Paul Zeise: Too many Steelers are legends in their own minds

[hawaiiansteeler]

Paul Zeise: Too many Steelers are legends in their own minds

PAUL ZEISE
Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
DEC 31, 2018

The Browns-Ravens game was watched closely by people in these parts as the Steelers’ playoff fortunes were tied to the result. What people hopefully saw was that the AFC North is going to get much tougher in the coming years because those two teams are both led by dynamic rookie quarterbacks who are only likely to get better.

The Steelers, meanwhile, have missed the playoffs for the third time in seven seasons and are trending in the wrong direction. They have now gone six out of their last eight seasons either missing the playoffs or failing to win a playoff game. That should be enough to scare Art Rooney II and company into making some changes. The Steelers don’t necessarily need a complete housecleaning, but they definitely need to clean house.

to read rest of article:

https://www.post-gazette.com/sports/paul-zeise/2018/12/31/ben-roethlisberger-steelers-playoffs-afc-antonio-brown-injury/stories/201812310098

[Hawkman]

Toooo many people writing about the Steelers.

- - - Updated - - -

Move on to the Penguins.

[Edman]

Let’s not forget that the old gunslinger, with his buddy “Coach Randy” calling plays, also led the league in interceptions with 16. That’s a statistic many of his apologists don’t want to talk about. They don’t want to talk about the number of times he killed drives because he wanted to “take shots down the field,” as opposed to making winning football plays. They all regurgitate the Roethlisberger company line about how he was shackled by Todd Haley. Guess what? That was probably the best thing for the Steelers.

Ben was turnover prone even when Todd Haley was here. People just pointed the finger at Todd because he was a convenient scapegoat, that and Haley wasn't the most likeable guy around and had his own issues (Playcalling).

Three different OC's. Three different offenses. Same old underachieving crap on Offense.

[fansince'76]

Yeah, being in the top 6 in scoring offense in the league was such a bitch. :rolleyes:

And if Zeise is going to bring up the team's performance in the decade before Roethlisberger's arrival, could he at least be intellectually honest about the fact that the defense in those days was FAR better than what it has been for years now?

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

The part in the article about the "old gunslinger...wanting to take shots downfiled as opposed to making winning football plays" is interesting, as I said earlier this season that Ben is kind of like Brett Favre was at the end of his career. He is going to pull a Favre and take risks with a throw that will get picked off and change the course of the game.

Unfortunately, this Steelers team no longer has the kind of defense that can withstand those kinds of turnovers and they end up as opposition points. I think having a coach as OC instead of the QB's caddy is likely the better option, but at this point in the career of Ben...it is what it is.

[zulater]

Winning and losing in the NFL can be a razor thin line. In 17 they were not as good as our 13-3 record imo. This year they're better than their 9-6-1 record. This team is a handful of plays from being 11-5 or better. Some of their own doing, some of the refs doing. I can never remember a season before where we had so many games negatively affected by poor officiating. No conspiracy theories. Just on the wrong end of luck and incompetence. Anyway a made fg here. A correct call there and viola they're 11-5 sitting with a first round bye.

Sure there was some self inflicted b.s. But outside of the first Ravens game and the Chiefs game I never came away with the feeling they were the inferior team on the field that day.

Now the AB crap puts next season in question. But I think there's enough people that know what they're doing to get through the storm and I think our window is still wide open going into the 19 season.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Winning and losing in the NFL can be a razor thin line. In 17 they were not as good as our 13-3 record imo. This year they're better than their 9-6-1 record.

if they were then they should have beaten the 4-12 Raiders...

[Mojouw]

Winning and losing in the NFL can be a razor thin line. In 17 they were not as good as our 13-3 record imo. This year they're better than their 9-6-1 record. This team is a handful of plays from being 11-5 or better. Some of their own doing, some of the refs doing. I can never remember a season before where we had so many games negatively affected by poor officiating. No conspiracy theories. Just on the wrong end of luck and incompetence. Anyway a made fg here. A correct call there and viola they're 11-5 sitting with a first round bye.

Sure there was some self inflicted b.s. But outside of the first Ravens game and the Chiefs game I never came away with the feeling they were the inferior team on the field that day.

Now the AB crap puts next season in question. But I think there's enough people that know what they're doing to get through the storm and I think our window is still wide open going into the 19 season.

Sums it up nicely.

[EzraTank]

Winning and losing in the NFL can be a razor thin line. In 17 they were not as good as our 13-3 record imo. This year they're better than their 9-6-1 record. This team is a handful of plays from being 11-5 or better. Some of their own doing, some of the refs doing. I can never remember a season before where we had so many games negatively affected by poor officiating. No conspiracy theories. Just on the wrong end of luck and incompetence. Anyway a made fg here. A correct call there and viola they're 11-5 sitting with a first round bye.

Sure there was some self inflicted b.s. But outside of the first Ravens game and the Chiefs game I never came away with the feeling they were the inferior team on the field that day.

Now the AB crap puts next season in question. But I think there's enough people that know what they're doing to get through the storm and I think our window is still wide open going into the 19 season.

Others disagree but receivers can be replaced just like Bell was this year. I think the only position you need a stud in is QB. All great teams are built around that position. Yes we can't replace AB but we sure can get close (plus he'll be 31 at the start of next season so the top of the hill is going to hit very soon). It's nice to have Juju to fall back on though and I think Washington is going to be much better in year #2. And don't forget that Samuels was more of a receiver than RB in college.

We'll be fine, I just hope we can move AB for someone (Ramsey or Kittle)? If we can build a decent defense and get 1-3 more years out of Ben we can still have a window (be it a tight one but still there).

[86WARD]

Why would the 49ers give up Kittle? Lol. You’re more likely to see AB and Bell in a Steelers Uniform than Kittle.

[Shoes]

Why would the 49ers give up Kittle? Lol. You’re more likely to see AB and Bell in a Steelers Uniform than Kittle.


I guess from post 48 & 49, but Teegre was joking. :chuckle:

http://www.steelersuniverse.com/forums/showthread.php/29801-Report-Antonio-Brown-has-requested-a-trade?p=675405#post675405

[Mojouw]

Trading AB at this point is like owning a classic muscle car that wins every car show you take it to. The value just goes up and up. Then you decide to drag race it. Everyone who ever wanted the car tunes in. The engine explodes and pistons are thrown 40 feet into the air. Then you advertise it for sale on Craigslist the next day for $1.2 million saying "only serious buyers -- I know what I have."

C'mon. AB isn't worth 25 cents on the dollar right now. At this point, until something changes, the options are to cut him and eat the cap $$$ or to rehabilitate the relationship and hope he and his teammates can have a come to Jesus moment and move forward together. Either that or trade him to the Patriots for a 3rd rounder.

[cubanstogie]

Trading AB at this point is like owning a classic muscle car that wins every car show you take it to. The value just goes up and up. Then you decide to drag race it. Everyone who ever wanted the car tunes in. The engine explodes and pistons are thrown 40 feet into the air. Then you advertise it for sale on Craigslist the next day for $1.2 million saying "only serious buyers -- I know what I have."

C'mon. AB isn't worth 25 cents on the dollar right now. At this point, until something changes, the options are to cut him and eat the cap $$$ or to rehabilitate the relationship and hope he and his teammates can have a come to Jesus moment and move forward together. Either that or trade him to the Patriots for a 3rd rounder.
there are suckers out there. Raiders gave a 3rd for a receiver who couldn't carry AB's jock, unless it had an ounce of weed in it. This crap will die down and come March teams will be ready to deal.

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

AB value is still high and at least 1st rd pick worthy and probably more.

[Mojouw]

there are suckers out there. Raiders gave a 3rd for a receiver who couldn't carry AB's jock, unless it had an ounce of weed in it. This crap will die down and come March teams will be ready to deal.


AB value is still high and at least 1st rd pick worthy and probably more.

While I am not certain I agree, that doesn't mean either of you is wrong. But if AB is still going to fetch a 1st rounder+ on the trade market, why trade him? I assume the answer is "locker room cancer who quit on his team". If so, why would any team give up multiple extremely valuable assets for that headache?

This happens all the time when fans want to trade a player. The argument seems to go in circles, at least to me.

Trade the guy. He isn't worth the hassle/salary/performance issues/attitude whatever. But make sure you get a ton of stuff back for him!

Wouldn't that mean the player was an extremely valuable member of an NFL roster? If so, why get rid of them?

[cubanstogie]

While I am not certain I agree, that doesn't mean either of you is wrong. But if AB is still going to fetch a 1st rounder+ on the trade market, why trade him? I assume the answer is "locker room cancer who quit on his team". If so, why would any team give up multiple extremely valuable assets for that headache?

This happens all the time when fans want to trade a player. The argument seems to go in circles, at least to me.

Trade the guy. He isn't worth the hassle/salary/performance issues/attitude whatever. But make sure you get a ton of stuff back for him!

Wouldn't that mean the player was an extremely valuable member of an NFL roster? If so, why get rid of them?
I don't want him to leave. Even a first rounder isn't going to replace him. They would draft D and we'd have a hole at WR. But if he wants out and is going to pull Leveon Bell crap then you might as well get a first rounder or Ramsey for him if possible. Best scenario IMO is he apologizes to teammates and organization and tries to mend fences if need be. Atleast we would see some accountability and maturity. A trade could be beneficial for both teams involved, its not always one team getting ripped off, like in the case of Martavis.

[teegre]

I don't want him to leave. Even a first rounder isn't going to replace him. They would draft D and we'd have a hole at WR. But if he wants out and is going to pull Leveon Bell crap then you might as well get a first rounder or Ramsey for him if possible. Best scenario IMO is he apologizes to teammates and organization and tries to mend fences if need be. Atleast we would see some accountability and maturity. A trade could be beneficial for both teams involved, its not always one team getting ripped off, like in the case of Martavis.

100%

AB is the best WR since Rice. We will not replace him. Period.

But, the best thing for the TEAM (and for AB) might be a fresh start for both parties.

[Craic]

100%

AB is the best WR since Rice. We will not replace him. Period.

But, the best thing for the TEAM (and for AB) might be a fresh start for both parties.

This.

And this. I'd be real sad to see him leave. However, this just might be the right time to go ahead and clean house. Get the last one or two locker-room distractions out of town and then start rebuilding with character guys.

[cubanstogie]

100%

AB is the best WR since Rice. We will not replace him. Period.

But, the best thing for the TEAM (and for AB) might be a fresh start for both parties.
maybe in the offseason Tomlin could get another consultant to come in, instead of helping D he could fix the soap opera going on. I was thinking Belichick. In all seriousness I would like to see how he would handle this crap.

[Steel Warrior]

One of the first rules of being a supervisor, which I was back then, is if you get rid of the "squeaky wheel", another will just fill the void, better to fix the squeaky wheel.

[teegre]

maybe in the offseason Tomlin could get another consultant to come in, instead of helping D he could fix the soap opera going on. I was thinking Belichick. In all seriousness I would like to see how he would handle this crap.

I heard Heyward (or Foster?) saying that “Coach T” did a great job holding it together this season... and that no other coach could have dealt with this chaos as well as Tomlin did.

That said, Belichick would have benched AB and then traded him long ago. Of course, Kraft would have nixed the deal, because Tommy wanted AB on the team. In turn, Belichick would have Gronk line up at FS on a Hail Mary. Meanwhile, Aaron Henandez’s ghost wanders the halls looking for blue cotton candy Bubblicious. Good times.