Team turmoil GONE

[Hound]

Hopefully this is the end of the nonsense and the me type personality that created the shit show in Pittsburgh. Do your job Mike

[st33lersguy]

You forget the ring master mike Tomlin is still here. Also getting rid of ab doesn't fix the awful coaching and poor management

[Hound]

Or the shitty fans that complain nonstop

[vasteeler]

Or the shitty fans that complain nonstop

Ha ha ha...post of the day...ha ha ha

[Shoes]

Or the shitty fans that complain nonstop


Shitty, spoiled fans? I agree there are, but there is also a great number who don't like to deal with reality, dig in and face the problems head-on.

[FrancoLambert]

It’s all Tomlin now. How does he manage a recovery from this mess.
Enabling didn’t work, it just made small problems grow into big problems.
We lost arguably the best RB and WR in the league for practically nothing.
He and Colbert better hit this draft.

[AtlantaDan]

For those keeping score, Blount, Harrison and AB have forced their way off the roster with few if any adverse consequences.

It is possible this is the end of turmoil. OTOH younger players on the roster who want more guaranteed $$ and want it sooner rather than later presumably have been paying attention.

Steelers now face both potential future turmoil from other players who may act out to get out and turmoil from their business model of not guaranteeing multiple years of contracts having been rejected by two stars. As Mojouw has posted, good luck sticking to that position when JuJu and Watt come up for their paydays after their rookie contracts

[Edman]

That's the optimistic outlook, but optimism should've give way to the real underlying issues with the Steelers: A broken foundation. If the foundation isn't there. The next building will fall as hard as the last one.

Antonio Brown and Le'Veon Bell are the results of a shitty locker room culture and piss poor coaching. Mike Tomlin is a great emotional leader but a wholly subpar head coach. Compounded with the fact that Ben Roethlisberger is still there, who has the absolute blessing of Colbert to throw players under the bus in the media, the Steelers have merely cut off the tumors. The source of the cancer and the poor foundation is still there.

Another tumor will just grow out of the remnants. It may be Juju or T.J Watt who may be next.

[vasteeler]

That's the optimistic outlook, but optimism should've give way to the real underlying issues with the Steelers: A broken foundation. If the foundation isn't there. The next building will fall as hard as the last one.

Antonio Brown and Le'Veon Bell are the results of a shitty locker room culture and piss poor coaching. Mike Tomlin is a great emotional leader but a wholly subpar head coach. Compounded with the fact that Ben Roethlisberger is still there, who has the absolute blessing of Colbert to throw players under the bus in the media, the Steelers have merely cut off the tumors. The source of the cancer and the poor foundation is still there.

Another tumor will just grow out of the remnants. It may be Juju or T.J Watt who may be next.

Or its it that AB and LB are the cause of the shitty locker room culture.

[Edman]

Or its it that AB and LB are the cause of the shitty locker room culture.

LeGarrette Blount and James Harrison were cut and the problems persisted.

Sooner or later, Tomlin supporters are going to run out of scapegoats to blame for his failure.

[DesertSteel]

Or the shitty fans that complain nonstop
Sounds like you were complaining/ being negative with your original post. I guess it’s easy to excuse it with ourselves.

[Hound]

No complaints here, and I don’t need any excuses. If feelings were hurt, sorry you feel that way. But the organization isn’t going to stop being good because they traded a 31 year old receiver. Just hoping team turmoil is gone

[86WARD]

meh...the precedent has been set. Players followed suit with the same results. It's just a matter of time before there is another.

[DesertSteel]

No complaints here, and I don’t need any excuses. If feelings were hurt, sorry you feel that way. But the organization isn’t going to stop being good because they traded a 31 year old receiver. Just hoping team turmoil is gone
I'm just saying it's the pot calling the kettle black:


Hopefully this is the end of the nonsense and the me type personality that created the shit show in Pittsburgh. Do your job Mike

[Hound]

The difference being that my original post was directed at the player that did everything possible to leave, not the whole organization from the owner to the janitor. Don’t be so upset bud, the Steelers are going to be fine

[Iron Steeler]

Am I the only one that is excited about this. No more headache players

[Hound]

I’m with you bro! I would have liked more compensation, but I understand that it probably wasn’t going to happen. AB and Drew painted the Steelers into a corner. The contract extension AB wanted caused every other team to bail. Some wanted to hold onto him to make a point, I say get rid of the headache

[DesertSteel]

No complaints here, and I don’t need any excuses. If feelings were hurt, sorry you feel that way. But the organization isn’t going to stop being good because they traded a 31 year old receiver. Just hoping team turmoil is gone
You also took a shot at Tomlin. So what?! Just don't act like it's only other fans who complain and never you. It's hard to be a real fan and not gripe. I guess the exception would be for the cheerleader type who likes the team colors and thinks the QB is cute...

[Hound]

I do like our team colors(especially the color rush) I like the ladies, but if you think Bens cute, that’s your business. Like I said bud, calm down the Steelers are going to be fine.

[munchy]

Am I the only one that is excited about this. No more headache players

there will be more. next man up

[DesertSteel]

I do like our team colors(especially the color rush) I like the ladies, but if you think Bens cute, that’s your business. Like I said bud, calm down the Steelers are going to be fine.
Calm down... lol

[Steeldude]

With Tomlin still here it will continue.

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

With Tomlin still here it will continue. It goes higher up then Tomlin.

[pczach]

For those keeping score, Blount, Harrison and AB have forced their way off the roster with few if any adverse consequences.

It is possible this is the end of turmoil. OTOH younger players on the roster who want more guaranteed $$ and want it sooner rather than later presumably have been paying attention.

Steelers now face both potential future turmoil from other players who may act out to get out and turmoil from their business model of not guaranteeing multiple years of contracts having been rejected by two stars. As Mojouw has posted, good luck sticking to that position when JuJu and Watt come up for their paydays after their rookie contracts



I believe the team needs to change the way they do things financially to adapt to the times. I also believe they need to do so, and reward players that deserve the guaranteed money with their actions and dedication to the team.

The best way to accomplish what everyone wants is to reward solid team-first guys that want to do it the right way with more guaranteed money. Get rid of guys that try to bully the team into a big contract, and don't reward disruptive behavior.

The organization needs to make this correction going forward. If they do, everything else falls in line and the right players will reveal themselves as long-term pieces while the garbage players are thrown out or used like chess pieces in trades before things escalate to ridiculous levels and their full value can be taken advantage of.

[AtlantaDan]

Or its it that AB and LB are the cause of the shitty locker room culture.

If Brown being on the roster was that harmful, one wonders why Pittsburgh didn’t trade him to the Patriots or Chiefs to try to sink those franchises. :coffee:

https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/11/18259834/antonio-brown-trade-raiders-steelers

[Neversatisfied]

Team turmoil gone along with team talent. Let's not forget that 2 of the 3 Killer B's that brought a great Offensive dynamic are now gone. Simply put the Steelers are reliant on Offense to carry the load because the defense isn't reliable . I'm worried that with AB gone teams will double JuJu and were not really sure how that will work for him. The Steelers might draft a WR early to compensate for the loss of AB.

[Mojouw]

I believe the team needs to change the way they do things financially to adapt to the times. I also believe they need to do so, and reward players that deserve the guaranteed money with their actions and dedication to the team.

The best way to accomplish what everyone wants is to reward solid team-first guys that want to do it the right way with more guaranteed money. Get rid of guys that try to bully the team into a big contract, and don't reward disruptive behavior.

The organization needs to make this correction going forward. If they do, everything else falls in line and the right players will reveal themselves as long-term pieces while the garbage players are thrown out or used like chess pieces in trades before things escalate to ridiculous levels and their full value can be taken advantage of.

This got raised somewhere or other before. But does anyone know the Steelers cash flow reality? The NFL has this weird rule that if you put guaranteed cash in a contract, you have to place all of it in like an escrow account right away. We know that basically two teams follow the low $$$ guaranteed model - Green Bay and Pittsburgh -- both teams without "hyper-rich" ownership. Is their a capitalization issue here?

[Bluecoat96]

This got raised somewhere or other before. But does anyone know the Steelers cash flow reality? The NFL has this weird rule that if you put guaranteed cash in a contract, you have to place all of it in like an escrow account right away. We know that basically two teams follow the low $$$ guaranteed model - Green Bay and Pittsburgh -- both teams without "hyper-rich" ownership. Is their a capitalization issue here?

I know I mentioned it somewhere, but I can't begin to tell you what thread I put it in. That's what I have wondered. We know the Rooney's don't hold a candle to a Jerry Jones in terms of net worth. Hopefully someone here knows where to look up something like that.

Sent from my XT1710-02 using Tapatalk

[AtlantaDan]

This got raised somewhere or other before. But does anyone know the Steelers cash flow reality? The NFL has this weird rule that if you put guaranteed cash in a contract, you have to place all of it in like an escrow account right away. We know that basically two teams follow the low $$$ guaranteed model - Green Bay and Pittsburgh -- both teams without "hyper-rich" ownership. Is their a capitalization issue here?

The Steelers do not have the revenue or operating income of the Cowboys or Patriots, but were middle of the pack with $85 million in operating income for 2017 and do not have a highly leveraged debt/value ratio.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/193556/operating-income-of-national-football-league-teams-in-2010/
https://www.forbes.com/nfl-valuations/list/#tab:overall

They do not do multi-year guarantees because they prefer not to, not due to any apparent financial constraints compared to other teams that do.

Unlike back in the day before TV revenue rolled in and everyone blackmailed their local government for a sweet stadium deal, nobody needs to finance their NFL team out of personal assets. Salary cap prevents that sort of arms race.

[Mojouw]

The Steelers do not have the revenue or operating income of the Cowboys or Patriots, but were middle of the pack with $85 million in operating income for 2017 and do not have a highly leveraged debt/value ratio.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/193556/operating-income-of-national-football-league-teams-in-2010/
https://www.forbes.com/nfl-valuations/list/#tab:overall

They do not do multi-year guarantees because they prefer not to, not due to any apparent financial constraints compared to other teams that do.

Unlike back in the day before TV revenue rolled in and everyone blackmailed their local government for a sweet stadium deal, nobody needs to finance their NFL team out of personal assets. Salary cap prevents that sort of arms race.

Good information. Then they need to seriously reconsider how they do contracts. Or they need to just never sign a top 5 at their position player to a post-rookie deal. Those are the harsh choices as I see them. Unless the next CBA changes things, these top tier guys are going to be constantly dissatisfied with their contracts - as they become outdated the moment the ink is dry on the page. And the way the Steelers choose to structure their contracts only pours fuel on the fire.

In the past handful of years, the Steelers have had 3 players on the roster that are/were top 5 at their positions: Bell, Brown, and Roethlisberger. 2/3 went coco for cocoa puffs over their contracts. And the only one who didn't had shots taken at him by the ones that were jealous of his contract situation.

[Fire Goodell]

I'm looking forward to the leaders on this team being more about the team and less drama. Heyward, Watt, Juju, Conner.

Tomlin has to learn something from this, that you can't let a great player have special treatment otherwise this happens. I look at this as his opportunity to start clean as far as controlling the locker room.

[The Bark]

In a way, I think there's very little that can be do with the management of narcissistic players. AB signed his contract what, a scant two years ago? Now it's suddenly not good enough and probably for a multitude of reasons including, but not limited to, someone else signing a bigger paycheck and someone else winning the team MVP who also happened to be a receiver. Unfortunately, with narcissistic personality types, the only thing they are beholden to is $$ and status. There's no doubt LB has some of these tendencies as well. As Tomlin would probably say, it is what it is. The organization needs to do a bit more soul-searching in terms of drafting quality players with character, who understand it's a team sport where everyone has a role to play. They also need to stop rewarding performance stats while sweeping behavioral issues under the carpet. I remember, and long for, the days of 15 to 20+ years ago where the Steelers would freely let coveted players leave without throwing more money at them. That's what Oakland does; pay veterans more than they're worth expecting the same performance or better despite the player usually having already peaked. I'm not happy seeing AB go, nor LB; I consider it unfortunate that they played the games they did to put themselves above everyone else. But at the end of the day, I'd be very surprised if when it's all said and done, their best years aren't behind them already - and for that, why bother holding on to fool's gold only to be proven a fool in the end? 6

[Shoes]

Good information. Then they need to seriously reconsider how they do contracts. Or they need to just never sign a top 5 at their position player to a post-rookie deal. Those are the harsh choices as I see them. Unless the next CBA changes things, these top tier guys are going to be constantly dissatisfied with their contracts - as they become outdated the moment the ink is dry on the page. And the way the Steelers choose to structure their contracts only pours fuel on the fire.

In the past handful of years, the Steelers have had 3 players on the roster that are/were top 5 at their positions: Bell, Brown, and Roethlisberger. 2/3 went coco for cocoa puffs over their contracts. And the only one who didn't had shots taken at him by the ones that were jealous of his contract situation.


Here is some dipshit advise

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/03/11/randy-moss-elite-players-can-get-paid-by-learning-from-antonio-brown/

[Mojouw]

Here is some dipshit advise

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/03/11/randy-moss-elite-players-can-get-paid-by-learning-from-antonio-brown/

Well, the thing is, Moss is 100% correct. If you are as ludicrously talented and productive as Antonio Brown, then this is exactly how you get paid what you want. Now, you can handle it smoother.

The NBA is exactly this for its superstars. It ranges from the Jimmy Butler rage fueled scorched earth way out to a max contract or the Anthony Davis more polite model. Either way, both guys will get a max deal in 2020.

Since the NFL gives the teams more control over player movement, Moss is correct that causing the crapfest AB did is the way out of town and to a new contract. ONLY if you are perceived as talented enough to be worth it.

[Shoes]

Well, the thing is, Moss is 100% correct. If you are as ludicrously talented and productive as Antonio Brown, then this is exactly how you get paid what you want. Now, you can handle it smoother.

The NBA is exactly this for its superstars. It ranges from the Jimmy Butler rage fueled scorched earth way out to a max contract or the Anthony Davis more polite model. Either way, both guys will get a max deal in 2020.

Since the NFL gives the teams more control over player movement, Moss is correct that causing the crapfest AB did is the way out of town and to a new contract. ONLY if you are perceived as talented enough to be worth it..

Im just old, stay true to your word and commitments in good times and bad. Moss and the AB's of the world can have it. My football meter is about pegged anyway. I'm not supporting assholes of any kind

[Fire Goodell]

I'm not even worried, top flight WR's are shiny pieces that have little to do with chances at a championship.

The year after we lost Santonio Holmes, we went to the Super Bowl. The year after we lost Wallace, we went 8-8, but also were 8-8 the season before WITH him.

The people saying that Juju won't have success because AB is gone, were probably saying that about AB when Wallace left.

We're winning the division next year, bank on it.

[Mojouw]

.

Im just old, stay true to your word and commitments in good times and bad. Moss and the AB's of the world can have it. My football meter is about pegged anyway. I'm now supporting assholes of any kind

It is a far less than positive or high character manner to handle your business and actions. But I do believe it is only going to become more prevalent.

The NFL is the only major sports league in the world (I think...certainly in the US) that does not guarantee contracts. Right or wrong, it creates the perception for the players that they are in a completely adversarial relationship with the owners (hence AB's "owner" comment) and that they are completely disposable commodities that are being compensated the least amount possible. Since most of them come into the NFL right out of sleazy and filthy NCAA programs featuring all kinds of underhanded dealings, I strongly believe that these guys are all cynical and jaded to an almost unbelievable degree. Top it all off with a dollop of class and racial justice issues related to a league that employs young minorities in perceived exploitative contracts with old white billionaires (doesn't have to be actually true, just has to be felt to be true...again this sucks...but it is where we are at as a culture) whose major consumer is other older white guys (hence the reason Goodell's "protect the shield" issues are so inconsistent and ridiculous) and I wholeheartedly believe that this is just the tip of the iceberg.

AB style attitudes and demands are going to become more and more. Players holding out Bell style (especially if his next contract is anything besides terrible) and setting owners and the league up as the bad guy are just going to become more and more common.

Honestly, as ridiculous as some NBA players are about their contracts and where they play -- that league has done a good job of creating the perception that management is not actively attempting to screw over labor. Seemingly as a result most NBA contract issues are (2-3 a year that are exceptions) are handled fairly smoothly and relatively quietly. Both MLB and the NFL have instituted CBAs that create the impression (not well versed enough to evaluate it fairly) that management can and does actively attempt to "stick it to" players as often as possible. As a result, players are loud, grumpy, and angry.

I know this is going to read as "MojoUW is banging the drum about the evil owners again". But that isn't really my point. The point is that if you run a business that is perceived as viewing its employees as disposable and actively attempting to drive down wages -- you are going to have disgruntled employees. Make those employees narcissistic jerks who are also staggeringly dumb -- and the outcome is sad and highly predictable.

[FrancoLambert]

I'm looking forward to the leaders on this team being more about the team and less drama. Heyward, Watt, Juju, Conner.

Tomlin has to learn something from this, that you can't let a great player have special treatment otherwise this happens. I look at this as his opportunity to start clean as far as controlling the locker room.

This.
Two first class divas gone. One second class diva remains because franchise QB’s don’t grow on trees.
How we rebound from this mess, as you said accurately, is up to Tomlin.
I’m looking forward to a reset where it’s team first.

[Michael]

Makes sense