The Draft, OLB, ILB & Shazier

[Shoes]

I think its reasonable to think the Steelers will be looking to fill Shazier's position in the draft in 2018. I know its possible Ryan may return to play, but I don't think that will be decided by draft day. I don't follow college football much so I don't know which position has a deeper class, OLB or ILB. For those that do what are your thoughts, put some names out there. Would it make any sense to move Dupree inside and take a OLB if the class is very good? Do you think Dupree would have success inside? I suppose we could also pick up some players but who knows who will be available.

I don't think the Steelers will draft a QB this year and as always I continue to hope for a TE. :chuckle: I suspect they will go heavy on the D, but then again JuJu was a R2 last year. Should be interesting.

[st33lersguy]

There are a lot of directions they could go.

Normally, I pin point 3 positions id likje to see them go in round 1, this year as of now I am seeing 5: OLB, ILB, QB, TE, and S

[teegre]

I’d keep Bud at OLB.

If they go ILB in R1, I would LOVE to get Roquan Smith (Georgia). The dude is basically Ryan Shazier, part II.

(Actually, I’d play him at SS/ILB like Deone Bucannon.)

[cubanstogie]

I’d keep Bud at OLB.

If they go ILB in R1, I would LOVE to get Roquan Smith (Georgia). The dude is basically Ryan Shazier, part II.

(Actually, I’d play him at SS/ILB like Deone Bucannon.)
If he’s available 99% they would draft him. Slated to be top ten I think

[teegre]

If he’s available 99% they would draft him. Slated to be top ten I think

True... yes, he’ll be gone by 32. :wink02:

[teegre]

Safety would be my choice at 32 (but, my gut says they go QB, since they’ve looked at a dozen of them). Regardless...

32. Justin Reid, Stanford
He can play anywhere in the secondary... just like Sean Davis. Imagine the formations you could run with two safeties who can do so much.

32. Ronnie Harrison, Alabama
He would have to play SS. But, Sean Davis is flexible enough that he could move to FS.

If they go QB and then TE...

96. Jordan Whitehead, Pitt
He probably shouldn’t last this long, but his diminutive stature might indeed make him drop to us in R3.

[steelreserve]

The only way I don't take a QB is if Ben vociferously assures us he'll be playing at least three more years, or if we for some reason think all of the ones in this year's draft are busts. Otherwise, this is the year. Simple math - fewer spots to trade up to get one; most other years we'd have to spend an extra first-rounder. So even if we're not over the moon for a particular guy, the opportunity cost of NOT doing it is too high.

ILB is definitely our next biggest need. No one will say if Shazier can even walk, which likely means he still can't. Hopefully that does not continue to be the case, but I doubt he'll be playing football next year, if ever.

But I would take my pick off the second-round crop at that position - you can win with an average ILB, but not with an average QB. And there are much better odds that we can address an ILB problem in a future draft or through free agency than a QB problem. Again: This is the time to do it.

[teegre]

I’m locked in on Troy Fumagalli, TE, Wisconsin in R2. He’s a R1 talent who will drop into R2 due to an injury (much like how Heath Miller dropped to 30 from the top 10). He can catch and block. Boom!!!

[Hawkman]

Can we focus on the here and now.

[Shoes]

I’m locked in on Troy Fumagalli, TE, Wisconsin in R2. He’s a R1 talent who will drop into R2 due to an injury (much like how Heath Miller dropped to 30 from the top 10). He can catch and block. Boom!!!

I like Mark Andrews also, but he'll probably be gone by the time we pick in R2



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wglkYD3sVQ

[teegre]

Can we focus on the here and now.

I get what you are saying, but it’s college bowl game time... and we can focus on some of the key prospects (although, one game should not trump the other 30+ games that the player has played).

[Shoes]

Can we focus on the here and now.

Sure start your own *here and now thread*

[DesertSteel]

Can we focus on the here and now.
I just had a grilled cheese and a Coke Zero. Watching a meaningless bowl game.

[Steeldude]

If they are going to move anyone to from OLB to ILB it should be Watt, IMO.

Hopefully Shazier can come back 100% healthy.

[Hawkman]

Sure start your own *here and now thread*

That’s a great thought Shoes and I will consider it, but on this great Steelers site there are specific areas for talking about the draft.......just saying.:wink02:

[BlackAndGold]

I have not looked at much of the prospect in this upcoming draft but it seem like ILB depth is solid in the first two rounds.

Two mid round(2-4) ILB's to watch for.
Tremaine Edmunds, Virginia Tech
Josey Jewell, Iowa

Darius Leonard, South Carolina State (I have no idea who this guy is but Walterfootball had this to say. '12/16/17: Scouting sources have told me that Leonard really impressed them this fall. He flew around the field, producing a lot for his defense. Leonard amassed 113 tackles with eight tackles for a loss, eight sacks, one pass batted, two interceptions and one forced fumble in 2017. He has a knack for making plays behind the line of scrimmage as he totaled 42 tackles for a loss with 13.5 sacks combined over his freshman, sophomore and junior years. Leonard has NFL size and dominated his level of competition.'

Later round pick(5): Skai Moore, South Carolina. Tweener LB/safety that has some durability issues, but could be a great fit on the next level. But he plays for the Gamecocks, awful.

[Shoes]

That’s a great thought Shoes and I will consider it, but on this great Steelers site there are specific areas for talking about the draft.......just saying.:wink02:

Thanks Sheriff, here's a reward for your labor.:cookie::cookie: :chuckle:


all kidding aside, I have no problem with this thread being moved

[Rotorhead]

Well, there are a couple safety's becoming FA's this year, so maybe we can address that need there, if so our def backfield will be our strength. I also think we should look at ILB to replace Shazier. After those to spots we really can just go best available. I think we are ok at TE (even without McDonald) and while I am not a big fan of Dupree, maybe we can replace him in rnd 3. One caveat would be if Haden is not retained, then we need to look for more CB depth. I also think Ben will be back at least one more season, more so if we win a SB as he will be one away from Bradshaw with basically the same roster.

Summary:
Rnd 1 - ILB
Rnd 2 - CB if we don't retain Haden, S if we don't replace Mitchell with a FA, otherwise OLB
Rnd 3 - Same as above

[DesertSteel]

Well, there are a couple safety's becoming FA's this year, so maybe we can address that need there, if so our def backfield will be our strength. I also think we should look at ILB to replace Shazier. After those to spots we really can just go best available. I think we are ok at TE (even without McDonald) and while I am not a big fan of Dupree, maybe we can replace him in rnd 3. One caveat would be if Haden is not retained, then we need to look for more CB depth. I also think Ben will be back at least one more season, more so if we win a SB as he will be one away from Bradshaw with basically the same roster.

Summary:
Rnd 1 - ILB
Rnd 2 - CB if we don't retain Haden, S if we don't replace Mitchell with a FA, otherwise OLB
Rnd 3 - Same as above

If we don't retain Haden we need to draft a new GM!

[Born2Steel]

It's all fine and good to list positions of need in order of greatest need, but that's not how we draft. Right now, today, our defense may have some position(s) that we can upgrade, but there are no 'glaring holes' that must be filled immediately. It's my opinion, the same can be said for the offense. Therefore, 1st round, like always, should be BPA on the board. Then, BPA at position of need or best upgrade.

My current list for position of need:
1. QB (BB will not be here forever. I don't trust who we have.)
2. TE/WR (Right now, we need a McDonald that will be on the field, and a WR opposite AB.)
3. Safety (However you feel about Mitchell, he is getting older.)

[Mojouw]

I think at this point in the process it is best to think about it as a shopping list. The team has an entire offseason cycle to do the following:

ILB needs at least 2 players added. Starter and upgraded depth.

QB -keep spamming the position until you get one.

RB - technically there is no healthy 2018 starter under contract.

WR - depth. Hunter and DHB could be upgraded or at least swapped out.

TE - been talked about enough.

OL - Hubbard likely priced himself off the team. Depth is always needed here.

OLB - Watt/Dupree/Chickfilet and nothing. That’s not a great group.

CB - Gay and Sensabaugh will need replaced.

S - After Davis, an argument could be made that everyone needs replaced.

That’s just off the top of my head. That is far more players than 2018 draft picks.

Not sure by any means, but it’s a fairly complex puzzle that really isn’t totally in focus yet.


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[Shoes]

I think at this point in the process it is best to think about it as a shopping list. The team has an entire offseason cycle to do the following:

ILB needs at least 2 players added. Starter and upgraded depth.

QB -keep spamming the position until you get one.

RB - technically there is no healthy 2018 starter under contract.

WR - depth. Hunter and DHB could be upgraded or at least swapped out.

TE - been talked about enough.

OL - Hubbard likely priced himself off the team. Depth is always needed here.

OLB - Watt/Dupree/Chickfilet and nothing. That’s not a great group.

CB - Gay and Sensabaugh will need replaced.

S - After Davis, an argument could be made that everyone needs replaced.

That’s just off the top of my head. That is far more players than 2018 draft picks.

Not sure by any means, but it’s a fairly complex puzzle that really isn’t totally in focus yet.


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I don't know if there may be better QB choices in the 2019 class, but I think I'd pass this year unless someone slipped through the cracks. Nice list!

[BlackAndGold]

I think at this point in the process it is best to think about it as a shopping list. The team has an entire offseason cycle to do the following:

ILB needs at least 2 players added. Starter and upgraded depth Agreed. A draft pick and a free agent. Wish Miami could dump Timmons in the offseason like the Lions did with Larry Foote years back.

QB -keep spamming the position until you get one. Maybe a later round project, but if Ben comes back I don't see them taking one.

RB - technically there is no healthy 2018 starter under contract We'll see how the Bell situation works out. Can see them bringing in a cheap RB, maybe Ridley shows something?

WR - depth. Hunter and DHB could be upgraded or at least swapped out. ​Could see Hunter easily being brought back, heard he plays well in practice, but of course never on gameday. Still young and brings physical tools to the table. Can see one drafted later in the draft.

TE - been talked about enough. Mike Gesicki please.

OL - Hubbard likely priced himself off the team. Depth is always needed here. Draft an OL with one of the 5th round picks. Man I wish they could keep Hubbard, but salary cap makes it impossible.

OLB - Watt/Dupree/Chickfilet and nothing. That’s not a great group. That's three guys right there, look to sign a vet that won't bitch about his role. I'll be watching for Keion Adams, could be a gem.

CB - Gay and Sensabaugh will need replaced. I still like Gay, knows the defense inside and out, maybe a move to back up safety? Burns, Haden, Hilton, Sutton, Allen, Gay is solid.

S - After Davis, an argument could be made that everyone needs replaced. Draft a safety in the first two rounds. I like Whitehead from Pitt in round 2.

That’s just off the top of my head. That is far more players than 2018 draft picks.

Not sure by any means, but it’s a fairly complex puzzle that really isn’t totally in focus yet.


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My thoughts in red

[DesertSteel]

I'm going Inside Linebacker in the 1st. Good value can usually be had at that position late in the 1st. In the 2nd, I'm going Running Back (bye bye Bell). Another good value position in the 2nd. Round 3, I'm going Safety. Unless Ben comes out and retires I'm not taking a QB in the first 4 rounds.

[Shoes]

NFL Draft Prospects – 2017 Bowl Game Preview: December 29th
http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/12/nfl-draft-prospects-2017-bowl-game-preview-december-29th/

[RunNGun]

I think its reasonable to think the Steelers will be looking to fill Shazier's position in the draft in 2018. I know its possible Ryan may return to play, but I don't think that will be decided by draft day. I don't follow college football much so I don't know which position has a deeper class, OLB or ILB. For those that do what are your thoughts, put some names out there. Would it make any sense to move Dupree inside and take a OLB if the class is very good? Do you think Dupree would have success inside? I suppose we could also pick up some players but who knows who will be available.

I don't think the Steelers will draft a QB this year and as always I continue to hope for a TE. :chuckle: I suspect they will go heavy on the D, but then again JuJu was a R2 last year. Should be interesting.

I wouldn't rule out a move to the inside for Dupree. He definitely fits the mold. If it were my call, I'd pick the best available LB. If there's an OLB who rushes the passer better than Dupree then try and make the switch. Dupree is a freak athlete who can run with any TE and most RBs. In fact, he may even be more suited as an ILB.

I don't like the idea of taking a QB in Rd 1 this year unless a no brainer falls. If Ben calls it quits then you roll with Dobbs/free agent for a season. If Dobbs shows he can lead the team, then problem solved. If Dobbs shits the bed then you take a QB in next years draft with, potentially, a top 15 pick versus a 28-32 pick in this years draft.

[RunNGun]

If they are going to move anyone to from OLB to ILB it should be Watt, IMO.

Hopefully Shazier can come back 100% healthy.

I think Watt could make the move with no problems, but I don't want to take him off the edge. He's shown flashes of dominance. Something we haven't seen from that position in awhile. Don't fix what isn't broken in that scenario.

[RunNGun]

The only way I don't take a QB is if Ben vociferously assures us he'll be playing at least three more years, or if we for some reason think all of the ones in this year's draft are busts. Otherwise, this is the year. Simple math - fewer spots to trade up to get one; most other years we'd have to spend an extra first-rounder. So even if we're not over the moon for a particular guy, the opportunity cost of NOT doing it is too high.

ILB is definitely our next biggest need. No one will say if Shazier can even walk, which likely means he still can't. Hopefully that does not continue to be the case, but I doubt he'll be playing football next year, if ever.

But I would take my pick off the second-round crop at that position - you can win with an average ILB, but not with an average QB. And there are much better odds that we can address an ILB problem in a future draft or through free agency than a QB problem. Again: This is the time to do it.

Is a QB taken at picks 28-32 more likely to lead the Steelers to the playoffs than Dobbs with a year in the system? Or a stop gap free agent? To me, the answer is no. Maybe Dobbs/FA goes 8-8, maybe they go 6-10. Best case scenario, 10-6. In any event, odds are we will be in better position to take a QB in next years draft.

[st33lersguy]

You never know with drafted qbs, they are as big a crapshoot as you get in the draft. I do know that a qb taken in round 1 provides more upside than the vast majority of free agent qbs, you know what you are getting and often times it's not very much. As for Dobbs, im not sure you can bank on a raw 4th round qb being the long term future of the team.

[RunNGun]

You never know with drafted qbs, they are as big a crapshoot as you get in the draft. I do know that a qb taken in round 1 provides more upside than the vast majority of free agent qbs, you know what you are getting and often times it's not very much. As for Dobbs, im not sure you can bank on a raw 4th round qb being the long term future of the team.

I'm definitely not banking on that. It's more likely we sign a free agent to start, but maybe they give Dobbs an oopportunity if he's shown enough improvement. Really don't want to see them reach for a QB.

[ALLD]

I think its reasonable to think the Steelers will be looking to fill Shazier's position in the draft in 2018. I know its possible Ryan may return to play, but I don't think that will be decided by draft day. I don't follow college football much so I don't know which position has a deeper class, OLB or ILB. For those that do what are your thoughts, put some names out there. Would it make any sense to move Dupree inside and take a OLB if the class is very good? Do you think Dupree would have success inside? I suppose we could also pick up some players but who knows who will be available.

I don't think the Steelers will draft a QB this year and as always I continue to hope for a TE. :chuckle: I suspect they will go heavy on the D, but then again JuJu was a R2 last year. Should be interesting.

Better chance of Ryan Clark returning than Ryan Shazier.

[DesertSteel]

Better chance of Ryan Clark returning than Ryan Shazier.
Based on what? Do you have inside info?

[ALLD]

Based on how many guys in professional sports of any kind were temporarily paralyzed and returned to form? It was a devastating injury where he could be one hit away from permanent paralysis. Remember Shazier is in the hitting business, he isn't a kicker.

[FrancoLambert]

Based on how many guys in professional sports of any kind were temporarily paralyzed and returned to form? It was a devastating injury where he could be one hit away from permanent paralysis. Remember Shazier is in the hitting business, he isn't a kicker.

Spinal stabilization surgery would and should preclude the patient from resuming an activity that would likely cause re-injury.
Permanent paralysis would result.
Sad to say, his football career is very likely over.

[DesertSteel]

Based on how many guys in professional sports of any kind were temporarily paralyzed and returned to form? It was a devastating injury where he could be one hit away from permanent paralysis. Remember Shazier is in the hitting business, he isn't a kicker.

"Pro Football Doc has 17 years of experience as an NFL team doctor, and he wrote about Shazier's situation in depth for the San Diego Union Tribune (http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sports/profootballdoc/sd-sp-pfd-ryan-shazier-surgery-1207-story.html). His guess is that the surgery that Shazier underwent was fusion surgery with a combination of metal screws, rods, a cage and a bone graft. He believes it was not done as an emergency measure, but to prevent future damage to his spine.
What is the prognosis on spinal fusion surgery? He believes it would take him four-to-six months to recover. That would make playing this season an impossibility, but would have him back at full strength between April and June. That gives him plenty of time to work back into football shape before next season starts if his recovery goes as planned."

[Shoes]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000901327/article/penn-state-rb-saquon-barkley-intends-to-enter-2018-draft

[steelreserve]

"Pro Football Doc has 17 years of experience as an NFL team doctor, and he wrote about Shazier's situation in depth for the San Diego Union Tribune (http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sports/profootballdoc/sd-sp-pfd-ryan-shazier-surgery-1207-story.html). His guess is that the surgery that Shazier underwent was fusion surgery with a combination of metal screws, rods, a cage and a bone graft. He believes it was not done as an emergency measure, but to prevent future damage to his spine.
What is the prognosis on spinal fusion surgery? He believes it would take him four-to-six months to recover. That would make playing this season an impossibility, but would have him back at full strength between April and June. That gives him plenty of time to work back into football shape before next season starts if his recovery goes as planned."

The dude still cannot even walk, or we would've seen it or heard about it by now. He is not playing pro football in 2018, probably ever. We need to plan as if that's what's happening. I just hope the guy is not actually permanently debilitated.

[Born2Steel]

The dude still cannot even walk, or we would've seen it or heard about it by now. He is not playing pro football in 2018, probably ever. We need to plan as if that's what's happening. I just hope the guy is not actually permanently debilitated.

One positive we can take away is that he was sitting upright in the box during the Patriot game. He was even shown waving a terrible towel over his head. The importance of his sitting position is that sitting puts more weight and stress on the low back that standing or lying on your back. Up to 75% more stress actually. The fact that he was allowed to do so is promising by itself. You are correct saying how we really want to hear the words that he is walking though.

[Shoes]

One positive we can take away is that he was sitting upright in the box during the Patriot game. He was even shown waving a terrible towel over his head. The importance of his sitting position is that sitting puts more weight and stress on the low back that standing or lying on your back. Up to 75% more stress actually. The fact that he was allowed to do so is promising by itself. You are correct saying how we really want to hear the words that he is walking though.

I've heard he was making good progress. if I were Ryan with my health restored, I'd find another line of work.

[GoSlash27]

For ILB, I absolutely endorse Josey Jewell. That kid is a certified badass and undervalued in this draft.

*edit* I take that back. "Scoutdraft" just recently bumped him up to the #1 ILB prospect.

[cubanstogie]

It's all fine and good to list positions of need in order of greatest need, but that's not how we draft. Right now, today, our defense may have some position(s) that we can upgrade, but there are no 'glaring holes' that must be filled immediately. It's my opinion, the same can be said for the offense. Therefore, 1st round, like always, should be BPA on the board. Then, BPA at position of need or best upgrade.

My current list for position of need:
1. QB (BB will not be here forever. I don't trust who we have.)
2. TE/WR (Right now, we need a McDonald that will be on the field, and a WR opposite AB.)
3. Safety (However you feel about Mitchell, he is getting older.)
I am satisfied with WR/TE until later rounds. Maybe a diamond in the rough. I see LB, Safety and QB. My number one would be Roquan Smith, followed by Minkah Fitzpatrick, and I actually think Mason Rudolph could turn out to be best QB. All three had great bowl games, highly doubt Smith or Minkah will be available.

[DesertSteel]

The dude still cannot even walk, or we would've seen it or heard about it by now. He is not playing pro football in 2018, probably ever. We need to plan as if that's what's happening. I just hope the guy is not actually permanently debilitated.
Maybe so but I'm not writing him off like all the doctors here on this board.

No one on here has played at the highest level so it's easy for us to say we'd walk away and find another line of work. If he wants to play I hope he fights his way back. Other people's heads is a terrible place to keep your happiness.

[Rotorhead]

I was thinking a little last night and with the players we have along the DL (Heyward, Alualu, Hargrave, Tuitt) could we switch to more of a 4-3 defense next season? Then we could use Watt, Williams, Dupree/?? for our LB's. It was just some thinking after Alualu put together that great performance against the Browns. Those 4 along the line would get quite a bit of push against most any OL and free up the LB's to work in a bit more coverage (like we do now anyway).

[Mojouw]

I was thinking a little last night and with the players we have along the DL (Heyward, Alualu, Hargrave, Tuitt) could we switch to more of a 4-3 defense next season? Then we could use Watt, Williams, Dupree/?? for our LB's. It was just some thinking after Alualu put together that great performance against the Browns. Those 4 along the line would get quite a bit of push against most any OL and free up the LB's to work in a bit more coverage (like we do now anyway).

The linebackers are all wrong for a 4-3 alignment. Think of the Urlacher era Bears, the Dungy era Bucs, and the Seahawks recently. The Steelers are totally missing that dominant MLB. I mean Shazier could pull it off, but VW isn't turning and running with TE's down the seam as the under man in a Cover 2/Tampa 2 situation. Or at least that isn't his strong suit. Watt might be a fit in the Derrick Brooks role, but he is still best suited as a pass rusher, not a coverage 'backer. Dupree, well not sure. It remains to be seen what he is best suited for consistently. His athletic measurables say pass rusher, but his performance says ?????

Maybe you could play some sort of Seahawks variant of a 4-3 with Dupree in the Cliff Avril pass rush role. But you are still missing the guy to play the Bobby Wagner role.

On top of having a personnel issue, you would have to hire all new defensive coaches. I think that the team can't switch because almost all of the front 7 players are young and drafted specifically to fill roles in a 3-4 base defense.

[teegre]

I had a dream where I saw the Steelers draft card:

32. Marcus Allen, QB, Penn St.

What is interesting is that Marcus Allen is a SAFETY. Yet, I distinctly saw “quarterback” written next to his name. So... hmmm.

[DesertSteel]

I had a dream where I saw the Steelers draft card:

32. Marcus Allen, QB, Penn St.

What is interesting is that Marcus Allen is a SAFETY. Yet, I distinctly saw “quarterback” written next to his name. So... hmmm.
Dang... I thought he was a running back from USC

[tube517]

I had a dream where I saw the Steelers draft card:

32. Marcus Allen, QB, Penn St.

What is interesting is that Marcus Allen is a SAFETY. Yet, I distinctly saw “quarterback” written next to his name. So... hmmm.


Dang... I thought he was a running back from USC

Just win, baby.

[teegre]

@Shoes I just read this:

Here is the complete list of TEs in NFL history who had at least 500 receiving yards in their rookie season that were drafted after the fourth round:

George Kittle - 515


#saltinthewound

[Shoes]

@Shoes I just read this:

Here is the complete list of TEs in NFL history who had at least 500 receiving yards in their rookie season that were drafted after the fourth round:

George Kittle - 515


#saltinthewound


Thanks Brother I needed that! :chuckle:

[Psycho Ward 86]

@Shoes I just read this:

Here is the complete list of TEs in NFL history who had at least 500 receiving yards in their rookie season that were drafted after the fourth round:

George Kittle - 515


#saltinthewound

prorate Kittle's statistics from his games with Garoppolo to a 16 game season and he has 48 catches, 761 yards, 15.9 YPC, and 3 TD's

Shoulda coulda woulda :lol:

[Born2Steel]

If we operate under the assumption that Shazier will not return, we must bring in a new ILB to replace him, that replacement is not on this team currently. I recommend FA since the draft is such a gamble, and this year's class is not impressive.

OLB play has not been bad this season. Never hurts to look for upgrades of course, but I don't think it's an early need.

[st33lersguy]

Even if Shazier somehow makes it back this season, they still need another ILB. Depth at that the position is non-existent (which has been exposed), plus Shazier has never played a full 16-game season so insurance is needed. They should have addressed the need for depth in the off-season and now it's coming back to bite them in a big way.

Also, it really stinks that they have spent 4 out of the last 5 first round picks on linebackers, yet they only have 2 LBs playing right now that are any good (TJ Watt and Vince Williams), not to mention depth is non-existent across the board

[cubanstogie]

Even if Shazier somehow makes it back this season, they still need another ILB. Depth at that the position is non-existent (which has been exposed), plus Shazier has never played a full 16-game season so insurance is needed. They should have addressed the need for depth in the off-season and now it's coming back to bite them in a big way.

Also, it really stinks that they have spent 4 out of the last 5 first round picks on linebackers, yet they only have 2 LBs playing right now that are any good (TJ Watt and Vince Williams), not to mention depth is non-existent across the board
Navarro bowman or Todd Davis are great run stoppers for under 3 mill

[BlackAndGold]

No doubt in my mind they'll address the ILB position in the first 3 rounds.

S, ILB, TE in any order.

[cubanstogie]

No doubt in my mind they'll address the ILB position in the first 3 rounds.

S, ILB, TE in any order.
I think qb over, te but I seem to be in minority. I actually feel like JJ is getting better and McDonald is solid if he can stay on field.

- - - Updated - - -

I don’t see James dropping many and is not afraid to get hit in traffic.

[BlackAndGold]

I think qb over, te but I seem to be in minority. I actually feel like JJ is getting better and McDonald is solid if he can stay on field.

- - - Updated - - -

I don’t see James dropping many and is not afraid to get hit in traffic.

Ben seems to be returning, so I don't see them taking a QB, maybe a project later in the draft.

JJ is just a guy, I respect he isn't scared to take a hit, but he can be upgraded. Also not much of a run blocker.

McDonald has looked very good when he is on the field, but he has struggled to do that.

[Shoes]

With Ben saying he'll return, I just don't see the Steelers taking a QB in 2018. We know the needs on defense but what about offense, where do you want the Steelers to go with their O picks considering they pass on a QB?

[Count Steeler]

With Ben saying he'll return, I just don't see the Steelers taking a QB in 2018. We know the needs on defense but what about offense, where do you want the Steelers to go with their O picks considering they pass on a QB?

TE and RB? Might need help on OL depth.

[Shoes]

I think Bell will get a contract but not the 15m he is seeking. So I go TE, OL and WR. If Mark Andrews somehow slipped to 28 we would be fools not to take him imo.

[teegre]

With Ben saying he'll return, I just don't see the Steelers taking a QB in 2018. We know the needs on defense but what about offense, where do you want the Steelers to go with their O picks considering they pass on a QB?

As much as I want Fumigalli (TE, Wisconsin)... I see the first two picks being FS/ILB or ILB/FS.

Those positions have larger holes. And, BB seems to like McDonald.

[Shoes]

As much as I want Fumigalli (TE, Wisconsin)... I see the first two picks being FS/ILB or ILB/FS.

Those positions have larger holes. And, BB seems to like McDonald.

It probably will be, but one can always hope! :chuckle: McDonald still concerns me with injuries and the drops, but he has been catching the ball better as the season moved on.

[tube517]

It probably will be, but one can always hope! :chuckle: McDonald still concerns me with injuries and the drops, tho he has been catching the ball better as the season moved on.

McDonald has a good rapport w/Ben now but his injuries and salary are a concern.

[Born2Steel]

There was a post last offseason showing the success rates of QBs taken after the 1st round. I would like for whoever was able to find that info, to please post that again, also can you find that same stat for ILBs and safeties.

[Shoes]

I think we were awed by Shazier's (picked @ 15) speed and athleticism and rightly so, but Mosley has been a better all around player I think. I think he was picked at 17

Mosley



Total tackles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tackle_(football_move)):
474


Sacks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacks):
8.0


Interceptions (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interception):
8


Pass Deflections:
30


Forced fumbles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
6


Fumble recoveries (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
5


Defensive touchdowns:
2




Shazier



Total tackles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tackle_(football_move)):
299


Sacks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterback_sack):
7.0


Forced fumbles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
7


Fumble recoveries (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
3


Interceptions (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interceptions):
7

[Mojouw]

I think we were awed by Shazier's (picked @ 15) speed and athleticism and rightly so, but Mosley has been a better all around player I think. I think he was picked at 17

Mosley



Total tackles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tackle_(football_move)):
474


Sacks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacks):
8.0


Interceptions (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interception):
8


Pass Deflections:
30


Forced fumbles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
6


Fumble recoveries (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
5


Defensive touchdowns:
2




Shazier



Total tackles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tackle_(football_move)):
299


Sacks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterback_sack):
7.0


Forced fumbles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
7


Fumble recoveries (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
3


Interceptions (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interceptions):
7




They are asked to do totally different things. I think both are excellent LBers, but only Shazier had the natural ability to be a game changing player. Mosley is great, but he can not single-handedly change the outcomes of games. Shazier could and did.

A draft pick can seriously upgrade and improve the ILB play of the Steelers in 2018 (although rookie defenders and all that) but the defense will need to be fundamentally different in a non-Ryan Shazier world.

[AtlantaDan]

The defense will need to be fundamentally different in a non-Ryan Shazier world.

Agreed but if so that arguably supports bringing in a new DC to tear it down rather than expect Butler to do more than rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic

Of course Tomlin has been much more involved in the defense in the three seasons since LeBeau was let go and has had a major role since then in drafting players presumably suited for his system (Dupree, Burns, Watt, Golson) so he has to sign off on any major redesign

Given the huge defensive problems since the Shazier catastrophe against chump offenses like the Ravens and Jags hard for Tomlin to argue to AJRII that just some minor adjustments are needed

IMO big coaching shakeups coming

[Psycho Ward 86]

I think we were awed by Shazier's (picked @ 15) speed and athleticism and rightly so, but Mosley has been a better all around player I think. I think he was picked at 17

Mosley



Total tackles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tackle_(football_move)):
474


Sacks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacks):
8.0


Interceptions (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interception):
8


Pass Deflections:
30


Forced fumbles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
6


Fumble recoveries (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
5


Defensive touchdowns:
2




Shazier



Total tackles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tackle_(football_move)):
299


Sacks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterback_sack):
7.0


Forced fumbles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
7


Fumble recoveries (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fumble):
3


Interceptions (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interceptions):
7



You're comparing stats in 62 games vs. 41. Context.

Mosely is the more fundamentally sound player, Shazier is more dynamic but oft injured/over pursuing the play

[fansince'76]

A draft pick can seriously upgrade and improve the ILB play of the Steelers in 2018 (although rookie defenders and all that) but the defense will need to be fundamentally different in a non-Ryan Shazier world.

Definitely need a defense that isn't entirely dependent on one player. It was the same story with LeBeau whenever Polamalu went down.

[Mojouw]

https://fanspeak.com/mtc/summary.php?id=wxdjtz

Here were my results on the salary cap sim tool. Kinda fun and gives some idea of what could happen. Although, the tool has guys hitting FA that will never make it.

[Shoes]

You're comparing stats in 62 games vs. 41. Context.

Mosely is the more fundamentally sound player, Shazier is more dynamic but oft injured/over pursuing the play

Mosley has also been far more dependable even before Ryans serious injury, which is why you have 62 games vs 41 games.