reason is what they call the 'thought police'.

In this case, people are allowed to say "AB is a scumbag and I think he's lying", but they are not allowed to say "This chick seems shady AF, her story doesn't check out, and I think *she's* lying. At least not out loud. That part, they keep quiet. And yeah, it pisses them off.

So the counter argument is that people are angry that they cant say racist, bigoted, prejudicial, misogynist, and vile stuff in public forums? Because that is the quiet parts.

And for the record, of course you can say you think she is lying. You just cant solely rest it on the solely on the idea that there is a proper and predetermined reaction or set of actions that an accuser must follow after abusive events. And failing this arbitrary litmus test is an a priori reason to reject the claims. That is not thought police or social justice. That is a simple acknowledgement of what is now known about how abuse impacts its victims and their relationships with abusers.

[AtlantaDan]

1172613457465827328

Thanks for that - forget the Pepsi & Pizza Hut endorsements - AB is so toxic he cannot even get paid on equipment deals

[steelreserve]

I'm afraid you just torpedoed your own argument. There is a reason "they can't say the quiet parts out loud", and that reason is what they call the 'thought police'.

In this case, people are allowed to say "AB is a scumbag and I think he's lying", but they are not allowed to say "This chick seems shady AF, her story doesn't check out, and I think *she's* lying. At least not out loud. That part, they keep quiet. And yeah, it pisses them off.

I think he genuinely believes that "the quiet part that you can't say out loud" means people are only attacked for saying things that are actually racist, sexist, or otherwise bigoted.

Not that people will denounce you as a racist, sexist, or bigot, for voicing benign opinions or facts that they just don't like. That's unfathomable, and believing that people would do it is just crazy tinfoil hat scare tactics.

But no, really, that's what's going on. Changing the acceptable frame of reference by repeating your own mantra loudly and aggressively, until enough people begin to question their own judgment and common sense. Gaslighting 101.

"A great way to tell that someone is not a racist is that they don't like being called a racist. A real racist doesn't care if you call him a racist. He'll just call you a n***** and move on with his day." I don't know whether it was some famous modern philosopher who said that, or some idiot on 4chan, but it's worth mentioning, and applies to most forms of bigotry.

[86WARD]

1172613457465827328

Maybe the shortest sponsorship of all time?

[GoSlash27]

So the counter argument is that people are angry that they cant say racist, bigoted, prejudicial, misogynist, and vile stuff in public forums? Because that is the quiet parts.
Close. People are angry that they can't say things that might be misinterpreted (intentionally or otherwise) as "racist, bigoted, prejudicial, misogynist, and vile". Which, surprise... is pretty much anything those people disagree with.


And for the record, of course you can say you think she is lying. You just cant solely rest it on the solely on the idea that there is a proper and predetermined reaction or set of actions that an accuser must follow after abusive events. And failing this arbitrary litmus test is an a priori reason to reject the claims. That is not thought police or social justice. That is a simple acknowledgement of what is now known about how abuse impacts its victims and their relationships with abusers.
I can base it on whatever I want, *including* "solely on the idea that there is a proper and predetermined reaction or set of actions that an accuser must follow after abusive events". Neither you nor anybody else has the authority to dictate to me what I'm allowed to say or think. If I'm wrong, then you should be able to provide a superior argument. Silencing people is a sign of weakness. And yes, that also applies to racists, misogynists, bigots, etc.
In her case, there's only one reason why she would hang around someone like AB after allegedly getting raped by him; she wanted money. Hell, there's only one reason *anybody* would spend time around that jackass, period. Likewise, the only reason anyone would spend time around that golddigger is because they want to bone her. A perfect match if you ask me.

[Mojouw]

Ok. So yeah. Just want to say stupid and shitty things out loud. Which of course you can. And go ahead. Just stop being so sensitive and turning it into the thought police when people push back against it.

Also other than politicians, Fox News hosts, Hollywood types, and athlete are actual people getting thought policed into unemployment?

Maybe I’m working in the wrong places but people say whatever the hell all time.

[GoSlash27]

Maybe the shortest sponsorship of all time?
Wait, my crystal ball just lit up.
AB: I ain't wearing your helmet if you don't pay me.
Belichick: Time to suit up for the game.
AB: I don't have a helmet.
Belichick: You're fired.

- - - Updated - - -


Maybe I’m working in the wrong places but people say whatever the hell all time.

Yeah. You're working in the wrong place. Your on-campus PC rules don't apply outside of Manhattan, Hollywood, and college campuses. If you want to "push back" do it with an argument. Assuming you have one...

[Mojouw]

Might want to read a little more carefully before you mash out a reply. I’m actually agreeing with you.

[NCSteeler]

Actually worked with a road rage murderer for about 6 months. He got fired for absenteeism once he was convicted and ran out of vacation time .

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

[GoSlash27]

Might want to read a little more carefully before you mash out a reply. I’m actually agreeing with you.

You might want to ponder what you believe, because you don't actually agree with me.

[DesertSteel]

You might want to ponder what you believe, because you don't actually agree with me.
Why would disagreeing with you make anyone want to change their beliefs?

[GoSlash27]

Actually worked with a road rage murderer for about 6 months. He got fired for absenteeism once he was convicted and ran out of vacation time .

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

I actually worked with a klan member for about 4 months. He got fired after sexually harassing our supervisor one too many times. Your story's better, tho' :D

- - - Updated - - -

Why would disagreeing with you make anyone want to change their beliefs?
Because he *thinks* he agrees with me, but he actually doesn't. If he did, he wouldn't have behaved the way he did in this thread.

[Mojouw]

You might want to ponder what you believe, because you don't actually agree with me.

I actually think that people should say whatever they want. They should also stop being such mewling wimps when they get called out for offending someone.

It isn’t the thought police if someone or multiple someones hound you online for saying something shitty. It isn’t a vast conspiracy. It’s just that you said/posted a shitty thing.

Stop being a wuss about it and painting yourself as some heroic warrior in a critical battle over the fate of the world. You just wanna say offensive crap online and not take shit for it.

[GoSlash27]

I actually think that people should say whatever they want. They should also stop being such mewling wimps when they get called out for offending someone.

It isn’t the thought police if someone or multiple someones hound you online for saying something shitty. It isn’t a vast conspiracy. It’s just that you said/posted a shitty thing.

Stop being a wuss about it and painting yourself as some heroic warrior in a critical battle over the fate of the world. You just wanna say offensive crap online and not take shit for it.

Umm... "multiple someones" is by definition a conspiracy, and "calling people out" is what "thought policing" is. You want to argue a point, we can do that. But your ad- hominems because you're butt-hurt hold no power here. IDGAF what you think of me; I outgrew that nonsense years ago. If you have a counter- argument, then let's hear it. Otherwise, save the passive-agressive insults, go somewhere quiet, and think of something persuasive.
That's how the free market of ideas works.

[steelreserve]

Also other than politicians, Fox News hosts, Hollywood types, and athlete are actual people getting thought policed into unemployment?

Isn't that actually even MORE important, though?

"If you have a public voice of any kind, you are only allowed to profess a narrow range of approved messages, otherwise your platform will be removed (likely along with your livelihood)." Attempting to enforce a homogeneous point of view in the public forum - and man, are some people eager to do that - sends an unmistakable message to everyone else.

And yeah, all kinds of people from police/fire, to teachers, to local news people, to scientists, to university professors and students, and especially small business owners, get thought-policed and harassed out of their jobs on a regular basis. Where have you been? The clear message: "The only way you are safe is if you are too insignificant to matter."



I actually think that people should say whatever they want. They should also stop being such mewling wimps when they get called out for offending someone.

It isn’t the thought police if someone or multiple someones hound you online for saying something shitty. It isn’t a vast conspiracy. It’s just that you said/posted a shitty thing.

Stop being a wuss about it and painting yourself as some heroic warrior in a critical battle over the fate of the world. You just wanna say offensive crap online and not take shit for it.

Tell you what. Why don't you try an experiment. Go post publicly, using your real name and identifiable information, something like, "I don't support illegal immigration, because the economic costs and the strain on public programs are just too high." See whether or not anyone calls you a racist, or calls your employer demanding you be fired, and exactly how long that takes. Do it, just as an experiment!

Is that worth taking the risk? No? Congratulations, you've just been thought-policed.

[GoSlash27]

And yeah, all kinds of people from police/fire, to teachers, to local news people, to scientists, to university professors and students, and especially small business owners, get thought-policed and harassed out of their jobs on a regular basis. Where have you been?
I'll tell you exactly where he has been: Working as a faculty member up in Madison, WI. Where not only is he not allowed to express non- PC opinions in any way that can be traced back to him, but where his habitual PC policing behavior is actually considered mainstream. He literally has no idea how far out of touch he is with the rest of us.

[AtlantaDan]

I'll tell you exactly where he has been: Working as a faculty member up in Madison, WI.

WTF?

[tom444]

Tell you what. Why don't you try an experiment. Go post publicly, using your real name and identifiable information, something like, "I don't support illegal immigration, because the economic costs and the strain on public programs are just too high." See whether or not anyone calls you a racist................

Or whether or not you get elected president of the United States.

[fansince'76]

Please keep it cool, folks and please start a thread in the Soapbox if you want to get political. Thanks!

[GoSlash27]

WTF?

What did you think "MojoUW" meant?

Turnabout being fair play, I work in Cedar Rapids, IA as an avionics technician for a major contractor. I am not barred from discussing where I work or what I do precisely... I just choose not to because IMO people don't need to know that. "Rule #1 of Fight Club" and so on.
Living and working in Cedar Rapids, it's as mainstream and battleground as anywhere in America.

[AtlantaDan]

What did you think "MojoUW" meant?

Turnabout being fair play, I work in Cedar Rapids, IA as an avionics technician for a major contractor. I am not barred from discussing where I work or what I do precisely... I just choose not to because IMO people don't need to know that. "Rule #1 of Fight Club" and so on.
Living and working in Cedar Rapids, it's as mainstream and battleground as anywhere else in America.

Did Mojouw disclose his alleged personal background to you with the understanding you could share it or post it on the board and you then decided to run with it?

IMO a red line is crossed by throwing someone’s personal information out there to make a tiresome political point in a football forum unless the poster does it but that is just me

Maybe the mods have a different view on whether that type of post is appropriate and is not worthy of some sort of sanction.

Not my call - like you I am just a guest of those who operate this site

[GoSlash27]

Did Mojouw disclose his alleged personal background to you with the understanding you could share it or post it on the board and you then decided to run with it?
Nope. It's all out here on the forum for general consumption.


IMO a red line is crossed by throwing someone’s personal information out there to make a tiresome political point in a football forum unless the poster does it but that is just me

Maybe the mods have a different view on whether that type of post is appropriate and is not worthy of some sort of sanction.

Not my call - like you I am just a guest of those who operate this site

I haven't actually posted any "personal info", and even if I did... No worries since Mojo insists that there's no such thing as the PC police. Besides, I posted the same info about myself.

[Mojouw]

Not a big deal. I don’t teach at Madison. I work for a living!

[AtlantaDan]

No. It's all out here on the forum.

I haven't actually posted any "personal info", and even if I did... No worries since Mojo insists that there's no such thing as the PC police. Besides, I posted the same info about myself.

Thanks for sharing :drink:

[steelreserve]

Please keep it cool, folks and please start a thread in the Soapbox if you want to get political. Thanks!

You're a thread in the Soapbox if you want to get political, so nyeah.


Did Mojouw disclose his alleged personal background to you with the understanding you could share it or post it on the board and you then decided to run with it?

IMO a red line is crossed by throwing someone’s personal information out there to make a tiresome political point in a football forum unless the poster does it but that is just me

Maybe the mods have a different view on whether that type of post is appropriate and is not worthy of some sort of sanction.

Not my call - like you I am just a guest of those who operate this site

I just always assumed that was who he was; it's no news to me. Not like I could go through a staff directory anyway and say "Hey! This is the guy who posts on the Steelers forum! And who occasionally professes political viewpoints that are not controversial at all, as far as his peers are concerned!"

But yeah, the less of that there is, the better. I like the people here, despite the fact we argue over football and other stuff. Once in a while they've even got something to say that makes me stop and think about whether I have the right idea, but not often.

[fansince'76]

You're a thread in the Soapbox if you want to get political, so nyeah.

:asskick:

:chuckle:

[AtlantaDan]

You're a thread in the Soapbox if you want to get political, so nyeah.



I just always assumed that was who he was; it's no news to me. Not like I could go through a staff directory anyway and say "Hey! This is the guy who posts on the Steelers forum! And who occasionally professes political viewpoints that are not controversial at all, as far as his peers are concerned!"

But yeah, the less of that there is, the better. I like the people here, despite the fact we argue over football and other stuff. Once in a while they've even got something to say that makes me stop and think about whether I have the right idea, but not often.

Thanks

Sorry for my pontificating on self-defined board posting norms

Nobody forces me to read posts or post in a thread. If I prefer to follow threads but not read certain posters the ignore list has a solution for that

:thumbsup:

[GoSlash27]

I just always assumed that was who he was; it's no news to me. Not like I could go through a staff directory anyway and say "Hey! This is the guy who posts on the Steelers forum! And who occasionally professes political viewpoints that are not controversial at all, as far as his peers are concerned!"

'Zackly. I'm not gonna 'call Mojo out' (by his definition). I actually like him. Threatening his livelihood because I disagree with him (which I nearly always do) would be a supreme dick move on my part and I don't roll that way. He is who he is and I am who I am. I'm not bashful about either of our backgrounds/ lives and I'm not afraid to discuss any topic, no matter how sensitive. I might be wrong... but probably not :flap:

My entire point is that we are both products of our experiences and environments. He is limited in what he can say and what he considers "normal" in his environment. My "normal", OTOH, is a better representation of mainstream America and I'm free to say whatever I like without fear of repercussions.

[steelreserve]

Or whether or not you get elected president of the United States.

Tell you what. You do it, and if you get elected president, I owe you a Coke.

[tom444]

Tell you what. You do it, and if you get elected president, I owe you a Coke.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yaf7zoL2uQs

[86WARD]

Antonio Brown’s stepfather now coming out and saying he’s ‘very abusive’ to women...

"I can't tell you that he did what they said he did,'' Moss told USA TODAY Sports. "But I know he's very abusive to women.

"As far as just raping somebody, [Brown] just feels like he can have whatever he wants. He's just empowered that way. So it doesn't surprise me that this kind of allegation came out about him.''

"A lot of things that Tony's doing, nothing surprises me,'' Moss said. "I'm surprised that it took them this long to figure him out. Because he's been this way since he's been 12 years old.''


https://sports.yahoo.com/antonio-browns-stepfather-claims-patriots-232945384.html

[86WARD]

So much for the CTE being the cause...

[teegre]

You're assuming she wants a trial, but we do not know all the facts. AB might have told his lawyers to tell her to go pound sand she's not getting a dime. If that was the case then she would have no other option but either drop the case or push for a trial.

Believe me if any of this happened I hope AB goes to jail and she takes every last dime of his but good luck proving it. I'm not a lawyer but the only thing she has going for her would be to push this in front of a jury and hope they read (if that's even possible) AB's texts/emails and feels it warrants some $$$. But for the millionth time NONE of us know all the facts.

Deducing

Because, you are correct: we do not know the truth. Only she does (not even AB does... because, inside of AB’s head, he might perceive his masterbating on her as his way of being altruistic.) We can only deduce based off of what we can see.

My point is that AB’s lawyer came out and said that the part of the pretrial where he receives the “settlement offer” never occurred, and he was a bit surprised. I deduced that it is not a “money grab” (which some have stated) because in this scenario, it’s going to trial*... which reminded me of the Fred Goldman (“I may not win the criminal trial, but I will expose the awful character of this person”) type of situation.


*there is always time to settle out of court, but the current trajectory suggests that that is not the case.

[ALLD]

1172613457465827328

Business is Booming!

[AtlantaDan]

My point is that AB’s lawyer came out and said that the part of the pretrial where he receives the “settlement offer” never occurred, and he was a bit surprised.

Not certain how that matches up with this ESPN story that the parties were in discussions for months and that the reason AB purportedly could not tell the Raiders or Patriots about the plaintiff’s allegations was to preserve the confidentiality of those discussions until a lawsuit was filed.

Representatives for New England Patriots (https://www.espn.com/nfl/team/_/name/ne/new-england-patriots)receiver Antonio Brown (https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/_/id/13934/antonio-brown) and Britney Taylor were in discussions over the past few months, but agreed their communication would remain confidential until the filing of Taylor's civil sexual assault lawsuit, sources told ESPN on Thursday....

Though the exact nature of the talks has not been confirmed, it is common practice for settlement talks to occur before a civil filing.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/27602699/pats-unaware-ab-involved-civil-matter

If plaintiff simply wanted to announce her claims and get a trial those discussions could have consisted of “we are filing suit who can accept service of process for AB?” Plaintiff’s attorney may have said I am not going to bargain until I know whether you indicate the minimum you will pay but any settlement discussions presumably would have required more than an apology.



*there is always time to settle out of court, but the current trajectory suggests that that is not the case.

AB’s attorney said he would vigorously contest the furniture toss civil action and filed a motion to dismiss that case. Then it settled.

Just guessing here but very few civil cases make it to trial once a motion to dismiss is filed and is not granted

[EzraTank]

Wow this thing grew some legs.

[tom444]

"Patriots rule Brandon Bolden out against Dolphins; Antonio Brown travels to Miami

Bolden being declared ‘out’ for tomorrow's game was not the only news to come out of Foxborough today: the Patriots also took wide receiver Antonio Brown (https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/108636/antonio-brown) with them to Miami. This does not yet guarantee that he will play against the Dolphins, but at this point anything else than him seeing at least some snaps would be a major surprise"

https://www.patspulpit.com/2019/9/14/20865957/new-england-patriots-rule-brandon-bolden-out-against-dolphins-antonio-brown-travels-to-miami

[EzraTank]

He's playing, bank on it.

[Mojouw]

For sure.

[j-d-s]

Funny how hundreds of people on twitter are saying to wait for the facts, innocent until proven guilty..yadayada....but still call Ben a rapist.
Even though I massively dislike AB, I still support that everyone is innocent until proven guilty. Especially in cases rape is alleged, because that is a very popular way to destroy a man's career. See Dominique Strauss-Kahn who possibly would've become President of France had he not been falsely accused of sexual assault.

[teegre]

Not certain how that matches up with this ESPN story that the parties were in discussions for months and that the reason AB purportedly could not tell the Raiders or Patriots about the plaintiff’s allegations was to preserve the confidentiality of those discussions until a lawsuit was filed.

Representatives for New England Patriots (https://www.espn.com/nfl/team/_/name/ne/new-england-patriots)receiver Antonio Brown (https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/_/id/13934/antonio-brown) and Britney Taylor were in discussions over the past few months, but agreed their communication would remain confidential until the filing of Taylor's civil sexual assault lawsuit, sources told ESPN on Thursday....

Though the exact nature of the talks has not been confirmed, it is common practice for settlement talks to occur before a civil filing.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/27602699/pats-unaware-ab-involved-civil-matter

If plaintiff simply wanted to announce her claims and get a trial those discussions could have consisted of “we are filing suit who can accept service of process for AB?” Plaintiff’s attorney may have said I am not going to bargain until I know whether you indicate the minimum you will pay but any settlement discussions presumably would have required more than an apology.




AB’s attorney said he would vigorously contest the furniture toss civil action and filed a motion to dismiss that case. Then it settled.

Just guessing here but very few civil cases make it to trial once a motion to dismiss is filed and is not granted

Extremely interesting... and 180 from the thing that I had read*.



*It wasnt some blogger or sports rag. I read it on one of the biggies (SI, ESPN, Nickelodeon).

[steelreserve]

Even though I massively dislike AB, I still support that everyone is innocent until proven guilty. Especially in cases rape is alleged, because that is a very popular way to destroy a man's career. See Dominique Strauss-Kahn who possibly would've become President of France had he not been falsely accused of sexual assault.

This case presents a moral paradox. While I am adamantly opposed to undermining the presumption of innocence because angry vindictive liberal feminists said so, it is also a bedrock principle to support anything bad that happens to the Patriots because they are scum, and to Tony Brown because he's a fuckin jerk.

Angry feminists versus Tony Brown. That's like having a choice between supporting dogshit and catshit.

Logically, the only acceptable outcome is for Tony Brown to get in a knife fight with angry feminists and everybody dies at the end.

[86WARD]

Antonio Brown Officially Active (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001054413/article/antonio-brown-officially-active-for-patriotsdolphins)

[stillers4me]

1173603615430324224

[86WARD]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190916/40f17e274548d8309e2507135f374a89.jpg

[stillers4me]

OK Rog....that's 2. Precedent.........

[fansince'76]

OK Rog....that's 2. Precedent.........

Yep. 6 games (reducible to 4 provided he jumps through the necessary hoops). The honor of "The Shield" is at stake here, after all.

Yeah, right. :coffee:

[fansince'76]

Uh, oh - looks like someone might be acting out already...

Antonio Brown leaves before speaking to media after Patriots blow out Dolphins (https://sports.yahoo.com/antonio-brown-avoids-media-after-first-game-with-patriots-215021677.html)


Given the investigation, Brown may not have wanted to face the media following his first game. By avoiding reporters, however, Brown broke the NFL media access policy.

More like he wasn't the focal point of their offense, nor is he going to be and decided to slink off and sulk about it. That's a big part of his problem. That's what he does.

[86WARD]

I could see Belichick telling him to do that though...

[stillers4me]

Antonio Brown farted in my face and still owes me $11,000: doctor
Antonio Brown’s former doctor says the football star repeatedly farted in his face and laughed about it during a consultation where he showed up three hours late — and claims the receiver still owes him $11,000 in unpaid fees, according to a new report.
Dr. Victor Prisk said he was wary of signing the then-Pittsburgh Steeler because he had a reputation for being “flighty” and not paying his bills, but agreed to take him on as a client anyway, Sports Illustrated said Monday (https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/09/16/antonio-brown-new-england-patriots-lawsuits-accusations-sexual-midconduct-assault).


One of Brown’s acolytes took video of the noxious meeting in August 2018, obtained by TMZ (https://www.tmz.com/videos/0-rz2wd5pn/), in which the footballer can be heard farting and laughing about it as Prisk tests his body fat.............

read more @ https://nypost.com/2019/09/16/antonio-brown-allegedly-farted-in-his-doctors-face/?utm_source=twitter_sitebuttons&utm_medium=site%20buttons&utm_campaign=site%20buttons

[86WARD]

Lol. It’s not like that doctor is all that professional himself...

That story btw totally looks like an “Onion” story.

[steelreserve]

So the doctor got paid with farts. The art of the deal right there.

[fansince'76]

Lol. It’s not like that doctor is all that professional himself...

Agreed - seems pretty close to a HIPAA violation there...

[AtlantaDan]

I must admit AB has shown a real talent for assembling a creative variety of debts

Antonio Brown Accused of Owing $2,000 for an Aquarium Filled With Dead Piranhas

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/09/16/antonio-brown-owes-money-aquarium-piranhas

[stillers4me]

1173369233914380288

[AtlantaDan]

Patriots wide receiver Antonio Brown is no longer a Nike athlete amid allegations of sexual assault, according to (https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/patriots/2019/09/19/antonio-brown-longer-nike-athlete/gKy2xXUFdLRYiZp3iZKtWK/story.html?s_campaign=bostonglobe%3Asocialflow%3At witter) The Boston Globe's Michael Silverman.

A spokesperson for Nike told the Globe on Wednesday night that "Antonio Brown is not a Nike athlete." When asked to elaborate on the reasoning or clarify the timing, the spokesperson declined.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/09/19/antonio-brown-patriots-no-longer-nike-athlete

I assumed endorsements for companies such as Pizza Hut and Pepsi were toast, but deals with the sports equipment companies are the last to go (Nike stuck with Tiger Woods when everyone else dumped him in 2010).

AB is officially toxic for peddling products.

[86WARD]

Damn...almost made it 3 days with no Antonio Brown news.

[tom444]

AB fielded a few questions today at Gillette. Humble pie. "I'm grateful to be here. My thanks to Tom Brady and Bill Belichick. I have a lot of offense to learn. It's just about football here.........blah....blah........ I only want to help out........blah......blah.........is there any humble pie left? ............blah.....blah .............."

[j-d-s]

This is getting out of hand. AB probably is a certified nutjob but because he now is with the Cheats will get away with 4 games suspension.

On any other team it would've been at least for the rest of the season (like Josh Gordon, Ray Rice, Richie Incognito, Adrian Peterson) but if you're with the Cheats you get away with everything, probably that's the reason why AB wanted to go to New England so badly...

[stillers4me]

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[stillers4me]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/09/20/report-antonio-brown-harasses-latest-accuser-via-text-message/

[86WARD]

I mean how this guy hasn’t been put on any kind of “leave” is crazy...

[AtlantaDan]

Lisa Banks, the attorney for the latest accuser who wrote the NFL to stop this crap, is a high profile discrimination/whistleblower attorney in Washington

If Rosenhaus has lined up someone other than Heitner to represent AB it is time for those attorneys to take over, assuming anyone can control AB at this point

[tom444]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/09/20/report-antonio-brown-harasses-latest-accuser-via-text-message/


What a moron. Apparently he can't destroy his life fast enough.

[st33lersguy]

I guess Roger Dodger wants to see AB catch passes from Tommy Boy, that's all I have right now

[AtlantaDan]

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[Squeegee Thompson]

Now the NFL is investigating a threatening text that Brown sent to his accuser:

1174895770752839681

I used to really like Brown - but man, this dude has become seriously messed up. Maybe Burfict can clean his clock again and knock some sense back into him. He's gonna be another Latrell Sprewell in 5 years.

Edit: Oops sorry, someone else already posted this.

[86WARD]

I loved watching him play...he was soooooooooo good...probably still is good but he’s ruined/ruining his career, character, everything with epic speed.

[tom444]

AB is at practice.

[ALLD]

Nike just dropped AB too.

Business is booming!

[AtlantaDan]

Looks like Hoodie is finding out what it is like when the AB traveling circus comes to your team

Bill Belichick told the assembled media he wasn't going to answer any questions regarding Antonio Brown when his press conference began Friday morning.

A short round of questions later, all touching on the Brown situation, the New England Patriots coach walked away from the podium.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/patriots/2019/09/20/bill-belichick-leaves-presser-antonio-brown-questions-sexual-assault/2385355001/

[NCSteeler]

Looks like Hoodie is finding out what it is like when the AB traveling circus comes to your team

Bill Belichick told the assembled media he wasn't going to answer any questions regarding Antonio Brown when his press conference began Friday morning.

A short round of questions later, all touching on the Brown situation, the New England Patriots coach walked away from the podium.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/patriots/2019/09/20/bill-belichick-leaves-presser-antonio-brown-questions-sexual-assault/2385355001/They deserve it.

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

[JnK]

I guess Roger Dodger wants to see AB catch passes from Tommy Boy, that's all I have right now

Rumor has it that Kraft has pics of Roger dressed in drag working at some sleezy massage parlor in Florida.

[86WARD]

Rumor has it that Kraft has pics of Roger dressed in drag working at some sleezy massage parlor in Florida.

And vice versus.

[86WARD]

Ian Rappaport reporting that the Patriots have released Antonio Brown. Waiting for a Schefter confirmation...lol

[86WARD]

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