7-2 with no complete team performance

[Edman]

The Steelers are 7-2, but the offense hasn't scored over 30 points yet, and just eeked out a win over the hapless Colts. However, Ben is starting to get some rhythm back, with two good games in a row.

Good in the idea that the team hasn't peaked yet, or concern that the team's record is a total fluke?

[Mojouw]

I honestly think this is what this team is this year. They are not getting any better and they won't get much worse barring injury.

The offense is designed to be as good as the quarterback. Ben has to be better and I don't see that happening. :noidea:

[AtlantaDan]

I honestly think this is what this team is this year. They are not getting any better and they won't get much worse barring injury.

The offense is designed to be as good as the quarterback. Ben has to be better and I don't see that happening. :noidea:

I tend to agree that while improvement is possible it is not likely - there is a body of work that this is a mediocre offense.

In 2014 the offense did not get it together until late October with the emergence of Bryant but in that case Ben was still in his prime rather than just showing flashes of excellent play. It can be blamed on the receivers or Ben, but the deep throw can no longer be completed with any regularity and that has been a key component of this offense.

Add to that the running game and placing everything on Bell seeming to have hit a wall and it is getting late for the offense to find itself.

Assuming the Steelers do not lose twice before then, the New England game for home field advantage over the Pats and simply being able to convince the team it can beat the Pats is shaping up as one of the most important regular season games in recent years (the Christmas Day game against the Ravens last year was big but that did not carry the psychodrama and path to the Super Bowl implications of playing the Pats at Heinz in 5 weeks). After teh Steeler blunders and the Pats rolling over Denver the national media has the Pats as locks for going to the Super Bowl again.

[st33lersguy]

I don't think they are as good as their record. Too many ugly wins and an offense that hasn't done well at all.

[Born2Steel]

I'm not sure why everyone seems convinced we are that much head and shoulders better than everyone else. We are still very young and a fairly new team. I think we have achieved about as much success as we can expect right now. Young/immature WRs are not running the best routes, young/new to team DBs are making some growing pain mistakes, our TEs just simply are not good, the Oline has been patched together, It's really still just Ben, Bell, and AB. JuJu is showing a lot of promise but still growing into his role. Bryant has not made it back like we all hoped he would. Until this offense can gel, however long that takes is how long that takes, this defense is the unit that is winning us these games. I thought this offense would be much better than they are, it's just not. YET.

[AtlantaDan]

I'm not sure why everyone seems convinced we are that much head and shoulders better than everyone else. We are still very young and a fairly new team. I think we have achieved about as much success as we can expect right now. Young/immature WRs are not running the best routes, young/new to team DBs are making some growing pain mistakes, our TEs just simply are not good, the Oline has been patched together, It's really still just Ben, Bell, and AB. JuJu is showing a lot of promise but still growing into his role. Bryant has not made it back like we all hoped he would. Until this offense can gel, however long that takes is how long that takes, this defense is the unit that is winning us these games. I thought this offense would be much better than they are, it's just not. YET.

He is an easy target but Haley's play calling certainly does not help.

The screwups on the 2 point conversion that somehow was converted were a summation of the dysfunction on offense. According to a P-G article that for some reason was taken down, Haley called a play which used an unusual formation that had rarely been practiced, which resulted in players (Bryant was specifically cited) not knowing where to line up. In addition to Ben's clear exasperation as well as Haley's screaming, Tomlin overruling Haley and saying screw it we will go for two from the seven indicates nobody is certain of what to do at this point, which is not a good place to be 10 days before Thanksgiving.

And FWIW the defense doing a group pose in the end zone after the Shazier INT shows the lack of focus is not limited to the offense.

929834222277230593

[steelreserve]

He is an easy target but Haley's play calling certainly does not help.

The screwups on the 2 point conversion that somehow was converted were a summation of the dysfunction on offense. According to a P-G article that for some reason was taken down, Haley called a play which used an unusual formation that had rarely been practiced, which resulted in players (Bryant was specifically cited) not knowing where to line up. In addition to Ben's clear exasperation as well as Haley's screaming, Tomlin overruling Haley and saying screw it we will go for two from the seven indicates nobody is certain of what to do at this point, which is not a good place to be 10 days before Thanksgiving.

And FWIW the defense doing a group pose in the end zone after the Shazier INT shows the lack of focus is not limited to the offense.


I think this summarizes the situation pretty well. The team looks like it has the talent but just lacks cohesiveness. On offense more than on defense.

btw, going for it from the 7 was absolutely the right call. A one-point PAT would do literally nothing for us in that situation, and missing the two-point try wouldn't leave us any worse off. The only thing that would affect our situation was making the two-point try. I was SURE they were going to send out the field goal team after the penalty, but was very pleasantly surprised.

[teegre]

The Steelers are 7-2, but the offense hasn't scored over 30 points yet, and just eeked out a win over the hapless Colts. However, Ben is starting to get some rhythm back, with two good games in a row.

Good in the idea that the team hasn't peaked yet, or concern that the team's record is a total fluke?

I agree 100%... and have made similar posts in several threads.

If BB can be just a tad better, this team has the potential to go undefeated. And, by "a tad better", I mean the differences between the first half (3 points) and the second half (17 points) of the Colts game.

[86WARD]

I honestly think this is what this team is this year. They are not getting any better and they won't get much worse barring injury.

The offense is designed to be as good as the quarterback. Ben has to be better and I don't see that happening. :noidea:

This is what I said yesterday.

It’s been 9 weeks...if the offense hasn’t “gotten it together” by now, there’s not going to be any sort of high powered offense coming from this team. If anything, the offense is going to get worse due to the overuse of Bell. You could see the fatigue Bell is suffering from yesterday. He was very lethargic and appeared slower than normal.

[SteelMayhem72]

He is an easy target but Haley's play calling certainly does not help.

The screwups on the 2 point conversion that somehow was converted were a summation of the dysfunction on offense. According to a P-G article that for some reason was taken down, Haley called a play which used an unusual formation that had rarely been practiced, which resulted in players (Bryant was specifically cited) not knowing where to line up. In addition to Ben's clear exasperation as well as Haley's screaming, Tomlin overruling Haley and saying screw it we will go for two from the seven indicates nobody is certain of what to do at this point, which is not a good place to be 10 days before Thanksgiving.

And FWIW the defense doing a group pose in the end zone after the Shazier INT shows the lack of focus is not limited to the offense.

929834222277230593They are more worried about celebrations than what it takes to play better. Our own arrogance will bite us in the ass again and the much more disciplined team (Pats) will prevail during regular season and again in the playoffs. There is a very real lack of discipline that nobody seems to talk about. We are getting by with just mere athleticism and not what beyween the ears. I hate the pats as much as anybody but lets face it they are almost always the most disciplined team on the field and very rarely beat themselves. Tomlin being a players coach is a double edge sword. Get along with the players but lack the focus/discipline.

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[SteelMayhem72]

This is what I said yesterday.

It’s been 9 weeks...if the offense hasn’t “gotten it together” by now, there’s not going to be any sort of high powered offense coming from this team. If anything, the offense is going to get worse due to the overuse of Bell. You could see the fatigue Bell is suffering from yesterday. He was very lethargic and appeared slower than normal.Totally agree with this. Bell needs a big breather and I would definitely let Conner play more. Bell will be worn out come playoff time and suffer an injury and be in the same shape as last year.

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[Mojouw]

Conner can't/won't play more until he demonstrates he can pass protect.

Do people really think that players are missing assignments or reads because they are thinking about celebration moves? If that was the case, then no one could ever be good at NFL football. Things that are on every person's mind:

1. Is my significant other mad at me?
2. Are my kids doing okay?
3. Did I pay the cable bill?
4. Wonder if my folks are going to be able to visit for the holidays?
5. Is that mole cancer?

I mean I can go on and on. Everyone is distracted all the time.

As for the penalties, it is kinda surprising that everyone thinks this team is penalty prone. Here is the data -- http://www.nflpenalties.com/?year=2017

3 more penalties for less yards have been called on the Steelers than the Pats this year. What a total lack of discipline. For those that notice that NE has run 100 more plays than Pittsburgh it is still 4% to 3.6 % - again what a totally undisciplined team.

Perception is not always reality.

There is only one issue holding the 2017 Pittsburgh Steelers back -- their terrible 3rd down conversion rate on offense. Fix that and everything else doesn't matter. Don't fix that, and who cares about the rest because this team won't win shit in December and January.

[AtlantaDan]

Totally agree with this. Bell needs a big breather and I would definitely let Conner play more. Bell will be worn out come playoff time and suffer an injury and be in the same shape as last year.

In his P-G chat today Ray Fittipaldo agrees on more Conner but also thinks it is more than fatigue with Bell

I want to see more of Conner. He has more speed to the outside ...

I'm not totally down on Bell. I just think Conner's ability to gain the edge is not something Bell can do at the moment. Looks like he's lost a step.

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/steelers/2017/11/13/Ray-Fittipaldo-Steelers-chat-11-13-17/stories/201711130085

[polamalubeast]

The Steelers are 14-2 in their last 16 regular seasons games, which is our best 16 games run since 2004-2005....In his 16 games, the steelers scored 30 points or more only once!

They are what they are, but yesterday were probably our worst game in offense since the disaster against the jaguars

Before that, the steelers were able to move the ball, but they were bad in the red zone.

I would not be surprised if the first time the steelers score 30 points be in the playoffs

[AtlantaDan]

Do people really think that players are missing assignments or reads because they are thinking about celebration moves?

I think when you are doing a planned group celebration on a turnover that does not result in a touchdown your priorities are fucked up - that clearly was in the script for a TD and apparently they figured close enough

FWIW the relaxed group celebration rule Goodell announced earlier this year only applies to celebrating scores

We know that you love the spontaneous displays of emotion that come after a spectacular touchdown. And players have told us they want more freedom to be able to express themselves and celebrate their athletic achievements.

So here are a few examples of celebrations that will be allowed after scores under the new policy

http://epidm.edgesuite.net/CMS/NFL/Commissioner_Letter.html

Of course why would the Steelers worry for a second about some ref overreacting (as happened to Burfict yesterday) and being flagged for the turnover celebration when Bell did not ask whether using the goal post as a punching bag prop after his TD in the KC game could be penalized.

At some point the coaches cannot be expected to police everything.

[Moose]

They are more worried about celebrations than what it takes to play better. Our own arrogance will bite us in the ass again and the much more disciplined team (Pats) will prevail during regular season and again in the playoffs. There is a very real lack of discipline that nobody seems to talk about. We are getting by with just mere athleticism and not what beyween the ears. I hate the pats as much as anybody but lets face it they are almost always the most disciplined team on the field and very rarely beat themselves. Tomlin being a players coach is a double edge sword. Get along with the players but lack the focus/discipline.

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Right now I couldn't agree more. This team is as good as Ben, and this team will go as far as Ben takes it. If Ben get's injured....season is over. The example of the Pat's is right on. I hate the Pat's also, but let's face it, they are disciplined, always ready to kill and bury an opponent ( Denver at Denver). Their player's aren't spending their time and effort figuring what little 'play' to put on at the next TD ( if it happens). Sooner or later they may have to design a little 'play ritual' for a FG. Sometimes I think this team is more of a 'pretender' than a 'contender'. Haley is a joke, his play calling at times is asinine. Playing DOWN to teams is old crap. Their conservative play calling when finally getting a 10+ lead is a killer, and sometimes let's the opponent back in the game.....playing to NOT lose is asinine. If you can beat another team by 50 ...DO IT ! I'm to the point this year that every game scares the hell out of me. I could never bet on this team in any game....even Cleveland game. Hopefully they will get another cylinder firing within the next few games. Maybe Ben will start balling the way we know of him. Hitting all his receivers in the numbers constantly. Receivers trying to catch everything coming their way. Defender's actually wrapping a player and making a tackle. Defense getting OFF the field and the OFFENSE staying on the field. TD's in red zone each time there. This team's talent definitely has the potential to win out and stop the Pat's in the championship game, if it comes to that. But 'POTENTIALLY' being awesome has to become ' ACTUALLY' being awesome. GO STEELERS

[polamalubeast]

I'm glad our games is Thursday this week!

[Psycho Ward 86]

Conner can't/won't play more until he demonstrates he can pass protect.

Do people really think that players are missing assignments or reads because they are thinking about celebration moves? If that was the case, then no one could ever be good at NFL football. Things that are on every person's mind:

1. Is my significant other mad at me?
2. Are my kids doing okay?
3. Did I pay the cable bill?
4. Wonder if my folks are going to be able to visit for the holidays?
5. Is that mole cancer?

I mean I can go on and on. Everyone is distracted all the time.

As for the penalties, it is kinda surprising that everyone thinks this team is penalty prone. Here is the data -- http://www.nflpenalties.com/?year=2017

3 more penalties for less yards have been called on the Steelers than the Pats this year. What a total lack of discipline. For those that notice that NE has run 100 more plays than Pittsburgh it is still 4% to 3.6 % - again what a totally undisciplined team.

Perception is not always reality.

There is only one issue holding the 2017 Pittsburgh Steelers back -- their terrible 3rd down conversion rate on offense. Fix that and everything else doesn't matter. Don't fix that, and who cares about the rest because this team won't win shit in December and January.

and our red zone offense? Which was 31st coming into the Colts game and probably not any better with 2 red zone conversions.

If we dont use Conner to spell Leveon, we wont even have a Leveon to spell. And theres goes the season.

[Steeldude]

What a bunch of haters. This is clearly a complete team. They played like a well-oiled machine yesterday and all year.

[Rotorhead]

Honestly it is just little things here and there from what I have seen. Take this last game, the first play was just taking a shot and hopefully catching the Colts sleeping, if that connects the game is completely different. AB dropping a wide open pass that hits him in the hands, another game changer and how often does that happen? Boz missing a FG, again rarely happens. The forward progress fumble/nonfumble? The good thing is we are fortunate enough so far to overcome those setbacks. Our biggest issues are once again the pass rush without the blitz. Watt has been pretty quiet lately, however with Tuitt back I feel that may change (edit the pass rush, not Watt necessarily). Dupree has shown more flashes, but is still inconsistent. The other issue is either the playcalling or the execution. Also, for ppl complaining about Outlaw, he catches almost everything thrown to him, and lately he is getting good YAC. Maybe his blocking is not up to par, but he certainly can be used to move the chains.

[Mojouw]

and our red zone offense? Which was 31st coming into the Colts game and probably not any better with 2 red zone conversions.

If we dont use Conner to spell Leveon, we wont even have a Leveon to spell. And theres goes the season.

3rd down stuff takes care of red zone. Convert those to either 1st downs or scores. Same thing in my mind.

Can't use Conner because he is a dead give-away. He can not play in the passing game. Almost every time they have tried it he has either led to Ben getting hit, a turnover, or he dropped the ball.

That's on Conner to get better and he hasn't.

[Born2Steel]

Can anyone look at our redzone trips and tell us how many of our offensive penalties occurred in the redzone?

[SteelMayhem72]

Hell, if need be put Watson in there. How about a two back set and give it to watson or rosie nix. I mean i would have a few more options than there showing with just one back(bell) and everybody knows hes gonna run it. Our offense has become way to predictable and bell will get hurt at some point because of the predictability. We are using same ole formation time and time again that every team is seeing on tape over and over. Change it up, throw different formations in there that teams havent seen on film. Bell is basically getting teed off on because of a stacked box and all these hits are starting to accumulate. Its almost like he is being punished.

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[SteelMayhem72]

The instagram post earlier last week I dont think Bell is kidding about be over worked.It showed yesterday.

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[cubanstogie]

The instagram post earlier last week I dont think Bell is kidding about be over worked.It showed yesterday.

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I think they miss DeAngelo, especially in pass protection and receiving. Problem is if he doesn't get overworked then guys whining that we turned into passing team with best RB in league. It would be nice to win a couple laughers ending season so guys could get some rest. Home field in playoffs is so huge especially with our history going into Foxboro that guys won't be afforded much rest.

[teegre]

and our red zone offense? Which was 31st coming into the Colts game and probably not any better with 2 red zone conversions.


They said that we were 32nd. Regardless, 31at/32nd... same difference. We are the WORST at scoring in the red-zone (despite getting there the 5th most).

...which is why I’m so optimistic. At some point, we HAVE to get better. In turn, those FGs will turn into TDs, and scores around 20 will turn into scores around 28.

[Born2Steel]

They said that we were 32nd. Regardless, 31at/32nd... same difference. We are the WORST at scoring in the red-zone (despite getting there the 5th most).

...which is why I’m so optimistic. At some point, we HAVE to get better. In turn, those FGs will turn into TDs, and scores around 20 will turn into scores around 28.

Another way to look at it....The Steelers haven't even started taking this season seriously yet, and lead the AFC. Once they get serious......

[Steeldude]

Another way to look at it....The Steelers haven't even started taking this season seriously yet, and lead the AFC. Once they get serious......

Haha, that sounds about right. They will take it seriously in March. They will forget it in April and work on their celebration dances all off-season.

[Geno71]

I honestly think this is what this team is this year. They are not getting any better and they won't get much worse barring injury.

The offense is designed to be as good as the quarterback. Ben has to be better and I don't see that happening. :noidea:

That doesn't sound like the words that a "fan" would say. Wouldn't you agree?

[DesertSteel]

They said that we were 32nd. Regardless, 31at/32nd... same difference. We are the WORST at scoring in the red-zone (despite getting there the 5th most).

...which is why I’m so optimistic. At some point, we HAVE to get better. In turn, those FGs will turn into TDs, and scores around 20 will turn into scores around 28.

No sure about that, but I know we can't get worse! :)

[Mojouw]

That doesn't sound like the words that a "fan" would say. Wouldn't you agree?

Clearly I don't because I wrote it.

Can argue all day about the reasons for it and the ways to fix things -- but until the production at the QB position gets better, this offense is what it is.

Can it get better? One would think so based on the fact that the QB is a 1st ballot HOF'er - but what do I know?

[Geno71]

I don't think they are as good as their record. Too many ugly wins and an offense that hasn't done well at all.

I thought style points didn't matter?


I honestly think this is what this team is this year. They are not getting any better and they won't get much worse barring injury.

You heathens! Have faith in your team!


Can't use Conner because he is a dead give-away. He can not play in the passing game. Almost every time they have tried it he has either led to Ben getting hit, a turnover, or he dropped the ball.

Bell got Ben drilled twice yesterday because he was slow getting to blitz pickup.

James Conner has had ONE PASS, thrown his way in 9 games.

But I'm just stunned at the lack of optimism and fandom in this thread. Show some loyalty people.


Can argue all day about the reasons for it and the ways to fix things -- but until the production at the QB position gets better, this offense is what it is.


Can't get better until the grown ups take over.

[teegre]

No sure about that, but I know we can't get worse! :)

33rd... here we come!!!

[Geno71]

I don't think they are as good as their record. Too many ugly wins and an offense that hasn't done well at all.

Now if *I* posted that? You'd start crying.

The way a message board actually works is, if YOU are allowed to post YOUR opinion, then others are allowed the same courtesy.

[st33lersguy]

Now if *I* posted that? You'd start crying.

The way a message board actually works is, if YOU are allowed to post YOUR opinion, then others are allowed the same courtesy.

Maybe if you weren't so combative and condescending every time people disagreed with what you posted (and the majority of your opinions are wild ideas that the majority would disagree with) you wouldn't draw the ire of so many people.

[Geno71]

Maybe if you weren't so combative and condescending every time people disagreed with what you posted (and the majority of your opinions are wild ideas that the majority would disagree with) you wouldn't draw the ire of so many people.

List these "wild" opinions.

I'm all ears.

No, I drew the ire of people because I don't suck off Todd Haley like most of the fan base does. Like Art II does.

I actually appreciate the TALENT, and not an in over his head OC who doesn't have a fucking clue what to do.

OMG Antonio Brown is being double-teamed! Oh no what shall I do? Daddy help!

[43Hitman]

Maybe if you weren't so combative and condescending every time people disagreed with what you posted (and the majority of your opinions are wild ideas that the majority would disagree with) you wouldn't draw the ire of so many people.

You're wasting your time. This asshole enjoys being an asshole.

[Count Steeler]

List these "wild" opinions.

I'm all ears.

No, I drew the ire of people because I don't suck off Todd Haley like most of the fan base does. Like Art II does.

I actually appreciate the TALENT, and not an in over his head OC who doesn't have a fucking clue what to do.

OMG Antonio Brown is being double-teamed! Oh no what shall I do? Daddy help!

Crash?

[teegre]

Maybe if you weren't so combative and condescending every time people disagreed with what you posted (and the majority of your opinions are wild ideas that the majority would disagree with) you wouldn't draw the ire of so many people.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&persist_app=1&noapp=1&v=53l-oNuY16k

[Geno71]

You're wasting your time. This asshole enjoys being an asshole.

I'm not the one who hurls insults here. Many post the same opinions here that I do.

So either we're all trolls or I'm not.

Again, pick one.

[Drazo85]

I'm not the one who hurls insults here. Many post the same opinions here that I do.

So either we're all trolls or I'm not.

Again, pick one.Yeah don't Nix this guy if you disagree with him. His opinion is tough as fullback play!

[Mojouw]

I'm not the one who hurls insults here. Many post the same opinions here that I do.

So either we're all trolls or I'm not.

Again, pick one.

Maybe. Maybe not. But most of us manage to post without making an oral sex reference or three per post.

Most of us manage to post without flatly stating that anyone who holds a different opinion then them is performing a variety of sex acts on the owner and/or coaching staff.

It is clear that you get a sense of superiority from the internet and social media - your Twitter demonstrates an obsession with tracking the # of followers you have. Additionally, you seem bitter and angry that Steelers fans and media listen/read people that you regard as "20 something bloggers" without your high level of football knowledge.

Judging by the fact that your main criticisms of various coaches is their ties to either Pittsburgh or the Steelers organization coupled with their lack of football playing experience - I'm just going to guess that you are pissed off that after your glorious pee-wee and high school career no one recognized your football acumen and offered you a coaching position. Clearly, multiple college and NFL organizations have made a grievous mistake in not locking up your incredibly perceptive and fertile football mind. Imagine the dizzying heights of success they might climb to if they were the only team to have access to your revolutionary insights to offensive schemes. But you should keep the dream alive! If a failed yinzer golf pro like Haley can manage to coach in the NFL, then you should eventually be able to climb the ranks and bring your offensive insights to an NFL starving for your innovative ideas. In the meantime - keep perfecting the "Madden video game" offense - just a suggested name, feel free to change it, but you need to name your scheme. All the "cool" coaches do!

I wish you luck in your quest to, well actually I have no idea what your goal is. As far as I can tell it is something to do with cuckolds, oral sex acts, and convincing strangers on the internet that you know more than Haley. Honestly, I hope you get whatever you want. Perhaps together we can Make the Steelers Great Again? Work to ban 22 personnel? Maybe have a tiny hands across america about it?

[zulater]

I honestly think this is what this team is this year. They are not getting any better and they won't get much worse barring injury.

The offense is designed to be as good as the quarterback. Ben has to be better and I don't see that happening. :noidea:

I'm a little surprised, this coming from you? No, I don't expect you to be a cheerleader. I'm fine with critical analysis. But seriously I'm seeing very positive signs of Ben's game rounding into shape the past two games. I'm surprised what I'm seeing is alluding you? Is he the 2014-15 Ben that could throw 10 Td's in 2 games? No. I can't see that happening again. But he hasn't been floating nearly as many passes these past couple games. He's putting some starch on those seam passes once again. Also seeing Martavis being involved this past game could reap huge future benefits. ( let's not forget the 2 point conversion, not sure why they don't count in player's stats?) Him getting out of his personal fog could help open up the running lanes in the weeks ahead. Lastly Ben's been a much better player at home than on the road in recent seasons. 5 of the last 7 games are at home. I think we're going to see a significant upturn in the passing game in the weeks to come.

[Mojouw]

I'm a little surprised, this coming from you? No, I don't expect you to be a cheerleader. I'm fine with critical analysis. But seriously I'm seeing very positive signs of Ben's game rounding into shape the past two games. I'm surprised what I'm seeing is alluding you? Is he the 2014-15 Ben that could throw 10 Td's in 2 games? No. I can't see that happening again. But he hasn't been floating nearly as many passes these past couple games. He's putting some starch on those seam passes once again. Also seeing Martavis being involved this past game could reap huge future benefits. ( let's not forget the 2 point conversion, not sure why they don't count in player's stats?) Him getting out of his personal fog could help open up the running lanes in the weeks ahead. Lastly Ben's been a much better player at home than on the road in recent seasons. 5 of the last 7 games are at home. I think we're going to see a significant upturn in the passing game in the weeks to come.

You may have me turned around on this issue! You hit the nail on the head for me. Most of this season "Bad Ben" has been around. The Ben who "aims" passes and as a result misses high or throws it into the ground 2 yards short.

If you are right and the Ben who drops back and just let's it rip is coming back - then things will definitely get better. I've been in a foul mood all season and have pessimistically assumed that Ben is gone forever. Hope I'm wrong and you are right!

[86WARD]

I'm a little surprised, this coming from you? No, I don't expect you to be a cheerleader. I'm fine with critical analysis. But seriously I'm seeing very positive signs of Ben's game rounding into shape the past two games. I'm surprised what I'm seeing is alluding you? Is he the 2014-15 Ben that could throw 10 Td's in 2 games? No. I can't see that happening again. But he hasn't been floating nearly as many passes these past couple games. He's putting some starch on those seam passes once again. Also seeing Martavis being involved this past game could reap huge future benefits. ( let's not forget the 2 point conversion, not sure why they don't count in player's stats?) Him getting out of his personal fog could help open up the running lanes in the weeks ahead. Lastly Ben's been a much better player at home than on the road in recent seasons. 5 of the last 7 games are at home. I think we're going to see a significant upturn in the passing game in the weeks to come.

I hope you’re right as well and could see this going in that direction, but just last game alone, he was floating passes out there. At least two to JuJu one of which JuJu pulled down and then the TD pass to McDonald, which it took him forever to see, was floated out there and by Ben’s own admission thought was going into the front row. Maybe he’s calming down a little bit but that’s gonna come back and bite him if he doesn’t get that under control sooner than later...

[tube517]

I hope you’re right as well and could see this going in that direction, but just last game alone, he was floating passes out there. At least two to JuJu one of which JuJu pulled down and then the TD pass to McDonald, which it took him forever to see, was floated out there and by Ben’s own admission thought was going into the front row. Maybe he’s calming down a little bit but that’s gonna come back and bite him if he doesn’t get that under control sooner than later...

I watched that play again on Youtube and there was a frighteningly not so funny moment where 3 Steelers (Bell, DeCastro, and Gilbert) are blocking one guy. Ben gets happy feet and scrambles around and then Bell breaks away from the block as he sees Ben scramble to give him an option, DeCastro falls asleep and turns around and takes his eye off the Colt. The Colt then pushes Gilbert, is now free and heads straight for Ben.

So, the pass was high but Ben got excited and saw a wide open McDonald with the Colt heading toward him.

Haley now yells at Danny Smith for chewing too loud and thinks he should be going for the extra point only to be overruled by cool shades

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Yeah don't Nix this guy if you disagree with him. His opinion is tough as fullback play!

I love great fullback play. :yay3: They can work well in the run game and take pressure off your QB, so he doesn't get hurt as often.....kind of the opposite of what they do in Arizona.

[Mojouw]

I love great fullback play. :yay3: They can work well in the run game and take pressure off your QB, so he doesn't get hurt as often.....kind of the opposite of what they do in Arizona.

And the NFL agrees with you. FB's are on the rise (too slowly for my taste) across the league. When all this pass-wackiness started 10-12 years ago, I thought the FB was done and you could use an H-back or motion a TE through or something. I continued to think that for a long time.

Last couple of years has me (re?) convinced that there is no substitute for a great blocking FB.

[GBMelBlount]

Great teams find a way to win.

As long as they hit their stride and peak when it matters, I am not too concerned if they sputter their way to victories during the season.

[Born2Steel]

Great teams find a way to win.

As long as they hit their stride and peak when it matters, I am not too concerned if they sputter their way to victories during the season.

Complete agreement.

[hwalker84]

Hopefully they wake up when New England beats the brakes off of us Dec 17th.

[BostonBlackie]

I still say it's a Patriots/Steelers AFCCG.

[EzraTank]

Watch the Eagles play. That is how a young good QB leads a high powered offense.

[GBMelBlount]

I still say it's a Patriots/Steelers AFCCG.

Hope so.

On a side note, I just started binge watching the Wahlburgers....

Gronk was in the episode I watched last night.

Marky Mark is the producer.

It is actually quite entertaining.

https://www.boston.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/WahlbergParty10-850x478.jpg

[tube517]

Hope so.

On a side note, I just started binge watching the Wahlburgers....

Gronk was in the episode I watched last night.

Marky Mark is the producer.

It is actually quite entertaining.

https://www.boston.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/WahlbergParty10-850x478.jpg

I went to the one in Myrtle Beach. Meh. Not impressed. I didn't feel any good vibrations.

[Born2Steel]

I see a Jags/Steelers rematch AFCCG

[GBMelBlount]

I went to the one in Myrtle Beach. Meh. Not impressed. I didn't feel any good vibrations.

Maybe they don't have the right stuff? :uhoh:

http://barfblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/vomit-cruise.jpg

[steel striker]

I feel they have not played but, 7-2 I'll take it. Look I think Ben can turn it around and, play well this is not a college ranking system either. Let's see what they finish the season and, enter the playoffs they usually play their best football around that time.

[AtlantaDan]

I was attempting to recall if there has been a Steelers team with a 7-2 record with less enthusiasm for the Super Bowl prospects of the team at the time it hit 7-2 than this one.

There were the 1983 Steelers featuring Cliff Stoudt at QB which peaked at 9-2 before finishing 10-6. And there were the 1996 Steelers with Mike Tomczak at QB (with some Kordell mixed in) which peaked at 9-3 before finishing at 10-6.

Both teams were flawed at QB.

I guess this is sort of like 1983. In 1983 the hope was Bradshaw would come back from his elbow injury - he played one half in week 15 against the Jets until reinjuring his elbow and that was it for his career.

In 2017 the hope is that the version of Ben the Steelers have had for most of his career returns rather than a continuation of the mediocrity we have seen so far. Waiting for the return of prime Ben for one final playoff run in some ways might be as realistic as those of us old timers who were hoping for one final playoff run from Bradshaw in 1983.

[Born2Steel]

I was attempting to recall if there has been a Steelers team with a 7-2 record with less enthusiasm for the Super Bowl prospects of the team at the time it hit 7-2 than this one.

There were the 1983 Steelers featuring Cliff Stoudt at QB which peaked at 9-2 before finishing 10-6. And there were the 1996 Steelers with Mike Tomczak at QB (with some Kordell mixed in) which peaked at 9-3 before finishing at 10-6.

Both teams were flawed at QB.

I guess this is sort of like 1983. In 1983 the hope was Bradshaw would come back from his elbow injury - he played one half in week 15 against the Jets until reinjuring his elbow and that was it for his career.

In 2017 the hope is that the version of Ben the Steelers have had for most of his career returns rather than a continuation of the mediocrity we have seen so far. Waiting for the return of prime Ben for one final playoff run in some ways might be as realistic as those of us old timers who were hoping for one final playoff run from Bradshaw in 1983.

I think i remember that '83 game vs the Jets. If it's the same one, we were being handled and abused. Bradshaw came in and the Steelers came back and won the game.

[Hawkman]

I was attempting to recall if there has been a Steelers team with a 7-2 record with less enthusiasm for the Super Bowl prospects of the team at the time it hit 7-2 than this one.

There were the 1983 Steelers featuring Cliff Stoudt at QB which peaked at 9-2 before finishing 10-6. And there were the 1996 Steelers with Mike Tomczak at QB (with some Kordell mixed in) which peaked at 9-3 before finishing at 10-6.

Both teams were flawed at QB.

I guess this is sort of like 1983. In 1983 the hope was Bradshaw would come back from his elbow injury - he played one half in week 15 against the Jets until reinjuring his elbow and that was it for his career.

In 2017 the hope is that the version of Ben the Steelers have had for most of his career returns rather than a continuation of the mediocrity we have seen so far. Waiting for the return of prime Ben for one final playoff run in some ways might be as realistic as those of us old timers who were hoping for one final playoff run from Bradshaw in 1983.

Sorry, but I'm really not agreeing with the comparisons, and frankly I think there is plenty of enthusiasm for a SB run, myself included. Games like the Colts, in the past, we would have lost that game,( playing down to the competition). We found a way to win this one. We've played six out of nine games on the road, and won five.

[AtlantaDan]

I think i remember that '83 game vs the Jets. If it's the same one, we were being handled and abused. Bradshaw came in and the Steelers came back and won the game.

I checked PFR to make sure my vague memory was correct. Steelers smoked Jets 34-7. In Bradshaw's first game of the season he led two TD drives for early 14-0 lead in second quarter - on the second TD pass he grabbed the elbow on his throwing arm and left never to return. Passer rating of 133 for the quarter and change he played.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/198312100nyj.htm

Bradshaw, the Steelers' 35-year-old starting quarterback, was in action for only eight and one half minutes of play and for just 20 of Pittsburgh's 75 plays. But when he came out early in the second quarter because of a bruised passing arm and elbow, he had thrown two touchdown passes

http://www.nytimes.com/1983/12/11/sports/bradshaw-s-arm-gives-steelers-a-lift.html

[tube517]

I checked PFR to make sure my vague memory was correct. Steelers smoked Jets 34-7. In Bradshaw's first game of the season he led two TD drives for early 14-0 lead in second quarter - on the second TD pass he grabbed the elbow on his throwing arm and left never to return. Passer rating of 133 for the quarter and change he played.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/198312100nyj.htm

Bradshaw, the Steelers' 35-year-old starting quarterback, was in action for only eight and one half minutes of play and for just 20 of Pittsburgh's 75 plays. But when he came out early in the second quarter because of a bruised passing arm and elbow, he had thrown two touchdown passes

http://www.nytimes.com/1983/12/11/sports/bradshaw-s-arm-gives-steelers-a-lift.html


I remember that game well. The Steelers were in a 3 game losing streak and suddenly had to win to hold off the Stains for the division.

Bradshaw threw a TD pass to rookie Gregg Garrity and didn't even know Garrity's name. He missed all of training camp and the entire season except for that Jets game.

Cliff Stoudt was the QB and was horrific.

[AtlantaDan]

Sorry, but I'm really not agreeing with the comparisons, and frankly I think there is plenty of enthusiasm for a SB run, myself included. Games like the Colts, in the past, we would have lost that game,( playing down to the competition). We found a way to win this one. We've played six out of nine games on the road, and won five.

This team, particularly the offense, is getting trashed in the local media this week and the fan base is bitching as well. For a 7-2 team my recollection is that is unusual compared to the enthusiasm for other Steelers teams with such a favorable record in November.

According to PFR about the only Steelers teams that reached 7-2 since Noll arrived were a number of the 70s teams, the 1983 team, the 1996 team, the 2001 team, the 2004-2005 teams and the 2007 team.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/pit/index.htm

The enthusiasm for the 2005 team collapsed after they lost three straight to fall to 7-5, not when that team was 7-2.

Only other comparable situation might be the 1974 team, which was at 7-2-1 but also had QB performance issues as Noll was still shuffling Bradshaw, Gilliam and Hanratty in November.

I certainly am not giving up on the season, just noting that when a team is at 7-2 I have not seen so many downbeat assessments - might be a reflection of anyone with access to a modem being able to share their opinions.

[Psycho Ward 86]

This team, particularly the offense, is getting trashed in the local media this week and the fan base is bitching as well. For a 7-2 team my recollection is that is unusual compared to the enthusiasm for other Steelers teams with such a favorable record in November.

According to PFR about the only Steelers teams that reached 7-2 since Noll arrived were a number of the 70s teams, the 1983 team, the 1996 team, the 2001 team, the 2004-2005 teams and the 2007 team.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/pit/index.htm

The enthusiasm for the 2005 team collapsed after they lost three straight to fall to 7-5, not when that team was 7-2.

Only other comparable situation might be the 1974 team, which was at 7-2-1 but also had QB performance issues as Noll was still shuffling Bradshaw, Gilliam and Hanratty in November.

I certainly am not giving up on the season, just noting that when a team is at 7-2 I have not seen so many downbeat assessments - might be a reflection of anyone with access to a modem being able to share their opinions.

The biggest fear of many is that the 7-2 record will mean nothing if we lose in an inevitable rematch with the Patriots in the playoffs. Count myself in that group.

People can spin it any cute way they want, if we cant get past them, we need to rely on luck. I for one prefer this team is too good to need any

[teegre]

This team, particularly the offense, is getting trashed in the local media this week and the fan base is bitching as well. For a 7-2 team my recollection is that is unusual compared to the enthusiasm for other Steelers teams with such a favorable record in November.

According to PFR about the only Steelers teams that reached 7-2 since Noll arrived were a number of the 70s teams, the 1983 team, the 1996 team, the 2001 team, the 2004-2005 teams and the 2007 team.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/pit/index.htm

The enthusiasm for the 2005 team collapsed after they lost three straight to fall to 7-5, not when that team was 7-2.

Only other comparable situation might be the 1974 team, which was at 7-2-1 but also had QB performance issues as Noll was still shuffling Bradshaw, Gilliam and Hanratty in November.

I certainly am not giving up on the season, just noting that when a team is at 7-2 I have not seen so many downbeat assessments - might be a reflection of anyone with access to a modem being able to share their opinions.

The Steelers fans might not be excited about the Steelers’ chances...

But, on an NFL Network panel consisting of 11 of their writers/players (including Ike Taylor & MJD) 5 of those chose the Steelers to hoist the Lombardi in February (the other choices ranged from the Seahawks to the Saints, but no other team had more than 3 votes).

It should be noted, aligning with your point, that Dave Dameshek (a Steelers fan) had Seattle beating Pittsburgh.

[st33lersguy]

The biggest fear of many is that the 7-2 record will mean nothing if we lose in an inevitable rematch with the Patriots in the playoffs. Count myself in that group.

People can spin it any cute way they want, if we cant get past them, we need to rely on luck. I for one prefer this team is too good to need any

It will mean nothing if the team falls short of the Super Bowl period. If theoretically the Steelers beat the Pats in the divisional round and say lose to the Chiefs in the Championship game (again theoretically speaking), it will be just as meaningless as losing to the Pats again.

There are a lot of concerns I have going against the Pats. The lack of offense, the poor special teams of late, and most of all the coordinators. Butler probably still stubbornly uses zone against Brady and Todd Haley's bad playcalling is the exact kind of bad playcalling the Pats have benefited from in their last 2 Super Bowls

[st33lersguy]

I see a Jags/Steelers rematch AFCCG

Yeah, I don't see a scenario where the Pats don't stroll to yet another AFFCG appearance

[fansince'76]

This team, particularly the offense, is getting trashed in the local media this week and the fan base is bitching as well. For a 7-2 team my recollection is that is unusual compared to the enthusiasm for other Steelers teams with such a favorable record in November.

I vividly recall the Steelers being 11-3 at one point in 2008 with fans CONSTANTLY bitching then too, again, because of the offense...

[Hawkman]

I vividly recall the Steelers being 11-3 at one point in 2008 with fans CONSTANTLY bitching then too, again, because of the offense...

I seem to recall that as well. About 20 threads bitching about the O-Line

[fansince'76]

I seem to recall that as well. About 20 threads bitching about the O-Line

That OL deserved to be bitched about. :chuckle:

[AtlantaDan]

I vividly recall the Steelers being 11-3 at one point in 2008 with fans CONSTANTLY bitching then too, again, because of the offense...

Oh I well recall that too - I was one of those bitching at the time on SFF (RIP), particularly after Ben had two lousy games against the Manning brothers at Heinz in a span of three weeks

That is why I checked the record of that 2008 team before asking what other 7-2 teams had so many rocks thrown at them - 2008 team hit 6-3 rather than 7-2 after losing to Peyton & the Colts in week 10, which in hindsight was probably the low point of the 2008 season :drink:

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/pit/2008.htm

[teegre]

I vividly recall the Steelers being 11-3 at one point in 2008 with fans CONSTANTLY bitching then too, again, because of the offense...

I recall that at the end of the 2008 season, Steelers fans were STILL bitching (LeBeau almost lost the game!!!).

And, as you know, I got banned from a certain site for suggesting that we celebrate for at least one night (before we descended into our normal pattern of dissatisfaction with anything & everything).

[Hawkman]

I recall that at the end of the 2008 season, Steelers fans were STILL bitching (LeBeau almost lost the game!!!).

And, as you know, I got banned from a certain site for suggesting that we celebrate for at least one night (before we descended into our normal pattern of dissatisfaction with anything & everything).

You got banned!?!!? Say it isn't so.:wink02::chuckle:

[tube517]

I vividly recall the Steelers being 11-3 at one point in 2008 with fans CONSTANTLY bitching then too, again, because of the offense...

Steelers offense in 2008: 21.7 ppg.....20th in the league.

Except Arians wasn't yelling, he was thinking up what mixed drinks he would serve from his trunk and what color Kangrol hat to wear.

[fansince'76]

I recall that at the end of the 2008 season, Steelers fans were STILL bitching (LeBeau almost lost the game!!!).

And, as you know, I got banned from a certain site for suggesting that we celebrate for at least one night (before we descended into our normal pattern of dissatisfaction with anything & everything).

Wasn't that the "Dong Sack" site? :chuckle:

[teegre]

Wasn't that the "Dong Sack" site? :chuckle:

:nod:

[Psycho Ward 86]

Steelers offense in 2008: 21.7 ppg.....20th in the league.

Except Arians wasn't yelling, he was thinking up what mixed drinks he would serve from his trunk and what color Kangrol hat to wear.

That right there is your statistic of the month. The 2008 offense, consisting of a Big Ben that was injured constantly and barely practiced, Gary Russell/Mewelde Moore in the backfield, and probably the worst O-line to ever win a superbowl STILL scored more points than an offense as talented as ours

[zulater]

That right there is your statistic of the month. The 2008 offense, consisting of a Big Ben that was injured constantly and barely practiced, Gary Russell/Mewelde Moore in the backfield, and probably the worst O-line to ever win a superbowl STILL scored more points than an offense as talented as ours

It wasn't all bad. They had Heath, Hines, and Santonio.

[teegre]

Oh I well recall that too - I was one of those bitching at the time on SFF (RIP), particularly after Ben had two lousy games against the Manning brothers at Heinz in a span of three weeks

That is why I checked the record of that 2008 team before asking what other 7-2 teams had so many rocks thrown at them - 2008 team hit 6-3 rather than 7-2 after losing to Peyton & the Colts in week 10, which in hindsight was probably the low point of the 2008 season :drink:

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/pit/2008.htm

The Eagles game (9 sacks on BB) was the low point.

[Psycho Ward 86]

It wasn't all bad. They had Heath, Hines, and Santonio.

The league's leading receiver. The league's leading rusher. A top 5 O-line. A receiver who's addition to our starting lineup used to help us average an extra TD per game. A receiver who gives Ben nearly a perfect passer rating when targeted. This is the offense that is failing to outscore the 2008 offense. Haley is lucky that nepotism is on his side

- - - Updated - - -


The Eagles game (9 sacks on BB) was the low point.

Ben starting every single game is the definitive miracle of that season. Cannot recall ever seeing a QB pass rushed as horridly as Ben that day

[st33lersguy]

The Eagles game (9 sacks on BB) was the low point.

Especially for me personally, living in F-ing Eagles country surrounded by those cave dwelling fans

[43Hitman]

Especially for me personally, living in F-ing Eagles country surrounded by those cave dwelling fans

Just point to their trophy case and laugh..

[st33lersguy]

I'd say overall this was a complete performance

[SteelerFanInStl]

I'd say overall this was a complete performance

I agree. This was a complete performance.

[polamalubeast]

I'd say overall this was a complete performance

4 interceptions and 5 sacks on defense....Great second half by the offense.And it was against a good(not great but good)team.

[86WARD]

8-2 with one complete team performance?

[polamalubeast]

8-2 with one complete team performance?

Baltimore was a good complete team performence too.

[Lady Steel]

And there you have it. :)

[zulater]

I'm a little surprised, this coming from you? No, I don't expect you to be a cheerleader. I'm fine with critical analysis. But seriously I'm seeing very positive signs of Ben's game rounding into shape the past two games. I'm surprised what I'm seeing is alluding you? Is he the 2014-15 Ben that could throw 10 Td's in 2 games? No. I can't see that happening again. But he hasn't been floating nearly as many passes these past couple games. He's putting some starch on those seam passes once again. Also seeing Martavis being involved this past game could reap huge future benefits. ( let's not forget the 2 point conversion, not sure why they don't count in player's stats?) Him getting out of his personal fog could help open up the running lanes in the weeks ahead. Lastly Ben's been a much better player at home than on the road in recent seasons. 5 of the last 7 games are at home. I think we're going to see a significant upturn in the passing game in the weeks to come.

:humble: :lol:

[tube517]

16-3 in the last 19 games since that Dallas game last year???

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

16-3 in the last 19 games since that Dallas game last year???

Yeah, but a true Steelers fan response from this board should be something like;

-"just imagine what the record would be if they had a red zone offense"

-"sure, but how many super bowls did they win in that timeframe?"

-"if Mike Tomlin disciplined his players the record would be 18-1"

[DesertSteel]

Yeah, but a true Steelers fan response from this board should be something like;

-"just imagine what the record would be if they had a red zone offense"

-"sure, but how many super bowls did they win in that timeframe?"

-"if Mike Tomlin disciplined his players the record would be 18-1"
We should have won at least 3 Super Bowls in that timeframe. Ridiculous.

[teegre]

16-3 in the last 19 games since that Dallas game last year???

I’m assuming that you are including the post season, yes?

(Regular season, they are 15-2.)

[polamalubeast]

931495255462907904

And Remember,last year the steelers was 5-5 after 10 games.

[tube517]

I’m assuming that you are including the post season, yes?

(Regular season, they are 15-2.)

Thanks, so 17-3 w/the playoffs. It was late :zzz: :yawn:

- - - Updated - - -


Yeah, but a true Steelers fan response from this board should be something like;

-"just imagine what the record would be if they had a red zone offense"

-"sure, but how many super bowls did they win in that timeframe?"

-"if Mike Tomlin disciplined his players the record would be 18-1"

Spot on.

You missed my sarcastic "We should have won 56-0" post in the other thread :chuckle:

[polamalubeast]

Steelers went up of 6 spots in the scoring offense (PPG)after yesterday's game.They are 13th in PPG now.

[Hawkman]

Steelers went up of 6 spots in the scoring offense (PPG)after yesterday's game.They are 13th in PPG now.

In the "current analysis" the only stat that matters is the one in the "W" column.:thumbsup:

[tube517]

In the "current analysis" the only stat that matters is the one in the "W" column.:thumbsup:

Not according to some Steeler fans. They'd rather be 5-5 and average 120 ppg and still blame Toddy and Rosey Nix.

[Hawkman]

Not according to some Steeler fans. They'd rather be 5-5 and average 120 ppg and still blame Toddy and Rosey Nix.

:rofl:

[Born2Steel]

In the "current analysis" the only stat that matters is the one in the "W" column.:thumbsup:

This is how I watch football week to week. Steelers went 1-0 this week.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

We should have won at least 3 Super Bowls in that timeframe. Ridiculous.

You know the Patriots would have.

:sarcasm2: