Darius Leonard LB

[Blue Marvel]

Definitely Plays a Position Of Need, I thought Colbert was gonna snatch him up Rd 1 since Vander Esch was off the board, instead he goes Edmunds....Leonard currently has more Combined Tackles than both Bostic and Williams..Combined

[DesertSteel]

Every team in the NFL passed on him. It happens.

[st33lersguy]

I wanted him in the 2nd and wouldn't have minded "reaching" for him in the 1st

[BlackAndGold]

Hindsight 20/20.

Edmunds has gotten better every game. Leonard has been great but lets wait this out before we mark this as a mistake.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Every team in the NFL passed on him. It happens.

You mean not every team uses hindsight in their draft evaluations? :sarcasm:

[DesertSteel]

You mean not every team uses hindsight in their draft evaluations? :sarcasm:
I’m currently working on my mock draft for 2018.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

I’m currently working on my mock draft for 2018. :thumbsup:

...and I'm searching 3 year old threads to point out somebody was wrong in their draft opinion so that I can "AngryChair" that poster for not being right.

I think we are onto something here. Summation: our use of hindsight is actually forward thinking.

[Mojouw]

Hmmm....let's see. Let's just look at tackles. Cool. But Leonard is leading in tackles on a team that lets up 15 more rush yards per game on 3 more attempts per game for 1 more first down per game. So you know, worse in every metric.

And Indy is giving up only 4 less passing yards per game.

So while Leonard is a pretty darn good player and I would gladly have him on the team -- let's not anoint him as the missing piece in a shutdown defense. Only 7 of his 88 total tackles have been behind the line of scrimmage. For comparison, Bostic has 5, VW has 2, and Dupree has 4, Watt has 9, and Edmunds has 0. All with under 50% of the total tackles that Leonard has.

Bottom line, Leonard seems to be an great addition to the Colts that is outperforming his draft status, but, to me, the #'s say that he isn't a big-time playmaker. Not to say that Bostic or Edmunds is either...

[Dwinsgames]

Hmmm....let's see. Let's just look at tackles. Cool. But Leonard is leading in tackles on a team that lets up 15 more rush yards per game on 3 more attempts per game for 1 more first down per game. So you know, worse in every metric.

And Indy is giving up only 4 less passing yards per game.

So while Leonard is a pretty darn good player and I would gladly have him on the team -- let's not anoint him as the missing piece in a shutdown defense. Only 7 of his 88 total tackles have been behind the line of scrimmage. For comparison, Bostic has 5, VW has 2, and Dupree has 4, Watt has 9, and Edmunds has 0. All with under 50% of the total tackles that Leonard has.

Bottom line, Leonard seems to be an great addition to the Colts that is outperforming his draft status, but, to me, the #'s say that he isn't a big-time playmaker. Not to say that Bostic or Edmunds is either...


stats like this were used often times when talking about Larry Foote as well

my general response was .... Good I am glad he is making these plays even if 5 yards beyond the LOS because ...

1) nobody else was making it before him

2) guy may run a long ways between 5 yards and the Foote tackle the next available tackler

honestly I do not think to much about where the play is made because its not material ...

the reason it is not material is we have zero clue as to what his assignment is on each and every play within their scheme ...

what we do know is he is making plays that 10 other guys on his team are not making before him....

31 Mar 2018 I posted this
980239493272866816

[teegre]

:thumbsup:

...and I'm searching 3 year old threads to point out somebody was wrong in their draft opinion so that I can "AngryChair" that poster for not being right.

I think we are onto something here. Summation: our use of hindsight is actually forward thinking.

You win. :applaudit:

Oh man... seriously... :lol:

[Mojouw]

stats like this were used often times when talking about Larry Foote as well

my general response was .... Good I am glad he is making these plays even if 5 yards beyond the LOS because ...

1) nobody else was making it before him

2) guy may run a long ways between 5 yards and the Foote tackle the next available tackler

honestly I do not think to much about where the play is made because its not material ...

the reason it is not material is we have zero clue as to what his assignment is on each and every play within their scheme ...

what we do know is he is making plays that 10 other guys on his team are not making before him....

31 Mar 2018 I posted this
980239493272866816

I'm not sure I am following the reasoning. It would appear that same chain of logic would conclude that Matekavich is good to really good ILB.

I haven't seen Leonard play. And I most likely won't because I have no interest in watching the Colts. I agree that Leonard is a good player and will almost certainly outperform his draft stock and players picked ahead of him. But the opening posts of this thread made it sound like somehow Leonard was this guy the Steelers should be weeping about not taking in the first round. Sure, he has a ton of tackles. Most likely because the rest of that roster is not good. The defense is not good. Leonard does not seem to be making impact plays. Bostic just had 97 tackles for that defense last year. The math works out to 4 more tackles per game for Leonard.

So the question is what is the impact of Leonard versus Edmunds? I mean, would Leonard even play in nickel and dime packages? Does Leonard make plays or have the potential to make plays that change field possession or result in takeaways? Does Edmunds?

I don't have the answers to all these questions, but I think tackle stats are not the path to figuring many of them out.

[Dwinsgames]

I'm not sure I am following the reasoning. It would appear that same chain of logic would conclude that Matekavich is good to really good ILB.

I haven't seen Leonard play. And I most likely won't because I have no interest in watching the Colts. I agree that Leonard is a good player and will almost certainly outperform his draft stock and players picked ahead of him. But the opening posts of this thread made it sound like somehow Leonard was this guy the Steelers should be weeping about not taking in the first round. Sure, he has a ton of tackles. Most likely because the rest of that roster is not good. The defense is not good. Leonard does not seem to be making impact plays. Bostic just had 97 tackles for that defense last year. The math works out to 4 more tackles per game for Leonard.

So the question is what is the impact of Leonard versus Edmunds? I mean, would Leonard even play in nickel and dime packages? Does Leonard make plays or have the potential to make plays that change field possession or result in takeaways? Does Edmunds?

I don't have the answers to all these questions, but I think tackle stats are not the path to figuring many of them out.

basically just saying that without watching a ton of colts film or games all it is is numbers ... good that he is putting them up ( because someone has to make the play )

I think he could become a special player , just not sure we ever see it as a Colt , unless they get him help ( not gonna hold my breath )

Here , I think he would have had a very good chance to be special , he is the closest thing to #50 out there ( and he is just a rookie ) a run and hit linebacker is what our def is missing and he looks to be a good one

[teegre]

As we discussed back in September (when I posted a similar thread)...

As good as Leonard has played, not a single person was advocating for him to get drafted in R1. Many/Lots were on board with him being our pick in R2.

Now, a few thought that he’d drafted 40-50. But, again, no one thought that he should have gone in R1... except for Angrychair.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

You win. :applaudit:

Oh man... seriously... :lol::hatsoff:

- - - Updated - - -


As we discussed back in September (when I posted a similar thread)...

As good as Leonard has played, not a single person was advocating for him to get drafted in R1. Many/Lots were on board with him being our pick in R2.

Now, a few thought that he’d drafted 40-50. But, again, no one thought that he should have gone in R1... except for Angrychair.

Agreed, most thought he was a top 2nd to middle 2nd round pick. That being said, I still think LVE wasn't worth a 1st round grade and I liked Leonard better, so it was either trade back in the 1st or trade up in the 2nd to get the MEAC ILB.

[Blue Marvel]

I look at it like this ...for a low in the first that Colbert Picks, it may as well be a second rounder so he wouldn't have been a reach, and we needed LB help

[teegre]

I look at it like this ...for a low in the first that Colbert Picks, it may as well be a second rounder so he wouldn't have been a reach, and we needed LB help

Okay. Again, I was on here, on Twitter, and on other various media locations... and no one was saying “We should have taken Leonard.”

[teegre]

Agreed, most thought he was a top 2nd to middle 2nd round pick. That being said, I still think LVE wasn't worth a 1st round grade and I liked Leonard better, so it was either trade back in the 1st or trade up in the 2nd to get the MEAC ILB.

From the Cowboys fans that I know, they are very pleased with LVE. I don’t think he’d have been worth the cost to trade up to 19 (it was already too costly to get up to 22), but if he had been there at 28... :lust:

[Hawkman]

And this is in Steelers thread.........why?

[st33lersguy]

Another guy that I wanted, Jesse Bates, I have heard he's been doing well for the Bengals as well. He slipped to the 3rd round, but has been passing his stock