Steelers at Lamar Jackson’s pro day

[teegre]

Tomlin, Colbert, & Fitchner all were at Lamar Jackson’s pro day.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nfl/news/lamar-jackson-pro-day-results-analysis-steelers-2018-nfl-draft/1lrgc5g6uxeud1qdxwd6jur04m

As I’ve mentioned: Lamar will need three years to develop... and Ben has three years left.

[Dwinsgames]

perhaps highest ceiling of all the QB prospects very electrifying player , that said also needs the most work to complete the deal ... its a big gamble and we would need to change as an offensive team to better utilize his skillet .... I wouldn't Hate the pick but I wouldn't love it either ... to much unknown to much risk for a team that rarely dips its toe in the FA market ... I think whomever drafts Jackson should have a contingency plan ...

if we draft a QB high he better be able to garner a hat on Sundays and Push Jones off the roster ... not sure Jackson is ready /capable to do that at this point in time

but he sure has some skills to drool over but so did Kordell he just never finished developing

[Dwinsgames]

perhaps the most comprehensive player breakdown as you will find ...

a lot to like about Jackson but as said before a lot to work on as well

http://nfldraftbible.com/lamar-jackson-final-exam-featuring-coach-steve-fairchild/

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

I listened to ESPN account of his pro day on xm radio. Impressive athlete, strong arm, they know he is fast. Andre Ware watched him warmup and said he has seen enough. Ware said "I wish I had an arm like that when I played" and "he is the best talent in the draft".

That being said, they also mentioned that he doesn't have an agent and everything runs thru his mother, so a lot of teams are having a difficult time talking to him because of that disconnect. Andre Ware being a former Heisman winner and Jackson a Heisman winner was part of the way ESPN got time to talk to him. That just seems weird to me and the fact that he scored 13 on the Wonderlic shows he isn't a generally bright kid. Now Brett Favre scored poorly on that too and he wasn't that bright either,......... but 3 years to develop, stand off-ish with teams before the draft, not that smart is not a combination that says I want to invest millions in.

[AtlantaDan]

I listened to ESPN account of his pro day on xm radio. Impressive athlete, strong arm, they know he is fast. Andre Ware watched him warmup and said he has seen enough. Ware said "I wish I had an arm like that when I played" and "he is the best talent in the draft".

That being said, they also mentioned that he doesn't have an agent and everything runs thru his mother, so a lot of teams are having a difficult time talking to him because of that disconnect. Andre Ware being a former Heisman winner and Jackson a Heisman winner was part of the way ESPN got time to talk to him. That just seems weird to me and the fact that he scored 13 on the Wonderlic shows he isn't a generally bright kid. Now Brett Favre scored poorly on that too and he wasn't that bright either,......... but 3 years to develop, stand off-ish with teams before the draft, not that smart is not a combination that says I want to invest millions in.

SI.com article on the train wreck that is Jackson's support staff

The biggest takeaway is that the NFL doesn't seem to understand what he's doing in the pre-draft process. He has a contract lawyer but still has no agent. His mom is operating as his manager but teams are having a difficult time getting her or anyone in his camp to return calls. I don't want it to sound like I'm campaigning for agents because I'm not. But this is a process too important for a guy of his caliber to go through without the guidance of someone who's done this before, and it seems like that's lacking here for Jackson.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2018/03/30/lamar-jackson-pro-day-draft-stock-prediction-themmqb-newsletter

This is fixable - hire Le'Veon Bell

[DesertSteel]

That just seems weird to me and the fact that he scored 13 on the Wonderlic shows he isn't a generally bright kid. Now Brett Favre scored poorly on that too and he wasn't that bright either,......... but 3 years to develop, stand off-ish with teams before the draft, not that smart is not a combination that says I want to invest millions in.
The 13 bothers me. I have some background with the wonderlic and have also taken it several times. In the financial industry we wouldn't even consider someone to work the phones as a collector without a minimum score of 18.

- - - Updated - - -

Seems like Jackson skipped the wrong test. He should've run the 40 and skipped the wonderlic.

[Dwinsgames]

Seems like Jackson skipped the wrong test. He should've run the 40 and skipped the wonderlic.


a truth burn there for sure

[st33lersguy]

Seems like Kordell 2.0. I say pass

[Fire Goodell]

Dan Marino scored a 16 on his and was probably one of the best QB's to play the game. I wouldn't put too much stock on wonderlic scores.

[teegre]

Dwins, thank you for the link. And, as I have averred: Lamar has some skills that you simply cannot teach, and a plethora of skills that he needs to learn. If the Steelers can improve those areas that need correction, they might be able to create the QB that Michael Vick was “supposed” to be.

Lamar’s mom as his agent: WTF!?!

Wonderlic... :jerkit: Josh Dobbs only scored a 29, and Dobbs is arguably the smartest player in the NFL. Lamar’s low score doesn’t mean he’s dumb; heck, he scored about the same as Terry Bradshaw. Oh... right. :lol:

[Dwinsgames]

other players have acted as their own agents over the years with Mixed results ...

Most recently Richard Sherman

Most Notably perhaps Dante Culpepper

the difference in those two results are monumental and they both already had League experience and have been through and seen the process first hand

as for Jacksons mom this is what I would call uncharted waters and if I were a team I would be concerned she may try and be a female version of Lavar Ball ( perhaps that is unfair ) but team should and probably will worry about just that

[Mojouw]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEtt1dvk_pE

Liked this guys breakdown of the QBs last draft. Here is what I kinda take away from it all:

Lamar Jackson is reaching the point that he is being criminally under-rated. He really mostly runs when the play is called for him to run - not his fault that L'ville is mostly some crappy dudes who will never play on Sunday and then an amazing talent like Lamar Jackson.

His accuracy issues are no worse than Allen's. But Allen is the top rated QB by some. In fact, when Jackson has a clean pocket (often hard to do with the quality of L'ville's line!) he is really accurate. Allen tends to miss screen passes.

Jackson has sloppy footwork. Okay. So does Darnold - the consensus #1 overall.

Jackson scored low on the Wonderlic and doesn't have an agent. Alright, maybe he is an idiot. Maybe not. But can he process information quickly enough on the football field? I don't need him to do my taxes or build a spaceship (got Dobbs for that!), I just need him to understand the playbook and identifying the proper WR in under 3 seconds.

Jackson isn't "pro ready" because he played in a gimmicky offense. And Baker Mayfield didn't?

Someone needs to explain to me how Lamar Jackson is significantly different than Watson on the field. Watson plummeted in last year's draft and then exploded in the NFL.

Obviously, the Steelers would need to adjust their offense to help ease Jackson's transition to the NFL. But I mean if he sat for a year or two...?

Additionally, some people are even putting Mason Rudolph ahead of Jackson. Go watch Mason Rudolph when he gets pressure. Tell me you don't see a guy who will fold under a pass rush or a muddled pocket like Palmer or Flacco. Now watch Jackson deal with pressure.

Bottom line, Lamar Jackson after a year to work on his footwork with no pressure to "save a franchise" and then unleash him on the NFL? Whoa, boy. Am I saying that the Steelers should take him? Nope. But I think he will be a better pro than most are projecting.

[Born2Steel]

Part of this is finding out who is the best player for THIS team. Not necessarily the next Marino. Any QB/player that isn't willing to be used how the team thinks he can best help, shouldn't be on the team. Jackson may end up the next Randall Cunningham but if he's not about doing whatever it takes to get that next ring, I really don't want him. That was the biggest disappointment to me about Kordell. I'm better knowing the talent level was over-rated than the player just didn't want to. I don't know this about Lamar Jackson or where his head is on this, but he seems to be making the statement he's going to do things his way or not at all. Great talent, low Wonderlic, questionable business sense. I'm not saying no to the guy, but I am backing away slowly at this point.

[teegre]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEtt1dvk_pE

Liked this guys breakdown of the QBs last draft. Here is what I kinda take away from it all:

Lamar Jackson is reaching the point that he is being criminally under-rated. He really mostly runs when the play is called for him to run - not his fault that L'ville is mostly some crappy dudes who will never play on Sunday and then an amazing talent like Lamar Jackson.

His accuracy issues are no worse than Allen's. But Allen is the top rated QB by some. In fact, when Jackson has a clean pocket (often hard to do with the quality of L'ville's line!) he is really accurate. Allen tends to miss screen passes.

Jackson has sloppy footwork. Okay. So does Darnold - the consensus #1 overall.

Jackson scored low on the Wonderlic and doesn't have an agent. Alright, maybe he is an idiot. Maybe not. But can he process information quickly enough on the football field? I don't need him to do my taxes or build a spaceship (got Dobbs for that!), I just need him to understand the playbook and identifying the proper WR in under 3 seconds.

Jackson isn't "pro ready" because he played in a gimmicky offense. And Baker Mayfield didn't?

Someone needs to explain to me how Lamar Jackson is significantly different than Watson on the field. Watson plummeted in last year's draft and then exploded in the NFL.

Obviously, the Steelers would need to adjust their offense to help ease Jackson's transition to the NFL. But I mean if he sat for a year or two...?

Additionally, some people are even putting Mason Rudolph ahead of Jackson. Go watch Mason Rudolph when he gets pressure. Tell me you don't see a guy who will fold under a pass rush or a muddled pocket like Palmer or Flacco. Now watch Jackson deal with pressure.

Bottom line, Lamar Jackson after a year to work on his footwork with no pressure to "save a franchise" and then unleash him on the NFL? Whoa, boy. Am I saying that the Steelers should take him? Nope. But I think he will be a better pro than most are projecting.

COMPLETION PERCENTAGE:
Lamar sits at 59%.
But... his supporting staff had a 12% drop rate. :scared: Let’s assume that we upgrade his receivers to “halfway decent”... that alone would raise his 59% completetion percdntage into the mid-60’s.

And, as you said, when he had time, Lamar was very accurate.

FOOTWORK:
This can be improved... with two years of coaching. Under duress, he might revert back to being an “arm” thrower, but like Favre & Mahomes, Lamar has the type of arm that allows him to do this.

WONDERLIC:
Using an SAT analogy... 40 times are to cornerbacks as Wondelic scores are to quarterbacks. (They don’t mean much when it comes to players actually playing football.)

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

The 13 bothers me. I have some background with the wonderlic and have also taken it several times. In the financial industry we wouldn't even consider someone to work the phones as a collector without a minimum score of 18.

- - - Updated - - -

Seems like Jackson skipped the wrong test. He should've run the 40 and skipped the wonderlic.

I hear ya, but as said here there are a few examples of guys with poor Wonderlic test that turned out to be good QB's. Those of us that have taken a wonderlic know that its a test of general intelligence with the pressure of a time component to it (so very few finish it), so I understand your concerns as somebody that knows what its about. But a guy can be generally stupid, but know a lot about football. But the question becomes if you want your franchise QB to lack intelligence and possibly make poor judgements?

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Lamar’s mom as his agent: WTF!?!

Wonderlic... :jerkit: Josh Dobbs only scored a 29, and Dobbs is arguably the smartest player in the NFL. Lamar’s low score doesn’t mean he’s dumb; heck, he scored about the same as Terry Bradshaw. Oh... right. :lol:

Yup, a guy that is a potential top 15 NFL pick should have somebody guiding him that has done it before. A day 2 or later guy...maybe Momma Felicia could work as his agent. Jackson will miss opportunity to meet with some teams because he is being so stand-offish.

Maybe Dobbs didn't handle the time pressures of the Wonderlic well? Maybe he handled the math well, but not some of the deductive reasoning or other types of questions. The first 5 questions of the Wonderlic are a gimme, the next 5 still not that bad (each 5 gets progressively more difficult), so getting a 10 is a gimme IMO. To me most guys that score poorly on a Wonderlic show they haven't gone to class consistently since the 11th grade.

[teegre]

Yup, a guy that is a potential top 15 NFL pick should have somebody guiding him that has done it before. A day 2 or later guy...maybe Momma Felicia could work as his agent. Jackson will miss opportunity to meet with some teams because he is being so stand-offish.

Maybe Dobbs didn't handle the time pressures of the Wonderlic well? Maybe he handled the math well, but not some of the deductive reasoning or other types of questions. The first 5 questions of the Wonderlic are a gimme, the next 5 still not that bad (each 5 gets progressively more difficult), so getting a 10 is a gimme IMO. To me most guys that score poorly on a Wonderlic show they haven't gone to class consistently since the 11th grade.

MAMA:
That’s what Wingo & Golic were saying. Lamar has already missed out on at least one interview, because his mother didn’t handle the situation correctly.

WONDERLIC:
Yep. Maybe time factor affected Dobbs. Or, he’s not good at pattern recognition. Or... this shows how bad NASA has become. :lol:

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

WONDERLIC:
Yep. Maybe time factor affected Dobbs. Or, he’s not good at pattern recognition. Or... this shows how bad NASA has become. :lol:

The average score for an Engineer according to this site is 29, http://wonderlictestsample.com/wonderlic-test-scoring/ so Dobbs is within range. Below are some other professions and the average scores as per the site.

Chemist.......31
Engineer......29
Programmer..29
Accountant...28
Teacher.......28
Investment Advisor.....27
Salesman.....25
Electrician.....23
Nurse..........23
Machinist......21
Security Guard..18
Welder........17
Janitor......14

Something tells me the average score for NFL QB is higher than a 13.

[Dwinsgames]

The average score for an Engineer according to this site is 29, http://wonderlictestsample.com/wonderlic-test-scoring/ so Dobbs is within range. Below are some other professions and the average scores as per the site.

Chemist.......31
Engineer......29
Programmer..29
Accountant...28
Teacher.......28
Investment Advisor.....27
Salesman.....25
Electrician.....23
Nurse..........23
Machinist......21
Security Guard..18
Welder........17
Janitor......14

Something tells me the average score for NFL QB is higher than a 13.

you are 100% correct the average would be higher than 13 ....

that said Bradshaw was 16 ... Marino was 15 ...

so pretty good company with " lower than average scores "

its not the be all end all .....

nobody can tell me Joe Theisman or Joe Nameth where very bright either but they did ok ...

If I was looking for a reason to NOT draft Jackson his wonderlic score would be pretty far down my list ...

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

If I was looking for a reason to NOT draft Jackson his wonderlic score would be pretty far down my list ...

I agree, but as I posted in this thread earlier:

-stand offish with teams (His mom declining contact/meetings)
-may take a few years to develop his technique (some saying 3)
-intelligence scores of the wonderlic very low

are not traits that make me comfortable investing millions of dollars in a player.

I like his talents and like how he improved his base and footwork from a soph to junior, but the latest antics and reports remind me of what was once said of Alonzo Spellman..."skills of a world beater, but mind of an egg beater".

[Dwinsgames]

I agree, but as I posted in this thread earlier:

-stand offish with teams (His mom declining contact/meetings)
-may take a few years to develop his technique (some saying 3)
-intelligence scores of the wonderlic very low

are not traits that make me comfortable investing millions of dollars in a player.

I like his talents and like how he improved his base and footwork from a soph to junior, but the latest antics and reports remind me of what was once said of Alonzo Spellman..."skills of a world beater, but mind of an egg beater".

fair enough I suppose ...

and likely why he has slid on many draft boards to 2nd round ( that is not saying teams feel that way because they will never tell you )

[teegre]

I agree, but as I posted in this thread earlier:

-stand offish with teams (His mom declining contact/meetings)
-may take a few years to develop his technique (some saying 3)
-intelligence scores of the wonderlic very low

are not traits that make me comfortable investing millions of dollars in a player.

I like his talents and like how he improved his base and footwork from a soph to junior, but the latest antics and reports remind me of what was once said of Alonzo Spellman..."skills of a world beater, but mind of an egg beater".

This reminds me of Dan Marino.

-questions cause him to fall
-insanely talented
-low Wonderlic

Could we be getting at “top ten” guy at 28???

And, the fact that Lamar has improved every year tells me that he can (& will) continue to improve. Since we have Ben for another 2-3 seasons, that “time element” is not really a concern for me.

[Born2Steel]

He is the risk/reward of this draft. What if, he is the next Steve Young? Or the next Russell Wilson? We know his athletic ability. The scary part is his ability to QB an NFL team.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

fair enough I suppose ...

and likely why he has slid on many draft boards to 2nd round ( that is not saying teams feel that way because they will never tell you )

I heard a draft analyst on XM radio say he could land anywhere from #15 to Cardinals, to the end of round 1, but definitely a round 1 talent. I was on the bandwagon a couple months ago, but the actions of his draft process raise more concerns that I would like to see. I think that he has the potential to be as much of a distraction as Robert Griffin was.

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

Honestly I don't see what more Lamar brings to the table that we don't already have in Dobbs. Both are very athletic and a project. I think it would be a wasted pick if we drafted him.

[teegre]

I heard a draft analyst on XM radio say he could land anywhere from #15 to Cardinals, to the end of round 1, but definitely a round 1 talent. I was on the bandwagon a couple months ago, but the actions of his draft process raise more concerns that I would like to see. I think that he has the potential to be as much of a distraction as Robert Griffin was.

I’d bet a month’s salary that Lamar gets drafted in R1... because of the fifth-year option.

That option allows teams to get sn extra “cheap” year from a player, and since QBs are the highest paid players, that fifth-year option is huge. Plus, Lamar will need that extra year to develop (before a team has to decide whether he’s their future).

[hawaiiansteeler]

no thanks...

https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/7w5I-b98raW4yzy4dEe7bHAE7us=/0x0:565x300/920x0/filters:focal(0x0:565x300):no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/9950721/lamar_pickson.0.gif

[Mojouw]

no thanks...

https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/7w5I-b98raW4yzy4dEe7bHAE7us=/0x0:565x300/920x0/filters:focal(0x0:565x300):no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/9950721/lamar_pickson.0.gif

I mean if we want to just take one thing -- Here is Josh Allen missing a stationary practice target in drills at the Senior Bowl -- https://ftw.usatoday.com/2018/01/josh-allen-wyoming-senior-bowl-throw-video-miss-workout-accuracy-browns-nfl-draft

There are many others of Allen overthrowing screen passes, putting it in the dirt at the feet of targets in the flat etc.

THe overall body of work seems to indicate that Jackson has as much raw talent and tools to work with as Mayfield, Rudolph, and Allen. Perhaps more. But he is getting lumped into a second or third tier of guys by many analysts.

Although recent Twitter buzz seems to indicate that this is more of a media creation than what actual NFL teams think.

[Dwinsgames]

no thanks...

https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/7w5I-b98raW4yzy4dEe7bHAE7us=/0x0:565x300/920x0/filters:focal(0x0:565x300):no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/9950721/lamar_pickson.0.gif

in fairness 20 seconds in .... it happens


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02p-8Q8lXho

[hawaiiansteeler]

Lamar Jackson often makes really bad inaccurate throws, watch the TaxSlayer Bowl where he threw 4 ints against Miss St. I just don't see him succeeding against NFL defensive backs.

we gambled a 4th round pick on Josh Dobbs, I wouldn't want to see us use a 1st round selection on Lamar Jackson when we have so many other needs.

[Dwinsgames]

Lamar Jackson often makes really bad inaccurate throws, watch the TaxSlayer Bowl where he threw 4 ints against Miss St. I just don't see him succeeding against NFL defensive backs.

we gambled a 4th round pick on Josh Dobbs, I wouldn't want to see us use a 1st round selection on Lamar Jackson when we have so many other needs.

completely agree on the bigger needs ... ILB /OLB/S/RB all higher on my personal wish list than QB in first 3 rounds

[Mojouw]

Lamar Jackson often makes really bad inaccurate throws, watch the TaxSlayer Bowl where he threw 4 ints against Miss St. I just don't see him succeeding against NFL defensive backs.

we gambled a 4th round pick on Josh Dobbs, I wouldn't want to see us use a 1st round selection on Lamar Jackson when we have so many other needs.

I don't think that the debate is really about whether or not the Steelers should or need to select Jackson in the upcoming draft. I think it is more a debate about how teams have evaluated and ranked the QB prospects versus how they will actually perform in the NFL.

While I agree with you that I feel that 2018 is not the year for the Steelers to get their next starting QB, I do want them to evaluate the QB class in a serious way and then track their evaluations and projections against what actually happened. Was the player drafted where the Steelers thought he would be? Did he perform in the NFL anywhere near what their projection system had him doing? If the answer is "Yes" to both of those questions than the team can be relatively confident that they have built an evaluation and projection model for QBs that will allow them to identify and select their next "franchise" QB. If the answer to either or both of those questions is "No". Then the team has to rebuild and revise their modelling.

For me, that is what Lamar Jackson is so interesting a case. It really isn't going to be the guys who everyone agrees on (Darnold and Rosen) that test your evaluation system, it is going to be the polarizing prospects.

[teegre]

Lamar Jackson is the most polarizing player in this draft.

This is the FIRST discussion that I’ve seen/read where it didn’t turn verrrrry ugly. That’s a credit to all of us, because we can actually “discuss” edgy topics, because we use logic, facts, and data (as opposed to reverting to blind, obstinate opinion).

[Born2Steel]

Lamar Jackson is the most polarizing player in this draft.

This is the FIRST discussion that I’ve seen/read where it didn’t turn verrrrry ugly. That’s a credit to all of us, because we can actually “discuss” edgy topics, because we use logic, facts, and data (as opposed to reverting to blind, obstinate opinion).

That's your opinion. :chuckle:

[teegre]

That's your opinion. :chuckle:


:applaudit:

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

Upside he is the next Michael Vick! Downside he is the next Michael Vick and I would pass on him. Again we already have a qb on the roster just like him and potential to be better. I still don't have a problem drafting a qb early but hope they get one we don't already have on the roster.

[86WARD]

This would be the worst scenario as a first round pick for the Steelers. These type of players have a couple good seasons but ultimately aren’t an NFL caliber winning QB.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

At least Colbert and Tomlin got LaMar's mom to let him goto dinner with them. The extra time should allow them to get a further read on his attitude, intelligence, character and whether he would be a fit for the team. We can speculate on completion % and wonderlic all we want, but meetings like that and some chalk talk are really important part of the process to figure out if a kid is worth drafting.

[DesertSteel]

Upside he is the next Michael Vick! Downside he is the next Michael Vick and I would pass on him. Again we already have a qb on the roster just like him and potential to be better. I still don't have a problem drafting a qb early but hope they get one we don't already have on the roster.
Not me... I want the next Ben.

[EzraTank]

A smart player should avoid a big name agent when entering the league since the prices are pretty much set. I would do the same, and just hire a lawyer to do the paperwork. But when I was getting close to my second contract I would definitely hire an proven agent especially if I was lighting the league up.

That said, being from Philly and watching Eric Lindros's father basically ruin his career in Philly ... having a parent or friend act as your agent is flat out a bad idea.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

A smart player should avoid a big name agent when entering the league since the prices are pretty much set. I would do the same, and just hire a lawyer to do the paperwork. But when I was getting close to my second contract I would definitely hire an proven agent especially if I was lighting the league up.

That said, being from Philly and watching Eric Lindros's father basically ruin his career in Philly ... having a parent or friend act as your agent is flat out a bad idea.


"I've had several teams tell me they're having trouble just getting to set up appointments to meet with him," Mayock said Thursday during Path to the Draft
's coverage of the UL pro day. "Not just work out, but appointments to meet with him, to put him up on the board, to work him out, to have dinner with him. And remember, and again I'm not taking a shot here at anybody, his mom is representing him, his mom has obviously his best interest at heart, but
you're doing the kid a disservice if NFL coaches and general managers are calling and you can't even get an appointment set up
."

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000923787/article/teams-having-trouble-setting-up-meetings-with-lamar-jackson

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

This would be the worst scenario as a first round pick for the Steelers. These type of players have a couple good seasons but ultimately aren’t an NFL caliber winning QB. Exactly and Vince Young and Kap come to mind. No way Steelers waste a 1 pick on him.

[Mojouw]

More on Jackson's agent issue:

https://www.theringer.com/2018/4/3/17191122/lamar-jackson-agent-nfl-draft

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

More on Jackson's agent issue:

https://www.theringer.com/2018/4/3/17191122/lamar-jackson-agent-nfl-draft

There is a good article on SI.com that mentions how some teams are able to make contact, while others are not. It also touches on how Jackson's mom has always steered him away from non QB activities like kick returns or even safety vs hail mary passes in HS. The plan has always been to present him as a QB.

I don't think its some elaborate plan to save on agent fees, but more of that they want to try and control the process and steer the process towards teams they want. If that is the case, it smells a bit like how Robert Griffin III father was a bit too influential of his son during his time in Washington. Hopefully Tomlin and Colbert had enough time with him to get some insight as to if the family dynamics are something that is fine or a red flag.

I personally think Jackson has a great arm, elite athleticism and his footwork and base have improved, but he still needs a lot of work on his mechanics so that he is more consistent as a passer. He might be the next Randall Cunningham, but I think when Cunningham became a passer first instead of a QB that liked to run, he was most impactful in the NFL. If they do their diligence and draft him at the end of the 1st round, I will trust that there is a good plan in place for him. For all we know, the pro day and meetings revealed something they don't like, or something the love. Will find out in a few weeks.

[Mojouw]

There is a good article on SI.com that mentions how some teams are able to make contact, while others are not. It also touches on how Jackson's mom has always steered him away from non QB activities like kick returns or even safety vs hail mary passes in HS. The plan has always been to present him as a QB.

I don't think its some elaborate plan to save on agent fees, but more of that they want to try and control the process and steer the process towards teams they want. If that is the case, it smells a bit like how Robert Griffin III father was a bit too influential of his son during his time in Washington. Hopefully Tomlin and Colbert had enough time with him to get some insight as to if the family dynamics are something that is fine or a red flag.

I personally think Jackson has a great arm, elite athleticism and his footwork and base have improved, but he still needs a lot of work on his mechanics so that he is more consistent as a passer. He might be the next Randall Cunningham, but I think when Cunningham became a passer first instead of a QB that liked to run, he was most impactful in the NFL. If they do their diligence and draft him at the end of the 1st round, I will trust that there is a good plan in place for him. For all we know, the pro day and meetings revealed something they don't like, or something the love. Will find out in a few weeks.

Doesn't have to be such an extreme negative case like RG III. The Manning and Elway family exerted enormous influence on where both Eli and John went in the draft and how they were perceived. This may be no different than that. Both those guys turned out fine.

[ALLD]

The guy could be a backup for a few years, but he is no NFL starter and never will be. I wouldn't even give him a clipboard.

[43Hitman]

The guy could be a backup for a few years, but he is no NFL starter and never will be. I wouldn't even give him a clipboard.

Why? That's a pretty firm stance, he's definitely more talented than our current backups.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Doesn't have to be such an extreme negative case like RG III. The Manning and Elway family exerted enormous influence on where both Eli and John went in the draft and how they were perceived. This may be no different than that. Both those guys turned out fine.

John Elway's father was a prominent coach and during the draft (and presumably his career) his agent Marvin Demoff helped guide him in the business process of the NFL.
Eli Manning's father was a prominent former QB and his agent Tom Condon helped guide the business part of Eli Manning's career.

Both Elway and Manning were prototypical NFL QB's and concensus top picks, with families that have a long standing knowledge of college and NFL football and presumably a great network of people they can lean on for advice. They still chose agents to navigate the process. Lamar Jackson is not the prototypical NFL QB. He threw footballs at the combine that fluttered and some looked like they were launched by a slingshot. His mother Felicia Jones does not appear to have the background in professional or college football to the level of Archie Manning or Jack Elway.

Felicia Jones involvement with her son's career may end the day he is drafted, or she may continue to arrange his appearances, endorsements, meetings with team management.....I don't know. But to compare Jackson's situation to that of Manning or Elway is comparing Apples to Turnips IMO.

- - - Updated - - -


Why? That's a pretty firm stance, he's definitely more talented than our current backups.

I agree. I think he can be a really good NFL QB, but he will need to learn to operate from the pocket and resist the urge to run for yardage when pressure gets close or pocket collapses. More Russell Wilson using feet extend plays and less Colin Kaepernick running when the pocket breaks down.

[86WARD]

Exactly and Vince Young and Kap come to mind. No way Steelers waste a 1 pick on him.

How often does a true "athletic QB" win the Super Bowl? Russell Wilson maybe? Steve Young in 1994? No thanks. I'll take a big slow white guy with an arm and some "escapability" any day over a guy with amazing speed and athleticism.

[Mojouw]

John Elway's father was a prominent coach and during the draft (and presumably his career) his agent Marvin Demoff helped guide him in the business process of the NFL.
Eli Manning's father was a prominent former QB and his agent Tom Condon helped guide the business part of Eli Manning's career.

Both Elway and Manning were prototypical NFL QB's and concensus top picks, with families that have a long standing knowledge of college and NFL football and presumably a great network of people they can lean on for advice. They still chose agents to navigate the process. Lamar Jackson is not the prototypical NFL QB. He threw footballs at the combine that fluttered and some looked like they were launched by a slingshot. His mother Felicia Jones does not appear to have the background in professional or college football to the level of Archie Manning or Jack Elway.

Felicia Jones involvement with her son's career may end the day he is drafted, or she may continue to arrange his appearances, endorsements, meetings with team management.....I don't know. But to compare Jackson's situation to that of Manning or Elway is comparing Apples to Turnips IMO.

- - - Updated - - -



I agree. I think he can be a really good NFL QB, but he will need to learn to operate from the pocket and resist the urge to run for yardage when pressure gets close or pocket collapses. More Russell Wilson using feet extend plays and less Colin Kaepernick running when the pocket breaks down.

Not really apples to turnips. All three individuals and groups wanted their son/client to land in the best possible spot for them to succeed and were not going to be told or forced by any team or other factor do anything they felt went against that. Just because Lamar's mom is not a former player or coach doesn't mean she can't see BS coming from a mile away. Every request by a team to run a 40, do drills at another position, discuss playing in any NON-Qb role is an attempt to devalue Lamar at his "best" current position and the one that represents his clearest path to high $$$ future earnings. Why should he have to do drills at other positions when lesser QB prospects like Tebow, Geno Smith, and Tyrod Taylor didn't. For all we know, the teams that are being "screened" and having trouble "reaching" Lamar Jackson are the teams that have made the most noise about seeing how he looks at WR or RB. Or maybe they are the teams that have starting QBs and back-ups on the depth chart that would block Jackson's path to playing time. These are all reasons that an actual agent might make his client hard to get a hold of. But since it is the dude's mom, everyone starts getting weird about it.

Remember this is a league where more than one scout has said they would pass on Rosen because he has a "bad face". The NFL has it's head squarely up its collective hindquarters when trying to parse out QB prospects.

Jackson seems to run more on called runs than on broken plays. Petrino's offense is notably complex, perhaps even "too" complex - a fact multiple pro coaches acknowledge. Yet Jackson seems to have mastered it. Darnold and Baker Mayfield have dealt with less pro concepts in their offense than Jackson has. His accuracy seems better than Allen's - who may struggle hitting the broad side of a barn on a consistent basis. But, of course, when Allen does hit the barn he is likely going to throw the damn ball 25 yards through the barn. Jackson's footwork is not good and will need work - something the stretch between the Combine and his Pro Day seemed to demonstrate he is aware of and already starting the process of correcting/cleaning up.

For me, Jackson is the 3rd best QB prospect in the class. I think he will be a far better pro passer than a college one for a variety of reasons. Additionally with the rookie wage scale for initial contracts, I'm not sure there is much need for an agent on that front. Remember, Eli and Elway both still had an opportunity to negotiate mammoth rookie deals.

[Born2Steel]

How often does a true "athletic QB" win the Super Bowl? Russell Wilson maybe? Steve Young in 1994? No thanks. I'll take a big slow white guy with an arm and some "escapability" any day over a guy with amazing speed and athleticism.

I can agree with this except for the "big slow white guy" part. Your overall point is valid though. I do not care if a QB can run. PERIOD! I don't want a statue either, but a QB's ability to tuck it and run means nothing to me. What makes a very big difference to me is a QB's accuracy and decision making ability. I put Dobbs, Jackson, and Rudolph in the same category as passers. All can make fantastic downfield bombs, on the move or from the pocket. What they all lack is consistent short to mid-range accuracy. This is why if they were all on the team, Landry Jones would still be Ben's backup. (5 QBs in a single post) In the decision making area, I like Dobbs over Jackson and Rudolph combined. This is not the draft to go QB in the 1st 3 rounds anyway.

[86WARD]

By “Big Slow White Guy”, I Mean Ben Roethlisberger, Brett Favre, Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Tony Romo types...lol.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Tom Brady on Louisville QB Lamar Jackson: 'He's a beast!!!!'

By Chase Goodbread
College Football 24/7 writer
Published: April 12, 2018

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000926111/article/tom-brady-on-louisville-qb-lamar-jackson-hes-a-beast

[DesertSteel]

Tom Brady on Louisville QB Lamar Jackson: 'He's a beast!!!!'

By Chase Goodbread
College Football 24/7 writer
Published: April 12, 2018

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000926111/article/tom-brady-on-louisville-qb-lamar-jackson-hes-a-beastThat's Brady's way of saying "Draft LJ so I won't have to worry about someone pushing me out of a job for the next three years."

[Mojouw]

Tom Brady on Louisville QB Lamar Jackson: 'He's a beast!!!!'

By Chase Goodbread
College Football 24/7 writer
Published: April 12, 2018

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000926111/article/tom-brady-on-louisville-qb-lamar-jackson-hes-a-beast

Look what the Pats staff was able to do with Jacoby Brissett. Now, give that same staff a prospect with a similar but far superior set of athletic tools. Imagine what happens next.

I almost hope that the Pats do draft Jackson and he is amazing. Maybe then the rest of the league and the talking heads will realize there is a new way to evaluate QBs and we can stop ignoring reality.

But then I realize that could lead to another decade of Pats dominance and I throw up in my mouth a little bit...

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

That's Brady's way of saying "Draft LJ so I won't have to worry about someone pushing me out of a job for the next three years."

Agree.

The most real evaluation that I heard on Jackson was...."he draws comparisons to Mike Vick, but lets not forget that Vick was a much better passer when he was drafted than Jackson is now."

I like Jackson, but he really should be a mid 2nd round grade. Somebody is going to jump up and grab him based upon athleticism and potential. But face it....he isn't even Mike Vick as a passer and may never develop his game to the level of Mike Vick as a passer.

[teegre]

Look what the Pats staff was able to do with Jacoby Brissett. Now, give that same staff a prospect with a similar but far superior set of athletic tools. Imagine what happens next.

I almost hope that the Pats do draft Jackson and he is amazing. Maybe then the rest of the league and the talking heads will realize there is a new way to evaluate QBs and we can stop ignoring reality.

But then I realize that could lead to another decade of Pats dominance and I throw up in my mouth a little bit...

:scared: That is my worst case scenario.

[teegre]

Agree.

The most real evaluation that I heard on Jackson was...."he draws comparisons to Mike Vick, but lets not forget that Vick was a much better passer when he was drafted than Jackson is now."

I like Jackson, but he really should be a mid 2nd round grade. Somebody is going to jump up and grab him based upon athleticism and potential. But face it....he isn't even Mike Vick as a passer and may never develop his game to the level of Mike Vick as a passer.

Interestingly... I read an article last week, describing how Jackson is already leaps & bounds ahead of Vick as a passer. (I don’t recall where I read the article... ergo, no link.) It talked about how Lamar played in a more complex system, and that he only ran on designed running plays. Here is one stat that stood out...

In their final seasons in college:

Jackson: 281 passing yards/game
Vick: 123 passing yards/game

NOTE: Vick's 1999 season was actually better (171 passing yards/game), but that’s still 110 yards less than Jackson.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Interestingly... I read an article last week, describing how Jackson is already leaps & bounds ahead of Vick as a passer. (I don’t recall where I read the article... ergo, no link.) It talked about how Lamar played in a more complex system, and that he only ran on designed running plays. Here is one stat that stood out...

In their final seasons in college:

Jackson: 281 passing yards/game
Vick: 123 passing yards/game

NOTE: Vick's 1999 season was actually better (171 passing yards/game), but that’s still 110 yards less than Jackson.

Below is link to Charley Casserly opinion on Jackson and a Vick comparison.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-path-to-the-draft/0ap3000000926010/Casserly-Vick-was-much-better-pocket-QB-than-Lamar-Jackson

[teegre]

Below is link to Charley Casserly opinion on Jackson and a Vick comparison.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-path-to-the-draft/0ap3000000926010/Casserly-Vick-was-much-better-pocket-QB-than-Lamar-Jackson

Charlie Casserly is wrong.

If YOU had broken down the tapes of Jackson and come to that conclusion, I’d listen. (i.e. I value YOUR opinion) But, Charlie Casserly... not so much.

[teegre]

El-Gonzo, you got me thinking. There’s one draft analyst out there whose opinion I completely respect, and it is Greg Costello. The dude is money.

So... I did a Google search and found this:

https://sports.yahoo.com/greg-cosells-draft-analysis-lamar-jackson-can-execute-nfl-passing-game-145150269.html

I haven’t even read it yet (I got excited and simply posted it). But, the title tells me that Costello probably disagree with Charlie Casserly.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

El-Gonzo, you got me thinking. There’s one draft analyst out there whose opinion I completely respect, and it is Greg Costello. The dude is money.

So... I did a Google search and found this:

https://sports.yahoo.com/greg-cosells-draft-analysis-lamar-jackson-can-execute-nfl-passing-game-145150269.html

I haven’t even read it yet (I got excited and simply posted it). But, the title tells me that Costello probably disagree with Charlie Casserly.

Thanks for the link Teeg, I will have a look. I honestly don't get "excited" to hear a good or bad review of Jackson or any other prospect. I just honestly look at it and see if it makes sense and if I agree or not.

Do you remember Mike Vick at VT ? I remember him having a good base when he threw the football and it had a ton of velocity and he was fairly accurate. Now can we say that of Jackson or does his game film smatter of inexplicable inaccurate throws, followed with some great ones? Did you see the NFL Combine workout of Jackson? He threw a couple footballs that were embarrassing for a highschool senior to throw. He pulled the string on a long throw that fluttered like it was tipped at the LOS and it instantly made me think of the inaccuracy comments. I don't care if the kid is drafted #1 overall or in the 5th round. I'm just telling what I see and I agree that Mike Vick was a more accomplished pocket passer during his draft year than Lamaar Jackson is now.

[Mojouw]

Thanks for the link Teeg, I will have a look. I honestly don't get "excited" to hear a good or bad review of Jackson or any other prospect. I just honestly look at it and see if it makes sense and if I agree or not.

Do you remember Mike Vick at VT ? I remember him having a good base when he threw the football and it had a ton of velocity and he was fairly accurate. Now can we say that of Jackson or does his game film smatter of inexplicable inaccurate throws, followed with some great ones? Did you see the NFL Combine workout of Jackson? He threw a couple footballs that were embarrassing for a highschool senior to throw. He pulled the string on a long throw that fluttered like it was tipped at the LOS and it instantly made me think of the inaccuracy comments. I don't care if the kid is drafted #1 overall or in the 5th round. I'm just telling what I see and I agree that Mike Vick was a more accomplished pocket passer during his draft year than Lamaar Jackson is now.

For me there is a potential big difference between the two. I grant that Vick might have been the superior passer coming out of school - I honestly don't remember. But Vick showed a stubborn refusal to be coached and a seeming unwillingness to modify his game at all. Combine that with a series of coaching staffs who seemed determined to jam him into a role he was not ideally suited for and you have a recipe for disaster. Now, I may be remembering this all wrong. But I kinda think there was little chance that Reeves was going to change his whole offense the way Obrian did for Watson and someone or other did for Kapernick during his good stretch.

If Jackson is willing to be coached and to make improvements/modifications to his game as well as have the team modify it's offense to a degree - I believe he can be far more successful than Vick ever was. And likely replicate and repeat the success of Watson last season.

As fans there is no way to know that since we are not in the interview rooms and coaching meetings.

[Iron Steeler]

He makes his receivers work to much. Not catchable ball. He will be affective in a RPO offense . But npt ours

[pczach]

For me there is a potential big difference between the two. I grant that Vick might have been the superior passer coming out of school - I honestly don't remember. But Vick showed a stubborn refusal to be coached and a seeming unwillingness to modify his game at all. Combine that with a series of coaching staffs who seemed determined to jam him into a role he was not ideally suited for and you have a recipe for disaster. Now, I may be remembering this all wrong. But I kinda think there was little chance that Reeves was going to change his whole offense the way Obrian did for Watson and someone or other did for Kapernick during his good stretch.

If Jackson is willing to be coached and to make improvements/modifications to his game as well as have the team modify it's offense to a degree - I believe he can be far more successful than Vick ever was. And likely replicate and repeat the success of Watson last season.

As fans there is no way to know that since we are not in the interview rooms and coaching meetings.




I think Vick was a better natural thrower, but that Jackson is ahead of him from a mental standpoint of understanding the game at the same points of their careers.

What I think that tells me is that Jackson is coachable and working harder on the game. Vick was never forced to truly embrace playing the position from the neck up. His physical gifts and rocket arm made NFL coaches hesitant to try to restrict him. In the end, it hurt his career and most of the teams he played for.

With Jackson, I see a kid that is trying like hell to learn the position. He makes some wonderful throws....then will throw some ducks. I don't know if hand size is a problem or his grip, but that shouldn't be happening to a someone that has been throwing the ball as much as he has for years now.

He's not a player I would take in the first round, but I do see potential in him and the drive to get better.

[zulater]

My biggest problem if this were the pick is it does nothing to help this team this and next season win a championship! I want a player that can come right in and contribute to a Super Bowl run. Finding Ben's successor can wait for a little longer.


Time might prove me wrong. And if the Steelers choose this path oh well. But I want to add to this defense and gives this team a real chance to add to that Super Bowl trophy case!

[teegre]

Thanks for the link Teeg, I will have a look. I honestly don't get "excited" to hear a good or bad review of Jackson or any other prospect. I just honestly look at it and see if it makes sense and if I agree or not.

Do you remember Mike Vick at VT ? I remember him having a good base when he threw the football and it had a ton of velocity and he was fairly accurate. Now can we say that of Jackson or does his game film smatter of inexplicable inaccurate throws, followed with some great ones? Did you see the NFL Combine workout of Jackson? He threw a couple footballs that were embarrassing for a highschool senior to throw. He pulled the string on a long throw that fluttered like it was tipped at the LOS and it instantly made me think of the inaccuracy comments. I don't care if the kid is drafted #1 overall or in the 5th round. I'm just telling what I see and I agree that Mike Vick was a more accomplished pocket passer during his draft year than Lamaar Jackson is now.

I live in San Diego; so, he was dissected to the fullest (before the Chargers traded out of the #1 spot). Also, a friend of mine at the time was a VaTech fan. And, my family are mostly all WVU alums (so Vick was readily discussed).

So... here is what I remember about Vick.

When Vick planted his feet, he could put the ball through a wall. But, he lacked the touch to make a simple 10-yard pass. More importantly, Vick was a runner who threw as a second choice.

Now, Lamar has some problems. But, he improved every year. If given time, I feel that his flaws are fixable.

[DesertSteel]

The mocks on that guy are all over the place.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Mike Mayock predicts Lamar Jackson will be first-round pick

By Edward Lewis
Around The NFL Writer
Published: April 20, 2018

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000927726/article/mike-mayock-predicts-lamar-jackson-will-be-firstround-pick

[hawaiiansteeler]

A note on Lamar Jackson's Wonderlic score of 13:

Nine quarterbacks were drafted in the past 15 years with a Wonderlic of 15 or less, according to Bob McGinn. Those names were, alphabetically:

Josh Booty
Nate Davis
Josh Johnson
Zac Robinson
Troy Smith
Tyrod Taylor
Seneca Wallace
Andre Woodson
Vince Young

Of those nine, only Young and Taylor were starters for an extended period of time, and neither was particularly good. Young had a decent stretch for a couple of seasons, but flamed out because he never developed as a passer, failing to ever throw for more than 12 touchdowns in a single year. Taylor is currently a starter, but not for long. Jackson's Wonderlic of 13 doesn't mean he'll necessarily fail - with some great coaching, I think he could become a good starter - but history is going against him.

http://walterfootball.com/combine2018QB.php

[DesertSteel]

If he goes in the top half of the first, it is the true definition of a roll of the dice. If he translates... watch out! But if not... It could cost a coach his job.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

A note on Lamar Jackson's Wonderlic score of 13:

Nine quarterbacks were drafted in the past 15 years with a Wonderlic of 15 or less, according to Bob McGinn. Those names were, alphabetically:

Josh Booty
Nate Davis
Josh Johnson
Zac Robinson
Troy Smith
Tyrod Taylor
Seneca Wallace
Andre Woodson
Vince Young

Of those nine, only Young and Taylor were starters for an extended period of time, and neither was particularly good. Young had a decent stretch for a couple of seasons, but flamed out because he never developed as a passer, failing to ever throw for more than 12 touchdowns in a single year. Taylor is currently a starter, but not for long. Jackson's Wonderlic of 13 doesn't mean he'll necessarily fail - with some great coaching, I think he could become a good starter - but history is going against him.

http://walterfootball.com/combine2018QB.php

Thanks for posting. While its not the end all test and sure some will find the exceptions (I'm sure Brett Favre couldn't even spell Wonderlic) of QB's that succeeded. It never ceases to amaze me how often people want to discount general intelligence, at a position that seemingly requires a high degree of intelligence to be successful.

[hawaiiansteeler]

4/23: "I've heard the Steelers are are high on Lamar Jackson, and sources that were at the Louisville pro day said they brought all of the top decision makers there to watch Jackson." - Charlie Campbell, WalterFootball.com

I personally have Jackson going to the Saints in my 2018 NFL Mock Draft, but I've slotted him to the Steelers in the past. If I had to guess, I'd say one of Pittsburgh or New Orleans trades up for Jackson. -Walter

http://walterfootball.com/nflrumors/teamdraft/17-32

[BlackAndGold]

4/23: "I've heard the Steelers are are high on Lamar Jackson, and sources that were at the Louisville pro day said they brought all of the top decision makers there to watch Jackson." - Charlie Campbell, WalterFootball.com

I personally have Jackson going to the Saints in my 2018 NFL Mock Draft, but I've slotted him to the Steelers in the past. If I had to guess, I'd say one of Pittsburgh or New Orleans trades up for Jackson. -Walter

http://walterfootball.com/nflrumors/teamdraft/17-32

https://media0.giphy.com/media/l3q2K5jinAlChoCLS/giphy.gif

[86WARD]

If they do that, it would be sooooooo disappointing...

[pczach]

If they do that, it would be sooooooo disappointing...


I like Lamar Jackson, but he won't help the team right away unless he plays slot receiver. If the Steelers want to win now, you would think they would take a position player, not a quarterback in the first round.

If the roster was set, and they didn't have many holes to fill, I'd be ok with it. Unfortunately, that's not the case and they already have limited draft picks. I'd rather they move down and pick up additional picks if a great player that fits the scheme isn't available in the first or they think they can still get the players they want a little later.

[86WARD]

I like Lamar Jackson, but he won't help the team right away unless he plays slot receiver. If the Steelers want to win now, you would think they would take a position player, not a quarterback in the first round.

If the roster was set, and they didn't have many holes to fill, I'd be ok with it. Unfortunately, that's not the case and they already have limited draft picks. I'd rather they move down and pick up additional picks if a great player that fits the scheme isn't available in the first or they think they can still get the players they want a little later.

Feel the same.

[Dwinsgames]

I agree with pczach and would add even if we knew this was Bens last year ( he claims otherwise via reports of 2-3 more years ) Jackson is not a guy you plug into THIS scheme .... he is not a prototypical QB his play style is quite different than we are accustomed and system changes and blocking schemes would need to be changed ...

it has always been my theory you draft a guy who fits your system there is 11 guys on offense not 1 ....

Get a guy who can run ( and run effectively) what the other 10 are already accustomed to as the apple cart is already upset enough when you make a change at the field general pos

[IowaSteeler927]

A note on Lamar Jackson's Wonderlic score of 13:

Nine quarterbacks were drafted in the past 15 years with a Wonderlic of 15 or less, according to Bob McGinn. Those names were, alphabetically:

Josh Booty
Nate Davis
Josh Johnson
Zac Robinson
Troy Smith
Tyrod Taylor
Seneca Wallace
Andre Woodson
Vince Young

Of those nine, only Young and Taylor were starters for an extended period of time, and neither was particularly good. Young had a decent stretch for a couple of seasons, but flamed out because he never developed as a passer, failing to ever throw for more than 12 touchdowns in a single year. Taylor is currently a starter, but not for long. Jackson's Wonderlic of 13 doesn't mean he'll necessarily fail - with some great coaching, I think he could become a good starter - but history is going against him.

http://walterfootball.com/combine2018QB.php

Interesting. Jackson is definitely his own person, but none of the guys on that list inspire confidence. Gotta have the brains to play QB in the NFL to go along with the talent. Talent in and of itself usually doesn't lend itself well to the QB position. You can have all the talent and raw natural athleticism in the world and still be a terrible QB because you just can't grasp the game. I wish this young man success, I try not to put too much stock in Wonderlic scores, but that list is an interesting bit of information that seems to suggest low Wonderlic scores aren't exactly translating to a ton of success on the field. Conversely though, there are a lot of guys that are highly intelligent and have degrees in areas like Engineering, or Business and they suck it up when they make it to the NFL...

I will say this though, when I was in college the football guys were some of the dumbest guys in our school. They were definitely getting passed through classes they shouldn't have been passing. Half the time or more they didn't even show up for class, and when they were actually in class they were about as collectively intelligent as a box of pet rocks. That's not to say it was every guy on the football team, but a majority of them weren't exactly the brightest crayons in the box. Having watched shows like Last Chance U, it kind of irritates me some times how many passes these guys get just because of their athletic abilities.